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Democratic Dirty Tricks - Massachusetts Edition - Page 4

post #121 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxParrish View Post

Finally, the European systems vary greatly but I don't think any of their systems resemble the Senate bill.

It's true that no European government would agree to spend billions of taxpayers' money on subsidising the insurance industry. But even so, the American bill provides cover for millions who didn't have it before.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxParrish View Post

And I have little doubt people oppose taking away something and replacing it with a system alien to their experience and cultural norms, no matter how good or bad an alternative might be.

Absolutely. Because if there's one thing that characterises American society it's America's resistance to innovation and its inability to accept changing 'norms', which is why you still have segregated bathrooms, no broadband and every major form of popular music since the 1950s was invented in Mexico.
post #122 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Pretty sure you won't find those quotes.

Pretty sure that if you had commented on it though that is what you would have said.

Quote:
I feel betrayed by the system. You'd think that after eight years of Republican rule, we'd have less debt and be safer.

First it wasn't eight years of Republican rule. The Republicans had the presidency, sure but only held both houses of Congress for four out of those eight years. The Democrats took back both houses in 2006 and the Senate switched from 2000-2002 due to Jeffords.

1994-2000 were indeed years where the Republicans held both houses of Congress and the spending cuts and controls were significant. Clinton had to be dragged kicking and screaming into signing a balanced budget but he did.

My view is that the president has the ability to sign off spending or establish priorities but in the end it is really the Congress that determines spending. We have really seen this in California where a Democratic legislature and various Republican governors haven't been able to dent the spending very much.

That said, while I radically disagreed with the Bush spending, it clearly is remarkable how much the reins must have been pulled in compared to the Democrats. When you hear all the complaints about what was driving up the deficits in the Bush years and realize those numbers are peanuts compared to now, it lets me know that even if his priorities were misplaced, at least they were efficient.

I mean we had an expansion of Medicare and two wars under Bush and averaged deficits of $250-400 billion a year (The $400 billion years were from Democrats 2006 on.) As critical we can be of those deficits, we would be thankful for them now in comparsion to the Obama deficits.

Quote:
We're way worse off than we were under Clinton and way less safe. And the immature behavior of the vocal Republicans and the candidates they've put forth has made me lose even more respect for them.

I'll agree and disagree. I'll agree that we have erected huge organizations that are supposed to keep us safe and cost fair amounts of money. I'll also say that they aren't very effective due to our desire to be sensitive instead of effective. We don't need to put people in internment camps but at the same time we should be able to say that single men with no baggage on expired student visa's from certain countries deserve a little extra scrutiny. We can't seem to say that so yes, the efforts are largely annoying and wasteful. The candidates the Republicans have put forth aren't bad at all as long as you turn off the sycophantic news networks and read the news.

Quote:
I also saw what happened in the last decade under deregulation when corporations were given more freedom to bend over the American public and ass fuck us without even the courtesy to give us a reach around. Libertarianism is great, in theory. In a bubble. In a world without greedy assholes who will stomp on anyone's neck to make a buck. We don't live in that world. Sorry to burst your bubble.

I can understand where you are coming from and even agree a fair amount. The issue, in my view is that such greedy enterprises are not propped up by market principles but rather by government conditions that create distortions where this greed operates. Clearly banks operating at a huge loss isn't very profitable for anyone. You add the Federal Reserve, Frannie and Freddie and government demand to stop "redlining" certain lenders though and what you end up with is a mess. The government is so large now that it is hard to find areas where it doesn't distort the market.

You know my own side field is landlording. The number of "rent subsidized" apartment buildings has grown tremendously in the last ten years for example. Section 8 housing vouchers have altered entire neighborhoods. My ads for my units now actually state that you can earn money and rent from me and likewise we won't alter your rent based on what you make. It is crazy out there. What we think of as private, just like with medical insurance, is nothing of the sort.

Quote:
And I bet I could dig up some choice quotes from you about not wanting to judge Bush so quickly. Except this time, those quotes are really likely to exist.

