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Apple beat Google to Lala deal after failed bid for AdMob - report

post #1 of 49
Thread Starter 
Google was in serous discussions with music streaming service Lala before it was sold to Apple earlier this month.

Google and Apple have been battling to purchase some of the same companies in an attempt to gain leverage in the highly competitive tech sector. According to the Wall Street Journal, Google had been in serious talks with online music streaming company La La Media Inc. before Apple closed the $85 million deal earlier this month.

In November, Google purchased mobile advertiser AdMob Inc. for $750 million in a deal that trumped Apple's rumored attempts at acquiring the company. The Wall Street Journal's sources indicate Apple wanted to acquire AdMob as a defensive tactic to keep Google from obtaining inside knowledge about the workings of the App Store.

Both companies find themselves growing in ways that have begun to overlap with each other, creating competition where none had existed before. As Google has branched out from search to become a player in the mobile, desktop, and media arenas - Apple has grown from a hardware and software company into a content provider and mobile powerhouse.

The companies have become so competitive that Google's CEO Eric Schmidt resigned from Apple's Board of Directors in August. At that time Apple CEO Steve Jobs commented, "Unfortunately, as Google enters more of Apple's core businesses, with Android and now Chrome OS, Eric's effectiveness as an Apple Board member will be significantly diminished since he will have to recuse himself from even larger portions of our meetings due to potential conflicts of interest."

Both Google and Apple are awash in cash, with $22 and $34 billion respectively, meaning that both have the resources to continue to compete over promising new technologies and companies that would bolster their positions in the market.

The WSJ reports, "More acquisitions could be in the works as Silicon Valley deal making heats up overall. As the worst of the recession appears to have passed, tech companies are eager to pick up promising technologies before prices climb."
post #2 of 49
It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.
post #3 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.

The perception that Apple and Google were the best of friends has always been a fallacy.

They were allies against bigger players. No more, no less.
post #4 of 49
and in Microsoft news, they're just as stagnant as the economy. Hopefully, we'll be seeing some cool stuff come out of the Lala purchase.
post #5 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by nofear1az View Post

and in Microsoft news, they're just as stagnant as the economy. Hopefully, we'll be seeing some cool stuff come out of the Lala purchase.

They can barely get their core (in)competency right, never mind other markets.
post #6 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

They can barely get their core (in)competency right, never mind other markets.

Maybe Apple and MS.. Sorry, Ballmer, will team up to "kill google"
post #7 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

The perception that Apple and Google were the best of friends has always been a fallacy.

They were allies against bigger players. No more, no less.

Apple isn't stupid enough to go up against Google, nor do they have to.

Ballmer on the other hand, sees Apple's and Google's business models apparently garner them money, so he tries to copy them and leverage his monopoly on the desktop (which is failing) to try and be competitive, miserably.
post #8 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by sprockkets View Post

Apple isn't stupid enough to go up against Google, nor do they have to.

Ballmer on the other hand, sees Apple's and Google's business models apparently garner them money, so he tries to copy them and leverage his monopoly on the desktop (which is failing) to try and be competitive, miserably.

Why wouldn't Apple go up against Google?

The way I see it, I think Apple should make their OWN search engine and make it better than google and bing combined.

Mr. Jobs has a habit of seeing something, and making it 10x better. If I was him right now, I would do this:

1. Ban ads inside apps and use the excuse "We take 30% of all profits from paid apps, if they are free than we don't get any money". That will kill Google's investment in AdMob before they even profit from it.
2. Use Lala's music streaming to let people access their music from the cloud without needing to download and sync it everywhere.
3. Make our own search engine that has better features than other search engines. Use it to search iTunes too for music (something Google and MS can't compete with).
4. Look into technology that would be helpful to Google, and then buy it before they can.
post #9 of 49
Quote:
In November, Google purchased mobile advertiser AdMob Inc. for $750 million in a deal that trumped Apple's rumored attempts at acquiring the company. The Wall Street Journal's sources indicate Apple wanted to acquire AdMob as a defensive tactic to keep Google from obtaining inside knowledge about the workings of the App Store.

