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Bill Gates unimpressed by Apple iPad - Page 8

post #281 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorBenway View Post

Better to name-drop Alan Kay, who I think deserves more press than Raskin ever did.

Excellent observation - it is indeed sad that I didn't consider him
post #282 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Zillions of them. Try Office for starters.

Zillions? .... just a little exaggeration on your part, don't you think? ... but then I suppose, in this case, even if you had said 10 it would still classify as an exaggeration.
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #283 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

To your 2nd point... I wonder how well the new Palm Pro models' wi-fi sharing works. It let's you use the phone's wi-fi to share it's 3G connection, similar to a mifi card would do. Maybe a feature request for the iPhone...to allow tethering via it's wi-fi connection rather than bluetooth or USB (I assume the current iPhone can't do that in those countries where tethering is allowed?)


Jailbreak your iPhone and use MyWi to create a wireless network for the iPad to use.
post #284 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEKSTUD View Post

Now I will be accused of being negative and a troll but I could care less.

Why should you? .... not like it hasn't happened before .... and with good reason, I might add. \
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #285 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

Just went back and read the headline of this article. The fact is that the iPad does have a hardware keyboard, but it's optional. With its little Bluetooth keyboard buddy along, it IS a 'netbook if you want it to be. Just more flexible: take the keyboard when you need it, leave it home when you don't. Beating it up because it isn't hinged seems really silly.

Excellent point. and the optional keyboard makes it ideal for students. they can carry just the iPad in a backpack/case at class for notes, read their course books anywhere, and then sit down at a desk that evening with the keyboard for "homework," papers, etc. the one other thing needed for that is blutooth printing, which i have to think the iPad will support too.

of course they can also use it to have fun anytime.

gosh, what a hard sell.
post #286 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

It appears that the case Apple is selling with it will do that. And of course third party vendors will have a multitude of cases, some of which certainly will have a keyboard pocket/flap that drops down to typing position while the rest of the case holds the iPad up to typing position--perhaps even with an adjustable angle. See, just like a laptop or 'netbook, no worries. The big scary iPad won't bite you complainers. (not referring to you, nkhm)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

Excellent point. and the optional keyboard makes it ideal for students. they can carry just the iPad in a backpack/case at class for notes, read their course books anywhere, and then sit down at a desk that evening with the keyboard for "homework," papers, etc. the one other thing needed for that is blutooth printing, which i have to think the iPad will support too.

of course they can also use it to have fun anytime.

gosh, what a hard sell.

While it can be used a stand alone system it's far from ideal if you can't back up the system, import your media into the iPod app, sync it with your iPhone/iPod, use an external HDD, or back up via Time Machine.

Right now, the device is positioned only as an accessory device to a proper PC where it can sync with iTunes. Everything is setup for all those things to happen quickly, but this is Apple, they start with a small focus and build out from there. Part of that focus is for the consumer's benefit. The "it can do almost everything but none of it very well" v. "it can very specific things very well" philosophies.

Also, while think what you two say is inevitable we have to consider that Apple doesn't want a $500 device cannibalizing their MacBook and MacBook Pro sales. I think it would be a trojan horse entry that would more than likely people into more Macs, but they might not see it that way, at least right away.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #287 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

Um, you are actually trying to be serious? As far as media streaming devices go, I think the X-Box 360 sales dwarf the Apple TV sales, and the PS3 sales dwarf the Apple TV sales.

the vast majority of XBox and PS3 are used only as game consoles, not media extenders. TiVo's are media extenders too, but few are used that way. it would be interesting to see an actual survey of those households that really use anything as a "media extender" a lot - the breakdown among the many varieties of hardware that are available. and now limited versions of media extension are being built directly into TV sets too.

that said, no question AppleTV is falling behind the competition overall. being a part of the Apple iTunes ecosystem is nice, but there is no other compelling capability that sets it apart.

aTVFlash shows its potential, with a browser, some applications, and linkages to many other streaming services. but the UI is still old school on-screen cursor. and the hardware is underpowered, still running a version of Tiger OS.

i hope to see later this year an overhauled ATV with more power, a Leopard-based OS, and a new kind of optional UI using an iPhone/iPad, all allowing for touch control of a browser and apps displayed on your big screen TV, along with all the standard media extender functions. that could be compelling, not just a "hobby."
post #288 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorBenway View Post

Better to name-drop Alan Kay, who I think deserves more press than Raskin ever did.

