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Apple overtakes Nokia to claim handset profit crown - Page 2

post #41 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

edit: Mea culpa.

Are you like flagellating yourself with an Apple mini display port cable as you type that?
post #42 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCompMan View Post

I've seen friendlier sites on Linux sites and they hate everyone.

You guys/gals even argue with each other.

I'll continue with ArsTechnica for my Mac forum reading. I've been reading the postings here and there is nothing but bashing each other and everything non Apple.

At least their feedback is very limited to the stuff I see here.

The stories of the 8 or 9 I've read and reviewed the postings are very arrogant people and clearly biased stories.

Some of the forum posters clearly need help in the real world.

Do you people really always have to be right and fight it to the end regardless of how clearly irrelevant it is to the article?

I'm confused. Did you expect to come to a web site called AppleInsider and not expect a lot of pro-Apple articles and pro-Apple posters on the forums? I happen to be one of the "fanboys", I guess, but have grown to respect, appreciate, and even agree more and more with some of the unbiased, non-"fanboy" posters on these threads (yes, even tekstud from time to time). I know some haven't and are much more vocal, but there is a place and a voice for everybody.

However, what I don't get, is why you are here making post after post anyway when you so clearly hate this venue. Go back to ArsTechnica, leave us alone, and we'll all forget this ever happened.
post #43 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Nokia also has a new operating system in the works, called Maemo.

Appleinsider, first with the news from 2005
post #44 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhyde View Post

As wonderful as this might seem from an Apple Fanboy point of view, do keep in mind that they are generating these high profits from *US*. I love my iPhone (and my Macs) and I happen to love AT&T (far better than Sprint, whom I had before), but I can't wait for Android, etc., to start growing and for multiple carriers to get the iPhone (not just Verizon) so that Apple (and the carriers) are forced to lower their profit margins a bit. Hopefully, this will happen in two years when my 3gs contract expires :-)

Wow, someone here has some sense, unless everyone on this site are Apple shareholders, that profit is coming out of your back pocket, which is bad for consumers
post #45 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post

Tecstud is just being a dick. As usual.

You are so out of here.

And you profit analogy is wrong on top of that. Didn't you read correctly - Apple does not dicslose profits by line.
post #46 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCompMan View Post

This room is hopeless & lost. Nokia has gained 39% year over year and Rim is right behind them.

Apple is 8% growth in the phone market year over year.

That should have been the title of this article.

Really... what is the matter with you?

A research firm publishes some cell phone market (FINANCIAL!) stats... and they get reported!
How fuckin' hard is that for you to understand?

You want an article and related comment on phone market share? Well you'll find that here to.
canalys_q3_2009_iphone_rim_taking_over_smartphone_ marketl

Now quit crying!
post #47 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post

How fuckin' hard is that for you to understand?

<edit>

Now quit crying!

Ouch! Shovel meet spade.
post #48 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

I'm confused. Did you expect to come to a web site called AppleInsider and not expect a lot of pro-Apple articles and pro-Apple posters on the forums? I happen to be one of the "fanboys", I guess, but have grown to respect, appreciate, and even agree more and more with some of the unbiased, non-"fanboy" posters on these threads (yes, even tekstud from time to time). I know some haven't and are much more vocal, but there is a place and a voice for everybody.

However, what I don't get, is why you are here making post after post anyway when you so clearly hate this venue. Go back to ArsTechnica, leave us alone, and we'll all forget this ever happened.

There is a clear distinction between between being a satisfied user of a piece of tech and delusional. Edit (And so do the writers of the forum). Biased and not giving all the facts to an article.

A forum is supposed to be an exchange of knowledge based on the article given. This site fails on every level.
This site crosses that line.

I never used the term "fanboys" as you reference in your posting.

There is a place and a voice for everybody that appears to praise Apple. By the postings in the forum if you don't you are crusified.

I don't see this as a forum. I see it more as a cult of ugly people that share a common theme. Hate everything that is non Apple.

Edit 2. I have put this site on the banned list for my kids. It's clearly not reading for a young child to read. This site give all people a very negative reflection of what Apple is.
post #49 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post


And you profit analogy is wrong on top of that. Didn't you read correctly - Apple does not dicslose profits by line.

I did not make an analogy. I can read quite well thank you. You, on the other hand appear to only read selectively.

Quote:
Apple does not disclose profits by line, operating profit was estimated at nearly $1.6 billion in the third quarter of this year.....

Do you understand what "estimated" means?

