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Smoking may void Applecare warranty - Page 7

post #241 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by abogus1 View Post

I'm not suggesting that anything be done about it. I am simply saying that the conditions exist, and that Steve does nothing about it for either his employees or the subcontractors. And that really is my only point. It seems very hypocritical to deny service based on the health of his service staff, and then to send his field staff into harms way. Don't you think?

Are you saying when people from Apple go over to China, they are exposed to the conditions in China, and that Jobs should do more to protect them?

Quote:
Just a side note... Final assembly sites may be clean, but the factories supplying these unibody enclosures we all love are horrendously filthy.

Are you talking about the metal smelting factories? Its not exactly a clean process. And actually much to the benefit of the US environmentally that its not done here any more.
post #242 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elkyss View Post

I own a mac and live in Oklahoma. Recently the burner stopped working. We have AppleCare so we took it in 2 days ago for repair. We just recieved a call today stating we needed to come get it because they are refusing to work on it due to health hazards from second hand smoke due to OSHA violations.

I pity the poor fool who works in a kitchen and needs a Mac. The french fry grease will clog it up not to mention all the Ratatouille hairs.
post #243 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobo Decosta View Post

Never thought there would come a day a would decide never to buy a mac again but that day has come. When I paid my MacBook Pro they didn't say they couldn't accept my money because it was a biohazard so I wonder why they would consider my notebook a biohazard.

A big fuck you to Steve Jobs! What's next? People who eat meat can't send in their Macs for repair anymore?

My father, along with quite a few people he worked with, died because his employer thought it okay to knowingly let them work with known hazardous materials - asbestos.

How can you honestly be this upset with a company who is taking a stand to protect their workers from a known health hazard? Are the warranty repair workers supposed to die to fix computers that were not faulty in the first place, but were rather damaged by neglect of their owners? Owners who knowingly put carcinogens in their body and in their air?

Also a company who's CEO nearly died from cancer - you want him to force his workers to work with known carcinogens?
post #244 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Actually among the 40 largest cities, NYC air quality is comparatively good.

NYC is 31 out of 40, with 40 being the best.

America's Most Toxic Cities

OK- Denver then.
post #245 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by abogus1 View Post

I'm not suggesting that anything be done about it. I am simply saying that the conditions exist, and that Steve does nothing about it for either his employees or the subcontractors. And that really is my only point. It seems very hypocritical to deny service based on the health of his service staff, and then to send his field staff into harms way. Don't you think?

Just a side note... Final assembly sites may be clean, but the factories supplying these unibody enclosures we all love are horrendously filthy.

No, I dont agree. Its like saying that a restaurant that wants there employees to wash their hands before returning to work is hypocritical because its serving food that used to shit wherever it was standing. They have nothing to do with each other.

Apple, like every other company that deals with China, is doing what it needs to protect its own employees, not a another companies employees. If they are being treated unfairly in accordance with that country, that is a different matter and many companies have stepped up to prevent that from happening, including Apple.

In the end, for a computer to be soiled to the point that second hand smoke is not just noticeable but needs to be cleaned out as its impeding a repair and/or diagnosis means that the machines has been misused and neglected. That is not the responsibility of any company under any warranty.
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post #246 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Cigarette smoke[huh?] and dust adhere to many things just not cigarette smoke and by lumping all together it gives that impression.

I've seen inside a lot of computers, both those used by smokers and those not. The ones used by smokers almost always have more "crap" in them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Also, there are many non- smokers that are dirty filthy disgusting slobs- don't generalize.

I said "people who smoke are often disgusting, dirty slobs." That's not generalizing any more than saying that smokers tend to get lung cancer more often. Saying that doesn't indicate that all smokers get lung cancer or that non-smokers never do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teckstud View Post

Is Barrack Obama a filthy dirty slob?

I don't honestly know. I somehow doubt that he has to do a lot of his own cleaning.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowededwookie View Post

Nope, smoking is not a good thing, it never has been a good thing, and it never will be a good thing. It damages the smoker, it damages the innocent bystander, and it lowers the respect others have of you. Not seeing any upshots to smoking here.

