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Samsung Bada unveiled as new iPhone, Android platform rival

post #1 of 41
Thread Starter 
Samsung, the world's second largest phone maker globally after Nokia, has announced Bada as its own new smartphone platform which it hopes to use to gain entry into the sophisticated phone market.

Samsung's Bada, the Korean word for "ocean," is reportedly built on top of Linux and is expected to be released with an open SDK next month, with the first Bada phones to be introduced early next year. Unlike Symbian or Android, Samsung appears to be developing its new mobile platform and software market solely for the benefit of its own phones, much like RIM, Apple, and Palm.

Searching for a smartphone platform

The company's current smartphone lineup is about 80% Windows Mobile and 20% Symbian. A year ago, the company released the new Windows Mobile Omnia as its flagship offering, but followed up this year with the Omnia HD using Symbian instead, a move identical to Sony Ericsson's release of the Windows Mobile Xperia X1 followed by this year's Symbian-based Idou.

Also like Sony Ericsson, Samsung announced plans earlier this year to back Android instead of Symbian in the future, with an announcement that 30% of its phones next year would use Android. That expansion was expected to come from reduced use of Windows Mobile, but now Samsung is indicating that it will phase out Symbian entirely, drastically reduce the use of Windows Mobile, and introduce the new Bada as its preferred smartphone operating system.

HMC investment securities analyst Greg Noh outlined Samsung's expected smartphone mix showing Symbian completely phased out by 2011, and Samsung's own Bada making up half of its portfolio by 2012, with the remainder being about 30% Android and 20% Windows Mobile.

Another big phone maker eyes a world outside of Android

In the general mobile phone market, Samsung has been making incremental progress toward leader Nokia with around 20% of the global phone market. It currently sells more phones than the rest of the top five makers (LG, Sony Ericsson and Motorola) combined. In smartphones however, Samsung has just recently broke into the top five vendors, well behind Nokia, RIM, Apple, and HTC with sales of just 1.4 million in the most recent quarter, the same figure as last year. With the growth in smartphones, that contributed to Samsung's market share of advanced phones actually slipping slightly year over year.



Android advocates widely expected Samsung to warmly adopt Google's platform, as it provides a free alternative to the Windows Mobile software the company currently uses. Instead, Samsung is following Nokia's lead in working to maintain its own destiny independent of Google. Nokia is both sponsoring the Symbian Foundation and its own Maemo Linux distribution.

Samsung's interest in creating and managing its own smartphone platform also reflects the interests of second place smartphone vendor RIM and its BlackBerry OS, and Apple in third place with the iPhone. Palm has followed a similar strategy with its own proprietary WebOS.

As a smartphone vendor experienced with using third party software from Microsoft and Symbian, Samsung's interest in developing and maintaining its own proprietary platform rather than trying to adapt Android to create differentiated phones in a competitive market is a dramatic refutal of the conventional thinking that Android will explode among vendors next year.

Instead, Samsung's considerable resources will be devoted toward its own new platform, creating more competition and differentiation in options among smartphone platforms and reducing the energy being channeled toward licensed operating systems, with Windows Mobile being the biggest loser (with the loss of around 1.2 million of the 3.6 million Windows Mobile phones that shipped in Q3 2009), Symbian losing a significant licensee entirely, and Android facing a rival new marketplace for mobile software.

Samsung expects to release more information to developers about its SDK plans next month via its Bada website.
post #2 of 41
So, if Samsung expands their tie-in with Microsoft and does a special search engine for this smartphone it will be:

Bada-Bing!
post #3 of 41
I don't know a single thing about this, but I'll dismiss it because Apple doesn't make it. It will never be beyond perfect like iphone is.

(beat you to it Quadra)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eideard View Post

So, if Samsung expands their tie-in with Microsoft and does a special search engine for this smartphone it will be:

Bada-Bing!

Holy shit. Could it be possible that's the very reason why Microsoft went with "bing" at the last moment? I don't know if I'd put it past them :/
post #4 of 41
yawning
post #5 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Another big phone maker eyes a world outside of Android

Come join the party, everyone's invited!
post #6 of 41
Something is off with some of the numbers. They've rounded some off in one chart, but not in another. Also, and if I'm missing something here, point it out, but it seems to me that both Apple and RIM should have the same percentage in both smartphone charts, as both only use their own OS, and so the numbers of smartphones sold in total by everyone should be the same whether going by OS or maker. As the same should be true for Apple and RIM, the percentage should be the same for both charts.

