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Tea Party Terrorism - Page 10

post #361 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by segovius View Post

He is on my ignore list so not sure what it was. And let's not single out specific individuals on here as such but - in the abstract - yes I think it is fair to say that AI does have it's quota or irrational loons fairly represented across the spectrum.

Perhaps I should follow your example on this one... I try to be very sparing in my use of the ignore function however.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
Reply
post #362 of 397
I don't know if anyone's made reference to this but it's an interesting Opinion piece.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35990654

Quote:
Olbermann: GOP self-destruction imminent
The party's obsolete ideas will undermine its relevance

Quote:
American political parties have disappeared before. They are never forced out by their rivals. They die by their own hands, because they did not know that the hatred or the myopia or the monomania they thought was still okay wasn't okay, any more. And so I offer this olive branch to the defeated Republicans and Tea Partiers.

It is a cold olive branch, and scarred, and there aren't many olives on it, but it still counts.You are rapidly moving from "The Party of No," past "The Party Of No Conscience," towards "The Party of No Relevancy." You are behind the wheel of a political Toyota. And before the mid-terms, you will have been reduced to only bein this generation's home for the nuts.

You will be the Flat-Earthers, the Isolationists, the Segregationists, the John Birchers. Stop.
Certainly you must recognize the future is with the humane, the inclusive, the diverse— it is with America. Not the America of 1910, but the America of 2010. Discard this dangerous, separatist, elitist, backward-looking rhetoric, and you will be welcomed back into the political discourse of this nation. Continue with it, and you will destroy yourselves and whatever righteous causes you actually believe in, and on the way you will damage this country in ways and manners untold.

I've been saying much the same myself as have others here. I just think the GOP will wise up and shed itself of the angry factions. For their survival. The extreme factions will become the
Quote:
Flat-Earthers, the Isolationists, the Segregationists, the John Birchers

Now the conservatives here can say " Olbermann's full of shit ". However he's not alone. He's one of many thinking this same thing.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #363 of 397
Good article here.

Who really thinks that the Tea Party was a "grassroots, spontaneous uprising of pro Americanism? No, its absolutely not the case..

This was a financed effort, largely funded by the Koch Corporation:

extracted:

Quote:
he Tea Party movement's dirty little secret is that its chief financial backers owe their family fortune to the granddaddy of all their hatred: Stalin's godless empire of the USSR. The secretive oil billionaires of the Koch family, the main supporters of the right-wing groups that orchestrated the Tea Party movement, would not have the means to bankroll their favorite causes had it not been for the pile of money the family made working for the Bolsheviks in the late 1920s and early 1930s, building refineries, training Communist engineers and laying down the foundation of Soviet oil infrastructure.

The comrades were good to the Kochs. Today Koch Industries has grown into the second-largest private company in America. With an annual revenue of $100 billion, the company was just $6.3 billion shy of first place in 2008. Ownership is kept strictly in the family, with the company being split roughly between brothers Charles and David Koch, who are worth about $20 billion apiece and are infamous as the largest sponsors of right-wing causes. They bankroll scores of free-market and libertarian think tanks, institutes and advocacy groups. Greenpeace estimates that the Koch family shelled out $25 million from 2005 to 2008 funding the "climate denial machine," which means they outspent Exxon Mobile three to one.

I first learned about the Kochs in February 2009, when my colleague Mark Ames and I were looking into the strange origins of the then-nascent Tea Party movement. Our investigation led us again and again to a handful of right-wing advocacy groups ..........

-continued-

Koch probably earns $billions from deals with RED, COMMUNIST, TOTALITARIAN, AUTHORITARIAN, BIG GOVERNMENT China as well.

Libertarian?
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #364 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

Good article here.

Who really thinks that the Tea Party was a "grassroots, spontaneous uprising of pro Americanism? No, its absolutely not the case..

This was a financed effort, largely funded by the Koch Corporation:

extracted:



Koch probably earns $billions from deals with RED, COMMUNIST, TOTALITARIAN, AUTHORITARIAN, BIG GOVERNMENT China as well.

