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Gulf Coast oil spill could eclipse Exxon Valdez - Page 5

post #161 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Er, I think we Lefties care about people, and get this, AND the environment.

I'm not buying this at all; lefties never once surface the number of people working for oil companies; an oily duck gets more sympathy than an platform oil worker feeding his family....
post #162 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPoster View Post

(I'll concede that Texas is big enough to weather this OK, and maybe Florida since they do have another coast that should stay oil free)

I don't know exactly what is going to happen, but the oil may hit heavily all along the Eastern Shore up to about Cape Hatteras, North Carolina. After that the winds will be the prevailing force sending it over my way getting to Western Europe by the end of the summer.
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post #163 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camp David View Post

I'm not buying this at all; lefties never once surface the number of people working for oil companies; an oily duck gets more sympathy than an platform oil worker feeding his family....

What do you mean? I hate ducks.
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"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #164 of 700
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #165 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Can we get a citation for this as well or is this in the category of "make even more shit up after being caught making the first shit up?"

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My apologies, I did get my numbers mixed up.
25% of the seafood industry is currently shut down and will be for the unforeseeable future.
40% of US wetlands are seriously threatened and will be for the unforeseeable future.

Great news!

When will you start eating Shrimp or Oysters again?
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #166 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

My apologies, I did get my numbers mixed up.
25% of the seafood industry is currently shut down and will be for the unforeseeable future.
40% of US wetlands are seriously threatened and will be for the unforeseeable future.

Great news!

When will you start eating Shrimp or Oysters again?

Whenever this nation's regional seafood outlets have issues, fishermen can go elsewhere to harvest the ocean's bounty...if 25% is shut down that leaves 75% operational! Luckily we have lots of outlets for seafood... this Gulf oil slick is a benefit in disguise for northern Atlantic and Pacific fishermen. Much of our frozen seafood comes from North Atlantic and Bering Sea off Alaska anyway! In terms of shrimp and oysters, I am sure the Gulf does not have a individual lock on those... I recall a decade ago when coastal Maine fishing was shut down the industry turned to the Gulf... just the reverse now. Secondly, I am unsure how "40% of US wetlands" are seriously threatened here? Threatened how in terms of a wetland?
post #167 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

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My apologies, I did get my numbers mixed up.
25% of the seafood industry is currently shut down and will be for the unforeseeable future.
40% of US wetlands are seriously threatened and will be for the unforeseeable future.

Great news!

When will you start eating Shrimp or Oysters again?

I don't eat either of those too often because I'm allergic to shell fish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Camp David View Post

Whenever this nation's regional seafood outlets have issues, fishermen can go elsewhere to harvest the ocean's bounty...if 25% is shut down that leaves 75% operational! Luckily we have lots of outlets for seafood... this Gulf oil slick is a benefit in disguise for northern Atlantic and Pacific fishermen. Much of our frozen seafood comes from North Atlantic and Bering Sea off Alaska anyway! In terms of shrimp and oysters, I am sure the Gulf does not have a individual lock on those... I recall a decade ago when coastal Maine fishing was shut down the industry turned to the Gulf... just the reverse now. Secondly, I am unsure how "40% of US wetlands" are seriously threatened here? Threatened how in terms of a wetland?

Exactly!

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #168 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camp David View Post

Whenever this nation's regional seafood outlets have issues, fishermen can go elsewhere to harvest the ocean's bounty...if 25% is shut down that leaves 75% operational! Luckily we have lots of outlets for seafood... this Gulf oil slick is a benefit in disguise for northern Atlantic and Pacific fishermen. Much of our frozen seafood comes from North Atlantic and Bering Sea off Alaska anyway! In terms of shrimp and oysters, I am sure the Gulf does not have a individual lock on those... I recall a decade ago when coastal Maine fishing was shut down the industry turned to the Gulf... just the reverse now. Secondly, I am unsure how "40% of US wetlands" are seriously threatened here? Threatened how in terms of a wetland?

I love Democrats like you "Never let a good crisis go to waste!"

Oil in wetlands not good. It will be there for centuries. It will kill everything. But don't worry if you don't live there and fish there and raise your crawdaddys there you won't have a problem.

Yes, huge environmental disasters are always a benefit in disguise! Especially for tax payers who will have to pay unemployment to 1000s of gulf coast fisherman and pay more for sea food.

Just a thought experiment:
Hurricane season starts shortly, if a big storm hits the coast and the slick is still in the water the oil will end up 0.5 miles inland. That should be fun for the beaches and tourism for the next 100 or so years.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #169 of 700
......
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #170 of 700
wrong thread
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #171 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Oil in wetlands not good. It will be there for centuries. It will kill everything. But don't worry if you don't live there and fish there and raise your crawdaddys there you won't have a problem.

