Inside Apple's iPad: iPhone OS vs Mac OS X - Page 4

For who and doing what?

How many people use the more advanced functions of Excel?

Do you have a link which shows how Excel is used?

I've found Numbers to be perfectly adequate for the things I do.

And being the ones who thought the iPhone would fail. My only complaint with iPad is lack of camera & iChat. Given that the iPad will also sync with windows just like iPhone it would be yet another way to shift people toward Mac.

Yes, but ask someone who uses some of the more advanced features of Excel and you'll find that they find it a little lacking in places. For instance my SO, who worked in credit control and now HR, uses a lot of features in Excel every day that just aren't in Numbers.

I have no doubt that Numbers is adequate for you. It's perfectly adequate for me too. But Excel is still a more capable spreadsheet program (unless you're planning on making it look presentable, when Numbers wins).

Similar with Word vs Pages, Word is a more powerful program but Pages is perhaps easier to use and capable of better looking results.

Keynote, however, is miles and miles better than Powerpoint. They are only just in the same league.

The way I see it is this: Microsoft is good at 'office' stuff, maths and accounting and the likes. Apple, meanwhile, is a wholly creative-minded company. You can see it represented in both companies' products. And it's also why Pages and Numbers, can produce better looking but not as powerful results, and why Keynote, which has a more creative use, is way ahead of Powerpoint.

Got a possible answer for you. Provided you don't have a need to run iTunes, use OS X based software and just want a safe and secure netbook to surf, email and do some personal office software type stuff.

(not a troll here at all)

1: A Dell Mini 10 with Ubuntu Linux installed by Dell all the drivers are included, about $350 or so.

A simple installation of a "theme" in this case either XP or OS X (optional)

http://ubuntu.online02.com/node/14

http://sourceforge.net/projects/mac4lin/

The OS X theme is a bit harder to install, the XP theme is effortless and only takes seconds. Naturally the underlining OS is Linux so it won't run Mac or Windows based software.

OpenOffice is pretty decent, it's a free download and Firefox should be included with the Ubuntu Linux install. The add-on's work too as well as the OS X theme applied to Firefox.

There is plenty of free software and even a iTunes like music software, however I don't know if it can access a iPod or not like iTunes can, it certainly can use the iPod as a disk mode. I haven't used it yet.


Despite these small drawbacks, for a $300-$350 little netbook to securely surf, email, write some notes or do some spreadsheets, it's not a bad deal. If you have a bad ass Mac at home to run the heavy duty stuff, multiple OS's etc. The Ubuntu netbook is less expensive than a iPad and comes with a real keyboard and tons of free software with the ability to download them directly from within Ubuntu. 99% of the use of the OS is GUI based, so unless your tweaking things under the hood you shouldn't need to hit the command line.

Files can be easily transferred from Windows to OS X to Linux provided they are saved in universal file formats on USB thumb drives. OpenOffice is available for free on the three major OS's so that makes it a cinch.

A bonus is Linux doesn't get viruses because it's a file permissions based OS just like Unix under OS X. So no need for anti-malware and no need to buy most software, so there is nothing better out there as far as value for price over the long term.

I intend to try a iPad for a few hours and if it doesn't work for me to get a Linux netbook to complement my $4000 MacBook Pro as a more portable/disposable device. If the MacBook Pro dies, to get a desktop, either a Mac Mini or a Mac Pro and use the Linux or iPad as a portable device.

I've tried the touch screen HP desktop, it totally sucks. Not because it's a touchscreen over Windows cursor based UI, but because I have to move my arm constantly to do anything, tapping several times to get things to work. Talk about lost productivity!

Something I've noticed on the HP touch screen, as you bring your finger close to to the surface before touching, a small cursor appears on the screen where your finger is and follows it around. Strange if it's a feature or a glitch.

My opinion is that touch screens are coming out as a means to reduce the costs incurred with a real laptop and increase margins. Just think how easy it is for a iPad to be completely assembled and tested without touching human hands at all. No moving parts neither to fail.

The really frustrating thing is that it's usually the same people who spend all their time posting "Apple sux" and "Mac OS X is a worthless toy". Funny how they can spend all their time bashing OS X, but when it comes to the iPad, they insist it needs to run OS X. Basically, they simply mindlessly attack anything Apple does because they're opposed to anything Apple does - usually because of their fear of the unknown and/or fear of finding out that their OS is inferior.


For 99% of users, iWork will do the job - particularly since the iPad will mostly be used for presentations, not content creation.


