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Quattro purchase, iTunes accounts could give Apple mobile ad advantage

post #1 of 52
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A new report alleges Apple hopes to shake up the mobile advertising business, as competition grows between it and search giant Google. One analyst believes the rift could even potentially lead the Cupertino, Calif., company to embrace its rival, Microsoft, for Bing search.

Profiling the similarities and differences between Google and Apple, BusinessWeek spoke with analysts and anonymous sources about the direction Apple is headed following its purchase of mobile advertising company Quattro Wireless. Sources told the publication that Apple co-founder Steve Jobs hopes to "overhaul mobile advertising in the same way they had revolutionized music players and phones."

Specifics at the moment are not known, but a number of potential approaches were offered: Apple could rely on user data collected through iTunes and the App Store, along with geo-location technology due to GPS in the iPhone, to create targeted, local advertisements that would be more relevant to consumers. The company could also utilize gimmicks, such as having users shake their iPhone to win a prize.

"Some developers have profited by embedding ads in their apps, but the payments tend to be insignificant since the ads are usually smaller, less effective versions of their Web banner forms," the report said. "According to a source familiar with his thinking, Jobs has recognized that 'mobile ads suck' and that improving that situation will make Apple even harder to beat."

Earlier this month, Apple and Quattro confirmed the purchase of the mobile ad company. Andy Miller, former CEO of Quattro, was named the vice president of Mobile Advertising at Apple, a new position for the company. The Waltham, Mass., company has a client list that includes Disney, Visa and Ford.

The price Apple paid for Quattro has not been confirmed, though it has been reported to be a $275 million investment. The purchase came months after Google bought rival ad firm AdMob, with which Apple also allegedly had discussions.

BusinessWeek speculated that Apple's experience -- and wealth of information about its customers -- through iTunes, combined with the purchase of Quattro, could make it a formidable force in the mobile advertising space. In 2007, Apple said it had more than 500 million active iTunes users. Currently, the mobile advertising industry generates only about $2 billion annually, but that is expected to grow.

"Apple has a vault of valuable data that can help drive an ad business," the report said. "It knows precisely which apps, podcasts, videos, and songs people download from iTunes; in many cases it has detailed customer information such as credit-card numbers and home addresses. That gives Apple a chance to blend advertising and e-commerce in new ways, particularly after the acquisition of Quattro."

And as the rift between Google and Apple grows, one analyst speculated to BusinessWeek that the iPhone maker could look to remove Google's presence entirely from its devices. Such a deal could place Microsoft's Bing as the search engine of choice on the iPhone, Jonathan Yarmis with Ovum said. Or, he said, Apple could opt to create its own search engine.

As Apple apparently looks to offer mobile ads that don't "suck," one unique iPhone advertisement from Medialets did gain some attention this week for its original approach. When selected, a banner ad for the band Vampire Weekend included in an iPhone application brings up a music video which users can "edit" by shaking the device, and each shake changes the footage. The advertisement will appear in the NPR iPhone application until Feb. 11.

post #2 of 52
"One analysts believes the rift could even potentially lead the Cupertino, Calif., company to embrace its rival, Microsoft, for Bing search."

Get the guy a straight jacket now!
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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post #3 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

"One analysts believes the rift could even potentially lead the Cupertino, Calif., company to embrace its rival, Microsoft, for Bing search."

Get the guy a straight jacket now!

If this is true and I do have my doubts then...Yea, thats right everyone... sip the koolaid and chant Google is BAD .... Microsoft is GOOD.

And I have no doubt a good number of the totally contaminated people posting here would do so with a smile on their face.
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post #4 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

... "According to a source familiar with his thinking, Jobs has recognized that 'mobile ads suck' and that improving that situation will make Apple even harder to beat." ...

No offence to Steve Jobs, but there is nothing in the known universe that can stop advertisements from sucking. Ads suck, they always have and always will.
post #5 of 52
Quote:
Apple has a vault of valuable data that can help drive an ad business," the report said. "It knows precisely which apps, podcasts, videos, and songs people download from iTunes; in many cases it has detailed customer information such as credit-card numbers and home addresses. That gives Apple a chance to blend advertising and e-commerce in new ways, particularly after the acquisition of Quattro."

