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HP plans to beat Apple iPad price, Microsoft Courier still in works

post #1 of 131
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Apple's iPad announcement has not deterred PC competitors, as HP's forthcoming 3G-enabled "slate PC" will reportedly be competitively priced, and Microsoft is still working on its unannounced Courier dual-screen tablet.

According to The Wall Street Journal, executives from HP intend to "tweak prices and features" soon on its upcoming Slate, which will offer a 3G data connection. The company had already intended to price their hardware below the starting $629 price for the 16GB 3G iPad, sources said.

The report also cited people familiar with Microsoft's dual-screen, touchscreen tablet, dubbed the Courier, in stating that the Redmond, Wash., software giant has a "secretive team" working on the unannounced device. Renders of the Courier leaked last September, showing a device with two color screens that folded together like a book.

"Although early designs leaked onto blogs last year, it's unclear whether the company will introduce the gadget," the report said.

The Journal said other manufacturers -- including Dell, Acer and Sony -- all have their eyes on Apple's impending iPad launch, set for the end of March, to decide how they might respond. The iPad has single handedly brought buzz to the concept of the tablet PC, which has been around for years but failed to generate significant sales for hardware makers.

"PC companies are eager for a piece of any tablet market that emerges," the report said. "With profit margins dwindling due to ongoing price wars, PC makers hope new touch-screen devices will sell for higher prices than mini-computers like netbooks, which have comparable components."



Weeks before the iPad was unveiled, Microsoft and HP partnered to tout the forthcoming HP Slate at the Consumer Electronics Show in early January. The device has a multi-touch screen and has instant-on capabilities. It was demonstrated running Windows 7 and being used for tasks such as reading novels.
post #2 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple's iPad announcement has not deterred PC competitors, as HP's forthcoming 3G-enabled "slate PC" will reportedly be competitively priced, and Microsoft is still working on its unannounced Courier dual-screen tablet.

According to The Wall Street Journal, executives from HP intend to "tweak prices and features" soon on its upcoming Slate, which will offer a 3G data connection. The company had already intended to price their hardware below the starting $629 price for the 16GB 3G iPad, sources said.

The report also cited people familiar with Microsoft's dual-screen, touchscreen tablet, dubbed the Courier, in stating that the Redmond, Wash., software giant has a "secretive team" working on the unannounced device. Renders of the Courier leaked last September, showing a device with two color screens that folded together like a book.

"Although early designs leaked onto blogs last year, it's unclear whether the company will introduce the gadget," the report said.

The Journal said other manufacturers -- including Dell, Acer and Sony -- all have their eyes on Apple's impending iPad launch, set for the end of March, to decide how they might respond. The iPad has single handedly brought buzz to the concept of the tablet PC, which has been around for years but failed to generate significant sales for hardware makers.

"PC companies are eager for a piece of any tablet market that emerges," the report said. "With profit margins dwindling due to ongoing price wars, PC makers hope new touch-screen devices will sell for higher prices than mini-computers like netbooks, which have comparable components."



Weeks before the iPad was unveiled, Microsoft and HP partnered to tout the forthcoming HP Slate at the Consumer Electronics Show in early January. The device has a multi-touch screen and has instant-on capabilities. It was demonstrated running Windows 7 and being used for tasks such as reading novels.

kindles being given away for free and now this? the ipad will be a huge success
post #3 of 131
"PC companies are eager for a piece of any tablet market that emerges,"

I think that's supposed to read "...that Apple creates"
post #4 of 131
Even with all of the power behind existing and forthcoming tablets from companies other than Apple and their lower prices, the iPad still has the potential to surpass its competitors. I think it's safe to say that most, if not all of the issues plaguing the iPad today (no Flash, no camera, high prices, low memory, etc.) will be taken care of completely or to a large extent within the next few years. That said, what potential can be seen with all of these other companies that may be on the same level as the iPad? I don't think any. Applications, it's iTunes and App stores, hype, simply being Apple - these are factors that are going to keep Apple ahead of the game in the tablet market for the forseeable future.

iPad news and updates:

http://iPadLot.com
iPad News, App Reviews, and More: iPadNewsUpdates.com
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iPad News, App Reviews, and More: iPadNewsUpdates.com
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post #5 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