Well put. But there is one upshot: It is like a big warning sign that says "do not date this person!" You look at the cigarette hanging out of the mouth and you know that the person is likely to be less-educated, die sooner, have greater health problems, and be the type of person who caves to social pressure from peers. And before any of the smokers get their panties in twists, there are statistics and facts to support those beliefs.
post #247 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by spliff monkey View Post

Dander and dust stick to your computers components regardless of wether or not smoke from a cigarette started the problem. Hope no one here uses scented candles around the house because it does the same damned thing.

True, but it is more easily removed if not adhered with tar. A good air blast will remove most dust and dander, but tar based dirt must be either rubbed or chemically removed.
post #248 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

I've seen inside a lot of computers, both those used by smokers and those not. The ones used by smokers almost always have more "crap" in them.

Have you ever looked inside a computer regularly used near a kitchen, a beach house, a fireplace, etc, etc???
You don't have to be a smoker to have a clogged up filthy computer with "crap" in it.
post #249 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

China has grown, but its limited in many ways. None of our modern technology has been invented in China. Technological advancements are mostly made in the US and Europe, China is used for manufacturing. Most of what China builds comes from other countries. The Chinese government restricts and limits its own ability innovate new ideas.

I would recommend watching the "Distant Voices" episode of James Burke's Connections as it shows you just how wrong that statement is. Much of our modern technology either came from or is dependent on Chinese (or Asian ideas)!

The Chinese were using the compass and stern post rudder in the 11th century--the West didn't have a clue until the later part of the 15th. The Chinese had the blast furnace and cupola furnace long before Julius Caeser was even born--the West didn't "invent" these until the 18th century some 2,000 years later! Around the same time the Chinese produced the first seismograph that could tell them how the earth moved and even where the main shock had come from.

The reason these technological advancements (and everything else China cranked out) didn't change China was due to their view of the world (Very similar to the Western Church from c450 to c1350) and a very stratified society that prevented personal advancement.

With the Ming dynasty China entered into its own "Dark Age" where technological development slowed to a crawl and in some cases previous advances were forgotten. The successive Qing dynasty had the problem of the East India Company in the 1700s hitting on the brilliant idea of using opium to pay for all the goods people wanted from China. The resulting Opium Wars further drained China's resources.

So counting China out is very short sighted--especially when you realize that the greatest general who ever lived was Chinese and his teachings has become the key to government, business, and warfare. In fact it was thanks to him that the US lost Vietnam:

When doing battle, seek a quick victory. (The US ignored this)

A protracted battle will blunt weapons and dampen ardor. (The US used this against Great Britain in the War of Independence)

If troops lay siege to a walled city, their strength will be exhausted.

If the army is exposed to a prolonged campaign, the nation's resources will not suffice.

Sun Tzu (c544c496 BCE)
post #250 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximara View Post

I would recommend watching the "Distant Voices" episode of James Burke's Connections as it shows you just how wrong that statement is. Much of our modern technology either came from or is dependent on Chinese (or Asian ideas)!

He said modern technology. We all know that each invention is built upon the inventions that came before it as James Burke clearly points out and as you clearly state, "Much of our modern technology either came from or is dependent on Chinese (or Asian ideas)! China either has not been at the forefront of new technological breakthroughs, or have simply been keeping them to themselves.
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post #251 of 332
Something that was invented 10,000 years ago is not apart of contemporary modern technological advancement. I'm not denying that China invented very important advancements. Every ancient culture has contributed something to what we have today. But what I'm talking about is today

There is no Apple, Intel, Google, Twitter, or Facebook coming from China. And there won't be with their current political practices.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximara View Post

I would recommend watching the "Distant Voices" episode of James Burke's Connections as it shows you just how wrong that statement is. Much of our modern technology either came from or is dependent on Chinese (or Asian ideas)!

