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Apple's iPhone 4.0 software to deliver multitasking support - Page 2

post #41 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

facts can be your friends: http://gizmodo.com/5490299/android-s...one-stalls-out

That graph was for US only (Notice how Nokia is not even mentioned). Apple sells the iPhone world wide.
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post #42 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh View Post

I want you to take a LONG hard look at this graph:




...and remember, the iPhone only has ONE carrier.

I agree that partnering with only ATT was one of Apple's biggest mistakes.

BTW, this graph is more recent:



What's interesting to me is that RIM is pulling away, leaving Apple at an increasingly distant second-place.

It is to be expected that WinMo is dying, and it is sad that Palm is dying. It is no surprise that Android is surging.

But clearly Apple is losing badly to RIM, and that surprises me.
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post #43 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

The iPhone is on one carrier. It stands to reason that if they don't open up to other carriers at some point, they'll get about as many customers as they're gonna get on AT&T.

Yeah - both the one-phone and the one-carrier strategies are huge mistakes. It is ironic though, that Apple popularized the market segment, and now RIM is eating their lunch.

Kind of like what happened to the GUI OS business: Apple was first (well, not first, but first in the consumer market), but lost out big time to their competitors.
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post #44 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by azazel- View Post

Considering you seem to come here to do nothing but bitch and complain, I'd say you should get whatever shuts you up.

I say let's take up a collection.....
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post #45 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by belunos View Post

I'm really more worried about battery life than anything. Don't get me wrong, multitasking will be nice (my biggest want is better handling of gmail), but I already can't get a full day on one charge.

Agreed, battery life is paramount. BTW, I do ok with location services off but with WiFi and BT on. I usually get 1 day +
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post #46 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:39am
RIM has their devices on all the major carriers and am sure small market carriers as well. Some of them have been giving buy one get one free deals as well. That being said, with all the places available to get a Blackberry, Apple is doing just fine on one carrier as far as sales are concerned. Imagine if it was available on all carriers with all proper radios...

I do agree that it does suck that WebOS isn't taking off like it was forecasted. I think it has some great features that Apple should look it. Android is surging, but I don't like it's look. Too cluttered for my tastes. I do like the nexus one hardware though...
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post #47 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStud View Post

Very few people would buy an iPhone now

Yes - the facts seem to support his conclusion.
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post #48 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes - the facts seem to support his conclusion.

That's not what iStud meant and you know it. They're not buying iPhones because of the impending release of the next-gen iPhone.
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post #49 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes - the facts seem to support his conclusion.

Then why did you say a few moments ago that it surprises you that RIM, who have been steadily pumping out new product refreshes over the past year, is selling more than a yet-to-be-updated iPhone model? Oh, wait, you just wanted to twist someones words.

The iPhone has remained level. Android and RIM have gobbled up the Palm and WinMo users. As stated here, and at the source page of your image, lets see this graph again after the iPhone update.
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post #50 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

Well, I was just thinking about that. If they made a Nano-phone (let's say) that didn't require a data plan and perhaps an iPhone Lite or even a step up from the iPhone, then yes, the stagnation would probably reverse. More importantly however, they need to open up to other carriers in the US.

Interesting thought. I'm no marketing guru, but that might work. However, Apple is not competing effectively against RIM, and I don't see them offering "Lite" blackberries. Maybe I'm wrong; I don't follow RIM products.

The 'Pad is an iTouch DeLuxe - might that reverse the stagnation? My guess is that Apple will sell a zillion of them.
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post #51 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by azazel- View Post

Yet you don't present any interesting ideas on your own. You troll, link to a graph that you clearly don't understand, and wait for the storm to ensue.

What do I fail to understand about the graph?
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post #52 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes - the facts seem to support his conclusion.

BTW, I gotta ask. Why all the negativity towards the iPad, iPhone, Apple etc...? Apple do something to you when you were a kid?
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post #53 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

I agree that partnering with only ATT was one of Apple's biggest mistakes.

BTW, this graph is more recent:

It's not about how recent they are... They are meaningless outside of yearly cycles.

But you just ignore these little facts.

More importantly, they are only US based. There is a whole world out there. Find the graphs for global share, and then you can talk about stagnation.
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post #54 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

That graph was for US only (Notice how Nokia is not even mentioned). Apple sells the iPhone world wide.

Where did you find the information that the graph is US only? The story didn't say that.
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post #55 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes - the facts seem to support his conclusion.

