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Consumers lose interest in iPad after Apple's unveiling - survey - Page 5

post #161 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillstones View Post

It is amazing what the little fanboys here will believe in. They actually think the iPad is more than an iPod Touch. Not everything from Apple becomes popular.

Poor thing. I see you have issues with reading and retention. Plus anyone who uses the term fanboy can be immediately dismissed as a non-serious person.
post #162 of 403
Perhaps they should do a survey of people to find out how many have heard of Retrovo. I have never heard of this site.

This is an effort (pathetic at that) to increase traffic to Retrovo, and nothing more.
post #163 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by OskiO View Post

Lost interest AFTER unveiling? I lost interest WHILE they were unveiling....

no multitask, no flash, no camera, no interest....

I know you are just here trolling like a child but in the real world where the rest of us live Apple allows built-in apps to multi-task. I block Flash anyway because it sucks so I don't care if it is on the iPad or not. Camera? For what?

Apple wants to kill Flash dead. Thank god for that as it is long overdue. Apple isn't the only company that thinks this. So does Google.
post #164 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielSW View Post

**** All kinds of factors go into pricing decisions for added features such as this. Parts prices are the tiniest sliver of that. Engineering, industrial design, consulting cost, etc., etc., all go into pricing.

While that data might be relevant, everything boils down to one factor and one factor only: Maximization of total profits.

Every pricing decision ever made by Apple was made in order to attain this goal.
post #165 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraBuggy View Post

I hear Balmer laughing again!

Yeah,,,he laughed at the iPod and the iPhone and Microsoft stock owners are furious at his incompetence.
post #166 of 403
Just put a USB port on the device to move files with the Mac. And PowerPoint inside as well.
post #167 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison View Post

The bleating about Flash is ridiculous. It's as if some of you actually desire a proprietary web.


Apart from geeks, most folks want access to the full web. Not just part of it.
post #168 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by snookie View Post

You must be on the internet in some alternate universe then.

Mel is right, I wasn't being serious. Sorry if I confused.
post #169 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

USB through adapter. Video output through adapter. Hi def.

It will not display hi def due to the antique aspect ratio.

In letterboxed mode, the image is quite shrunk, and not nearly HD dimensions. The vertical resolution is only about 60% of the lowest HD resolution, and is barely better than DVD.
post #170 of 403
The sheer volume of posts so quickly in response to this story tells me the iPad (oh how I hate the name!) will do well!
post #171 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by briandouglas View Post

I dont understand why Apple would leave out a camera at this point, to me, it would make sense. Almost every person today wants a camera attached to whatever device. I LOVE Apple, I LOVE my Iphone....and yes i do want an ipad, but i'm NOT buying one without a camera, without better memory, as far as flash goes, i dont care...but here's my question, why would Apple leave it out, and leave out websites that rely on that? If this device is to be truely revolutionary, then why would it exclude web content that used Flash. Now i know, it's old, macs crash when running it, i get it, i read what Jobs said, but that doesn't change the fact that the rest of the world is using that type, so why would you just leave it out, i know HTML5....but until then....wouldn't that take away from the desire to have an ipad? Also, when i watched the unveiling...i couldn't wait for him to show us ichat....and then he never did. Honestly, i'd put a camera in the thing, add the flash support..for now, nix a non 3G option, lower the price, and push this thing as the next way to communicate and Mass Market the heck out of it ( i know the latter will be done). Until a camera and flash, not buying it....so hopefully, something may be added prior to release of this...but i've come to find out that holding one's breath on these things, just makes one pass out...

Do you mean a webcam or a camera? I don't understand the burning desire to have a camera on a device with a 10" screen. Take a picture on your camera or camera equipped device and transfer it over to the iPad instead of holding an iPad in front of your face. Most cell phones have cameras, and people generally carry those around. It's not like people are hurting for the lack of a camera. I don't get the need for webcams either. They are a nice feature, but I don't see how they are a must have. Regardless of that, I think an addon webcam would do a better job anyway. A webcam that is independent of the screen orientation would be a good thing for a tablet as a tablet mounted webcam would shoot the ceiling if you ever laid it down.

