Apple TV 3.0 update not helping sales as AirPort routers lose share - Page 4

Originally Posted by MacTel

AppleTV is a hobby because there's no lock-in for users. If AppleTV gets subscriptions in 2010 then Apple will no longer call it a hobby. It will be a deal changer that will challenge cable companies.

It would be nice if a new hardware release was good enough to be a game console as well. Some of those iPhone games might be ok on the big screen.

Originally Posted by MacTel

It would be nice if a new hardware release was good enough to be a game console as well. Some of those iPhone games might be ok on the big screen.

Originally Posted by hmurchison

I don't think the next ATV is going to come out until the tablet comes out. Because the Tablet is going to deliver apps with larger interfaces it's a natural for Apple to coelesce the two together. The Tablet becomes much more powerful if the apps I run on it also work on the new ATV.

Originally Posted by Rock

Interesting idea, but what apps would people really want on their Apple TVs? Most apps seem optimized for the portable factor of the iPhone, Touch, or soon to be tablet. Games maybe? Anything else I probably can just use my regular iMac computer just as well.

I think most people would want apps like Netflix, Hulu, or other video services. Unfortunately Apple will never allow it since it would compete with their closed iTunes system.



If Apple wants to boost the Apple TV, and get people like me to buy it, they need to open it up. I would like to see:

Better hardware
DVD ripping into iTunes
More codec support
More customization of menus - Add, subtract, modify menus and folders
Maybe even customizable skins like in Plex

Right now the system is too closed. I have no interest in buying stuff from iTunes. It's over priced, full of DRM, is missing subtitles, and no extras. Besides I already own most of the movies and TV shows I like on DVD so there is no way I am going to buy them again.

Originally Posted by hmurchison

It's the same thing that's propelling widgets on TV and more. I think the worst thing about the Apple TV is its name. It does more (and it should) than just become an apparatus that enables the viewing of video. I would hope that the successor to the current Apple TV undergo a name change to something closer to what it really offers.

Apple's forced people to view the product through the lens of what they expect a TV device to be and thus they have opened themselves up to criticism about lack of DVR or DVD rip playback capabilities. Uncharacteristically, Apple has mismarketed this product and further panned it by Jobs' "Hobby" content.

Sell the successor for what it really is. A media device that can fetch Social content, calendar data, weather and much more. Open it up for the many fantastic developers out there and link it with the Tablet and they will once again find success. Apple profits by making the ecosystem work better than other companies offerings. They need to stick with this model.

Originally Posted by hmurchison

I'm not happy with home sharing at all. It still does not centralize content which means I have islands of media all over my home. iTunes 9 Home Sharing is certainly not the kind of innovative tool that we expect from Apple.

I really want to buy an Apple TV but it's hardware is old and slow. I'm looking forward to a ARM based unit that stays much cooler and a lot more functionality in software. I don't really a DVR and I damn sure won't be looking for Blu-ray but I need something that handles iTunes content very well and my own content well.

Originally Posted by hmurchison

That's why streaming is so important. The ideal solution would be a large NAS to centralize media but we're still not there yet.

Originally Posted by Orlando

I like Apple; however, If Apple were put AppleTV up against current game consoles I expect Apple would lose.

Originally Posted by BenRoethig

Not surprised. The Airport is well built and stylish, but prohibitively expensive. Knock $50 off of it and the 1TB time capsule as well as $100 off the 2TB capsule and they would sell very well.

As for AppleTV. Unless the movie studios permit Apple to give it the ability to import your DVDs, its not going to catch on, especially at $230. In a lineup of integrated multi-use devices, its a one trick pony that requires a separate DVD or Blu-ray player for your current movies, a PVR for recording your shows or games, and video game console if you want to do that. Combine one, two, or all of these features, or integrate it into TVs and it would sell much better.

Originally Posted by Dorotea

This sounds like a very pricey device... Not gonna happen.

Originally Posted by hmurchison

True but that also means that you are not the target market for Apple TV. SDTV marketshare can only decline so it makes little sense to add support for a format that's fading away rapidly..

Originally Posted by Gwydion

Appel TV is useful in countries where you can rent or buy movies and tv shows but in countries like Spain where you can't it's almost useless.