The Chinese were using the compass and stern post rudder in the 11th century--the West didn't have a clue until the later part of the 15th. The Chinese had the blast furnace and cupola furnace long before Julius Caeser was even born--the West didn't "invent" these until the 18th century some 2,000 years later! Around the same time the Chinese produced the first seismograph that could tell them how the earth moved and even where the main shock had come from.
post #252 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

There is no Apple, Intel, Google, Twitter, or Facebook coming from China. And there won't be with their current political practices.

Pingala invented Facebook because he developed a binary numeral system in 200 BCE. Back then it might have been called MukhBook.
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post #253 of 332
Very nice,

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Pingala invented Facebook because he developed a binary numeral system in 200 BCE. Back then it might have been called MukhBook.
post #254 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

No it doesn't. That stuff is most certainly NOT from dust. That is some serious buildup and it doesn't look safe. At all. I wouldn't touch that thing.

Yeah it s. I'm talking about LA. And the soot on the cars outside is from smokers too? LOL. google Los Angeles air quality spring summer.
post #255 of 332
The quality of air in a city has nothing to do with the quality of air in a confined room, they are two very different concepts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hiimamac View Post

Yeah it s. I'm talking about LA. And the soot on the cars outside is from smokers too? LOL. google Los Angeles air quality spring summer.
post #256 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbonner View Post

True, but it is more easily removed if not adhered with tar. A good air blast will remove most dust and dander, but tar based dirt must be either rubbed or chemically removed.

Exactlly. Besides I didn't know Apple had tar-ohmmeters
lol.

Oh and for the record they are not geniuses, they put in a disc, wait for the results and 80% of the time they send it out for repairs. And now to save $$$ it's mostly grownyourown mac specialist doing the job for a little above minium. Saw a guy there that has been a specalsy doing the growyourown for over ONE YEAR. The techs make $17 an hour. 5 years ago it was a lot mote and they were told not to approach customers. Nman have times changed.
post #257 of 332
I feel little sympathy for smokers in this situation. If your computer is so obviously smoke damaged, why should Apple be responsible for fixing it under warranty?

I once knew a chain smoker whose entire home was caked in a layer of brown tar. He was a computer technician and did most of his smoking around his own computers. It wreaked in his home and I can only imagine how the insides of his computers (not to mention his lungs) looked.

How is smoke damage from cigarette smoking different from smoke damage from a fire? Actually, it's probably worse because of the tar and length of exposure.
post #258 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post

Smoking is NOT illegal anywhere that I know of.


In California, smoking is illegal in the workplace and within 25ft of an entrance to a building that is used by employees or the public. It's also banned in most bars and restaurants. The town of Belmont, California banned smoking in all businesses and multi-story apartments and condominiums, effective January 2009.

There may be an argument that the computer was used in a workplace and/or a private home where smoking is banned and is therefore impaired by an illegal substance.

The owners of these machines will get little sympathy from me, and if I was a technician I would also consider refusing to work on a machine that was clearly affected by tobacco smoke.
post #259 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by geekdad View Post

Now this brings up a few things......
First if the laptop looked like that on the inside then it maybe should have been denied service.
BUT then how would one clean that kind of mess? They can't open the chassis...that would definatley void the warranty.
Smoking is NOT illegal anywhere that I know of. If smoke residue can build up inside of a machine.....especially inside a laptop then one could argue that the machine design was at fault and not the fault of the owner who was doing nothing illegal.
So was the machine design at fault for not providing enough ventilation?
Or was the machine owner at fault for excessive smoking around the computer.....
Very very interesting!!!!

This is ferret ball hair. Ferret's should be illegal.

Really this looks like a home built rig and the guy didn't get his fans set up right.
post #260 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

This is truly mind-boggling, if true! Corporatism at its worst. Can't they wear some gloves and a mask?! Where are we heading next? Apple campus is going to be sealed off in an antiseptic bubble?

At the least, I hope Apple refunded their money.