Then don't buy an iPad. Here's a thought for you - Apple is creating a wide range of products and not all of them will suit everyone. But they are designed to do their jobs very well and will therefore appeal to lots of people. The iPad is not a full blown computer. It's not designed for writing the great American novel. It's not designed for building 10,000 row spreadsheets. It's not meant to fit into your pocket. That doesn't make it worthless - it simply isn't the right product for those applications. Apple offers THOSE products, too.


No, but there are lots of practical reasons. Full-blown Mac OS X would run slowly on this device and suck down battery life like crazy. Not to mention the UI issues discussed in this article.


That's just silly. Apple would accept Office on the iPad in a heartbeat. I would imagine that there's a team at Microsoft looking at it right now - and if they decide to proceed, Apple would welcome it with open arms. What's really preventing Office on the iPad is 20+ years of crud in the Office software package. It would take Microsoft years to rebuild the package into a clean, efficient package that would run well on this device. I just don't see it happening.


Here's a hint for you: the iPad isn't a full blown computer and won't be used the same way. It will not replace laptops (or even netbooks, for that matter). If you need a laptop, carry a laptop. The iPad is for people who have tasks that don't require a laptop.

Your complaint is the same as saying that my Corvette is no good because you can't haul a ton of mulch in it.


That's crazy. You obviously haven't used iWork. iWork is not designed to duplicate 100% of the functionality of Microsoft Office. It's for the overwhelming majority of people who only use 2% of the functions in Office and the other 98% just slow things down. I'm a busy executive and when I write a document, I don't need flashing lights and twisted banners. I need to write and edit the document with a minimum of functions. It is the CONTENT that matters, not the glitz. For the overwhelming majority of users, iWork provides 100% of everything they need. For the tiny percentage who need more than iWork offers, they're going to need Office. It's called market segmentation.


I really wish people would understand. You want a full keyboard. Someone else wants Flash. Someone else wants Microsoft Office. Someone else wants to be able to play first person shoot-em-up games. When you start making a device to make everyone happy, it quickly becomes impractical. Apple set out to create a new device that looks like it's going to be a huge hit by all standards. It won't do everything, but great devices rarely do.

Oh, and btw, I'll bet you that it's just a matter of time before there's an iPad app which allows you to take handwritten notes and either convert them on the fly or send them to your desktop computer for OCR.


That's nice. So she's one of the 0.02% of people who can't live with Numbers. The iPad (and iWork) aren't for everyone. Isn't it nice to have a choice?

Overall I am happy with the choice of iPhone OS for the iPad. (So will it become the iPad OS or will we still call it the iPhone OS?) My only complaint has to do with the limited input options, i.e. TOUCH ONLY. I truly feel that an option to allow for stylus input would have truly given the iPad more options...ESPECIALLY...when it is released in Asia. If Apple had offered a stylus input for East Asian languages such as Japanese, Korean and Chinese (and others), I would have been a first-gen buyer on DAY ONE. As it is now, we are still limited to keyboard input for Japanese. Trying to input a 13+ stroke kanji with an iPhone is insane.

WHY APPLE WHY could you have not provided stylus input and support with the iPad? When people don't take into consideration that the larger number of internet users in the world are Chinese and that the most widely used language on the internet in the next five years will be Chinese (Mandarin), they are making a mistake. This type of ethnocentric thinking really will put a damper on the future expansion of the iPad...or it will require a localized version (stupid stupid stupid) of the hardware/software.

I hope Apple can fix this shortcoming in the near future.

There are capacitance styli you can buy, but there is an issue with the capacitance sensors not working well with a very fine tip while being great for a much fatter finger for input.

Actually I wonder how much more battery life you would get if you removed the DVD drive on a Macbook Pro and replaced that dead space with extra batteries. 11 hours battery life anyone?

Get one of these!



C.

Forum etiquette, please create hyperlinks to huge images.

Sorry - I thought it was a small image! It's easy to forget how large a 2megapixel image is.
Changed it now.

C.

Forum etiquette,??

are you nuts dude
he showing a picture of stolen apple SW
carni seemed so cool
now i see he is a only lowly low class f..ing thief .

no soup for either one of you guys

I don't believe that the iPad paradigm will instantly replace laptop and desktop computers as we know them today.

However the concepts and deliverables in the iPad point the way to what will eventually replace laptop and desktop computers as we know them today... much as the introduction of the Mac in 1984 lead to universal adaption of the mouse/GUi.

People assert that the iPad/Mobile OS X is not capable of running this or that desktop or power app. That is true for now. But, recall that the original 1984 Mac came with just 2 apps: MacWrite and MacPaint-- and it changed the world.

The iPad will come with some "best-of-class" apps that will redefine how computer apps are written, how to interface users, and how to realize productivity.