Libertarian?

Wherever they came from I think in the end they will be an enemy of the GOP as well as the Democrats as the Tea Party seem to not like anyone but themselves. That will probably be their undoing.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #365 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I don't know if anyone's made reference to this but it's an interesting Opinion piece.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35990654





I've been saying much the same myself as have others here. I just think the GOP will wise up and shed itself of the angry factions. For their survival. The extreme factions will become the

Now the conservatives here can say " Olbermann's full of shit ". However he's not alone. He's one of many thinking this same thing.

Yea Olbermann's always been known for his well reasoned and supported opinions. He's not at all catering to the foaming at the mouth left cynically treating them like political crack addicts.
post #366 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

Yea Olbermann's always been known for his well reasoned and supported opinions. He's not at all catering to the foaming at the mouth left cynically treating them like political crack addicts.

From my original post :
Quote:
Now the conservatives here can say " Olbermann's full of shit ". However he's not alone. He's one of many thinking this same thing.

If he was the only one saying these kinds of things I'd say you might have something.

But he's not. Disrupting goverment ( and the other insults ) while in session is no small matter. And yes people have noticed. Republicans have been growing more bold in their classless remarks and the voters are really tired of this kind of behavior.

Don't believe me? Sit back and watch.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #367 of 397

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #368 of 397

A "HuffPost's Pick" comment summed some of it up very profoundly-

Quote:

Martin Luther King- "I have a dream"

TeaBagger- "I have an automatic 9mm"

Martin Luther King- "I believe in the power of the people"

TeaBagger- "I believe in the power of the automatic 9mm"

Martin Luther King- "I believe in equality and justice"

TeaBagger- "That's why I own a gun"

~ http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0...nt_id=45062843
We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #369 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

A "HuffPost's Pick" comment summed some of it up very profoundly-

I assume that by "profoundly" here you mean "not profoundly at all." That is the only interpretation that makes any sense. I must compliment your for your use of irony though in using Huffington Post and "profound" in the same sentence.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #370 of 397
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXbeq6Rt6Z0

http://gatewaypundit.firstthings.com...p-brown-waite/

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #371 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

From my original post :
But he's not. Disrupting goverment ( and the other insults ) while in session is no small matter. And yes people have noticed. Republicans have been growing more bold in their classless remarks and the voters are really tired of this kind of behavior.

Don't believe me? Sit back and watch.

Ah yea. Operation Pink Never did any of that. Nor any of the "peace" protesters. You won that one.
post #372 of 397
Getting back to that whole cop-killing Michigan militia thing. It sounds the the government is a bunch of Keystone Cops on this.

Quote:
An FBI agent who led the investigation of nine Michigan militia members charged with trying to launch war against the federal government couldn't recall many details of the two-year probe yesterday during questioning by defense lawyers.
Even the judge who must decide whether to release the nine until trial was puzzled.


"I share the frustrations of the defense team that she doesn't know anything," U.S. District Judge Victoria Roberts said after agent Leslie Larsen confessed she hadn't reviewed her notes recently and couldn't remember specific details of the case.

Judge Roberts is hearing an appeal of another judge's order that has kept members of so-called Hutaree militia in jail since their arrest in late March.

The indictment says the nine planned to kill police officers as a steppingstone to a widespread uprising against the federal government.

Defense lawyers, however, say their clients are being punished for being outspoken.

Prosecutors fought to keep Ms. Larsen off the witness stand, saying the defendants had no legal right to question her.

But the judge said the agent's appearance was appropriate because the burden is on defense lawyers to show their clients won't be a threat to the public if released.

The nine lawyers asked specific questions about each defendant. Ms. Larsen said she had not listened entirely to certain recordings made by an undercover agent who infiltrated the group.

She said that because they were still being examined, she didn't know if weapons seized by investigators last month were illegal.

At other times, Ms. Larsen couldn't answer questions because she said she hadn't reviewed investigative reports.