Does your car warranty cover the removal of bio hazards? Before anyone else gets caught up the the reactionary screaming tea baggers movement of "I hate facts" maybe check them:

http://www.topix.com/album/detail/ro...63JQKGCNFCSDBQ
Science and technology multiply around us. To an increasing extent they dictate the languages in which we speak and think. Either we use those languages, or we remain mute.
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Science and technology multiply around us. To an increasing extent they dictate the languages in which we speak and think. Either we use those languages, or we remain mute.
J G Ballard
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post #261 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

Because your parroting all of his don't-regulate-business, free-market-solves-everything crap.

Mr. "Intellectual" - free trade is not even close to a Ron Paul's invention, nor does he have a monopoly on it. That's an F in economics to go along with your F in history.

Nobody cares about Ron Paul here but you. Why don't you two get a room?

Considering your argument consists of a lame citing of Child Labor laws and obscure mining equipment regulations to support your "government knows best and solves all" argument, you appear to have a very weak case. I'll give you one more chance, then I'll argue your own side for you. Only because I can't stand your incompetence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

I am an actual intellectual. My mistake was in assuming that you had a better understanding of politics than you do.

I believe you have completely misidentified your mistake(s) AND you are totally unqualified to self-apply the title "intellectual". Without a resumé, very difficult to prove. Love to hear about your breakthroughs in physics and the classic literature you've authored.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

I didn't compare them to any of those people. I just showed the stupidity of your "logic" in which you imply that we shouldn't say bad things about smokers because some smokers also did good things. Again, I overestimated you.

Nice try on the "I am rubber and you are glue" defense with the selective quoting.

Yes, you did indeed equate smokers with rapists. Try accepting responsibility for your own words. Maybe when you got all agitated & irrational it's easy forget the details?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

Maybe you've done nothing to be proud of, never accomplished anything of significance, but that would be an area where we differ.

I said neither you or I, are as rad as serial smokers Mark Twain or Albert Einstein, after you denigrated everyone who smokes as inferior to non-smokers. If that offends your sense of accomplishment - get used to it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

So what? If I can find four pedophiles, six rapists, and someone who tortured animals that smoked, would that mean have any bearing on whether smoking should be viewed in a positive light?

Again - YOU equated smokers with rapists and pedophiles. I know this is difficult when you're frothing and spewing, but just go back a few pages and re-read.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

Yes.

Good luck with that. Everybody else disagrees with you - called a free society. Start asking around and see how many people want the government deciding what they can do.

*Remedial History Lesson*
According to the Constitution and Bill of Rights, the People only grant specific, limited powers to the Government. Not the other way around.

*Homework*
Read the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, and The Federalist Papers for background/detailed explanations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

No.

See above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

I don't care what they want. The fact that a mining company can find economically desperate people does not mean that the government should let the company send those people down without respirators, poisonous gas detectors, hearing protection, and eye protection.

You are correct... but only in your fairy tale world where all the big bad companies chain mindless workers in their sugar mines. I know this is a foreign concept, but most people can think for themselves and make big boy decisions.

1. A lot of people that work in mining are pretty damned educated and specialized in their field. But in your world, mining companies are evil, and see their experienced workforce as expendable, unless the government steps in. I guess they must have endless supply of money and poor people to keep retraining, and that nobody of a senior status ever sets foot in a mine? Think I might see your problem with tobacco now, do you prefer to smoke crack?

2. You're a big fan of government solutions, I'm surprised you've never heard of welfare. You must think poor people are so desperate that they'll work in super dangerous mines? Poor Tiny Tim with coal on his cheeks, a crutch in one hand and a pick axe in the other?

3. You think only the miners are affected in a disaster? How about the mining company? Why would they, in your wildest fantasies want a mine to collapse, stop their productivity, and lose all that money in the market? The government needs to remind them of this? How will their evil CEOs buy Ferraris?

Obviously, you haven't thought this through.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

You act like you said something profound when all you did was expose your failure to reason and think critically.

Dude, you got pØwned. No amount of selective quoting can change that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmaxwell View Post

Very. It's why McDonalds and Walmart can't have 12 year olds working 12 hour days seven days a week.