If you have a problem with the methodology... or the results... then fine, rant about those but at least try to understand what is being said in the story.
post #50 of 116
Do people really choose carriers based on what phones are available from said carriers? I used to have an iPhone, but hated AT&T, so went with the best available phone- Samsung Behold, T-Mobile offered. All things being equal, I think most who have spent some time with an iPhone would rather have one, than any other phone. Once the iPhone becomes available to most carriers, I imagine the phone wars will be over, with the iPhone ending up at the top, and all others fighting for 2nd place.
post #51 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCompMan View Post

This room is hopeless & lost. Nokia has gained 39% year over year and Rim is right behind them.

Apple is 8% growth in the phone market year over year.

That should have been the title of this article.

Continue to argue amongst yourselves. You really do deserve each other.

This is in response to your comment about RIMM vs AAPL sales growth. From last earnings call: "In the September quarter, Apple sold almost 7.4m handsets. Sell-through was up 38% year over year ". Several websites can confirm this.
post #52 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Fail comprehension much?


Question: So how much of that is iPhone?
Answer: YOU DON'T KNOW- PERIOD.

ANd show me where Nokia has a whole line of dedicated music players- ipods from classics, to shuffles to Touches ????? Computers??? OS sales for those computers????? SOftware- Final cut . etc, etc.

Is there no limit to your warped bias??

The numbers in the article is ONLY for the iPhone.

Look here to see how that number was arrived at.

http://www.reuters.com/article/marke...0091110?rpc=44

But I believe this includes the deferred income Apple gets from using the subscription model. Thus not all of the $4.5 Billion in revenue and $1.6 Billion in operating profit got reported in the last quarter report.

Apple total revenue reported for the last quarter came in at $9.9 Billion. Without the deferred iPhone income. Which was about $2 Billion. Their NET profit (iPhone, iPod, Macs, iTunes, etc.) came in at $1.67 Billion. Net profit is after taxes. Operating profit is revenue - cost to make product and cost to sell product (operating expense).

Make no mistake about. Apple is wiping the floor with Nokia when it comes to making money selling phones. Apple sold ONLY 7.4 Million iPhone during the last quarter. While Nokia sold over 108 Million phones during the period. But you wouldn't guess that by comparing their operating profits.
post #53 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhyde View Post

As wonderful as this might seem from an Apple Fanboy point of view, do keep in mind that they are generating these high profits from *US*. I love my iPhone (and my Macs) and I happen to love AT&T (far better than Sprint, whom I had before), but I can't wait for Android, etc., to start growing and for multiple carriers to get the iPhone (not just Verizon) so that Apple (and the carriers) are forced to lower their profit margins a bit. Hopefully, this will happen in two years when my 3gs contract expires :-)

I sure hope you pressed charges against that guy that held a gun to your head and made you buy the iPhone.
post #54 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Analysts estimate Apple's iPhone operating profit to be the highest in the mobile phone industry, overtaking market leader Nokia in the last financial quarter.

Reuters reports that although Apple does not disclose profits by line, operating profit was estimated at nearly $1.6 billion in the third quarter of this year, compared to $1.1 billion in profit by Nokia for the same period of time.

The news only serves to reiterate what has been known for some time: Apple, along with competitor Research in Motion, carries a much higher profit margin on its handsets than competitors. This summer, a report stated that though Apple and RIM together only control 5 percent of the cell phone market, they take 58 percent of its total operating profits.

Estimated $1.6 billion operating profits appears right.

7.4 million iPhones at $600 each and Apples stated gross margins of around 35% equals $1.6 billion (iPhone only) for the quarter.

Nothing innocuous here to be upset with. This report is only for brokers'/investors' recommendations.

Why anybody would be overly concerned here is beyond me.
post #55 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

7.4 million iPhones at $600 each and Apples stated gross margins of around 35% equals $1.6 billion (iPhone only) for the quarter.

You are assuming that Apple sells all their phones only in the US with exactly the smart margin
post #56 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

You are assuming that Apple sells all their phones only in the US with exactly the smart margin

Let's see
  • "…that the company achieved a new record in iPhone sales as well, with 7.4 million units sold in the quarter ending in September 2009."*†

  • "Peter Oppenheimer, Apple's Chief Financial Officer, also said that the Average Selling Price of iPhones in the quarter "was just over $600."*

  • "Gross margin (Q4, 09) was 36.6 percent, up from 34.7 percent in the year-ago quarter…"†

* Apple's Q4 2009 conference call call. http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...us_growth.html
† Apple Reports Fourth Quarter Results. http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2009/10/19results.html
post #57 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

Let's see

So why didn't you include that in the first place, rather than trying to look like a hero with the late information.
post #58 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

So why didn't you include that in the first place, rather than trying to look like a hero with the late information.

I simply assumed that anybody with half a brain would recognized what I was saying.

I apologize for making an ass of me(self).
post #59 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidW View Post

Apple total revenue reported for the last quarter came in at $9.9 Billion. Without the deferred iPhone income. Which was about $2 Billion. Their NET profit (iPhone, iPod, Macs, iTunes, etc.) came in at $1.67 Billion. Net profit is after taxes. Operating profit is revenue - cost to make product and cost to sell product (operating expense).

