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Apple sues HTC for alleged infringement of 20 iPhone patents - Page 7

post #241 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superbass View Post

If you include computers, software, ipods, peripherals, songs, etc. etc.

Not if you compare profit made on telephones vs. profits made my nokia or ericsson or motorola or HTC or etc. etc. on telephones.

That statement by Stevie was pretty loaded. But I guess you went for it....

But if you take it that "Apple is the largest company that sells cellphones", that statement is probably true.
post #242 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by SactoMan01 View Post

I'd suggest you look up the US v. United Shoe Machinery Company cases. That was a classic case where United Shoe held a number of critical patents on shoemaking machinery, and they used to patents to effectively shut out competition. Apple's marketshare on "smart" cellphones has reached the point that suits like what they're trying to do against HTC could be construed as violating antitrust laws because Apple effectively wants to prevent competition from Android-based touchscreen cellphones.

Apple's market share of the smartphone industry is in the teens.

They just happen to be in the market segment that covers 70% of the profits.
post #243 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

If the problem is the refresh cycle, wouldn't it make more sense to increase the refresh cycle?

Yeah but why have a 3-6month refresh cycle?

Most customers can't upgrade for 18-24months, so you end up with a ton of stale hardware sat on shelves and wasted time and effort on R&D
post #244 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Apple's market share of the smartphone industry is in the teens.

They just happen to be in the market segment that covers 70% of the profits.

Apple just three years ago had essentially ZERO presence in the cellphone market. The iPhone is one of the highest growth products for the company, and within a few years could reach over 30% of all new "smart" cellphones sold out there.

I do think the Feds and possibly EU antitrust authorities should start being concerned because Apple's lawsuit against HTC is essentially a lawsuit by proxy against the Google Android cellphone operating system, trying to not only intimidate HTC but also LG, NOKIA, Samsung and Sony Ericcson (the four biggest cellphone makers in the world) and by proxy Google, too. Given the US v. United Shoe Machinery Company cases I cited earlier, Apple is effectively trying to use patent laws to prevent competition, a big no-no according to the Sherman Antitrust Act.
post #245 of 279
It's only a matter of time. Just wait. If anybody thinks the Europeans are going to sit back and watch Nokia get decimated they are fooling themselves. The way I see it, with every patent suit that Apple brings (particularly related to iPhone patents) and wins, the closer they bring themselves to the magical threshold for anti-trust action against themselves.
post #246 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

The way I see it, with every patent suit that Apple brings (particularly related to iPhone patents) and wins, the closer they bring themselves to the magical threshold for anti-trust action against themselves.

There has to be some wrongdoing for there to be any antitrust action. If Apple has truly been victimized, they've simply defended their patents successfully. If a good chunk of the competition victimized Apple, their liability to suffer consequences is incidental.
post #247 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by tawilson View Post

Yeah but why have a 3-6month refresh cycle?

Most customers can't upgrade for 18-24months, so you end up with a ton of stale hardware sat on shelves and wasted time and effort on R&D

I think there are two theories. One is that it reduces the "oldness" of the last model. I wouldn't buy an iPhone in April because 1) it is 9/10-months old technology and 2) the new one is coming. But if there were models in May and Nov, the max age of the old model is only 4/5-months, so I might be more willing to buy it even though the new one is coming.

The other theory is that you can get more marketing mileage out of "NEW", even if it isn't that much "newer" than the previous model.

Personally, I think Apple could work it its big software release in June, but follow it with another not-as-big-but-still-significant software release in Jan/Feb. This year and last, there's not been much in any of the .x point releases.
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post #248 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by SactoMan01 View Post

Apple just three years ago had essentially ZERO presence in the cellphone market. The iPhone is one of the highest growth products for the company, and within a few years could reach over 30% of all new "smart" cellphones sold out there.

I do think the Feds and possibly EU antitrust authorities should start being concerned because Apple's lawsuit against HTC is essentially a lawsuit by proxy against the Google Android cellphone operating system, trying to not only intimidate HTC but also LG, NOKIA, Samsung and Sony Ericcson (the four biggest cellphone makers in the world) and by proxy Google, too. Given the US v. United Shoe Machinery Company cases I cited earlier, Apple is effectively trying to use patent laws to prevent competition, a big no-no according to the Sherman Antitrust Act.