Raskin never did get any press, certainly not more than Alan Kay, so that's kind of a deceptive statement. Besides, it isn't a competition.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #289 of 404
So the iPad is just a bigger iPod Touch? And that's a bad thing?

Is the 17" MBP just a bigger 13" MBP? And is that a bad thing too?
post #290 of 404
It's still weeks away, at least 6(?)before the iPad is released and people argue over what it will have and what it won't. It's kinda fun reading some of these posts. I'll take the wait and see approach. Maybe MacWorld will have some goodies revealed for the iPad. I see some starting to show up now.

http://www.cnet.com/2300-31324_1-10002409.html
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post #291 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

While it can be used a stand alone system it's far from ideal if you can't back up the system, import your media into the iPod app, sync it with your iPhone/iPod, use an external HDD, or back up via Time Machine.

Right now, the device is positioned only as an accessory device to a proper PC where it can sync with iTunes. Everything is setup for all those things to happen quickly, but this is Apple, they start with a small focus and build out from there. Part of that focus is for the consumer's benefit. The "it can do almost everything but none of it very well" v. "it can very specific things very well" philosophies.

Also, while think what you two say is inevitable we have to consider that Apple doesn't want a $500 device cannibalizing their MacBook and MacBook Pro sales. I think it would be a trojan horse entry that would more than likely people into more Macs, but they might not see it that way, at least right away.

well i think parents are buying a lot of cheap netbooks for students now, only upper income households get them MacBooks. so for every one student MacBook sale cannibalized, several more iPads will be bought instead of a netbook. overall, a net gain.

plus Apple's 30% cut of all sales activity on the platform has to be adding up to some real money. maybe even $1 billion a year now just for the iPhone. add all the iPad's new services and this continuing annual revenue stream from each device begins to be really significant for the long term. most "pundits" and "analysts" haven't caught on to this part of Apple's business strategy yet. but just run the numbers. if there are 100 million iPhone/touch/iPad users in 2011 spending an average of just $100 a year each on whatever, that totals $10 billion - with Apple taking its $3 billion cut off the top. and the growth potential to increase that to a lot more per user each year is tremendous.

the PC synch will back up the iPad and the other things you mention, so i don't see the problem there. if there is no other computer in the house they can't use an iPad anyway. college students away from home will share PC's if they need to.
post #292 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Nobody has to spin anything to be impressed by 0.5", 1.5 lb device, that has a 9.7" web browser.

[CENTER]and...
What exactly does the iPad do that any number of other (more capable/versatile) 'devices' do far better at a much lower price point?

Exactly... Nothing! (at least at this point)[/CENTER]
"Why iPhone"... Hmmm?
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"Why iPhone"... Hmmm?
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post #293 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant View Post

So the iPad is just a bigger iPod Touch? And that's a bad thing?

Is the 17" MBP just a bigger 13" MBP? And is that a bad thing too?

Too bad, so sad when they have to nit pick!!

I like the thought of more real estate on the desktop. That's why last year I replaced my 20" iMac to a 24" iMac. The iPad with a bigger screen might be good for some of us with older eyes too.
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post #294 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by VisualZone View Post

It's still weeks away, at least 6(?)before the iPad is released and people argue over what it will have and what it won't. It's kinda fun reading some of these posts. I'll take the wait and see approach. Maybe MacWorld will have some goodies revealed for the iPad. I see some starting to show up now.

http://www.cnet.com/2300-31324_1-10002409.html

The Kickback stand and the bluetooth keyboard are my accessories of choice.
post #295 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by VisualZone View Post

Too bad, so sad when they have to nit pick!!

I like the thought of more real estate on the desktop. That's why last year I replaced my 20" iMac to a 24" iMac. The iPad with a bigger screen might be good for some of us with older eyes too.

No, no, no... you upgraded from a 20" to a 24"? How unimpressive!
post #296 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

the PC synch will back up the iPad and the other things you mention, so i don't see the problem there.

I was skimming and I misread Robin Huber's and your reply to infer that it could be a standalone device. I was going much further and seeing potential for this being the only device in certain households. eg: People that typically do the most rudimentary of computing (mail and safari), and students who are on a tight budget. Hence my comments about would would need to happen to make this a stand alone machine.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #297 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Raskin never did get any press, certainly not more than Alan Kay, so that's kind of a deceptive statement. Besides, it isn't a competition.

Like hell - name dropping serves no other purpose than imagined competition.