If the cost of cheap oil is a sharp reduction in "crawdaddys" I am sure we'll all survive!

Are you at all concerned of real tragedy this week is not "in the Gulf" but in Tennessee as storm death toll there at 31 as floodwaters recede with billions of dollars in damage! I realize there are no oily ducks about in Tennessee but just the same the tragedy in Nashville is far more desperate and tragic.
post #172 of 700
The flooding in Nashville is a problem; nobody said it isn't. It is sad that so many lost their lives. Mother nature can wreak havoc at times. However, the flooding will recede, and the damage can be repaired in good time. The damage and deaths, however, were not due to man. The problem in the Gulf of Mexico was (despite the opinion of the governor of Texas). The damage to the environment, as illustrated by the "oily ducks", will continue to harm the region for many years to come. Damage to the wetlands could create weaknesses in the natural coastal defenses that protect the area from hurricanes. The damage could possibly have been prevented had the rig used a system used in other countries, or reduced had BP been better prepared.

Fishermen are out of work. Tourism may decline. wetlands and coastal defenses could be destroyed leading to further death and destruction in the future. People along the coast are being treated for health problems from inhaling fumes. BP is only liable for up to 75 million outside cleanup costs, a drop in the bucket for such a large company.


And it could have been prevented. That is the real tragedy.

 

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post #173 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camp David View Post

If the cost of cheap oil is a sharp reduction in "crawdaddys" I am sure we'll all survive!

Are you at all concerned of real tragedy this week is not "in the Gulf" but in Tennessee as storm death toll there at 31 as floodwaters recede with billions of dollars in damage! I realize there are no oily ducks about in Tennessee but just the same the tragedy in Nashville is far more desperate and tragic.

I agree that GW is becoming a problem and is costing lives. Both events are connected by oil.

As long as people value cheap oil more than nature we can not call ourselves "civilized".
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #174 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

As long as people value cheap oil more than nature we can not call ourselves "civilized".

Our civilized society cannot function valuing nature as you would probably like; our society cannot travel to work on horseback nor heat our homes with wood anymore. For these purposes we need petroleum. Even under the best circumstances of adoption of 'green' technologies, we as a nation will still be reliant, as least partially, on petroleum, for another generation or more. Even the best hybrids use petroleum at least half time. 50 million internal combustion engines in the United States do not just disappear nor go out of favor overnight. Like it or not, oil for transportation and heating will be with the United States for the next 100 years. Even use of electricity partially, for heating and transportation, still utilizes fossil fuel (coal). So relax...
post #175 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camp David View Post

Our civilized society cannot function valuing nature as you would probably like; our society cannot travel to work on horseback nor heat our homes with wood anymore. For these purposes we need petroleum. Even under the best circumstances of adoption of 'green' technologies, we as a nation will still be reliant, as least partially, on petroleum, for another generation or more. Even the best hybrids use petroleum at least half time. 50 million internal combustion engines in the United States do not just disappear nor go out of favor overnight. Like it or not, oil for transportation and heating will be with the United States for the next 100 years. Even use of electricity partially, for heating and transportation, still utilizes fossil fuel (coal). So relax...

I am the most relaxed dude you could ever meet.
Cavemen are drawn to the fire. We understand.

We have one in the sky that burns very well. So well indeed, we can use it for driving, tanning, refrigeration, trains, busses, strip clubs, lobotomy surgery, pool heating, and all for free. Not taking it is stupid.
yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #176 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

I am the most relaxed dude you could ever meet.
Cavemen are drawn to the fire. We understand.

We have one in the sky that burns very well. So well indeed, we can use it for driving, tanning, refrigeration, trains, busses, strip clubs, lobotomy surgery, pool heating, and all for free. Not taking it is stupid.

To pretend that taking it is free and would be simple for everyone is also stupid. I agree that we should be using more renewable resources. However, people like you are not going to make it happen. Your message is snobbish and elitist. It will drive people away. If you truly care about making a change, don't drive away the people who can help to make it happen.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #177 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

To pretend that taking it is free and would be simple for everyone is also stupid. I agree that we should be using more renewable resources. However, people like you are not going to make it happen. Your message is snobbish and elitist. It will drive people away. If you truly care about making a change, don't drive away the people who can help to make it happen.

I am a snob and an elitist.
Not paying for energy drives people away and they really want breathe more oil fumes, I know.
Are you saying you can help? Don't!
Us elitists do not need your help. we have money because we don't pay for our energy.

I hope I drive you away. I only want reasonable people to enjoy clean energy.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #178 of 700
Remember by drive away he means kill and by reasonable he means murder.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #179 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Remember by drive away he means kill and by reasonable he means murder.

Of course, what else could I mean.