Defense lawyer William Swor asked if the No. 1 defendant, Hutaree leader David Stone, had ever instructed anyone to make a bomb.

"I can't fully answer that question," the agent replied.


Assistant U.S. Attorney Jonathan Tukel defended Ms. Larsen, telling the judge it wasn't clear until Monday that she would testify.
Judge Roberts, however, said she told the government to be prepared last week.

Assistant U.S. Attorney Ronald Waterstreet played an audiotape of what he said were several militia members talking freely about killing police.

The participants talked over each other, often laughed and made goofy noises and disparaging remarks about law enforcement.

Prosecutors objected to questions about interpreting the secretly recorded conversations, but the judge said they were fair game.

The judge will resume the court hearing today.

Prosecutors will have a chance to question people who are willing to be responsible for some of the nine if they are released from jail.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #373 of 397
Also getting back to another claim, turns out the n-word didn't happen either and the video proof is there from a half dozen angles.

BG.com

BG2.com

Quote:
Not only is the audio devoid of any racial slur, but the scene at Cannon clearly shows the congressmen coming down the steps completely unobstructed, and with a clear path to the Capitol. And, when we juxtapose the audio accusation Rep.Carson made moments after the alleged event occurred with actual video footage of the moment Rep. Carson claims he first heard the racial slur, it is as plain as day that Congressman Carson was not isolated by a mob and facing a racist throng that could conceivably hurl rocks at him. As you can see for yourself.

As seg loves to note, for the left, reality is what you can get away with and as ol'Saul says..."Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it."

I hope every person in that videoframe decides to sue for defamation and slander.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #374 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Also getting back to another claim, turns out the n-word didn't happen either and the video proof is there from a half dozen angles.

BG.com

BG2.com



As seg loves to note, for the left, reality is what you can get away with and as ol'Saul says..."Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it."

I hope every person in that videoframe decides to sue for defamation and slander.



BG.com?

Where did the video come from and was the audio altered?

Just a question since in that crowd it would be easy to just turn down the treble when recording the transfer and not pick it up. I would prefer to hear this from a nationally recognized source since it's such an important issue.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #375 of 397
Parsing the tea-party logic

Quote:
The tea partyers aren't crazy. Maybe they're just living in an alternate universe.

I went to one of those tea-party tax protests last week and found it didn't fit the crudest media stereotypes. They were friendly, not a bunch of whack jobs in training for the militia, as they are sometimes portrayed.

The ones I met didn't even seem all that angry.

But: I do wonder if the tea partyers and I live on the same planet.

For instance, several speakers inspired the crowd with stories about how the most courageous and noble people left are the capitalists. Because they bravely walk the road of struggle against a powerful, socialistic bureaucracy.

And I'm thinking — didn't the capitalists just nearly destroy capitalism? Only to be saved by the socialists?

Didn't all that happen just a year and a half ago?

Then there's the matter of taxes.

"Born Free, Taxed to Death," read one tea-party sign. "Tax Slaves Unite," said another. "Welcome to France," read a third.

That was a strong theme — the way our Marxist government incessantly gropes in our pockets for more of our hard-earned money.

A cry went up: "Taxes Suck!"

Yes they do. But here's something else about taxes, at least the federal kind. Did you know that total federal tax receipts, as a percentage of the size of the economy (gross domestic product), are now the lowest in 60 years?

---

The trouble is, they don't have much appetite for cutting Medicare, Social Security or military spending. They want even lower taxes. Put these views together and the math says the budget can't balance. Even if you eliminate 100 percent of everything else.
You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
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You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
The Story of Stuff
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post #376 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

BG.com?

Where did the video come from and was the audio altered?

Just a question since in that crowd it would be easy to just turn down the treble when recording the transfer and not pick it up. I would prefer to hear this from a nationally recognized source since it's such an important issue.

A review of the video will show that two members of the entourage from the people claiming the racism had VIDEOCAMERAS themselves. Clearly they would have recorded slurs and likewise could have used the video to great political advantage.

