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AT&T to release Android, WebOS devices & new app platform - Page 2

post #41 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

Verizon also has not made clear if phones which only use the Verizon app store get a higher subsidy than phones which can also use non-Verizon app stores. I think the pricing and app store issues cannot be separated within the overall negotiation.

Well, I really can't say either way. But that would mean that all phones would be in the same boat because all phone manufacturers are making, or have made their own app stores, and it's not likely that they will give them up because they're making them the centerpiece of their operations. So they would all be at the same level there.
post #42 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

There are 500 million CMDA2000 users, 130 million EV-DO users, if the EV-DO users are a subset of the CDMA ones, I don't know, but I guess they would be.

I was being conservative. I don't know how many are on that in China.
post #43 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That would be a good time to do it, especially with other vendors getting closer to the iPhone so waiting for a full year to pass before giving us the iPhone OS demo, new SDK and then the new HW may not be viable strategy anymore.

Maybe Apple is going to a twice a year iPhone refresh - as it would make sense to have releases in March/April and Sept/October (instead to June/July and January).
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post #44 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"Our goal is to bring more apps to millions more of our customers who want convenient access to the market's hottest apps," de la Vega said. "At the same time, in the future, we plan to go well beyond mobile devices to spur apps development."

de la Vega then added, "Although we hope to entice customers to download and use these apps, we hope it doesn't become so popular as to strain our fragile network. By 'millions more of our customers' I actually only mean about 'hundreds more of our customers' while we build out our backbone-of-a-jellyfish infrastructure."

de la Vega ended by shutting down the portable cell phone tower he brought to provide reception for his Motorola StarTac.
post #45 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Maybe Apple is going to a twice a year iPhone refresh - as it would make sense to have releases in March/April and Sept/October (instead to June/July and January).

I'd like to see Apple do a .5 update at about the 6 month mark. Others are moving pretty rapidly. Apple appears to be behind as they rarely release major features before the new version comes out. Overall, Apple has as much of an upgrade as they do, it just takes the full year. But for competitive purposes, I'm not sure the once a year upgrade is as helpful as it was when stodgier companies were taking two years between upgrades.
post #46 of 96
Just cause at&t didn't talk about the iPhone, doesn't mean their exclusivity is gonna over and done.
At&t and Apple are a unique partnership. At&t let's Apple be Apple, and Apple let's at&t be at&t.
It's like them saying- "hey, I'm the one with the cellphone, and you're the one giving the phone its service. You do what you gotta do, and I'll just manage the phone itself. Plain and simple."
And then there was an agreement!
So at&t is being smart enough, and minding its own business, and letting Apple take care of the sales.
post #47 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morky View Post

That won't work, because LTE will need to fall back to CDMA on Verizon's network when LTE is not available, just like 3G falls back to Edge and GPRS. Apple needs a CDMA-capable phone to support Verizon within the five years. The buzz is growing; the Verizon iPhone is coming.

Not what I suggested. Your fall back is a free VZ phone with a $35 dollar a month plan. Some people would consider that pocket change. LTE is not going to be for everyone in the beginning.

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post #48 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

My point about a CDMA phone being "dumb" is that it's a fading technology and pretty much not used anywhere except the USA. I think the conventional wisdom is that even if the entire USA was on CDMA, it probably wouldn't make sense to make a CDMA phone. It's a dead end technology.

CDMA might have no long term future, but it will still take years before it disappears. In the meantime, the lack of an CDMA iPhone allows Android to compete unopposed. Apple cannot rely on people switching from Verizon to AT&T in order to sell iPhones, they need to be on all major networks.
post #49 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifail View Post

Well they have been on life support for the past year or more. Palm has made quite the resurgence, but being exclusive to Sprint for so long was incredibly silly (or they were testing the water) They just went international and are now bringing the action to AT&T and Verizon, which gives the platform a much better chance at getting recognition and more widespread acceptance. As nice as the Pre is...Sprint? F*ck that lol.

RIM is successful because "It just works". People use phones as a communication device and the Blackberry has no superior in this regard. It doesnt have the eye candy that other platforms have (yet) or the webkit (yet) but the platform works and remarkably well.

Anyways, AT&T needs more phones other than the iPhone and 4 BlackBerrys so i see this as a great boost for AT&T. Hopefully the HTC HD2 makes its way to AT&T since the Nexus One is going to be on T-Mo and Verizon.

blackberries work as long as RIM's datacenters don't crash and your phone is a paperweight since everything goes through BIS or BES.
post #50 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

blackberries work as long as RIM's datacenters don't crash and your phone is a paperweight since everything goes through BIS or BES.

