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New hack could allow 'jailbroken' Apple iPads at launch

post #1 of 73
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iPhone hacker George Hotz has demonstrated a new method to permanently "jailbreak" the iPhone 3GS, and he said the hack will "probably" work on the iPad, which goes on sale next week.

Hotz, known by his online handle "Geohot," updated his blog this week to reveal a new video demonstrating a jailbroken iPhone 3GS being rebooted. Jailbreaking is a practice that allows users to run unsigned code on the iPhone OS, which powers the iPhone, iPod touch and forthcoming iPad. It voids the warranty and can open up the device to security issues, but can also be used to allow new features like multitasking.

"The jailbreak is all software based, and is as simple to use as blackra1in," Hotz said, referencing his previous iPhone 3GS crack that employed a method known as a tethered jailbreak. "It is completely untethered, works on all current tethered models (ipt2, 3gs, ipt3), and will probably work on iPad too."

Late last year, Apple quietly updated the BootROM in the iPhone 3GS to thwart potential hackers. It marked the first time ever that the handset maker had modified its hardware in the middle of a product line, without a new model released.

The new BootROM, known as iBoot-359.32, has proven challenging for hackers, who have only been able to implement the tethered jailbreak, which requires users to connect their iPhone to a computer via USB every time they reboot the device. Hotz claims his latest hack will not require a USB connection.

While iPhone users can rely on jailbreaking to unlock their handset for use with unauthorized carriers, the 3G-capable version of the iPad, scheduled to arrive in late April, ships unlocked by default. However, its 3G frequencies are only compatible with AT&T in the U.S.

But the warranty-voiding jailbreak process can also allow users to run software Apple does not allow. Hackers have created their own custom applications that allow features like multitasking not currently permitted within the iPhone OS.



Apple and the jailbreaking community, led by Hotz and a separate group of hackers known as the iPhone Dev Team, have gone back and forth for some time, as the Cupertino, Calif., company has looked to close avenues used by hackers. One of the main concerns about jailbreaking is piracy, as the procedure can allow users to steal software from the App Store.

Users who jailbreak without knowledge of what they are doing could potentially open up their phone to exploits, as was revealed last November when the first-known iPhone worm attacked jailbroken handsets. The worm only affected users who did not change their phone's default SSH password, which allows file transfers between phones.
post #2 of 73
Wouldn't want to try this as it will void the warranty.
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post #3 of 73
I don't know if permanent jailbreaking is possible. Apple will surely look at this hack and close that particular loophole. Another one will show up of course...
post #4 of 73
I have to think Apple have an internal team who try to hack so as to see the possible vulnerabilities. It seems they need to hire a few of these guys too.
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post #5 of 73
All I have to say is...
post #6 of 73
Says the video is a hacked 3GS? Anyone else notice the headphones at the bottom? Thin body? That's an iPod Touch right?
post #7 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by swinge View Post

Says the video is a hacked 3GS? Anyone else notice the headphones at the bottom? Thin body? That's an iPod Touch right?

I was thinking it was a touch 3rd Gen too.
post #8 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

Wouldn't want to try this as it will void the warranty.

One can always restore it.
post #9 of 73
gotta be an ipod touch. looks pretty thick to be a touch though....
post #10 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriamjh View Post

One can always restore it.

Not true. The warranty is voided by the action of jailbreaking even if you subsequently restore the phone or pad. The question is whether anyone can tell what you did.

If you restore the phone and Apple is unable to tell it was ever jailbroken, then you are still safe, but there's nothing to stop Apple from simply putting something in the firmware, or giving their store employees tools that can detect if the phone was ever *previously* jailbroken. So you can restore the phone, but it's still a gamble and if anyone finds out you did it, the warranty is still void.

Also, relying on some shifty, anonymous, quasi-criminal on the Internet to restore your phone is almost as dumb as relying on that same person to jailbreak it for you IMO.
post #11 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eriamjh View Post

One can always restore it.

Not that I would want to try to jailbreak an iPad or other iDevise, I read that first if you should want to really know what you are doing and how to do it. Some who have tried have and didn't do it right were open to a worm attack specifically designed to attack that weakness. When these jailbreakers took their iPhones to an Apple store, they were informed that they had voided their warranty--so you broke it, you fix it.