I doubt it. I was never the biggest Bush fan. Just like the last election, you didn't see me expressing any strong opinions for McCain. I've already stated this is true for with regard to Romney if he were to run next time. Republicans that want to just run "better" wealth transfer programs are like Democrats who want to just run "better" wars. We should point at both and laugh.

Nice post btw, that is more of the BR I used to know and enjoy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxParrish View Post

Trump;

My parents were young adults in WWII, and raised a family after the war. I asked them about medical insurance and they told me most people did'nt have it - you just paid for hospitalization out of pocket.

My father had crappy jobs for 15 years, but paying for a three day stay in the hospital (to have a baby) was not a financial crisis.

And a broken arm? That used to be ordinary stuff, not 45K jobs.

Fplks often claim that its the cost of technology - sure, that is a factor. BUT everything costs much more, including old technology and basics (X-rays, an overnight stay, etc). And back then doctors could afford the time for home visits.

Two events changed all that: first the tax exemption to employers and employees for third party insurance, then the giant Medicare (and Medicaid) expansion (causing a 40% rise in costs).

So the government is chasing its tail, dumping more money in (via reform) while claiming they are going to reduce costs -

The free lunchers never learn.

Exactly and this is what becomes so hard to see. There isn't a half free lunch either. It just creates market distortions where the greedy folks who aren't true capitalists operate.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post



Oh Jesus. I will try and explain this as simply and clearly as I can. You wrote:

OK. Now, please enjoy finishing this sentence:

"Keith Olberman was homophobic when he used the term "teabagger", which is not a homosexual term, to describe Scott Brown because..."

Or you could just admit YOU MADE A MISTAKE. For ONCE.

There is nothing you quoted that showed myself or anyone else trying to claim the act was exclusive. It isn't even close. Please give up your sad little strawmen.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #123 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

There is nothing you quoted that showed myself or anyone else trying to claim the act was exclusive. It isn't even close. Please give up your sad little strawmen.

You don't actually read my posts, do you?

I will try again.

You wrote this:

Quote:
The irony of someone calling someone else a homophobe while using the term "teabagger" is just too sad to be funny.

And then I showed you that 'teabgging' is not a homosexual term. By showing you a clip of women discussing the term.

So fine. Forget I used the word 'exclusive'.

Just explain to me how Keith Olberman can be homophobic using the term 'teabagger'.

Or you could just take it on the chin, so to speak, and admit you made a mistake. It's just a little one. You can do it.
post #124 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

You don't actually read my posts, do you?

I will try again.

You wrote this:

Are you delusional? The word exclusive isn't anywhere in there.

Quote:
And then I showed you that 'teabgging' is not a homosexual term. By showing you a clip of women discussing the term.

So fine. Forget I used the word 'exclusive'.

MJ, I'll give you this response but honestly, I can't believe you are a real person expressing real sentiments anymore. The logic is too tortured to be real.

You say forget the word exclusive. You were the one who claimed that the term wasn't exclusive and thus anyone who claimed it was wrong. You are saying forget the very point you were trying to make.

It's like you forget what you type. Do you disagree just to disagree?!?

Quote:
Just explain to me how Keith Olberman can be homophobic using the term 'teabagger'.

Or you could just take it on the chin, so to speak, and admit you made a mistake. It's just a little one. You can do it.

When you call someone a derogatory name associated with certain types of people, it is because you consider those people inferior in some fashion and want to convey that sense of inferiority onto the person being called that name.

The name doesn't have to be exclusive or anything else. Even using such names is not appropriate for newscasters. Injecting opinion might be acceptable when done as analysis but calling someone a name isn't analysis. It is just rude, nasty and hateful.

Your point is like complaining that people don't only call people of Polish descent, Pollocks. It would be right to declare it isn't exclusive but it is used as a derogatory term and thus wouldn't be appropriate for news presentation or analysis. The group in question hasn't given themselves the name of 'teabaggers'. The name has been substituted by Olbermann.

