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Microsoft, HP introduce touchscreen 'slate PC' at CES - Page 4

post #121 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by antkm1 View Post

An 88% + market share is hardly the sign of a floundering company.

Don't you love it when a PC head pulls Microsoft's market share out of their butt as evidence they are better?

I hope Microsoft's share stays big forever. They can have it and all the viruses and bullcrap that go along with it. I'm delighted to be a minority so no one bothers me.

Regarding Windows 7, I still use XP (sadly) but isn't the consensus that 7 is just a bug fix for Vista that should have been given out free with an apology, not a whole new OS?
post #122 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

You sure sound angry to me, as do a lot of other posters on this thread. People here are making a mockery of PC fanboys' "hysterical" posts on whatever outside site, but all I need point to are some of the ridiculous posts being spewed in this thread. Let's have some balanced perspective, shall we? Belittling the other side here at AI and going over there to troll makes you all look like 5 years olds (PC trolls are despised here at AI, but yet it's seemingly alright to go troll for Apple elsewhere). And Microsoft does not equal HP. Microsoft has become a spokesman for the PC industry, yes, but Microsoft has been and continues to be primarily a software company. Microsoft's "whoring" of its OS to the PC hardware makers is the nature of the PC industry. Why does it bother you so much? The Apple fanboys here constantly use the hardware+software vs. software debate in their defense of Apple/smearing of Microsoft, do they not? And yet here you are, as well as others, sneering and jeering at Microsoft because they didn't manufacture and deliver on a rumored hardware product that was only a concept in the first place. Perhaps it is the Apple mentality that concepts are expected to become the real deal, I don't know. If I earned a dime for every time product concepts didn't become reality, whether from other industries (automotive comes to mind), or even the tech industry, I'd be rich.

Can't really disagree with any of that. However, I will say that the software on everybody's devices does have its downsides, even if "whoring" is excessively pejorative. Maybe "promiscuous"?
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post #123 of 227
The form factors of all tablets thus far, have sucked the reason i was much looking forward to the Courier would be the new form factor similar to a laptop and would give me a reason to replace my laptop if it worked well. Now if you are gaming or doing some serious hardware accelerated work then im sure tablets are 100% out of the question.

While tablets seem to be the new "in" thing again for 2010, the problem i have is how am i going to integrate this into my life? It needs to REPLACE something in some way, not be another device for me to tote around.

Every feature these tablets have like media playback, web surfing, email and ebook reading are just duplicate features from either a iPhone or Blackberry (sole reason id never buy a Kindle...no point), so why if you have said smartphone is this even worth buying?
post #124 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

And then we see MS put their personal computer desktop OS on a tablet device. Apple has moved on. But MS is still clinging to the past.

MS has their software on phones, cars, their own game system, Zune, PDAs, a wide variety of PC form-factors, and probably more things. How is that clinging to the past?

I really don't think MS cares all that much about the tablet/slate space. "Oh yeah, our OS runs on that, and this, and that, and this other thing, and.." What MS doesn't provide is a nicely tailored UI for all those different form-factors. I don't know if that's MS's fault or the hardware makers.

"Look! We got Windows 7 running on a 'slate'! Isn't that cool!?" Um, no. Because you didn't tailor the UI for that device. Then MS and the hardware makers point fingers at each other. MS says, "Hey, we have a decent Touch API in the OS, the vendors need to write a compelling user environment on their device." The vendors say, "Yeah, um, we don't do software so much."

- Jasen.
post #125 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasenj1 View Post


I really don't think MS cares

Forgive me for editing your post, but that right there sums up the situation perfectly.

Just have the OS on as many devices as possible, whatever the outcome, and win on sheer volume of unit sales. Quanity over design and attention to detail. MS doesn't really care about the Average User. It comes through in their awkward, poorly thought out keynotes. MS (ballmer and co.) talks to people as if they were IT managers at a board meeting. Apple talks to people as if they are people.
post #126 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by camroidv27 View Post


Anyhow, I'd love to see Apple at this point NOT release a "Slate" PC. Just to show other companies the "You all just chase us" mentality they have.

