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Nokia, Apple courtroom showdown to wait until mid-2012

post #1 of 18
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The legal battle over mobile technology patents between handset makers Apple and Nokia will likely drag out for years, with both companies looking for a court hearing to be held in 2012.

The trial date with the U.S. International Trade Commission was revealed in a court filing obtained by Reuters this week. It noted that the date raises "the spectre of a prolonged legal struggle."

When the battle between the two giant companies began last fall with Nokia suing Apple over alleged patent violations, some said if Apple countersued, the battle between the two Goliaths could last two or three years. Sure enough, only months later, Apple filed a countersuit against Nokia, accusing the Finnish company of its own list of patent infringements.

In January, the ITC agreed to investigate Apple over the complaints lodged by Nokia. Weeks later, the U.S. commission announced it would also investigate Nokia over Apple's claims.

Reuters noted that Apple originally accused Nokia of infringing 13 patents the Cupertino, Calif., company owns. However, the suit has since been revised to remove four from the list.

Analyst Gene Munster with Piper Jaffray has said he believes Nokia seeks a 1 percent to 2 percent royalty on every iPhone sold. That would amount to about $6 to $12 per handset in compensation for intellectual properties related go GSM, 3G and Wi-Fi.

While Nokia first provoked Apple with a lawsuit last fall, Apple recently began its own patent-related pursuit against handset maker HTC earlier this month. The iPhone maker filed a suit with the ITC accusing HTC of infringing on 20 patents related to the handset's user interface, underlying architecture and hardware. Some believe the lawsuit is meant as an indirect attack against Google's Android mobile operating system.

The ITC has been busy with Apple lately. The U.S. commission is also investigating a complaint from camera maker Kodak, which has accused Apple of infringing on patents related to the previewing of images and processing them at different resolutions. Kodak believes Apple's iPhone infringes on those inventions.
post #2 of 18
It is truly sad when companies rip off other's technology instead of innovating.
post #3 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

It is truly sad when companies rip off other's technology instead of innovating.

I know, right? Jeez guys, fight it out in the marketplace like real men.
post #4 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

The legal battle over mobile technology patents between handset makers Apple and Nokia will likely drag out for years, with both companies looking for a court hearing to be held in 2012.

Nothing unusual about this. Standard fare. These things take years, and in 2015, we'll all go "what the heck was this all about, and who cares!"
post #5 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Nothing unusual about this. Standard fare. These things take years, and in 2015, we'll all go "what the heck was this all about, and who cares!"

That is a huge problem when litigating tech patents. By the time there's a decision, the tech is too often obsolete.
post #6 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Nothing unusual about this. Standard fare. These things take years, and in 2015, we'll all go "what the heck was this all about, and who cares!"

Unless you believe that that the world is going to end in 2012.

Yeh, these things take years and cost $$$$$$.
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #7 of 18
After the decision there are the appeals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iGenius View Post

That is a huge problem when litigating tech patents. By the time there's a decision, the tech is too often obsolete.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #8 of 18
In the meantime, I guess the right to a speedy trial must only apply to other types of court cases...

And it's funny, that while we wait, if indeed one party is in the wrong, they get to continue their "illegality" under the noses and supervision of the courts!

Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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Ten years ago, we had Steve Jobs, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash.  Today we have no Jobs, no Hope and no Cash.

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post #9 of 18
After the dust settles, if the plaintiff prevails then they are awarded damages in terms of royalty payments and court cost--even if the technology is now obsolete.
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #10 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post

In the meantime, I guess the right to a speedy trial must only apply to other types of court cases...

And it's funny, that while we wait, if indeed one party is in the wrong, they get to continue their "illegality" under the noses and supervision of the courts!

Speedy trials apply to criminal and not civil, patent or copyright cases. Sixth Amendment. Due Process 14th Amendment.
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #11 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rot'nApple View Post

In the meantime, I guess the right to a speedy trial must only apply to other types of court cases...

And it's funny, that while we wait, if indeed one party is in the wrong, they get to continue their "illegality" under the noses and supervision of the courts!


there is something called Discovery in civil cases. Both Nokia and Apple are going to go to court and present a list of data the other is supposed to provide. In each case the strategy is to provide too much data to bog the other legal team down in searching for the right data. at work i've had to satisfy these. one time they wanted almost 10 years of data going back to before a merger. we gave them a few DLT tapes and that was it.

in the end both legal teams will be busy for the next year going through all the discovery data trying to build their case and asking for more data. and this is why MS Exchange is so popular in corporate america. it makes doing things like these very easy. just restore a few months worth of databases, use Ontrack Powertools to filter the right data and export it to a file
post #12 of 18
This will probably never reach court and will end up with some sort of cross licensing agreement.
post #13 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

there is something called Discovery in civil cases. Both Nokia and Apple are going to go to court and present a list of data the other is supposed to provide. In each case the strategy is to provide too much data to bog the other legal team down in searching for the right data. at work i've had to satisfy these. one time they wanted almost 10 years of data going back to before a merger. we gave them a few DLT tapes and that was it.

in the end both legal teams will be busy for the next year going through all the discovery data trying to build their case and asking for more data. and this is why MS Exchange is so popular in corporate america. it makes doing things like these very easy. just restore a few months worth of databases, use Ontrack Powertools to filter the right data and export it to a file

In the process, we lose another forrest. Even if the documents are in PDF, there are times when it will be necessary to produce hard copies.
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #14 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

This will probably never reach court and will end up with some sort of cross licensing agreement.

Exactly. The vast majority of these types of lawsuits (most torts, in fact) never go to trial. Both sides want to settle, the judge wants a settlement. Nobody wants a trial if only because the outcome is far too unpredictable.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #15 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

This will probably never reach court and will end up with some sort of cross licensing agreement.

I don't think so. It's a little late for that. From what I understand The issue for Apple isn't that they didn't want to pay the licensing fees. It's that Apple is pissed at Nokia for gouging them by demanding higher licence fees from Apple than what the rest of the industry gets charged. Also Nokia demanded some sort of unfettered access to Apple IP along with the higher than normal licence fees. Apple is basically said "Screw you Nokia. We're not giving you access to any of our IP and we're not paying the higher licence fee. You had your chance to get a fair licence deal and you fucked it up. Now you get nothing and if it goes to trial, so be it. Plus we'll probably counter sue you." Which is what happened. If Apple wins then Nokia is royally screwed. They'll lose all their licence fees they charge the rest of the industry. Plus they then have to deal with the law suit Apple has against them.
post #16 of 18
It's a long way from too late for a settlement. At least two years away from too late.

They will try to beat each other up in discovery and pretrial motions. Someone will get the upper hand. Then they will settle. The odds of going to an actual trial are probably one in a hundred.
Please don't be insane.
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Please don't be insane.
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post #17 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

In the process, we lose another forrest. Even if the documents are in PDF, there are times when it will be necessary to produce hard copies.

Maybe Apple will provide the court and Nokia lawyers with iPads full of documents.
post #18 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

Maybe Apple will provide the court and Nokia lawyers with iPads full of documents.

Not now--limit 2
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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