How can we go with two different rating companies?
post #7 of 41
Quote:
So, if Samsung expands their tie-in with Microsoft and does a special search engine for this smartphone it will be: Bada-Bing!

Lol bada bing. Hahaha
Except instead of pushing WinMo on Samsung, I suggest Microsoft joins Samsung in developing another linux alternative to Android, they can call it LinMo, and the phone can still be called Bada-Bing
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post #8 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Something is off with some of the numbers. They've rounded some off in one chart, but not in another. Also, and if I'm missing something here, point it out, but it seems to me that both Apple and RIM should have the same percentage in both smartphone charts, as both only use their own OS, and so the numbers of smartphones sold in total by everyone should be the same whether going by OS or maker. As the same should be true for Apple and RIM, the percentage should be the same for both charts.

How can we go with two different rating companies?

(I assume you caught the footnotes: "Reported figures differ slightly by research firm.")

Each firm might have different methods of arriving at the same overall figures. The differences between 'Platform' and 'Maker' for RIM and Apple are within rounding error, although the 19% to 21% jump is a bit more than 17% to 18%. Close enough for government work.
post #9 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dlux View Post

(I assume you caught the footnotes: "Reported figures differ slightly by research firm.")

Each firm might have different methods of arriving at the same overall figures. The differences between 'Platform' and 'Maker' for RIM and Apple are within rounding error, although the 19% to 21% jump is a bit more than 17% to 18%. Close enough for government work.

That's why I asked how we could go with different rating companies. Their numbers are always different. As all of these companies rate for the same things, I don't see why they couldn't have gotten ratings from one company instead of three.
post #10 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

That's why I asked how we could go with different rating companies. Their numbers are always different. As all of these companies rate for the same things, I don't see why they couldn't have gotten ratings from one company instead of three.

Comparing the earlier Canalys numbers, it appears that only IDG reported Samsung figures (which wasn't in the top five previously), and and only Strategy Analytics presented mobile numbers. Rather than presenting part of the story, the article presents three sides of the same situation.

It's also interesting to see proof that IDG/Gartner/Calalys and others are presenting their estimates of the industry, not some irrefutable proof numbers. So take all market share and sales numbers with a grain of salt, as they are only estimates. Getting multiple estimates also helps even out perspective of the industry.
post #11 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glockpop View Post

Comparing the earlier Canalys numbers, it appears that only IDG reported Samsung figures (which wasn't in the top five previously), and and only Strategy Analytics presented mobile numbers. Rather than presenting part of the story, the article presents three sides of the same situation.

It's also interesting to see proof that IDG/Gartner/Calalys and others are presenting their estimates of the industry, not some irrefutable proof numbers. So take all market share and sales numbers with a grain of salt, as they are only estimates. Getting multiple estimates also helps even out perspective of the industry.

I don't entirely agree. All of these companies do the same ratings. If we want to see a picture from all three, then they can all be presented.

But to present one rating by one company, and a different, but somewhat similar one by another, is misleading, and confusing.
post #12 of 41
Hmmm, noting the absence of screen shots.
post #13 of 41
I see only one reason for Bada. Vanity.
post #14 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eideard View Post

So, if Samsung expands their tie-in with Microsoft and does a special search engine for this smartphone it will be:

Bada-Bing!

Makes good sense... Should be the 6th Element on future charts
post #15 of 41
And why would developers want to develop for Samsung? If they don't have a software platform in the past, and any track record for supporting developers?
post #16 of 41
I like the graph showing Windows Mobile at about 9% (and shrinking). It reminds me of Ballmer's boast that "I'd rather have our software in 70%-80% of the phones than 2-3%, which is what Apple might get".
post #17 of 41
So, Windows Mobile vers 7 is still born.

Who does that leave to use it?

Nokia, Symbian (occassionally Windows, but less and less so)
Palm, Palm OS
RIM, their own system, the name of which escapes me.
Apple, iPhone OS (OS X-ish)
Motorola, Android
Sony Errikson, Android (is that correct?)
HTC, Android
LG, Android
um...

Who's left?

Do Panasonic still make phones? Is Dell still trying to develop a mobile? um... Siemens? (or have they given up...)

So either the companies are paying loads to develop their own, or deciding to pay less to develop their own 'skins' of Android. No one is paying to license. I wonder if this will filter back into computers. I wonder...
post #18 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraboy View Post

I see only one reason for Bada. Vanity.