Originally Posted by minderbinder

No surprise that aTV isn't selling, there's no compelling reason to get it and there are competing boxes that offer much more.

I'd probably buy an aTV if it could stream Hulu, abc.com, netflix, and any other web video. I don't even really think dvd ripping (never gonna happen) or even other codec support is that important, on a new i7 machine handbrake can convert an hour show in about six minutes.

At this point, I'd consider something like a PS3 way before an aTV, it can do bluray (which doesn't interest me at all, but I'll probably get into it at some point just because I don't want to buy any more movies in DVD format), stream netflix, and play other video formats. Not to mention I hear it's not a bad game console, all for not much more than the aTV.

aTV isn't a bad hardware box, it just needs to be able to play back a ton more things. Or a price drop to like $99. Or both.

None of the airports have ever appealed to me, don't really get it.

Originally Posted by mitchelljd

Apple TV is a bit long on needing a vibrant upgrade. in my belief it needs

1- Larger hard drive 500gb+ option, also ability to add extra storage externally via USB, Firewire or ESata.
2- upgrade 1080p programming to hdtv
3- Open up the Apple TV - allow third party programs and developers, allow Netflix, Amazon, Blockbuster, Vudu and others to stream/download content to the device.

4- Apple TV app store- have it be able to be used for alot more. let developers create games, apps and so much more for

5- Videoconferencing - add ability for people to add a cam, hell apple could make a cam. so people can do video calls not just on their computer. but allow it to be used not only with ichat/aol chats, ie Skype app to use it. and who knows. other corporate ways. let Cisco create a app to use on it.
6- Blu-Ray - it is long overdue for apple to support Blu-Ray properly. to be a proper computer company it can't block technology which "competes" with itunes. Mac OS X must be open, as should all of Apple's products. sad to see things end up being more closed and well restricted to what Apple approves only.

7- Bluetooth - have the ability to add alot of extra add on's via this great tech. from headsets, to keyboards and gaming controllers
8- USB port fully functional - if you can add a camera, and external mic and more... why stop there... allow companies to add all sorts of extra devices and be able to build out a properly functional media center / computer apple tv.
9- full internet capability - yes, all my thoughts about making Apple tv capable require full internet capabilities and the ability for it to do oh so much more.

I would be alot happier if i could use my apple tv as a place for all the blu-Ray digital copies i have or maybe even a place to store movies i buy from apple itunes movie store. but do NOT want to keep on my laptop because it would take up too much room in my laptop. or even desktop.

Anyway, it would be awesome to really make more of this device as a proper home media center and computing entertainment center.

Originally Posted by macadam212

No compelling reason to get it? How about having whole movie collection stored on your computer, like I have, but I really want to watch my collection in the lounge rather than my desk. There's a compelling reason for you!!!

Originally Posted by lo_fye

I have a PS3 and although it can see videos stored on my NAS, it has issues with lots of codecs.
About 30% of the time, I have no choice but to watch whatever it is on my computer instead of the big screen :-|
Plus, the PS3 has a huuuge clunky remote, whereas the Apple Remote is so great.

Originally Posted by mitchelljd

most of this should be done in a device at about the same price. just has to be slightly larger, for hard drive.

the blu-ray could be added on a higher end model. so if people don't want BD, they don't have to get it.

Originally Posted by macadam212

No compelling reason to get it? How about having whole movie collection stored on your computer, like I have, but I really want to watch my collection in the lounge rather than my desk. There's a compelling reason for you!!!

Originally Posted by timgriff84

But why would you want your whole movie collection on your computer? I admittedly started it once but now really don't see the point. I hardly ever watch a film more than once and putting a DVD in a DVD player takes less time than ripping it. Plus as the apple tv isn't big enough to store all my films I would have to turn my mac on every time I want to watch a film. Seems great that it can do it but I just don't get why I would pay £250 to do somthing that seemingly has absolutely no advantage.

Originally Posted by timgriff84

But why would you want your whole movie collection on your computer? I admittedly started it once but now really don't see the point. I hardly ever watch a film more than once and putting a DVD in a DVD player takes less time than ripping it. Plus as the apple tv isn't big enough to store all my films I would have to turn my mac on every time I want to watch a film. Seems great that it can do it but I just don't get why I would pay £250 to do somthing that seemingly has absolutely no advantage.