Yeah, and all these people would continue to be happy customers, paying the higher iTunes prices, if they are abused like that... I have spent over 5k EUR on iTunes since 2004. One single ad in my face - and I'm gone.

I have some faith that Apple knows better than these tasseographists.
post #6 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

No offence to Steve Jobs, but there is nothing in the known universe that can stop advertisements from sucking. Ads suck, they always have and always will.

Lots of ads do suck, but some are hilarious and others very informative.

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post #7 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

"One analysts believes the rift could even potentially lead the Cupertino, Calif., company to embrace its rival, Microsoft, for Bing search."

Get the guy a straight jacket now!


And the Thorazine too!

This guy needs to comfortably numb in a hurry!

I assume Apple is going to make a large audience with their new iSlate /e-Reader device and get a cut of the display advertising (not web advertising) from any newspapers or magazines hosted on the device.

Competition with Google? Nah. But Apple might want a cut of Googles ads on the device.


Apple also has the advantage of incorporating animated display advertising on the iSlate.

So for instance your looking at the local used cars and they rotate in 3D, show the interior and what-not. Sure beats the pants off static ads.
The danger is that we sleepwalk into a world where cabals of corporations control not only the mainstream devices and the software on them, but also the entire ecosystem of online services around...
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The danger is that we sleepwalk into a world where cabals of corporations control not only the mainstream devices and the software on them, but also the entire ecosystem of online services around...
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post #8 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Lots of ads do suck, but some are hilarious and others very informative.

Some ads are hilarious (while they suck), or informative (while they suck), is how I would put it. The basis of the modern advertisement is deception and behaviour control. I'm sure a lot of Guinea Pigs like their wheels too.
post #9 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

lead [Apple] to embrace its rival, Microsoft

Microsoft and Apple do not really compete with each other. They are way more complementary.
Every Mac sold means more money for Microsoft than for every Windows PC sold.
post #10 of 52
The ad creativity doesn't suck, but that band sure does.
post #11 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

No offence to Steve Jobs, but there is nothing in the known universe that can stop advertisements from sucking. Ads suck, they always have and always will.

Not necessarily ... look no further than Apples various campaigns to see examples of ads which can amuse or inspire.

Definitely exceptions though.

I DO always love it when Jobs starts trashing a category in the market or culture, usually means that an Apple initiative is in the offing.
post #12 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

Some ads are hilarious (while they suck), or informative (while they suck), is how I would put it. The basis of the modern advertisement is deception and behaviour control. I'm sure a lot of Guinea Pigs like their wheels too.

I guess I'm biased since I am sort of in the marketing biz. But I would rather watch a solid hour of TV ads than 5 minutes of typical prime time drama. Some of the smartest people in the entertainment business are in advertising. Unlike most people, I often click the channel to find another ad when the scheduled program comes back on.

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post #13 of 52
"ads suck" - he's got the be one of the best CEO's ever...
post #14 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post

Every Mac sold means more money for Microsoft that for every Windows PC sold.

Without Office?

Like what in kickbacks or stock or something?
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The danger is that we sleepwalk into a world where cabals of corporations control not only the mainstream devices and the software on them, but also the entire ecosystem of online services around...
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post #15 of 52
Apple makes ads sexy, LOL
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #16 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

BusinessWeek speculated that Apple's experience -- and wealth of information about its customers -- through iTunes, combined with the purchase of Quattro, could make it a formidable force in the mobile advertising space. In 2007, Apple said it had more than 500 million active iTunes users.


If they don't want ads to suck and they have information on me, then they know that whatever ad they thrust in my face better have something FREE, FREEEE!, FFRRREEEEEEEE!!!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Or, he said, Apple could opt to create its own search engine.


Create your own search Apple! Call it MacMan-age!

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Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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post #17 of 52
Sorry, I can't get past how aweful that music was to recall the story and comment... oh wait, it was on the NPR app... that explains the music selection.
post #18 of 52
Internet ads are quite possibly the most ANNOYING thing ever, ive only ever seen a few good ones in my lifetime, there was a good Apple one on Youtube a few months ago with PC switchers going into the Apple store.

