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Apple sues HTC for alleged infringement of 20 iPhone patents

post #1 of 279
Thread Starter 
Apple on Tuesday filed a lawsuit against rival handset maker HTC over the alleged infringement of 20 patents related to the iPhone's user interface, underlying architecture and hardware [updated with specific patents].

The suit was officially filed with the U.S. International Trade Commission and in a U.S. District Court in Delaware. Apple announced the lawsuit in a press release.

"We can sit by and watch competitors steal our patented inventions, or we can do something about it. We've decided to do something about it," said Apple co-founder Steve Jobs. "We think competition is healthy, but competitors should create their own original technology, not steal ours."

Update: Revealed in the lawsuit are the patents in question. They are entitled:
No. 7,362,331: "Time-Based, Non-Constant Translation Of User Interface Objects Between States"
No. 7,479,949: "Touch Screen Device, Method, And Graphical User Interface For Determining Commands By Applying Heuristics"
No. 7,657,849: "Unlocking A Device By Performing Gestures On An Unlock Image"
No. 7,469,381: "List Scrolling And Document Translation, Scaling, And Rotation On A Touch-Screen Display"
No. 5,920,726: "System And Method For Managing Power Conditions Within A Digital Camera Device"
No. 7,633,076: "Automated Response To And Sensing Of User Activity In Portable Devices"
No. 5,848,105: "GMSK Signal Processors For Improved Communications Capacity And Quality"
No. 7,383,453: "Conserving Power By Reducing Voltage Supplied To An Instruction-Processing Portion Of A Processor"
No. 5,455,599: "Object-Oriented Graphic System"
No. 6,424,354: "Object-Oriented Event Notification System With Listener Registration Of Both Interests And Methods"
No. 5,481,721: "Method For Providing Automatic And Dynamic Translation Of Object Oriented Programming Language-Based Message Passing Into Operating System Message Passing Using Proxy Objects"
No. 5,519,867: "Object-Oriented Multitasking System"
No. 5,566,337: "Method And Apparatus For Distributing Events In An Operating System"
No. 5,929,852: "Encapsulated Network Entity Reference Of A Network Component System"
No. 5,946,647: "System And Method For Performing An Action On A Structure In Computer-Generated Data"
No. 5,969,705: "Message Protocol For Controlling A User Interface From An Inactive Application Program"
No. 6,275,983: "Object-Oriented Operating System"
No. 6,343,263: "Real-Time Signal Processing System For Serially Transmitted Data"
No. 5,915,131: "Method And Apparatus For Handling I/O Requests Utilizing Separate Programming Interfaces To Access Separate I/O Service"
No. RE39,486: "Extensible, Replaceable Network Component System"
While HTC primarily makes handsets running Windows Mobile, the company has also made a number of high-profile phones based on the Google Android mobile operating system. In addition to the first Android phone, the G1, HTC was also behind the recently released Nexus One, which features multi-touch technology.

The lawsuit is yet another filed with the ITC with Apple's name featured prominently on it. In recent months the iPhone maker has sued Nokia, and is also being sued by the Finnish handset maker. The ITC has agreed to look into both companies' complaints of patent infringement.

The ITC has also begun investigating claims made by Kodak against Apple. The camera company has alleged that Apple is in violation of patents that relate to the previewing of images, and processing them at different resolutions.
post #2 of 279
I'm dying to know exactly what 20 items they stole from Apple. Glass screen? Buttons?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW0DU...layer_embedded
post #3 of 279
Here we go!

"We've patented the hell out of this thing"

Finally! Apple wakes up and takes action.
post #4 of 279
As a shareholder, I am glad Apple is doing something...
It sucks that a few companies like Apple strive to innovate while others just sit by and copy them...
post #5 of 279
Well right off the bat, there's that name. It's starts with H, which is way too similar to i, and that creates confusion in the marketplace.
post #6 of 279
This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I wanto know exactly what it is they claim HTC is stealing from them. I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent. Seriously 20 things?