They haven't produced their own videos because they don't contain the slurs and in fact prove what all other videos have shown, that there was no slurs.

Likewise how do you account for the complete lack of confrontation as opposed to what was claimed. Do you see seething mobs being held back by riot police with rocks in hard just waiting to throw them? That was the claim.

If all have to fall back on is claims of altered video, even when the incident has been submitted from MULTIPLE ANGLES, then that really speaks to how desperate and delusional November will be for you and your party. Hell I expect all the elections will suddenly be "stolen" again now that Republicans will make massive gains.

Pure bullshit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iPoster View Post

Parsing the tea-party logic

There's a reason we don't consider things in isolation iPoster. This is a nice attempt to move the goalposts though. See first they were angry and violent. Now that every attempt to video and document this has proven quite the opposite, it is time for a new round of lies called the ignorant and stupid lies.

Did you know that total federal tax receipts, as a percentage of the size of the economy (gross domestic product), are now the lowest in 60 years?

The reason tax receipts are lowest is two-fold. One the economy is in the shitter in case you hadn't noticed and stimulating, printing, and spinning hasn't changed that fact. Nearly 10% unemployment means lots of folks have no income and thus pay no income tax. This is also true of Social Security and Medicare tax as well.

The second point of this is that government spending is part of GDP and it has grown massively. The entire economy has shrunk to roughly 10 trillion a year of activity and the government is a massive part of that including deficits of over a trillion dollars a year.

So basically in context, what is says is that there is less money coming in but spending outstripping it on a historic scale. The spending by government as a percentage of GDP is the same as when we were fighting WWII. Just think about that for a minute. It's up around 26% of all GDP last I read whereas it was previously 20-21%. You add enough government spending to total 5% of all economic activity and don't raise the taxes to go with it, then the amount of taxes in comparison to spending will shrink as a ratio, which is what your statement claims.

However tea party folks aren't protesting tax increases. They have clearly been protesting the massive federal expansion and deficit spending. The claim was Republicans were engaging in Starve the Beast. Well the claim for Democrats has been that they are engaging in STUFF the Beast. They will create deficits so large that the only choice is to raise taxes or default. We are quickly heading to a PIIGS type scenario where we will be in debt to 100% of GDP.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #377 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

A review of the video will show that two members of the entourage from the people claiming the racism had VIDEOCAMERAS themselves. Clearly they would have recorded slurs and likewise could have used the video to great political advantage.

They haven't produced their own videos because they don't contain the slurs and in fact prove what all other videos have shown, that there was no slurs.

Likewise how do you account for the complete lack of confrontation as opposed to what was claimed. Do you see seething mobs being held back by riot police with rocks in hard just waiting to throw them? That was the claim.

If all have to fall back on is claims of altered video, even when the incident has been submitted from MULTIPLE ANGLES, then that really speaks to how desperate and delusional November will be for you and your party. Hell I expect all the elections will suddenly be "stolen" again now that Republicans will make massive gains.

Pure bullshit.






There's a reason we don't consider things in isolation iPoster. This is a nice attempt to move the goalposts though. See first they were angry and violent. Now that every attempt to video and document this has proven quite the opposite, it is time for a new round of lies called the ignorant and stupid lies.

Did you know that total federal tax receipts, as a percentage of the size of the economy (gross domestic product), are now the lowest in 60 years?

The reason tax receipts are lowest is two-fold. One the economy is in the shitter in case you hadn't noticed and stimulating, printing, and spinning hasn't changed that fact. Nearly 10% unemployment means lots of folks have no income and thus pay no income tax. This is also true of Social Security and Medicare tax as well.

The second point of this is that government spending is part of GDP and it has grown massively. The entire economy has shrunk to roughly 10 trillion a year of activity and the government is a massive part of that including deficits of over a trillion dollars a year.