The iPad with flash would not be revolutionary. Revolution implies change. Having flash is just maintaining the status quo. If (and it is a big if) the growing number of flashless idevices means that web developers stop using flash so they can gain greater platform support, it could be stated that the lack of flash was actually revolutionary. While I'm not sure if Apple will be able to force changes in web development, the device could be revolutionary in other ways, such as redefining what the average consumer actually needs out of a computing device.
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post #172 of 403
I can hear SJ now - "That's it. Revise those 2010 Budget numbers for advertising- NOW"
post #173 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Did you just make all of this up?
No, just

USB through adapter.
Adapter It's not about additional adapters/cables you need to carry with you to operate the device. Video output through adapter.
That's another adapter
Hi def.
I meant HD aspect ratio, it would have to be 1280x962 and now it looks like SD.
140,000 third party apps.
Good for portable devices like iphone/ipod, not good for real business application.

Did you actually read anything about this before commenting?

Yep, and did you actually thought about the use and not just followed the specs available on apple website?
post #174 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

While that data might be relevant, everything boils down to one factor and one factor only: Maximization of total profits.

Every pricing decision ever made by Apple was made in order to attain this goal.

Your point being?
post #175 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by snookie View Post

...anyone who uses the term fanboy can be immediately dismissed as a non-serious person.

Couldn't agree more. A juvenile delinquent and therefore a non-serious person.
post #176 of 403
Revised edit
post #177 of 403
While I know people will disagree anyway, I'm going to try and make some sense out of surveys like this, as it's a perfect example.

Let's first make an assumption for the sake of the argument that this survey is different from other online self selected surveys, and say that it's correct. Who knows, it might be.

So where does that leave us? Well, there are two ways to look at surveys, depending on the product, and how it's positioned.

If a large company has a new $1 product that's been rumored for a while with a 100 million possible market size, and a survey shows what the "before" survey shows, it would have 49% of people being possible buyers, not bad.

But the "after" survey only shows 30% as interested. Not good.

Even with the "definitely buying" percentage tripling from 3 to 9% that's way too small for a $1 product to be on market for a large company, and the 30% shows a serious drop in overall interest.

Well, for a $1 product, the manufacturer might take it off the shelves after a few months if sales are that slow, as not all of the 30% will materialize as real sales.

But now we take a product that averages about $675. How do we look at the survey, assuming the same number 100 million customers?

Well, it's not likely the company is looking for that 49% as real customers. The after survey results aren't devastating with the drop to 30% either. Why? Because the product isn't expected to resonate with the majority of consumers at that price, as it's a more specialized product. The fact that 30% are interested is itself amazing.

But here, the 3% originally, and the later rise to 9% is the real story.

3% would result in 3 million sales that first year, and 9% would result in the company possibly not being able to fill orders. The product would be a good seller at the low number, and a major hit at the higher one.

So the survey can be looked at in two different ways, but how one looks at it must depend on the size of the market, the price of the product, how specialized it is, and the sales of approximately similar products.
post #178 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Wasn't the competition able to build a better phone with a better interface? Wasn't the competition able to change the entire Mobile landscape almost overnight?\\

No, they were not. But the differences between the original and the 3GS are incremental, and Apple was fully capable.

You may think otherwise, and assume that for years they couldn't properly implement cut and paste. Are you one of the guys who is currently saying that Apple is unable to figure out how to implement multitasking without disastrous results? I don't believe that for one second.
post #179 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by zunx View Post

Just put a USB port on the device to move files with the Mac. And PowerPoint inside as well.

USB is available through an adapter, and you don't need Powerpoint, as Keynote, a product that is considered to be better, is only $9.95.

And, apparently, you will be able to move files over WiFi. That's something that people have been screaming for. Now its here, be happy.
post #180 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

It will not display hi def due to the antique aspect ratio.

In letterboxed mode, the image is quite shrunk, and not nearly HD dimensions. The vertical resolution is only about 60% of the lowest HD resolution, and is barely better than DVD.

Anything higher that 480p is officially considered to be hi def according to the broadcasting industry.
post #181 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmurchison
The bleating about Flash is ridiculous. It's as if some of you actually desire a proprietary web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Apart from geeks, most folks want access to the full web. Not just part of it.

I want the full web experience, minus the Flash part.
post #182 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

What evidence do you have that the general public cares anything about Flash?

The millions and millions and millions of page views that the general public generates at flash-enabled web sites. Every day.

But to be clear, the general public doesn't "care about flash". That is a red herring.

Instead, the general public cares that their device will just work. And when they go to their favorite websites, they don't leave that desire behind.
post #183 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

... you don't need Powerpoint, as Keynote, a product that is considered to be better, is only $9.95.....

