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post #1481 of 2499
5/29/12 at 4:41am

I guess Romney is your savior.
 

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post #1482 of 2499
5/29/12 at 5:58am

Isn't it wonderful how quickly BR resorts to name-calling and insults:

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You and MJ just don't like government run education because it makes it harder to shelter your idiotic children...

 

I suppose it might be because he can't really make an argument so he feels the need to try and bait his opponent into an emotional response to derail the discussion rather than keep the discussion at a mature and civil level.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1483 of 2499
5/29/12 at 6:53am
Moreover, BR has yet to explain how someone merely believing differently than he does merits the use of government violence against that person.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1484 of 2499
5/29/12 at 6:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

Neither the 1% nor Wall Street is my enemy.  That is where you are absolutely incorrect.  China may be our enemy though, and Romney's stance on China is far better than Obama's.  I agree with you on the debt issue and Fed's money printing.  It's out of hand and is likely to lead to disaster.  Here again, Romney is far better.   I still want to see him propose something more aggressive on government spending and tax reform.  

 

I'd like to see more on what Romney says about China over the next few months. Not being fascetious, just honest. I do honestly get an impression in general that Obama's China management is not quite there.

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post #1485 of 2499
5/30/12 at 7:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

If Steve thought that, he was wrong.  Yeah, let's remove union protections so that whenever there's a budget shortfall, the experienced teachers can be fired to make way for younger, cheaper teachers.  That's a fucking great idea.  No, what's wrong with education is ridiculous class size, profit-motivated testing companies selling bullshit standardized tests to schools, idiots believing in the validity of said tests, and non-experts deciding what goes into the curriculum.

 

Mittens actually said that class size doesn't matter.  Are you fucking kidding me?

 

Class size does matter, but it's not a cure all.  This is a complicated area of education research, one that you apparently know very little about.  As for education, yes, the teachers' unions (of which I am a member) are a major part of the problem.  Your understanding of "union protections" in education is also particularly shallow. 

To save time, assume I know everything.
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To save time, assume I know everything.
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post #1486 of 2499
5/31/12 at 4:20am

Romney has no experience in  foreign affairs at all.He is a businessman all the way. China is our boss not the other way around! Think about it.
 

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post #1487 of 2499
5/31/12 at 7:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Romney has no experience in  foreign affairs at all.He is a businessman all the way. China is our boss not the other way around! Think about it.
 

 

Neither did Obama.  Neither did Bush.  Neither did Clinton.  The question is whether or not Romney will be better than who we have now, a man that has shown his lack of experience in almost any relevant area.  Meanwhile, he's had a tough week when it comes to foreign relations: 

 

In comments about him being perceived as not supporting Israel, Obama said:  "I know more about Judaism than any other President."  

 

Oh, but it gets better:  Polish leaders and media demand apology for Obama's "Polish Death Camps" comment.  

 

Yeah, foreign affairs are going really well for him.  I see no reason not to give him another four years. :)  

To save time, assume I know everything.
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To save time, assume I know everything.
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post #1488 of 2499
6/8/12 at 1:19pm
Thread Starter 

And stop looking at the white women!

Damn straight!

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #1489 of 2499
6/11/12 at 8:57am

Booming Sweden’s Free-Market Solution

 

 

Quote:

Not so long ago, Sweden could claim world leadership in unmitigated Keynesian economics, with a 90 percent marginal tax rate and a welfare state second to none.

Now Swedes look at the conflict between the U.S. and German examples over whether more spending or more austerity is the key to financial salvation, and for them the choice is easy: Germany was right. Northern Europe harbors no sympathy for the spendthrifts of Southern Europe.

Americans still think of Sweden as a tightly regulated social-welfare state, but in the last two decades the country has been reformed. Public spending has fallen by no less than one-fifth of gross domestic product, taxes have dropped and markets have opened up.

The situation is similar in the other Scandinavian countries, the Baltic nations and Poland. But no turnabout has been as dramatic as Sweden’s.

From 1970 until 1989, taxes rose exorbitantly, killing private initiative, while entitlements became excessive. Laws were often altered and became unpredictable. As a consequence, Sweden endured two decades of low growth. In 1991-93, the country suffered a severe crash in real estate and banking that reduced GDP by 6 percent. Public spending had surged to 71.7 percent of GDP in 1993, and the budget deficit reached 11 percent of GDP.

