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iPad vs HP Slate vs Tablet PC

post #1 of 24
1/27/10 at 2:07pm
Thread Starter 
Will the 1GHz Apple A4 Processor limit the iPad to just iPad/iPhone/iPod apps?

From what I gather looking at the picture of the HP Slate, it can actually run really popular and useful software such as MS Office and perhaps Photoshop. If not, then I am sure a Tablet PC running Windows 7 and on Intel Processors can run that type of software. Can anyone see those software running on the iPad? Perhaps running with an emulator?
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post #2 of 24
1/27/10 at 2:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vtorch View Post

Will the 1GHz Apple A4 Processor limit the iPad to just iPad/iPhone/iPod apps?

From what I gather looking at the picture of the HP Slate, it can actually run really popular and useful software such as MS Office and perhaps Photoshop. If not, then I am sure a Tablet PC running Windows 7 and on Intel Processors can run that type of software. Can anyone see those software running on the iPad? Perhaps running with an emulator?

I know I shouldn't say this but I think this may open a window of opportunity for Microsoft and Google.

Perhaps something the size/weight of the macbook air, but with a full touch screen (removable perhaps) and a far more powerful processor running Windows 7 (or crappy chrome OS).
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post #3 of 24
1/27/10 at 2:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellbound View Post

I know I shouldn't say this but I think this may open a window of opportunity for Microsoft and Google.

Perhaps something the size/weight of the macbook air, but with a full touch screen (removable perhaps) and a far more powerful processor running Windows 7 (or crappy chrome OS).

Hello? This window has been open for years. And the world still waits.

People have been releasing tablet computers since the early 90s.
The most significant was the Origami Project. Where Microsoft encouraged hardware manufacturers to build computers (UMPCs) using Windows.

All such devices have been an epic commercial failure.

Because...

a) the devices run a desktop OS and support standard desktop applications
b) consequently no software developer has an incentive to create tablet applications.
c) and then users discover that all un-modified desktop applications are terrible when running on a tablet.

C.
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post #4 of 24
1/27/10 at 3:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

Hello? This window has been open for years. And the world still waits.

People have been releasing tablet computers since the early 90s.
The most significant was the Origami Project. Where Microsoft encouraged hardware manufacturers to build computers (UMPCs) using Windows.

All such devices have been an epic commercial failure.

Because...

a) the devices run a desktop OS and support standard desktop applications
b) consequently no software developer has an incentive to create tablet applications.
c) and then users discover that all un-modified desktop applications are terrible when running on a tablet.

C.

Window of opportunity as in; copying everything Apple has done right (as with phones,opening an app store, featuring a lovely touch screen etc etc) and bettering Apple with everything the iPad has done/is doing wrong.

Technology moves with the times, forget what's happened in the past and you'll see Microsoft, Google and Apple all gunning for the same prize.
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post #5 of 24
1/27/10 at 3:07pm
I would say window of opportunity of all the others. True Microsoft have been pushing tablets for years without a huge amount of success, but then they've all been in a different market. Since netbooks have come along these are really the next step. The fact all the one ones in the Windows world run full Windows 7 is also major. Whenever anyone does anything good with an interface, someone else copy's it. With phones its a bit hard but just look at what you can get to replace the Apple TV interface, you think all the good bits of the iPAD arn't going to come out as free downloads for Windows 7.

Also unlike XP the newer OS's (OS X included) would actually make great tablets with the Sidebar and widgets being perfectly suited to a tablet screen.

Lastly as far as I know HTML 5 currently doesn't support any touch events. Silverlight does, so as these things get more popular expect to see more Silverlight powered web apps with multi touch. The iPAD though will be the only one not running them.
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post #6 of 24
1/27/10 at 3:24pm
The iPad isn't meant to replace Apple's line of laptops, so I imagine Apple's A4 will be more than enough to run a version of iWork, and iPhoto. Seemed pretty quick in the presentation this afternoon.
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post #7 of 24
1/27/10 at 8:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vtorch View Post

Will the 1GHz Apple A4 Processor limit the iPad to just iPad/iPhone/iPod apps?