Everyone (including Apple since they do copy on a few things too) needs to stop chasing the other dogs tail, and forge their own path! Tons of creative minds out there, make use of them. All computers (Mac, Windows, Linux) do the same things in the same way... break the mold. If I had the talent and patience, I'd program it myself, but I can't.

Erm...Apple haven't admitted to any tablet. It's all forum speculation...all of it. Apple aren't responsible for other people's hopes and dreams. However i bet they are watching all the frenzy with glee.
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post #127 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Apple talks to people as if they are people.

You mean like

"Change your apps name. Not that big of a deal.

Steve"

Yeah right!!
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post #128 of 227
Five hundred dollars!!!

Five hundred dollars!!!

Five hundred dollars for a picture frame without a keyboard!!!

Bwahahahhhaahhhaaahhhhaaa!!!
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post #129 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Forgive me for editing your post, but that right there sums up the situation perfectly.

Just have the OS on as many devices as possible, whatever the outcome, and win on sheer volume of unit sales. Quanity over design and attention to detail. MS doesn't really care about the Average User. It comes through in their awkward, poorly thought out keynotes. MS (ballmer) talks to people as if they were IT managers at a board meeting. Apple talks to people as if they are people.

On the nose. Microsoft is trying to pander to the consumer market but still talks and designs for the business market. Although they are close to doing it right with the XBox 360 and the Zune HD (yes I love my Zune HD so sue me ), Ballmer still doesn't know how to properly capitalize on the consumer markets. And I have often wondered if it is a corporate culture issue where MS allows the different departments to do what they want versus Apple that has a clear 'buck stops here' man with Jobs. It is clear that some departments at MS actually know what they are doing while others have their heads lodged somewhere unnatural. And it all just clashes.
post #130 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by iReality85 View Post

And yet here you are, as well as others, sneering and jeering at Microsoft because they didn't manufacture and deliver on a rumored hardware product that was only a concept in the first place.

Well, there's always going to be sneering and jeering at AI, but when the last entry of the keynote coverage of your event from one of the top tech sites in the world reads:

Quote:
From Engadget: "Thank you very much." And Robbie is gone. And... that's it? Wow. Incredibly boring. Incredibly incredibly boring. Really.

you have to think your presentation was a bit of a flop.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/06/l...-2010-keynote/

As far as the "rumored hardware product that was only a concept" that you seem to be dismissing - I really hope that isn't so. The creatives I worked with thought that was a far more interesting product than a slate form factor. We've been working with Cintiqs for years (so "slate" computing is old hat to us) and having a portable product with an extra screen would be a HUGE selling factor for the creative market. Among my associates, we are very disappointed today, and we're all pretty much agreed we're not buying in to the Apple slate as a professional product until we see if the Courier shows up in the next year. So your "only a concept" is the only MS product any of the Mac-head creatives I work with really, really want.

I would say to MS, stop trying to make everyone somewhat happy with every product and try and get your hardware manufacturers to make a few people extremely happy with a few products. There's nothing like a few zealots who can't stop talking about their gadgets to spread the word. If you don't have people who "get it" and "love it" you're not going to inspire passion in your products.
post #131 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifail View Post

Every feature these tablets have like media playback, web surfing, email and ebook reading are just duplicate features from either a iPhone or Blackberry (sole reason id never buy a Kindle...no point), so why if you have said smartphone is this even worth buying?

Tablets are a terrible form-factor for productivity and media creation.
But they are an ideal form-factor for media consumption.

Apple have figured out that there are a lot of professional users of computers. And for that market they make the MacBook Pros and the like.

But Apple also know that there are a lot of computer users - who do little more than watch media, browse the web, and do a little light face-booking.

For this audience, the full-blown OS / Notebook OS is entirely the wrong product. Mac OS X is wrong. Windows 7 is wrong. Ubuntu is super wrong. So how about a computer, purpose built for that audience.

Yes you can do some of this on a phone. But I would never read a book on a phone or want to watch a full length movie on a screen the size of a business card.

C.
post #132 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasenj1 View Post

MS has their software on phones, cars, their own game system, Zune, PDAs, a wide variety of PC form-factors, and probably more things. How is that clinging to the past?

Because they put a desktop OS, including it's interface, on a "slate" device. That is the pretty much the definition of clinging to the past.