We desperately need patent reform. So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pionered. Yes, the iPhone was a million times more userfriendly but don't tell me the iPhone would have been possible even without the existance of Windows Mobile and the Orange SPV that broke ground in bringing smartphones to market.

My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. If the iPhone OS 4 was revolutionary (like the original iPhone) they wouldn't be scared.

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post #7 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

...So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pioneered.

I don't know what you are referring to. If what you say is true, then why would HTC not sue Apple? And if Apple patents things, what would be the purpose of that when they would not enforce it?

Of course there may be some truth in the fact that Apple is not happy with the strong Google/HTC combination, but they can afford good lawyers and wouldn't start a lawsuit it if they knew the outcome would not be in their favor.
post #8 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I wanto know exactly what it is they claim HTC is stealing from them. I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent. Seriously 20 things?

We desperately need patent reform. So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pionered. Yes, the iPhone was a million times more userfriendly but don't tell me the iPhone would have been possible even without the existance of Windows Mobile and the Orange SPV that broke ground in bringing smartphones to market.

My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. If the iPhone OS 4 was revolutionary (like the original iPhone) they wouldn't be scared.

Appleis scared of Android?
Check yor meds buddy.... it's time.
post #9 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I can 100% guarantee that Apple's patents have absolutely nothing to do with HTC's rendition of Windows Mobile.
post #10 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by wbrasington View Post

Appleis scared of Android?
Check yor meds buddy.... it's time.

Personal attacks, nice!

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post #11 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I wanto know exactly what it is they claim HTC is stealing from them. I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent. Seriously 20 things?

We desperately need patent reform. So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pionered. Yes, the iPhone was a million times more userfriendly but don't tell me the iPhone would have been possible even without the existance of Windows Mobile and the Orange SPV that broke ground in bringing smartphones to market.

My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. If the iPhone OS 4 was revolutionary (like the original iPhone) they wouldn't be scared.

You're partly wrong. We do need patent reform and, yes, the iPhone was built on the shoulders of other tech. No one has said this is about multitouch. We'll have to wait and see but it has been on Android phones for awhile outside of the US. Chances are these are some patents which no one in this forum can wrap their heads around.

I seriously doubt that Apple is worried about Android or WM. Android is more popular in the press than it is in reality and right now WM is vaporware. The press promotes Android because they want to create a storyline of an iPhone rival.

Unless you are an AAPL shareholder, no one should give a damn. If HTC loses, they will find ways around the patent as companies always do.

It is interesting to note now that Apple is now defending their patents since the Nokia situation.
post #12 of 279
The problem is that htc has been making phones for longer then apple has. Apple could get itself into trouble by doing this. Htc could dig up patents that apple is infringing of htc's .

Also what exactly does apple have patented? Touch screens on phones go back a long way. Also other companies have patents on multitouch also .
post #13 of 279
I have a dream... that one of these days sanity will come to the world of Patents. Unfortunately, I don't think Apple will end up on the bright side of the reform.
post #14 of 279
This is great news. It's about time Apple beat a company with the patent stick.
post #15 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I wanto know exactly what it is they claim HTC is stealing from them. I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent. Seriously 20 things?

We desperately need patent reform. So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pionered. Yes, the iPhone was a million times more userfriendly but don't tell me the iPhone would have been possible even without the existance of Windows Mobile and the Orange SPV that broke ground in bringing smartphones to market.

My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. If the iPhone OS 4 was revolutionary (like the original iPhone) they wouldn't be scared.

The only thing scared and stupid is YOU.

Apple doesn't file frivolous law suits. They're too busy making great products, whose patents need to be protected no matter HOW confident they may be about their products and expansion possibilities.

Daniel Swanson

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Daniel Swanson

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post #16 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

When you've been making phones since is a complete red herring as to whether or not you violated a patent.

Quote:
We desperately need patent reform. So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pionered. Yes, the iPhone was a million times more userfriendly but don't tell me the iPhone would have been possible even without the existance of Windows Mobile and the Orange SPV that broke ground in bringing smartphones to market.