You are one of a class!
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post #56 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

What do I fail to understand about the graph?

Priceless!
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post #57 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:51am
I don't see Apple ever really doing this. The nano is $149, you can buy a iPhone 3G for $99 with a "full" phone screen. Why would Apple make a Nano Phone, assuming small screen, no apps\ there are plenty of dump phones that play music. I think Apple has it covered.
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post #58 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

BTW, I gotta ask. Why all the negativity towards the iPad, iPhone, Apple etc...? Apple do something to you when you were a kid?

You'd be hard pressed to find him making a positive post about Apple anywhere on this Apple-centric site. Now, typically there is a label one applies to those that behave such as this, but he's rather content to skirt along the fringe of the rules without doing anything truly ban-worthy.
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post #59 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. K View Post

I'm thinking that they could incorporate a system sorta like a cross between Spaces and Expose; punch four fingers together on the screen to enter it and see all applications running, tap on an application to select and access it.

How do you close an App?
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post #60 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:54am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

That's not what iStud meant and you know it. They're not buying iPhones because of the impending release of the next-gen iPhone.

Yes, the facts support the contention that he made: Few people would buy an iPhone at this point. The reasons why Apple's sales are dwarfed by RIM, and why Apple's sales are falling further behind, are not clear from the graph.

I agree that the technical inferiority of iOS may well have a big impact, hence my comments that Apple really needs to catch up if they want to advance market share. They seem to have lost all momentum in the smartphone market.

The next-gen iPhone might reverse the trends. But only if Apple can figure out why so many more folks decide to buy Blackberries rather than iPhones.
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post #61 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes, the facts support the contention that he made: Few people would buy an iPhone at this point. The reasons why Apple's sales are dwarfed by RIM, and why Apple's sales are falling further behind, are not clear from the graph.

A graph of facts will never give you reasons. That's called a causality relationship and it needs a totally different mathematical analysis (not that you care, of course)
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post #62 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alkrantz View Post

Well, I don't agree that the android OS is going to end badly, primarily because it's free to license for phone manufacturers vs the licensing fees they would incur for Windows Mobile and of course they cant license IOS. That being said, I DO agree that the Android UI is horrible.

As far as the IOS stagnating, I agree that's completely off base. They have clearly been growing it just as they have OSX, with regular steady updates. Ironically, I do think they should spend MORE time on the OSX UI which feels rather dated to me compared to Win 7.

I sortof felt this way also initially. But I have since altered my opinion to some degree. I don't think OS X is dated, I just think that Windows 7 just leaped forward to finally catch up. Sure there may be a few things W7 does better, but also many things OS X does better. I think mainly I am just in an uncomfortable position because it feels very weird to have a Windows product be an actual competitor to OS X. In the past Windows was always (in my opinion) way behind the Mac OS. The recent improvements to Windows that close the gap are a bit off-putting. I'll get used to it though because we need good competition. This should spur Apple on to really great things that will put it way out in front again. And then I can rest a bit easier.
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post #63 of 469
3/11/10 at 6:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by azazel- View Post

Then why did you say a few moments ago that it surprises you that RIM, who have been steadily pumping out new product refreshes over the past year, is selling more than a yet-to-be-updated iPhone model?

I was surprised because I thought that Apple had finally gained traction. I was unaware that RIM is becoming increasingly successful, while the iPhone has been failing to gain market share. Maybe I shouldn't have been surprised at this, but I was.
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post #64 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:00am
Is it safe to assume the iPhone 4.0 update would provide for multitasking in the iPad as well?
iPad News, App Reviews, and More: iPadNewsUpdates.com
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iPad News, App Reviews, and More: iPadNewsUpdates.com
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post #65 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

I was surprised because I thought that Apple had finally gained traction. I was unaware that RIM is becoming increasingly successful, while the iPhone has been failing to gain market share. Maybe I shouldn't have been surprised at this, but I was.

Even though this was amply explained on the sites from which you linked those graphs? So you're just the type that looks for images without any regard to context. Gotcha.

Textbook troll behavior. And why you chose to interject this line of discussion into a thread about iPhone multitasking...well, I wouldn't presume to rationalize that for you.
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post #66 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStud View Post

A graph of facts will never give you reasons. That's called a causality relationship and it needs a totally different mathematical analysis

Yes. Hence my comment.

Do we have any objective information as to why the iPhone is falling further and further behind the Blackberry?

The opinions presented so far include:

The iOS is technically inferior.
Apple made a huge mistake in marketing only one phone.
Apple made a huge mistake in using only one carrier.
Apple's product refresh cycles are too long.

