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Can someone please explain the use of the tablet to me?

post #1 of 62
Thread Starter 
Hey guys, I'm a long time apple fan and there really isn't anything the company's released that they haven't been able to convince me was worth getting. But i really just can't see any practicality to a tablet computer, made by apple or otherwise. I know MS and Dell have their own stuff in the tablet field now and i still don't see the point.

The news that the apple tablet is going to run the iPhone OS was very disappointing, basically what I've been able to gather is that this thing will be able to do everything the iPhone can do except its completely lost its portability being too big to fit in your pocket, and anything it does better than the iphone, could still be done better, and with more ease of use with a laptop. So it kind of fails as a portable computer right off the bat.

People are comparing the tablet to e-readers, the kindle and whatnot, is that the market apple's aiming at here? why? The reason apple's revolutionary releases the Macintosh, iPod, and iPhone, were so successful is because they were needed. It seems with each of these products, apple looked at an important market, analyzed everything that was wrong with it, and fixed those problems creating an easy to use product that anyone can enjoy without being intimidated. The personal computer industry needed that. The music industry needed that. The smart phone (well really the entire mobile phone) industry needed that. Why the hell should I care about the revolution of the electronic books market?? Not everyone reads, and most who do cherish the feel of holding a book and feeling the pages in their hands as they turn them. No one who enjoys reading is going to pay $600+ to scroll through a sea of blinding pixels.

Folks as i've stated i am indeed a big fan of apple, I really really want to be as excited as everyone else about the device thats coming. I just need someone to tell me where the practicality of this endeavor is. I really can't see it. Help?
post #2 of 62
Try looking at the wide number of threads about this very point.

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #3 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Try looking at the wide number of threads about this very point.

im looking and im not really seeing anything that counters my point. If you're feeling so damned helpful could you at least send me a link to one of these "countless" threads so i can get out of everyones hair?
post #4 of 62
Alas my friend, no one can explain the use of a tablet to YOU.

Reading your post, it seems that you have followed rumors and news like most everyone else here.
If, in reading those, you have not found a personal use for the tablet, then there is a strong chance you never will, and nothing any member of this forum says will change your mind.

Of course, you should probably wait a few hours, and let Mr. Jobs himself attempt to explain the use of the tablet to you. If at that time, you still feel the way you obviously do now, I would discourage purchase of the device.

For the record, with the way the rumors are skewing, I myself am moving closer to buying a modbook... but again, I'll let Mr J. make his pitch to me before I decide.
post #5 of 62
maybe something like http://tapntap.com
Most of us employ the Internet not to seek the best information, but rather to select information that confirms our prejudices. - Nicholas D. Kristof
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Most of us employ the Internet not to seek the best information, but rather to select information that confirms our prejudices. - Nicholas D. Kristof
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post #6 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapple View Post

Hey guys, I'm a long time apple fan and there really isn't anything the company's released that they haven't been able to convince me was worth getting. But i really just can't see any practicality to a tablet computer, made by apple or otherwise.

Here was the mini-essay I wrote. Trying to work out the same thing.

Sorry, it's a long post.


Quote:
What good is this tablet thing?
I have been trying to work out what the justification of an iSlate is. Where is the market? After all, all previous tablet computers have been dismal failures.

Computers, desktops and laptops are not really consumer products and never have been. Their origins date back to professional computer uses like Word Processing and Spreadsheets.

Despite attempts to make them easier to use. Personal Computers remain tools for professionals, which have only made a handful of concessions for non-professional usage.

The "professional tool" PC is not bad thing. We professionals like to create content. We want keyboards, and we want an exposed file system, and we want to plug stuff in. These are essential aspects to the personal computer and can never be dropped.

But these requirements come with three unavoidable problems.

1) The form factor. Physical bulk. Professional computers simply must have keyboards. They are useless without them. And even the slimmest computers are bulky when opened.

2) Power. You need a desktop-like CPU to run desktop apps. This means a low batter life.

3) Complexity. The desktop experience demands a windowing WIMP interface. With file systems, and settings and all.

For us technophiles, a full OS and GUI is something we hardly think of. It is a given. But such systems requires a lengthy boot process, and a level of technical expertise which is not universal. Some basic tasks are ridiculously difficult.

The flexible nature of software also brings with it the risk of viruses or configuration nightmares, which non-technical people just cannot solve. Your Granny can still not use your Mac. Your uncle can use a PC, but he has to trade it in every 18 months because it is "broken".