As far as press, every time the late Mr. Raskin opened his mouth it was to remind people he started the Macintosh project. For every, single, year after he left Apple, and in every book about Apple (there's more than 1 - and they come off printing presses). Google and find out for yourself. In the meantime, Kay, the person who accomplished far more at Xerox from coming up with portable computing to the whole fundimental concept of UI (as opposed to Raskin's "look I'm a UI god too" rants which are also all over the net) never went out of his way to self-promote himself or grouse about all the ways he didn't get the "credit he deserved".

History is written by the winners. If that's not competition - what is? Example: Go to China - ask the winners about Tiananmen Square, Tibet, or Taiwan.
post #298 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant View Post

No, no, no... you upgraded from a 20" to a 24"? How unimpressive!

It would have been the 27" iMac but unfortunately I bought the 24" iMac before they were announced. No complaints. Btw, to some, size doesn't matter.
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post #299 of 404
The iPad will blow everything else away.

It will set a new mark for game/content/communication/information devices.

Steve jobs is a true visionary.

Apple makes the most insanely great/coolest/best products in the world.

/R
post #300 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

But at least they happen in the background



I was hoping for a hard drive version of the iPad for this reason - would love to dump my photos while shooting. Actually, with the wi-fi grip from Canon (or the newer Eye-fi that can work with ad-hoc wireless) and a hard drive based iPad in my backback....

Where's that homer drool icon???



lol - time will tell. Actually, instead of importing what if iAperture just did a "referenced master" thing with the RAW files? Suck in the smaller JPEGs for basic organization, but leave the larger RAW files alone? Yeah, you would need more cards and it wouldn't give you that often desired second copy, but it could be a useful compromise.

Naw, on second thought I like my wi-fi/hard drive iPad vision better

I suspect that a hard drive would just not allow for the sleek form factor, would impact battery life, and just be out of place. If Apple could have done this with hard drive components, the iPad would have come to market sooner than this. Apple waited for flash memory to come down enough to make this work, not to mention battery technology to catch up to the targets this device meets.

Down the road this device might well be able to work well for photography but that time isn't now. Still, you have to start somewhere.
post #301 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorBenway View Post

Like hell - name dropping serves no other purpose than imagined competition.

As far as press, every time the late Mr. Raskin opened his mouth it was to remind people he started the Macintosh project. For every, single, year after he left Apple, and in every book about Apple (there's more than 1 - and they come off printing presses). Google and find out for yourself. In the meantime, Kay, the person who accomplished far more at Xerox from coming up with portable computing to the whole fundimental concept of UI (as opposed to Raskin's "look I'm a UI god too" rants which are also all over the net) never went out of his way to self-promote himself or grouse about all the ways he didn't get the "credit he deserved".

History is written by the winners. If that's not competition - what is? Example: Go to China - ask the winners about Tiananmen Square, Tibet, or Taiwan.

Huh? I mentioned Raskin because of his UI theories, which (ironically, if you will) may be the direction Apple is headed today. As I said, I thought had he lived that he might feel vindicated with the release of the iPad, which I meant literally, since he certainly seemed to feel like Jobs crushed him under his heal. Which he did.

Anyhow, yes, I know how annoying he could be about his role in the Mac project. I met him at MWSF once. Saw his badge, did a double-take and stopped to talk with him for awhile. When I introduced myself the first thing he said was "Welcome to my show!" So I knew what I was in for. But we did have an interesting conversation after that. He sent me a copy of his book .
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post #302 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I suspect that a hard drive would just not allow for the sleek form factor, would impact battery life, and just be out of place. If Apple could have done this with hard drive components, the iPad would have come to market sooner than this. Apple waited for flash memory to come down enough to make this work, not to mention battery technology to catch up to the targets this device meets.

Down the road this device might well be able to work well for photography but that time isn't now. Still, you have to start somewhere.

The only way an SSD would fit in the iPad was if it was a 1.8" HDD, not a2.5" drive. As I recall, the power usage stats aren't shown to be that different on the MBA with a 1.8" HDD compared to a 1.8" SSD. The drive is so small and designed to be more power efficient for handhelds, it's the larger drives that need all the power. But that is beside the point since Apple isn't likely using an expensive SSD solution, but NAND built right onto the logic board. This offers cost savings while also allowing it to be more efficient in several way.