Billboard ads like along the highway tend to catch your eye...usually because there is nothing but cement/trees/openness and a billboard just out there kinda forces you to look. I dont think they have the same effect in cities imo.

TV ads that are done well make you want to watch them. The Apple ads are mostly rehash garbage now and AT&T putting Luke Wilson to combat VZW raping them hard in public perception is just terrible enough that i have to change the channel. VZW and the Droid commercials made a big splash, and Superbowl ads are probably some of the best you will see all year cause a lot more work is done into making them interesting.

In short, not all ads suck.
post #19 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Lots of ads do suck, but some are hilarious and others very informative.

It's starting already. Soon Ads will be bearable because Apple's involved and in about 12 months there will be complaints that people aren't getting enough ads. Gotta hand it to Apple. They could sell ice to an eskimo.

Gazoobee makes an interesting point about behaviour control. Owning Apple products is a shining example of it.
post #20 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

No offence to Steve Jobs, but there is nothing in the known universe that can stop advertisements from sucking. Ads suck, they always have and always will.

You're totally wrong . . . again. The "Get a Mac" ads are sheer genius and obviously quite effective, as Apple wouldn't have continued the series for YEARS if they weren't.

And THAT qualifies this as as NOT sucking.

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post #21 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

No offence to Steve Jobs, but there is nothing in the known universe that can stop advertisements from sucking. Ads suck, they always have and always will.

Amen.

It's the intrusion of it, not the ad itself. I don't want to be paying for a service, product, movie, etc, and be subjected to advertising.
post #22 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreyfus2 View Post

One single ad in my face - and I'm gone.

You don' get ANY ads now?
If you are referring to ads in iTunes, this article does not mention that. It talks about using the iTunes user database to better target people with ads.
post #23 of 52
Perhaps missing the obvious...

Apple could allow items in ads to be purchased through the customer's iTune account.
post #24 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_CA View Post

You don' get ANY ads now?
If you are referring to ads in iTunes, this article does not mention that. It talks about using the iTunes user database to better target people with ads.

Almost none. I use ad blocking and ClickToFlash, which keeps most things out - I have only manually white-listed some sites which depend on the ads to keep up their work. I do not mind static ads in newspapers, but all this blinking, animated crap is just an annoyance and turning it off does not hurt them either, as I would never click on one of these things anyhow.

Apple can of course use iTunes user data to inform about own products - but so far, they do not even do that. All the newsletters they send, advertise stuff that is not remotely related to what I have bought in the past. I have not seen anything in iTunes' terms that says I have authorized Apple to monetize on my data, or use it for the benefit of third parties. Not saying they plan to do that, but these pundits make it sound like a company could use any data they have as they please...
post #25 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielSW View Post

You're totally wrong . . . again. The "Get a Mac" ads are sheer genius and obviously quite effective, as Apple wouldn't have continued the series for YEARS if they weren't.

And THAT qualifies this as as NOT sucking.

Well, there is a logical flaw in your statement in that I'm saying that ads (as a category) suck. So whether an ad by it's own terms was "effective" or not, is irrelevant.

"Suck" is probably too vague a word anyway. I should have used things like "immoral," "stupid," "unnecessary," "intrusive," etc.
post #26 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreyfus2 View Post

Yeah, and all these people would continue to be happy customers, paying the higher iTunes prices, if they are abused like that... I have spent over 5k EUR on iTunes since 2004. One single ad in my face - and I'm gone.

I have some faith that Apple knows better than these tasseographists.

Not sure what you look at when you buy something on iTunes but, the moment you open the iTunes Store in iTunes you are barraged by advertising. Every (almost) page that iTunes presents is littered with advertisements so I don't know how you spent 5K EUR since 'you were gone' the moment you opened the application.
post #27 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by physguy View Post

Not sure what you look at when you buy something on iTunes but, the moment you open the iTunes Store in iTunes you are barraged by advertising. Every (almost) page that iTunes presents is littered with advertisements so I don't know how you spent 5K EUR since 'you were gone' the moment you opened the application.

The iTunes store displays the wares it sells, like absolutely every store. If you can't tell the difference between that and advertisements, I can't help you.
post #28 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreyfus2 View Post

The iTunes store displays the wares it sells, like absolutely every store. If you can't tell the difference between that and advertisements, I can't help you.