Not to mention that PPT files can be read/edited as Keynote files and saved back as PPT.

I do hope that the iPad (did I mention I hate the name?) allows for use as an external disk drive so that one can simply click and drag to and from a physically connected source, than having to rely solely on wifi.
post #184 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by transocean View Post

Yep, and did you actually thought about the use and not just followed the specs available on apple website?

Yup! Just like all the people who have tried the device, and read its specs. The specs, after all, are what matters. The use follows the specs, as that allows what can be done.

You were just talking about specs, and you were wrong about them.
post #185 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

No. Exactly what is that point?

That using the metric "What if everybody did it?" is not useful.
post #186 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magic_Al View Post

Wow, it sure makes a difference what headline you pick. It's also true that the number of people who want to buy one tripled from 3% to 9%.

Exactly..
I think the RIGHT buyers will come around eventually.
That iWork suite looked sweet! It was the thing that tipped me over from "don't need it" to "probably gonna buy it".

And a sidenote, in regards of the left out camera I think there are two VERY simple explanations:
- If you hold the thing in your lap most of the time, it means your face will be shot in low angle perspective. It will come out really really bad. Looks kind of menacing.
- Apple probably isn't ready with a complete mobile iChat.

So either a stylish way to snake the cam up to face level, or just leave it with the stupid low angle face shot. I mean it would be hard enough to hold an iPhone at cam level for a long time, then think how heavy an iPad would be.
post #187 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Apart from geeks, most folks want access to the full web. Not just part of it.

1) Having Flash Lite doesn't give you access to the "full web" so these 2007 talking points are pretty lame.

2) Having a full version of Flash doesn't give you access to the "full web" if you consider plug-ins and browser-specific code relevant.

3) This device is not designed for "geeks". The sooner you realize that the sooner you understand Apple's market strategy.

4) How is Flash working out for the geeky android crowd? Oh it's not ready yet despite you crying foul on Apple for not building Flash for Adobe back in 2007? Oh you can't play games on a touchscreen because they were designed to use keyboard inputs? Oh it still can't play Hulu and Vimeo videos?


Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

It will not display hi def due to the antique aspect ratio.

In letterboxed mode, the image is quite shrunk, and not nearly HD dimensions. The vertical resolution is only about 60% of the lowest HD resolution, and is barely better than DVD.

1) Maybe you should try an Apple product before you comment on it. Their Dock Connector video cables scale nicely with TVs. Never had a problem with it. Couldn't be easier.

2) DVD resolution is 480p/576p. The iPad output H.264, 720p @ 30fps. A little more than "better than DVD" and claiming 720p is not HD is silly.


Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

The sheer volume of posts so quickly in response to this story tells me the iPad (oh how I hate the name!) will do well!

Me too and I can see not useful thing this device can do for me, but it's obvious it will be the most successful tablet to date.
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post #188 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

Do you mean a webcam or a camera? I don't understand the burning desire to have a camera on a device with a 10" screen.

Much as I find the whining deafening around here I do think a camera would be good. Who knows if the first rev will feature one or not. I wouldn't be surprised. A camera on the iPad will perhaps be less useful than on the iPhone but I can see many situations in which it would be handy - or fun. To snap a photo of someone in order to put it into you address book would be an unnecessarily convoluted procedure without a built in cam. Need to scan a document? Take a picture. FrontRow fun for kids, video conferencing. etc.
post #189 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

In what ways is it better than any netbook on the market?

Dell's Mini 10 Netbooks have a choice of 3 different OS's, built-n TV tuners, huge hard drives (or an SSD if you prefer), real HD widescreens, and lots of other stuff. And instead of having 140,000 apps available, they have about 140 million full applications available. A fully tricked out Mini 10 running Ubuntu is comparable in price to the lowest-end 'Pad.

What factors are you using as a basis for your opinion?

iSteve tried to position the iPad by saying that it has to do some things better than a phone and some things better than a laptop. I heard nothing to justify it being better than a laptop - or even a $500 netbook.

If your reasoning is "I just kinda like the form factor. I think I would really like using it." then I have no argument. That's an entirely reasonable position.

But objectively? Is it better than any netbook on the market? Maybe that's not what you meant.