Control.
post #19 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Control.

So the lesson of Windows and PlaysforSure is rapidly sinking in. If you want to be a real player in the market, you need to control your own platform. Otherwise, you're in the worst part of the market - the low-margin undifferentiated commodity (Windows) or out of the market completely (PlaysforSure until it died).

Nokia and Samsung now understand. Apple, RIM, and Palm have always understood, though Palm ventured off-course because the "analysts" said they should follow the Windows model and they thus screwed up PalmOS and got screwed by WinMo.

Will Motorola, SonyEricsson, LG, and HTC eventually learn their lesson?
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post #20 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

So the lesson of Windows and PlaysforSure is rapidly sinking in. If you want to be a real player in the market, you need to control your own platform. Otherwise, you're in the worst part of the market - the low-margin undifferentiated commodity (Windows) or out of the market completely (PlaysforSure until it died).

Despite Ballmer saying that Apple wont get anywhere unless they license their mobile OS, i have a feeling that MS only recourse is to due what it did with the Zune, and make a product that is entirely in the MS ecosystem. I wouldnt be surprised to see a Zune Phone hit the market. It would be the best competitor to the iPhone in media playback. Even Android v2.0 is severely lacking in this area, and it doesnt look like itll be changing quickly.
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post #21 of 41
"There's no chance that the iPhone is going to get any significant market share. No chance. It's a $500 subsidized item. They may make a lot of money. But if you actually take a look at the 1.3 billion phones that get sold, I'd prefer to have our software in 60% or 70% or 80% of them, than I would to have 2% or 3%, which is what Apple might get."

\t- Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer, April 30, 2007
post #22 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Despite Ballmer saying that Apple wont get anywhere unless they license their mobile OS, i have a feeling that MS only recourse is to due what it did with the Zune, and make a product that is entirely in the MS ecosystem. I wouldnt be surprised to see a Zune Phone hit the market. It would be the best competitor to the iPhone in media playback. Even Android v2.0 is severely lacking in this area, and it doesnt look like itll be changing quickly.

When it was finally confirmed in early/mid 2006 that MS was developing their own Zune, Jobs was quoted as saying something along the lines of "I knew they eventually would." At the time, I really thought that MS/Ballmer understood the importance of creating a mobile platform. And once the iPhone was announced, a couple of months after the first Zune, I thought for sure that MS knew that personal media players would converge into phones, and that the Zune would soon become a phone. But the recent revelations of Zune HD, Danger, Pink, WinMo, make it seem like MS never grasped this at all.

So tho there really should be a Zune phone, I have little confidence that there is one coming anytime soon.
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post #23 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Despite Ballmer saying that Apple won’t get anywhere unless they license their mobile OS, i have a feeling that MS’ only recourse is to due what it did with the Zune, and make a product that is entirely in the MS ecosystem. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a Zune Phone hit the market. It would be the best competitor to the iPhone in media playback. Even Android v2.0 is severely lacking in this area, and it doesn’t look like it’ll be changing quickly.

SO obsessed with Ballmer- so sad. What exactly does he have to do with Samsung and the Bada. He simply permeates your every thoughts. Recourse? Bizarre!
post #24 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Samsung's Bada, the Korean word for "ocean," ...

Go figure, I thought it was the Korean word for "me too!".

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post #25 of 41
Samsung is going to continue with Android phones starting with the Galaxy.

Another nail in WinMo's coffin.

Samsung also currently make 2 LiMo based phones custom built for Vodafone, Bada is probably an extension of that work.

Will Samsung Bada run Nokia Maemo software?

Will open source Linux become closed source in the world of smartphones?
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post #26 of 41
So how bada is it?
post #27 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

So how bada is it?

Is there a graph for that?
post #28 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Is there a graph for that?

I couldn't resist.
post #29 of 41
Yep, just what we all needed, another Linux phone. Maybe this time this will actually make it here in the states, untouched and ready to go.

Right.

Prove me wrong Nokia N900 where everyone else has failed.
post #30 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubert View Post

"There's no chance that the iPhone is going to get any significant market share. No chance. It's a $500 subsidized item. They may make a lot of money. But if you actually take a look at the 1.3 billion phones that get sold, I'd prefer to have our software in 60% or 70% or 80% of them, than I would to have 2% or 3%, which is what Apple might get."