Three quarters of a billion dollars just to keep Google from getting "inside knowledge about the workings of the App Store"? I'm sorry, that doesn't sound very plausible.
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post #10 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.

They are frienemies.

Apple won't ever enter search as you know it today. If you own the largest app and music store you have a means for making money on ads. I'm surprised Apple hasn't turned some coin on the iTMS as of yet with ads. Maybe the Lala deal will help with that.

I'm sure Eric was privy to Apple's acquisition list and ran off with it.
post #11 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Three quarters of a billion dollars just to keep Google from getting "inside knowledge about the workings of the App Store"? I'm sorry, that doesn't sound very plausible.

I agree. And how would acquiring Admob even do that?
post #12 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Three quarters of a billion dollars just to keep Google from getting "inside knowledge about the workings of the App Store"? I'm sorry, that doesn't sound very plausible.

Why not? Apple's worth ~$180B, and the iPhone/Touch is a huge piece of that.

What do you think the App Store might be worth? My guess: many multiples of $750M. It's like saying that I would spend $1 to save, say, $2 in (even uncertain) value.
post #13 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Why not? Apple's worth ~$180B, and the iPhone/Touch is a huge piece of that.

What do you think the App Store might be worth? My guess: many multiples of $750M. It's like saying that I would spend $1 to save, say, $2 in (even uncertain) value.

Yeah, but we're not talking about the App Store IP, we're talking about AdMob, which at best would have had tangential info. Maybe Apple should start buying music labels, just in case?
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post #14 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Yeah, but we're not talking about the App Store IP, we're talking about AdMob, which at best would have had tangential info.

OK. Perhaps I don't fully understand the link between AdMob and the App Store then.

What does/did AdMob do, anyway?
post #15 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neotyguy40 View Post

Why wouldn't Apple go up against Google?

The way I see it, I think Apple should make their OWN search engine and make it better than google and bing combined.

Mr. Jobs has a habit of seeing something, and making it 10x better. If I was him right now, I would do this:

1. Ban ads inside apps and use the excuse "We take 30% of all profits from paid apps, if they are free than we don't get any money". That will kill Google's investment in AdMob before they even profit from it.
2. Use Lala's music streaming to let people access their music from the cloud without needing to download and sync it everywhere.
3. Make our own search engine that has better features than other search engines. Use it to search iTunes too for music (something Google and MS can't compete with).
4. Look into technology that would be helpful to Google, and then buy it before they can.

You know how people say it's too late to overtake the ipod ecosystem? Think that about Google when it comes to search.
post #16 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.

Apple has had 30 years to make even the slightest attempt at it and haven't.

They have failed with every Browser that they have introduced to the market.

Apple knows nothing about search engines, browsers or the cloud.

When a product fails you rebrand it. Thus the introduction of the .Mac still failing as MobileMe and now moving to the Internet under yet another new REBRANDING of Apple's cloud.

Enter Google. They have their hands in everything that Apple does and a thousand other projects.

Steve Jobs was a sucker if he believed that Google ever wanted anything but domination and control of the market.
post #17 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Why not? Apple's worth ~$180B, and the iPhone/Touch is a huge piece of that.

What do you think the App Store might be worth? My guess: many multiples of $750M. It's like saying that I would spend $1 to save, say, $2 in (even uncertain) value.

This article is comparing Apple's to Oranges. AdMob was for Google to get more revenue from internet advertising.

Apple purchased LaLa at an attempt to enter the streaming music cloud arena because Google has just signed a partnership with them.

Read more than this room and you'd have a clue to the bigger picture.

Apple is betting all their eggs on the Tablet. If it fails then the stock will tank. This is the reason Apple can't break through the 210 barrier for it's stock.

Everyone is waiting
post #18 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

They were allies against bigger players. No more, no less.

you mean like the big box religions?--sorry, couldn't resist--wrong forum.
post #19 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.

Apple hasn't got the first clue how to do search. Have you ever tried to find a technical support document by searching on apple.com? It's so bad that I go to google and do the same search in order to find where Apple is hiding the information.

