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Apple releases new MacBook Pros with Intel Core i7, i5 processors - Page 6

post #201 of 335
4/13/10 at 12:49pm
What I really want is a MacBook Air with 4GB of ram. However, the 1680x1050 anti-glare display makes the 15" MacBook Pro rather tempting.
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post #202 of 335
4/13/10 at 12:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce Young View Post

Depends on what is meant by average user and what kind of games.

For the average user - if the definition is web browsing, email, document processing and typical multimedia of iTunes, iPhoto and movie watching, then the Core 2 Duo (C2D) is plenty of power. and certainly the lower end i-series is more than adequate. Since the real value of the i-series CPU is in the multi-core multi-threading, and most of the average user applications don't exploit multi-threading that much. Thus the two cores you get in either C2D or the i3 or i5 is sufficient for the average user.

Re. games, for the kind of games that I do, sudoku, mahjong and the like, C2D is plenty. It's even OK for the role-play type games that my daughter likes. But if you are into high video action shooter games, then the question is not as simple. (and I have no inclination in that direction, but high-end gamers seem to want high-end machines... if the articles and comments posted are followed).

Perfect, thank you.

Had a buddy chime in on the video portion. His contention is that even with these offerings, the PC cards available are much faster. If your a gamer, you probably have a PC sitting next to your Mac and optimize. Or, in his case, buy an gaming console. Way better value for the dollar than trying to turn your laptop into a high end gaming platform.
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post #203 of 335
4/13/10 at 12:59pm
Has anyone seen any benchmarks between the past version of the MBP (running 2.8 ghz) to the new line. I am tempted to get the I5 at 2.4 thinking that overall optimization will push it a bit faster than what I use now, but would love some stats on this.
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post #204 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:00pm
It's mind-boggling to me that my 2007 SR-MBP has the same amount of VRAM as some of these new machines. What is happening here? I'm very, very disappointed. I originally planned to upgrade, but I think I'll just get a new 500GB HD now to give my MBP a new lease on life.
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post #205 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by macapptraining View Post

maybe next year we will see 4-core macbook pro's (probably just in 17-incher).

The current quad-core mobile chips are 45nm. These generate too much heat and drain the battery too quickly to seriously consider putting in a high-volume laptop. Only the dual-core Arrandales are 32nm now. Next year Intel will release quad-core 32nm mobile chips. Those will find their way into the 15" and 17" MacBooks Pro and perhaps the 13" MacBook Pro too.
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post #206 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

Yes, it's been suggested. OWC has an eSATA adapter for $40.

I use the OWC eSata express card in my MBP and it works well. I think having the express card slot is more versatile than putting in a SD card slot. I already have an external SD card reader that is multi functional for the different kinds of storage I am using. At least they have one in the 17" now if I have to replace my MBP. When they eventually add the USB3 to all their laptops & desktops, I don't think the eSata I will be using as often.
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post #207 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:54pm
I expected there to be an option for a 1440x900 13" Macbook. The 1280x800 resolution just doesn't cut if for most of us. Aah well, at least I can always get the 1680x1050 Core i5 15" Macbook Pro.
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post #208 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbonner View Post

Has anyone seen any benchmarks between the past version of the MBP (running 2.8 ghz) to the new line. I am tempted to get the I5 at 2.4 thinking that overall optimization will push it a bit faster than what I use now, but would love some stats on this.

Never mind, it was as if Apple Insider was listening, they just posted the benchmark.
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post #209 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by gotApple View Post

LOL! Geforce 330M is just renamed Geforce what 9600? Which was renamed Geforce 8600... Is that 17" actually slower than the previous MacBookPro?

330M is a rebrand of the 240M. 9600M GT was a rebrand of the 8600M GT. The rebranding doesn't mean identical though - the 9600M GT was faster than the 8600M GT.

The 330M is double the speed of the 9600M GT.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gotApple View Post

EDIT: I was hoping that this refresh would bring the graphics department up to date. It didn't. I need to look elsewhere for a new laptop.