Some of the other devices you list (Zune, etc) at least had some innovation in the UI. But why in god's name would they run a Windows 7 UI on a 10" screen?

Answer: Because Apple hasn't yet showed them what a good UI for such a device looks like. Once Apple shows their device, you can get MS will begin working on a new interface for these types of devices.

Anyway, the point of my post was that Apple has for many years, probably longer than any of us would suspect, been working towards the day when the personal computer as we currently know it is gone.
post #133 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Microsoft has nothing new to show. Its been that way for a while now. That isn't news. Microsoft isn't the one Apple should be concerned about, its Google.

Every company has its dark times, clearly Microsoft is in those dark times. Its not like Apple hasn't had theirs and you know what hey say about being #1, there is only one place to go.

I remember when Apple had to struggle to get 2% market share on any of their products. Apple is doing very well now but it would be foolish to think its always going to stay that way. Steve Jobs isn't going to be at Apple forever and in history their have been alot bigger and stronger companies then Apple have have gone downhill fast. AIG and GM come to mind.

You must be out of your mind to compare ford/Aig to Apple, good luck with your microsoft stock.
post #134 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post

History will show this for what it is... a desperate move by a floundering company.
It is almost as if they want to be accused of copying Apple.

I thought of the PC brands HP was actually passing up Dell.

Still, I have to agree that this is just sad. Sad, sad, sad.... It looks fairly sleek but that commercial didn't give me a hint of anything significant. It's as if it was saying to me, "Look, I can do the same things you can do on an iPhone, except mine is huge. I'm split between whether I want to be a Kindle or an iPhone, I'm so confused!"

Lame, just lame. They totally need to fire their ad agency cause from that commercial I'm more likely to jump to the conclusion that it's just a glorified digital picture frame that can browse the web.
post #135 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

That's the problem. MS whoring its OS out to all takers regardless of the hardware it runs on. MS chose HP (or HP chose MS, whichever, LOL.) And HP produced THAT.

MS = HP.

Done.

I'm not angry, just incredibly amused.

Oh, but you do sound angry, bitter, quite a bit scared as well. No idea why, though.
post #136 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by pembroke View Post

Yep, tablet PCs have been around for ages - screens you could remove off of a keyboard and such.


and slate computers have been around for ages. They typically used pen input as touchscreen tech was pretty poor back in the 90's

M$ even had "windows for pen computing" back on Windows 3.1 to support that market
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post #137 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTBLQ View Post

You don't demo/debut a product like that... if it's not ready to buy today or next month don't show it.

how long before the release of the iPhone did Apple demo it?
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post #138 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

That's the problem. MS whoring its OS out to all takers regardless of the hardware it runs on. MS chose HP (or HP chose MS, whichever, LOL.) And HP produced THAT.

MS = HP.

Done.

I'm not angry, just incredibly amused.

not angry, but definitely stupid

ya notice all of those PC's on the stage with the monkey? they are not all HP computers... MS did not choose HP, but *USED* HP
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post #139 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

Because they put a desktop OS, including it's interface, on a "slate" device. That is the pretty much the definition of clinging to the past.

Some of the other devices you list (Zune, etc) at least had some innovation in the UI. But why in god's name would they run a Windows 7 UI on a 10" screen?

Answer: Because Apple hasn't yet showed them what a good UI for such a device looks like. Once Apple shows their device, you can get MS will begin working on a new interface for these types of devices.

Anyway, the point of my post was that Apple has for many years, probably longer than any of us would suspect, been working towards the day when the personal computer as we currently know it is gone.

One problem that MS has, however, is that they lack a unified code base ready to be customized for new devices. So for intermediate devices like a mid-sized slate, manufacturers have to choose between a widget-y but compact WinCE based OS or full blown Windows with some touch bells and whistles.

Given the drift of things in the CE industry, it looks like most manufacturers are electing to forgo WinCE in favor of Linux variants or Android, so that leaves Windows 7 as the default OS for when you want to make claims to having "a real OS."

That distinction-- between light-weight but somewhat limited OSes for small devices on the one hand, and the entirety of Windows whether you want it or not-- represents a huge competitive advantage for Apple, IMO. They don't have to try to fit 100 lbs of potatoes into a 10 pound sack, and they don't have to try to make a potato into a meal-- they can use exactly the components that are called for, with the UI that works best, for each and every machine they make, all of it drawing from the same code base.