Thanks, you posted just before I got mine done.
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #12 of 73
This was expected, frankly I will wait until a jailbreak is published before I buy an ipad.
post #13 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by elpasi View Post

I was thinking it was a touch 3rd Gen too.

which is what makes the video even more exciting for the hacking community. the 3rd gen itouch has never been jailbroken untethered before. ever...
post #14 of 73
jailbreaking is definitely more trouble than it's worth to an "old man" like myself, but it's really only akin to ripping the "do not remove" tag off of your mattress. There is no law that says you are a criminal for doing so other than Apple's stipulations and it's highly improbable Apple can detect it and even if they did, they are not going to brick your device. They've made similar statements about pirated software in the past, they feel it's not their responsibility. Unlike MSFT xbox fiasco when people "jailbroke" their 360's and MSFT bricked them

Apple really only cares that you paid for the device, sure they don't want every phone, IPT or Ipad broken into. As long as it's not endemic I doubt it's worth too much effort to make it impregnable. All they have to do is make it "hard enough" that most people will find it just enough work to not be worth it.

If this issue ever made it to the courts Apple might open padora's box.
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post #15 of 73
Apple's attempts at creating a closed ecosystem will continue to fail.

People in general detest being told what or what not they can do with something they put a lot of their hardworking hours to achieve.


Anyone can get a computer and a AT&T 3G connect card and do whatever they want, disrupt the entire network if they can. Run any software they want. They are held liable for their actions.

It makes no difference with the iPhone, it's a computer and a cell phone, people should be able to do what they want, run what software they want. They are held liable for their actions just the same.

It's on AT&T's end to monitor their network and stop any disruptions, because there are bound to people that will do so regardless. Trying to prevent issues on the phone side is stupid and reeks of the bottom up approach to problem solving.


The only reason the iPhone is locked down is to promote the App Store and profits for Apple. Step outside their closed ecosystem and you void your warranty, how stupid is that?

Apple is about to repeat the same mistakes again with the iPad.


A possible solution is to allow a legitimate means to jailbreak one's device, with appropriate risk warnings of course, therefore allowing software to be installed from third party sources outside the App Store.

Apple can continue to update the iPhone OS and firmware, place safeguards in to protect the hardware just like they do with OS X and EFI.

Leave the Disney World like "App Store" to the kiddies where Apple seems to like to keep it.


If I want to play Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Removable Game with my large touchscreen iPad I should be allowed to do so, I'm a adult.
post #16 of 73
I know I am not much of a video maker ( http://www.peafowl.com/videoblog.html ) and a music teacher but can someone tell me the point of the video with the story "New hack could allow 'jailbroken' Apple iPads at launch". The story is good as well as the information and if one uses an imagination, the same can be said for the video ( this type of music is not my cup of tea, but I do use some of this kind of music in my class, for the kids, not me!) ...but my peacock videos make as much sense with story!

Sorry,
post #17 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Not true. The warranty is voided by the action of jailbreaking even if you subsequently restore the phone or pad. The question is whether anyone can tell what you did.

If you restore the phone and Apple is unable to tell it was ever jailbroken, then you are still safe, but there's nothing to stop Apple from simply putting something in the firmware, or giving their store employees tools that can detect if the phone was ever *previously* jailbroken. So you can restore the phone, but it's still a gamble and if anyone finds out you did it, the warranty is still void.

Also, relying on some shifty, anonymous, quasi-criminal on the Internet to restore your phone is almost as dumb as relying on that same person to jailbreak it for you IMO.

"quasi-criminal"? - that's a pretty serious bit of name calling there... Of course you have evidence for that right?
post #18 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondgeeza View Post

"quasi-crimial"? - that's a pretty serious bit of name calling there... Of course you have evidence for that right?

Are you serious? Do you even know what "quasi-criminal" means?
post #19 of 73
Danger danger will Robinson!

Seriously this article is about 98% parental advisory note and 2% content, I'd hope for better from AI. Why don't you go ahead and suggest jailbreaking can cause cancer too.
post #20 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Are you serious? Do you even know what "quasi-criminal" means?

How does jailbreaking an iPhone resemble any criminal activity at all?

Edit: I guess you are referring to the guy who created the hack. You do need proof to back that up.
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post #21 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Are you serious? Do you even know what "quasi-criminal" means?