They could have put in a faster GPU and you'd get lower battery life and more heat. The 330M plays Crysis on High Quality:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyAVNJa5d-E

I doubt you need more than that in a laptop with an 8 hour battery.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gotApple View Post

HAHAHA My old 8800GTX (sold it away ages ago) from 2006 had 128 cores. 330M (same family BTW) has 48 cores... Not buying that old tech again, sorry Steve.

You're comparing a desktop GPU that draws 130 Watts to a laptop GPU that draws 35 Watts. The fastest non-SLI mobile GPU from NVidia draws 75W. Sure it has 128 cores like the 8800 but your battery would last less than half the time and your fan would have to run at maximum strength (Crysis reference) all the time when it was maxed out.

Apple only really had a few realistic options to have high performance enough graphics and maintain the battery life. The fastest they probably could have gone for was the Radeon 5830 from ATI or the GTS 250M from NVidia. But even at that, you're talking about 25-40% speed increase over the 330M. That's only an issue when you get a game that the GPU can't handle and it's the difference between playable or unplayable. When it's down to high graphics or enthusiast graphics, it's really a non-issue.
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post #210 of 335
4/13/10 at 1:59pm
For those interested in an awesome comparison of the new specs against the old, here you go.

Link
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post #211 of 335
4/13/10 at 2:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by orion99 View Post

For those interested in an awesome comparison of the new specs against the old, here you go.

Link

Great chart! Thanks. I hadn't realized some of the price changes and battery size increases between models.
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post #212 of 335
4/13/10 at 2:10pm
What? No BJ or happy ending?
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post #213 of 335
4/13/10 at 2:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

330M is a rebrand of the 240M. 9600M GT was a rebrand of the 8600M GT. The rebranding doesn't mean identical though - the 9600M GT was faster than the 8600M GT.

The 330M is double the speed of the 9600M GT.

Sure, I'd love to see such benchmarks.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-...M.22437.0.html

"The performance of the GT 330M is similar to the GeForce GT 240M and therefore located in the range of the Mobility Radeon HD 4650. The card supports DirectX 10.1 and all the features of the GT 230M / 240M (as it is based on the same GT216 core). The modern ATI Radeon HD 5650 offers DirectX 11 effects and performs better.

Modern and demanding DirectX 10 and 11 games (like Crysis or Risen) can only be played fluently with medium detail settings and resolution settings. Less demanding games like Sims 3 run in high details and resolutions."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


They could have put in a faster GPU and you'd get lower battery life and more heat. The 330M plays Crysis on High Quality:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyAVNJa5d-E

I doubt you need more than that in a laptop with an 8 hour battery.

You're comparing a desktop GPU that draws 130 Watts to a laptop GPU that draws 35 Watts. The fastest non-SLI mobile GPU from NVidia draws 75W. Sure it has 128 cores like the 8800 but your battery would last less than half the time and your fan would have to run at maximum strength (Crysis reference) all the time when it was maxed out.

Apple only really had a few realistic options to have high performance enough graphics and maintain the battery life. The fastest they probably could have gone for was the Radeon 5830 from ATI or the GTS 250M from NVidia. But even at that, you're talking about 25-40% speed increase over the 330M. That's only an issue when you get a game that the GPU can't handle and it's the difference between playable or unplayable. When it's down to high graphics or enthusiast graphics, it's really a non-issue.

Whatever. It's still based on that 2006 tech which is a shame. 5830 would have been nice. And I mean really nice. Could have dual booted to DX11 Win7...
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post #214 of 335
4/13/10 at 2:54pm
High end = Core i7.

Yessssss
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post #215 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:05pm
I don't care about a few milli seconds of speed improvement to open and store a Pages document but I care about ergonomics and as such I'm disappointed about the missing matte feature for the 13"MBP. Phil, no good, no good at all.
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post #216 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenRoethig View Post

The continued use of Core 2 Duos in the 13" is a bit dissapointed, but overall a pretty good update, bordering on great for the 15 and 17 inch models. I would have also preferred 16:9 displays, but they did just update the form factor.