Of course, some people are going to confuse that with "crippling" OS X to fit a form factor or performance envelope, but then again some people can't understand what Apple could possibly do to make a tablet more desirable than the Windows running devices that have been around for a while.
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post #140 of 227
I really don't understand majority of people here.

Apple keeps announcing pretty much same phones, ipods, laptops and desktops with small tweaks and updates for the last few years, and yet everyone here is really excited because new iPod Mini now has useless camera - what a huge step forward.

Then HP comes out with their first multi-touch Windows 7 tablet and some sort of Amazon/Kindle deal and everyone see it as judgement day come for both MS and HP, and probably rest of PC industry.

What gives?

While HP Slate is definitely not Courier, with decent battery life and good screen resolution I can see myself using it; recently majority of my laptop usage was about reading books too complex for iPhone screen, comics, occasionaly having a flick or TV show episode in bed, before sleep, review a document I did in the office and do some minor editing... I know that on this device my CDisplay, VLC, Word, PowerPoint and other software will work well with advantage of having less than half of a notebook bulk in a firm, single-piece unit.

Revolutionary? No.

Useful? Hell yes.

Sure I'd like to see something really breathtaking, like Courier might be. I'd also like to win LOTTO. Some things don't happen when we want them. Some things don't happen at all. Is Courier dead, or MS is again "following" Apple with keeping their lips sealed? Time will tell.

Untill then I'm waiting to see in-depth review of HP Slate, before I make my final judgement, and also see infamous Apple tablet. I'm hoping that it will really come out and be more than oversized iPod Touch. Having resemblance of iPhone's simple GUI would be nice, but if I can't do above mentioned things, whole exercise for me would really be pointless.
post #141 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Five hundred dollars!!!

Five hundred dollars!!!

Five hundred dollars for a picture frame without a keyboard!!!

Bwahahahhhaahhhaaahhhhaaa!!!

I wonder what price apple will charge for their picture frame without a keyboard
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post #142 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

Then HP comes out with their first multi-touch Windows 7 tablet and some sort of Amazon/Kindle deal and everyone see it as judgement day come for both MS and HP, and probably rest of PC industry.

What gives?

... I know that on this device my CDisplay, VLC, Word, PowerPoint and other software will work well with advantage of having less than half of a notebook bulk in a firm, single-piece unit.

Revolutionary? No.

Useful? Hell yes.

What gives?
This new HP device still runs Windows. HP should choose another operating system and give consumers a real choice, now that would dazzle me. That would be revolutionary.
I agree with you that as this product is it's far from revolutionary, but since it's a Windows machine being useful and working well is still light years away.
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post #143 of 227
One of the PC makers that I think does have some good ideas is ex-IBM/Lenovo,
and all their good stuff consists of disconnecting Windows.

The (IBM) ThinkVantage technology is nice for a PC, providing backup and recovery tools that live outside of Windows - even including a browser that connects to their support site when Windows won't even boot.

And there was something recently about a detachable Lenovo tablet that runs Windows when in laptop mode and seamlessly transitions into a non-windows system when you detach the screen.

Lenovo have found the key to differentiation in the PC market, which is to understand that Windows is unfit as an operating system and must be treated more like a flakey app within the system.

( But even with ThinkVantage, I gave up and switched to a Mac ).

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post #144 of 227
I'd say the MSI dual-screen device is the closest to the Microsoft Courier:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/06/m...ader-hands-on/

The problem Microsoft has is they can't risk competing with their strong partners so I can't see how the Courier could ever have materialized.

To be perfectly honest, I actually like the slates that have been introduced including the HP one. Sure the UIs that are running aren't very good but they can be improved before shipping. I don't expect them to match the UI that Apple has because their UI is deeper than how it appears on the surface.

Apple anti-alias text system-wide, double buffer graphics contexts, hardware accelerate vector rendering - they do so many things you can't add by just copying layout and their gestures make sense.

But, consider this: if Apple do decide to make an iphone OS device with an intuitive UI, will you use it to write office documents - doctors, students etc? There are no text editors for the iphone OS. Will you use it to watch all your DivX/XVid/Mkv/Video-TS movies on the sofa? There is no Perian or VLC for iphone OS. If you want to do some work like design a website - no Photoshop, no FTP apps, no code editors. What if you want to play WoW in comfort? You can't.