"PC companies are eager for a piece of any tablet market that emerges,"

I think that's supposed to read "...that Apple creates"

Very well said.
post #6 of 131
LOL HP et all know that they can't compete and never will be able to. Itunes is the gold in the ipad's success. Seems like Steve realized that any tablet is just a tablet and the thing that makes a tablet really work is the software and media ecosystem it lives in. (MMMM thousands of awesome apps we are all drooling already) Hmm somebody studied evolution and Biology. LOL No one can compete with Itunes at this point; most are still trying to compete with the device itself and/ or the pricing.
turtles all the way up and turtles all the way down... infinite context means infinite possibility
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turtles all the way up and turtles all the way down... infinite context means infinite possibility
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post #7 of 131
Rumor has it that Play Skool has annouced the kidPad that will only cost $29. It does not really do anything. Pundits predict that it will sell millions simply because it is cheaper than an iPad and not an Apple product.
post #8 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by spliff monkey View Post

LOL HP et all know that they can't compete and never will be able to. Itunes is the gold in the ipad's success. Seems like Steve realized that any tablet is just a tablet and the thing that makes a tablet really work is the software and media ecosystem it lives in. (MMMM thousands of awesome apps we are all drooling already) Hmm somebody studied evolution and Biology. LOL No one can compete with Itunes at this point; most are still trying to compete with the device itself and/ or the pricing.

ditto...nicely stated
post #9 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

According to The Wall Street Journal, executives from HP intend to "tweak prices and features" soon on its upcoming Slate, which will offer a 3G data connection. The company had already intended to price their hardware below the starting $629 price for the 16GB 3G iPad, sources said.

Quote:
"With profit margins dwindling due to ongoing price wars, PC makers hope new touch-screen devices will sell for higher prices than mini-computers like netbooks, which have comparable components."

Smart HP. Hoping for higher margins we will lower prices. If anyone challenges us in this (soon to be) highly competitive market we will lower our prices again.

My guess is that that the iPad will be more expensive but offer a superior experience. Status Quo.
post #10 of 131
LOL HP et all know that they can't compete and never will be able to. Itunes is the gold in the ipad's success. Seems like Steve realized that any tablet is just a tablet and the thing that makes a tablet really work is the software and media ecosystem it lives in. (MMMM thousands of awesome apps we are all drooling already) Hmm somebody studied evolution and Biology. LOL No one can compete with Itunes at this point; most are still trying to compete with the device itself and/ or the pricing.

Couldn't agree with you more. It has become kind of sad to see once-great innovators like HP adopt this kind of Microsoft-like strategy based almost entirely on imitation. It IS the ecosystem that makes all the difference, and the companies that just try to build cheap iPad lookalikes will not do well. They will fool a lot of people into buying a cheap knockoff, but the rest of us will actually be enjoying all of the superior benefits of the iPad. As Mark Twain once said, "The public is the only critic whose judgment is worth anything at all." I think once the "public" gets their hands on the iPad the attempts by other companies to compete are going to be a little comical. I want Apple to have strong competitors that keep them on their toes but the reactions of companies like Microsoft and HP to the iPad show that so far they just-don't-get-it.
post #11 of 131
A wrinkled laundry list of features long enough to fill almost 18 seconds!

Who wants to guess Maya and green screen?
post #12 of 131
As was proven by the iPod, iPhone, and the iMac, pricing has always been secondary.
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post #13 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post


My guess is that that the iPad will be more expensive but offer a superior experience. Status Quo.

So do you predict Mac-like market share as well?
post #14 of 131
A tablet running Windows 7 is alone enough of a reason why I will not buy one. And for full disclosure, I'm running Windows 7 - in a virtual machine on my i7 iMac.
post #15 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by BAW View Post

It IS the ecosystem that makes all the difference,

I agree. That is why Apple chose to make the 'Pad an oversized touch - the touch has an existing ecosystem.

And that is also why so few folks choose Macs - the ecosystem just isn't there.
post #16 of 131
The biggest problem facing the WinPad is getting the shoehorned version of Windows it will run to perform adequately on the lighter duty processors. The second is getting the UI for this form factor right, which Microsoft has proven itself to be uniquely inept at doing after several tries now. The third is Apple's signal that they are prepared to be aggressive on price with the iPad.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #17 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

So do you predict Mac-like market share as well?