Big tech firms are like imperial age European nations constantly shifting alliances in an effort to prevent any one from getting too strong. Today the battle is against Microsoft, but the allies are watching each other for signs that they intend to take over the role of conquering despot. Apple and Google are coming at this from different angles just like England (navy) and Prussia (army) did when they took on Napoleon. History tells us that less than a century later those allies were on opposite sides of the trenches. It's only a matter of time before Microsoft is reduced to a spectator in the great war between the hardware company and the internet software company.
post #20 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

OK. Perhaps I don't fully understand the link between AdMob and the App Store then.

What does/did AdMob do, anyway?

Two things, mainly, AFAIK-- infrastructure for mobile advertising, and analytics of same. It's not even clear to me what they would have to do with iTunes.
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post #21 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

OK. Perhaps I don't fully understand the link between AdMob and the App Store then.

What does/did AdMob do, anyway?

AdMob provides advertising in applications, notably iPhone Apps. AdMob can tell what applications sell, how often they are used, where people are using them... everything. That gives them a lot of insight into Apple's AppStore business.

With Google having this information, they can figure out how to best use resources on developing new apps, and marketing them.
post #22 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

AdMob provides advertising in applications, notably iPhone Apps. AdMob can tell what applications sell, how often they are used, where people are using them... everything. That gives them a lot of insight into Apple's AppStore business.

With Google having this information, they can figure out how to best use resources on developing new apps, and marketing them.

Right. But getting a window into how and where apps are being used and what's selling doesn't strike me as three quarter of a billion dollars worth of intel.
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post #23 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

They can barely get their core (in)competency right, never mind other markets.

Microsoft is starting to get it's core competency right!

Why just the other night I saw one of those entertainment news shows starring Mario Lopez (Saved By The Bell) and co-host (whoever she was) use Microsoft's "Surface" table and they had a vertical tv camera hanging over top the table looking down to show the female cohost drag a photo of some woman who was going to be their next segment and she did so using her, now get this, fingers and she even rotated the photo a little just using fingers. Fascinating stuff. Microsoft has a hit on their hands with that Surface Table...</Sarcasm>

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post #24 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Right. But getting a window into how and where apps are being used and what's selling doesn't strike me as three quarter of a billion dollars worth of intel.

Maybe that is why Apple didn't make a higher bid. I haven't heard anything about a bidding war between the two companies, but the devious thing for Apple to have done would have been to bid up the price or to express more interest in AdMob than they really ever had. Now that Google owns AdMob, I wonder if Apple will continue to allow AdMob to gather that information for free.
post #25 of 49
Good for Apple, can't let Google continue to bully the Big Boys and Girls. They already bulling the small guy, all those millions of blogs that have less than $100 in their Adsense accounts that have not been paid. Hope you read my iCrazee Mac Blog, enjoy the ads but actually click on them instead of letting advertising be free and just maybe Google will actually write all of us bloggers a check one day.
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post #26 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

They have failed with every Browser that they have introduced to the market.

What are you talking about?

Safari is in my not so humble opinion the best browser out there. I only ever use FireFox when I'm web developing just to make sure it looks right in other browsers and I only ever use IE when I'm accessing our stupid call system at work.

Mobile Safari is the best mobile browser on the market bar none so I fail to see how you think Apple has failed with every browser they've ever made when from memory they've only ever made two... Safari and iPhone Safari.

As for web development Apple is a major player in developing the HTML5 standard in fact it is streaks ahead in pushing standards than FireFox or Opera.
post #27 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bregalad View Post

Apple hasn't got the first clue how to do search. Have you ever tried to find a technical support document by searching on apple.com? It's so bad that I go to google and do the same search in order to find where Apple is hiding the information.

Actually Google is a very poor search engine as well.

In fact ALL search engines suck. They are all fundamentally flawed.

I wrote about this last year here:

http://www.nzmac.com/community-blog/...h-engines.html

I couldn't - and still can't - workout why it is that with so much processing power we are still using a boolean type search system instead of a natural language search?

The Internet has all this information locked up in it that we can't access because there's no real way to actually find what we want. Google is making it worse by selling results.

If Apple ever did get into search I believe they would go for natural language search which. If they pulled it off Google would lose its dominance because people would use a system that gives them what they want.