Well, Nokia is still about 40% of the smartphone market, so if Apple got to 30%, well, they'd still be less!

And Nokia has already filed a patent suit against other cellphone makers (uh, that would be Apple). So if what you say is valid, why haven't there been any rumblings abut the Feds and EU antitrust authorities going after them? Isn't Nokia using patent laws to prevent competition? Or is it because what you're saying is nonsense - as neither Nokia or Apple are anywhere near monopolies.

Or maybe, there are just special rules dreamed up for Apple.
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post #249 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

It's only a matter of time. Just wait. If anybody thinks the Europeans are going to sit back and watch Nokia get decimated they are fooling themselves. The way I see it, with every patent suit that Apple brings (particularly related to iPhone patents) and wins, the closer they bring themselves to the magical threshold for anti-trust action against themselves.

And as I said above, then that should apply to Nokia too, shouldn't it?

Especially since Nokia's patents are even more basic to cellphones, including smartphones.
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post #250 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Exactly what is it that Apple is copying? If it's happening "like crazy", it should be easy to give lots of examples with info to back it up.

Nokia's lawsuit against Apple is a recent example. Apple blatantly ripped off Nokia's IP. And that's just a small part of it. The technologies needed to build a modern phone are patented, and Apple simply trampled all over other people's IP when entering the market.
post #251 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

And when Apple has lost, they've paid up.

No way! Do you really think they have a choice?
post #252 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

So the only reason to protect one's IP is to make life difficult for competitors?

No, but in this case, that's exactly what it is about. The proof is in the pudding.

Quote:
And by going after HTC, Apple is really going after other manufacturers is some odd, circuitous fashion that has nothing to do with actually protecting one's property, selling products or HTC?

No, they want to attack Android because they see Android as a huge threat.

Quote:
By that logic then you could say the creation of the iPhone was because Apple wanted to make life difficult for manufacturers who want to sell phones.

Not at all.

And let's not forget Apple's shameful and disgusting behavior in the W3C, blocking the progress of open standards with frivolous patent claims! Apple is clearly feeling the heat, and are becoming desperate.
post #253 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Nokia's lawsuit against Apple is a recent example. Apple blatantly ripped off Nokia's IP. And that's just a small part of it. The technologies needed to build a modern phone are patented, and Apple simply trampled all over other people's IP when entering the market.

Examples, please?
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post #254 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by SactoMan01 View Post

Apple just three years ago had essentially ZERO presence in the cellphone market. The iPhone is one of the highest growth products for the company, and within a few years could reach over 30% of all new "smart" cellphones sold out there.

I do think the Feds and possibly EU antitrust authorities should start being concerned because Apple's lawsuit against HTC is essentially a lawsuit by proxy against the Google Android cellphone operating system, trying to not only intimidate HTC but also LG, NOKIA, Samsung and Sony Ericcson (the four biggest cellphone makers in the world) and by proxy Google, too. Given the US v. United Shoe Machinery Company cases I cited earlier, Apple is effectively trying to use patent laws to prevent competition, a big no-no according to the Sherman Antitrust Act.

Apple's certainly not trying to stifle competition, they're trying to protect their intellectual property. Apple spent 10 years and billions of dollars to develop the iPod/iPhone/iPad and to simply let others cherry pick what they want is ridiculous.

Sure, companies borrow and are influenced by others' designs, that's just the way everything works. BUT, when one sees blatant and direct copies of the iPhone, down to the the shape, color and surface finishes, even the home screen and icons and other interface elements... it's a wonder that Apple waited so long to go after the thieves.
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post #255 of 279
insike - seriously do you even know what the Nokia suit and the Apple counter suit are about?? Any idea? At ALL?? Before running around like a witless numbnut - do just the smallest attempt at understanding the situation you reference - here let me help you:

Nokia has filed suit (and lodged a complaint with the International Trade Commission (ITC)) against Apple for what they claim is infringement by Apple of ten patents Nokia has applied to various mobile (under GSM/UMTS) and WiFi standards. Nokia has provided licensing of these patents under a standards pooling agreement the terms of which are fair and reasonable licensing terms to any company that wishes to use it and pay the established licensing fees, or in some cases, completely free and open.