So can the computer be "re-thunk" for a non-professional market? Can you design a device for a market that cares more about consuming media than creating media? If you see kids with laptops, they watch movies, send text-like messages on facebook - they never open a file-system. They don't want to.

Perhaps there is a demand for a consumer-oriented computer appliance? It would offer all those computer benefits we get on the notebook, but without these problems.

So the a CE computer would
1) Have a form factor which lends itself to media-consumption, reading, portability, bagability. A robust, slim, screen format which would take-up less space than a magazine. This means dumping the rarely needed keyboard. This means a chamfered edge. This means a scratch-proof screen. A round-edged slab that can take abuse.

2) Switch to a processor and GPU designed for portable hardware. Offering long battery life. Good performance, and offload heavy lifting to the GPU where possible. 8 hours use would be good. A couple of days stand-by would be handy too.

3) Create a user experience around media consumption and not media creation. This means a brain-dead easy UI. We are talking chimpanzee-level intelligence to operate. Want to Facebook. Poke Facebook. Want to watch a movie. Poke the movie. Want to videochat with the grandkids. Poke the grandkids pic, or the camera pic. Either will get you there. And it should not only be simple, it should be fun. Every action would be rewarded with clear visual feedback.

The market is full of people who already want to do this stuff, but currently are compelled to buy a pro device that offers too much. Too much complexity. Too much bulk. They buy notebooks but secretly they are confused why the screens are blank, and the useful stuff is hidden in a menu. They don't know why sometimes it does not work. Or what some of those settings do.

A consumer-targetted device has the potential to split the computer market in two. With professional media-creation computers on one side, and consumer media consumption computers on the other.

Done well, and priced like a netbook, such a device could get to consumers who previously would never consider buying a computer. It could sell into schools to replace textbooks. It would make the Kindle look dull. It would make netbooks look like something from a previous century. Granny would have one as a photoframe that lets her Skype the grandkids.

And for us professionals who love our notebooks. We will keep on buying them. We demand the flexibility. But when we are on the commute, we might look enviously at all those dullards reading the newspaper on their tablets.



C.
post #7 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Here was the mini-essay I wrote. Trying to work out the same thing.

Sorry, it's a long post.
C.

Points considered you're still basically talking about a device like the iPhone. I have an ipod touch, have the facebook app, the pandora app, i have games, movies, photo's, and ofcourse all my music. It works with that super easy concept of, touch it, and there it is working, and yet it fits in my pocket. i dont need a backpack or extra carrier to tote it around.

I've once before considered the possibilities of the tablet replacing text books (college level). I thought to myself how wonderful it would be to have my text books in a digital format, where i can highlight and make notes and still be able to get rid of them if i want. The ability to being able to use a search feature to find something i need rather than scanning pages seems like an absolute need for making things easier. How much easier could it get? books would be sold like apps, or like audiobooks. you find the one you need on itunes (rather than that treacherous search through your schools book store) and just click buy.

However there's one pretty huge downside to this idea. resale. If you're in college or have been, you know very well that the books are hugely expensive and you are likely short on money as is. Getting to sell back your books or to put them on ebay is pretty much a necessity, if you want to be able to afford your next semesters books. If you got them from a purchase on itunes, then that cant happen. You pay hundreds of dollars for a digital version of a book that you only needed for a few months. or worse, end up in those scenarios when professors require books, then on the first day of class tell you that you'll never use them and can return them. Well for those who bought the tablet version, too late. And thats a HUGE loss.
post #8 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapple View Post

Points considered you're still basically talking about a device like the iPhone.

Honestly, people will enjoy the tablet so much, they will demand that Apple make a pocket version.

C.
post #9 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Honestly, people will enjoy the tablet so much, they will demand that Apple make a pocket version.

C.

well precisely the reason im confused. There IS a pocket version.
post #10 of 62
I think the advantage of the Apple tablet machine over the iPhone will be larger screen real estate to work with, more advanced and complex methods of input beyond a compressed keyboard and touch/swiping. It'll also allow more storage, higher resolution video, potentially better web browsing, more powerful apps, and on top of it all, print-style media. This isn't going to be a machine for replacing the desktop- it's going to augment the desktop. It's going to be the ultimate portable media consumption, media editing, and internet communications device. For those already using a laptop it's practical use will be diminished, but for those that primarily use a stationary desktop like the iMac, it's going to be perfectly slotted. It'll offer all the portability of a laptop, minus most of the media creation capabilities. It's gonna be perfect for the media-consumption-oriented path consumer computing is taking. For doing more advanced types of content creation you'll want a traditional computer- touch screen keyboards aren't yet ideally suited for large amounts of text entry, and moreover this thing simply won't have the sort of horsepower an iMac or MacBook Pro will.