Why would you want a computer at 16:9? It just takes away vertical workspace - you can't get an entire document page on the screen.

Is it that big a deal to watch video that's a little shorter than the screen?
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post #217 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RageX View Post

Really surprised the 13 inch didn't get a resolution update. That baseline 15 inch is looking pretty good. Solid updates.

I'm pretty undecided about the higher resolution - it makes menus awfully small. Good that you have a choice on the 15", but the anti-glare screen is available only in the higher resolution.
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post #218 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984 View Post

He's full of it. Why is it not a "bag of hurt" for any other manufacturers? The ONLY reason they don't offer it is because they don't want anything to compete with their "HD Lite" digital downloads.

That's totally not true, and a bit paranoid on your part. Did you see the presentation of iPhone 4.0? Jobs highlighted the Netflix app, talking about how great it is. In the video distribution market, Netflix is kicking Apple's butt. If your theory is true, why is Apple pumping up their competitor Netflix?
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post #219 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by elroth View Post

That's totally not true, and a bit paranoid on your part. Did you see the presentation of iPhone 4.0? Jobs highlighted the Netflix app, talking about how great it is. In the video distribution market, Netflix is kicking Apple's butt. If your theory is true, why is Apple pumping up their competitor Netflix?

Yeah, I agree. Blu-Ray isn't really "competing" with iTunes-downloads anyway, since the difference in quality is so striking. Blu-Ray is about quality, iTunes is about convenience. These two things do not necessarily compete, but they do complement each other. As of now, Apple is offering its American customers convenience, but not quality. The rest of the world (movies can only be bought in the US-ITMS) gets neither.
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post #220 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by elroth View Post

I'm pretty undecided about the higher resolution - it makes menus awfully small. Good that you have a choice on the 15", but the anti-glare screen is available only in the higher resolution.

I can't wait until RI comes to OS X so that Apple can increase dot pitch without affecting the readability of their displays. This is one area that MS has done a better job. They don't have RI either but they do have Windows Presentation Foundation which is a good intermediate solution.
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post #221 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

Bingo. The only reason there's no BR on any Macs to date is because that's the way SJ wants it.

Yeah, but it's not because BD (Blue-Ray is abbreviated BD) is competing with iTunes. It's more likely because only about 10% of people care about having it. It would be nice if there were more options for a lot of things with Apple, but that's not their business model..
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post #222 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by elroth View Post

Why would you want a computer at 16:9? It just takes away vertical workspace - you can't get an entire document page on the screen.

Is it that big a deal to watch video that's a little shorter than the screen?

It never ceases to amaze me that anyone would purchase a Mac to use as a video player?

No Blue Ray and no 16:9 ???

They were never going to buy a Mac in the first place.

To those of you still complaining about these 'serious' drawbacks please STFU
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post #223 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984 View Post

Yeah because something basic like Blu-Ray, which EVERY OTHER MAJOR PC MANUFACTURER OFFERS is unobtainable "pixie dust" when it comes to Apple. If they ever do offer it I'm sure it will be described as "magical"

Just buy a bloody external BluRay drive. Easy-schmeezy. $382USD at Newegg.
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post #224 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by macbuff View Post

Anyone notice the "antiglare" option on the high res 15" display? It's not advertised at "matte" - so what is it?

I was worried about that too, but I was just in an Apple Store that still had the older MacBook Pros on display - even on the older ones it was called "anti-glare" and not matte, at least on their signs.

They didn't have any new ones out yet, so I couldn't actually look at it to see if it was the same.
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post #225 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984 View Post

He's full of it. Why is it not a "bag of hurt" for any other manufacturers? The ONLY reason they don't offer it is because they don't want anything to compete with their "HD Lite" digital downloads.

over a lot of processors. By running on fully commoditized hardware systems they can still charge you what look like nice low prices on even cheaper components, which is why the average person trades out a PC every two years nowadays. The darn things just simply stop working. How do you think PC makers are able to keep sales up in a rapidly saturated market (US)?