Personally, I don't really know why the iPhone growth has vanished, or whether this trend will reverse when they finally catch up to the competitors with the new iOS. I'll remain optimistic about the iOS in the meantime.
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post #67 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

Sure there may be a few things W7 does better

Like what?
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post #68 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes. Hence my comment.

Personally, I don't really know why the iPhone growth has vanished

And herein lies the problem. You don't understand the graph, its meaning, nor its relevance. Yet you extract all sort of odd conclusions from it, which are most of the time fantastic, magic, exaggerated or plainly wrong.
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post #69 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by azazel- View Post

And why you chose to interject this line of discussion into a thread about iPhone multitasking...well, I wouldn't presume to rationalize that for you.

My original comment was "What the heck is taking them so long? In the meantime, Android is surging in popularity and the iOS is stagnating."

The nexus between Apple's slow modernization of iOS and the current market stagnation of the iOS was interesting to me.

From what I have seen, the complaints about the iPhone rarely mention the hardware; what bugs people is the software. The article was about Apple finally (someday...) adding basic features to the software. I saw a connection, and wanted to explore it.

Lots of folks here seem to think that the current stagnation is directly tied to the delays in implementing common features in the iOS. Others think that the stagnation is not due to the old OS, but rather, to other factors.

I have no firm conclusions, but I enjoy discussing the technology and the market.
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post #70 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

My original comment was "What the heck is taking them so long? In the meantime, Android is surging in popularity and the iOS is stagnating."

The nexus between Apple's slow modernization of iOS and the current market stagnation of the iOS was interesting to me.

From what I have seen, the complaints about the iPhone rarely mention the hardware; what bugs people is the software. The article was about Apple finally (someday...) adding basic features to the software. I saw a connection, and wanted to explore it.

Lots of folks here seem to think that the current stagnation is directly tied to the delays in implementing common features in the iOS. Others think that the stagnation is not due to the old OS, but rather, to other factors.

I have no firm conclusions, but I enjoy discussing the technology and the market.

Yet many others disagree that there is stagnation. And that is what you cannot grasp.
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post #71 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes. Hence my comment.

Do we have any objective information as to why the iPhone is falling further and further behind the Blackberry?

The opinions presented so far include:

The iOS is technically inferior.
Apple made a huge mistake in marketing only one phone.
Apple made a huge mistake in using only one carrier.
Apple's product refresh cycles are too long.

Personally, I don't really know why the iPhone growth has vanished, or whether this trend will reverse when they finally catch up to the competitors with the new iOS. I'll remain optimistic about the iOS in the meantime.


The way you tend to word things are laughable. Since graphs seem so much more visually impressive than text, lets put some perspective on this;



There are no "huge mistakes" here. The iPhone has always been second best, in terms of marketshare. Regardless of you having realized that or not, it's true. The business world is firmly entrenched with RIM, and this will not change in the foreseeable future. There are many parallels going on here in relation to desktop marketshare, but here we get to see what happens when Microsoft doesn't have a choke hold on the industry and complete vendor lock-in of the market. Apple is following the same product model they have always followed for everything they've put out. A person either likes the iPhone as it is, or they don't. There are no compromises on that, and quite frankly it's staggering that they've done as well as they have. Then again, I don't think Apple ever really wants to be #1 at anything, since it limits what they can do. I've tinkered with many many different models of Blackberry's, and I'd be hard pressed to be able to tell any of them apart.
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post #72 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:19am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yeah - both the one-phone and the one-carrier strategies are huge mistakes. It is ironic though, that Apple popularized the market segment, and now RIM is eating their lunch.

Kind of like what happened to the GUI OS business: Apple was first (well, not first, but first in the consumer market), but lost out big time to their competitors.

Facts are your friend??!!

"eating their lunch" "lost out big time"

It seems that you are more comfortable with hyperbole than facts.

... and you say you're not trolling.

But I guess that no matter what we say you won't go away.... so the ignore list is my friend.
We know where you are. We know where youve been. We can more or less know what youre thinking about. - Eric Schmidt
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We know where you are. We know where youve been. We can more or less know what youre thinking about. - Eric Schmidt
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post #73 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by alkrantz View Post

Well, I don't agree that the android OS is going to end badly, primarily because it's free to license for phone manufacturers vs the licensing fees they would incur for Windows Mobile and of course they cant license IOS. That being said, I DO agree that the Android UI is horrible.