Turning Point

The combination of the crisis and the non-socialist government under Carl Bildt from 1991 to 1994 broke the trend and turned the country around. In 1994, the Social Democrats returned to power and stayed until 2006. Instead of revoking the changes, they completed the fiscal tightening. In 2006, a non- socialist government returned, and Finance Minister Anders Borg, with his trademark ponytail and earring, has led further reforms. Sweden successfully weathered the global financial crisis that started in 2008, and the Financial Times named Borg Europe’s best finance minister last year.

Before 2009, Sweden had a budget surplus, and it has one again. For the past two years, economic growth has been 4 percent on average, and the current-account surplus was 6.7 percent in 2011. The only concerns are the depressed demand for exports caused by the current euro crisis and an unemployment rate that is about 7.5 percent.

Sweden’s traditional scourge is taxes, which used to be the highest in the world. The current government has cut them every year and abolished wealth taxes. Inheritance and gift taxes are also gone. Until 1990, the maximum marginal income tax rate was 90 percent. Today, it is 56.5 percent. That is still one of the world’s highest, after Belgium’s 59.4 and there is strong public support for a cut to 50 percent.

The 26 percent tax on corporate profits may seem reasonable from an American perspective, but Swedish business leaders want to reduce it to 20 percent. Tax competition is fierce in some parts of Europe. Most East European countries, for example, have slashed corporate taxes to 15-19 percent.

In the bad old days, the annual centralized-wage bargaining between the Trade Union Confederation and the Swedish Employers’ Confederation was a prized custom. But in the 1970s, this system led to both inflation and strikes. Today, it is long gone. Wage bargaining is still collective, but it is decentralized. Wage inflation is no longer a concern and strikes are extremely rare. The employers have won, but real wages are rising with productivity, so the workers are benefiting, as well. As everywhere, trade unions are losing members, money and power.

Debt Averse

Sweden has belonged to the European Union since 1995, but it isn’t a member of the euro area, and the exchange rate of its krona floats freely. Finance Minister Borg argues against a more expansionary policy in Sweden in case Europe faces a real meltdown. After the Keynesian financial and monetary stimulus in the 1970s and ’80s, which led to inflation, repeated devaluations and low growth, Swedes believe in fiscal discipline. They are scared of huge national debt and budget deficits -- especially at the levels they are in the U.S.

Where are the left-wing intellectuals to challenge this new order? They have disappeared. The old socialist research organizations have closed down. The Center for Labor Market Studies was a state institution that generated propaganda, not research, and the government closed it. The Trade Union Confederation had a sophisticated research institute, which it eliminated for not being sufficiently political.

The union economists, who dominated Swedish economic debate in the 1970s and ’80s, have been replaced by bank economists. The free-market right has influential research centers in Stockholm.

After many years of absence from the debate, I attended a conference on the Swedish economy in the southern city of Malmo last month. Swedbank, a large bank, was the organizer, and the 180 speakers represented the full range of Swedish views. I was amazed to hear how far the consensus had moved to the free- market right, even among Social Democrats and trade-union leaders. The values are competition, openness and efficiency, while social and environmental values remain -- a social-welfare society without the social-welfare state. The idea is to make it more efficient through competition among private providers.

The name of the conference said it all: “Growth Days.” Wanja Lundby-Wedin, the president of the Trade Union Confederation, declared without hesitation: “We want flexibility in the labor market.” She complained that the media no longer pay attention to the labor market. The reason is that it functions so well.

During the global financial crisis, the metalworkers’ union quietly agreed to major wage cuts to safeguard their real incomes in the long run. The leader of that union, Stefan Lofven, has just been elected chairman of the Social Democratic Workers’ Party.

Moving Right

The Social Democrats haven’t only joined the free-market consensus, but seem to attack the current government from the right, pushing for a better business environment. Gone are demands for the restoration of social benefits. Opinion polls have rewarded the Social Democrats for their right turn with sharply improved ratings.