Profound, but you're ignoring the part where you said "government regulation" led to this. Kind of like saying US laws concerning theft, led to the prevailing notion that theft is bad. Try again.

Once again - it's common knowledge and undisputed that Child Labor laws/the government were ineffective in changing the abuses of children in this country during the Industrial Revolution and all that textile mill stuff you slept through in history. Your insistence of your ignorance is not a defense.

Pick a university, write their history department about it. In the meantime... I'll have fries with that.
post #262 of 332
I was dating this girl who smoked and who's computer kept shutting off randomly. I figured it was overheating when she said she had never cleaned it and owned it for over 5 years.

When I started taking it apart to clean it I found a light layer of black sludge all throughout the components inside. I had no idea how to clean it off.

On top of the black sludge stuff, there was dust all mixed in with it. It created a perfect insulation that trapped heat and put the computer into protection.

It makes sense that Apple doesn't allow smoking.
post #263 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by chronster View Post

I was dating this girl who smoked and who's computer kept shutting off randomly. I figured it was overheating when she said she had never cleaned it and owned it for over 5 years.

When I started taking it apart to clean it I found a light layer of black sludge all throughout the components inside. I had no idea how to clean it off.

On top of the black sludge stuff, there was dust all mixed in with it. It created a perfect insulation that trapped heat and put the computer into protection.

It makes sense that Apple doesn't allow smoking.

Now where did that come from?
post #264 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by canucklehead View Post

I feel little sympathy for smokers in this situation. If your computer is so obviously smoke damaged, why should Apple be responsible for fixing it under warranty?

I hold no quarter for smokers either, but that's not the issue--in spite of some people's efforts. No evidence has been reported either that the computer(s) were damaged by the smoke. All we have reason to believe is that Apple refuses to adequately ventilate the workplace and to honor their warranty. We don't even really know that the computers were hazards. (Since when is Apple tech support the expert on smoke residue, particularly when their mentioning nicotine shows a high degree of ignorance?)
post #265 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

China isn't going to call in the debt. The US is essentially borrowing back the money that we have pumped into the Chinese economy.

I'm saying it could if America decides to be dicks and stop buying from China. If America pumped money into China's economy and then China bought back a large chunk of American debt then who really holds the power? Why is America borrowing money in the first place? I thought it was the richest nation on earth. Clearly it isn't if it is at the mercy of the Arabs and the Chinese.

As for modern technology and China we have no idea what the hell they are up to. The Chinese government censures pretty much everything so we have no idea what they've got. I love China for this fact. The fact they have around a third of the world's population and yet we know nothing about them. That to me is awesome.

Also look at any university around the world and there will be a high amount of Chinese students. Who's not to say that a lot of the modern advances haven't come from Chinese students? It's like all those inventions often credited to white people when in fact it was a black person who invented it but due to sociopolitical factors at the time they go uncredited until many years, decades, centuries later.
post #266 of 332
Here's the thing that annoys the snot out of me the most about smokers. They whinge and moan that it's THEIR right to smoke and get all snotty when non-smokers try to legislate their ability to smoke but what they fail to realise it is also we non-smoker's right to not have our lungs filled with their pollutants and have our clothes not smelling of their horrible habit.

Until these twats realise there are more people living on this planet than themselves then we non-smokers will continue to try and get these idiots legislated so that they can only smoke in their own homes and only kill themselves. Considering smokers smoke through a filter and get lung cancer how much more so we non-smokers that have to walk through their smoke UNFILTERED? I'm sorry but I want to die doing something outrageously stupid not from cancer caused by thoughtless dickheads who don't care about anyone but themselves and who get all high and mighty when people who do think about others take them to task.

I am going to continue farting in smoker's faces because at least my farts won't kill people but they sure as hell will stick to their clothing. Let's see how they feel about that.
post #267 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foo2 View Post

No evidence has been reported either that the computer(s) were damaged by the smoke.