So, you actually do realize that there is some advertising that is useful - that is what displaying its wares is all about. I go to iTune to buy Music. I don't want Movies but they (Apple and content providers) provide advertising on the front page that give me information that these are available. It benefits me - gives me information - and them - potentially increases their sales. That is what advertising is.

If you don't think that placement on the front page of iTune isn't valuable advertising you really don't appreciate the breadth of advertising. Content provides will kill for such placement and the costs of getting there are certainly in their advertising budget.
post #29 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreyfus2 View Post

The iTunes store displays the wares it sells, like absolutely every store. If you can't tell the difference between that and advertisements, I can't help you.

Actually there is big difference between being in a store and seeing displays of a few of the products they sell versus driving down the freeway and reading a billboard advertising Coke, or reading a magazine and seeing an advert for a watch. There is a huge disconnect with the latter.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #30 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gazoobee View Post

No offence to Steve Jobs, but there is nothing in the known universe that can stop advertisements from sucking. Ads suck, they always have and always will.

How to make ads not suck (or suck considerably less):

1) give us a CHOICE of ads or not. If the ads earn 25c per viewer (for a TV show for example), then let me pay 25c to not see them at all (for whatever that 25c worth of ads covered). The ads in apps might be worth .1c.

2) customise them to my interests, needs, and location
I am now eligible for baby ads, but for many years I have not been.
Even let me request ads of certain types if there's something I'm particularly looking for at the moment.

3) let me interact with the ads and the ad servers in some way
Some ads I want to remember for later, or explore further. Others I'd like to say "that annoys me, never show me that again". etc. In fact, if I say I want to mark this ad for later, Apple might start showing me related competitors ads for the same style of product.

4) Make the ads fit with the article.
In a magazine etc, make it visually appealing as well as relevant, if possible.

5) Show fewer ads.
We all know that once you get too many ads, you ignore them. So make less of them but charge advertisers more for each since they're more likely to be remembered.

I want ads. To a point. I just can't afford to pay for everything.
In TV - I want a subscription to ABC for $5/mth (as rumoured) but with the option to add regular commercials (and make ABC free) or add far fewer but customised/interactive commercials (and make ABC free), or half the commercials (and charge $2/mth for ABC).
post #31 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Lots of ads do suck, but some are hilarious and others very informative.

And after seeing any ad once I never want to see it again. In fact, I would give up the "hilarious" and "informative" ads (no sacrifice at all) if I could never see any ad ever again.
post #32 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post

Microsoft and Apple do not really compete with each other. They are way more complementary.
Every Mac sold means more money for Microsoft than for every Windows PC sold.

How do you come up with that? I will not put Windows on my Mac, I will never buy another version of Office, I've never used Bing, etc. etc.

Explain yourself.
post #33 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I guess I'm biased since I am sort of in the marketing biz. But I would rather watch a solid hour of TV ads than 5 minutes of typical prime time drama. Some of the smartest people in the entertainment business are in advertising. Unlike most people, I often click the channel to find another ad when the scheduled program comes back on.

I'm glad I never engaged you in a dinner conversation.
post #34 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by physguy View Post

So, you actually do realize that there is some advertising that is useful - that is what displaying its wares is all about. I go to iTune to buy Music. I don't want Movies but they (Apple and content providers) provide advertising on the front page that give me information that these are available. It benefits me - gives me information - and them - potentially increases their sales. That is what advertising is.

If you don't think that placement on the front page of iTune isn't valuable advertising you really don't appreciate the breadth of advertising. Content provides will kill for such placement and the costs of getting there are certainly in their advertising budget.

When I go to a supermarket to buy milk, I do not call everything else in the store advertising, just because I do not need it.
post #35 of 52
Interesting observations. But let offer a couple of counter-points:

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregAlexander View Post

How to make ads not suck (or suck considerably less):

1) give us a CHOICE of ads or not. If the ads earn 25c per viewer (for a TV show for example), then let me pay 25c to not see them at all (for whatever that 25c worth of ads covered). The ads in apps might be worth .1c.