From what I gather looking at the picture of the HP Slate, it can actually run really popular and useful software such as MS Office and perhaps Photoshop. If not, then I am sure a Tablet PC running Windows 7 and on Intel Processors can run that type of software. Can anyone see those software running on the iPad? Perhaps running with an emulator?

That's because the HP slate is a full Windows 7 PC and more than likely uses the Atom processor. The iPad is -literally- a large smartphone with what is assumed to be a fast ARM processor. There is not a chance in hell that it has the power to run a full OS like Snow Leopard or Windows 7 necessary to run software like Photoshop. Could Adobe make a pared down iPhone OS version of PS? They already have, and it pales in comparison to the desktop counterpart.

Its direct competitors aren't full PC's in slate form running Windows 7. Instead look at all the Windows Mobile and Android based tablets coming soon to get an idea of what to expect. What's funny is that the much maligned Crunchpad/JooJoo is a far, far more powerful machine in a similar form factor. And it runs Flash.
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post #8 of 24
1/27/10 at 8:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitespecter View Post

What's funny is that the much maligned Crunchpad/JooJoo is a far, far more powerful machine in a similar form factor. And it runs Flash.

"Powerful" in what sense? As far as I know, it's basically a browser.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #9 of 24
1/27/10 at 8:46pm
Is the CrunchPad that awful-looking device with the green background, with icons that look like they are from 1993? If so, there's no competition there.
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post #10 of 24
1/27/10 at 9:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

"Powerful" in what sense? As far as I know, it's basically a browser.


In the sense that it's a full Atom based computer with nVidia Ion graphics (the same graphics in the Macbook Pro) that can easily run a full Windows 7 installation. And say what you will, but Windows 7 has a lot of multitouch specific adaptations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevegmu View Post

Is the CrunchPad that awful-looking device with the green background, with icons that look like they are from 1993? If so, there's no competition there.

I disagree. It represents a far more open and useful experience than the iPad does. Is it as elegant or pretty? Obviously not.
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post #11 of 24
1/27/10 at 9:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitespecter View Post

In the sense that it's a full Atom based computer with nVidia Ion graphics (the same graphics in the Macbook Pro) that can easily run a full Windows 7 installation. And say what you will, but Windows 7 has a lot of multitouch specific adaptations.

It's fun to invoke specs as if they were a secret incantation, isn't it? What does any of that do for me, exactly?

Quote:
I disagree. It represents a far more open and useful experience than the iPad does. Is it as elegant or pretty? Obviously not.

I see. So the JooJoo (which you've never seen or held) represents a far more open and useful experience that the iPad (which you've never seen or held), and you know this because of "openness" and, I guess, those "multitouch specific adaptations" in Windows 7. Which kind of leaves me wondering why the people who made the tablet you think is so good didn't bother to go with that.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #12 of 24
1/27/10 at 10:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

It's fun to invoke specs as if they were a secret incantation, isn't it? What does any of that do for me, exactly?

Allow you to run flash fully accelerated by the graphics card, for one.

Quote:
I see. So the JooJoo (which you've never seen or held) represents a far more open and useful experience that the iPad (which you've never seen or held), and you know this because of "openness" and, I guess, those "multitouch specific adaptations" in Windows 7. Which kind of leaves me wondering why the people who made the tablet you think is so good didn't bother to go with that.

Are you seriously implying that a computer with a full Windows 7 installation is not more open and capable than the walled garden iPhone OS?
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post #13 of 24
1/27/10 at 11:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitespecter View Post

Allow you to run flash fully accelerated by the graphics card, for one.



Are you seriously implying that a computer with a full Windows 7 installation is not more open and capable than the walled garden iPhone OS?

Flash can go fsck itself. There are native apps available that are better than the run of the mill flash games and I hope flash dies out soon on the internet as a video container. (Go HTML5 powered Youtube!).