Sure, the iPad/Mobile OS X paradigm doesn't have the heft to run Photoshop, Final Cut Studio, Microsoft Office... but neither did the 1984 Mac (Do the name Kensch Rutha strike a familiar note?).

Sure, the iPad/Mobile OS X paradigm doesn't support elementary task switching or user-app multi-tasking... but neither did the 1984 Mac (Remember Switcher?)


That doesn't mean that someone out there won't look at Photoshop, Final Cut or whatever and figure out:

1) what 90% of the users need
2) how to implement it to fit the paradigm (easy, intuitive, in-your-face, short attention-span, productive)
3) how to make a profit doing it


Actually, it appears that Apple has primed the pump with the Photos and iWork apps!

Can GarageBand be far behind?


Do you think that Apple is going to restrict this new paradigm to underpowered, battery-only, portable devices?


Savvy developers will see the opportunity to rethink and re-implement their existing apps, eliminate bloat and cruft and deliver on the promise of this new paradigm!

*

HOw do you know the disc was stolen? Installing it on unapproved HW is a violation of the EULA but it's not stealing.

The interesting thing is that MacOS X runs okay on this class of hardware. But I don't think Apple will every make such a device.

And interestingly, I don't ever really use it. Whereas I think I *would* use a tablet.

My main machine is Mac Pro, and that is my primary work machine. And I have a MacBook Pro for when I visit clients or If I need to run Windows.

I got the Netbook because I thought it would be good to have a lightweight machine I could toss into a bag and not worry about. But to make the machine useable I added a big battery. The keyboard is cramped, the trackpad is awkward, and the screen size is a problem for some software. For serious work it is sub optimal. And for casual use (Media or Web browsing) it is worse.

So yes, I broke the EULA. But morally, I don't think anyone was harmed by this experiment. Not least Apple. The experiment directly resulted in me buying yet another MacBook Pro for my daughter.

So why does this netbook gather dust? I think Jobs was right when he said that netbooks are not better at anything.

C.

Please don't call me a thief. Nothing stolen here. No counting the netbook, this is a seven Mac household.

C.

I've built plenty of Hacintoshes. While they run great compared to other versions of Windows on a netbook it's patently clear that these machines are not ideal for a desktop OSes designed for faster machines with larger displays.

The Apple fanboy brainwash has started....! Maybe Mac OS X isn't THE solution for iPad but that doesn't mean iPhone OS is adequate... How about having a bunch of widgets that run on the desktop where I can access things in a hurry.. Dont give me reasons why this is not possible.. If Apple makes a product which does small things like that, I will gladly buy one.

...yawn
The iPhone simulator runs my fart app on my Mac. Visibly my Mac is running iPhone OS, which may as well be a topic for quarter long trolling storm.

That said, the iPad UI is surely underdesigned. What it actually is has been created for a phone and has been indisputable perfect for a phone. The pad should have had tabbed bookmark-oriented interface; animations should have resembled turning pages. Which would make it really classy

I agree, technical people in general seem to have a blind spot when thinking about Apples technology.
Whats hindering them is that:
1. they are not visually oriented; why use a graphical user interface at all, if you can use some obscure key combination to do the same 'a lot faster'
2. they are not sensitive to aesthetics. It doesn't mater if the icon is a god awful array of badly arranged pixels, if it is recognizable it is good enough.
3. they think that all big commercial company's are bad. In the end it doesn't matter if its Apple or Microsoft or Google. No matter what the argument is or how much the history (and criminal behavior ) differs.
4. they are extremely sensitive to conspiracy theory's. If Apple introduces a new technology it must be because they want to rip off the public. No mater (again) what the technical argument is. If Apple poses some restriction, like for example not 'allowing' flash on the iPhone, it must be because Apple wants to hinder them. Pointing out to them that there are several very valid technical reasons to do so results in an almost emotional response that all technical arguments could be valid (they don't agree on any one of them of course) but that they are not the main reason, Apple just wants to restrict people to be able to sell them the unrestricted version later on.
5. after years of struggle they reluctantly use a GUI because they have to. But - to them - the commandline is still the best way to do things. But a touch interface, what in the name of god, is the big deal? Pointing out that touch does make a big difference, like 3D does for movies, is to no avail. Perhaps, they are right, touch doesn't make a difference for them, because they lack feeling.
6. they think that all software must be open to inspect and modify. If it isn't, only bad intentions can account for that. No mater if you point out that (for example) security and development cost are valid reasons to do so. They argue that if you cant handle security you shouldn't use a computer (computer use should be restricted to experts only), and software should be given away freely even if they earn their money from a firm that sells such restricted software.
7. they know best. Without even a hint of realization that their view on software and hardware is only a fraction of all possible views on the subject matter.

I could go on.

J.

