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WSJ: Apple working on two new iPhones, including one for Verizon

post #1 of 39
Thread Starter 
In addition to a new iPhone model to be introduced this summer, Apple is also working on a CDMA-capable version that could run on the Verizon network in the U.S., sources have told The Wall Street Journal.

In a report issued Monday evening, Journal reporters Yukari Iwati Kane, Tin-I Tsai and Niraj Sheth reported that Apple "appears" to be working on a new iPhone model for Verizon Wireless. The report suggested that the CDMA iPhones might come after Apple introduces a new handset this summer, as the CDMA iPhones are not scheduled to go into mass production until September. The report noted it was "unclear when Apple might make the model available."

"The people briefed on the matter said one of the new iPhones is being manufactured by Taiwanese contract manufacturer Hon Hai Precision Industry Co., which produced Apple's previous iPhones," the report said. "The model that has CDMA capability, used by Verizon Wireless, is being manufactured by Pegatron Technology Corp., the contract manufacturing subsidiary of Taiwan's ASUSTeK Computer Inc., said these people."

Apple is expected to introduce a new iPhone model at its annual Worldwide Developers Conference this summer. A calendar listing for San Francisco's Moscone Center, where the event is usually held, has led some to believe that WWDC 2010 could take place between June 28 and July 2.

In January, Apple executives made a clear effort to demonstrate they are happy with their partnership with AT&T. The company also aimed to downplay speculation that the iPhone would become available on multiple carriers in the U.S. Apple Chief Operating Officer Tim Cook said multi-carrier strategies are not the best option for every country.

"I don't want to imply that would happen in every market or that we are headed that way in every market," Cook said in the company's quarterly earnings call. He also specifically defended AT&T and said the nation's second-largest wireless carrier is working to alleviate coverage concerns across the country.

But rumors of the end of exclusivity have persisted for years. Currently, AT&T is the sole carrier of the iPhone in the U.S.

The rumored September manufacture date reported Monday by the Journal would fit with rumors that surfaced in late 2009 that Apple could launch a UMTS/CDMA hybrid iPhone in the third quarter of calendar 2010. However, some have speculated that the technology will not be ready for the iPhone until 2011 at the earliest.

Early this year, one report alleged that Apple and Verizon were in negotiations for a summer 2010 CDMA iPhone launch, but the two companies were said to be at odds over pricing. That report alleged that Apple could still make a CDMA phone for other markets like China and Japan, even if a deal with Verizon couldn't be reached.

Sources have told AppleInsider that the new iPhone to be introduced this summer will bring the latest update to its mobile operating system, iPhone OS 4.0, and with it support for full-fledged multitasking with third-party applications.
post #2 of 39
The same time every year, like clockwork.
post #3 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

The same time every year, like clockwork.

And I still don't believe it this year.
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post #4 of 39
My Iphone is already up for sale on Ebay. Thank god! F-U AT&T!!!!!!!!!!
post #5 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by erybovic View Post

My Iphone is already up for sale on Ebay. Thank god! F-U AT&T!!!!!!!!!!

Read before you comment.

CDMA is a dead technology and a niche technology. LTE is the direction Apple is headed and it will only be with presently deployed GSM 3G technology systems.
post #6 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

The same time every year, like clockwork.

Right?!

As we've already discussed, I hope it's true for my bandwidth and stock's sake I think that most Apple has considered Verizon is to have talks with them to make AT&T bend to their will even more.

The 3G iPad, which is unlocked, doesn't even have the simple 1700Mhz radio to work T-MObile USA so if they aren't going to do that I have doubts they'll go full turkey in with Verizon as the 2nd carrier at a time when NAND is already in short supply.
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post #7 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

In addition to a new iPhone model to be introduced this summer, Apple is also working on a CDMA-capable version that could run on the Verizon network in the U.S., sources have told The Wall Street Journal. ...