Flash memory was the only way to go going into the future. The new NAND 3-bit design will add 50% more capacity for the same volume. Then there is halving of the size. I don't think it'll be more than 2 years before we start seeing 2.5" HDDs being bested in capacity (not price) by 2.5" SSDs of the same height. HDDs just doing increase that much.

The 1.8" HDDs are growing even slower. The maximum is 160GB for the drive that came out in September. Intel already matches that size with a 160GB SSD and I think they did that before the 160GB single platter HDD was announced. So we're already seeing HDDs get taking in capacity for the same size drive.

If we consider that 2.5" SSDs are 7mm instead of the 9.5mm found in notebooks right now and lose a platter to do a direct comparison we see that the game is even closer. Of course, notebooks do have spaces for 9.5" drives (Apple's ODDs are 9.5mm, too) so that point is moot, but eventually they will want to go thinner and they will see SSDs and no ODDs as the way to do it so I wouldn't be overly surprised to see Apple sport HDDs with one less platter in them.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #303 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

But that's exactly what excites me about the iPad for my parents. All they want to do is read email, visit a few web sites and my mother want's quicken. That's pretty much it! I don't see my mom giving up her iMac, but I see the iPad as being perfect for my father who mainly wants to send email to his friends and occasionally read some web sites. Well, that and read newspapers or magazines - he actually asked me about electronic books on the iPad - you could have knocked me over with a feather. When my 72 year old father starts asking about ebooks and electronic newspapers on an iPad that had only been announced for two days (and I hadn't talked with them about it yet) you know Apple is getting broad penetration.

I think far more "average" people get it than the tech press wants to admit.

I understand that, but I think it is more because of your influence than your parents free will

What I'm trying to say is - I doubt your parents - or my parents, matter of fact - would walk into IT shop on their own and decide to get iPad, without your (mine) guiding... so in a way, it is more your decision than theirs.

But that being said, yes I do see iPad (or anything like it) great for parents category. My mother is using computer only to Skype with me, and will type an email once in a month or so (sending some recipes to my wife sort of emails). However, she is kind of dinosaur - a generation that didn't catch Internet/personal computing virus. I'm pretty sure in her age I'll still demand much more from my computing appliances, whatever they turn to be in 20 or 30 years time. Of course iPad 15, available then, will be much more than this one, but as a general principle I'd like this iPad to be closer to Mac than to iPod - that's all.
post #304 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

Building previews isn't fast with Aperture, either. I shudder to think how long it's going to take to upload and build previews after my upcoming 3 week trip to New Zealand with my new 18 MP 7D. Especially because I'm not taking a laptop with me and will have to upload them all when I get home.

On the one hand, it'd be nice to have something as small/lightweight as an iPad to have all that done by the time I get home. On the other hand, the thought of uploading that much data over USB/dock is kinda painful, too. (Not to mention that the iPad's camera connection is probably going to be pretty slow compared to my ExpressCard reader.)

Dammit, you are ruining my iPad buzz.

I am ruining my iPad buzz as well! That is what I keep saying - I'd like iPad form with decent processing power (Core 2 Duo ULV?) and trimmed OSX optimized for touch interface, still capable of running full desktop apps (like Aperture or Lightroom)... with, say, one or two USB ports for attaching external USB HDD.

Aww...

So how's 7D working for you? I envy you so much!
post #305 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

But at least they happen in the background



I was hoping for a hard drive version of the iPad for this reason - would love to dump my photos while shooting. Actually, with the wi-fi grip from Canon (or the newer Eye-fi that can work with ad-hoc wireless) and a hard drive based iPad in my backback....

Where's that homer drool icon???



lol - time will tell. Actually, instead of importing what if iAperture just did a "referenced master" thing with the RAW files? Suck in the smaller JPEGs for basic organization, but leave the larger RAW files alone? Yeah, you would need more cards and it wouldn't give you that often desired second copy, but it could be a useful compromise.

Naw, on second thought I like my wi-fi/hard drive iPad vision better

iPad hard drive...... drooooolllll......

But there is a point - much more people will want iPad for browsing web and such, than for dumping, organizing and procesing RAW images... so... \
post #306 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Anyhow, yes, I know how annoying he could be about his role in the Mac project. I met him at MWSF once. Saw his badge, did a double-take and stopped to talk with him for awhile. When I introduced myself the first thing he said was "Welcome to my show!" So I knew what I was in for. But we did have an interesting conversation after that. He sent me a copy of his book .