Sweden is still offering good social welfare, but more efficiently and sensibly and increasingly through the private sector. This model of falling taxes and public spending is rapidly proliferating from the north of Europe toward the south, and the northern Europeans have little tolerance for the statist conservatism and fiscal negligence of Southern Europe. Nor do the Swedes understand the fiscal irresponsibility of the U.S., while they still admire American research and innovation.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1490 of 2499
6/11/12 at 4:19pm

What's interesting about the superficial analysis many of our leftist/socialist friends are guilty of is that they often default to a very static view of things. It's as if they're unable to see things longer term at all. This is interesting in regard to Sweden in particular because if you look at the long term what you see is is the following:

 

1. A long period (1860s - 1950s) of market-driven economy and policies producing wealth and greatly raising the standard of living.

2. A shorter period of socialist expansion (1950s - 1980s) where the country was able to pay for its socialism out of the wealth and capital accumulation that occurred in the previous phase and make it appear as if you could have pervasive socialism, high taxes and heavy government intervention in the economy and all would be fine.

3. A period where the damage of this second period begins to show.

4. A period of reform by returning to more market-driven policies, lower taxes and less government in which wealth creation returns and standards of living begin to rise again. Still there is much socialism existent.

 

What our leftist/socialist friends get to do is use the apparent well being during period 2 and the return to prosperity during period 4 as clear evidence that socialism and capitalism can coexist completely ignorant (willfully or otherwise) of the fact that it is capitalism that has created the wealth and raised the standards of living while their socialism has destroyed wealth, lower standards of living and acted as a governor on prosperity but still able to be supported by what capitalism did before and after.

 

The facts are actually quite clear: Free-market capitalism is the mechanism for creating wealth a prosperity and socialism is the mechanism for destroying both. Sometimes socialism has a foundation built by capitalism to make it appear as if it is working but, in reality, it is a slow working cancer that destroys wealth, prosperity and societies. The sum total of history, to the present day, shows us this. But some will never learn. Their righteous indignation over the alleged "scourge" economic inequality, their quest for the ever elusive and vaguely defined goal of economic "fairness" and their general envy and dislike of those who are highly economically successful distorts their thinking and encourages them to continue supporting such destructive policies.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1491 of 2499
6/12/12 at 4:40am

Truthfully Obama and Romney could never equal the leadership of RR or Bush Sr.
 

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post #1492 of 2499
6/12/12 at 10:00am

This is the whole point. "Left and Right" has no real meaning anymore. We all want the same thing. We all need a social safety net, but we don't need to go overboard with it, neither to we need to be ultra-conservative. As Steve Jobs said, is it constructive or destructive?

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post #1493 of 2499
6/12/12 at 10:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

This is the whole point. "Left and Right" has no real meaning anymore. We all want the same thing. We all need a social safety net, but we don't need to go overboard with it, neither to we need to be ultra-conservative. As Steve Jobs said, is it constructive or destructive?

 

What is a "social safety net" but a group of individuals taking care of the less fortunate among them? Is government required for that?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1494 of 2499
6/14/12 at 7:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post
What is a "social safety net" but a group of individuals taking care of the less fortunate among them? Is government required for that?

 

Government is not required, but where governments don't do it, it doesn't really exist. Salvation Army doesn't count. I'm not sure you can deregulate the social safety net... I haven't seen a strong case where private (profit or nonprofit) entities can achieve what governments can (eg. Scandinavia).

 

There is a role for government. But if the government is shite then of course one thinks what's the point of government. But that doesn't mean all government is shite.

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post #1495 of 2499
6/14/12 at 8:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

 

Government is not required, but where governments don't do it, it doesn't really exist. Salvation Army doesn't count. I'm not sure you can deregulate the social safety net... I haven't seen a strong case where private (profit or nonprofit) entities can achieve what governments can (eg. Scandinavia).

 

There is a role for government. But if the government is shite then of course one thinks what's the point of government. But that doesn't mean all government is shite.

 

An excerpt from the book For a New Liberty: The Libertarian Manifesto, by Murray N. Rothbard, published in 1973:

 

 

Quote:
...the libertarian position calls for the complete abolition of governmental welfare and reliance on private charitable aid, based as it necessarily will be on helping the "deserving poor" on the road to independence as rapidly as possible. There was, after all, little or no governmental welfare in the United States until the Depression of the 1930s, and yet — in an era of a far lower general standard of living — there was no mass starvation in the streets. A highly successful private welfare program in the present-day is the one conducted by the three-millon-member Mormon Church. This remarkable people, hounded by poverty and persecution, emigrated to Utah and nearby states in the nineteenth century, and by thrift and hard work raised themselves to a general level of prosperity and affluence. Very few Mormons are on welfare; Mormons are taught to be independent, self-reliant, and to shun the public dole. Mormons are devout believers and have therefore successfully internalized these admirable values. Furthermore, the Mormon Church operates an extensive private welfare plan for its members — based, again, on the principle of helping their members toward independence as rapidly as possible.
 