Umm that's not actually what Apple was claiming. They said they weren't going to look at the machine because it posed a health risk to their people according to the OSH listing of harmful substances. BIG difference there.
post #268 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

AppleCare is one year by default, 3 years extended. I’ve dealt with many machines from corporate to consumer over the decades and I can assure you that Apple’s warranties are the best I’ve seen/ They are very lenient compared to others. You can’t say that about Dell. Just hope to god that you’ll never need to use your Dell warranty.

Wrong.
Applecare is not 3 years extended. Applecare is 2 years extended as the first year is by default. So, you're getting 1 year default covered + 2 more years if you purchase Applecare = 3 years.
Dell is having "accidental damage", something which Apple doesn't have.

I have a Dell, and I have an UniMB as well.
For my Dell, they have sent the engineer down to my home to clean the dust out of the fan as it was too much and was getting hot (actually, they have replaced the whole cooling part including the fan). They did the same when my nVidia died.
PS: that happen when my Dell was under the 1-year default warranty...

I wanna see Apple doing that when my AluMB will encounter the same problem. (that'll never happen) [edit: doing the same will never happen]
PS: I have Applecare as well, so, I'm paying money to be "out of troubles".
PS2: I have just asked Apple to replace my very bad & washed out screen on my one year old AluMB, and they don't want. I have shown them side by side two similar AluMBs, and I have just asking them to make my computer display looking the same, but they don't want. I think it's unfair to pay the same money for same product and get a lower quality screen. So, Apple sux as well, don't kiss their axx and lick their boloks so much as they don't really deserve it.
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post #269 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowededwookie View Post

Umm that's not actually what Apple was claiming. They said they weren't going to look at the machine because it posed a health risk to their people according to the OSH listing of harmful substances. BIG difference there.

Yeah, right. How does Apple know a computer contains harmful substances in sufficient quantities to be harmful? (especially if they wouldn't even look at it?) They got an OSHA inspector at every repair station? The OSHA regulations on nicotine concern concentrations in air. Just containing a harmful substance doesn't mean the computer is harmful. Look at all the BFRs in their slightly older computers. Does Apple refuse to service them because of that?
post #270 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

He said modern technology. We all know that each invention is built upon the inventions that came before it as James Burke clearly points out and as you clearly state, "Much of our modern technology either came from or is dependent on Chinese (or Asian ideas)! China either has not been at the forefront of new technological breakthroughs, or have simply been keeping them to themselves.

You want modern? OK.

Hybrid rice: Yuan Longping aka "The Father of Hybrid Rice" 1973
computerized laser photocomposition (ie Laser typsetting): Peking University Professor Wang Xuan "the Father of Chinese Language Laser Typesetting" 1974
First synthesized protein (bovine insulin): Wang Yinglai 1966
Compound artemether (Used to treat Malaria that has become resistant to other methods) , in Tu Youyou 1972

What would you like with your main course of crow?
post #271 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foo2 View Post

Yeah, right. How does Apple know a computer contains harmful substances in sufficient quantities to be harmful? (especially if they wouldn't even look at it?) They got an OSHA inspector at every repair station? The OSHA regulations on nicotine concern concentrations in air. Just containing a harmful substance doesn't mean the computer is harmful. Look at all the BFRs in their slightly older computers. Does Apple refuse to service them because of that?

It's all about common sense, something sadly lacking in this world today.

If there is a risk, no matter how great or small, then it is often far better to act on the side of caution. How much plutonium is safe and not safe? How much nitroglycerin is safe and not safe? How much arsenic is safe and not safe? If nicotine is listed as a dangerous chemical then it stands to reason playing it safe is a far wiser course than rushing headlong into it.

Many industries today have an MSD sheet so maybe Apple has the same... I don't know because I've never been there. The fact Apple is taking the hard line and saying "NO" to these machines is showing that Apple wants to take safety seriously... Hell, there is two sections in the Apple Technician Training exam that if you fail that's it it doesn't matter if you pass everything else and those are ESD Precautions and Technician Safety. That's the level of commitment Apple has to technician safety and exposing a technician to hazardous substances would fall under technician safety.