So basically in context, what is says is that there is less money coming in but spending outstripping it on a historic scale. The spending by government as a percentage of GDP is the same as when we were fighting WWII. Just think about that for a minute. It's up around 26% of all GDP last I read whereas it was previously 20-21%. You add enough government spending to total 5% of all economic activity and don't raise the taxes to go with it, then the amount of taxes in comparison to spending will shrink as a ratio, which is what your statement claims.

However tea party folks aren't protesting tax increases. They have clearly been protesting the massive federal expansion and deficit spending. The claim was Republicans were engaging in Starve the Beast. Well the claim for Democrats has been that they are engaging in STUFF the Beast. They will create deficits so large that the only choice is to raise taxes or default. We are quickly heading to a PIIGS type scenario where we will be in debt to 100% of GDP.


Where did the video come from trumpy???????

Quote:
They haven't produced their own videos because they don't contain the slurs and in fact prove what all other videos have shown, that there was no slurs.

Ah! I see a conclusion from you.
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post #378 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Where did the video come from trumpy?

The point here was that the lies espoused from Georgia Congressman Lewis et al., i.e., that racial epithets were forthcoming from Tea Party when in fact no evidence for such can be found despite hundreds of cameras being present. It was yet another manufactured slander against the Tea Party movement that had no basis in fact.
post #379 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


However tea party folks aren't protesting tax increases. They have clearly been protesting the massive federal expansion and deficit spending. The claim was Republicans were engaging in Starve the Beast. Well the claim for Democrats has been that they are engaging in STUFF the Beast. They will create deficits so large that the only choice is to raise taxes or default. We are quickly heading to a PIIGS type scenario where we will be in debt to 100% of GDP.

Not arguing that cutting deficit spending is a good thing, it is. As you said taxation is a complex situation, but are you implying that the past and present admins cutting taxes to the point where ~50% of Americans didn't pay into the tax system this year (myself included) had no impact on revenues? There may be 10% unemployment, but what about the other 90% of wage earners? The main issue I have with the TEA (Taxed Enough Already, at lest originally BTW) Party (at least self proclaimed members I've spoken with, not sure if there is an actual platform statement) is that they are the tax equivalent of NIMBYs, they want to cut everyone else's outlays but not the ones that impact them themselves. (generally medicare, medicaid, SS, etc.)

I would agree that the party in general is somewhat unfairly portrayed in the media; but then they partly brought it on themselves, if the readily available (but yes probably selective) photos and videos on the internet from rallies up to the national level are any indication.

You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
The Story of Stuff
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You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
The Story of Stuff
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post #380 of 397
This is the closest place to post this but it does kind of go with the Tea baggers..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37271857...ife/?GT1=43001

Quote:
Texas OKs school textbook changes
Critics claim conservatives trying to revise history

This is why this kind of crap has to stop! This kind of ideology is just stupid. Teaching kids something that is a different or watered down version of the truth that won't sync with the way the rest of the world teches history is just nuts. And folks do you know what it reminds me of? The way the truth is taught in communist countries or dictatorships. Just the kind of thing these people pretend to be against. Only it's ok when it's them.

Truly nuts. And truly doomed to fail in the end.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #381 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

This is the closest place to post this but it does kind of go with the Tea baggers..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37271857...ife/?GT1=43001



This is why this kind of crap has to stop! This kind of ideology is just stupid. Teaching kids something that is a different or watered down version of the truth that won't sync with the way the rest of the world teches history is just nuts. And folks do you know what it reminds me of? The way the truth is taught in communist countries or dictatorships. Just the kind of thing these people pretend to be against. Only it's ok when it's them.

Truly nuts. And truly doomed to fail in the end.

Communism anyone?
Text book mods to make ourselves look good?
Whitewashing?
yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #382 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Communism anyone?
Text book mods to make ourselves look good?
Whitewashing?

When the changes were made 10 years ago you suppose the other side said the same type of things?

You pounce based on this short article, and have not even actually read any of the books to know what they are going to say. Very intelligent and informed of you.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #383 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

When the changes were made 10 years ago you suppose the other side said the same type of things?

