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Sun former CEO: Steve Jobs threatened to sue us over patents too

post #1 of 89
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Former chief executive of Sun Jonathan Schwartz has accused Steve Jobs of threatening patent action against his company in 2003, related to desktop OS technologies, in a long blog post that highlights a series of tech patent squabbles.

Schwartz introduced his blog posting commiserating for Google, although Apple's current patent lawsuit is actually being taken against HTC, the hardware partner behind the Google-branded Nexus One, and does not directly involve Google at all.

HTC also makes most of the other significant Android phones on the market as well as a number of high profile Windows Mobile phones, both under its own brand and cobranded with other companies.

Schwartz said that Jobs called him personally in 2003 "to let me know the graphical effects [in Sun's Project Looking Glass project] were stepping all over Apples [Intellectual Property]." If Sun decided to release the product commercially, Jobs reportedly threatened to sue for infringement.

Schwartz said that Sun chose not to launch the product in question, but that the decision was not affected by Jobs' threat. Instead, he said Sun abandoned the Linux desktop user interface shell because it thought there would be no market for a Windows desktop competitor among businesses.

The point of the blog posting was further muddled by Schwartz's comments that Apple's Keynote app was likely infringing on intellectual property in Sun's Concurrence. It is an open secret that Apple based elements of its suite of iWork apps on a series of productivity apps created by Lighthouse Design for Jobs' original NeXT Computer.

Schwartz was a cofounder of Lighthouse, and therefore an associate of Jobs during his stint at NeXT. The Lighthouse apps were "the Offices suite" for NeXT, and were a personal favorite of Jobs. NeXT needed Lighthouse because Microsoft had refused to port its Office apps to the platform, with Bill Gates famously saying he'd rather "piss on it" than develop apps for the advanced operating system Jobs created after leaving Apple.

However, when Sun bought Lighthouse in the mid 1990s, it locked up the company's suite of apps and threw away the key, abandoning all new development. Apple was then forced to create a Cocoa-based productivity suite on its own over the last decade, as Sun had no interest in developing for Cocoa because it was then focused on pushing Java.

Microsoft only begrudgingly did the least amount of work necessary to get its existing Mac Office running on the new Mac OS X, using Apple's legacy Carbon environment rather than porting Office to use the advanced new Cocoa frameworks.

Apple is now touting iWork as a suitable replacement for Office on the Mac desktop, and debuting it as the first multitouch productivity suite, developed for the upcoming iPad.
post #2 of 89
This reeks of me-too-ism... as in... it's not stealing, in fact, somehow even though I'm infringing I'm the victim type of claim.
post #3 of 89
It's Steve Jobs' world, everyone else is just living in it.
post #4 of 89
If Apple did infringe Prince wouldn't step on that alter.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of a rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #5 of 89
What I cannot understand is the outrage Apple is recieving for sueing HTC. There's a most bloody war being fought, in the smartphone sector.

Apple is the target of Nokia, Kodak and other minor players. Putting aside the urgent need for patent reform, Apple is seeking leverage. It needs to test its patents in court, the least bloody way to test those is with a small timer like HTC.

Once it has proven patents Nokia will step back and if it hurts Android and Windows Phones in the process Apple will feel it this won 2-0.

Shooting wars often hurt civilians, sadly in this case its HTC who takes the proxy war.
post #6 of 89
Quote:
Schwartz said that Sun chose not to launch the product in question, but that the decision was not affected by Jobs' threat. Instead, he said Sun abandoned the Linux desktop user interface shell because it thought there would be no market for a Windows desktop competitor among businesses.

That, and it looked like half-assed crap. I remember when there was quite a buzz going around about Project Looking Glass, and many comparisons were made to OS X at the time. Doesn't surprise me at all if this is true.
post #7 of 89
CEOs calling one another to inform them they are infringing on their IP instead of using lawyers as intermediaries sounds awfully gentlemanly.
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post #8 of 89
Looks like Sun did everything wrong.

I think we've heard enough from Mr. Schwartz and his now-defunct company.
post #9 of 89
Quote:
Microsoft only begrudgingly did the least amount of work necessary to get its existing Mac Office running on the new Mac OS X, using Apple's legacy Carbon environment rather than porting Office to use the advanced new Cocoa frameworks.

If Microsoft Office is that Bad then why do 3/4 of Mac users have it on their Mac.

It puts a smile on Steve Balmer's face with every sale.

http://www.macworld.com/article/1380...se_office.html

And now that it's Cocoa I imagine that will only go up.