This is what I don't understand.

Apple reported a total profit of $1.67 billion and this report is stating that Apple's profit from the iPhone alone is $1.6 billion. Even adding in taxes, these figures suggest that 75% of Apple's profits are coming from the iPhone.

Surely that can't be correct?
post #60 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

I simply assumed that anybody with half a brain would recognized what I was saying.

I apologize for making an ass of me(self).

You shouldn't assume anything, after all if I did that, I would have to assume you are trying to insult he with that little piece of crap you call a posting.
post #61 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

This is what I don't understand.

Apple reported a total profit of $1.67 billion and this report is stating that Apple's profit from the iPhone alone is $1.6 billion. Even adding in taxes, these figures suggest that 75% of Apple's profits are coming from the iPhone.

Surely that can't be correct?

That is the deferred revenue. The non-GAAP for the quarter is $2.85 billion net profit income.
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2009/10/19results.html
PS: MS did $12.92 billion last quarter while Apple did $12.25 billion. Hard to believe that Apple is so close to MS quarterly revenue.
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post #62 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

This is what I don't understand.

Apple reported a total profit of $1.67 billion and this report is stating that Apple's profit from the iPhone alone is $1.6 billion. Even adding in taxes, these figures suggest that 75% of Apple's profits are coming from the iPhone.

Surely that can't be correct?

Apple only reported about $2.3 Billion of the $4.5 Billion in iPhone revenue this last quarter. They deferred $2.2 Billion of it. So the quarterly operating profit from iPhones would only be about $800 Million. And that's "OPERATING PROFIT". Deduct taxes of about $250 million and you get about $550 Million in "NET PROFIT". Which is about 30% of their quarterly "NET PROFIT" of $1.67 Billion.
post #63 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

This is what I don't understand.

Apple reported a total profit of $1.67 billion and this report is stating that Apple's profit from the iPhone alone is $1.6 billion. Even adding in taxes, these figures suggest that 75% of Apple's profits are coming from the iPhone.

Surely that can't be correct?

Operating profit is the difference between price and the costs of bringing to market. It is gross and not net.

Note that the estimates for the iPhone in this report are not based on the same formula, i.e., subscription accounting) that has been used in accounting the sales in the quarterly report.

Quote:
Previously, the company divided iPhone revenue over 8 quarters under subscription accounting. Now it can report all of its iPhone and Apple TV in the quarter the devices are sold.

http://www.businessinsider.com/iphon...pproved-2009-9

Under the new accounting rule, all sales for the iPhone will be recorded in the quarter they were sold.
post #64 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

* Apple's Q4 2009 conference call call. http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...us_growth.html
Apple Reports Fourth Quarter Results. http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2009/10/19results.html

Let's see

I looked at both links, the only one that has the average price is the Appleinsider link, which since it is written by Prince McLean isn't really worth anything, can you provide an actual link with actual information.
post #65 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That is the deferred revenue. The non-GAAP for the quarter is $2.85 billion net profit income.
http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2009/10/19results.html

Aha, thanks for clearly that up. This is why I'm not an accountant.
post #66 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCompMan View Post

There is a clear distinction between between being a satisfied user of a piece of tech and delusional. Edit (And so do the writers of the forum). Biased and not giving all the facts to an article.

A forum is supposed to be an exchange of knowledge based on the article given. This site fails on every level.
This site crosses that line.

I never used the term "fanboys" as you reference in your posting.

There is a place and a voice for everybody that appears to praise Apple. By the postings in the forum if you don't you are crusified.

I don't see this as a forum. I see it more as a cult of ugly people that share a common theme. Hate everything that is non Apple.

Edit 2. I have put this site on the banned list for my kids. It's clearly not reading for a young child to read. This site give all people a very negative reflection of what Apple is.

I been away for a couple days and missed the amusement. You have every right not to take part on this site and make your comments. But what surprises me, is after you said you are leaving, you can't resist to post 4-5 more comments and show, how childish you are.
post #67 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuisDias View Post

Kudos to Apple. They are the company of the first decade of the 21st century. Let's see how the game will be played in the next decade!

Do you mean 2000/12/31 - 2010/12/31 or 1999/12/31 - 2009/12/31 ?


post #68 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post

I did not make an analogy. I can read quite well thank you. You, on the other hand appear to only read selectively.



Do you understand what "estimated" means?

If you have a problem with the methodology... or the results... then fine, rant about those but at least try to understand what is being said in the story.