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yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #180 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

I am a snob and an elitist.
Not paying for energy drives people away and they really want breathe more oil fumes, I know.
Are you saying you can help? Don't!
Us elitists do not need your help. we have money because we don't pay for our energy.

I hope I drive you away. I only want reasonable people to enjoy clean energy.

By this you mean that you don't care for the actual effects, just how it can profit you and those you actually care for. You have no leg to stand on sir.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #181 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Remember by drive away he means kill and by reasonable he means murder.

No, he means that unless you agree with his political stance you don't deserve to enjoy any benefits of what he may have to offer. Not that anyone would buy from him if they knew what he thought of the people he does business with. He is fortunate that his "businesses" are not named here. It would be a simple thing to have him put under investigation for price manipulation and discrimination based on purely prejudicial means. He does not care about having anyone actually switch to clean energy unless they are his kind of people, and he does not care to have them interested unless they believe what he does. Amazingly bigoted viewpoint.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #182 of 700
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

trains.

LOL wut? I'm all for increasing use of solar power, but the technology (and battery storage technology) just isn't mature enough for this. If you're talking about the all solar bullet train proposal for AZ: it's crazy expensive (~$27 Billion minimum estimate), would still require power assist in the mountains, wouldn't be able to run at night or on the rare cloudy day, and probably wouldn't have the ridership to pay for the investment. (likely why the proposal has not been taken seriously)

Now solar as an assist to provide A/C, electric for the passenger cars, that has (I believe) been successfully trialed in Europe and Japan and would be a good step forward here.
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post #183 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPoster View Post

LOL wut? I'm all for increasing use of solar power, but the technology (and battery storage technology) just isn't mature enough for this. If you're talking about the all solar bullet train proposal for AZ: it's crazy expensive (~$27 Billion minimum estimate), would still require power assist in the mountains, wouldn't be able to run at night or on the rare cloudy day, and probably wouldn't have the ridership to pay for the investment. (likely why the proposal has not been taken seriously)

Now solar as an assist to provide A/C, electric for the passenger cars, that has (I believe) been successfully trialed in Europe and Japan and would be a good step forward here.

Who needs batteries? You can pump water uphill, Solar power can generate lots of Hydrogen. You are really a one way thinker, energy can be stored in all kinds of ways.

27 billion is that money??? it's a fraction of what this spill is going to cost it's laughable the compared to wars about oil and buying bullets for our enemies every time you pull up to a gas station?

This would be a one time investment without much ongoing cost This would mean deficit reduction, debt reduction,... imagine living without energy bills.

I have been doing it for a while now and it's nice. Despite people like yourself this will happen and I want to congratulate you on missing the E boat.
yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #184 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

No, he means that unless you agree with his political stance you don't deserve to enjoy any benefits of what he may have to offer. Not that anyone would buy from him if they knew what he thought of the people he does business with. He is fortunate that his "businesses" are not named here. It would be a simple thing to have him put under investigation for price manipulation and discrimination based on purely prejudicial means. He does not care about having anyone actually switch to clean energy unless they are his kind of people, and he does not care to have them interested unless they believe what he does. Amazingly bigoted viewpoint.



Exactly, I wouldn't want force reason and happiness on people that's undemocratic.

FYI doing business comes with experiencing legal actions, copyright lawsuits and more. Making money takes a good lawyer in this country that we love so much.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #185 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

By this you mean that you don't care for the actual effects, just how it can profit you and those you actually care for. You have no leg to stand on sir.

Absolutely, profit is the motive. It's the American way.
yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #186 of 700
Thank you all for your mind reading skills. You really show me your talents here. You always know better what I mean than myself and you are always correct. I wouldn't know what I mean without you girls.

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yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #187 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Thank you all for your mind reading skills. You really show me your talents here. You always know better what I mean than myself and you are always correct. I wouldn't know what I mean without you girls.

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I love how you cannot see the extreme irony in that statement.
NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #188 of 700
US rig survivors recall gas cloud and deadly blast

Quote:
As rig workers and engineers on the deck of the rig were finishing a delicate operation to cement the metal well casing in place, something went horribly wrong.

According to the transcripts, a giant bubble of methane gas rushed up the drill pipe and enveloped the deck of the drilling platform in a cloud of highly flammable gas, followed by a scalding flood of crude oil that spilled onto the drill deck and ignited.

"Gas and oil rushed up the riser. There was little wind and a gas cloud got all over the rig," according to a transcript from a rig worker recited by Bea in a telephone interview.

The drill deck itself is "intrinsically safe," meaning that it is free of any sources that can cause a spark such as a spark plug in a generator, Bea said.

But the methane flood that rushed up the drill pipe was so immense that it soon spread across the entire length of the massive drilling platform, Bea said.

When the methane gas reached a room where mud used in well-drilling was stored, sparks from engines running pumps there ignited the gas cloud, according to the transcript.