So far most tablets have been oriented with content creation being the primary goal, and content consumption being the secondary goal. Touch screens simply don't do that as well as the traditional setup for most people. This tablet is going to have to make omnipotent use of the hardware via the software- and it's going to have to be primarily focused on content consumption with content creation being secondary.

The big point of the tablet/slate design is the portability. If you already use a laptop, then the portability of a tablet/slate isn't necessary since you more or less already have it. What the laptop offers is that level of portability with the horsepower and input tools (keyboard/trackpad) to make content creation & interaction easy. What the tablet offers is the interface and input tools (touch screen, "Multitouch") to make content consumption & interaction easy. The choice of one over the other is really dependent on what you do with the computer. If it's getting "real work" done, or media creation, the laptop offers more benefits. If it's surfing the web/listening to music/watching movies/chatting/making the occasional Keynote presentation, the tablet/slate offers more potential benefits. This thing is essentially going to be the bigger brother of the iPod touch- basically a powerful pocket computer that's been amped up in every way. It'll allow things to be done that simply weren't feasible on the iPod Touch's small screen- such as photo editing/organization as seen in iPhoto, or Presentation creation as seen in Keynote. Or even text-ebook viewing & margin noting as proposed elsewhere on this board.

What Apple's tablet/slate will do is fix a problem category most people didn't even realize existed. It'll offer the ability to do a great deal of what most consumers buy laptops for today- and it'll do it in a way that utterly pampers the user.

[/rant]
PC Gamer, Musician, Mac Geek. | Jerion.us
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PC Gamer, Musician, Mac Geek. | Jerion.us
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post #11 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapple View Post

well precisely the reason im confused. There IS a pocket version.

Yeah, but the pocket-version kinda sucks for for Movies and for Books and web-browsing could be better.

The tablet form-factor makes the touch technology useful for a different class of applications.
And the only thing that is radical is that this class of applications corresponds very closely to what most regular people do with computers.

In other words, this would be mostly all the computer they will ever need.

C.
post #12 of 62
siggy
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #13 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

siggy

Why would a "pro" want a tablet?

C.
post #14 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Yeah, but the pocket-version kinda sucks for for Movies and for Books and web-browsing could be better.

The tablet form-factor makes the touch technology useful for a different class of applications.
And the only thing that is radical is that this class of applications corresponds very closely to what most regular people do with computers.

In other words, this would be mostly all the computer they will ever need.

C.

IMO you are dramatically underestimating people. I think most people want to do a lot more with their PCs but don't have the money or the knowledge and ability. To bad Jobs can't address those issues rather than treating them like chimps.
post #15 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Why would a "pro" want a tablet?

C.

It depends what kind of pro you are talking about.. I think all visual artists -- right brain people would prefer a tablet over a laptop.
post #16 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Why would a "pro" want a tablet?

C.

They wouldn't be the same product,  Tablet would be a large iPod touch, Mac touch would be a replacement Mac. They might even be "quite different" on the hardware side, aside from the screen size.

The reason why I wresting with this idea is I think Apple needs to be quite ambitious with this particular endevour, and if they are the issue then is price, so you're sort of begging for two different product offerings then. 1: Large "jumbo" iPod touch to make sure the print thing makes sense. 2: To also do a touchscreen Mac at the same time. So if you buy the more niche product you're still getting all the benefits of the cheaper product, you just have the addition of that tablet having the potential to be your only computer. I.E. The Mac touch could be instead of an Air, but the  Tablet wouldn't have the functionality for that possibility.

If they only release the jumbo iPod touch product then I expect some serious crippling of it as they wouldn't dare eat up Mac sales by giving it too much power or functionality. I guess my final point here is that I hope Apple is the dreamer I am, and not simply play it safe with merely a jumbo iPod touch.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #17 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

It depends what kind of pro you are talking about.. I think all visual artists -- right brain people would prefer a tablet over a laptop.

I am a visual artist.
I need me my 30" screen. Wish it was bigger.
I need a big Wacom tablet.
I need a mostrous collection of CPU Hungry 2D and 3D applications
And my Mac Pro - is a bit underpowered at times.