Apple's countersuit and counter complaint with the ITC against Nokia claims infringement of 13 of Apple's patents and charges Nokia with not only demanding higher licensing fees for the ten standards-related patents from Apple but also demanding access to Apple's proprietary patents as a part of its own licensing terms with Apple.

The issues and allegations are plain - Nokia wants Apple to pay above and beyond the "fair, reasonable and non-discrimintory" fees required by being part of the patent pool for GSM technologies, up to and including proprietary patents that Apple holds that are of interest to Nokia.

You can in fact look at Apple's countersuit here: http://www.docstoc.com/docs/19291155...s=ZTY0Yy00OWE4

Now stop being silly and deal with the actual facts
post #256 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

It's only a matter of time. Just wait. If anybody thinks the Europeans are going to sit back and watch Nokia get decimated they are fooling themselves. The way I see it, with every patent suit that Apple brings (particularly related to iPhone patents) and wins, the closer they bring themselves to the magical threshold for anti-trust action against themselves.

Remember what I said: Apple's market growth for new cellphones has been spectacular, and they could approaching 1/3 of the entire world's market for "smart" cellphones within two years.

There's a famous quote from an early Spider-Man comic, "With great power comes great responsibility." Apple now wields tremendous influence in the cellphone market, but it needs to act as a responsible corporation with such a fast-growing market share. Apple in its suit against HTC is essentially a "shot across the bow" against Google and the four major cellphone manufacturers--LG, Nokia, Samsung and Sony Ericsson--in an attempt to stop the widespread distribution of "smart" touchscreen cellphones based on Google Android cellphone OS. That is approaching the point of potential patent abuse to eliminate a potential competitor, and I don't think Google, the four cellphone manufacturers I mentioned, or antitrust authorities in the USA and the EU will stand by idly!
post #257 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Nokia's lawsuit against Apple is a recent example. Apple blatantly ripped off Nokia's IP. And that's just a small part of it. The technologies needed to build a modern phone are patented, and Apple simply trampled all over other people's IP when entering the market.

I guess you didn't bother to read any part of that suit, and is just mouthing some nonsense picked up from the Internet.

If you had read it, you'd know that Apple claims that Nokia is attempting to charge Apple (and only Apple) higher rates than it's charging others for use of its patented technology, AND that Nokia's not allowed to do this since they submitted this technology to a standards body to be included in the GSM Standards, which requires that they offer licensing on a Fair, Reasonable and Non Discriminatory (FRAND) basis. Thus, Apple has refused to agree to pay the higher rates. And that's why Nokia sued.

Apple made it very clear that they are willing to pay FRAND rates - so that there is no intent to "rip off Nokia's IP."
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post #258 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by SactoMan01 View Post

Remember what I said: Apple's market growth for new cellphones has been spectacular, and they could approaching 1/3 of the entire world's market for "smart" cellphones within two years.

There's a famous quote from an early Spider-Man comic, "With great power comes great responsibility." Apple now wields tremendous influence in the cellphone market, but it needs to act as a responsible corporation with such a fast-growing market share. Apple in its suit against HTC is essentially a "shot across the bow" against Google and the four major cellphone manufacturers--LG, Nokia, Samsung and Sony Ericsson--in an attempt to stop the widespread distribution of "smart" touchscreen cellphones based on Google Android cellphone OS. That is approaching the point of potential patent abuse to eliminate a potential competitor, and I don't think Google, the four cellphone manufacturers I mentioned, or antitrust authorities in the USA and the EU will stand by idly!

You still haven't answered why your assertion doesn't apply to Nokia, who has an even larger market share and sued Apple first.

Until you do, I see no reason to entertain any other assertions you make.
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post #259 of 279
The end result of the Apple vs Nokia & Apple vs HTC cases will be the same. A cross-licensing agreement and maybe some other shared technologies.
post #260 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Outsider View Post

The end result of the Apple vs Nokia & Apple vs HTC cases will be the same. A cross-licensing agreement and maybe some other shared technologies.

A rational post at last!

Many people see these patent disputes as corporate warfare.

When as often as not, this is how large companies exchange their intellectual DNA.

It's not so much war. More a sort of clumsy mating.

C.
post #261 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffharris View Post

Examples, please?

You just quoted the post where I mentioned Nokia.
post #262 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by masternav View Post

insike - seriously do you even know what the Nokia suit and the Apple counter suit are about?? Any idea? At ALL??

