Fourth generation iPhone prototype's finder, keeper revealed - Page 2

Originally Posted by str1f3

While I think that this kid, in effect did steal it by trying to sell it to Engadget and Gizmodo, I don't think he should be prosecuted. Everyone is fallible and makes mistakes. He sounds decent if what his lawyer says is true. The evil party is Gizmodo for revealing the Apple engineer's name.

If it was me, though, I would have sent the device back to Apple with a note hoping to get a MBP and the new iPhone when it comes out.

Originally Posted by macslut

AI isn't outing the guy. They're reporting on what was revealed by Wired and CNET.

Also, this is much different from outing the engineer. In both cases, outing wasn't illegal, but outing the engineer was definitely a douche move by Gizmodo. Wired and CNET are reporting on a public case and didn't break any laws to do so. The finder was going to be named at some point due to his own unethical actions.

"Innocent until proven guilty."

All of what I have said is based on the claims of Gizmodo and Hogan himself.

Originally Posted by k2director

Dude, I wasn't serious about the earthquake. It's called hyperbole...

Originally Posted by macologist

I am not thrilled to see LEFT, RIGHT, and other LABELS get into this forum... There is an App for that -- TV, talk radio, etc... Why bring it here, where it's supposed to be about Mac..

I do agree with you, but I'd just call it STUPID! A misguided sense of loyalty, Journalists Of The World, Unite, Stick Together!

The Press should be the first ones to BEAT UP on those GIZHOLES, instead of standing by/with them! They are no Freedom Fighter, but CHARLATANS who have not paid their dues, and tried CUT THE LINE!!!

It's too bad that John Stewart, even though it was a funny skit, ended up being very one sided!!! Even though he fights for his RATINGS, he should have put JUSTICE FIRST!!! Those GIZHOLES "journalists" are NO HEROES! The are a LOW LIVES RATINGS WHORES!!! They must PAY!!!

Of course it looks icky when you hear about the search of that "journalist's" home, but when that "journalist" acts like CRIMINAL, who is tech savvy, and can delete evidence in a Billions of $$ worth of Industrial Spying Case, it would have been dumb to set an appointment for a search!!! Let that "journalist" now sit with the police and watch him go through his hard drives, asking Q's! Yes, the lawyers will call it inadmissible evidence, fishing expedition, and similar lingo... The lawyers and Chen will be allowed to make sure that there was no planted evidence... In the end, let GizHOLES pay for the ENTIRE COST of this INVESTIGATION that must be concluded!!!

And I am not even gonna touch the Conspiracy Theories of Apple planting this whole story!!! I simply don't believe that they would!!! And if they did, GizHOLES would have been the LOUDES ones SCREAMING about that, and Apple would prevent the seizure of Chen's computers!!!

As to SF.... I've visited SF, and I LOVED it there!!! Great place + PEOPLE!!! To LABEL the whole town is a silly generalization...

Asking for SF Earthquake -- that's very LOW...., unless you meant it as joke? But, even as a joke, it's not cool to wish people death, with exceptions of Bin Laden and such!!!

Happy Spring + Mac Love to ALL, regardless of politics and or any other stuff that I'd rather not see here!!!! This Forum ROCKS! ! Thanks!

Originally Posted by applestockholder

The kid is a greedy a$$. He had no right to the phone, and the fact that he held on to it for a while suggests to me malicious intent. It does not take weeks to decide that it NEEDS to be returned. He knew full well that he was sitting on trade secrets worth thousands. I actual believe that he was underpaid for the gravity of what he was doing. But it's like, when you deal with criminals don't be suppressed if you are the one that gets ripped off.

In this case, Gizmodo, in my mind criminals in this scenario, took advantage of the the kids greed. In turn, the the kid is left holding the bucket, as shield laws may help Gizmodo, but no such luck for the iPhone thief who sold it. He is not a journalist, and shield laws, if applicable to anyone, are are definitely not going to help him.

As a stockholder, and thus partial owner of Apple, I want to see him prosecuted so this does not happen again any time soon, to any tech company. Real money is at stake for this stupid guy's $5000.00 greed - drop in the bucket compared to the damage that this may have caused. And the jury is still out on the latter...