No, more like the iPod Touch share.

Do you consider company X selling millions of low-end, cheap knockoffs, with barely a profit being made to be more successful than company Y selling less but making more money than company X?
post #18 of 131
And the sheep follow.
post #19 of 131
If MSFT releases this as-is, using a dual screen "book" like feature, it's going to massively fail. It is going to be more expensive to produce, requires more power thus will be heavier and users turning in couriers broken in half at the hinge.

The report also cited people familiar with Microsoft's dual-screen, touchscreen tablet, dubbed the Courier, in stating that the Redmond, Wash., software giant has a "secretive team" working on the unannounced device. Renders of the Courier leaked last September, showing a device with two color screens that folded together like a book.
post #20 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

The biggest problem facing the WinPad is getting the shoehorned version of Windows it will run to perform adequately on the lighter duty processors. The second is getting the UI for this form factor right, which Microsoft has proven itself to be uniquely inept at doing after several tries now. The third is Apple's signal that they are prepared to be aggressive on price with the iPad.

Yep. I'm taking a skeptical view of Win7 tablets too. I would expect that the Android tablets will be the best ones for a long while, but my crystal ball has never been reliable.

At any rate, it will be a great year for gadgets.
post #21 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

No, more like the iPod Touch share.

Do you consider company X selling millions of low-end, cheap knockoffs, with barely a profit being made to be more successful than company Y selling less but making more money than company X?

It depends on your defininition of "more successful". I have little desire to banter about the definitions of words.
post #22 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

The biggest problem facing the WinPad is getting the shoehorned version of Windows it will run to perform adequately on the lighter duty processors. The second is getting the UI for this form factor right, which Microsoft has proven itself to be uniquely inept at doing after several tries now. The third is Apple's signal that they are prepared to be aggressive on price with the iPad.

Some of the tablets being announced are running a version of Linux not Windows.

I hope there are many GOOD Tablets to choose from. I like competition.
post #23 of 131
[QUOTE=BobABoui;1574970]If MSFT releases this as-is, using a dual screen "book" like feature, it's going to massively fail. It is going to be more expensive to produce, requires more power thus will be heavier and users turning in couriers broken in half at the hinge.

And I'll bet it will be hailed by the scores of spoon-clanging geeks because it's not the iPad.
post #24 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

It depends on your defininition of "more successful". I have little desire to banter about the definitions of words.

do you have any desire to banter about the definition of defininition though?
post #25 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

The biggest problem facing the WinPad is getting the shoehorned version of Windows it will run to perform adequately on the lighter duty processors. The second is getting the UI for this form factor right, which Microsoft has proven itself to be uniquely inept at doing after several tries now. The third is Apple's signal that they are prepared to be aggressive on price with the iPad.

i run Windows 7 at work on a 5 or 6 year old HP desktop with a P4 chip. i can go to youtube and stream flash with only 50% of the CPU being used. compare that to my G4 Mac Mini that stutters when playing the same videos
post #26 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

"PC companies are eager for a piece of any tablet market that emerges,"

I think that's supposed to read "...that Apple creates"

[CENTER]I'm sure you're aware that...

MIDS, (which is what the iPad actually is) as well as Tablet PCs featuring desktop/full operating systems, have been around for nearly a decade, so the market was already created, though I'm sure that any popularity the iPad achieves will move the market in a positive direction.

Evidence of an existing/long-standing tablet/slate market:

I'm pretty sure that I bought my Hp/Compaq TC1000 back in February of 2003, and it had USB, a media card reader, and several other 'features' not present on Apple's (as yet unreleased) 'New Creation'.

http://www.thevooner.com/feature/200...000/tc1000.htm[/CENTER]
"Why iPhone"... Hmmm?
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"Why iPhone"... Hmmm?
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post #27 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShepherd View Post

Some of the tablets being announced are running a version of Linux not Windows.

I hope there are many GOOD Tablets to choose from. I like competition.