Seriously you really don't get the market do you. People have already purchased boatloads of content on DVD, the market for Blu-Ray is mostly in combo packs for current titles. They aren't seeing any demand for Blu-Ray legacy content - which is where a lot of the format-change market is. Folks are still buying DVDs of their old VHS titles fer friggin' sakes.
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post #226 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:52pm
Automatic switch between GPU's and audio through Mini DisplayPort - finally!

Those two things should never have been missing on the unibody, but I'm glad they finally fixed it. I guess that means I will still have to stick to the faster GPU on my first-gen unibody MBP and just deal with the shorter battery time - I doubt that will come as a software upgrade, sadly.

I want one! ;-)
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post #227 of 335
4/13/10 at 3:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by masternav View Post

Because they are able to spread the licensing out over a lot of processors. By running on fully commoditized hardware systems they can still charge you what look like nice low prices on even cheaper components, which is why the average person trades out a PC every two years nowadays. The darn things just simply stop working. How do you think PC makers are able to keep sales up in a rapidly saturated market (US)?

Licensing aside, is it really worth it for Apple to offer a $500 Blu-ray drive when their most popular product are 13" with 800 horizontal lines and 15" with 900 horizontal lines? Who in their right mind would pay that just to watch movies? Each year it seems less likely yet the desire becomes more rampant. Reports show that digital streaming/downloading brings in more profit than Blu-ray.
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post #228 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:13pm
The prices they are asking are insane for what they are offering. Factor in the poor (but necessary AppleCare) and things get ridiculous.

I'm staying away from this line until 200 euros gets chopped off across the board or they start to bundle AppleCare with them at no extra cost.
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post #229 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Licensing aside, is it really worth it for Apple to offer a $500 Blu-ray drive when their most popular product are 13" with 800 horizontal lines and 15" with 900 horizontal lines?

Two reasons:

1.) MacBooks have DVI output. So if you don't already have a blu-ray player, you could use the MacBook as your main blu-ray source, hooking it up to your HDTV.

2.) If you have a collection of titles on blu-ray, it might be nice to be able to watch them "on the move", even if you can't benefit from the full resolution.
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post #230 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:20pm
Is the apple care essential? How long is the guarantee over here in the states? (just moved here)
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post #231 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. H View Post

Two reasons:

1.) MacBooks have DVI output. So if you don't already have a blu-ray player, you could use the MacBook as your main blu-ray source, hooking it up to your HDTV.

2.) If you have a collection of titles on blu-ray, it might be nice to be able to watch them "on the move", even if you can't benefit from the full resolution.

I can see how it would be nice for the people that want to use their MBs as HTPC or carry with them a stack of encrypted BRDs, but I can't see how that would be something Apple would cater to since the market for that is so small. Apple doesn't even market the Mac Mini as an HTPC by adding HDMI or allowing for it to boot into the AppleTV OS.
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post #232 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I can see how it would be nice for the people that want to use their MBs as HTPC or carry with them a stack of encrypted BRDs, but I can't see how that would be something Apple would cater to since the market for that is so small. Apple doesn't even market the Mac Mini as an HTPC by adding HDMI or allowing for it to boot into the AppleTV OS.

Apple has never understood the living room. It's why AppleTV is still a hobby. Apple are missing so many opportunities here to be head-and-shoulders above the rest of the market; it makes my head hurt.

How do you know what size the market is? The development effort required by Apple would be tiny; as you say just offer it as a $500 option and see who goes for it.
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post #233 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RabidRabbit View Post

Is the apple care essential? How long is the guarantee over here in the states? (just moved here)

Essential is hard to gauge, but it does come in handy. I find that it also helps if you resell your Macs frequently.
http://www.apple.com/support/products/mac.html
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post #234 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh.B. View Post

I think that you have a couple of choices: Settle for LCD performance or look at another brand of laptop. Gamers have looked elsewhere for years.

is this an example of the quantity vs. quality issue called earlier?