Note, for example, the following principles from the "Welfare Plan" of the Mormon Church. "Ever since its organization in 1830, the Church has encouraged its members to establish and maintain their economic independence; it has encouraged thrift and fostered the establishment of employment-creating industries; it has stood ready at all times to help needy faithful members." In 1936, the Mormon Church developed a "Church Welfare Plan, . . . a system under which the curse of idleness would be done away with, the evils of a dole abolished, and independence, industry, thrift and self-respect be once more established amongst our people. The aim of the Church is to help the people to help themselves. Work is to be enthroned as the ruling principle of the lives of our Church membership." Mormon social workers in the program are instructed to act accordingly: "Faithful to this principle, welfare workers will earnestly teach and urge Church members to be self-sustaining to the full extent of their powers. No true Latter-Day Saint will, while physically able, voluntarily shift from himself the burden of his own support. So long as he can, under the inspiration of the Almighty and with his own labors, he will supply himself with the necessities of life." The immediate objectives of the welfare program are to: "1. Place in gainful employment those who are able to work. 2. Provide employment within the Welfare Program, in so far as possible, for those who cannot be placed in gainful employment. 3. Acquire the means with which to supply the needy, for whom the Church assumes responsibility, with the necessities of life." Insofar as possible, this program is carried on in small, decentralized, grass-roots groups: "Families, neighbors, quorums and wards and other Church organizational units may find it wise and desirable to form small groups for extending mutual help one to the other. Such groups may plant and harvest crops, process foods, store food, clothing and fuel, and carry out other projects for their mutual benefit."
 
Specifically, the Mormon bishops and priesthood quorums are enjoined to aid their brethren to self-help: "In his temporal administrations the bishop looks at every able-bodied needy person as a purely temporary problem, caring for him until he can help himself. The priesthood quorum must look at its needy member as a continuing problem until not alone his temporal needs are met but his spiritual ones also. As a concrete example — a bishop extends help while the artisan or craftsman is out of work and in want; a priesthood quorum assists in establishing him in work and tries to see that he becomes fully self-supporting and active in his priesthood duties." Concrete rehabilitation activities for needy members enjoined upon the priesthood quorums include: "1. Placing quorum members and members of their families in permanent jobs. In some instances through trade school training, apprenticeships, and in other ways, quorums have assisted their quorum members to qualify themselves for better jobs. 2. Assisting quorum members and their families to get established in businesses of their own . . . ."
 
The prime objective of the Mormon Church is to find jobs for their needy. To this end, "The finding of suitable jobs, under the Welfare Program, is a major responsibility of priesthood quorum members. They and members of the Relief Society should be constantly on the alert for employment opportunities. If every member of the ward welfare committee does well his or her work in this respect, most of the unemployed will be placed in gainful employment at the group or ward level." Other members are rehabilitated as self-employed, the church may aid with a small loan, and the member's priesthood quorum may guarantee repayment from its funds. Those Mormons who cannot be placed in jobs or rehabilitated as self-employed "are to be given, in so far as possible, work at productive labor on Church properties . . . ." The Church is insistent on work by the recipient as far as possible: "It is imperative that people being sustained through the bishops storehouse program work to the extent of their ability, thus earning what they receive . . . . Work of an individual on welfare projects should be considered as temporary rather than permanent employment. It should nevertheless continue so long as assistance is rendered to the individual through the bishops storehouse program. In this way the spiritual welfare of people will be served as their temporal needs are supplied. Feelings of diffidence will be removed . . . ." Failing other work, the bishop may assign welfare recipients to aid individual members who are in need of help, the aided members reimbursing the Church at prevailing wage rates. In general, in return for their assistance, the welfare recipients are expected to make whatever contributions they can to the Church welfare program, either in funds, produce, or by their labor.
 