So do I, but I think Apple has a leg up on both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

i run Windows 7 at work on a 5 or 6 year old HP desktop with a P4 chip. i can go to youtube and stream flash with only 50% of the CPU being used. compare that to my G4 Mac Mini that stutters when playing the same videos

A review of one of these tablets was posted here recently, I can't recall which one (maybe someone else will). The reviewer noted the poor performance including a two minute boot time (IIRC).
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #28 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

I agree. That is why Apple chose to make the 'Pad an oversized touch - the touch has an existing ecosystem.

And that is also why so few folks choose Macs - the ecosystem just isn't there.

Bullshit. There is an excellent Mac ecosystem. The number of Mac developers is increasing all the time. More and more hi-end software is making the transition - the latest announcement being SolidWorks. The The iPhone/iPad phenomenon can only increase the number of Mac developers dramatically.

90% of computers over $1000 sold in retail are Macs.

You don't understand what you are talking about. You purpose here is clearly simply to annoy.
post #29 of 131
post #30 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

So do you predict Mac-like market share as well?

Hard to say. Are we talking iPod Touch / iPhone, or Macs? I expect the competition will try and undercut on price which always works to a certain extent. Higher number of sales is clearly Apple's goal (as for any business) but for Apple there are other more important criteria. If Android based slates come to market with the same form factor, the same functionality and a more developed eco-system, the game changes entirely.
My prediction is that in the short term others will bring out slates that are lower priced but have inferior user experience. These will sell well on the back of the iPad but likewise, these will increase product category awareness and help re-inforce the iPad's strengths.
I think the iPad will be a huge success. I think the slate market will become huge but I don't necessarily think Apple will own this market a few years down the line.
post #31 of 131
It looks like Microsoft might finally be making some interesting, desirable products, what with the new Zune phone and the Courier concept.

However, I have one question: How does a company with such a large warchest and an army of talented engineers follow and not lead?

They sit back, wait for someone else to change the landscape, then point at said landscape and exclaim, "We are going to do that, and do it better! (By the holidays)!"
post #32 of 131
you might think any thoughtful reporter or blog would notice:

- any tablet running Win 7 has all the same complex operation and maintenance requirements as a desktop or laptop, even if the OS supports a touch UI. (this includes security issues of course.)
- almost no Windows applications have been re-designed for a touch UI, and so can be harder or very difficult to use on such a tablet. Many are totally impractical.
- if the 2nd gen smartphone revolution proves anything, it is that simplified OS's and apps, designed from ground up for touch UI, are key to consumer popularity - the exact opposite of the above.
- and thus for years all attempts to sell Windows tablets to consumers have, in fact, failed.

but no, we keep reading this same nonsense about HP's latest touch UI Windows products - TouchSmart et al. and now its tablet. who are the idiots writing this garbage?

this emperor/storyline has no clothes.
post #33 of 131
The price to beat is $499. And you havent beaten if you dont have a software experience to rival the iPadbecause what is a tablet besides the software experience?

3G is a nice option to have in the lineup, but most people dont need it. Nor do most people need more than 16GB of storage. Im a heavy data user and my iPhone has about 4GB of photos/videos, 4GB of apps (and I have hundredsmore than will even fit on the screens) and 6GB of music. My actual library is much larger, but smart playlists keep the best stuff always present and cycle through the rest automatically. Id like 32, but if I can make do with 16, most people can make do with even less. More GB is a bullet point that very few real people care aboutespecially since this isnt a computer in the conventional sense.

So theres no sense in comparing with the iPad by bullet points or by priceunless you beat $499 for something just as good.
post #34 of 131
I am just wondering, how can HP "beat" the Apple iPad price if they don't have the same product
post #35 of 131
HP junkware and MS vaporware.

Big news!
post #36 of 131
I'm still under the impression that nearly no Windows user want to use any simplified slate computing device. The closest thing to a slate I've gathered that any Windows user wants is a convertible netbook such as the Asus Eee PC T101MT.
http://www.gizmag.com/asus-eeepc-t10...otebook/14223/
This supposedly is the ultimate hybrid mobile solution for any Windows user.