That IS cool. I like Nerderatti stories. I've met Woz a couple of times - but he's Apple's semi-official spokesnerd which means anyone is guaranteed to run into him more times than any metaphor involving swinging cats anywhere between Los Gatos and San Francisco. Tip tho - anywhere he's at - Andy Hertzfeld is probably nearby, and he's also a good talker. For another ego contrast - compare Howard Warshaw to Al Acorn (both of Atari fame). The later is always good for a comment at CAX, and adds great insight on any of the panels he's been on (different stories everytime too - like the fact he interviewed Steve Jobs when he was hired at Atari - that one's hillarious). The former sells life-story DVDs and wears T-Shirts espousing himself. Talk about wearing it on your sleeve.
post #307 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

You do know you're wrong, right? I suppose not, but then I'd assumed you'd have not shot your mouth off if you had been in NeXT/Apple Engineering design labs where prototyping took/takes place.

Software programming is NOT ENGINEERING. Get it through your brain.

Bill Gates oversaw his products and prototypes while driving the direction he saw for each product.

Paul Allen was the software head and founder of Microsoft [Bill's Boss] before they screwed him out of it. He's the programming genius.

Steve Jobs does know how to write some ObjC and he's got decades of industrial design input.

He also designed the NeXT Computer Inc Robotic Assembly Plant. It was his vision to the core. He picked out the materials, the assembly systems he wanted installed and how they all worked together.

He hired the talent to assemble it under his specs.

Did he come up with the design of the iMac? Yes. He took his look to Ive and they co-designed it down to the finished product.

He drove it just like he drove every design at NeXT and every design at Apple with Ive refining his vision.

Did Ive actually Engineer anything? No. He's an Industrial Designer. He's akin to the Architect who then passes it off to the Structural Engineer who invalidates his work throughout the process until it's structurally sound.

Did Ive design the implementation of any IC boards? No. He designed a layout of how he wanted the basic Mac Pro tower to look and worked with Engineers to refine the look--all then refined by Jobs.

People call him a visionary because he's got his hands into how he wants all the products to look and work.

Talk about popping off with factual incorrect information...
post #308 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

[CENTER]and...
What exactly does the iPad do that any number of other (more capable/versatile) 'devices' do far better at a much lower price point?

Exactly... Nothing! (at least at this point)[/CENTER]

It will probably work well.
What other tablets are less expensive than the iPad? The Archos 9 is a POS, and costs more.
post #309 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Right now, the device is positioned only as an accessory device to a proper PC where it can sync with iTunes. Everything is setup for all those things to happen quickly,

I wouldn't discount Mobile.Me. Right now you can add content via the iTunes and App Store applications - it isn't inconceivable that a student could sync the iPad at home to kick it off and then maintain it via the cloud or mobile.me. We just don't know, but I guarantee Apple has plans - they are building that big data center for something
post #310 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

iPad hard drive...... drooooolllll......

But there is a point - much more people will want iPad for browsing web and such, than for dumping, organizing and procesing RAW images... so... \

It would be a niche market, certainly, but I would think that Apple would welcome broadening the device's appeal over time. It's going to take a while but technology marches on and an expansion of the iPad's capabilities is inevitable.

I spent around $300 last year for a netbook, specifically to have a place to store lots of HD video footage while on vacation. This isn't something that I need to do on a regular basis, unlike a lot of other people who do, so I can consider replacing my netbook with the iPad but it would be great to have the option of using the iPad to do something that the cheaper netbook handled with ease.

Long-term, I have to think that Apple would love to add functionality that helps out photographers and videographers. Not a priority, maybe, but on Apple's radar.

The iPad will be like everything else in Apple's stable of products, a forever evolving technology. It's the starting point, not the final destination.
post #311 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

I find it hypocritical that a marketing guy that never really invented anything except DOS says "no biggie" to something he doesn't really know anything about.

Bill Gates knows innovation like Donald Trump knows how to mop his floor.

Microsoft didn't invent DOS. They bought that from Seattle Associates for a pittance after promising it first to IBM.

Microsoft didn't even invent Windows NT either. That was a DEC project. You think that Microsoft had the capability to port their OS to something other than x86? As part of a deal with DEC, DEC gave Microsoft what became NT on the promise that Microsoft would continue to support their DEC Alpha chip. Microsoft barely did so.
post #312 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I suspect that a hard drive would just not allow for the sleek form factor, would impact battery life, and just be out of place. If Apple could have done this with hard drive components, the iPad would have come to market sooner than this. Apple waited for flash memory to come down enough to make this work, not to mention battery technology to catch up to the targets this device meets.