You pounce based on this short article, and have not even actually read any of the books to know what they are going to say. Very intelligent and informed of you.

One can only reply to the info given in the article which was a reply to Camp David.

And Noah it already sounds bad.
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post #384 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Communism anyone?
Text book mods to make ourselves look good?
Whitewashing?

It's commonly known as " Censorship" or " Propaganda ".
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #385 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

This is the closest place to post this but it does kind of go with the Tea baggers..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37271857...ife/?GT1=43001

Quote:
Texas OKs school textbook changes
Critics claim conservatives trying to revise history

Yes! Only liberals are allowed to do that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

This is why this kind of crap has to stop!

I agree!


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Teaching kids something that is a different or watered down version of the truth that won't sync with the way the rest of the world teches history is just nuts. And folks do you know what it reminds me of?

The present day public school system of the United States?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #386 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

One can only reply to the info given in the article which was a reply to Camp David.

And Noah it already sounds bad.

Is that all one can do???
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #387 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

Is that all one can do???

No one can point out how stupid and dangerous this idea is.

Altering the truth taught to our children isn't upsetting to you?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #388 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

No one can point out how stupid and dangerous this idea is.

Some of us have been trying to do this about many of Obama's ideas


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Altering the truth taught to our children isn't upsetting to you?

Well since we've taken the responsibility to teach our own kids ourselves that's not an issue for us. Who exactly are "our children?" Is this your collectivist thought slipping out again? Sure looks like it. My kids aren't your kids and your kids aren't my kids. You don't like what your kids might be taught in the public schools, take them out and teach them what you think they should be taught.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #389 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

This is the closest place to post this but it does kind of go with the Tea baggers..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37271857...ife/?GT1=43001

This is why this kind of crap has to stop! This kind of ideology is just stupid. Teaching kids something that is a different or watered down version of the truth that won't sync with the way the rest of the world teches history is just nuts. And folks do you know what it reminds me of? The way the truth is taught in communist countries or dictatorships. Just the kind of thing these people pretend to be against. Only it's ok when it's them.

Truly nuts. And truly doomed to fail in the end.

Besides noting that MSNBC is upset that conservatives alter or change something, can you actually substantiate any of these claims. As it typical with the tirades around here it is interesting to note how the charges evolve with each repetition. Those goal posts are really moving here.

Note the charge here... it is a different or watered down version of the truth. How exactly does one do that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Communism anyone?
Text book mods to make ourselves look good?
Whitewashing?

Piling on, really no surprise here. Uninformed rants are becoming the specialty of the left. It reflect the lack of thinking that replaces the former thinking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

No one can point out how stupid and dangerous this idea is.

Altering the truth taught to our children isn't upsetting to you?

Please explain what truth has been altered. First it was watered down or different form the world consensus view, not that there was any proof of that consensus, it is just assumed of course.

Please list what has been changed that is a lie or untruth.

You won't be able to do that because there isn't anything changed that is untrue. When kids have hundreds of years of history and 180 days to do it in, then obviously things have to be prioritized. All this board is changing is the priority of items taught. Much like how our Supreme Court has no actual WASPS on it any more, our history books are often much the same, side stories and minor figures that reflect diversity and special interests or intentions have often overwhelmed and replaced the entire mainstream narrative of that history. Simply bringing some balance here isn't a lying.

The left has an inert media non-reporting on all their mistakes. They feel they can lie with impunity but the bill for all that is coming due in the worst way. November can't get here fast enough.

For we live in a world where Rand Paul's tiny bit of inarticulateness is worth days of news, but President Obama bribing Sestak not to run against Specter, well that isn't news. Flooding in Tennessee and a month long oil spill in the Gulf, that isn't worth our time. Unemployment rising from 9.7 to 9.9 with the DOW dropping below 10k, well that isn't news nor even worthy of thought or analysis either.

Just because the media doesn't want to look at it, but the public is looking at it and they will be voting on it come November. NY23rd is sign of a Republican Division and collapse but what happened in Hawaii, well... wait.. nothing happened in Hawaii..... these aren't the droids you are looking for....