You appear to want to argue about how offensive the term is and to whom. My point is that the term is offensive and isn't appropriate for news and analysis. I could care less about your point because it doesn't invalidate mine. It is just another strawman.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #125 of 186
The win is more indicative of democrats' failures, rather than republican successes.. for example in managing the financial collapse, rein in the insurance companies, and all the other crazinesses.... in other words, the continuation of the previous 8 years infamy with a "outwardly friendlier" appearing train driver.

Scott Brown.. what a great guy. He voted against helping 9/11 workers and first responders in order to subsidize a golf course. Typical DC politician... no matter which side of the swamp they hail from.
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #126 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


snip: totally irrelevant to my question.

.

Instead of explaining yourself you seem to have made an ad hominem attack on my 'logic'.

I will have to resort to bolding words and using capitals in order to get you to address my question.

HOMOPHOBIC.

You said that Keith Olberman was being HOMOPHOBIC for the use of the word 'teabagger.'

HOMOPHOBIC.

Now please explain how, if 'teabagging' is not a HOMOSEXUAL term, Keith Olberman might be accused of being HOMOPHOBIC for using it.

Keywords:

HOMOPHOBIC
TEABAGGING
NOT A HOMOSEXUAL TERM
post #127 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

The win is more indicative of democrats' failures, rather than republican successes..

The win reaffirms the strength of the conservative independent.

The numbers I heard say that there are 3 registered democrats for every registered republican, and 51% of voters self-identify as independent.

The mandate is to let the freaky fringe spew and listen to the centrists. "It's about jobs, stupid" should be the headline.
post #128 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Instead of explaining yourself you seem to have made an ad hominem attack on my 'logic'.

I will have to resort to bolding words and using capitals in order to get you to address my question.

HOMOPHOBIC.

You said that Keith Olberman was being HOMOPHOBIC for the use of the word 'teabagger.'

HOMOPHOBIC.

Now please explain how, if 'teabagging' is not a HOMOSEXUAL term, Keith Olberman might be accused of being HOMOPHOBIC for using it.

Keywords:

HOMOPHOBIC
TEABAGGING
NOT A HOMOSEXUAL TERM

Actually what you fail to understand is that I don't give a crap about your question and the little strawman you attempt to raise with it. Raise it however you want and watch it be ignored because it isn't relevant to the point I raised.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #129 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taskiss View Post

The win reaffirms the strength of the conservative independent.

The numbers I heard say that there are 3 registered democrats for every registered republican, and 51% of voters self-identify as independent.

The mandate is to let the freaky fringe spew and listen to the centrists. "It's about jobs, stupid" should be the headline.

You've got the headline right. Secondary points should be that people who hold to conservative principles don't have to change an iota to get elected. They'll even stay elected if they manage to hold to those principles in office instead of getting into the business of buying votes by stealing from one constituency to pay off another.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #130 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Actually what you fail to understand is that I don't give a crap about your question and the little strawman you attempt to raise with it. Raise it however you want and watch it be ignored because it isn't relevant to the point I raised.

Teabagging isn't a homophobic term. You may not like Mumbo Jumbo and the way he talks to you, but you are making yourself look silly in the process.

 

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post #131 of 186
According to Howard Dean 18% of the the people who voted for Brown had voted for Obama. Of those two thirds wanted a public option. Obama voters who didn't vote wanted a public option six to one. So in other words Brown won in large part as the left sent a message to Obama that they wanted more from the healthcare bill.

Brown also never used the name Republican on any of his ad's or any of his leafleting. That tells you that the repubs are on very thin ice still.

Also there's this-

"Scott Brown, the Republican state senator who won a stunning upset in Tuesday's election, voted for the state's health-care legislation, which was signed by then-Gov. Mitt Romney (R) and has covered all but 3 percent of Massachusetts residents. That legislation became the basic model for national health-care legislation. Brown has not disavowed his support for the state's law, which retains majority backing in Massachusetts.

Instead, he argued on the campaign trail that Massachusetts had taken care of its own uninsured, and it would not be in the state's interest to contribute to an effort to cover the uninsured nationwide.