Apple are vulnerable to failure like the other companies even if they are less vulnerable. If they make a great looking device that runs a great UI but you can't do half the things you use a laptop for, the question remains - why not buy a netbook at half the price running the full OS X? Sure it may be a nice kindle competitor but I personally don't own a kindle because I don't need what it offers. I have an iphone so iphone apps + ebooks on a big screen isn't enough.
post #145 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by icyfog View Post

What gives?
HP should choose another operating system and give consumers a real choice, now that would dazzle me. That would be revolutionary.

I think plenty of people will install different operating systems on the HP slate. Its relatively easy to change OSes on anything that runs Windows. I think Apple's the one that won't let you install their OS on any other system, the iPod Touch requires you to jailbreak it to mod it, and I bet Apple won't let you install a different OS on their (alleged) tablet. I'm betting the HP slate isn't a closed system at all.
post #146 of 227
Just say no to Windows pre-installed.
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post #147 of 227
How many people do you see lugging around 10 inch screens for media consumption? Portable dvd players have pretty much been killed by PMPs like the iPod and Zune and whatever else there is. Now that smartphones have the same capabilities coupled with web surfing and email these tablet features would only appeal to someone who either doesnt have a smart phone/PMP or a laptop.

Ebook readers seem more like a new fad than anything right now. I see them occasionally from time to time at the Resort but if i head out to the local "reading" spots like Panera or Starbucks they are none-existent. I believe mac daily said that Amazon has sold only roughly 3 Million Kindles since its launch in 07 and i doubt any other company is remotely close in sales. For a specific feature device i guess thats decent but hardly setting the industry on fire and is shifting the world towards this.

Ebook readers have zero value to most people unless your an avid reader in which the device will pay for itself over time. If your just the average Twilight/Harry Potter junkie well a 300 dollar ebook is a hard sell, especially if your just trying to READ. A possible 5-700 dollar ebook reader with the same features as my phone is an even harder sell in my eyes for just content consumption.
post #148 of 227
All I have to say is...

The real motive behind this tablet announcement was for Microsoft to 1up Apple, and they failed miserably at it! (They also failed the tech community yet again) I am of the opinion that Microsoft is bloated with vaporware at this point. This announcement itself is evidence that the iSlate is indeed coming...

I don't think Microsoft is developing anything truly viable to compete at the level of the "iOS". Even if Windows 7 (or any win flavor) is multi-touch capable, the significance is minimal when the iPhone interface, app store, Mac hardware and user community is so tightly unified. Assimilate the iSlate into the ecosystem and you have an established quality product right out of the box. More importantly a product developers will have confidence to succeed in. Far more feasible is this scenario than anything Microsoft honchos and pundits can regurgitate against Apple's strategies.

Whether the iSlate will end up being a "Macbook Air" for mobile devices outside favorable pricing tiers remains to be seen. Still who wouldn't agree that the Macbook Air is a unique and beautiful peace of tech, and that one could expect the same level of quality in the iSlate.

P.S - Does Microsoft think it can still succeed by throwing it's OS onto any device and expect it to be a compelling contender in the slate market when they can barely achieve a contender against the iPhone?
post #149 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

I'd say the MSI dual-screen device is the closest to the Microsoft Courier:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/06/m...ader-hands-on/

The problem Microsoft has is they can't risk competing with their strong partners so I can't see how the Courier could ever have materialized.

To be perfectly honest, I actually like the slates that have been introduced including the HP one. Sure the UIs that are running aren't very good but they can be improved before shipping. I don't expect them to match the UI that Apple has because their UI is deeper than how it appears on the surface.

Apple anti-alias text system-wide, double buffer graphics contexts, hardware accelerate vector rendering - they do so many things you can't add by just copying layout and their gestures make sense.

But, consider this: if Apple do decide to make an iphone OS device with an intuitive UI, will you use it to write office documents - doctors, students etc? There are no text editors for the iphone OS. Will you use it to watch all your DivX/XVid/Mkv/Video-TS movies on the sofa? There is no Perian or VLC for iphone OS. If you want to do some work like design a website - no Photoshop, no FTP apps, no code editors. What if you want to play WoW in comfort? You can't.