As far as the IOS stagnating, I agree that's completely off base. They have clearly been growing it just as they have OSX, with regular steady updates. Ironically, I do think they should spend MORE time on the OSX UI which feels rather dated to me compared to Win 7.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Like what?

I said "there may be a few things W7 does better". This is not an admission or belief of mine. Just conceding that some folks out there may enjoy certain aspects of W7 more than OS X. Note: I am not one of these people.
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post #74 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStud View Post

And herein lies the problem. You don't understand the graph, its meaning, nor its relevance. Yet you extract all sort of odd conclusions from it, which are most of the time fantastic, magic, exaggerated or plainly wrong.

Please tell me which conclusions are odd or incorrect. I conclude that for the time period reported by the graph, Android is surging, the Blackberry is increasing its lead over the iPhone, and the iPhone is stagnating WRT market share.

Is any of that wrong? Can any additional conclusions be drawn?
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post #75 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:23am
Multi-tasking would be nice, as long as I can control it/turn it off.

Because of my experience with 'Push' notification on a few iPhone apps, I don't really know if this is a good thing. Push cuts my battery life by about 1/3. I wouldn't mind if certain apps (chat, pandora, etc) had the ability to run in the background, but I'm afraid that every hack programmer in the world is going to layer on mostly needless background updating and kill my battery life. Weather apps that constantly feel the need to update in the background, stock tickers that continue to tick in the background, social networking that continue to pull status updates (and chat requests and email updates) without concern for platform performance or battery life.

I hope that apps have to be 'certified' to use background services, that is meet certain performance and impact benchmarks to be able to be sold on the App Store.
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post #76 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes. Hence my comment.

Do we have any objective information as to why the iPhone is falling further and further behind the Blackberry?

The opinions presented so far include:

The iOS is technically inferior.
Apple made a huge mistake in marketing only one phone.
Apple made a huge mistake in using only one carrier.
Apple's product refresh cycles are too long.

Personally, I don't really know why the iPhone growth has vanished, or whether this trend will reverse when they finally catch up to the competitors with the new iOS. I'll remain optimistic about the iOS in the meantime.

This gentleman's or lady's set of arguments convinced me once for all that one has to invest in any technology but Apple's.
Especially in the Mobile Phone business.
Very compelling indeed.
So I complied with this very thoughtful advice and bought any phone that wasn't Apple branded.
I am now the happy owner of ten mobile phones, and counting, and none are Apple branded; furthermore, I've decided that from now on I would get up one hour earlier in the morning and stay up one hour late at night so that I can have a more satisfying, longer lasting and endearing user experience at excoriating the Apple father figure.
I may now be a nervous wreck and in a deep financial hole but do I ever feel vindicated!
Thanks all for having listened to me...
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post #77 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iStud View Post

Yet many others disagree that there is stagnation. And that is what you cannot grasp.

The lack of progress in market share is a fact. If you don't like "stagnation", would you prefer "loss of momentum"?

What description do you prefer if neither of these are to your liking? I would hesitate to say that iPhone popularity has peaked, because it is hard to draw reliable trends from snapshots. However, if they don't do something about the iOS problem prior to the third quarter, a trend may be identifiable.

So how would you characterize the lack of market growth shown by the graph?
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post #78 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Yes. Hence my comment.

The iOS is technically inferior.
Apple made a huge mistake in marketing only one phone.
Apple made a huge mistake in using only one carrier.
Apple's product refresh cycles are too long.

With the market share they have and their capitalization value approaching MS, I'd say Apple's "huge mistakes" have paid off pretty well. I don't find their iOS technically inferior. I find it a pleasure to write for, as I expect the iPad will, sharing a common IDE and OS.

I think a big question is going to be how the introduction of LTE will affect things. That's either going to start to happen this summer or this time next year. I would imagine businesses have already begun jockeying for position.
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post #79 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Please tell me which conclusions are odd or incorrect. I conclude that for the time period reported by the graph, Android is surging, the Blackberry is increasing its lead over the iPhone, and the iPhone is stagnating WRT market share.

Is any of that wrong? Can any additional conclusions be drawn?

Go on, what else did you conclude? Go on, don't be shy. You were very verbose before. Suddenly you are to cautious... So far so good.
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post #80 of 469
3/11/10 at 7:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

Where did you find the information that the graph is US only? The story didn't say that.

Look at the table, which is basically the graph in table form, it clearly states "Total U.S. Age 13+".
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