Brown's message underscores a little-noticed political dynamic in a country where rates of the uninsured vary widely, from Massachusetts to Texas, where 25 percent are uninsured. Seeking national universal coverage means sending money from states that have tried hard to expand coverage, mostly in the Northeast and Midwest, to states that have not, mostly in the South and West.

"Massachusetts's reforms continue to be popular in Massachusetts -- sufficiently popular that Brown did not repudiate them," said Paul Starr, a Princeton public affairs professor. "Here is a state that has enacted a similar reform and it is popular. That should encourage people that if it's done at the national level, that it would work as policy, and that it would be popular.""
~ http://mediamatters.org/blog/201001210028
We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #132 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Teabagging isn't a homophobic term. You may not like Mumbo Jumbo and the way he talks to you, but you are making yourself look silly in the process.

Silly to you sounds great to me. You can find the nice John Water's clip from 'Pecker' that introduced the term so long ago and see how many women you see in that clip. It's slang so the meaning can clearly vary a bit. A google search for teabagging and homosexual provides plenty of hits.

BTW, speaking to my actual point from MJ's own link....

In 2009, Tea Party protests were formed to protest against United States government tax and spending policies.[7][8] The use of the term "Tea Bagger" to describe these protesters has been used by several pundits and journalists to ridicule the protesters. Anderson Cooper apologized for using the term. [9][10][11][12][13] The term's growth in the political arena earned attention by the Oxford American Dictionary, and the word "teabagger" achieved finalist status for the OAD Word of the Year.[14]

Apparently the job of the liberal media complex is to ridicule the people they disagree with rather than report on them. The point stands.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

According to Howard Dean 18% of the the people who voted for Brown had voted for Obama. Of those two thirds wanted a public option. Obama voters who didn't vote wanted a public option six to one. So in other words Brown won in large part as the left sent a message to Obama that they wanted more from the healthcare bill.

Brown also never used the name Republican on any of his ad's or any of his leafleting. That tells you that the repubs are on very thin ice still.

Also there's this-

"Scott Brown, the Republican state senator who won a stunning upset in Tuesday's election, voted for the state's health-care legislation, which was signed by then-Gov. Mitt Romney (R) and has covered all but 3 percent of Massachusetts residents. That legislation became the basic model for national health-care legislation. Brown has not disavowed his support for the state's law, which retains majority backing in Massachusetts.

Instead, he argued on the campaign trail that Massachusetts had taken care of its own uninsured, and it would not be in the state's interest to contribute to an effort to cover the uninsured nationwide.

Brown's message underscores a little-noticed political dynamic in a country where rates of the uninsured vary widely, from Massachusetts to Texas, where 25 percent are uninsured. Seeking national universal coverage means sending money from states that have tried hard to expand coverage, mostly in the Northeast and Midwest, to states that have not, mostly in the South and West.

"Massachusetts's reforms continue to be popular in Massachusetts -- sufficiently popular that Brown did not repudiate them," said Paul Starr, a Princeton public affairs professor. "Here is a state that has enacted a similar reform and it is popular. That should encourage people that if it's done at the national level, that it would work as policy, and that it would be popular.""
~ http://mediamatters.org/blog/201001210028

You can imagine how much I want this self-deluding reasoning to be the party line for this election. Nothing will make me happy than for the Democrats to keep taking actions that further help along their implosion.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #133 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Silly to you sounds great to me. You can find the nice John Water's clip that introduced the term so long ago and see how many women you see in that clip. It's slang so the meaning can clearly vary a bit. A google search for teabagging and homosexual provides plenty of hits.



You can imagine how much I want this self-deluding reasoning to be the party line for this election. Nothing will make me happy than for the Democrats to keep taking actions that further help along their implosion.

Well it seems to me you guys are getting this worked up about the win in one state ( treating it like it's the second coming and it's just smooth sailing from here on out for the republicans ) you really must be desperate.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #134 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well it seems to me you guys are getting this worked up about the win in one state ( treating it like it's the second coming and it's just smooth sailing from here on out for the republicans ) you really must be desperate.

That's because some of us live in states other than delusion. We even remember those victories in Virginia and New Jersey.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #135 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

that's because some of us live in states other than delusion.