A tablet-form-factor computer is not going to sell to me for the purposes of work.

But as an entertainment device, I would be quite interested.

C.
post #18 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

They wouldn't be the same product,  Tablet would be a large iPod touch, Mac touch would be a replacement Mac. They might even be "quite different" on the hardware side, aside from the screen size.

I still don't get it. I don't see what benefits a professional computer user would get by reducing the screen size and losing the keyboard.

C.
post #19 of 62
I so wish they would do the mac touch. A big iPhone would have some uses, but a tablet based mac, that you could take home, drop into a dock and use with a bluetooth keyboard and mouse, not that would be something else!
post #20 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

I am a visual artist.
I need me my 30" screen. Wish it was bigger.
I need a big Wacom tablet.
I need a mostrous collection of CPU Hungry 2D and 3D applications
And my Mac Pro - is a bit underpowered at times.

A tablet-form-factor computer is not going to sell to me for the purposes of work.

But as an entertainment device, I would be quite interested.

C.

for 600 to 800 bucks? when an iPod touch would cost half that and give the same results?
post #21 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

It depends what kind of pro you are talking about.. I think all visual artists -- right brain people would prefer a tablet over a laptop.

Teachers could certainly use tablets, especially those like EFL teachers who often work with small groups.

Restaurant managers could use them to help with seating plans. Add wedding planners here.

Fire departments could use them to allocate assets.

Lots of pros could use tablets given the right apps.

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #22 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Teachers could certainly use tablets, especially those like EFL teachers who often work with small groups.

Restaurant managers could use them to help with seating plans. Add wedding planners here.

Fire departments could use them to allocate assets.

Lots of pros could use tablets given the right apps.

Sure.

Yes, the tablet form-factor is ideal for a number of on-the-go applications. Point of sale, nursing and so on. But all of these applications could be met by an iPhone class CPU and GPU.

Any of these professions could make use of such a device, as long as the software was available.

But they would not need a "pro" version of the hardware.

C.
post #23 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

IMO you are dramatically underestimating people. I think most people want to do a lot more with their PCs but don't have the money or the knowledge and ability. To bad Jobs can't address those issues rather than treating them like chimps.

If a user wants to do something more with their tablet. Then they buy an app for it.

The tablet would be great for a large range of general purpose tasks. But bear in mind the nature of a touch interface; it's better for getting stuff out of a computer than putting stuff in.

C.
post #24 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

I am a visual artist.
I need me my 30" screen. Wish it was bigger.
I need a big Wacom tablet.
I need a mostrous collection of CPU Hungry 2D and 3D applications
And my Mac Pro - is a bit underpowered at times.

A tablet-form-factor computer is not going to sell to me for the purposes of work.

But as an entertainment device, I would be quite interested.

C.

Well I AM an artist.. but I am a sculptor and don't require nor can I afford a big Wacom that I would only use in a limited capacity. So I can't justify the expense. I also have no pressing need for a laptop.. a tablet would be a PERFECT solution for me.

I bet there are a ton of right brain people that would prefer a more intuitive method to interact with their computers as well. If Microsofts user interface wasn't so poor I believe many would have discovered that already.

Also, note that Apple computers main market was towards artists in the past.. I think a tablet for artists fits that MO much more than a media player.
post #25 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

I still don't get it. I don't see what benefits a professional computer user would get by reducing the screen size and losing the keyboard.

C.

Full computer functionality with ultra-portibility, more like an Air on steroids. All the benefits of the  Tablet--like gaming and reading. Direct manipulation of data. Easy learning curve, efficient operation. Revolutionary user-interface.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #26 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

If a user wants to do something more with their tablet. Then they buy an app for it.

The tablet would be great for a large range of general purpose tasks. But bear in mind the nature of a touch interface; it's better for getting stuff out of a computer than putting stuff in.

C.

Not according to this guy... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcKqyn-gUbY
post #27 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

Not according to this guy... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcKqyn-gUbY

If you watch the video.. Which I have done several times.. What does he achieve?

He uses multi-touch to accelerate and optimise the browsing of data in visual form.

That's what its good for!

C.
post #28 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohsnapple View Post

for 600 to 800 bucks? when an iPod touch would cost half that and give the same results?

I would never read a book on a touch. I have tried on my iPhone.
I wouldn't watch a movie on it either.
Nor would I browse the web, if I had a bigger screen available.