Yes, as a matter of fact.

Quote:
The issues and allegations are plain - Nokia wants Apple to pay above and beyond the "fair, reasonable and non-discrimintory" fees required by being part of the patent pool for GSM technologies, up to and including proprietary patents that Apple holds that are of interest to Nokia.

No, this is false. FRAND applies to the other companies who added their patents to the GSM patent pool. Apple did no such thing, but wanted special treatment. Despite not having contributed, they wanted to get away with not having to pay up for the IP they blatantly stole.

Other mobile manufacturers are cross-licensing patents. Apple refused to. Apple also refused to pay up. Apple blatantly stole Nokia's IP. Nokia sued Apple for their theft of IP.
post #263 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

If you had read it, you'd know that Apple claims that Nokia is attempting to charge Apple (and only Apple) higher rates than it's charging others for use of its patented technology, AND that Nokia's not allowed to do this since they submitted this technology to a standards body to be included in the GSM Standards, which requires that they offer licensing on a Fair, Reasonable and Non Discriminatory (FRAND) basis. Thus, Apple has refused to agree to pay the higher rates. And that's why Nokia sued.

See the post above:

Apple did no such thing, but wanted special treatment. Despite not having contributed, they wanted to get away with not having to pay up for the IP they blatantly stole.

Other mobile manufacturers are cross-licensing patents. Apple refused to. Apple also refused to pay up. Apple blatantly stole Nokia's IP. Nokia sued Apple for their theft of IP.

Quote:
Apple made it very clear that they are willing to pay FRAND rates - so that there is no intent to "rip off Nokia's IP."

The problem is that if Apple never contributed to the GSM patent pool, but still wanted to have the exact same terms as companies that did, leaving other companies at a huge disadvantage. Simply put: Apple wanted special treatment, and didn't give a crap about stealing the IP of other companies.
post #264 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

See the post above:

Apple did no such thing, but wanted special treatment. Despite not having contributed, they wanted to get away with not having to pay up for the IP they blatantly stole.

That's false. Are you just trying to bullshit your way through this?

If Apple isn't supposed to get FRAND rates when they haven't contributed to the patent pool, they'd be laughed out of court for even bringing it up.

Instead, I'm laughing at you.
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post #265 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Outsider View Post

The end result of the Apple vs Nokia & Apple vs HTC cases will be the same. A cross-licensing agreement and maybe some other shared technologies.

Probably no cross-licensing in Apple vs Nokia, as Nokia is in the wrong by asking for more money from Apple than from any other manufacturers.

Remember, Apple WANTS to pay Nokia the money they are entitled to (which happens to be less than Nokia is DEMANDING).
post #266 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Well, Nokia is still about 40% of the smartphone market, so if Apple got to 30%, well, they'd still be less!

Apple don't care about selling fewer units than Nokia. They care about making more profits. (as a commercial entity, they should).

So when will Apple pass Nokia in terms of profits?

Sometime in the middle of last year.

C.
post #267 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

By that reasoning no one should ever seek legal redress for having their innovations copied. They should just "compete in the market" against, well, effectively themselves, since anyone should be free to do wholesale cloning of whatever seems to be popular.

Hope you felt that way when Nokia launched its suit. After all, they're entitled to protect their IP too (yes, I do know what the dispute is about...just saying). Some lawsuits are just plain stupid and are not done to protect IP but just to hinder the opposition. It's clear which category this (and Nokia's lawsuit) falls under. Heck, there are patents here that are in dispute with Nokia and embroiled in the courts on that front.

I sincerely hope Apple get's back to making great products as opposed to going patent crazy and deciding that the best way to compete is just to sue everybody else.
post #268 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

There has to be some wrongdoing for there to be any antitrust action. If Apple has truly been victimized, they've simply defended their patents successfully. If a good chunk of the competition victimized Apple, their liability to suffer consequences is incidental.

At the current moment, yes, there has been no wrongdoing. Despite the fact that some of these patents shouldn't have been awarded for being so broad in the first place, they were and Apple has the right to sue.

However, you can clearly see a precedent that can form here. If Apple wins, then they can use this case as leverage against the contracted hardware manufacturers for its competitors across the board. Take out the competitor's ability to actually manufacture and sell their software on a smartphone, and you essentially kill their business. And that's when you get into the antitrust action.