The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #136 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well it seems to me you guys are getting this worked up about the win in one state ( treating it like it's the second coming and it's just smooth sailing from here on out for the republicans ) you really must be desperate.

Faux is giddy when saying a guy asked why he voted Repub responded by saying he was saving America. Yeah, maybe the Faux Noise Amerika.

The the USSC goes and opens the flood gates to corporate donations. Wow. A good week for Republicans, to the detriment of the country and ultimately the world.

The virus which is eating away at society doesn't have Dem stamped on it.

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #137 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

That's because some of us live in states other than delusion. We even remember those victories in Virginia and New Jersey.

Are you sure?

Good luck with that!
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #138 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talon8472 View Post

This must be purely for the sake of a theoretical argument because few, if anyone, whose been posting in this forum really believes that you hadn't already pre-judged Bush and judged him to be a failure well before Bush's term was up, second or first. Your partisan blinders couldn't be so heavy that you would have blinded yourself to this fact so completely. If it is true, then your delusional state would have to be taken to a whole new level.

I love it when one of the minority here speaks for the entire forum!

Nah! In his first year he was just annoying. A milktoast, spoiled fratboy that can't even run an oil company and liked to take too many vacations!

It might have stayed that way for 4 years.

After the going got tough he turned into a real mistake. That came later.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #139 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

A google search for teabagging and homosexual provides plenty of hits.

I see. So wikipedia: that's no good as a source. Google hits, on the other hand: totally fine.

Hey, everyone, I'm arguing with trumptman!

Anyway.

You said that Keith Olberman was using a homophobic term.
But teabagging is not a homosexual practice.
So he was not being homophobic.
So you are wrong.

Keyword:

WRONG
post #140 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Faux is giddy when saying a guy asked why he voted Repub responded by saying he was saving America. Yeah, maybe the Faux Noise Amerika.

The the USSC goes and opens the flood gates to corporate donations. Wow. A good week for Republicans, to the detriment of the country and ultimately the world.

The virus which is eating away at society doesn't have Dem stamped on it.

There's no way the Dems can avoid catching that virus with the flood gates opened. They're going to have to get down and dirty with the donations to have a shot at keeping up.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
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post #141 of 186
Thread Starter 
Charles Krauthammer crushes the Obama breakdown of the election results in Mass. so bad that I'm sore from laughing.

Quote:
After Coakley's defeat, Obama pretended that the real cause was a generalized anger and frustration "not just because of what's happened in the last year or two years, but what's happened over the last eight years."

Let's get this straight: The antipathy to George W. Bush is so enduring and powerful that ... it just elected a Republican senator in Massachusetts? Why, the man is omnipotent.

He goes on using a word that I've mentioned a few times myself, delusional.

Quote:
And the Democrats are delusional: Scott Brown won by running against Obama not Bush. He won by brilliantly nationalizing the race, running hard against the Obama agenda, most notably Obamacare. Killing it was his No. 1 campaign promise.

There isn't a way to spin away the results of this election. It is true whether you like or dislike the results, elections have consequences.

Quote:
The reason both wings of American liberalism -- congressional and mainstream media -- were so surprised at the force of anti-Democratic sentiment is that they'd spent Obama's first year either ignoring or disdaining the clear early signs of resistance: the tea-party movement of the spring and the town-hall meetings of the summer. With characteristic condescension, they contemptuously dismissed the protests as the mere excrescences of a redneck, retrograde, probably racist rabble.

You watch pretty pictures on the television screen where "smart" people read teleprompter platitudes to you to shape your lack of thinking, then you are surprised by these results.

Quote:
The evidence was unmistakable: Independents, who in 2008 had elected Obama, swung massively against the Democrats: dropping 16 points in Virginia, 21 in New Jersey. On Tuesday, it was even worse: Independents, who had gone 2-to-1 Republican in Virginia and New Jersey, now went 3-to-1 Republican in hyper-blue Massachusetts. Nor was this an expression of the more agitated elements who vote in obscure low-turnout elections. The turnout on Tuesday was the highest for any nonpresidential Massachusetts election in 20 years.