It seems far more likely to me that after the major revision of the iPhone expected this year, Apple would put out an LTE version of that model instead of a CDMA one. Since this would effectively have the same end result (an iPhone for Verizon), I'm betting this is a mangled report of exactly that.

It would correspond to Apple's advertisement for an LTE engineer last week, and it makes sense that they wouldn't want to deflate the launch of the new iPhone, by having a faster one come out at the same time.
post #8 of 39
I do not believe it either, but the stock went up $5 after hours because of that rumor. Sounds more like somebody is manipulating here...
post #9 of 39
Why is it so hard for people to believe in a CDMA iPhone? This is NOT about CDMA, ATT is not the only GSM carrier in the US, it is and always has been about the exclusivity contract. Which WILL expire at some point. Every other major phone manufacturer makes CDMA phones. It would not cost Apple billions to do so, anything to the contrary is ATT fanboy misinformation (amazing how fanboys of phone companies actually exist)

LTE will not replace CDMA over night. It's going to take years and years and years for CDMA to be completely "dead." Dying tech? Sure...but one that is going to die painfully slowly. And in any case, even if Verizon could put up LTE overnight in every single market, phone calls will still be routed through CDMA for a long time! So you are prepared to say that the iPhone will not be available on Verizon for the next 5-6-7-8 years?

Riiiight.
post #10 of 39
The iPhone can't simultaneously use data and voice on Verizon's network.

A million fanbois cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.
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post #11 of 39
Okay, this time, I believe it. Why?

1 .The Apple exclusive with AT&T is clearly over. AT&T is already adding lots of 3G smartphones, including Android and Palm. We all know Apple clearly got what it wanted, but AT&T got the headstart they wanted from their partnership with Apple, in terms of data subscribers to recoup their 3G investment, and increased cash (more subscribers at higher ARPUs) to fund the deployments of HSPA+ and LTE.
2. iPhone's ability to grow further in the US is slowing. Now almost three years since its intro, those who are willing to switch to AT&T (or those who needed to wait for their 2-year plan to end) to get an iPhone have likely already done so.
3. Even with an LTE phone on Verizon next year, the Verizon iPhone would still have to support CDMA/EVDO as the backup since LTE will not cover 95% of the US for some time. So the CDMA development work is needed. As it is, I think Apple already did some of this work back in 2006; if you remember, Verizon was Apple's first choice. (Remember that Apple maintained an Intel version of OS X for several years; they could as easily maintained a CDMA version of iPhone in the lab as well.)
4. The Android threat is growing in the US and Apple isn't going to let it get entrenched at Verizon. This move has been Apple's trump card in waiting and this is the year to play it.
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post #12 of 39
Just do it if you're going to. Don't talk about it. Send me an email when it's ready to ship and I'll take two.
post #13 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by MsNly View Post

And I still don't believe it this year.

I agree with you.......... I will believe it when I see it.......

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post #14 of 39
"I do not believe it either, but the stock went up $5 after hours because of that rumor. Sounds more like somebody is manipulating here..."

If it were published any other place other than the WSJ, then I'd be inclined to agree, but not this time.
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post #15 of 39
This was baloney last year and it is baloney this year.

Apple is not going to invest in a US only technology.

And no, replying with the countries occupied by a US military base mandating US technologies does not count as it being adopted outside the US.
post #16 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe in miami View Post

"I do not believe it either, but the stock went up $5 after hours because of that rumor. Sounds more like somebody is manipulating here..."

If it were published any other place other than the WSJ, then I'd be inclined to agree, but not this time.

Agree. That would be my fifth reason. We know Apple has intentionally leaked to the WSJ (and Kane in particular). For the cynics, is Apple adopting the FUD technique to try to freeze Android sales at Verizon, having calculated that there are few additional Verizon-to-AT&T switchers so few sales would be lost in the meantime?
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post #17 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat View Post

Apple is not going to invest in a US only technology.