Wolfram Alpha is on the right track but they're ultimately aiming at the mathematical results which is moot for the majority of the world.
post #28 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.

apple is known for making enemy. I remember when they got emagic logic. Boy was avid livid. Ironically, apple doesn't have any hardware for the prosumer. You can't count the iMac as you can't upgrade a thing.

I then remember a spat with adobe and adobe released all windows updates with no mac for almost two years, ironically again, you can't find
pro trainers to learn about this wheras Avid has their Avid Pro Tool and Maudio for the prosumer, most which are in oc due to uogradability. Shoot you don't even have the express slot in the 15 anymore and Internet musicians editors producers are the future.
I wonder what could happen with a great google phone, matt media center some of mac fanboy friena love. It's like dvr and sharing anywhere. No restrictions like with the iPhone and which computer you have to use.
Anyway. What would happen I wonder if msft google amd
and some good phone and internet phone samsung net TVA joined together

has anyone else notices but it's all becoming about open source ala hearst and not closed end systems. The future is going to be great for those on board. The net TVA are already there. This is why I don't think apple paid subscription would work. All the sites like abc,?NBC,CBS, FX already have free shows so whoa going to want topay??
post #29 of 49
There's no way Apple are getting into search. No one will pay for a subscription search, and I just don't see Apple doing adverts on it, for the same reason Apple have really done adverts with iTunes... they're not clean, they're uncontrolled, a bad advert reflects badly on the people showing the advert.
post #30 of 49
It is nice to see Apple trying to get ahead of Google. It would like to see this LaLa acquisition benefit Apple's products for years to come.
post #31 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Right. But getting a window into how and where apps are being used and what's selling doesn't strike me as three quarter of a billion dollars worth of intel.

No, but besides that, AdMob makes its money on mobile platforms (i.e. iPhone) the way Google makes money on the web in general, by placing advertisements. AdMob is poised to grow on Apple's back. That's why it would also be interesting for Apple to own it. It would be a way for Apple to profit on the free ad-supported apps too.
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post #32 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Right. But getting a window into how and where apps are being used and what's selling doesn't strike me as three quarter of a billion dollars worth of intel.

bingo
google makes %99 of their income from ads

admob does nothing unique at all
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beatles
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post #33 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowededwookie View Post

Actually Google is a very poor search engine as well.

In fact ALL search engines suck. They are all fundamentally flawed.

I wrote about this last year here:

http://www.nzmac.com/community-blog/...h-engines.html

I couldn't - and still can't - workout why it is that with so much processing power we are still using a boolean type search system instead of a natural language search?

The Internet has all this information locked up in it that we can't access because there's no real way to actually find what we want. Google is making it worse by selling results.

If Apple ever did get into search I believe they would go for natural language search which. If they pulled it off Google would lose its dominance because people would use a system that gives them what they want.

Wolfram Alpha is on the right track but they're ultimately aiming at the mathematical results which is moot for the majority of the world.


are you saying we need a search engine to<< search>> the search engines ??

you may be correct

google sucks all day every day
sometimes on page 3 I find a non ad that fill my needs
and those google bots that ...
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post #34 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

It's just a matter of time before Apple enters the search business, and then it will be a full-blown official war between these two. How quickly times can change. One day they are the best of friends, and the next they couldn't have a bigger enemy.

nahhh
who cares dude
google is after adobe sun msft and all print media
google is a one horse show
everyone else has 4 or 5 irons in the fire

one tiny misstep and googles stock goes 1/2
and what if a 13 yr old pimple faced kid invents a better faster more dianostic way to show/sell receive ads ?? At a cheaper /free price ?
what if apple bans ads ??
or bans flash ??

f google
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post #35 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by lowededwookie View Post

Actually Google is a very poor search engine as well.

In fact ALL search engines suck. They are all fundamentally flawed.

I wrote about this last year here:

http://www.nzmac.com/community-blog/...h-engines.html

I couldn't - and still can't - workout why it is that with so much processing power we are still using a boolean type search system instead of a natural language search?