A short list of why Windows users feel that the iPad is a major fail :

1. The iPad is far too expensive. The T101MT is nearly the same price or less but with more features.
2. The iPad has an under-featured and crippled OS. The T101MT runs a full version of Windows 7.
3. The iPad has no keyboard. The T101MT has the best of both worlds of keyboard and touch.
4. The iPad lacks ports. The T101MT has all the standard ports of a full-size computer.
5. The iPad won't multitask or run Flash. The T101MT does both with ease.
6. The iPad doesn't have a user replaceable battery. The T101MT does.
7. The iPad doesn't have a hard drive which limits storage. The T101MT has a huge hard drive.
8. The iPad doesn't have a external slot. The T101MT has the newest and greatest SDXC external slot.
9. The iPad is controlled by Steve Jobs. The T101MT is completely controlled by the end user.

These are just a few of the reasons why Windows users say the iPad is an overpriced and under-featured piece of junk that no well-informed, self-respecting computer user should buy. Compared to the the T101MT, not only the iPad, but also the HP slate and all the other touch-only slates are devices that nobody in their right minds would ever buy. Bill Gates also supports this theory by also wanting a stylus for pen input along with a keyboard and touch.

If any of you has ever followed the comments on Engadget, you will see that Windows users hate any device that is a pure slate and that a decent computing experience cannot exist without a physical keyboard. Any pure tablet is doomed from the start for Windows users.

I'm buying an iPad merely because I like the large iPod Touch concept and being able to run thousands of apps. I basically want an instant-on playback device with lots of content. The iPad isn't perfect for me, but it's close enough for me to enjoy using on a day to day basis. I've got other Macs so I'll just add one more to my collection. I hope that most low tech consumers will find the simplicity of the device compelling enough to buy. I believe the iPad will be a huge success based on what most tech-geeks think it lacks.
post #37 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Constable Odo View Post

If any of you has ever followed the comments on Engadget, you will see that Windows users hate any device that is a pure slate and that a decent computing experience cannot exist without a physical keyboard. Any pure tablet is doomed from the start for Windows users.

That is not fair to Windows users. 99.9% of Windows users have no idea what Engadget is. If they all did, only a very low percentage would know what they are talking about and an even lower percentage would care.
As was pointed out in the Matt Gemmel piece the iPad is not a computer and will not be thought of as such. Most Windows users will look at the iPad for what it is - a really cool 'thing'
post #38 of 131
iPhone-like marketshare or iPod like marketshare or somewhere in the middle.

So are you going with HP or Dell for your multitasking, Farmville playing Adobe Flashâ„¢ based tablet goodness?

Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

So do you predict Mac-like market share as well?
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #39 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinney57 View Post

http://mattgemmell.com/2010/02/05/ho...pete-with-ipad

Excellent piece. Read and learn.

Exactly!

I am sorry, but the vast majority of people on sites like this just don't get it. The iPad isn't meant for us. Sure, we might end up getting one, but it will be for reasons outside of the target demographic, or because we will fit into the target demographic at times.

This is not a computer replacement. It is not a laptop replacement. While it can create some things, like letters and art. It isn't meant for creation, it is a device meant for consumption.

That is what most of the competition, unfortunately, is missing.

The wheel just keeps turning. In the beginning computer companies were all like Apple. They made their own hardware and software. They created their own ecosystem.

Then came the age of specialization when Microsoft came into power. Microsoft, and software houses, created software and others created hardware. Apple and the other computer companies of the time either died or moved into niche markets.

Now the wheel has returned to the beginning. The age of separate hardware and software companies is dying. The age of the computer, as we know it is going away. And nobody should be surprised, it has been predicted for close to a decade now.

The iPad is just another step into the realm of the computer as a consumer device. Sure it is limited in what it can do when compared to a computer, but so what. It isn't a computer.

It is just that we, the minority, who work with computers, don't see that.

There is a reason Apple dropped the computer from its name a long time ago. If Steve Jobs is remembered for anything I think it will be for his foresight in seeing the demise of the computer market as it was and capitalizing on the consumer device (powered by computers) that is coming. Of course, he will likely also be remembered as the guy who didn't see the first change in the computer market and nearly lost his company because of it.
post #40 of 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

HP intend to "tweak prices and features" soon on its upcoming Slate

Don't they do this with their Laptops already.

And that's why they end up so crummy*.

* Disclaimer for their business notebooks.
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