Apple are vulnerable to failure like the other companies even if they are less vulnerable. If they make a great looking device that runs a great UI but you can't do half the things you use a laptop for, the question remains - why not buy a netbook at half the price running the full OS X? Sure it may be a nice kindle competitor but I personally don't own a kindle because I don't need what it offers. I have an iphone so iphone apps + ebooks on a big screen isn't enough.

I saw that MSI device, seems the closest but i want the Courier UI. Ill pass on anything else.

This is where MS agitates me. Not making hardware for PC is fine, they dont need to there are plenty that do and cheaply. Not making hardware for phones is pretty stupid but i can deal with it (Zune phone would be pretty amazing in my eyes but not to MS i guess).

Not capitalizing on a dead and weak sector with your own hardware is just stupid. Just because its a touch PC with windows means nada. No vendor has been successful at all in this market because they've been slapping just Windows on it and calling it a day. Its been that way for 9 years now.

Your points about the Apple Tablet are spot on, while a nice UI is to be expected, if i have to spend a higher price tag i need to get at least OS X on it.
post #150 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

not like Bill Gates didn't demo a tablet back in 2001

And I demoed a perpetual motion machine back in 1997. I never did produce it, though.
post #151 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by elroth View Post

And I demoed a perpetual motion machine back in 1997. I never did produce it, though.

just like microsoft did not produce a tablet.

however, lots of other companies did, using microsofts XP tablet edition

how did your perpetual motion machine go for being produced by others?
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post #152 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

just like microsoft did not produce a tablet.

however, lots of other companies did, using microsofts XP tablet edition

how did your perpetual motion machine go for being produced by others?

And virtually no one bought them. Is that because consumers were wrong or because such devices didn't serve any real purpose (outside of a few specialized markets)? If not, why? Perhaps because they were poorly designed? If so, what was wrong with them? Perhaps the OS was ill suited to the application? Perhaps the available hardware at the time of their introduction was inadequate to the task at hand?

Now what if Apple makes a well designed tablet, with an OS and UI that work very well with the hardware, which supports a pleasing user experience? Do we discount what Apple has done because "tablets already existed"? Do we pretend that Apple "got lucky" by being in "the right place at the right time", or that whatever it is they do is obvious and inevitable and they just happened to get their version out a little ahead of the pack?

Or would one be obliged to admit that Apple, again, looked at a market that was being poorly served by the incumbents, decided there was money to be made by doing better, and shook up the industry by doing things differently?

As an aside to Nikon133, the above is why no one is particularly excited about a tablet running Windows. They've been around for a while, and although Windows 7 has more touch stuff baked in, it's still a desktop OS in drag.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #153 of 227
Microsofts Ballmer claims there isnt a sizeable market for tablets

"Last night's keynote address by Microsoft Chief Executive Officer Steve Ballmer came and went without a mention of a Microsoft tablet. Ballmer had a line up of products that included a tablet PC from HP. He spent less than a minute showing it off," Laura Sydell reports for NPR.

"This morning, I interviewed Ballmer and asked him about the market for tablet/slate computers," Sydell reports. "He made the excitement sound like empty chatter. He claimed to believe that there isn't a sizeable market for the tablet. 'They're interesting,' he said. 'But it's not like they're big numbers compared to the total number of smart devices in the world.'"

"As the world knows, everyone is anticipating a tablet computer from Apple later this winter. Based on the veracity of past rumors about Apple, I believe this to be true," Sydell reports. "I asked Ballmer, 'Why would Apple spend so much money and time on a tablet if there wasn't a big market?' He deftly deflected my question saying, 'You'd have to ask Apple.'"


http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechcons..._tablet_c.html

"There's no chance that the iPhone is going to get any significant market share. No chance." - Steve Ballmer, 2007.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5oGa...layer_embedded
post #154 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

And virtually no one bought them. Is that because consumers were wrong or because such devices didn't serve any real purpose (outside of a few specialized markets)? If not, why? Perhaps because they were poorly designed? If so, what was wrong with them? Perhaps the OS was ill suited to the application? Perhaps the available hardware at the time of their introduction was inadequate to the task at hand?