I'm still waiting for a sweet tablet computer to keep on the coffee table, able to be grabbed to surf the 'web or to play media. IMO, the 'Pad doesn't cut the mustard for either of these things (no Flash, wrong aspect ratio, no HD, horrible codec support). I might just break down and get a netbook. But likely, I'll keep waiting until someone comes out with a cool HD Android tablet. Win7 is reputedly ill-suited for touchscreen use, and I'm very disappointed with the iPad.

Looking strictly at the specs, as you seem intent on doing, the iPod was never the best choice among MP3 players and none of Apple's computers look great when done strictly by the numbers. Yet, is there any doubt that the iPod is the dominant MP3 device?

It's not about raw numbers. For instance, you talk about how many millions of full-feature apps are available to netbook users but overlook the fact that your typical netbook doesn't do a good job of running many of them. Isn't it better to have a device that aces 100 apps than one that mangles 1000 of them. It's your approach, pursued by Apple's competition, that has made dominating the competition child's play for Apple. Consumers are not, it turns out, the dummies that other companies believe them to be. They know a good thing when it's offered to them which is why the iPod became the dominant MP3 player.

Don't get me wrong. I'm typing this response on a netbook and the reason I bougth it was to have access to a hard drive large enough to store HD video footage while on vacation. For that purpose, a $280 netbook did the trick and now I use it because I already own it so why not. But I can't pretend to being thrilled with the device. It accomplished what I needed it to and it's OK for now. But I can easily imagine the iPad will offer a better experience in many respects if only because that's what Apple products typically provide.

By avoiding the everything-but-the-kitchen-sink approach of the competition, Apple has become one of the most successful tech companies of the past few years.
post #190 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

It's been noted that Flash use on the net has hit its peak, with about 75% of all video using it, but more sites moving away.

Everyone was surprised when YouTube announced that they were re-encoding all their videos so as not to require Flash a couple of years ago. I find more sites that don't require it all the time. Don't be surprised in a few months when Hulu announces the same thing.

Apple is usually ahead of the curve, with some people complaining furiously at first. But then, others follow, and it seems normal. It will happen here as well.

Everything you say is true.

But we don't live in the future. In the present, for better or worse, Bazillions of folks go to flash sites every day. And "someday you won't care about that website - there will be something else, just as good" is hardly an answer to a kid who wants to play Farmville.
post #191 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

Flash is in trouble and there is a movement away from it that is gaining momentum.

More to the point, to reduce the browsing experience down to whether or not Flash is supported, is to miss Jobs' point entirely. It's about the overall experience of browsing on the iPad that Jobs is talking about. In a perfect world Flash would be supported but just as you can successfully browse with a Touch or iPhone, browsing with the iPad will not be the untenable experience you are suggesting it will be. As the number of Apple portable devices like the Touch, iPhone and iPad, grows, the pressure for sites to opt for a standard other than Flash will as well. Flash is not the only way to go and there are other standards that are universally accepted. Do the math.

My math tells me that millions of people currently use the 'web to visit flash sites. And that many popular sites use flash.

Maybe you're right. The current unavailability of favorite sites to millions of folks might not matter.
post #192 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1)...I can see not useful thing this device can do for me...

C'mon. Ever read while taking a crap? How about hanging it on the wall in your kitchen? It would be the coolest audio control center in your living room. I know nothing about the way you live but I do know you have the money and don't you just want one? Just a little?
post #193 of 403
Before and after the first iPod and the iPhone were about the same response but that did not change how popular the products became. We will all have to see what comes.

What states the iPad can not multi task?
post #194 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Abster2core View Post

But you don't.

It may seem that way only because you haven't been paying attention. You should read the posts again.


Quote:
But you already do.

You have Posting Guidelines, particularly the first one, i.e., The right (if you are an American citizen) to free speech as guaranteed by the 1st amendment to the U.S. Constitution does not apply when posting at this message board. AppleInsider is a privately owned and operated forum. Posters are allowed a great deal of flexibility in their posts, but be respectful of other members and the guidelines.

You misinterpret the guidelines. Respectful, yes, to a certain extent, some members do sometimes cross the line. It depends on how much. A tweak doesn't seem to bother most people. More than that and we do take action. I've already removed a line from one post here.

But you're concerned with "lies". What are we supposed to do definitely assess each and every post, including yours, to make certain that everything posted is "true"? How do we go about that? Can you prove that everything you don't agree with isn't true? You can't. Even though some people here think that I think I do, I don't know everything, and certainly not enough to "know" when every "lie" is being presented, even though I suspect some, and simply don't agree with others.