Sure it may be to cover their butts if a technician gets hurt on the job to prevent them from suing them but at least they are going that extra mile to ensure everyone wins out... except the smoking consumer but then who cares about them?
post #272 of 332
Talk about a thread with a life of its own lol

Forget about Apple products. Everyone wants to debate lol
post #273 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

I fully agree with Apple here. Smoking kills more than 500,000 people every single year in the USA, more than 500,000 in Europe and more than 3 million worldwide every year. Besides the healthcare costs that could be used for other purposes and the of work hours lost. THIS IS OBSCENE.

injust reD. Report dated October 2, 2009. China is #1 in air polution. You know, where are macs are now made and most Chinese smoke. Anyway they then took an exampl using Mexico city, top ten I believe, ao are we, top 10, but living or breathing in Mexico city is the same as smoking two packs of cigarettes a day so you might want to think about where you walk. I know you want to stay away from LA, NYC and move to somewhere like vermount. Lowetst crime rate too. Grin. Something about if you live there you don't need a license to carry a concelled weapon but you have to be ready. As I stated early, I gave up for three years and know one grows up saying they want to smoke. Rememeber all the suits that tobacco were going after treen in advertising? Anyway dude, it's an addition and this article said Mexico city was like smoking two packs a day. And I know LA is not that much better, remember if you've done nothing wrong, cast the first stone but the sad part is, a smoker hasn't done anything wrong and having quit I can use food as an anlogy. Hungry? So. Dont eat. See what happens in a day. Smokings kind of the same way. You can't explain it. You just feel full (satisfied), after smoking. I've been married one year. We pray and hope to have children. My wife does not smoke and I pray that by the time we have wonderful, beautiful children, I no longer smoke. Some addiction exerts sat it's harder than giving up heorin or methadone so yours and anyones kind vibes/prayers appreciated. Lots going in. Si much so that even my PCP haw a plan to help me but says with all that's going on, she does not want to put my body through any stress at this time as my FSH/Fh levels are to low.
post #274 of 332
AppleCare is for repairing computers that break. Usual warranty practice is something like "we'll repair your appliance if it breaks under normal use, but not if the damage resulted from abnormal use", and they usually go on to amplify what "abnormal" use would be, like using your Mac under water, etc. I haven't looked at my AppleCare policy, but I'm confident that smoking is nowhere listed as constituting a condition of abnormal use for a computer. And I suspect that lack of mention would void Apple's voiding the warranty.

And if it were mentioned, I'd be enraged. If it broke down because of a build-up of lint and dust, I bet they'd fix it; how is smoke - "normal" tobacco smoke, not the smoke caused by the fire that burnt my house down - different? I can use my TV, etc., while smoking, without voiding the warranty, so why not my Mac?

And the health hazard part of this is outrageous. We're talking about smoke residue, not second-hand smoke, and I'd be curious to know what, if any, valid qualitative and quantitative studies have been done on the local or systemic effects of skin contact with cigaret smoke residue, and what these studies show. (None, I bet.) If you're a service technician, I can believe that some of the gunk you find in some computers is disgusting. And if you find it repugnant, or are concerned about a possible health hazard, why don't you put on rubber gloves, like a lot of occupations regularly require, from plumbers to medicine? (You know what you'll find if you poke around in someone's rectum, but doctors have to do it in the interest of health care. A doctor who refused to wear gloves would be a fool, at least; and if he refused to do his job thoroughly because he found it disgusting, he has no business being a doctor.) Or is Apple simply trying to discourage smoking among Mac users in the same spirit as making Macs greener? If so, they should stop selling to smokers altogether - as well as drinkers, the obese, and people who sit at their computers too much and don't exercise enough. (BTW, such a policy would probably be illegal, too.)
post #275 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

Are you saying when people from Apple go over to China, they are exposed to the conditions in China, and that Jobs should do more to protect them


Are you talking about the metal smelting factories? Its not exactly a clean process. And actually much to the benefit of the US environmentally that its not done here any more.