Besides, Microsoft is Apple's new BFF to fight off Google dominance in every market.
Good luck with Bing!
post #10 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

CEOs calling one another to inform them they are infringing on their IP instead of using lawyers as intermediaries sounds awfully gentlemanly.

Steve Jobs is not a gentleman and never has been.
post #11 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

Steve Jobs is not a gentleman and never has been.

I see your shift has started.
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post #12 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

If Microsoft Office is that Bad then why do 3/4 of Mac users have it on their Mac.

Because people are under the impression that they somehow need MS Office and that nothing else exists in the Office suite market. It's what they use at work and they assume it's what they need at home. They're bringing that Windows mentality to the Mac platform. I feel sorry for them, but Apple seems to be making some headway in weaning people off Windows. Like a dangerous addiction, it takes time to bring users around. They aren't going to quit cold turkey and feel alright.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

Steve Jobs is not a gentleman and never has been.

The next time you have lunch with him tell him I said hi.
post #13 of 89
Who cares what Jonathan Schwarz has to say. As far as I can tell, he has been the most over paid, unsuccessful CEO in history. So he has an opinion. Big deal, so does my dog and right now I need to take him out...
post #14 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I see your shift has started.

Isn't that a typo?
Blindness is a condition as well as a state of mind.

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Blindness is a condition as well as a state of mind.

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post #15 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I see your shift has started.

I heard the wine bottle open in your thread and thought I'd post before I couldn't understand your ever so informative 9 page posting and the infamous French quotes that you look up in Wiki.
post #16 of 89
Jobs also invented suing people who infringe on your patents.

Oh, wait...
post #17 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Because people are under the impression that they somehow need MS Office and that nothing else exists in the Office suite market. It's what they use at work and they assume it's what they need at home.

The oddest thing about his post is the weird ass logic that the popularity of Office for Mac means that MS has put extensive resources into the Mac office suite development.

The truth is Office for Mac is one of the handful of areas MS makes money, but MS has used Office for Mac as leverage against Apple by stalling updates and features.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #18 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Because people are under the impression that they somehow need MS Office and that nothing else exists in the Office suite market. It's what they use at work and they assume it's what they need at home. They're bringing that Windows mentality to the Mac platform. I feel sorry for them, but Apple seems to be making some headway in weaning people off Windows. Like a dangerous addiction, it takes time to bring users around. They aren't going to quit cold turkey and feel alright.



The next time you have lunch with him tell him I said hi.

It doesn't matter to Microsoft. It's still cash in their pockets.

I wouldn't have lunch with Steve Jobs. He'd probably tell me he forgot his wallet and make me pay for it. Plus the thought of it makes me lose my appetite (much like your postings).
post #19 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by CurtisEMayle View Post

Isn't that a typo?

Nice!
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post #20 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

It doesn't matter to Microsoft. It's still cash in their pockets.

I wouldn't have lunch with Steve Jobs. He'd probably tell me he forgot his wallet and make me pay for it. Plus the thought of it makes me lose my appetite (much like your postings).

Why are you here?
post #21 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Why are you here?

To ask why 3/4 of Mac users that don't care for Microsoft need them. It was a part of the article. Why are you asking other than to troll me.
post #22 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

The oddest thing about his post is the weird ass logic that the popularity of Office for Mac means that MS has put extensive resources into the Mac office suite development.

The truth is Office for Mac is one of the handful of areas MS makes money, but MS has used Office for Mac as leverage against Apple by stalling updates and features.

Check your facts before spewing like Jobs does.

http://www.businessinsider.com/chart...ivision-2010-2

Article for the lazy
Quote:
Microsoft is the largest, most profitable software company in the world.

And its profits are still being generated by the same engines that have driven Microsoft for years: Office, Windows, and its server division. (Meanwhile, its entertainment and devices division is only recently profitable again, and its online division is a money pit.)

This is why Google is increasingly focusing on disrupting Microsoft's core businesses, including its Google Docs rival to Office; its Chrome OS rival to Windows; and now Google Buzz, an add-on to Gmail that some have compared most closely to Sharepoint, one of Microsoft's enterprise tools.
post #23 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

Check your facts before spewing like Jobs does.

http://www.businessinsider.com/chart...ivision-2010-2

Article for the lazy

Speaking of being lazy (or is just incompetence?), nothing I wrote negates that article which I've posted to AI on several occasions. Reading comprehension isn't a crime, but it sure is fraking annoying.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #24 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

Check your facts before spewing like Jobs does.

http://www.businessinsider.com/chart...ivision-2010-2

Article for the lazy

Let's look at that profit graph shall we?