Indeed, how does one separate a lie from a mistake?

Quote:
This is what you call it? You have to be kidding.

This isn't? You would rather call it a site that has mostly Apple users and supporters? I don't mind being called a fan of Apple, and I don't suppose most here would be. Being called a fanboy isn't quite the same thing though. When used, it is pejorative in nature, and means that someone has excessive zeal, without acknowledging the negatives. Some people who post here fit that category. It's the opposite of trolling.

I readily admit to being an Apple fan, as I use their products extensively, and hold stock, but I'm not a fanboy, as I often disagree with their policy, and some of the products and services. It's a matter of balance. You always come across as an Apple fan, even though you might be afraid to say so. Even criticizing MDN has gotten you upset.

Quote:
Why can't we have self policing? You post something in error. You get correct it or get called out. You revise it or you get notified. Continue to do do and you could lose your privileges.

We have self policing. I've already said that. You haven't come up with a reasonable way to prove anything. Do you want to be the site researcher and spend all day looking things up so that we can "prove" that someone is constantly writing lies? It's a full time job, and the pay sucks.

Quote:
P.S., Isn't calling someone an Apple/Mac fanboy an 'ad hominem'?

Sometimes. It depends on the context, and how loud it's shouted.

I wish people wouldn't be so sensitive. People call me many things here. A duck's back. Quack.
post #195 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by snookie View Post

Thats easy. Netbooks are a compromise in every possible way. Run a mainsteam OS but not enough memory or cpu. Too small a keyboard and screen. Poor user experience.

We're not talking about "netbooks" as a nebulous category. The OP said "any netbook", as in "even the best netbook".

And to use your listed criteria, many high end netbooks have plenty of CPU and RAM for Ubuntu or XP. The screens are bigger in many cases than the iPad, and at any rate, they use a modern aspect ratio. And they have bigger keyboards than the iPad, given that they exist widescreen 10 or 12 inch models.

So why is the "Pad better than any netbook?
post #196 of 403
I'm getting one because I think it will saveme about $200 a semester in books. One book I had to get this semester was $140 on Amazon, and $32 on Kindle. Assuming Apple prices the same, that's more than $100 saving on one book. Plus I don't have to carry 25 lbs of books all day.

Do not overrate what you have received, nor envy others.
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Do not overrate what you have received, nor envy others.
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post #197 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by snookie View Post

I know you are just here trolling like a child but in the real world where the rest of us live Apple allows built-in apps to multi-task.


Yep. When you're right, you're right.

He should have said "extremely limited multitasking". The distinction is quite important.
post #198 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Everything you say is true.

But we don't live in the future. In the present, for better or worse, Bazillions of folks go to flash sites every day. And "someday you won't care about that website - there will be something else, just as good" is hardly an answer to a kid who wants to play Farmville.

1) If you don't make inroads to change tech it's not going to magically change.

2) Screw Farmville! You're finding a specific use for a specific user. That isn't how devices are designed.

3) No one is saying Flash doesn't have it's place, but mobile devices is not of them.

4) Some Good info: : http://daringfireball.net/2010/02/wi...open_standards

5) YouTube and Vimeo moving to HTMl5. Others will follow. Hulu is a video site, not a Flash site, they will move to HTML5 this year.

6) Mozilla on Firefox 3 for Maemo, "The Adobe Flash plugin used on many sites degraded the performance of the browser to the point where it didnt meet our standards." http://blog.pavlov.net/2010/01/27/fi...for-maemo-rc3/

7) Now it's rumoured that WinMo 7 won't have Flash support, either.

it's not just Apple, it's mobile computing in general, and it's because Adobe dropped the ball years ago. Enough with the anti-Apple crap.
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post #199 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Your point being?

That the other points listed are all subordinate, and as such, are unimportant in the final analysis.
post #200 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Plenty of choice in the App Store. And there's about to be a lot more.

What would I want to do with the OS to require Apple to not "lock" it away from me?



Use GoogleVoice App perhaps? Like all the other phones can use?

http://www.tulsaworld.com/business/a...4_SANFRA539309


I hear soap does a good job of getting the taste of foot out of one's mouth.
The danger is that we sleepwalk into a world where cabals of corporations control not only the mainstream devices and the software on them, but also the entire ecosystem of online services around...
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The danger is that we sleepwalk into a world where cabals of corporations control not only the mainstream devices and the software on them, but also the entire ecosystem of online services around...
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