There are plenty of other countries that use CDMA as their primary cellular tech. Adding a CDMA iPhone would increase sales in developing nations by dozen, maybe even hundreds of units per year.
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post #18 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat View Post

Apple is not going to invest in a US only technology.

CDMA is not US only.
post #19 of 39
this is awesome i can't wait!
post #20 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Read before you comment.

CDMA is a dead technology and a niche technology. LTE is the direction Apple is headed and it will only be with presently deployed GSM 3G technology systems.

There over well over 100 million subscribers in that dead niche.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OriginalMacRat View Post

This was baloney last year and it is baloney this year.

Apple is not going to invest in a US only technology.

AT&T accounts for half of worldwide iPhones.
post #21 of 39
You all know Apple skates to where the puck will be next year. That place is not CDMA. I agree this rumor is baloney. Move along people, nothing to see here.
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenRoethig View Post

AT&T accounts for half of worldwide iPhones.

I don't think so. AT&T said they have 11m iPhone subscribers. Excluding original iPhones, there have been 36m iPhones sold.
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post #23 of 39
It's NOT gonna happen pple ! The next thing that the iPhone might get is the 3G AWS 1700Mhz band for T-Mobile NA, Wind, Mobilcity, Videotron etc.

And the next step will probably be LTE or just a faster HSPA (14Mbps, 21Mbps or 28Mbps) in the mean time. That's it.

Adi
post #24 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Okay, this time, I believe it. Why?

1 .The Apple exclusive with AT&T is clearly over. AT&T is already adding lots of 3G smartphones, including Android and Palm. We all know Apple clearly got what it wanted, but AT&T got the headstart they wanted from their partnership with Apple, in terms of data subscribers to recoup their 3G investment, and increased cash (more subscribers at higher ARPUs) to fund the deployments of HSPA+ and LTE.
2. iPhone's ability to grow further in the US is slowing. Now almost three years since its intro, those who are willing to switch to AT&T (or those who needed to wait for their 2-year plan to end) to get an iPhone have likely already done so.
3. Even with an LTE phone on Verizon next year, the Verizon iPhone would still have to support CDMA/EVDO as the backup since LTE will not cover 95% of the US for some time. So the CDMA development work is needed. As it is, I think Apple already did some of this work back in 2006; if you remember, Verizon was Apple's first choice. (Remember that Apple maintained an Intel version of OS X for several years; they could as easily maintained a CDMA version of iPhone in the lab as well.)
4. The Android threat is growing in the US and Apple isn't going to let it get entrenched at Verizon. This move has been Apple's trump card in waiting and this is the year to play it.

Well-argued. I am inclined to agree with you.
post #25 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Okay, this time, I believe it. Why?

1 .The Apple exclusive with AT&T is clearly over. AT&T is already adding lots of 3G smartphones, including Android and Palm. We all know Apple clearly got what it wanted, but AT&T got the headstart they wanted from their partnership with Apple, in terms of data subscribers to recoup their 3G investment, and increased cash (more subscribers at higher ARPUs) to fund the deployments of HSPA+ and LTE.
2. iPhone's ability to grow further in the US is slowing. Now almost three years since its intro, those who are willing to switch to AT&T (or those who needed to wait for their 2-year plan to end) to get an iPhone have likely already done so.
3. Even with an LTE phone on Verizon next year, the Verizon iPhone would still have to support CDMA/EVDO as the backup since LTE will not cover 95% of the US for some time. So the CDMA development work is needed. As it is, I think Apple already did some of this work back in 2006; if you remember, Verizon was Apple's first choice. (Remember that Apple maintained an Intel version of OS X for several years; they could as easily maintained a CDMA version of iPhone in the lab as well.)
4. The Android threat is growing in the US and Apple isn't going to let it get entrenched at Verizon. This move has been Apple's trump card in waiting and this is the year to play it.

As anantksundaram states your points are well argued and i want to agree with you as I think an official Verizon announcement would account for an extra ten points in the stock price almost immediately and get people off AT&T, which works well for me.