I agree, that's why I didn't expect it \ It still would have been nice. Who knows, maybe I can attach a USB hub and plug in a USB hard drive and reader at the same time and do everything I want - with 20 minute battery time

Quote:
Down the road this device might well be able to work well for photography but that time isn't now. Still, you have to start somewhere.

While I agree you have to start somewhere I don't ever expect Apple to add a hard drive. Frankly I'm surprised the iPod classic has survived as long as it has. I wouldn't be surprised if Apple doesn't buy all the capacity for Intel and Micron's new 25nm flash technology and put a couple hundred gigs or more in an iPad within the next year - that would be more likely to me than seeing them put in a hard drive. Part of me wishes for this more - while it will take longer than just slapping a hard drive in there now, in the long run it will drive the costs for flash down that much faster with Apple's legendary volume.
post #313 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by steviet02 View Post

You do know Steve Jobs never developed, engineered, or designed anything right? Is he a hypocrite too for saying something isn't up to snuff?

A lot of patents with Stephen P Jobs' name on them say otherwise.

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post #314 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

I wouldn't discount Mobile.Me. Right now you can add content via the iTunes and App Store applications - it isn't inconceivable that a student could sync the iPad at home to kick it off and then maintain it via the cloud or mobile.me. We just don't know, but I guarantee Apple has plans - they are building that big data center for something

Of course! I can do that now with Mobile Me and video or audio streaming from iDisk. However, your example still has the iPad syncing with a PC which means it's not the device that I described.

As long as you can't sync an iPod or iPhone with the iPad directly it will always be an accessory device.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #315 of 404
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Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

What I'm trying to say is - I doubt your parents - or my parents, matter of fact - would walk into IT shop on their own and decide to get iPad, without your (mine) guiding... so in a way, it is more your decision than theirs.

The week before last, I would have agreed with you. But as I'm said, I'm just floored my dad asked me about ebooks, newspapers and magazines. Normally he wouldn't pay attention to any of it - but for whatever reason not only did he, but he paid attention to the details. He then parroted them back to me for me to confirm that he understand what he read or saw.

The only reason he paid attention is he thought there was something in it for him. So yes, while I do have some influence, if he wasn't interested in an iPad at all no matter how much I prod, he wouldn't look at it - or he would just humor me. But this time, he is actively interested in it - and I wasn't directly responsible for it. That's a pretty big (yet subtle) shift.

Quote:
But that being said, yes I do see iPad (or anything like it) great for parents category. My mother is using computer only to Skype with me, and will type an email once in a month or so (sending some recipes to my wife sort of emails). However, she is kind of dinosaur - a generation that didn't catch Internet/personal computing virus.

That was my father. Until a few years ago when he discovered through email he could reach friends and family - even if they were overseas - easily. All of the sudden he became very interested in using email. Not running a computer, mind you...

My mother has had a Mac since the 80's because she is a Quicken addict. I almost didn't get to take my Mac with me to college She is slowly getting into digital photography, but there are many times I still have to come in via iChat and show her stuff.

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I'm pretty sure in her age I'll still demand much more from my computing appliances, whatever they turn to be in 20 or 30 years time. Of course iPad 15, available then, will be much more than this one, but as a general principle I'd like this iPad to be closer to Mac than to iPod - that's all.

Meh - I'm not hung up on "Mac" or "iPod" labels. I'm much more interested in functionality. Will it do what I want, with a minimum of fuss? If the answer is yes, it's a win and I will buy it. If no, then I won't buy it. Same thing if it says Microsoft or Apple on the front. By and large, I am more loyal to Apple - but not because it's just Apple, or they are popular - Apple has traditionally been the best fit for my needs. When they cease being that, I will stop using them (much like I pretty much stopped using Mac's during the horrid Performa days). I just don't get the emotional responses or the hand wringing over the iPad being a "real" computer - heck, I have friends that think you are a wuss if you don't code in Assembler - at what point do you separate the hobby/for the fun of it tendencies vs. the tool aspects of computing? I am in both camps depending on what I am doing or when, but there are some people who never ever want to be in the hobby/for the fun of it and only look at computers as tools. That latter group is where the iPad is targeted, and it's a smart targeting as that group is much, much larger than the hobbiest/for the love of it group.
post #316 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

As long as you can't sync an iPod or iPhone with the iPad directly it will always be an accessory device.