AT least I can "understand" why X Company's operating profits cannot be compared with Y Company's when they operating in two separate industries yet may share one product line. I don't flame on when I'm proven wrong.
post #69 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by success View Post

Do you mean 2000/12/01 - 2010/12/31 or 1999/12/31 - 2009/12/31 ?

Ask solipsism - he's the decade genius. ANd he'll give you Gregorian links to prove it.

Seriously we all know its 1/1/00 to 12/31/09 at least that's how we refer to as "Of the decade" in the modern age in the US. Not quite sure what world he lives.
post #70 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

Let's see

I looked at both links, the only one that has the average price is the Appleinsider link, which since it is written by Prince McLean isn't really worth anything, can you provide an actual link with actual information.

Try this. Last sentence of 3rd paragraph is what you're looking for.

http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/new...nference-call/
post #71 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Ask solipsism - he's the decade genius. ANd he'll give you Gregorian record to prove it.

Once you go Mayan you never go Cayan.

Oh wait....once you go black you never go back...once you go cayan you never go Mayan.... yeah that's better.

EDIT: I just noticed your sig LOL
post #72 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

This is what I don't understand.

Apple reported a total profit of $1.67 billion and this report is stating that Apple's profit from the iPhone alone is $1.6 billion. Even adding in taxes, these figures suggest that 75% of Apple's profits are coming from the iPhone.

Surely that can't be correct?

That's because that IS their total profit. It's plainly written in the article! Apple doesn't give out line by line figures. Apple should not be compared to Nokia in their bottom line. Maybe SOny but certainly not Nokia for crissake!
Be very care who you listen to on here.
post #73 of 116
No, it isnt.
post #74 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

I'd keep the iPhone but leave it in the car when I fish if I were you. That makes me think.. what would it cost to replace a lost one ... I can't see AT&T kicking in and insurance companies might balk at taking one in a boat .. \

What kind of way is that to live?! In fear of loss? At the behest of insurance companies? That's really sad, man!

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post #75 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubert View Post

We've learned and struggled for a few years here figuring out how to make a decent phone. PC guys are not going to just figure this out. They're not going to just walk in.

\t- Palm CEO Ed Colligan, commenting on then-rumored Apple iPhone, Nov. 16, 2006

LOL, what a buffoon, I bet he's kicking himself so hard right now, and too busy trying to clone the iPhone down to the last detail, not to mention poaching employees from apple.
post #76 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

. . .Now if I can get the iPhone apps on a computer...it's stupid not having those 100,000 apps on a computer too.

WTF?

You speak out of ignorance of the simple fact that the iPhone has a distinctly different interface than a Mac, which is why they're designed and programmed differently from the get-go. There's also the fundamental difference in distribution between the App Store and whatever else Mac apps have to deal with. That's WTF!

Daniel Swanson

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post #77 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCompMan View Post

The article is clearly biased and not giving the entire story. I'm just making sure the readers (like myself) that see an article on my google home page and click it don't get the wrong impression and read the entire story on a site that appears to be much more open to giving the entire story than this site is.

The article makes it sound like Nokia and RIM are closing the doors and they are seeing better year over year growth than the single iPhone.

Year over year growth does say a lot about a mindshare in the market. Apple clearly doesn't have it and Android numbers haven't won't even be worth checking for a couple quarters. But I wouldn't be surprised to see them pull a segment of the appphone market share from everyone.

This is a forum not a cheer leading session. If a site is going to post a story. Give the entire picture. 7% year over year gain is poor given the market.

You seem to want to rely on these silly publications for your data and for their particular evaluations of that data. It's a *gleaning* process, not a believe-everything-you-read process. It's a long-standing tradition spanning centuries that newspapers are each their own mouthpiece of various vested interests. Your petty protests aren't about to change any of that.

So learn to use your own eyes and ears. Provide your own best counsel, and move on, for cryin' out loud!

Daniel Swanson

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post #78 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

AT least I can "understand" why X Company's operating profits cannot be compared with Y Company's when they operating in two separate industries yet may share one product line.

Yes, but what you fail to understand (or are just ignoring!) is that this article (and the research from which it was derived) is NOT comparing Apple's TOTAL operating profits to Nokia's.

The article compares iPhone operating profits to Nokia's figures. Nokia and the iPhone both compete in the cell phone market.


Quote:
I don't flame on when I'm proven wrong.

Actually, that's exactly what you are doing.
post #79 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

That's because that IS their total profit. It's plainly written in the article! Apple doesn't give out line by line figures. Apple should not be compared to Nokia in their bottom line. Maybe SOny but certainly not Nokia for crissake!
Be very care who you listen to on here.

thats good point, I am very careful
post #80 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTripper View Post

Now we know why Nokia is suing Apple.

Sore losers.

They are suing Apple cause they say Apple ripped off some of their patents, which is actually possible you know.
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