Originally Posted by str1f3

Then I'm sure you include Jobs and most employees of Apple because they are one of the most liberal companies in the Valley. Give everyone a break and keep your teabag talk for the next meetup.

Originally Posted by JeffDM

I'm skeptical. Before, you stood by your statement, now decide to now call that part hyperbole when challenged. Cute. Do you say you prayed for people to die, then later call it a joke?

Originally Posted by echosonic

I'll encourage him to do the same if you keep your a-hole talk to yourself as well, mm kay?

"A-hole talk?" you ask?

Yes, a-hole talk. Its called "Tea Party", and you know it. It's never been called "teabag" by anybody except liberal a-holes looking to associate the conservative activist movement with the gay sex-act. Anybody who suggests "teabag" this or that is an intellectually tiny, dishonest a-hole.

Originally Posted by tullius

That's a really horrible effort at spin control. What was the $5000 payment for, again? To allow Gizmodo "access" to property which neither Hogan or Gizmodo had a legal right to?

They should just shut up and let the lawyers handle it. They're digging themselves in deeper and deeper every time they try and explain this.

Originally Posted by JeffDM

I'm skeptical. Before, you stood by your statement, now decide to now call that part hyperbole when challenged. Cute. Do you say you prayed for people to die, then later call it a joke?

Originally Posted by k2director

Of course it is, when 1 in 3 city employees make more than $100,000...thanks to, again, the liberal wackoism of the city. When a locksmith working for the public school system is making over six figures, with a full pension and rich medical benefits to boot, you know something's wrong.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...MNC51CLUBN.DTL

And that's in 2009, when the economy had collapsed and tons of private sector workers were struggling with pay freezes, cutbacks, layoffs and rampant unemployment. But combine runaway unions with a city government that's never met a tax it didn't love, and that's what you get. ;-) Liberal wackoism at its finest.

Originally Posted by GregoriusM

Well, if Appleinsider isn't cut from a similar mold as Gizmodo...

People are vilifying Gizmodo for identifying the Apple employee who lost the prototype, and then this appears on Appleinsider without the complete facts as to the person's involvement in the matter.

The words "alleged" and "not charged with any crime" are ones you should think over, Daniel.

So, if this person has not been charged with any crime, is it any worse that Gizmodo identified the Apple employee than Appleinsider identifying this person?

And people wonder why true journalists, journalist, bloggers, and people who assemble incomplete facts, are sometimes lumped into the same category.

Daniel, I often enjoy your thoughts and commentaries, but I don't appreciate this one. But, I'm now asking myself why Appleinsider would be any different than Gizmodo?

No, I don't recall if you called out Gizmodo for identifying the Apple employee, but thousands did. I don't see this as any different.

Innocent until proven guilty.

Greg

Originally Posted by applestockholder

The kid is a greedy a$$. He had no right to the phone, and the fact that he held on to it for a while suggests to me malicious intent. It does not take weeks to decide that it NEEDS to be returned. He knew full well that he was sitting on trade secrets worth thousands. I actual believe that he was underpaid for the gravity of what he was doing. But it's like, when you deal with criminals don't be suppressed if you are the one that gets ripped off.

In this case, Gizmodo, in my mind criminals in this scenario, took advantage of the the kids greed. In turn, the the kid is left holding the bucket, as shield laws may help Gizmodo, but no such luck for the iPhone thief who sold it. He is not a journalist, and shield laws, if applicable to anyone, are are definitely not going to help him.

As a stockholder, and thus partial owner of Apple, I want to see him prosecuted so this does not happen again any time soon, to any tech company. Real money is at stake for this stupid guy's $5000.00 greed - drop in the bucket compared to the damage that this may have caused. And the jury is still out on the latter...

Originally Posted by CurtisEMayle

Yes, and it isn't as though they weren't forewarned in January by Apple Legal about this very thing:
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/915...eletter101.jpg
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/303...eletter201.jpg

Originally Posted by k2director

I'm so sick of these San Francisco liberal wackos (and liberal wacko felons) who characterize theft as "sharing" and suggest Apple is the new Third Reich when it moves to protect its trade secrets.