The numbers don't lie.

Quote:
Democrats must so rationalize, otherwise they must take democracy seriously, and ask themselves: If the people really don't want it, could they possibly have a point?

"If you lose Massachusetts and that's not a wake-up call," said moderate -- and sentient -- Democratic Sen. Evan Bayh of Indiana, "there's no hope of waking up."

I say: Let them sleep.

Let them sleep indeed, let them sleep. Let them set up strawmen and ad-homs. Let them make up fake quotes. Let them talk about you lost, we won, get over it and you don't get to participate anymore. Let them claim the voter desires are every -ist and -ism in imaginable. Let them talk about cycles and ignorance while being asleep to reality.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #142 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

It is. The French healthcare system is the best in the world. French people love their system.

French healthcare is better than yours. It is cheaper, and it covers everyone, and it provides a better service, with better facilities, than yours, and something like %65 of the French people are happy with it.

The sooner you follow the French model, the better it will be for you.

LMAO

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GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #143 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

I see. So wikipedia: that's no good as a source. Google hits, on the other hand: totally fine.

Hey, everyone, I'm arguing with trumptman!

Anyway.

You said that Keith Olberman was using a homophobic term.
But teabagging is not a homosexual practice.
So he was not being homophobic.
So you are wrong.

Keyword:

WRONG

LMAO2

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #144 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Faux is giddy when saying a guy asked why he voted Repub responded by saying he was saving America. Yeah, maybe the Faux Noise Amerika.

The the USSC goes and opens the flood gates to corporate donations. Wow. A good week for Republicans, to the detriment of the country and ultimately the world.

The virus which is eating away at society doesn't have Dem stamped on it.

The Democrats took control of the executive and legislative branches and treated the economic future of this nation as a cookie-jar to raid, to fund decade old party priorities.

Problem was, there were much more important things, like REALLY recovering the economy instead of propping it up in order to rob it. More important things like American Jobs. The Democrats didn't think these were the highest priority... they thought taking away from my future and the future of my kids was more important than the job I do have, and the lack of jobs for the unfortunate 10% of the working population that want to work.

People watched how the Democrats lined up at the trough and divvied up the future with the unions, the drug and insurance companies, and the liberal special interest groups and planned on how they would slurp the meat off the bones...and they called it "Health Care" and were going to force it down all our throats...then make us pay for it, to boot.

Democrats are their own worst enemies. It's about JOBS, stupid!
post #145 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taskiss View Post

It's about JOBS, stupid!

It's always been about Jobs.

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post #146 of 186
I think we should be recreating the Seven Ancient Wonders of the world all across the country to bring tourism to cities that have been hit the hardest and put people to work. Maybe make the banks finance it with their bonuses. More jobs means more people earning money and buying houses! Win win!

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #147 of 186
Trumpetman,

There is much truth to Kraut's analysis - altough I'd make a distinction between running against Obama (who remains popular in Mass) and running against his policies.

For those unwilling to accept reality, they ought to checkout the Rassmussen exit poll of 1000 Mass. voters:

Quote:
First Look At Massachusetts Election Night Poll Data
Health Care Top Issue for Massachusetts Voters
Tuesday, January 19, 2010...

Health care has been a huge issue in this election. Fifty-two percent (52%) of Brown voters say it was the most important issue in determining their vote. Sixty-three percent (63%) of Coakley voters say health care was the top issue:

· 78% of Brown voters Strongly Oppose the health care legislation before Congress.

· 52% of Coakley supporters Strongly Favor the health care plan. Another 41% Somewhat Favor the legislation.

· 61% of Brown voters say deficit reduction is more important than health care reform.

· 46% of Coakley voters say health care legislation more important than deficit reduction.

· 86% of Coakley voters say its better to pass the bill before Congress rather than nothing at all.

· 88% of Brown voters say its better to pass nothing at all.

Health care and deficit spending were the critical issues. Moreover, the middle class voted with Brown, the supplicants and elites when for Coakley.