Originally Posted by Dave K.

Can someone tell me why having my content (whether iTunes purchased or DVD ripped) sitting on both my AppleTV and my computer in the same residence is ideal?

Furthermore, exactly how many more AppleTV revisions is going to take for me to view my iMovie library content streamed from my Mac to an AppleTV?

Originally Posted by wtbard

Another strike against Apple TV is that it primarily only works with HDTVs. That really limits your market. It may take 5 to 10 years for that market share to become more accepted.

Originally Posted by vinea

It would be a Wii competitor...not the 360 or PS3.

Nintendo would have better games wile the aTV better for media. For casual games it would be good enough and with iPhone and iPod Touch controllers a lot of the accelerometer gameplay based games would work.

Originally Posted by Grunt21

That's cool info if you have an iMac or big machine, but for me, it means having to constantly set up and dismantle the whole external drive from my notebook every time I leave for work. When I take my notebook from the house, my wife wouldn't be able to use this setup to watch media on the TV until I come home and set it all up again. The whole reason I bought the WDTV in the first place was that it freed up my notebook and offered a permanent solution for both of us.

Originally Posted by MacTripper

I would like to see the AppleTV take off, be another Netflix, unfortunately in order to get decent downloads you need cable...and Comcast just bought NBC...ouch.

AT&T is going to hang up land lines, so there goes DSL.

Originally Posted by Dorotea

Absolutely unrealistic.

Originally Posted by pt123

Steve Jobs calls it a hobby so everyone else calls it a hobby. Funny how everyone focuses on what Steve Jobs say, isn't it?

Originally Posted by Dorotea

Actually the advantage is storage space of DVDs. A large hard drive takes up much less space than drawers and shelves full of DVDs.

Originally Posted by Orlando

Game-console sales are driven by content, especially exclusive content. Nintendo has Wii Fit, Wii Sports and Mario. These are big name franchises and are only available on a Nintendo system. Casual games are simply not system sellers. If you have a AppleTV you might then buy casual games for it, but very few new customers will buy a AppleTV for casual gaming.

In addition, unless Apple sells a lot more AppleTVs (or at least get the public excited about it), developers won't bother with the platform and will focus their resources elsewhere.

Originally Posted by Alfiejr

maybe not. there is a very good case to add an optional BD drive to AppleTV. because it would allow Apple to continue to avoid adding BD to desktop and laptop Macs. any computer with BD must be HDCP compliant. which means the entire OS must be programmed to enforce its DRM, even blocking playback of unauthorized media (if a "flag" is triggered by content owners, which to date has not happened). we know Jobs/Apple do not want any third parties to have any control over any part of OS X, ever.

but the AppleTV is already HDCP compliant, so adding BD to it raises no new DRM issue. so it would make sense to sandbox it there, in a peripheral device.

Originally Posted by Alfiejr

if AppleTV allowed you to mirror your iPhone/touch games simultaneously on your big screen HDTV, that would be terrific fun. that would mean there are already tens of millions of game controllers in consumer homes today. that would mean there are already tens of thousands of games available - many being "exclusive content". that would mean kids and adults already have favorites and know how to play them. Then all they would need to bridge the connection wirelessly is a $229 AppleTV - which btw also does some other things.

iPhone games keep becoming more varied and sophisticated. multiplayer games are now being developed too. yes, they are very different than traditional game counsel or PSP/DSI games - but that is actually a very compelling reason to buy them - something new and different! and the games prices are so much lower than Sony/Nintendo charge, it would undercut their market savagely.

Originally Posted by Alfiejr

maybe not. there is a very good case to add an optional BD drive to AppleTV. because it would allow Apple to continue to avoid adding BD to desktop and laptop Macs. any computer with BD must be HDCP compliant. which means the entire OS must be programmed to enforce its DRM, even blocking playback of unauthorized media (if a "flag" is triggered by content owners, which to date has not happened). we know Jobs/Apple do not want any third parties to have any control over any part of OS X, ever.

but the AppleTV is already HDCP compliant, so adding BD to it raises no new DRM issue. so it would make sense to sandbox it there, in a peripheral device.

i do not think Apple will do this tho, because Jobs clearly wants to shift the market away from physical media like DVD's and BD to on-line sales instead.