Complementary to this comprehensive system of private aid on the principle of fostering independence, the Mormon Church sternly discourages its members from going on public welfare. "It is requested that local Church officers stress the importance of each individual, each family and each Church community becoming self-sustaining and independent of public relief." And: "To seek and accept direct public relief all too often invites the curse of idleness and fosters the other evils of dole. It destroys one's independence, industry, thrift and self-respect."
 
There is no finer model than the Mormon Church for a private, voluntary, rational, individualistic welfare program. Let government welfare be abolished, and one would expect that numerous such programs for rational mutual aid would spring up throughout the country.

 

I am an active member of this church, which now numbers 14 million members, and there are now more members living outside the United States than inside. The Church Welfare Program is as vibrant and active as ever, and we regularly welcome officials and dignitaries from around the world to tour our humanitarian aid and welfare facilities and learn more about our programs.

 

This is only one of many cases of individuals, independent of the coercion of The State, actively working to take care of those in need and teach them to be self sufficient.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1496 of 2499
6/14/12 at 2:11pm
Thread Starter 

Israel chucks out its blacks. Says they're a cancer-

 

"The goal is to repatriate all the estimated 60,000 African migrants, whose growing numbers are seen by many Israelis as a law and order issue and even a threat to the long-term viability of the Jewish state.

 

 

"My policy with regard to the illegal infiltrators seeking work is clear," Netanyahu said in a May 29 speech. "First of all, to stop their entry with the fence and at the same time to deport the infiltrators who are in Israel."

He warns of Africans "flooding" and "swamping" Israel, threatening "the character of the country". Emergency measures to reverse the influx will include "detention facilities with thousands of units", Netanyahu said last week.

 

 

Israeli human rights and activist groups back the Africans. But rightwing and religious parties say that if they are not stopped today's 60,000 will become 600,000 in a few years, in a population of 7.8 million.

Poor south Tel Aviv residents say affluent north Tel Aviv Jews can afford to be liberal, because the Africans are not in their back yard. An opinion poll last week showed 52 percent of Israelis agree that the Africans are "a cancer".

"They've come here to rape and steal," one Israeli woman shouted at a small but ugly anti-migrant demonstration earlier this month in south Tel Aviv. "We should burn them out, put poison in their food," said an elderly man.

Netanyahu urges restraint. "We are a moral people and we will act accordingly. We denounce violence; we denounce invective. We respect human rights," he said, but added: "Israel cannot accept "infiltrators from an entire continent".

The term "infiltrators" is also used by authorities to describe armed Palestinian militants."

~ http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/11/us-israel-africans-idUSBRE85A0VI20120611

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #1497 of 2499
6/15/12 at 4:13am

Are you referring to the High Orthodox Jews who look down upon Israeli people and the common Jews there? These people are in their own utopia.
 

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post #1498 of 2499
6/17/12 at 4:14am

Let Israel live in harmony with all the Jewish people  living there that is what they really want.No outsiders!

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post #1499 of 2499
6/17/12 at 10:22am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Let Israel live in harmony with all the Jewish people  living there that is what they really want.No outsiders!

 

 

Jews live all over the world, including Africa. If they can't extend the generosity back that has been shown to them, then they don't deserve to be outside of their own tiny little arid settlement of a country. And remember too if it wasn't for the US and UK which both allow all races to come and live in their countries, Israel wouldn't even exist. We provided them with a country, they should show some respect for our values. 

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #1500 of 2499
6/18/12 at 4:32am

Remember before 1948 England was the protectorate of Israel and the English treated the Jews like shit.People do not forget that.There is still hatred and prejudice in the states today regarding the Jewish people especially in the South.Yes Jews live all over but the question is why are they treated differently than the other religions?
 

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post #1501 of 2499
6/18/12 at 9:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Jews live all over the world, including Africa. If they can't extend the generosity back that has been shown to them...

 

This has got to be the most unintentionally hilarious post of the decade.

The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #1502 of 2499
6/19/12 at 2:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post

 

This has got to be the most unintentionally hilarious post of the decade.

Thank you. I needed that! lol.gif 

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #1503 of 2499
6/20/12 at 7:50am

"The most transparent administration in U.S. history."