My father in law uses a white MacBook circa 2007, his first non-1995ish Windose machine, and while he loves it, it is STILL too much computer for him.

On the PC's he had, he was able to: E-Mail, Browse (when he could get online), and occasionally burn CDs with pictures on them.

Since getting the MacBook, he's learned to: Use iPhoto (and Smart albums!), Use iDVD (couldn't believe it), Use Facebook and play Facebook Games, connect to a TV for slideshows and videos, and manage his finances with QuickBooks.

I'm really proud of him. But he's still only scratched the surface, and is still afraid to go deeper because he lacks that raw understanding of what the computer can/should do. He told me the other day that he sat and watched the beachball spin for 2.5 hours before calling my wife who told him to hold down the power button....

....This is who the iPad is designed for. I can't wait to buy and show him one. He'll still probably want to use iPhoto for organizing the thousands of photos he takes, but when he sees that he can plug in his camera and boom his recent photos are on a gorgeous 10" touchable display, with customizable slideshows (his fav), he'll be sold right there.

When he sees he can play and touch Bejeweled Blitz on that big screen, he'll probably not let me take mine home.

There is about 90% chance that the iPad has Dashboard, a Mac OSX feature, built in, and will be announced on or close to launch.

Basically, a limited selection (or possibly complete) of widgets that are simple yet informative and powerful that can be called up from anywhere, at any time, possibly with the use of a 4 or 5 finger gesture.

Picture using any app, then placing all 5 finger tips of one hand on the screen and "closing" them together. Dashboard activates, just like on the Mac. There you have your Calc, Weather, World Clock(s), Dictionary, Stocks, whatever you want. One touch outside of a widget returns to the App underneath.

Again, about a 90% chance we hear official word on this in the next 3 weeks.

What should be available and is easilly possible is file downloads. Why the hell should I have to use my Mac to DL ANY file? When I had my iPod Touch jailbroken, it was awesome to be working on my machine at work and downloading .rar files, .zip files, .dmg files, etc. But you can't do that natively and it wouldn't take ANYTHING away from the UX. Considering you can already "dl" data, as in view web pages and get email. It makes no sense I can't DL files on the go to put on my Mac when I get home.

Your argument that fingers don't work well for pointing at objects in high resolution OS environments is a straw man.

If fingers are incapable of accurately pointing at desktop/laptop OS objects on screen, then how does any laptop with a trackpad function?

You've created a false dichotomy between using a desktop OS and using a finger to point at objects.

Apple, themselves, have crafted an admirable solution with their multitouch trackpad interfaces on their laptop devices. If Apple engineers can create a functional on screen keyboard for the iPad, surely they could create an on screen trackpad, too, that would allow finer resolution pointing when required.

There may be many reasons for Apple to prefer the iPhone OS for the iPad - notably thousands of apps in the App Store - but an inability to point at objects with one's finger is not among them.

Mr. Dilger has me convinced. There's NO WAY the brilliant minds at Apple could have made OSX work on the iPad. All of those issues like small icons and font size could never be addressed in OSX. And all those "elements" like the dock and a menu bar that would get in the way and make it impossible to use! - of course, the iPad has a dock and top bar, and apps have their own top bars, and some apps (like the racing game in the pic provided) don't even run truly full screen, but Mr. Dilger has made an amazing argument that these things are totally OK on the iPad and would just be awful if it were OSX.

Btw that whole thing about how OSX normally uses a mouse pointer, and therefore couldn't possibly be transformed into a touch interface is the nail in the coffin for OSX.

I just hope that the iPad is more open than the iPhone. I would like to be able to share files between my MacBook Pro and my iPhone without having to get a 3rd party app (even if it's free) or jump through hoops. I hope this is address with the iPad.

I have a MacBook, which I love and use at work, even though the rest of the company are Microsoft, I will buy a iPad, but I also own a Netbook, but it is running OS X. I use it when I am on the road and need my emails and there is no Wi-Fi available.

I am currently sitting on a train and the iPad would be ideal, rather than having my MacBook on the table, just so I can surf the net and catch up on a few emails.

But a small laptop with a built in SIM card is ideal in those situations when I need it and is much better than typing on a screen for longer work related emails.

If Apple made one of these I would buy it as well.

It's not so much the lack of a full OS that's bothersome insofar as this is the first Apple computer that comes with the restrictions and locks usually reserved for an iPhone. Can you imagine only being allowed to get software for your mac from one outlet run by Apple?That's exactly what Apple is demanding of iPad users.

As for Flash...would have been nice for a device that's supposed to be more light laptop than iPhone but the reasons are valid. It will be the first time though, that I think, most of the public will really notice the lack of Flash support on Apple's devices.