1) I agree that the contractual obligations are likely over, but I don't think that means another contract can't be had and that Apple may using rumours they created or actual meets with Verizon to make AT&T's butt pucker and give Apple even more control. Plus, if the NAND supply issue is real, going for a carrier larger than AT&T in the US may not be the smartest move until that gets resolved.

2) It is slowing, but the worldwide growth is still strong. Since it's the total YoY growth that matters it might be best for long term shareholder interest for a more controlled growth.

3) Apple isn't the first to jump on new tech that isn't well tested and I've seen nary a cellphone LTE radio, nor heard anything about price, size or power usage. I think an LTE iPhone may not show up until at least 2012.

4) The Android threat is growing. Even AdMod shows that Android is about to surpass the iPhone and I think it could be this year that Andorid-based phones could outsell the iPhone in a quarter. It's just inevitable with so many possible units in play, but like the Mac snagging a reported 35% of OEM PC operating profits worldwide yet having only only a few percentage of the market, I don't think they car about that or we would have seen the iPhone OS v4.0 get demoed before the typical 1 year, not after.
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post #26 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

As anantksundaram states your points are well argued and i want to agree with you as I think an official Verizon announcement would account for an extra ten points in the stock price almost immediately and get people off AT&T, which works well for me.

1) I agree that the contractual obligations are likely over, but I don't think that means another contract can't be had and that Apple may using rumours they created or actual meets with Verizon to make AT&T's butt pucker and give Apple even more control. Plus, if the NAND supply issue is real, going for a carrier larger than AT&T in the US may not be the smartest move until that gets resolved.

Given my point 2, I don't think another contract with AT&T has much to offer to Apple in terms of phone sales. I actually see an Apple exit strategy that attempts to stem any loss of AT&T iPhone customers to Verizon - AT&T has just about resolved its worst network issues (excepting NYC), is gaining a significant though short-term advantage over Verizon with 7.2Mbps HSPA+ in some areas, is selling femtocells, has simultaneous voice/data, and will likely enable tethering by then. A June iPhone launch for AT&T and a Oct launch for Verizon fits as a concession to AT&T. (The Oct launch will be long after any NAND supply issue is resolved.)

Quote:
2) It is slowing, but the worldwide growth is still strong. Since it's the total YoY growth that matters it might be best for long term shareholder interest for a more controlled growth.

But worldwide growth may be slowing by winter 2010. Regardless, a Verizon launch in Oct would be a perfect boost to carry sales thru June 2011.

Quote:
3) Apple isn't the first to jump on new tech that isn't well tested and I've seen nary a cellphone LTE radio, nor heard anything about price, size or power usage. I think an LTE iPhone may not show up until at least 2012.

Agree that an LTE phone is more likely in 2012 even if Verizon tries to sweeten the deal. But my point still holds, CDMA/EVDO would still be needed in the 2012 LTE Verizon phone.

Quote:
4) The Android threat is growing. Even AdMod shows that Android is about to surpass the iPhone and I think it could be this year that Andorid-based phones could outsell the iPhone in a quarter. It's just inevitable with so many possible units in play, but like the Mac snagging a reported 35% of OEM PC operating profits worldwide yet having only only a few percentage of the market, I don't think they car about that or we would have seen the iPhone OS v4.0 get demoed before the typical 1 year, not after.

I think Apple isn't worried about Android phones or sales levels in general, but it is concerned only about Google-branded Android phones, as Google looks to be able to significantly subsidize both the carriers (cheaper data plans) and consumers (cheaper handset price) with its search/ad revenue. Google phones, with good-enough functionality and design, and heavily subsidized, are a real threat that could truly slow iPhone sales. Can Apple wait another year and allow Google to get its "Google phone" act fully together? I wouldn't risk it.