\t- Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer, April 30, 2007

but now it will be WinMo that is lucky if it can hang on to 2% or 3%. Ah! the worm turns!
post #31 of 41
So the real question, then, is whether Samsung can bring the "ss".
post #32 of 41
Samsung has to be responding to its arch rival Nokia most of all. they go head-to-head in Asia much more than here. Samsung could use Android too (and probably will) but clearly wants to control its own premium product like Nokia might with Maemo. with a branded app, media, and cloud store like Ovi too.

this won't be aimed at the US market. Samsung will probably push Android products here mainly, thanks to Google's strong US presence. it's all about Asia. Apple sells in Asia too of course and so there is competition (plus all the silly media stories about the next "iPhone killer"). but the death match is Samsung vs. Nokia.

(does anyone care about Sony/Erricson anymore? do they?)

funny how Linux at long last is finally hitting the big time. but the fragmentation among all these new mobile OS variants will really frustrate and confuse consumers. with their clear identity and momentum Apple and RIM can rise above the chaos with a loyal customer base. but all the rest - including the telcos with their own branded phones too - will be chopping each other to pieces every product cycle.

what a bloody mess it will be.
post #33 of 41
The N900 will be coming to T-Mobile it has the 1700 UMTS band, it'd be alright if you didn't have to use it in landscape mode for everything except calls, it also *shock, horror* doesn't support MMS \ \ \



Quote:
Originally Posted by sprockkets View Post

Yep, just what we all needed, another Linux phone. Maybe this time this will actually make it here in the states, untouched and ready to go.

Right.

Prove me wrong Nokia N900 where everyone else has failed.
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post #34 of 41
What experience does Samsung have in developing its own OS?

Don't answer, we'll soon find out how good Bada is.

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post #35 of 41
I think it'll possibly be popular
I actually like the name "Bada"
When i first read about the article, it had already clicked into me.

I can't wait until they unveil this new platform.
post #36 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aizmov View Post

What experience does Samsung have in developing its own OS?

Many of their phones run their own 'Touch Wiz' UI and they have developed their own OS

Quote:
TouchWiz can be downloaded to Samsung handsets running on Symbian, Windows Mobile, or Samsung's own OS.

Any chance there will be a gold plated bling offering called the Bad-Ass

Couldn't resist.

I think Samsung are hoping to create an ancillary revenue stream such as Apple have done with the App Store.

Since the iPhone has Unix at it's heart and so will Bada, how difficult would it be for developers to port versions of their apps over to the new platform?
post #37 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

Many of their phones run their own 'Touch Wiz' UI and they have developed their own OS



Any chance there will be a gold plated bling offering called the Bad-Ass

Couldn't resist.

Ah, the Bada SS model.
post #38 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


Many of their phones run their own 'Touch Wiz' UI and they have developed their own OS

A UI isn't an OS. A 'dumb'phone OS isn't anything like a smartphone OS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post


Since the iPhone has Unix at it's heart and so will Bada,

Even if Bada had a Unixy kernel it'll still account to nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnocbui View Post

how difficult would it be for developers to port versions of their apps over to the new platform?



May warrant a full rewrite. As Objective-C, Cocoa, and other iPhone OS specific frameworks wont be available on Bada. iPhone OS may be Unix, but so is Solaris, HP-UX, etc... There is more to an OS than just the kernel.

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post #39 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraboy View Post

I see only one reason for Bada. Vanity.

Indeed.

Really, there's room for two platforms, three at most. It increasingly looks like those are iPhone and Android, with RIM slowly disappearing as the other two improve on the corporate side.

What can they possibly be thinking?

Maury
post #40 of 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

funny how Linux at long last is finally hitting the big time. but the fragmentation among all these new mobile OS variants will really frustrate and confuse consumers. with their clear identity and momentum Apple and RIM can rise above the chaos with a loyal customer base. but all the rest - including the telcos with their own branded phones too - will be chopping each other to pieces every product cycle.

what a bloody mess it will be.

Hear, hear! Well, there's LiMo which is Linux. And there's Android which is also Linux but not LiMo. But there's Android in the T-Mobile phone which is different from Android in the Droid. Then there's Maemo which is also Linux but not Limo or Android. Then there's Bada which is also Linux but not Limo, or Droid or Maemo. Then there's WinMo 6.5 which is not Linux or Limo or Android or Maemo and is yes, kinda lame but WinMo 7 is coming out soon! Although WinMo 7 can't be installed in virtaully all current WinMo phones. Did I already tell you about Limo and Android and Maemo and Bada?

Apple's marketing guys must be licking their chops.
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