This biggest profit is their Windows. Why you ask? Well let's see "NO COMPETITION!" being that Apple is only 2% of the OS market, every computer automatically comes with Windows, not only that but Microsoft gets a paycheck even if there isn't any computers sold. Dell and HP prepay Microsoft for the already pre-installed software. Also the damn market forces Microsoft Office in a Microsoft Monopoly for every computer there is a trial version. Gee... I wonder why they are making money?

Idiot
post #25 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Speaking of lazy (or is just incompetence?) nothing I wrote negates that article I've posted to AI on several occasions. Reading comprehension isn't a crime, but it sure is fraking annoying.

Didn't Steve Jobs say "People Don't Read Anymore"?

By the way, your posting

Quote:
The truth is Office for Mac is one of the handful of areas MS makes money, but MS has used Office for Mac as leverage against Apple by stalling updates and features

I wouldn't say that Apple's 10 percent PC market share does anything more than put a smile on Steve Balmer's face. That's just 3/4 of Mac users saying they can't live without MS.

That's not exactly OR ANYTHING CLOSE to Mac is one of the handful of areas (divisions for the big boys). that make money.

Grow up and quit putting smiley faces in your postings, it's infantile.
post #26 of 89
The end of that blog post confuses me. Schwartz seems to be saying that the standard practice in business is for a company that gets sued for infringement to cook up counter-allegations of infringement against the plaintiff, and thus force a settlement.

But then he cites an open-and-shut case in which Sun LOST a patent lawsuit, apparently because Kodak (those selfish bastards) hadn't actually infringed on any Sun patents. The case went to court, Kodak won all the way around, then Sun quickly agreed to license whatever-it-was from Kodak … which was all they needed to do in the first place.

Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but to me this blog post boils down to "I'm really bad at running a company, please point and laugh at me."
post #27 of 89
This is the dumbest thread ever...

Microsoft's profit Monopoly.
post #28 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

Didn't Steve Jobs say "People Don't Read Anymore"?

By the way, your posting



I wouldn't say that Apple's 10 percent PC market share does anything more than put a smile on Steve Balmer's face. That's just 3/4 of Mac users saying they can't live without MS.

That's not exactly OR ANYTHING CLOSE to Mac is one of the handful of areas (divisions for the big boys). that make money.

Grow up and quit putting smiley faces in your postings, it's infantile.

Put away your arrogance, it's infantile.

Give it some time, as people are looking to alternatives and shelling out more money up front (read that as record Mac sales) they are also learning that they do not need Microsoft.
I think MS is starting to realize the truth as well, and Office 2011 will be closer to feature parity. If they didn't see the writing on the wall, they would surely have crippled the next version as well.
post #29 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

If Microsoft Office is that Bad then why do 3/4 of Mac users have it on their Mac.

It puts a smile on Steve Balmer's face with every sale.

http://www.macworld.com/article/1380...se_office.html

And now that it's Cocoa I imagine that will only go up.

Besides, Microsoft is Apple's new BFF to fight off Google dominance in every market.
Good luck with Bing!

The reason Mac users use MS Office is because cross platform compatibility and iWork is a Mac only software. No one is undermining MS Office success. MS Office for Mac lacks many features available on Windows version (VBA for one). Furthermore, there are some compatibility issues between the two.

I am not talking simple documents and spreadsheets here. I am currently working on my dissertation on my MBP using Office for Windows via Parallels. One of the reasons I am doing so is because the Word template the department provided me didn't work well on Office for Mac (2004 and 2008). Fortunately for me, all MS software (Windows XP to 7, Office (Mac & Windows) .. etc) are provided free of charge for ALL students in our university.
post #30 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

Plus the thought of [having lunch with Steve Jobs] makes me lose my appetite.....

How can you have such strong reactions to someone you don't know? What exactly has he done to you to make you feel so vehemently repulsed?

It seems kind of unnatural, man.
post #31 of 89
Haha, haha, project looking glass, their attempt at making 3d desktop effects to one up microsoft, when OSX already had it.

Quote:
I wouldn't have lunch with Steve Jobs. He'd probably tell me he forgot his wallet and make me pay for it. Plus the thought of it makes me lose my appetite (much like your postings).

Steve Jobs probably can eat for free at many places, so him not having a wallet isn't a problem

Btw, ad hominem attacks are quite childish, not
post #32 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

The reason Mac users use MS Office is because cross platform compatibility and iWork is a Mac only software. No one is undermining MS Office success. MS Office for Mac lacks many features available on Windows version (VBA for one). Furthermore, there are some compatibility issues between the two.