So for those activities, a tablet would be as good as - or better than an iPod touch. And for many people who use netbooks for these applications, the tablet would be a much better experience.

So $599-$699 seems okay. I think more is unlikely.

C.
post #29 of 62
He says in the video that computer controls should be adapting to us not the other way around. what if you want to use a different keyboard pattern LIKE Dvorak.. or a completely different configuration of buttons?

And creating and manipulating something on screen IS putting in data. It would be impossible to control that stuff he did without that ability to input information in that way with so many control points and so accurately. We just need to learn how to use all that input power to make all our work more efficient.
post #30 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

He says in the video that computer controls should be adapting to us not the other way around. what if you want to use a different keyboard pattern LIKE Dvorak.. or a completely different configuration of buttons?

And creating and manipulating something on screen IS putting in data. It would be impossible to control that stuff he did without that ability to input information in that way with so many control points and so accurately. We just need to learn how to use all that input power to make all our work more efficient.

Arm,

I don't think you get what I am saying.

Each input method has its strengths and weaknesses.
  • The scrollwheel is good at scrolling.
  • The keyboard is good at inputting text.
  • The Wacom/stylus combo is great for painting and drawing
  • And the touch surface is great for moving through visual data and selecting.
That's what I meant when I said the touch-surface is good for getting out of a computer. It's simply awesome for browsing through a virtual space. It's much less good at the sort of input drudgery required to write a report or do a spreadsheet.

C.
post #31 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Arm,

I don't think you get what I am saying.

Each input method has its strengths and weaknesses.
  • The scrollwheel is good at scrolling.
  • The keyboard is good at inputting text.
  • The Wacom/stylus combo is great for painting and drawing
  • And the touch surface is great for moving through visual data and selecting.
That's what I meant when I said the touch-surface is good for getting out of a computer. It's simply awesome for browsing through a virtual space. It's much less good at the sort of input drudgery required to write a report or do a spreadsheet.

C.

I understand what you are saying.. I just don't think you realize all the potential the touch interface has for inputing data and controlling apps.. and how poor the keyboards and mouses we use are for this.

I would like to see how many people are touch typists anyway.. probably a minute number of computer users. If no one can touch type very efficiently is it a good input method?
post #32 of 62
You guys realize the tablet isn't out yet? Is it really worth arguing the merits of a product that we don't even know official details of?

"Well, I heard these rumors, and they think it's going to look like this, so it obviously must be a useless device"

It's still a little early to call this one. Can't you just wait a couple more hours to figure out if the tablet has any real purpose?
post #33 of 62
@ bungamunji.

We got nothin better to do to kill time!
post #34 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

@ bungamunji.

We got nothin better to do to kill time!

Yeah, This is fun!
And in a couple of hours the referee blows the whistle and we see who came closest!

C.
post #35 of 62
Haha, me either. I mean, I'm doing the same thing you guys are. But the hype is a little bit ridiculous. It just cracks me up when people seriously argue over things that aren't announced yet.
post #36 of 62
It doesn't really surprise me people are arguing.. I know how much I have invested in this -- lots of time and thought. I have a bad feeling my dreams are about to get dashed from what I have heard so far though..
post #37 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Yeah, This is fun!
And in a couple of hours the referee blows the whistle and we see who came closest!

C.

Sadly, from what I have heard so far, I think you may end up being right about what we get.. BUT.. the question then becomes.. did we get what we really need?
post #38 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bungamunji View Post

Haha, me either. I mean, I'm doing the same thing you guys are. But the hype is a little bit ridiculous. It just cracks me up when people seriously argue over things that aren't announced yet.

the tablets like apple's Area 51. The most famous thing that doesn't exist.

the odd thing is despite my inability to see how this "rumored" product would be useful, i'm still expecting to be won by it once it's presented
post #39 of 62
If it allows coupling of a keyboard and ten-key (USB or BT) then it will be very useful for lots of people.

As a teacher, I can see plenty of ways even just a touch-based device could be very useful, not just for accessing data, but inputting. I already use my iPhone for plenty of tasks I used to use a notebook for.

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

Reply
post #40 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArticulatedArm View Post

did we get what we really need?

Depends who you mean by we.

I think we professionals did not get what we need from this product.

But to be fair... we professionals have had the entire computer industry making us products for the last 25 years.

But we consumers will get a device which is pretty cool, and people will ask why no one has build a consumer computer before.

C.
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