I highlighted the two main points.

The tablets of ye old days were slow & expensive. The novelty was you could write on it! Awesome! While that is a cool concept and is very niche (very) i think almost everyone can type faster than they can write. That meant carrying around an EXTRA keyboard. Now why buy a tablet over a laptop when you need extra peripherals to accomplish the same task? Why pay for an overpriced tablet with less power than a laptop, that STILL needs even more money for peripherals to make it more usable for basic computing needs?

Still, with the introduction of cheaper laptops, the tablet was pretty much killed.

The Courier was exciting not only because of the UI but because it was similar to a laptop, one does not need to buy an extra keyboard. On screen solutions work but on a slate design you need to either prop it up to use both hands, hold it with one hand while you peck at it, or lay it completely down to type which results in you having to look down the entire time. With a style more similar to a laptop, all you have to do is just prop up the screen and type away (you still have to look at what your typing though unless they have similar nubs like those commonly found on the f and j keys)
post #155 of 227
Ballmer has no business running a lemonade stand, let alone one of the largest corporations in the world. MSFT shareholders should toss this moron out with the rest of the garbage that they are trying to pass off as innovation and cutting edge.

That being said, I hope Apple's slate kicks ass just to spite this arrogant moron.
post #156 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

I already posted that the current Tablet market is between 2-4%. Do you consider that sizeable?

Until Apple releases theirs.

There isn't a sizable market for tablets with Winblows, that much is clear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Here you go look at how innovative Apple is being by creating a Tablet. Sure looks like they are in short supply......


http://www.pencomputing.com/TabletPC/

Exactly. Neither of those were made by Apple.
post #157 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Neither of those? Did you see how many Tablets are reviewed? You know whats so funny about this forum, if Apple announced their Tablet first everyone would have said they stole the thunder for CES. Looks like thats what CES did today to Apple.

How? By introducing a half-assed device that barely got any reaction and which prompted laughter from everyone reporting on it? Even Ballmer looked like he hated it.

MS doesn't get it. Period.
post #158 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

MS has nothing to do with this. MS simply provides software to anyone that wants to pay to use it. Thats something you seem to have trouble understanding. Microsoft doesn't and shouldn't care if their software is used on a 5,000 gaming system or a netbook they get paid the same amount.

That'as the problem. Whoring out your OS to any and all takers is not a recipe for ensuring that the User Experience meets ceratin standards. All MS is interested in is more units sales and sheer volume. That's how crap is produced.

What Steve Jobs said at one point, is what he said. The proof is in Apple's actions. Just look at what rolls out of Cupertino. We're on the verge of Slate computing for the masses. If Apple's making it, that means there's something they know that the pundits can't seem to grasp, that the big players can't seem to grasp, and that remains somewhat ill-defined until Apple shows us exactly what it's about. If it's a major project for Apple, chances are that current trends mean squat . . . because Apple's about to change them. You don't see a reason for a tablet? Apparently MS and HP saw one. Those other tablet manufacturers saw one. But this time around, there's an atual possibility that someone will do it right.

But hey, keep repeating Ballmer's comments and pundits' common assumotions on the subject, because when Apple's device is revealed, we'll all be interested in your (very likely) "modified" opinion on the subject.
post #159 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

You clearly have no clue what you are talking about when it comes to understanding how the end user benefits from competition. Apple isn't the one that needs competition the end users is the one the benefits from it.

Reading comprehension isn't part of your skill set, is it? My statement had nothing to do with whether or not end users benefit from competition. That's a given. The writer was using the "competition" argument to suggest that somehow companies like Microsoft and other are somehow forcing Apple to innovate in order to stay relevant.

Again, the only competition Apple has had for a while is Apple itself, and end users have benefitted for it greatly, without the help of outside forces. What part of that did you not understand?

Once again; Apple is pushing Apple to innovate, NOT Microsoft, NOT Dell, NOTHP.

Try again.
post #160 of 227
Quote:
Originally Posted by John the Geek View Post

Or it could just be the word for a tablet that has no keyboard. Slate computers have been around for years. They just always used a stylus until now.

Indeed. "Slate," like "convertible," is a generic term for a type of tablet computer, and has been for many years.
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