As for iPhone OS 4.0, I think it would've been shown already if not for the iPad launch. Apple has neither released nor announced anything (hardware or software) major since the iPad event. Aperture and OS X 10.6.3 are not major. There's a laser-sharp marketing focus on launching the iPad category.
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post #27 of 39
I do agree that if a CDMA-based iPhone does come out that it won't hit shelves until months after the next GSM-based iPhone hits shelves.
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post #28 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by adisor19 View Post

It's NOT gonna happen pple ! The next thing that the iPhone might get is the 3G AWS 1700Mhz band for T-Mobile NA, Wind, Mobilcity, Videotron etc.

And the next step will probably be LTE or just a faster HSPA (14Mbps, 21Mbps or 28Mbps) in the mean time. That's it.

Adi

NO. If the iPhone is LTE on Verizon it will have to support CDMA until at least 2013-2014 as a backup (like GSM 3G/Edge). If Apple thinks they can not release a phone on Verizon for 3-4 more years and still be in the game they are sorely mistaken.
post #29 of 39
Why are AI and WSJ so gullible? keep up the good work
post #30 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Read before you comment.

CDMA is a dead technology and a niche technology. LTE is the direction Apple is headed and it will only be with presently deployed GSM 3G technology systems.

LTE is the direction Verizon is headed at the end of this summer which is directly backwards compatible with CDMA & will be for many years. At&T will be catching up true....Only to find G.S.M will also be the same, a dead end technology eventually..............for L.T.E.

Your logic isn't exactly informative.
post #31 of 39
Verizon? Never!

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post #32 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by g3pro View Post

The iPhone can't simultaneously use data and voice on Verizon's network.

A million fanbois cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.

Yet you can Skype for free on any Blackberry or Android over their 3g network.

Get the Fuck out of here!
post #33 of 39
Jesus H. Christ. Some of you fanboys amaze me.

If you want to stay on T, feel free to. If they give you better and faster service in your area, good. I'm glad you live in an area where that's the case and you can stay put. I personally could give a flying you know what about talking and using the web at the same time, where VZW's network goes to speeds that are faster on 3G than most AT&T areas (2.2 mbps per second down and 700 kbps per second on a friend's Droid here in Chester, Illinois) while my town probably won't be wired for AT&T's 3G this year.

The CDMA argument doesn't hold much water for me either for three reasons.

1. Establishing a relationship with Verizon isn't so much for CDMA but for future technologies, mainly LTE. Since a VZW iPhone will have to have some sort of CDMA fallback for voice in the beginning, it would be good for Apple to get a head start there.
2. Extending the technology for putting simultaneous voice/data would as simple as implementing IMS network wide for Verizon, and they're already at work to do just that.
3. In the end, Apple is about getting things to just work. Most people couldn't care about the urinating matches between CDMA and GSM, they just want to get fast access to the Web and to have call quality be good without dropped calls. Verizon's network does better than AT&T for the most part.
post #34 of 39
On a whole AT&T sucks no worst then Verizon. In some ways AT&T is better. For instance, it is willing to budge in terms of pricing; change it's network specifically for Apple [e.g. visual voice mail]; and the network is superior in some forms [e.g. ability to use both data and voice at the same time].


Personally, I see Apple coming to Verizon at some point, but I would be surprised if Apple doesn't give T-Mobile a chance to play first. Apple could very well be developing CDMA for other countries like China and Brazil.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

As anantksundaram states your points are well argued and i want to agree with you as I think an official Verizon announcement would account for an extra ten points in the stock price almost immediately and get people off AT&T, which works well for me.
post #35 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

On a whole AT&T sucks no worst then Verizon. In some ways AT&T is better. For instance, it is willing to budge in terms of pricing; change it's network specifically for Apple [e.g. visual voice mail]; and the network is superior in some forms [e.g. ability to use both data and voice at the same time].


Personally, I see Apple coming to Verizon at some point, but I would be surprised if Apple doesn't give T-Mobile a chance to play first. Apple could very well be developing CDMA for other countries like China and Brazil.