To me it means: A reference to a court's right to punish for actions or omissions as if they were criminal.

The most common example is finding a parent who is delinquent in child support in contempt of court and penalizing him or her with a jail sentence. When a hearing is quasi-criminal, the quasi-defendant is entitled to all due process protections afforded a criminal defendant.

What does it mean to you?
post #22 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Not true. The warranty is voided by the action of jailbreaking even if you subsequently restore the phone or pad. The question is whether anyone can tell what you did.

If you restore the phone and Apple is unable to tell it was ever jailbroken, then you are still safe, but there's nothing to stop Apple from simply putting something in the firmware, or giving their store employees tools that can detect if the phone was ever *previously* jailbroken. So you can restore the phone, but it's still a gamble and if anyone finds out you did it, the warranty is still void.

Also, relying on some shifty, anonymous, quasi-criminal on the Internet to restore your phone is almost as dumb as relying on that same person to jailbreak it for you IMO.

False. More FUD by people who don't know anything about jailbreaking. Keep your uninformed opinions to yourself, pls. Or at least specify that it is in fact uniformed opinion.

I've been jailbreaking for 3 years, and have had 2 phones replaced under warranty. Knowing what you're doing is the first part. Jailbreaking is the second.


There is some misinformation in the article, specifically regarding the required USB reboot. This is not the case at all. GEOhot has produced the most stable iPhone jailbreak, i won't ever use anything else again, nor will I ever update my firmware from 3.1.2 unless are really great reason has arisen (there ain't one).

I'm encouraged by Geohots announcement, though not surprised at all because the guy is brilliant, and will happily JB my iPad as soon as I get it home. Wouldn't want to be without it!
post #23 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpotOn View Post

Apple's attempts at creating a closed ecosystem will continue to fail.

Yup, that iPhone thing is a complete flop

Jailbraking matters to an extreme minority who aren't the target audience of these devices. Whether or not it exists will have absolutely zero effect on the success of the platform - just like it's had no affect on the success of the iPhone and iPod touch. Yet another non-issue that's presented as the end of the world in geek oriented internet echo chambers
post #24 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmfett View Post

...someone tell me the point of the video with the story "New hack could allow 'jailbroken' Apple iPads at launch".

I think it is to show that the jailbreak is "untethered," meaning that the device can be rebooted without being connected via USB to a Mac or PC (as explained on his site.) Took me a while to realize the point too.

Can anybody here please enlighten me, though, about the 3-D interface he's got there-- I assume it is tied to the jailbreak? Thanks.
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post #25 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manictosh View Post

To me it means: A reference to a court's right to punish for actions or omissions as if they were criminal.

The most common example is finding a parent who is delinquent in child support in contempt of court and penalizing him or her with a jail sentence. When a hearing is quasi-criminal, the quasi-defendant is entitled to all due process protections afforded a criminal defendant.

What does it mean to you?

Or more specifically:

"Quasi Criminal Law & Legal Definition


Quasi-criminal refers to treating an act in a civil case as if it were occuring in a criminal proceeding. It is a court's right to punish for actions or omissions as if they were criminal. For example, a person may be held in contempt of court for a civil matter, such as divorce, and be given a criminal punishment of serving jail time."

@ http://definitions.uslegal.com/q/quasi-criminal/

good first post welcome to AI
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #26 of 73
If a person with a jailbroken iPhone/iPod touch had a bunch of pirated apps on their device, that might be construed as criminal. If Apple wants to detect something, they should work on detecting that. The danger of massive jailbreaking and piracy is that app developers might get tired of being ripped off and quit developing for the platform.
post #27 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

.....I've been jailbreaking for 3 years, and have had 2 phones replaced under warranty. Knowing what you're doing is the first part. Jailbreaking is the second.

That's a key point. As I pointed out earlier, from what I've read somewhere that those who didn't know what they were doing caused problems for themselves. I guess this is like adding more RAM to your MBP, read the warnings and instructions before you open it up. er, is that an admission that you have been doing it for three years?
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post #28 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

That's a key point. As I pointed out earlier, from what I've read somewhere that those who didn't know what they were doing caused problems for themselves. I guess this is like adding more RAM to your MBP, read the warnings and instructions before you open it up. er, is that an admission that you have been doing it for three years?