Everyone has opinions. Not all opinions are the same. Some are "good" opinions, based in actual vs. attributed fact. Others are questionable or "bad" opinions where facts are more, shall we say, loosely defined and the rigor is in flogging the opinion with great vigor, not accuracy.

The term "whiney" comes up in these threads a lot because much of the commentary stems out of the recurring theme of "I want, I want, I want". Or a Cartmaneque "RESPECT MA AUTHORITAY". There is a wide market of standard, semi-custom, and fully custom laptops out there. You can have Blu-Ray, eSata, HDMI, USB3, 16:9 full HD, and TB hard drives. It will perform as well as you desire it to (hopefully) and give you bragging rights on features. And a 10lb laptop. With 3 hours of battery life - unless of course you buy the 5lb extended battery, which will give you 6 hours. They are called trade-offs - which is why many in this forum are not in the computer industry as very successful designers and engineers of hardware. The proof of performance is not completely in the stats but in the actual hands-on usage. which is why you can buy a statistically higher performance/higher featured PC which still pretty much sucks and will be replaced on average in 3 years.
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post #235 of 335
4/13/10 at 4:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. H View Post

Apple has never understood the living room. It's why AppleTV is still a hobby. Apple are missing so many opportunities here to be head-and-shoulders above the rest of the market; it makes my head hurt.

How do you know what size the market is? The development effort required by Apple would be tiny; as you say just offer it as a $500 option and see who goes for it.

I can judge the desire by looking at the uptake of PCs with Blu-ray and the Blu-ray market as a whole, which includes the living room where Blu-ray is ideal. I don't think it's great enough for a company like Apple to worry about, especially with them working to push digital downloads and my other theory that they are holding to CD/DVD drives until they can remove the optical drive altogether since it's slow, power hungry and takes up 25% of the internal space of the 13" MB/MBP.

Plus, even if they add it they still have to support AACS in the OS for protected Blu-ray videos to play. It seems to me that if they were fine with Blu-ray as a technology they would have added the OS elements long ago so that external or 3rd-party internal Blu-ray drives could play Blu-ray media.
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post #236 of 335
4/13/10 at 5:20pm
This troll is still waiting for the 13" matte/anti-glare option to upgrade from his 12" powerbook.

Might be time to find another option for my mobile business needs.
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post #237 of 335
4/13/10 at 5:22pm
No blueray, no hdmi, no full keyboard, no fair price! And I'm a mac user! Come on apple. 1799 for a low end i5? Show some competitive pricing. The MBP i5/i7 are priced like a some rare gem stone. i5/i7 are plentiful and priced less than 1500 on the pc. Fail
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post #238 of 335
4/13/10 at 5:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by elroth View Post

I was worried about that too, but I was just in an Apple Store that still had the older MacBook Pros on display - even on the older ones it was called "anti-glare" and not matte, at least on their signs.

They didn't have any new ones out yet, so I couldn't actually look at it to see if it was the same.

The Apple store here in Austin says the high res and anti glare will be on display tomorrow.
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post #239 of 335
4/13/10 at 5:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Fix View Post

This troll is still waiting for the 13" matte/anti-glare option to upgrade from his 12" powerbook.

Might be time to find another option for my mobile business needs.

I've read good review about this.
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post #240 of 335
4/13/10 at 5:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kung Fu Guy View Post

No blueray, no hdmi, no full keyboard, no fair price! And I'm a mac user! Come on apple. 1799 for a low end i5? Show some competitive pricing. The MBP i5/i7 are priced like a some rare gem stone. i5/i7 are plentiful and priced less than 1500 on the pc. Fail

Apple is Doomed!
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