Certainly we need patent reform, but you've done nothing to show what this case has to do with patent reform. In fact, we know so precious little about the patents in question, that it would be very hard to argue whether they're the types of patents that allow companies to protect IP while continuing to foster innovation (the ideal behind patents), or the types that are meant to allow you easy access to lawsuits (the bad kind).

Quote:
My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. If the iPhone OS 4 was revolutionary (like the original iPhone) they wouldn't be scared.

I'm sure Apple treats Android and WP7S as competition and is watching them closely, but I disagree that their confidence in their product would or should prevent them from suing. If you made an amazing widget that you were confident and excited in, and someone came along, stole it, and started selling an exact replica down the street from you, no matter how confident you are in your widget's greatness or the next version of your widget, you have a right to protect your original widget.
post #17 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by replicant View Post

As a shareholder, I am glad Apple is doing something...
It sucks that a few companies like Apple strive to innovate while others just sit by and copy them...

If you're a shareholder, fine, but don't make this about morality. It's business. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW0DUg63lqU
post #18 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom1981 View Post

The problem is that htc has been making phones for longer then apple has. Apple could get itself into trouble by doing this. Htc could dig up patents that apple is infringing of htc's .

Also what exactly does apple have patented? Touch screens on phones go back a long way. Also other companies have patents on multitouch also .

You also have to remember that Apple have been in the computer biz since day one. They pretty much invented the UI (albeit initially slightly pilfered), and a phone is just a small computer really.
post #19 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by gFiz View Post

I'm dying to know exactly what 20 items they stole from Apple. Glass screen? Buttons?

most def. the UI element, Pinch off loaf.
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post #20 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roos24 View Post

why would HTC not sue Apple? .


i can almost guarantee we'll see a countersuit.
post #21 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielSW View Post

The only thing scared and stupid is YOU.

Apple doesn't file frivolous law suits. They're too busy making great products, whose patents need to be protected no matter HOW confident they may be about their products and expansion possibilities.

Another personal attack! I don't think i'm stupid. I think my opinions are different obviously.

I think most of the people on here are hypocrites. I didn't see you people so happy when Nokia filled suit for their innovations.

We don't even know what patents HTC has supposedly infringed. But 20 infringements is a bit suspect. Even Multitouch is suspect since Apple didn't invent it, just bought a company who was working on an implementation meanwhile other companies like Microsoft Research were working on the same ideas (that became the Microsoft Surface).

And if it is all Google/Android related then sue Motorola (their Android devices have multitouch in Europe). Or see Google directly. Or sue Microsoft over the Zune HD.

No they have picked the potentially weekest link and sued them. Hardly classy when HTC only includes software that Microsoft or Google approves (beyond HTC Sense). Unless it is 100% HTC Sense they are after, when I don't see how that is anything Apple like or iPhone like.

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post #22 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by str1f3 View Post

If your a shareholder, fine, but don't make this about morality.

It takes much effort to innovate. Many risks are taken. Money, time even relationships gambled.

When companies steal my ideas (which they have on numerous occasions) it's soul destroying, .
It would be so much easier for me to just steal other people ideas, but I do not find that a challenge, and yes IMO it's morally wrong.
post #23 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom1981 View Post

The problem is that htc has been making phones for longer then apple has. A

Meaningless.

Apple introduced the iPhone and suddenly everyone else got busy changing around their UIs, adding capacitive touch screens, you name it.

Apple knows exactly what they're doing in the legal arena. They've dodged any and all antitrust dangers, maintained their iTunes business model, fought off all allegations of corporate wrongdoing (stock-options, etc.) and recently got their OS X EULA upheld, burying Psystar.

Smart money is on Apple.
post #24 of 279
Everyone's suing everyone these days.
post #25 of 279
I keep reading from people posting here that "HTC made phones long before Apple" and using that as evidence that Apple can't sue for patent infringement.