Without any doubt, jailbreaking is smooth and easy for anyone who "knows what they're doing." That is a very generic statement, but it has meaning for those who "know."

I know at least 2 dozen iPhone owners who are not jailbroken, but who drool over some of the features that my iPhone has. Most of my co-workers. Truth is I don't trust any of them to not screw it up somehow, (like bringing their phone into Apple while JB'd), so I've never offered to JB for them. You need to know a little about OSX, the iPhone, programming, and general electronic device behavior. You also need to READ. If you can READ the documentation online, you can learn all you need to know, and JB to your heart's content....the sad thing is most people won't read, they just want the satisfaction without the knowledge. I for one believe that true satisfaction only comes from actually knowing. but I digress.

Jailbreaking is great, very beneficial to the user, and not "dangerous" at all. You need to be smart, and not abuse it. You need someone who has been jailbreaking for a few years to tell you the history of jailbreaking and the different quirks and behaviors that have been seen over the years. Without this, you have no way of understanding what you're seeing.

Not trying to sound arrogant, but JB's are not for all users, and really should be considered exclusive to savy and informed individuals, for safety's sake. The first time Mobile Substrate crashes on someone, it should be a shrug and restart, not a panic.
post #29 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

Not that I would want to try to jailbreak an iPad or other iDevise, I read that first if you should want to really know what you are doing and how to do it. Some who have tried have and didn't do it right were open to a worm attack specifically designed to attack that weakness. When these jailbreakers took their iPhones to an Apple store, they were informed that they had voided their warranty--so you broke it, you fix it.

Thanks, you posted just before I got mine done.

put it in DFU mode, download latest OS and restore as new

what's funny is that some of the newer jailbreaks require a Mac and won't work on Windows
post #30 of 73
GO GEO!!!!!

And yes, restoring your phone does work to unjailbreak, but in your iTunes backup of your phone there will always be fragments of your jailbreak and every app you ever DLed.
post #31 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmz View Post

Without any doubt, jailbreaking is smooth and easy for anyone who "knows what they're doing." That is a very generic statement, but it has meaning for those who "know."

I know at least 2 dozen iPhone owners who are not jailbroken, but who drool over some of the features that my iPhone has. Most of my co-workers. Truth is I don't trust any of them to not screw it up somehow, (like bringing their phone into Apple while JB'd), so I've never offered to JB for them. You need to know a little about OSX, the iPhone, programming, and general electronic device behavior. You also need to READ. If you can READ the documentation online, you can learn all you need to know, and JB to your heart's content....the sad thing is most people won't read, they just want the satisfaction without the knowledge. I for one believe that true satisfaction only comes from actually knowing. but I digress.

Jailbreaking is great, very beneficial to the user, and not "dangerous" at all. You need to be smart, and not abuse it. You need someone who has been jailbreaking for a few years to tell you the history of jailbreaking and the different quirks and behaviors that have been seen over the years. Without this, you have no way of understanding what you're seeing.

Not trying to sound arrogant, but JB's are not for all users, and really should be considered exclusive to savy and informed individuals, for safety's sake. The first time Mobile Substrate crashes on someone, it should be a shrug and restart, not a panic.

Now that was the most practical common sense post about jailbreaking I have read yet! Nice post!
I mistakenly updated to 3.13 and it killed my JB. Hopefully this wil let me JB my phone again. I can't wait to get home from work to try it.....

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post #32 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpotOn View Post

The only reason the iPhone is locked down is to promote the App Store and profits for Apple.

You appear to have forgotten to add 'in my opinion' or some such qualifier to this bald statement. This meme is rapidly becoming an internet fact, sorry FACT, but it doesn't make much sense to me.

A large proportion of apps in the app store are free to the end user, meaning they cost Apple for their hosting and bandwidth with zero financial return i.e. they represent a loss. Out of their commission on the paid apps, along with the aforementioned costs add credit card transaction fees and general admin and maintenance costs for the service. Also you have set against the remainder the loss of hardware sales (where they do make their money) to people who do not want to be restricted to the closed model. They have always said that ITS is essentially profit neutral and it looks to me that they are following the same model for the app store. Perhaps they do break even on the right side (or perhaps suffer a small loss) but compared to their overall sales it is peanuts. They provide a service to stimulate the hardware sales that earn them their multi billion dollar profits, that's what the logic looks like to me.