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #390 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Besides noting that MSNBC is upset that conservatives alter or change something, can you actually substantiate any of these claims. As it typical with the tirades around here it is interesting to note how the charges evolve with each repetition. Those goal posts are really moving here.

Note the charge here... it is a different or watered down version of the truth. How exactly does one do that?



Piling on, really no surprise here. Uninformed rants are becoming the specialty of the left. It reflect the lack of thinking that replaces the former thinking.



Please explain what truth has been altered. First it was watered down or different form the world consensus view, not that there was any proof of that consensus, it is just assumed of course.

Please list what has been changed that is a lie or untruth.

You won't be able to do that because there isn't anything changed that is untrue. When kids have hundreds of years of history and 180 days to do it in, then obviously things have to be prioritized. All this board is changing is the priority of items taught. Much like how our Supreme Court has no actual WASPS on it any more, our history books are often much the same, side stories and minor figures that reflect diversity and special interests or intentions have often overwhelmed and replaced the entire mainstream narrative of that history. Simply bringing some balance here isn't a lying.

The left has an inert media non-reporting on all their mistakes. They feel they can lie with impunity but the bill for all that is coming due in the worst way. November can't get here fast enough.

For we live in a world where Rand Paul's tiny bit of inarticulateness is worth days of news, but President Obama bribing Sestak not to run against Specter, well that isn't news. Flooding in Tennessee and a month long oil spill in the Gulf, that isn't worth our time. Unemployment rising from 9.7 to 9.9 with the DOW dropping below 10k, well that isn't news nor even worthy of thought or analysis either.

Just because the media doesn't want to look at it, but the public is looking at it and they will be voting on it come November. NY23rd is sign of a Republican Division and collapse but what happened in Hawaii, well... wait.. nothing happened in Hawaii..... these aren't the droids you are looking for....

Quote:
Please list what has been changed that is a lie or untruth.

Read the article for a clue.


The fact that you would support this just shows how out there you are. There would be no reasoning with you. Your whole premise is different. I prefer the truth. Facts are facts. You can't argue with something that is an accurate account. You obviously don't care about that as the truth is a much more tenuous thing for you. One that can be manipulated or altered. Stretched or bent and used on a political platform and for you it still remains the truth.

That doesn't fly here.

As far as Paul goes you just gotta love the way he shot himself ( after winning ) right out of the shute. And then he does it again. Well that pretty much it for him. I'm not crying.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #391 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

There would be no reasoning with you.

Funny, I've found the same to be true about you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I prefer the truth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

You obviously don't care about that as the truth is a much more tenuous thing for you. One that can be manipulated or altered. Stretched or bent and used on a political platform and for you it still remains the truth.

That doesn't fly here.

Based on what I've seen of your posts, this is downright laughable!


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

You can't argue with something that is an accurate account.

And yet I've seen you do exactly that.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #392 of 397
I'm thinking someone here still doesn't grasp the concept of ignore because you don't care what that person has to say.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #393 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Read the article for a clue.


The fact that you would support this just shows how out there you are. There would be no reasoning with you. Your whole premise is different. I prefer the truth. Facts are facts. You can't argue with something that is an accurate account. You obviously don't care about that as the truth is a much more tenuous thing for you. One that can be manipulated or altered. Stretched or bent and used on a political platform and for you it still remains the truth.

That doesn't fly here.

As far as Paul goes you just gotta love the way he shot himself ( after winning ) right out of the shute. And then he does it again. Well that pretty much it for him. I'm not crying.


Please list what has been changed that is a lie or untruth.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #394 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


Please list what has been changed that is a lie or untruth.

Careful, if you corner him and he can no longer stand up to it, he'll put you on ignore.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #395 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post


Please list what has been changed that is a lie or untruth.

You can read the article can't you?

Quote:
The standards, which one Democrat called a "travesty," also will be used by textbook publishers who often develop materials for other states based on guidelines approved in Texas, although teachers in the Lone Star state have latitude in deciding how to teach the material.