That's pretty much the rest of my take on it.

If they make CDMA for the rest of the world China's 3rd largest carrier could use it, to though It's only 56M subs and I've heard no news of talks with China Telecom. China Mobile on the other hand has 532M subs, but does require a new device for their TS-SCDMA network.

I'm not seeing much CDMA in Brazil. I see some D-AMPS for 2G but It looks a lot of their carriers have moved to UMTS for their 3G. Of course, Wikipedia can be outdated and/or incomplete.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...tors#By_region Regardless, I'll take the iPhone everywhere as I'm sure it will bump the stock tremendously.
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post #36 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

The same time every year, like clockwork.

yep. and it is still more likely that Apple won't ever do a CDMA phone and Verizon will have to wait for LTE. or for someone to make a trip chip that doesn't eat battery life faster than a sumo wrestler at a pasta festival

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark2005 View Post

Okay, this time, I believe it. Why?

1 .The Apple exclusive with AT&T is clearly over.

you know this because you've seen the contract and you know the end date.

Quote:
AT&T is already adding lots of 3G smartphones, including Android and Palm.

oh so you also saw in that contract that you've seen that ATT was not allowed to have other 3g smart phones while they had the iphone.

Quote:
2. iPhone's ability to grow further in the US is slowing.

AND you have access to the iphone sales numbers and how many are upgrades v newcomers. You are so connected.

Quote:
if you remember, Verizon was Apple's first choice.

something that was probably settled before the first prototypes came out.

Quote:
4. The Android threat is growing in the US and Apple isn't going to let it get entrenched at Verizon. This move has been Apple's trump card in waiting and this is the year to play it.

Cause Apple is so worried about what the competitors are doing. Especially when they are only making millions and not billions of dollars in sales each week.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

There are plenty of other countries that use CDMA as their primary cellular tech.

Last stats I saw, China is the largest CDMA area in the world. However China Unicom is selling the GSM iphone (since last October) and there's been a huge blackmarket for GSM iphones since day one. Puts a little dent in that argument.
post #37 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by g3pro View Post

The iPhone can't simultaneously use data and voice on Verizon's network.

A million fanbois cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced.

If they did release an iPhone on Verizon it would probably be the iPhone 'Lite' so that it didn't get confused with the real thing that can do data and voice at the same time.

Not sure which other features to cripple to make it cheaper but I'm sure Verizon could think of some.

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post #38 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

Last stats I saw, China is the largest CDMA area in the world. However China Unicom is selling the GSM iphone (since last October) and there's been a huge blackmarket for GSM iphones since day one. Puts a little dent in that argument.

Not that many. While China's CDMA provider, China Telecom, is their 3rd largest carrier they currently only have about 60M subscribers, 2/3 the size of Verizon. When you compare it to China Unicom's 150M subs on GSM or China Mobile's 535M subs on TD-SCDMA they are don't look so hot.
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post #39 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

something that was probably settled before the first prototypes came out.

And you were there for that?

Quote:
Cause Apple is so worried about what the competitors are doing. Especially when they are only making millions and not billions of dollars in sales each week.

Who said Apple is worried? Regardless, Apple doesn't plot its strategy blindly, as we've seen how up-to-speed they were regarding competitor's netbooks (over the last two years) and smartphones (before the iPhone).

Quote:
Last stats I saw, China is the largest CDMA area in the world. However China Unicom is selling the GSM iphone (since last October) and there's been a huge blackmarket for GSM iphones since day one. Puts a little dent in that argument.

There's no iPhone exclusive in China (see iphonasia.com). Apple is still talking with China Mobile, so it wouldn't be out of the question for them to also be talking to China Telecom. Still, it is 60M potential subs; much more than those in most of the remaining countries still without iPhone.
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set you free."
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"you will know the truth, and the truth will
set you free."
Reply
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