Windows 7 is not more powerful than the iPhone OS given the horsepower of the device. I am sure some people are using Netbooks that are powered by Windows 7 and Office 2010 while multitasking Adobe PS at the same time on that Atom powered device.
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Most of us employ the Internet not to seek the best information, but rather to select information that confirms our prejudices. - Nicholas D. Kristof
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post #14 of 24
1/28/10 at 12:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by talksense101 View Post

Flash can go fsck itself. There are native apps available that are better than the run of the mill flash games and I hope flash dies out soon on the internet as a video container. (Go HTML5 powered Youtube!).

Windows 7 is not more powerful than the iPhone OS given the horsepower of the device. I am sure some people are using Netbooks that are powered by Windows 7 and Office 2010 while multitasking Adobe PS at the same time on that Atom powered device.

I registered just to point out that this is what my desktop looked like while reading this post:

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/8207/dshjg.jpg

Runs fine. Cheers.
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post #15 of 24
1/28/10 at 4:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitespecter View Post

In the sense that it's a full Atom based computer with nVidia Ion graphics (the same graphics in the Macbook Pro) that can easily run a full Windows 7 installation. And say what you will, but Windows 7 has a lot of multitouch specific adaptations.



I disagree. It represents a far more open and useful experience than the iPad does. Is it as elegant or pretty? Obviously not.

That you for summing up why the iPad belongs in the consumer market and why these other half baked ideas never did or will.
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post #16 of 24
1/28/10 at 4:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phyzix View Post

I registered just to point out that this is what my desktop looked like while reading this post:

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/8207/dshjg.jpg

Runs fine. Cheers.

Fine eh? Little subjective. Fine to someone who wants this hardware and this software and wants it to work. To someone who cares only about those particular pieces of software, you'd be pretty cruel to recommend such terrible hardware for using them.
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post #17 of 24
1/28/10 at 12:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Fine eh? Little subjective. Fine to someone who wants this hardware and this software and wants it to work. To someone who cares only about those particular pieces of software, you'd be pretty cruel to recommend such terrible hardware for using them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by talksense101 View Post

I am sure some people are using Netbooks that are powered by Windows 7 and Office 2010 while multitasking Adobe PS at the same time on that Atom powered device.

Have either of you ever even used an Atom powered machine? Everything you're saying is patently wrong and reeks of ignorance and prejudice.

I run a lot of apps on mine simultaneously, and I know others who do too. How slow do you think the Atom is, exactly? It's more powerful than the fastest PowerPC G4 processors, and we all know how "powerful" we thought those were just a few years ago. Using your logic, all that the PowerMac G4s were good for was surfing the web.
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post #18 of 24
1/28/10 at 2:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Fine eh? Little subjective. Fine to someone who wants this hardware and this software and wants it to work. To someone who cares only about those particular pieces of software, you'd be pretty cruel to recommend such terrible hardware for using them.

I believe you are unfairly discrediting the abilities of atom processors, which are at par or more powerful than comparable single core processors from several years ago. You are correct that I would not recommend using a netbook equipped with an atom processor for intensive applications or gaming, that would be ludicrous. However to say that the Ipad is more powerful than a comparably priced netbook certainly shows ignorance about just how capable these machines are.
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post #19 of 24
1/29/10 at 1:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phyzix View Post

However to say that the Ipad is more powerful than a comparably priced netbook certainly shows ignorance about just how capable these machines are.

We know nothing at all about the iPad CPU.
Except - commentators remark how incredibly fast it is
and the battery life is 10 hours.

Making statements comparing the two, seems to show that ignorance is no barrier.

C.
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post #20 of 24
1/29/10 at 2:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phyzix View Post

I registered just to point out that this is what my desktop looked like while reading this post:

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/8207/dshjg.jpg

Runs fine. Cheers.

Great.
Seems like you are truly multitasking there. With your browser filling the screen, Photoshop doing the same and true also for Word. Those programs are not active per se, you are using one of them at a time anyway with such a small screen. Put that PS to work; apply some heavy duty filters, let Word run spell check for 1000 page document - then try to switch back to your browser. See, thats multitasking at a device level. Not so fluid anymore.
Right now your applications are idle, just as they would be on an iPhone or with the iPad.