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1504 of 2499
6/20/12 at 8:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

"The most transparent administration in U.S. history."

 

Racist!

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #1505 of 2499
6/20/12 at 8:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Racist!

 

Hmmm. I thought I was hiding it well. How could you tell?!

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #1506 of 2499
6/21/12 at 12:44pm
Thread Starter 

Whites speak out about racism in America in a new awareness campaign, that shows how ingrained white racism functions throughout American society. Ad's like these are sure to anger some whites who feel they're losing some of their power by becoming a minority group in the US. But, it's perhaps best that by seeing ad's like these some whites might take a closer look at themselves and ask themselves "Am I just racist?". The more whites become a minority the more whites willl have to accept that America is starting to move into a new era, perhaps best defined by Obama as our first black POTUS.

 

Here's the ad- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do_w2V0-3D0&feature=player_embedded

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #1507 of 2499
6/21/12 at 3:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Whites speak out about racism in America in a new awareness campaign, that shows how ingrained white racism functions throughout American society. Ad's like these are sure to anger some whites who feel they're losing some of their power by becoming a minority group in the US. But, it's perhaps best that by seeing ad's like these some whites might take a closer look at themselves and ask themselves "Am I just racist?". The more whites become a minority the more whites willl have to accept that America is starting to move into a new era, perhaps best defined by Obama as our first black POTUS.

 

Here's the ad- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do_w2V0-3D0&feature=player_embedded

 

Saw that yesterday.  It is utterly pathetic.  

To save time, assume I know everything.
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To save time, assume I know everything.
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post #1508 of 2499
6/21/12 at 4:35pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

Saw that yesterday.  It is utterly pathetic.  

Really?

 

I saw race playing a huge role with the people around me in the US. What country do you live in?

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #1509 of 2499
6/21/12 at 9:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

Saw that yesterday.  It is utterly pathetic.  

Really?

 

I saw race playing a huge role with the people around me in the US. What country do you live in?

 

Apparently not in the part where people act all racist like you do.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #1510 of 2499
6/22/12 at 10:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

 

Apparently not in the part where people act all racist like you do.

 

Nope.  

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post #1511 of 2499
6/23/12 at 3:31am
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
 Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Whites speak out about racism in America in a new awareness campaign, that shows how ingrained white racism functions throughout American society. Ad's like these are sure to anger some whites who feel they're losing some of their power by becoming a minority group in the US. But, it's perhaps best that by seeing ad's like these some whites might take a closer look at themselves and ask themselves "Am I just racist?". The more whites become a minority the more whites willl have to accept that America is starting to move into a new era, perhaps best defined by Obama as our first black POTUS.

 

Here's the ad- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Do_w2V0-3D0&feature=player_embedded

 

Shocking that the resident wingnuts are opposed to the message in that video, isn't it?  Enjoy this Scalzi piece about how being a straight white male is life's easy mode.  

 

 

 

Quote:

Straight White Male: The Lowest Difficulty Setting There Is

MAY 15, 2012 BY JOHN SCALZI

I’ve been thinking of a way to explain to straight white men how life works for them, without invoking the dreaded word “privilege,” to which they react like vampires being fed a garlic tart at high noon. It’s not that the word “privilege” is incorrect, it’s that it’s not their word. When confronted with “privilege,” they fiddle with the word itself, and haul out the dictionaries and find every possible way to talk about the word but not any of the things the word signifies.

So, the challenge: how to get across the ideas bound up in the word “privilege,” in a way that your average straight white man will get, without freaking out about it?

Being a white guy who likes women, here’s how I would do it:

Dudes. Imagine life here in the US — or indeed, pretty much anywhere in the Western world — is a massive role playing game, like World of Warcraft except appallingly mundane, where most quests involve the acquisition of money, cell phones and donuts, although not always at the same time. Let’s call it The Real World. You have installed The Real World on your computer and are about to start playing, but first you go to the settings tab to bind your keys, fiddle with your defaults, and choose the difficulty setting for the game. Got it?

Okay: In the role playing game known as The Real World, “Straight White Male” is the lowest difficulty setting there is.

This means that the default behaviors for almost all the non-player characters in the game are easier on you than they would be otherwise. The default barriers for completions of quests are lower. Your leveling-up thresholds come more quickly. You automatically gain entry to some parts of the map that others have to work for. The game is easier to play, automatically, and when you need help, by default it’s easier to get.