So why have a closed system? I suspect there are clauses in their contract with AT&T that require it, because unrestricted tethering would break their network. I think they do genuinely want to make the iPhone as secure as possible, don't you think that is a responsible attitude? A big part of Apple's hugely successful brand is user-experience, and getting your phone hacked by some iffy app out of the Ukraine does not a happy user-experience make.

It's not as though you are compelled to buy one of these things, nor do Apple try to hide the nature of the eco-system. as an informed consumer you have a choice, if you don't want such a controlled environment don't buy one. There's plenty of others to choose from, and then you can peruse your bathing beauties to your heart's content. The world seems to be filling up with people who are getting angry for the sake of getting angry, I just don't understand it.

Quote:
I'm a adult.

Thank you for the clarification.
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post #33 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterz1337 View Post

GO GEO!!!!!

And yes, restoring your phone does work to unjailbreak, but in your iTunes backup of your phone there will always be fragments of your jailbreak and every app you ever DLed.

Truth. But just like Mac OSX, a full restore does NOT included restoring from a backup. As far as I've always been concerned, restoring from backups in any scenario, defeats the purpose of the restore.
post #34 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manictosh View Post

... What does it mean to you?

Quasi means "sort of" or partially, and criminal means ... criminal. A criminal is someone who breaks the law or behaviour that is illegal.

Since a person is a technically a criminal if they break any law, (even something like running a red light, not paying your taxes on time, or violating a contract), the "quasi-criminal" term is actually being kind to the jailbreakers.

I don't see how it's contentious at all to refer to them with the relatively mild term "quasi-criminal."
post #35 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Quasi means "sort of" or partially, and criminal means ... criminal. A criminal is someone who breaks the law or behaviour that is illegal.

Since a person is a technically a criminal if they break any law, (even something like running a red light, not paying your taxes on time, or violating a contract), the "quasi-criminal" term is actually being kind to the jailbreakers.

I don't see how it's contentious at all to refer to them with the relatively mild term "quasi-criminal."

Well, you ARE wrong, so goodbye.
post #36 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Quasi means "sort of" or partially, and criminal means ... criminal. A criminal is someone who breaks the law or behaviour that is illegal.

Since a person is a technically a criminal if they break any law, (even something like running a red light, not paying your taxes on time, or violating a contract), the "quasi-criminal" term is actually being kind to the jailbreakers.

I don't see how it's contentious at all to refer to them with the relatively mild term "quasi-criminal."

You are wrong and your attitude betrays you in your words.

First of all, a person is not a criminal if they break any law (not all laws are criminal). Secondly, even if it was a criminal offense, no one would call people committing such minor acts criminals.

Thirdly, the other posters definitions are spot on. It is a big deal to treat a civil case as if it was a criminal one. The term quasi-criminal is not a term to be thrown around lightly.

Lastly, like I said, your attitude betrays you. You came up with your own definition for quasi-criminal. You claim that it means "sort of a criminal", but you also say that jailbreakers are lucky to be called that. This means that you believe people who jailbreak their phones to be practically criminals or full fledged criminals.
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post #37 of 73
Also keep in mind that all of the legit jailbreaking efforts are done for free, and anyone is free to choose not to use the free tools being provided.

And furthermore, the fact that my phone is jailbroken is hurting neither you nor Apple in any way. And considering I personally do not pirate any software, I am not hurting any developers either. This whole argument seems silly to me, given the fact that what each of us does with our hardware has absolutely no effect on others.

In other news, people sometimes paint their cars a different color, and cut the finger tips off their gloves, and put dimmer switches in their house.
post #38 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by jglavin View Post

In other news, people sometimes paint their cars a different color, and cut the finger tips off their gloves, and put dimmer switches in their house.

I J-walk when there are no cars coming in either direction but that doesn't mean I'm a bank robber. I drive above the speed limit but have never set bombs to explode on a bus if it goes below 50mph. I participate in office betting pools but have never been a bookie nor whacked a guy that couldn't pay.
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post #39 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

A criminal is someone who breaks the law or behaviour that is illegal.

Or works in banking...
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post #40 of 73
Does anyone know for a fact whether jailbreaking your own iPhone is illegal??? If so, please cite the code noting the state or if it's Federal statute. Nuff said on the legality??
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