When is that next major earthquake due? It couldn't come soon enough...

Originally Posted by Buck

Brian looks rather sexy in a peculiar way.

Originally Posted by macologist

Too bad those JPGs of the Warning Letter are too small for comfortable reading...

...

Originally Posted by AppleInsider

The individual who found the lost iPhone prototype and held it for weeks before delivering it to Gizmodo for a reported $5,000 has been identified as Brian Hogan, a 21 year old resident of Redwood City, California.

A posting by the Wired Threat Level blog named the individual as it continued to present a revised history of events that portrayed Hogan's failure to return the phone for weeks as a "mistake" and his sale of the device to Gizmodo as "sharing."

Originally Posted by CurtisEMayle

Yes, and it isn't as though they weren't forewarned in January by Apple Legal about this very thing:
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/915...eletter101.jpg
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/303...eletter201.jpg

Originally Posted by freddych

The Orrick letter bases it's opinion on the fact that the information is trade secret. However, many courts have held that leaving a phone in the public, even accidentally is enough to defeat the requirements for information being a trade secret. Of course, there is a circuit split on the issue, but the 9th circuit follows the more "liberal" approach and applies a very strict standard to be afforded protection as a trade secret.

Thus, the letter's don't really apply here.

If I were the buyer, I'd structure the transaction to make it an exclusive access sale as they are now claiming and not a transfer, but I'm also a lawyer and can spot those issues.

Originally Posted by macologist

rant, rant, rant...

Originally Posted by elroth

Apple Insider didn't out this guy - his lawyer gave a freakin' interview to Wired magazine! In the interview, the lawyer admitted this guy got $5,000 for giving the iPhone to Gizmodo. I don't see your problem with this: the guy's lawyer publicly revealed the information - on purpose.

Originally Posted by caliminius

Two simple words:

Shut up.

Thank you.

Originally Posted by k2director

Be as skeptical as you like. The statement I stood by referred to the liberal wacko nature of San Francisco, and how it taints the viewpoints of the city's tech press regarding Apple's behavior in this particular case. A few people suggested that there was no such connection, and I pushed back and said there definitely was, standing by my earlier statement.

And please stop trying to put words in my mouth....I never said "pray" or "prayed."

Originally Posted by freddych

The Orrick letter bases it's opinion on the fact that the information is trade secret. However, many courts have held that leaving a phone in the public, even accidentally is enough to defeat the requirements for information being a trade secret.

Originally Posted by bucci

I'm going to play devil's advocate for a second...

For everyone who is wishing the demise of Gizmodo, did you feel the same way for ThinkSecret? Does AppleInsider and its sources deserve the same treatment?

Originally Posted by k2director

Of course it is, when 1 in 3 city employees make more than $100,000...thanks to, again, the liberal wackoism of the city. When a locksmith working for the public school system is making over six figures, with a full pension and rich medical benefits to boot, you know something's wrong.

Originally Posted by djsherly

BTW, why didn't Apple or Powell immediately report the theft? Isn't that what a sane person would do? Rather than wait weeks? Weeks? Apple's famed secrecy may have been compromised but that's a real risk when you play those kinds of games.

Originally Posted by swtchdtomak

Did it ever occur to you that Powell, out of fear of the "Hammer of Jobs" ©, kept it quite as long as he could hoping Hogan would act like a decent human being and turn the phone into the bar where he "found" it?

Originally Posted by macologist

Too bad those JPGs of the Warning Letter are too small for comfortable reading...

Clearly, GizHOLES were warned..., and they chose to play Hardball with Apple, still... Now let them pay for such SLEEZY "Business Model"....

The verdict in this case has to be such that no other clowns try this kind of stuff ever again! If they tried that in China, they would probably be shot after a quick trial... If my China example is less than perfect, the better informed ones on this forum could suggest another country..., North Korea?

The Press Shield in this case is a farce!!!. It is an insult to journalists worldwide, and particularly to those journalist that lost their lives in the name of freedom etc.! The real journalists should be the first ones to condemn GizHOLES loudly and clearly!!!