Amazing - so much for the compact with the middle class...even in Mass.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/publ...ight_poll_data
post #148 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxParrish View Post

Trumpetman,

There is much truth to Kraut's analysis - altough I'd make a distinction between running against Obama (who remains popular in Mass) and running against his policies.

For those unwilling to accept reality, they ought to checkout the Rassmussen exit poll of 1000 Mass. voters:



Health care and deficit spending were the critical issues. Moreover, the middle class voted with Brown, the supplicants and elites when for Coakley.

Amazing - so much for the compact with the middle class...even in Mass.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/publ...ight_poll_data

Thanks for the find and we have to remember that these are Mass. numbers. If we went to a part of the country where it is less blue, the percentages would be even higher. Also Obama has always been more popular than his actual policies. Part of it is reverse racism where people don't want to express displeasure with him. They don't want to be labeled racist and since that is what the media labels every person, organization or even policy that disagrees with him, I can understand their point. The other part is that he acts as a blank canvas and allows people to project their wants and desires onto him. This is why, even when governing, his speeches are nothing but empty platitudes.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #149 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Thanks for the find and we have to remember that these are Mass. numbers. If we went to a part of the country where it is less blue, the percentages would be even higher. Also Obama has always been more popular than his actual policies. Part of it is reverse racism where people don't want to express displeasure with him. They don't want to be labeled racist and since that is what the media labels every person, organization or even policy that disagrees with him, I can understand their point. The other part is that he acts as a blank canvas and allows people to project their wants and desires onto him. This is why, even when governing, his speeches are nothing but empty platitudes.

Yep. Guess that is what annoyed me so much; that his platitudes were not even consistent or coherent. Whereas most blowhards at least have a group of platitudes that mesh with our culture memory, I was thought them something like Prof Irewin Correy speak - just saying things that sound like something...but one is not sure.
post #150 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

LMAO

French healthcare is the best in the world.

It is better than American healthcare.

French healthcare provides better doctors and better facilities than American healthcare.

French healthcare treats more people than American healthcare.

65% or the French population is 'content' or 'very pleased' with the system.

French healthcare is the best in the world.

It is better than American healthcare.

French healthcare is free and funded with taxes.

Do you have any questions?

You can put one of these on an internet forum.

And American healthcare is still not as good as French healthcare.

Do you have any questions? Do you want to discuss this? Or do you want to put a and pretend that American healthcare is better than French healthcare?

Because French healthcare is BETTER than American Healthcare.

American healthcare is NOT AS GOOD as French healthcare.

Do you want to discuss this? Or do you just want to ?

Because American healthcare is NOT AS GOOD as French healthcare.
post #151 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

LMAO2

Yes.

'Teabagging' is not a homosexual term.

You are wrong.

You have made yourself look foolish.

It is very, very clear.

You know when you did this above?

You made yourself look like foolish. Yes. You did.

Goodnight.
post #152 of 186
I just thought of another way to put it.

You know how you think that American healthcare is 'the best in the world'?

It isn't.

It's quite shit.

It's really expensive, and it doesn't serve people who need it, and it's facilities aren't as good, and it costs the state more.

It's not very good,

French healthcare?

That is good.
post #153 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

It's always been about Jobs.


That is a handsome man.
post #154 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

French healthcare is the best in the world.

It is better than American healthcare.

French healthcare provides better doctors and better facilities than American healthcare.
French healthcare treats more people than American healthcare.
65% or the French population is 'content' or 'very pleased' with the system.
French healthcare is free and funded with taxes.

Do you have any questions?

One of the unfortunate results of bally-hooing a cherished myth is that if one major part of it is found to be shameless falsehood, the remaining assertions tend to be dismissed as disinformation.

For example, the French healthcare system is not free, nor is it funded by just taxes:

Quote:
The resulting programme is profession-based: all people working are required to pay a portion of their income to a health insurance fund, which mutualises the risk of illness, and which reimburses medical expenses at varying rates.



Quote:
4) Price Comparison. Like in the United States, French workers and employers split the cost of health insurance on payday. Employees pay a one percent wage levy as well as a "social contribution" that varies according to income. Employers pay a straight 13 percent wage levy. Simple comparisons of insurance premiums in the United States are difficult because the price of American insurance depends on the "risk class" and size of the group seeking coverage.