I am not talking simple documents and spreadsheets here. I am currently working on my dissertation on my MBP using Office for Windows via Parallels. One of the reasons I am doing so is because the Word template the department provided me didn't work well on Office for Mac (2004 and 2008). Fortunately for me, all MS software (Windows XP to 7, Office (Mac & Windows) .. etc) are provided free of charge for ALL students in our university.

So, let me get this straight (if I can read through the BS)...

You not only run MS Office but MS OS XP or 7. That's putting even a bigger smile on Steve Balmer's face. You can't make it in the real world without Microsoft.

I'll call BS on All MS software is Free for you. Where do you attend your education?

Not even MIT/Government gets MS software for free. It was either included in your tuition or you are not telling the truth.

Care to supply the school, link for free software for students and date purchased?

Bill Gates gives Billions to charity but not to higher education. That is unless you're graduating grade school, it may be possible.
post #33 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by sprockkets View Post

Haha, haha, project looking glass, their attempt at making 3d desktop effects to one up microsoft, when OSX already had it.



Steve Jobs probably can eat for free at many places, so him not having a wallet isn't a problem

Btw, ad hominem attacks are quite childish, not

And I'll bet he takes advantage of it just like he does parking in handicap parking spaces.

Parking in Handicap Parking Spaces is about as low and uncaring as they come. Steve Jobs does it with a smile on his face. Pitiful.
post #34 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I see your shift has started.

Brilliant!

These guys do conjure up an image of sad, pasty faced workers... clocking in for yet another 8 hour shift on a seemingly endless and repetitive production line.
post #35 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

So, let me get this straight (if I can read through the BS)...

You not only run MS Office but MS OS XP or 7. That's putting even a bigger smile on Steve Balmer's face. You can't make it in the real world without Microsoft.

I'll call BS on All MS software is Free for you. Where do you attend your education?

Not even MIT/Government gets MS software for free. It was either included in your tuition or you are not telling the truth.

Care to supply the school, link for free software for students and date purchased?

Bill Gates gives Billions to charity but not to higher education. That is unless you're graduating grade school, it may be possible.

Here is the link. It seems you really don't know what you are talking about. I suggest you stop posting BS.

Jackass.

PS: You might need to look up the definition of dissertation as well.
post #36 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by piot View Post

Brilliant!

These guys do conjure up an image of sad, pasty faced workers... clocking in for yet another 8 hour shift on a seemingly endless and repetitive production line.

And this is bad because why?...

If they are putting in 8 hours a day and feeding their family and that is all the education they have then more power to them for having a job.

Is this so low on your elitist list that it somehow disgusts you?
post #37 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

It doesn't matter to Microsoft. It's still cash in their pockets.

I wouldn't have lunch with Steve Jobs. He'd probably tell me he forgot his wallet and make me pay for it. Plus the thought of it makes me lose my appetite (much like your postings).

Angus, I have the opening paragraph for your memoirs just in case you need the help:

I could while away the hours, conferrin' with the flowers
Consultin' with the rain.
And my head I'd be scratchin' while
my thoughts were busy hatchin'
If I only had a brain.
post #38 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

Here is the link. It seems you really don't know what you are talking about. I suggest you stop posting BS.

Jackass.

PS: You might need to look up the definition of dissertation as well.

It's included in your tuition and as a part of OKY state funding. That is unless you're under a Federal Lower Income Grant, then it's just the government.

Student Technology Products. Students are eligible for discounts on Microsoft, Dell, Apple, and Cingular products and services through OSU. For information on how to obtain the OSU discount on Dell or Apple products, as well as information on Cingular cellular plans for students, please visit http://it.okstate.edu/students/. Virus protection software and Microsoft products, including Windows and Mac versions, are available to download through OSU's Microsoft Campus Agreement at the software distribution center Web site at https://app.it.okstate.edu/sdc/login.php. Directions for software pick-up or delivery also are available on the software distribution center Web site.

Additional Information. For a complete listing of IT resources, please visit http://it.okstate.edu/rc. For additional information about the Information Technology department, please visit http://it.okstate.edu.

Nothing is Free.
post #39 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngusYoung View Post

......If they are putting in 8 hours a day and feeding their family and that is all the education they have then more power to them for having a job.
.......

My apologies. I did not realise that, by posting comments here, you were helping to keep your family clothed and fed.
post #40 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cranky View Post

Angus, I have the opening paragraph for your memoirs just in case you need the help:

I could while away the hours, conferrin' with the flowers
Consultin' with the rain.
And my head I'd be scratchin' while
my thoughts were busy hatchin'
If I only had a brain.

And I could be on Acid or Crack and come up with something as disturbing. But I chose not to do drugs.

I'd suggest the same "Cranky".
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