Now, once you’ve selected the “Straight White Male” difficulty setting, you still have to create a character, and how many points you get to start — and how they are apportioned — will make a difference. Initially the computer will tell you how many points you get and how they are divided up. If you start with 25 points, and your dump stat is wealth, well, then you may be kind of screwed. If you start with 250 points and your dump stat is charisma, well, then you’re probably fine. Be aware the computer makes it difficult to start with more than 30 points; people on higher difficulty settings generally start with even fewer than that.

As the game progresses, your goal is to gain points, apportion them wisely, and level up. If you start with fewer points and fewer of them in critical stat categories, or choose poorly regarding the skills you decide to level up on, then the game will still be difficult for you. But because you’re playing on the “Straight White Male” setting, gaining points and leveling up will still by default be easier, all other things being equal, than for another player using a higher difficulty setting.

Likewise, it’s certainly possible someone playing at a higher difficulty setting is progressing more quickly than you are, because they had more points initially given to them by the computer and/or their highest stats are wealth, intelligence and constitution and/or simply because they play the game better than you do. It doesn’t change the fact you are still playing on the lowest difficulty setting.

You can lose playing on the lowest difficulty setting. The lowest difficulty setting is still the easiest setting to win on. The player who plays on the “Gay Minority Female” setting? Hardcore.

And maybe at this point you say, hey, I like a challenge, I want to change my difficulty setting! Well, here’s the thing: In The Real World, you don’t unlock any rewards or receive any benefit for playing on higher difficulty settings. The game is just harder, and potentially a lot less fun. And you say, okay, but what if I want to replay the game later on a higher difficulty setting, just to see what it’s like? Well, here’s the other thing about The Real World: You only get to play it once. So why make it more difficult than it has to be? Your goal is to win the game, not make it difficult.

Oh, and one other thing. Remember when I said that you could choose your difficulty setting in The Real World? Well, I lied. In fact, the computer chooses the difficulty setting for you. You don’t get a choice; you just get what gets given to you at the start of the game, and then you have to deal with it.

So that’s “Straight White Male” for you in The Real World (and also, in the real world): The lowest difficulty setting there is. All things being equal, and even when they are not, if the computer — or life — assigns you the “Straight White Male” difficulty setting, then brother, you’ve caught a break.

(Update, 11:07 pm: The comment thread hit 800 comments by 11pm and I’ve turned it off, because now I’m going to sleep and tomorrow I travel, and this is the sort of comment thread that needs to be watched closely. I may turn it back on at some later point, but inasmuch as 800 comments already made it slow to load up, don’t necessarily count on it. But after 800 comments, most of what could be said has been, I think.)

(Update 2: Here’s a follow-up article addressing some common questions/comments regarding this piece.)

(Update 3: Some final thoughts here.)

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #1512 of 2499
6/23/12 at 4:31am

Go to some southern states and see if Jews are liked there or especially in Idaho or other wonderful states where the look down upon a Jew as evil or worse than that some dummies even think the Jews persecuted Jesus.
 

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post #1513 of 2499
6/24/12 at 6:39am

What is racist to you?
 

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post #1514 of 2499
6/25/12 at 4:30am

What happened no more responses from a maven like you?
 

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post #1515 of 2499
6/25/12 at 4:31am

I guess everything is humor to you. Pretty pathetic.

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post #1516 of 2499
6/26/12 at 1:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

 

Shocking that the resident wingnuts are opposed to the message in that video, isn't it?  Enjoy this Scalzi piece about how being a straight white male is life's easy mode.  

 

 

 

 

I, for one, am not arguing against the fact that white males benefit from privilege of being, well...white males.  My issues is with the campaign and this video in particular.  We're not going to continue to make progress on race and racial attitudes by conducting a White Guilt™ campaign, nor by pointing out racism where none exists.  Such actions merely stoke MORE racism and make it harder to identify and fight actual racism that exists. 

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post #1517 of 2499
6/26/12 at 9:17pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance

I feel like we watched two completely different videos. I just see a reasonably tame video not making any particularly bold or controversial statements--simply raising some awareness.  It's almost as if you are looking to be outraged.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #1518 of 2499
6/27/12 at 6:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I feel like we watched two completely different videos. I just see a reasonably tame video not making any particularly bold or controversial statements--simply raising some awareness.  It's almost as if you are looking to be outraged.