I personally hope that Steve Jobs and Apple don't get power crazy to that point and everyone can happily settle out of court.
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post #269 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimateKylie View Post

I think most of the people on here are hypocrites. I didn't see you people so happy when Nokia filled suit for their innovations.

We don't even know what patents HTC has supposedly infringed. But 20 infringements is a bit suspect. Even Multitouch is suspect since Apple didn't invent it, just bought a company who was working on an implementation meanwhile other companies like Microsoft Research were working on the same ideas (that became the Microsoft Surface).

And if it is all Google/Android related then sue Motorola (their Android devices have multitouch in Europe). Or see Google directly. Or sue Microsoft over the Zune HD.

No they have picked the potentially weekest link and sued them. Hardly classy when HTC only includes software that Microsoft or Google approves (beyond HTC Sense). Unless it is 100% HTC Sense they are after, when I don't see how that is anything Apple like or iPhone like.

<<<<< This.

What's going to happen here eventually is HTC, LG, Nokia, Samsung, Kodak, Motorola and Google are going to pull together and freaking demolish the most over-rated, over-priced and over-branded corporation we've ever seen much to the dismay of their sycophantic fan base. If you know anything about computers and technology and pricing you'd stay the hell away from Apple. Lockdown, money money money and more lockdown.

I certainly wouldn't call Microsoft any better but just as was said above HTC is an easy target and much more of an innovator than Apple. The only thing the other companies lack that Apple have is brand power plain and simple, it's nothing to do with innovation and if people are too stupid to step back and see this then they can mosey on being overcharged for underpowered hardware in pretty cases, targeted at people too dumb to use more than one mouse button (until absurdly recently) who can only relate to technology through personification of it via teletubby ads.

Imagine what would be left of the iPhone if Google pulled their support? Bye bye maps, bye bye search, by bye youtube bye bye internet. Bye bye crApple. Apple want to prey that Google don't get involved in this.

Man I'm disproportionately cross about the whole thing.
post #270 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

Hope you felt that way when Nokia launched its suit. After all, they're entitled to protect their IP too (yes, I do know what the dispute is about...just saying). Some lawsuits are just plain stupid and are not done to protect IP but just to hinder the opposition. It's clear which category this (and Nokia's lawsuit) falls under. Heck, there are patents here that are in dispute with Nokia and embroiled in the courts on that front.

I sincerely hope Apple get's back to making great products as opposed to going patent crazy and deciding that the best way to compete is just to sue everybody else.

I actually have no opinion about the merits of these lawsuits because I don't know enough about the technical particulars. And yes, I think that Nokia has a right to protect its IP, although from what I've read that doesn't seem to be the actual matter in dispute, involving as it does some cross licensing demands from Nokia.

In general, I don't think it's a good idea to posit anthropomorphized, emotional motivations for huge legal actions, I don't think it's a good idea to simply dismiss all such lawsuits out of hand as being baseless, or to assume that every such lawsuit is an ironclad case. I think it's pretty obvious that companies can and do bring suit for strategic and leverage reasons.
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post #271 of 279
Prove it.

or prove that Apple is using more than a combination of the technology it licensed from Qualcomm, SonyEricsson, others and in-house developed solutions.

Apple is a member of the WiFi standards group, which is one of the issues Nokia is suing over.

I guess we'll have to wait until it gets to court to prove your unsubstantiated claims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Yes, as a matter of fact.


No, this is false. FRAND applies to the other companies who added their patents to the GSM patent pool. Apple did no such thing, but wanted special treatment. Despite not having contributed, they wanted to get away with not having to pay up for the IP they blatantly stole.

Other mobile manufacturers are cross-licensing patents. Apple refused to. Apple also refused to pay up. Apple blatantly stole Nokia's IP. Nokia sued Apple for their theft of IP.
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post #272 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

If Apple isn't supposed to get FRAND rates when they haven't contributed to the patent pool, they'd be laughed out of court for even bringing it up.

The point here is that Apple wants special treatment. They want the same as the companies who have actually contributed to the GSM standard. But since they didn't contribute, they do not deserve the same terms as those who actually submitted their IP to the standard.
post #273 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by tawilson View Post

Probably no cross-licensing in Apple vs Nokia, as Nokia is in the wrong by asking for more money from Apple than from any other manufacturers.