The Internet has all this information locked up in it that we can't access because there's no real way to actually find what we want. Google is making it worse by selling results.

If Apple ever did get into search I believe they would go for natural language search which. If they pulled it off Google would lose its dominance because people would use a system that gives them what they want.

Wolfram Alpha is on the right track but they're ultimately aiming at the mathematical results which is moot for the majority of the world.

google is just fine at natural language search. i use it to search support information for MS products and it's better at it than Microsoft's crappy support site and Bing. I can start typing in an error and it will automatically complete it for me
post #36 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neotyguy40 View Post

Why wouldn't Apple go up against Google?

The way I see it, I think Apple should make their OWN search engine and make it better than google and bing combined.

Mr. Jobs has a habit of seeing something, and making it 10x better. If I was him right now, I would do this:

1. Ban ads inside apps and use the excuse "We take 30% of all profits from paid apps, if they are free than we don't get any money". That will kill Google's investment in AdMob before they even profit from it.
2. Use Lala's music streaming to let people access their music from the cloud without needing to download and sync it everywhere.
3. Make our own search engine that has better features than other search engines. Use it to search iTunes too for music (something Google and MS can't compete with).
4. Look into technology that would be helpful to Google, and then buy it before they can.

The way I see it, with the strategy Google is pursuing, Apple has no choice but to go down the path of acquiring its own Maps, Search and advertising. And that's before I realised, as this article pointed out, how AdMob would provide insights into the App Store's inner workings. It is pertinent to note that Google has been the one to make the first hostile gambit, mainly with Android.

To quote Steve Jobs in an interview about Google (on their seeking not to get locked out of the mobile phone world): 'I actually think Google has achieved their goal without Android, and I now think Android hurts them more than it helps them. Its just going to divide them and people who want to be their partners.'

As it stands, any new features that Google may come up with in Maps, Search etc may lead to its new Android partners (Verizon, Motorola, Samsung, LG, HTC etc) demanding that they are not released to their bitter rival Apple's mobile platform and should remain Android-only features. Herein lies the conflict and division easily foreseen by Steve Jobs.

It's going to get a lot uglier, but as the saying goes "you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas".

Now which of the warring sides does that apply to - or is it both?
post #37 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neotyguy40 View Post

Why wouldn't Apple go up against Google?

The way I see it, I think Apple should make their OWN search engine and make it better than google and bing combined.

Mr. Jobs has a habit of seeing something, and making it 10x better. If I was him right now, I would do this:

1. Ban ads inside apps and use the excuse "We take 30% of all profits from paid apps, if they are free than we don't get any money". That will kill Google's investment in AdMob before they even profit from it.
2. Use Lala's music streaming to let people access their music from the cloud without needing to download and sync it everywhere.
3. Make our own search engine that has better features than other search engines. Use it to search iTunes too for music (something Google and MS can't compete with).
4. Look into technology that would be helpful to Google, and then buy it before they can.

Along your line of thinking, didn't I read a while back Apple had purchased a mapping company? What happened to that ... I assume a work in progress.
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post #38 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

google is just fine at natural language search. i use it to search support information for MS products and it's better at it than Microsoft's crappy support site and Bing. I can start typing in an error and it will automatically complete it for me

It's not natural language search. If you meta tag the most commonly used words in English and include the mechanism for completion of the most commonly expected words as you start typing them it gives the illusion one is getting semantic searching. Never mind the fact the context of such search will continue to be a crap shoot.
post #39 of 49
Stop bringing MS into every thread, please.
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post #40 of 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Along your line of thinking, didn't I read a while back Apple had purchased a mapping company? What happened to that ... I assume a work in progress.

Apple acquired Placebase and their Pushpin Map technology and I for one am very excited to see the fruits of this labor. I read that Pushpin is Google Maps on steroids. Apple should be able to leverage it's excellent design to good effect.

I'm glad that Apple is moving away from riding Google's coattails on technology. Google's good at many things but Maps has consistently steered me wrong and Google Docs are simply "ok" nothing really groundbreaking IMO.

Apple will probably find the next Admob and get into that as well. I love seeing these battles erupt..it's just like the "old days"
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