But, maybe mostly the big media decided to not give GizHOLES too much free pr by covering this story... So maybe that's for the best... I was annoyed when I saw the "raid... search" mentioned on CNN Healine News, with a photo of the stolen item, and GizHOLES site watermark!!! It was hard to tell which side the reporter was on, but if I had to guess, I'd say it would be on the side of the GizHoles, "The Victims of The Big Brother!"... Thus another "deposit" inot GizHOLES 15 Minutes of Fame Account!!! What a perversion!!!

When the New iPhone is out, soon I hope, this story won't matter much, it'll fade away, and, hopefully, GizHOLES will have plenty time in JAIL to write their book on how they tried to mess with Apple... Their fans will try to buy them more fame with petitions, and online videos, demanding their release!

Sorry if I come off too angry about this topic, it's just that it insults me!!! So many people at Apple, and everywhere in this world, work hard, on deadlines, pay their dues to excel at their work, trying to feed their families! Not every Apple Shareholder is a rich person with Play Money! It could be someone's retirement, or income! Then these GizClowns come in, and try to get Famous at those hard working people expense!

Obviously, GizClowns, like all other paparazzi, don't care about hurting people! Less and less is sacred these days! Celebrities are being constantly haunted by media... Ratings = Ads $$!!! Clearly, by picking on Apple, being The Biggest Tech Celebrity of Today, these GizClowns aimed to put themselves on a map in a big way!!! That's what Celebrity Stalkers and Assassins do!!!

This was a crime not just against Apple, but many more hard working people! And that is what makes me so ANGRY, particularly when that aspect is hardly, if at all, mentioned in the media in conjunction with this story!

That was not a People Have The Right To Know issue! The media should not treat them as "one of us"!!! The GizClowns are bad for the media!!!

The "raid search" of the Editor's home is almost equated to (prison, child) rape, or human rights!!! In reality, those GizClowns are nothing more than anarchists, pretending to be journalists, attacking The Comeback Kid Company, Apple, and its cancer survivor CEO, Steve Jobs, so that they can ride that company's coat tales, as far as Tech Press Fame goes, while at the same time hurting that company, using that company's own products (Mac laptops etc.) Pretty sick!!!

No, I am not gonna wish the GizClowns cancer, or call them SF Liberals... They are just a bunch of •• selfish •• brats, who tried to see how much they'd be able to get away with! I wouldn't be surprised if making a movie about this stunt was in their sick fantasies... And •• selfish •• knows no boundaries, political and otherwise...

Now, let the GizClowns go serve Big Time in JAIL!!! Hopefully they'll be put away without much fanfare, which Apple Haters will try to exploit to the max!!! Jealousy!!!

Originally Posted by christopher126

Whenever you need an attorney, you are already screwed!

Originally Posted by jragosta


I've answered that already. It's not a difficult concept. The difference is that ThinkSecret or AppleInsider do not purchase stolen property.

If someone voluntarily gives information to a rumor site that is covered by NDA, that person is guilty of breaking the NDA, but the rumor site who publishes it is not - and they are covered by Journalist Shield statutes.

As soon as the journalist commits a crime in order to gather information (stealing property, buying stolen property, breaking and entering, etc), they lose that defense - and become criminals rather than just reporters.

Originally Posted by swtchdtomak

Did it ever occur to you that Powell, out of fear of the "Hammer of Jobs" ©, kept it quite as long as he could hoping Hogan would act like a decent human being and turn the phone into the bar where he "found" it?

Originally Posted by bucci

I'm quite clear how the law works. However the point of my post, which you compounded, is that without people breaking the law or NDAs, we would not have much to talk about. In fact, this site probably wouldn't even exist.

Careful what you wish for.

Originally Posted by k2director

Of course it is, when 1 in 3 city employees make more than $100,000...thanks to, again, the liberal wackoism of the city. When a locksmith working for the public school system is making over six figures, with a full pension and rich medical benefits to boot, you know something's wrong.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...MNC51CLUBN.DTL

And that's in 2009, when the economy had collapsed and tons of private sector workers were struggling with pay freezes, cutbacks, layoffs and rampant unemployment. But combine runaway unions with a city government that's never met a tax it didn't love, and that's what you get. ;-) Liberal wackoism at its finest.