Your assuming everyone has a "real computer" legacy. My father doesn't. He has nothing in iTunes, no iPhone or no iPod. All he cares about is what is in the cloud - email. if Apple does offer a Mobile.Me backup solution for the iPad (which I would expect them to) then quite literally, for him, the iPad will do everything he needs.

Much like those who held onto Prodigy and AOL, the iPad has a large potential audience of people just like my father. You should be very careful about evaluating "needs" through your point of view - whether you think so or not, you (and me and everyone else in this forum) are in a very small minority in relationship to the rest of the population.

It will be interesting to see to what degree has all of the above developed. I agree the potential is definitely there.
post #317 of 404
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Originally Posted by DoctorBenway View Post

That IS cool. I like Nerderatti stories. I've met Woz a couple of times - but he's Apple's semi-official spokesnerd which means anyone is guaranteed to run into him more times than any metaphor involving swinging cats anywhere between Los Gatos and San Francisco. Tip tho - anywhere he's at - Andy Hertzfeld is probably nearby, and he's also a good talker. For another ego contrast - compare Howard Warshaw to Al Acorn (both of Atari fame). The later is always good for a comment at CAX, and adds great insight on any of the panels he's been on (different stories everytime too - like the fact he interviewed Steve Jobs when he was hired at Atari - that one's hillarious). The former sells life-story DVDs and wears T-Shirts espousing himself. Talk about wearing it on your sleeve.

The odd part is nobody else seemed to know who he was. I was freelancing back then and had an idea to write an article about him. I waited too long -- not many months after that, he died. So instead I wrote an appreciation/obituary, which his widow saw in publication. She wrote me a very, very nice note of thanks. I also saw Hertzfeld at MWSF one time but too many people were hanging around to talk to him so I moved on. I attended the expo for years but never saw Woz. Not sure why -- I'm sure he was there more than once.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #318 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Your assuming everyone has a "real computer" legacy. My father doesn't. He has nothing in iTunes, no iPhone or no iPod. All he cares about is what is in the cloud - email. if Apple does offer a Mobile.Me backup solution for the iPad (which I would expect them to) then quite literally, for him, the iPad will do everything he needs.

Much like those who held onto Prodigy and AOL, the iPad has a large potential audience of people just like my father. You should be very careful about evaluating "needs" through your point of view - whether you think so or not, you (and me and everyone else in this forum) are in a very small minority in relationship to the rest of the population.

It will be interesting to see to what degree has all of the above developed. I agree the potential is definitely there.

For your dad there's mobileMe, or if he is not going to travel with his iPad a simple set up with some kind of Airport Extreme & TimeMachine configuration. For people (like your dad) who also use a digital camera there may be a question whether the iPad will have a version of iPhoto (and the horsepower to manipulate large images). But even at a modest 16gb the storage is plenty for email, surfing and photographs for many people. People like my mother takes few photographs and deletes most of them. She even deletes emails - I have tried to tell her she needn't but alas, she will only keep ones she deems essential. (housekeeping)
I agree with Solips that the iPad is probably thought of as a secondary device but I suspect a lot of people will be using the iPad as their primary / only device.
post #319 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

So how's 7D working for you? I envy you so much!

It's horrible. We've had nothing but crappy, cloudy, freezing rain weather ever since I got it a couple weeks ago. Sucks to have a new toy and not be able to go out and play.

So I haven't really had a chance to see how well Aperture deals with the larger RAW files. But I'm loving that it will now manage the 1080p video the 7D can capture and import my GPS track logs.
post #320 of 404
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

It's horrible. We've had nothing but crappy, cloudy, freezing rain weather ever since I got it a couple weeks ago. Sucks to have a new toy and not be able to go out and play.

So I haven't really had a chance to see how well Aperture deals with the larger RAW files. But I'm loving that it will now manage the 1080p video the 7D can capture and import my GPS track logs.

You can take gorgeous moody pics in cloudy freezing rain. Try some low-light streetlight pics at night or boost up the contrast on some moody landscapes. Try a fog effect with a foreground subject. Under an umbrella.

These can all be done in B&W or color with fantastic effect.

If you're worried about weather exposure, just wrap a huffy bag around your kit with a tight rubber band around the lens hood.

Of course, you know all this.

I'm going to be doing a lot more work myself once I get my Alpha 850 (or the equivalent when I can finally afford it).
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