This is pretty tortured logic here. By the same logic, RCA should be suing like crazy. I mean... they made radios long before Sirius. RCA should sue Teh Internets too. All those wacky patent infringing internet radio stations SURELY must be in violation of some RCA patent.

I popped a pimple once. It may or may not have been before Stridex. Maybe I should sue them?

I assume these folks believe we should live in a world of lowest common denominator, garbage, commodity "phones" that do nothing but make simple phone calls over copper wires?
post #26 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent.

That is not just ONE patent.
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post #27 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I wanto know exactly what it is they claim HTC is stealing from them. I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent. Seriously 20 things?

Take a look at the smart phones before iPhone. All had plastic keys. The UI sucked and did not flow well either. bla bla bla.

Quote:
We desperately need patent reform....

Totally. But live in the now. Look at Nokia suing Apple. What a crock. But its the way the world currently works. sorry.

Quote:
My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. .....

Now that is funny. I think its the other way around. Look at iPod, iTunes, iPhone, ..... each time Apple came up with a new product.... it took over the market. Period. iPod 100 million sold by 2007.... iTunes... 10 BILLION sold..... iPhone / touch 75 million sold.

Apple is the largest cell phone seller by profit in the world. Others sell more units... Apple makes more money..

So, take a breath, look objectively, and have a nice day.

Just a thought,
en
post #28 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

We don't even know what patents HTC has supposedly infringed. But 20 infringements is a bit suspect.

If, as you correctly say, we don't know what patents HTC have infringed, how can you possibly say 20 infringements is in any way suspect? Have you checked a list of iPhone patents? Or are you just making stuff up to troll? Judging by your posts in this thread, I suspect the latter. And note how I based my judgment on available facts rather than pull it out of the air.
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post #29 of 279
Note that Apple did nothing against Palm, even though that was a similar situation. Apple *has* decided to go after HTC, though. Seems Apple has a strong position this time.
post #30 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

That is note just ONE patent.

Don't confuse him with facts.
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post #31 of 279
post #32 of 279
Its about freaking time to do something about this. The iPhones unique interface is starting to look generic with all these copies running around.
post #33 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by monstrosity View Post

It takes much effort to innovate. Many risks are taken. Money, time even relationships gambled.

When companies steal my ideas (which they have on numerous occasions) it's soul destroying, .
It would be so much easier for me to just steal other people ideas, but I do not find that a challenge, and yes IMO it's morally wrong.

I'm not arguing against all patents in general but just this case. Apple is large corporation and these are games. Apple has innovated and has taken ideas from others. This is a reality and Jobs himself admitted as much.

Right now, large companies seem to be able to patent anything. This is a major problem.

I feel bad for your situation but this is why the system needs major reform. Existing patents are stomped on and larger businesses always benefit.
post #34 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGuessSo View Post

Well right off the bat, there's that name. It's starts with H, which is way too similar to i, and that creates confusion in the marketplace.

The suit is not over "confusion in the market place," but "architecture, hardware, and human interface" developed by Apple engineers.

Such inventions are protected by US patent law from theft. If HTC does in fact use some or all of the twenty inventions claimed, then they need to pay royalties, just as Apple, Microsoft, Motorola, and every other legitimate manufacturer does for the use of the inventions of others.
post #35 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by knightlie View Post

If, as you correctly say, we don't know what patents HTC have infringed, how can you possibly say 20 infringements is in any way suspect? Have you checked a list of iPhone patents? Or are you just making stuff up to troll? Judging by your posts in this thread, I suspect the latter. And note how I based my judgment on available facts rather than pull it out of the air.

Well the fact that HTC does not make Android or Windows Mobile? The fact that the only software they make is HTC Sense? So it would have to be HTC Sense related which is still suspect since most of the software is quite different to the iPhone and its not like Android itselt isn't also touch friendly, so why not also sue Google.

And if its hardware, then i'm having real difficulties. As most HTC hardware is quite different to the iPhone.