The board attempted to make more than 200 amendments this week alone, reshaping draft standards that had been prepared over the last year and a half by expert groups of teachers and professors.

As new amendments were being presented just moments before the vote, Democrats bristled that the changes had not been vetted.

"I think we're doing an injustice to the children of this state by piecemealing together, cutting and pasting, coming up with new amendments as late as today," said Mary Helen Berlanga, a Democrat. "What we have done today and what we did yesterday is something that a classroom teacher would not even have accepted."


Quote:
During the monthslong revision process, conservatives strengthened requirements on teaching the Judeo-Christian influences of the nation's Founding Fathers and required that the U.S. government be referred to as a "constitutional republic," rather than "democratic." Students will be required to study the decline in the value of the U.S. dollar, including the abandonment of the gold standard.

Quote:
At least one lawmaker vowed legislative action to "rein in" the board.

"They have ignored historians and teachers, allowing ideological activists to push the culture war further into our classrooms," said Rep. Mike Villareal, a Democrat. "They fail to understand that we don't want liberal textbooks or conservative textbooks. We want excellent textbooks, written by historians instead of activists."

Quote:
In one of the most significant changes leading up to the vote, the board attempted to water down the rationale for the separation of church and state in a high school government class, pointing out that the words were not in the Constitution and requiring that students compare and contrast the judicial language with the wording in the First Amendment.

They also rejected language to modernize the classification of historic periods to B.C.E. and C.E. from the traditional B.C. and A.D., and agreed to replace Thomas Jefferson as an example of an influential political philosopher in a world history class. They also required students to evaluate efforts by global organizations such as the United Nations to undermine U.S. sovereignty.

Why the hell do they have to change it at all? This is clearly printing opinion and calling history.

Get real trumpy. This is just crap.
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #396 of 397
Quote:
During the monthslong revision process, conservatives strengthened requirements on teaching the Judeo-Christian influences of the nation's Founding Fathers and required that the U.S. government be referred to as a "constitutional republic," rather than "democratic." Students will be required to study the decline in the value of the U.S. dollar, including the abandonment of the gold standard.

Heavens-to-Betsy! Which part, jimmac, of the items in this are incorrect or non-factual?


Quote:
In one of the most significant changes leading up to the vote, the board attempted to water down the rationale for the separation of church and state in a high school government class, pointing out that the words were not in the Constitution and requiring that students compare and contrast the judicial language with the wording in the First Amendment.

Excluding the editorialized part of that statement (I've underlined that part for those unable to detect it), which part of "the words were not in the Constitution" is incorrect or non-factual and what is wrong exactly with "requiring that students compare and contrast the judicial language with the wording in the First Amendment?"


Quote:
They also rejected language to modernize the classification of historic periods to B.C.E. and C.E. from the traditional B.C. and A.D.,

This one is probably a silly argument in either direction, so I'll skip it.


Quote:
and agreed to replace Thomas Jefferson as an example of an influential political philosopher in a world history class.

This is the one item I'd have a qualm with, but I'd like to understand the reasoning before immediately rejecting it. Furthermore, on this front, I'm not sure why liberals care all that much, it's not like they really give a shit what Thomas Jefferson said or stood for anyway.


Quote:
They also required students to evaluate efforts by global organizations such as the United Nations to undermine U.S. sovereignty.

Seems like a reasonable topic for study in a US and world history class.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac

This is clearly printing opinion and calling history.

Wrong.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #397 of 397
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

You can read the article can't you?


Why the hell do they have to change it at all? This is clearly printing opinion and calling history.

Get real trumpy. This is just crap.

Seems to me that you should perhaps back up the parts that you see as being wrong and instead of simply copying and pasting another's opinions say why that opinion is the right one. They did not in any of those passages explain why it was wrong, just that they did not like what was being done. They did however decry the "cutting and pasting" approach, so perhaps you should live up to the standard you are supporting and do more than that.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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