Micropayment systems still have problems being economically viable. Otherwise, we would all be paying for our AI stories by now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregAlexander View Post

How to make ads not suck (or suck considerably less):

2) customise them to my interests, needs, and location
I am now eligible for baby ads, but for many years I have not been.
Even let me request ads of certain types if there's something I'm particularly looking for at the moment.

That actually creeps some people out, like me, for instance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregAlexander View Post

3) let me interact with the ads and the ad servers in some way
Some ads I want to remember for later, or explore further. Others I'd like to say "that annoys me, never show me that again". etc. In fact, if I say I want to mark this ad for later, Apple might start showing me related competitors ads for the same style of product.

This is an interesting point. However, our tastes, preferences, interests etc change over time. What if you forgot to uncheck an ad you thought you wanted a couple of years ago but don't anymore? You'll be complaining about getting unwanted 'baby' ads......

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregAlexander View Post

4) Make the ads fit with the article.
In a magazine etc, make it visually appealing as well as relevant, if possible.

That is impossibly difficult. You'll have to create 'contingent' ads for all kinds of possible stories, and that is obviously unviable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregAlexander View Post

How to make ads not suck (or suck considerably less):

5) Show fewer ads.

Yeah, we all want want that. But the problem is, that only addresses the 'demand' side of the equation. The 'supply' side of ads has its own imperatives.
post #36 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Interesting observations. But let offer a couple of counter-points:

Excellent

Quote:
Micropayment systems still have problems being economically viable. Otherwise, we would all be paying for our AI stories by now.

And yet, if Apple is controlling the iPhone/iSlate experience, they could easily charge to a users iTunes account. Could work on Safari too.

And with regards to paying to not see ads - if the user doesn't have an iTunes account, show the ad.

Quote:
That actually creeps some people out, like me, for instance.

Yeah I get that. Part of me classifies it in with when Windows asks "do you want to always trust Microsoft content?". I figure, if I don't trust microsoft, then they'll ignore my answer anyway. What can you do?

Seriously though, is there a way around it that would work for you? I would rather see fewer ads customised to me (which is appealing to me, appealing to the advertiser, but has big brother overtones). Further in my post I suggested that if people didn't want it customised to them they should have the option of seeing the regular number of non-specific ads.

Quote:
This is an interesting point. However, our tastes, preferences, interests etc change over time. What if you forgot to uncheck an ad you thought you wanted a couple of years ago but don't anymore? You'll be complaining about getting unwanted 'baby' ads......

Absolutely. You'd think anything like this would need a time out... like you opt out (or in) for a few months and then it assumes your preferences are no longer as important and tests that.

Or upgrades your baby to a toddler?

Quote:
That is impossibly difficult. You'll have to create 'contingent' ads for all kinds of possible stories, and that is obviously unviable.

You're probably right.
I was thinking of magazines and how their ads are often very relevant to the article. Perhaps article writers themselves could nominate brands or ads they believe relevant to their article and submit this in some way, or advertisers could search for articles to place their ad with.

Quote:
Yeah, we all want want that. But the problem is, that only addresses the 'demand' side of the equation. The 'supply' side of ads has its own imperatives.

Not so! Or at least, the supply/demand equation works on 2 fronts. If there were half as many ads on TV, advertisers would have less supply of ad-slots, and the cost for those would go up.

Basically they'll pay more for their ads if there are less other distracting ads.
post #37 of 52
Quote:
One analysts believes the rift could even potentially lead the Cupertino, Calif., company to embrace its rival, Microsoft, for Bing search."

Not.Gonna.Happen

But if it did. If it did, I wont be using/buying any Apple product that forces Microsoft's Bing on me.

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post #38 of 52
Apple should just make their own search engine. Call it iFind and have it integrate with iPhoto and all the OSX varients in ways no other search engine and web browser can.
post #39 of 52
Apple have absolutely no choice but to do this.

To allow Google to serve this data would basically allow Google to know explicitly what Apple iPhone customers want.

Essentially they are going to embed 'genius' tech into their ad network - makes sense -if you have to have em then if they're are stuff you actually want you may even begin to enjoy your ads .
post #40 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamIIGS View Post

The ad creativity doesn't suck, but that band sure does.

Well, they are vampires after all.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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