Nokia is just asking for what's right. That means that Apple will not get special treatment..

Quote:
Remember, Apple WANTS to pay Nokia the money they are entitled to (which happens to be less than Nokia is DEMANDING).

No, Apple wants to pay less, and get a lot for free, since they didn't contribute to the GSM pool.
post #274 of 279
So part of Nokia's patents cover codecs, Apple has done a lot of work on codecs and compression for transmission over networks, in partnership with Qualcomm who recently obtained a largish settlement off Nokia.

Prove that Apple is using ANY of Nokia's technology in their phones.

That will happen in COURT.

Have you ever heard of the presumption of innocence?

It's what most civilised countries have in their legal system to protect people and other legal entities from unfounded accusations.

The first suit by Nokia covers the GSM patents, it is not before the ITC.

The SECOND suit by Nokia, WHICH DOES NOT INVOLVE the GSM patents is before the ITC AND involves patents relating to almost everything Apple makes.

So why don't you f@#k off with your kangaroo court bulls#@t and let the legal system get on with it's job.



Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Nokia is just asking for what's right. That means that Apple will not get special treatment..


No, Apple wants to pay less, and get a lot for free, since they didn't contribute to the GSM pool.
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post #275 of 279
Fact is, Nokia's patents have been accepted by other companies who have been willing to act honestly. Not so with Apple.
post #276 of 279
"Other companies" are not the legal entities who will decide the merits of Nokia's patents, thus they are irrelevant to the cases.

Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Fact is, Nokia's patents have been accepted by other companies who have been willing to act honestly. Not so with Apple.
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post #277 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Fact is, Nokia's patents have been accepted by other companies who have been willing to act honestly. Not so with Apple.

AFAIK the issue centers on Nokia demanding much higher licensing fees from Apple, allegedly in an effort to force cross licensing on some Apple tech. That being the case, what other companies have "accepted" wouldn't be relevant.

Again, I don't know enough about these matters to make any definitive proclamations about the technicalities or the merits, but then again neither do you. So bald assertions of what the "facts" aren't really persuasive.
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post #278 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by insike View Post

Fact is, Nokia's patents have been accepted by other companies who have been willing to act honestly. Not so with Apple.

Fact is, in Apples response to Nokia's suit, Apple explicitly states Apple is using those Nokia patents and recognizes those patents as valid. Apple is contending Nokia has turned down Apples payment of the GSM standards body Fair, Reasonable And Non-Discriminatory licensing terms. So the Apple-Nokia case isn't really a patent case at all because everyone in the case agrees on the patents in question, it is a licensing fees case. As in what is the acceptable licensing rate when all players are members of a standards body and have agreed to license standards relevant patents with standardized FRAND rates and terms.

I think a possibility is that the court sides with Nokia because the GSM standards body agreements are not binding on the court system. But that would completely blow up the GSM standards body FRAND agreements and either Nokia could be censured/penalized or the whole play nice with each other so we can all make money on cell technology gets shit-canned because trust in the standards body as a safe haven to cooperate is dead.

This case is a classic case of beware what you ask for because you might get it, and that it may have some very unpleasant unexpected consequences.
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post #279 of 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiro View Post

This case is a classic case of beware what you ask for because you might get it, and that it may have some very unpleasant unexpected consequences.

A great case in point example is Apple Comuters, Inc. v. Apple Corps. Apple Computer paid Apple Corps on many occasions spanning 3 decades.
In September 2003, Apple Corps sued Apple Computer again, this time for breach of contract, in using the Apple logo in the creation and operation of Apple Computer’s iTunes Music Store, which Apple Corps contended was a violation of the previous agreement.

Apple Corps rejected a US$1 million offer from Apple Computer to use the Apple name on the iTunes store. On 8 May 2006 the court ruled in favour of Apple Computer, with Justice Mann holding that “no breach of the trademark agreement [had] been demonstrated”. [...] The Judge held Apple Computer’s use was covered under this cause.

The judgment orders Apple Corps to pay Apple Computer’s legal costs at an estimated UK£2m, but pending the appeal the judge declined Apple Computer’s request for an interim payment of UK£1.5m
.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_C...Apple_Computer Not only did Apple Corps not get the $1M they also had to pay Apple Computer's and their court costs and have little to no avenue for future cases against Apple's music store.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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