And how am I a troll? Is anyone who has a different opinion about a lawsuit a troll? Because I want patent reform and disagree with the Apple and Nokia lawsuits, I'm a troll. Though I will say I understand Nokia's suit now as they probably believed they would have been sued sooner or later and wanted to use their patents to create some sort of deal.

No, I'm a troll because I got to an Apple site when I own a Macbook Alu, Airport Extreme, iPhone, and Cube G4.

But I see the general trend is to do personal attacks when you disagree with someone on this site. And to have blind love for Apple and not actually think and discuss like adults. Not everything Apple does is perfect or 100% correct.

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post #36 of 279
Apple needs to protect the iPhone at all costs.
post #37 of 279
I would say the entire concept of black background with all major functionality broken down into squarish icons representing "Apps" has been directly stolen from the iPhone by more than just HTC.

I'm glad Apple is doing this. The industry wide patent infringements are why we have no real competition (aka something clearly better than the iPhone/iTunes product), but rather vast me-too attempts that have barely gotten off the ground.

The iPhone is so freaking popular it drives not only its own sales, but sales from the copy cats who want to sell to the cheaper crowd.

Hopefully Apple can force the cost of ownership down in the future, and pave the way for more widespread iPhone adoption.

I don't really care if 40 million or 240 million people have iPhones, as long as other companies do the same kind of real work, research, and development that Apple does to drive competition (REAL competition) through the roof.

All we have seen to date is theft from Apple, and it has done NOTHING to spur Apple to make a better iPhone.
post #38 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Note that Apple did nothing against Palm, even though that was a similar situation. Apple *has* decided to go after HTC, though. Seems Apple has a strong position this time.

Again highly suspect. Palm controls the whole experience, so it would be much more valid to go after them.

I am guessing that Apple has done research and sees that Palm has patents they care about but probably most of HTC's prior work was Windows Mobile and Microsoft probably owns those patents.

HTC could use that as a defence though, unless Apple has already cross licensed with Palm they could argue that they are selectively enforcing their patents.

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post #39 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

This is stupid. HTC has been making phones since 2002. In fact I have their first ever Windows Smartphone the Orange SPV.

I wanto know exactly what it is they claim HTC is stealing from them. I wouldn't be suprised if it has to do with the Nexus One getting Multitouch though. But that is only one patent. Seriously 20 things?

We desperately need patent reform. So much of the iPhone was taken from what HTC, Nokia has pionered. Yes, the iPhone was a million times more userfriendly but don't tell me the iPhone would have been possible even without the existance of Windows Mobile and the Orange SPV that broke ground in bringing smartphones to market.

My opinion: Apple is just scared of the future of Android and WP7S. If they were confident about their product and their expansion possibilities they would not sue. If the iPhone OS 4 was revolutionary (like the original iPhone) they wouldn't be scared.

Your opinion doesn't seem to be worth much. You're just making a lot of angry unsupported statements here and throwing in some guesses for good measure. It's much more likely the patents are related to concrete things like the multi-touch implementation.

Despite what you rave about above, multi-billion dollar corporations hardly ever engage in expensive lawsuits over emotional, high-school bitchy-ness. Mostly folks grow out of such things before they even get hired for the company, let alone end up running it.

Apple also was finally granted it's trademarks last week, which means that they have a lock on the "look" of the iPhone as well. I don't think they are HTC phones, but I've seen several handsets that look far too close to the iPhone to not be infringing on the trademark.
post #40 of 279
Hi, my name is Sue, how do you do!*

But seriously folks, I've been a Mac owner and lover since 1985 and am sick and tired of copycats. The thing that Apple has going for it is innovation, creativity, quality, and service. The copycats have, well they have copies of the real thing, complete with flaws, foibles, shoddy workmanship, and disservice to the creative process. Sue the bastards!, probably won't put the command line interface back on desktops all over the world again, but...





*(for you you youngsters out there, it's an old Johnny Cash song, well worth the listen)
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