What happens when Apples activation servers crash?
post #51 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

What happens when Apples activation servers crash?

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post #52 of 96
It may not necessarily be true, but AT&T shows up some chicken business manners when seen from outside. Why not?

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post #53 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

What happens when Apples activation servers crash?

Wouldn't need them if the iPhone was sold in the US unlocked
post #54 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by bartfat View Post

Verizon, who would presumably want to restrict the iPhone experience to almost the bare minimum, so that it would be able to force its own app store down the throats of consumers tied to that carrier rather than the App Store.

I used a Palm Treo on Verizon for years. It had no crippling by Verizon, and the regular Verizon app store was not even available on it.

There is precedent for Verizon offering an unrestricted smartphone.
post #55 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Well, check how much they fell today after that announcement, along with others made at CES.

Oh, I'm not concerned with today's or tomorrow's price. Just like you, I'm a long.

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post #56 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

What happens when Apples activation servers crash?

Nothing to current users. What happens to Blackberry users when the same thing happens? Or Palm users, or Nokia users, or Win Mobile users etc?
post #57 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Nothing to current users.

Since when does Apple activate phones and not the carriers?
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post #58 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

Oh, I'm not concerned with today's or tomorrow's price. Just like you, I'm a long.

I'm just hoping that the tablet is close to what people think it will be in expectations, or there WILL be a sell-off.
post #59 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Since when does Apple activate phones and not the carriers?

Only with AT&T does Apple play a part in that.
post #60 of 96
Thank g-d, AT&T has been needing an Android phone for so long. I was about to buy an iPhone, but now I think I'll wait until "First half of 2010" for my AT&T Android... whenever that will be.
post #61 of 96
Apple will most certainly go to all other GSM carriers in the US sometime this year. iPhone 4G might even do CDMA, though there is kinda no point with 4G coming around. In any case exclusivity should have ended aready (starting Jan 1 for example) but it seems like there is something stopping Apple from leaving ATT. At first I thought it was technical, like the ability to do visual mailbox or have a fast enough 3G, but it seems like most carriers can do this now and so there is no point of sticking to just one carrier.
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post #62 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheff View Post

Apple will most certainly go to all other GSM carriers in the US sometime this year. iPhone 4G might even do CDMA, though there is kinda no point with 4G coming around. In any case exclusivity should have ended aready (starting Jan 1 for example) but it seems like there is something stopping Apple from leaving ATT. At first I thought it was technical, like the ability to do visual mailbox or have a fast enough 3G, but it seems like most carriers can do this now and so there is no point of sticking to just one carrier.

There's only one other GSM carrier, T-Mobile, the stepchild of the mobile industry. They're terrible. I can imagine the complaints coming from iPhone users on their network. It will make AT&T seem like paradise.
post #63 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by epheterson View Post

Thank g-d, AT&T has been needing an Android phone for so long. I was about to buy an iPhone, but now I think I'll wait until "First half of 2010" for my AT&T Android... whenever that will be.

Good for you!
post #64 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Nothing to current users. What happens to Blackberry users when the same thing happens? Or Palm users, or Nokia users, or Win Mobile users etc?

Well for Nokia users, Nokia has nothing to do with the activiation process, so nothing.
post #65 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheff View Post

Apple will most certainly go to all other GSM carriers in the US sometime this year. iPhone 4G might even do CDMA, though there is kinda no point with 4G coming around. In any case exclusivity should have ended aready (starting Jan 1 for example) but it seems like there is something stopping Apple from leaving ATT. At first I thought it was technical, like the ability to do visual mailbox or have a fast enough 3G, but it seems like most carriers can do this now and so there is no point of sticking to just one carrier.

Of course there's something stopping Apple from leaving ATT. Its the lovely subsidy deal Apple got in which ATT got raped.
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post #66 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

Well for Nokia users, Nokia has nothing to do with the activiation process, so nothing.

The point was basically, nothing for any of them. You've raised an issue that doesn't exist.
post #67 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

The point was basically, nothing for any of them. You've raised an issue that doesn't exist.

They why was there such an outcry when the last iPhone was released, with all the people that couldn't activate them?
post #68 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

They why was there such an outcry when the last iPhone was released, with all the people that couldn't activate them?

What did that have to do with Apple? Besides, there was no other phone in history that sold in such great numbers in the first few days. As Apple passed buyer data to AT&T, it was AT&T's problem mostly.