As I just posted, china =#1 in all pollution and that's where are macs come from they use to be USA only. Alas. Anyway was over at the EPA site and China was nuber one. Deeper in or a&r another site the EPA talked about Mexico city and how the air is equal to smoking two packs a day and los Angeles fairs no better.

Quitting is hard I stopped for 3 years and its a lot like food. You can't really desribe being hungry but once you eat or smoke;You are satisfied. Been married a year. Wife dies not smoke and want to give it up for her, me and someday, Lord willing, children. Butbman it's tough. It's been documented in the new England journal of medecine that harder then heroin.

On s happy note glad to see new iMacs beating the pro machines. Just wish they had the express slot for pros for things like:
http://emusician.com/hardware/universal-audio-uad-1209/

it makes a huge difference offloading all your fx onto another set if chips. Sort of lime pro tools and tdm cards vs native. So will hold onto my 15 " since it's gone there now v not sure why they call those pro machines. Backlit keys and dedicated gou? Hmmm. Most non mac laptops have dedicates gpu. Hopefully apple will see the sakes potential and release a headless iMac. Same specs.
post #276 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

I fully agree with Apple here. Smoking kills more than 500,000 people every single year in the USA, more than 500,000 in Europe and more than 3 million worldwide every year. Besides the healthcare costs that could be used for other purposes and the of work hours lost. THIS IS OBSCENE.

How about you learn the facts first before you spew BS. If no one smoked there would be even less money in healthcare to use so as to save extra lives. Healthcare actually makes money off of smokers (over 1 cent per cigarette to be precise).

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/...co-costs_N.htm
post #277 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Smokers are drug addicts. That's just a simple fact. They have no more control over smoking than a crackhead does over doing crack

Really, I smoked for nearly 10 years, and I haven't had one now nearly 3 years.

I have plenty of "control over smoking", it's all about whether or not you really care about your health enough to resist. I no longer feel the need to smoke, the old urges/habits do occasionally catch me off guard (when frustrated with something in particular). But the thought of actually smoking again repulses me, and the smell is repugnant.

The only people who can't stop smoking, don't want to or aren't willing to try.
post #278 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbdoc View Post

AppleCare is for repairing computers that break. Usual warranty practice is something like "we'll repair your appliance if it breaks under normal use, but not if the damage resulted from abnormal use", and they usually go on to amplify what "abnormal" use would be, like using your Mac under water, etc. I haven't looked at my AppleCare policy, but I'm confident that smoking is nowhere listed as constituting a condition of abnormal use for a computer. And I suspect that lack of mention would void Apple's voiding the warranty.

If you look at the AppleCare policy, you'll probably find that they say something along the lines of "this list is by no means exhaustive", i.e. they haven't listed everything that counts.
post #279 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by tawilson View Post

If you look at the AppleCare policy, you'll probably find that they say something along the lines of "this list is by no means exhaustive", i.e. they haven't listed everything that counts.

This case basically boils down to Apple saying we don't want to fix your computer because it's too dirty and we don't like our people messing with dirty computers, especially if the dirt might contain precipitated acrolein and polynuclear aromatic hydrocarbons (both are colloquially known as "tar"). The problem is all computers collect dirt so how much is too much? No one knows, as far as I can tell. The other problem is the known adverse health affects of acrolein and PAH's are via inhalation of combustion vapors. The computer isn't burning or smoldering, though.

If Apple wants to go down this road then they really should tell people up front that if they want warranty servicing on their computer, the owners are first responsible for seeing that the computer isn't excessively dirty. My hunch is had the owners of the denied coverage computers made some rudimentary attempt to clean their machines, the incidents would have never happened. Just my two cents (from a non-smoker).
post #280 of 332
This is going to result in a lawsuit Apple is going to lose. I'm not a smoker but give me a break.

It is hard to love a Mac when Apple's politics and business rules are sometime so terrible.
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