 

It must be nice to have the intellectual dishonest to assert some bullshit one guy wrote to validate some claims some other people wrote and then, with a straight face, declare that you are a person of science and facts instead of opinions.

 

Racism used to be about treating people badly because you believed them to be inferior. I'm supposed to believe that because I'm not automatically suspicious as a 42 year old white male to a mall cop, that the world rolls out the red carpet for me? I was certainly suspicious when I was a 16 year old white male and treated like a youthful jackass with half a brain because whether I acted that way or not, the majority of my peers did.

 

Why don't you go make a video about being a 30-40 year old white male trying to apply as a day care provider. I suspect you won't find much privilege there. Why not try getting into a shelter for battered spouses or just for being homeless? Good luck! Go apply for some financial aid and see what you get because it isn't jack squat.

 

As for the people in that video, if they want to talk about being white, tell them to start with their teeth which were nasty and dirty.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #1519 of 2499
6/27/12 at 9:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I feel like we watched two completely different videos. I just see a reasonably tame video not making any particularly bold or controversial statements--simply raising some awareness.  It's almost as if you are looking to be outraged.

 

I wouldn't say I'm outraged.  I simply find the video and campaign ridiculous and pointless.  "Raising awareness?"  Of what?  It's nothing but guilty white liberals feeding their obsession with apologizing for being white.  All it does is stoke racial tensions.  

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

 

It must be nice to have the intellectual dishonest to assert some bullshit one guy wrote to validate some claims some other people wrote and then, with a straight face, declare that you are a person of science and facts instead of opinions.

 

Racism used to be about treating people badly because you believed them to be inferior. I'm supposed to believe that because I'm not automatically suspicious as a 42 year old white male to a mall cop, that the world rolls out the red carpet for me? I was certainly suspicious when I was a 16 year old white male and treated like a youthful jackass with half a brain because whether I acted that way or not, the majority of my peers did.

 

Why don't you go make a video about being a 30-40 year old white male trying to apply as a day care provider. I suspect you won't find much privilege there. Why not try getting into a shelter for battered spouses or just for being homeless? Good luck! Go apply for some financial aid and see what you get because it isn't jack squat.

 

As for the people in that video, if they want to talk about being white, tell them to start with their teeth which were nasty and dirty.

 

Good points.  There are many fields where white males don't enjoy automatic preference.  In fact, I've noticed that many corporations--desperate to appear to be "diverse"--deliberately promote/hire women and minorities.  I can't get into specifics...but I've seen it. 

 

The point on what racism is stands out as well.  There is real racism in America and throughout the world.  Our efforts over the past 50 years have dramatically reduced it.  It moved quickly enough that in two generations, there was little to be found.  Compare racism in the Greatest Generation with that of the Boomers.  Then compare the GG to Generation X.  My daughter's generation (Generation Y? D?) hardly understands what racism IS.  We must continue to stamp out racism where it exists.  The problem is we have people running around screaming that anyone who disagrees with, say, a black politician are actually racists.  We have race baiters like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson.  This video does about as much good as they do.  

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post #1520 of 2499
7/7/12 at 8:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Remember before 1948 England was the protectorate of Israel and the English treated the Jews like shit.People do not forget that.There is still hatred and prejudice in the states today regarding the Jewish people especially in the South.Yes Jews live all over but the question is why are they treated differently than the other religions?
 

 WTF???

 

There was no Israel before 1948. There was the British Palestine Mandate and it is true that following the Arab uprisings in the 30's the British decided to limit the numbers of Jewish people wishing to immigrate in  to Palestine. Previously under British control the Jewish population increased from 11 to 33%. So if you mean that refusing entry or having to resort to putting illegal immigrants into holding camps is treating people like shit then so be it.

 

Or perhaps you are referring to the knee jerk detaining of suspected Jewish terrorists following the murder of 91 people at the King David Hotel by Jewish terrorists who had close ties to the Jewish Agency.

 

Come to think of it,Palestine was probably a fairer place under British "rule", the saddest thing about Israel is that the (historically) oppressed have become the oppressors of those that have lived there for thousands of years.

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