There's also a big difference between having trouble activating a new phone for a possible few hours for some people, and ALL of your users losing their e-mail for hours, or a day, and nor being able to e-mail during that time.
post #69 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

What did that have to do with Apple? Besides, there was no other phone in history that sold in such great numbers in the first few days. As Apple passed buyer data to AT&T, it was AT&T's problem mostly.

They why do all the articles on the web mention people being stuck in iTunes?


Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

There's also a big difference between having trouble activating a new phone for a possible few hours for some people, and ALL of your users losing their e-mail for hours, or a day, and nor being able to e-mail during that time.

Well both would cause a user satisfaction problem.

And I found the process of getting a new SIM when you upgraded your connection a bit funny, the only time I have needed to get a new SIM card for an upgrade was when they changed the spec of them.
post #70 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

What did that have to do with Apple? Besides, there was no other phone in history that sold in such great numbers in the first few days. As Apple passed buyer data to AT&T, it was AT&T's problem mostly.

Reinventing history? iTunes servers were the issue last go-round.

http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=1972
http://www.engadget.com/2008/07/11/i...ers-being-sen/
post #71 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Well you are just thinking of the USA.

My point about a CDMA phone being "dumb" is that it's a fading technology and pretty much not used anywhere except the USA. I think the conventional wisdom is that even if the entire USA was on CDMA, it probably wouldn't make sense to make a CDMA phone. It's a dead end technology.

Dead end maybe, but CDMA accounts for a good portion of the USA mobile network and we still account for over half of all iPhone sales.
post #72 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I'm just hoping that the tablet is close to what people think it will be in expectations, or there WILL be a sell-off.

I fully expect a sell-off anyway. The question is how much? If it manages to dip to $185 or lower, I'm loading up like there's no tomorrow. So far 2010 is shaping up pretty good despite talk of potential hyperinflation. Either way, flexibility is key to survival in this environment.

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post #73 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

They why do all the articles on the web mention people being stuck in iTunes?

I havent read all the articles on the web, congrats for doing so.

Mostly having to do with AT&T's service getting bogged down when iTunes attempted to hand it off.



Quote:
Well both would cause a user satisfaction problem.

And I found the process of getting a new SIM when you upgraded your connection a bit funny, the only time I have needed to get a new SIM card for an upgrade was when they changed the spec of them.

You're overseas, right? I can't account for how they do things over there.

But I'd rather wait a few hours to get activated than lose a whole days messages, and not be able to message during that time.

It's not equivalent.
post #74 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by StLBluesFan View Post

Reinventing history? iTunes servers were the issue last go-round.

http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=1972
http://www.engadget.com/2008/07/11/i...ers-being-sen/

Your misunderstanding what happened.
post #75 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

You're overseas, right? I can't account for how they do things over there.

Well 95% of the world is overseas compared to you (and 99.94% compared to me)

Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

But I'd rather wait a few hours to get activated than lose a whole days messages, and not be able to message during that time.

You seem to keep referring to RIMM, I don't have a blackberry, and don't really want one, so I would rather have the activation straight away, especially if it is an upgrade.


Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It's not equivalent.

The end result is, poor user experience.
post #76 of 96
[QUOTE=jfanning;1546274]Well 95% of the world is overseas compared to you (and 99.94% compared to me)[/uote]

Yes, well, most of them so far don't have a phone.

Quote:
You seem to keep referring to RIMM, I don't have a blackberry, and don't really want one, so I would rather have the activation straight away, especially if it is an upgrade.

I believe you were the one using them as an example.

Quote:
The end result is, poor user experience.

It's true.

But one is much worse than the other.

Also, all iPhone purchasers didn't have that problem, and out of the ones who did, the delay was from a few minutes to a few hours. It was documented pretty well here in our forums, with people posting their experiences, both good and bad.
post #77 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I believe you were the one using them as an example.

Nope someone else mentioned them, I asked a question.
post #78 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

Nope someone else mentioned them, I asked a question.

Hmmm!
post #79 of 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Hmmm!

You can hmmm all you like, it is still the truth
post #80 of 96
I would argue that this depends on sales. You only have the opportunity to introduce new features once. If sales remain strong without significant software upgrades, then its better to hold major upgrades for later when they can be used to push the new OS.

It can also be argued that the third party apps themselves constantly introduce new functionality for the iPhone. Apple doesn't have to do that in the way that other platforms have to.


Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I'd like to see Apple do a .5 update at about the 6 month mark. Others are moving pretty rapidly. Apple appears to be behind as they rarely release major features before the new version comes out. Overall, Apple has as much of an upgrade as they do, it just takes the full year. But for competitive purposes, I'm not sure the once a year upgrade is as helpful as it was when stodgier companies were taking two years between upgrades.
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