That said, I wish iPad had some kind of multitasking just for those couple of cases it would really be handy.
And a shelf of sorts for misc files from the web and email - not everything belongs in your photos and movies apps.
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post #21 of 24
1/31/10 at 11:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

We know nothing at all about the iPad CPU.
Except - commentators remark how incredibly fast it is
and the battery life is 10 hours.

Making statements comparing the two, seems to show that ignorance is no barrier.

C.

Well certainly I could install a phone OS on a netbook and it would be pretty zippy (if I could theoretically get drivers developed). I believe that we will soon find out that the processor on the Ipad is a glorified snapdragon/tegra mix, similar to what will be on next generation cell phones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomppu View Post

Great.
Seems like you are truly multitasking there. With your browser filling the screen, Photoshop doing the same and true also for Word. Those programs are not active per se, you are using one of them at a time anyway with such a small screen. Put that PS to work; apply some heavy duty filters, let Word run spell check for 1000 page document - then try to switch back to your browser. See, thats multitasking at a device level. Not so fluid anymore.
Right now your applications are idle, just as they would be on an iPhone or with the iPad.

That said, I wish iPad had some kind of multitasking just for those couple of cases it would really be handy.
And a shelf of sorts for misc files from the web and email - not everything belongs in your photos and movies apps.

Please show me Word, Photoshop and Firefox running idle on an Ipad I must have missed that in the presentation.
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post #22 of 24
1/31/10 at 12:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitespecter View Post

Have either of you ever even used an Atom powered machine? Everything you're saying is patently wrong and reeks of ignorance and prejudice.

I run a lot of apps on mine simultaneously, and I know others who do too. How slow do you think the Atom is, exactly? It's more powerful than the fastest PowerPC G4 processors, and we all know how "powerful" we thought those were just a few years ago. Using your logic, all that the PowerMac G4s were good for was surfing the web.



Maybe you've missed the shit storm of iPad belittling from people who have never even seen one, much less used one, much less even know for certain what it can and cannot do and how it will go about it. Oh, that's right, you've been participating in same! And now you're indignant that these dreadful ignorant and prejudiced people would cast judgement! Awesome.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #23 of 24
1/31/10 at 9:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevegmu View Post

The iPad isn't meant to replace Apple's line of laptops, so I imagine Apple's A4 will be more than enough to run a version of iWork, and iPhoto. Seemed pretty quick in the presentation this afternoon.

You're 100% correct... however it not a hard stretch to imagine if Apple had the desire to do so they certainly could given the rollout of the iPad.

People were often asking if the (rumored at the time) Apple table would run a touch ready version of OS X or (what we now know to be true) the iPhone/iPod Touch OS.

Not me.. I knew deep in my heart the way Apple wanted to go if the tablet ever got to become a reality... I wasn't entirely happy about it... but none the less, I knew it right from the very start of renewed iPad rumors that began 12-16 months ago.

Now mark my words... cause I'm likely the first person to make this statement (I've made it in other threads so who knows the idea might be going around by now). Try not to die laughing but I firmly believe Apple WILL (or could) become the market leader in the 'Home Desktop PC Market' but in a totally unexpected way.

Not by bring full OS X to the iPhone and iPod Touch (and now iPad) but instead bring the iPhone OS (once fully mature) to replace desktop OS we now know as 'OS X'.

Shake your heads if you like but let it sink in just a little before dismissing it as nutball idea. If my prediction does come to fruition I have a feeling the number of zombies blindly defending App Store actions (no matter how unjust) will fall off quite rapidly.
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post #24 of 24
1/31/10 at 9:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

Maybe you've missed the shit storm of iPad belittling from people who have never even seen one, much less used one, much less even know for certain what it can and cannot do and how it will go about it. Oh, that's right, you've been participating in same! And now you're indignant that these dreadful ignorant and prejudiced people would cast judgement! Awesome.

And the best part is the guy won't have the slighest idea WHAT you're talking about and simply move on to his next poke.
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