And

Quote:
Finally, for fees that the mandatory system does not cover, there is a large range of private complementary insurance plans available. The market for these programs is very competitive, and often subsidised by the employer, which means that premiums are usually modest. 85% of French people benefit from complementary private health insurance.[21][22]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_insurance
http://jan.ucc.nau.edu/pvd/Primer.htm
post #155 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxParrish View Post

One of the unfortunate results of bally-hooing a cherished myth is that if one major part of it is found to be shameless falsehood, the remaining assertions tend to be dismissed as disinformation.

For example, the French healthcare system is not free, nor is it funded by just taxes:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_insurance
http://jan.ucc.nau.edu/pvd/Primer.htm

You're quite right. I shouldn't have written 'free'. I meant 'free at the point of service'.

French people are quite proud of the health care and don't mind paying for it.
post #156 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

Yes.
'Teabagging' is not a homosexual term.
You are wrong.
You have made yourself look foolish.
It is very, very clear.
You know when you did this above?
You made yourself look like foolish. Yes. You did.
Goodnight.

Trolling is sad.

That said, here is one of your favorite truth tellers explaining how Olbermann was completely over the top and not acting appropriately for someone presenting the news.

Jon Stewart on Keith Olbermann


Keith's reply....

"You're right. I have been a little over the top lately. Point taken. Sorry."

On the main point, not the tangential point, not the strawman, not only am I right, but Jon Stewart agrees with me and so does Olbermann.

The only one who doesn't agree? Someone who like scaring away crows with strawmen.

Game, set, point and match.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #157 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

You're quite right. I shouldn't have written 'free'. I meant 'free at the point of service'.

French people are quite proud of the health care and don't mind paying for it.

And I should have been so harsh, it was not a shameless falsehood...just a misleading exaggeration.

The French should be quite proud of their health care, it is one of the two highest quality systems in the world (the US being the other). Almost as good as you think, and in actual performance (cure rates) almost equal to that of the US. And studies suggest that it is far less expensive in terms of GDP and absolute cost.

Interestingly though, in spite of our widely diverse groups and lower quality care for low income groups (including crappy diet, obesity, etc.) the average US cure rates constantly rank in the top three - an average that only France approaches.

On the other hand, the US system is far better at health care than the UK or Canada, and much of Europe.

And of all the systems, Germany interests me the most. The French model cannot be imported, it is too tied to French culture (e.g. French doctors earn 1/3rd of US doctors). Germany, on the other hand, has a system that might be adaptable.
post #158 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Trolling is sad.
.

No. What is sad is your inability to accept that you have made a mistake, even when it is demonstrated in the most humiliatingly direct fashion. Making the ad hom of 'troll' and attacking my 'reasoning' ad hominem only serve to humiliate you further.

It is a fact that you said that Keith Olberman was 'homophobic' for using the term 'teabagger'.

It is a fact that 'teabagging' is not a homosexual practice.

It is a fact, then, that Keith Olberman was not being homophobic, and you are wrong.

Please read these sentences again. And then, perhaps, again. And then (why not?) a third time.

It is a fact that you have made a mistake. And that you will not admit it.

I note also that Keith Olberman's apology has absolutely fuck all to do with your post, which was made on an internet forum for Apple computer users. You accused Keith Olberman of being homophobic. And you were wrong, because Keith Olberman was not being homophobic.

Just take it on the chin, like a pair of balls, say, and admit that you are in error. Game, set, match and championship.

You are wrong.
post #159 of 186
When I found my son "teabagging" another young boy on his halo 360 video game system he explained that all of the boys do it to one another. Girls do not play the halo 360 video game, therefore, it's clearly an act of homosexual deviance.

Obviously, I promptly discarded the halo 360 video game system.
post #160 of 186
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumbo Jumbo View Post

It is a fact that 'teabagging' is not a homosexual practice.

Are you claiming a male homosexual cannot engage in this act?

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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