"When the main inductions of the engines got a whiff (of the gas) they ran away and exploded -- blew them right off the rig," the transcript said. "This set everything on fire."

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #189 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post


Here is how large scale solar works.
Sun makes very hot fluid.
Fluid is pumped into underground tank.
Heat of fluid makes steam and drives generator DAY AND NIGHT.

Wind energy can be used to pump water up to a dam. Water runs down because of gravity and makes energy.

Here's another one-

"German researchers have succeeded in storing renewable electricity as natural gas. They convert the electricity into synthetic natural gas with the aid of a new process. The process was developed by the Center for Solar Energy and Hydrogen Research Baden-Württemberg (ZSW), in cooperation with the Fraunhofer Institute for Wind Energy and Energy System Technology IWES. Currently, Solar Fuel Technology, the Austria-based partner company, is setting up the industrial implementation of the process. One advantage of the technology: it can use the existing natural gas infrastructure. A demonstrationsystem built on behalf of Solar Fuel in Stuttgart is already operating successfully. By 2012, a substantially larger system in the double-digit megawatt range is planned to be launched.

The storage reservoir of the natural gas network extending through Germany is vast: It equals more than 200 terawatt hours enough to satisfy consumption for several months. The power network has only a capacity of 0.04 terawatt hours by itself. The integration into the infrastructure is simple: The natural gas substitute can be stored like conventional natural gas in the supply network, pipelines and storage systems, in order to drive natural gas cars or fire natural gas heating systems."
~ http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releas...-sge050510.php
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #190 of 700
Quote:

Here is a very detailed account of events leading up to the accident:

http://www.nola.com/news/gulf-oil-sp...ved_befor.html
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post #191 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by FloorJack View Post

Yea 'cause most oil spills come from tankers and with less off shore drilling in the US there will be more oil going by ship and more oil spills. Killer logic you have.

I think the racists attitude of the anti-drilling folks is amazing. You'd rather the poor counties full of "those people" do the drilling and deal with the oil spills but your country is so fantastic and your environmental ethics so high that drilling is unthinkable in your own waters. Shame on you!

A very valid point given the massive environmental destruction in Africa. Better to just get off oil as soon as possible.
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #192 of 700

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #193 of 700
You guys think $ 10,000,000.- per Dolphin and per sea turtle is fair?
yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #194 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

You guys think $ 10,000,000.- per Dolphin and per sea turtle is fair?

No. Why should BP be responsible for what seems to be an accident? We kill hundreds of mammalia daily on our nation's transportation infrastructure as roadkill... I don't see driver's ponying up $ for those accidental death of environmental creatures! The evidence seems to point to an accident at the platform - recall that it was April 23, the day after the oil rig sank, that oil appeared to be leaking from the well head at the ocean floor. If we force BP to start a bounty payment for every dead dolphin and sea turtle the Chinese will be sending in alleged victims from the Pacific in minutes! Let's call this an accident, get it cleaned up, and begin drilling again. I want cheap oil. We have enough dolphins and sea turtles at Seaworld!!
post #195 of 700
Watching the three stooges all saying "He did it!" like elementary school kids was sickeningly humorous. They make more than enough money to take responsibility for their actions, but the public just wants gas in their cars so they don't really care. It's just a bird here, an ecosystem there. Ecosystems upon which we depend to survive.

The latest news is suggesting BP knew a bit more than they are saying, and that the whole system is screwed... a preventable accident, all in the quest to feed the unquenchable thirst for oil.

Demand has to be reduced a bit and regulations strengthened on these companies that are taking advantage of That Endless Thirst™ and getting filthy rich at the expense of their own customers who don't seem to know better. Sounds a little like the GOP...

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #196 of 700
blah blah blah... filthy rich...blah blah blah

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #197 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camp David View Post

I want cheap oil. We have enough dolphins and sea turtles at Seaworld!!

If Palin is a moose you are it's rectum.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #198 of 700
The clean-up is safe though Black Wave- http://www.blackwavethefilm.com/videos
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

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post #199 of 700
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Here's another one-

~ http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releas...-sge050510.php

That's interesting tech there. The only questions I'd have are how much water the process uses if it goes large scale (probably not that much, but it could be an issue in areas such as southern California) and if any by-products are generated in the chemical reaction phase?

I suppose it would make solar more useful in the near term, but in the long term is still generating CO2 as an end product of combustion. (about 30% less than burning oil or coal though)
You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
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You need skeptics, especially when the science gets very big and monolithic. -James Lovelock
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post #200 of 700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

You guys think $ 10,000,000.- per Dolphin and per sea turtle is fair?

Japan eating everything in the oceans is a bigger threat to dolphins, turtles and the ecology of the oceans, than is an oil leak. They probably massacre more dolphins per week than this leak will affect.
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