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Verizon, Google collaborating on Android-powered iPad competitor - Page 2

post #41 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant View Post

Is Apple the gold standard now? I bet Verizon regrets passing on the iPhone.

Worse mistake than Boston trading Babe Ruth to the Yankees.
post #42 of 87
If other Verizon directed software is any indication, it will end up disorganized, frustrating, and almost guaranteed not to work with a Mac.
post #43 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by gchriste View Post

You mean the features that have caused it to be a sales flop?

/sarcasm

all those crucial features that make it worthless without them
post #44 of 87
Quote:
"We're working on tablets together, for example. We're looking at all the things Google has in its archives that we could put on a tablet to make it a great experience."

Translation: We have nothing right now and we have no idea how to develop a competing tablet. So we hope to copy and paste from here and there just to have someone to show.
post #45 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

This post says it all.

We will deconstruct this phenomenon for years to come....... I don't think it (iPad+iPhone+iPod) can be matched -- even by Apple -- in the future.

All 3 of those have the same dated broken OS that would be a joke in 2000. And I don't see a "phenomenon" here, it's just the Wizard of Oz (Steve) serving up the "magical" juice.
post #46 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpotOn View Post

Well this should put to rest any ideas of a Verison iPhone now, right?

Well that does it, I'm switching to AT&T in August
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post #47 of 87
You mean copy the iPad like they copied the iPhone....they are like Japanese car manufacturers they cannot come up with their own original products so they simply copy someone else's

"Apple people have no objectivity when it comes to criticism of Apple.." Lenovo X1 Carbon is out..bye bye MBAir

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post #48 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by cgc0202 View Post

I do not know when but eventually it is good strategy for Apple to release an iPhone for Verizon, especially after it has "saturated" the key target GSM (???) carriers worldwide.

For one, Apple cannot cede such a huge market in the US. The main concern should be whether such forking would not also fragment the iTune and more specially the Apps. I do not know the engineering that differentiates the communication systems, but if the iPhone OS can work with the system for Verizon, then creating an iPhone, and even iPad for Verizon should not be an issue.

In fact. I would be very interested to witness a head-to-head competition between RIMM, iPhone OS and Android within Verizon, and other carriers.

Ever seen a Toyota Prius vs. a Porsche 99 Turbo? Same results. The Toyota will eventually get you there, kinda... while the guy in 911 has already met the ladies and had a few cocktails in the lounge. Verizon didn't want to work with Apple, then got spanked by the iPhone and AT&T. Now they are slumming it with Poodle trying to catch up, and claiming they are savvy. They are the el cheapo cell phone service, that segment is never a good fit for Apple. Their biggest problem seems to be that there seem are much smarter people working at AT&T, and willing to put in the work and take a risk. Their corporate culture is younger than AT&T, you'd think they would be the dinosaur. AT&T is clearly making the bolder moves, which is clearly working pretty damn well with Apple.

Quote:
Note that Apple is also still in talk with the other carriers in China. It is unlikely that the main telecome in China would change its "communication system" (a modified version of CDMA??? modified specifically for China) just to accommodate the existing iPhone.

CDMA is the floppy drive of the cell phone world. I'm sure as China's providers upgrade and roll out new services, there will be iPhones like manna from the skies.

Quote:
If you look at the history of Apple, it is not always the case that Steve Jobs will make a business decision simply because he was slighted. If memory serves me, Steve Jobs also had issues with Intel because he was snobbed or something by Intel when Steve Jobs sought Intel's help. And yet, Steve Jobs eventually embraced Intel when IBM/Motorola overpriced the chips and I think they could not develop fast enough to suit SJs standards.

Memory does not serve you. Jobs has always been chummy with Intel, they pursued Apple for years. Apple was already stuck with Motorola when Jobs came back. OS X for Intel was maintained as project 'Start Trek' since the beginning of OS X development. From all perspectives Jobs kept Apple's options open, and jumped ship only after Motorola began to falter and couldn't get faster chips happening. You're trying to turn that into something it wasn't, in order support your psycho-analysis of Jobs. I think you're probably dead wrong about the rest too.


Quote:
I like to think that Apple and Steve Jobs do not let their bias or past hurts to rule their decision making.

I think the reality is that Apple and Jobs let their bias make very good decisions.
post #49 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

You mean copy the iPad like they copied the iPhone....they are like Japanese car manufacturers they cannot come up with their own original products so they simply copy someone else's

I don't think that is the same. Back in the 70's and 80's, the Japanese truly did make a better car. The American cars were heavy lead-sleds, got horrible gas mileage, and the quality was second-rate. The japanese came in and did (imho) innovate and improved.

The Apple/Google scenario is actually backwards. Apple is the one creating and innovating. They make high-quality products and they are fanatical, almost to the point of clinical, about the user-experience.

Then you have the makers that implement Android. See, they can't figure out what the market wants so they wait for the real innovator (Apple) to do all the work for them, wait on the sidelines, and if Apple's product works, they simply fire-up the copy machines and try to shoe-horn a cheap, knockoff in a 6-12 month window and hope they can simply last long enough to make some money and wait again for Apple's next game-changer. Rinse, repeat.

The truly sad part is that the makers of these products compete with so many other similar folks that in time, they will fragment themselves out of existence. The "open" ecosystem will end up being one of the garbage mountains of Manila. But hey, the Android folks will still be able to use their SSH on them.
post #50 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

And if they don't make it 16:9 I'll laugh my ass off.

So you think they made it 4/3 for no specific reasons? Like...ergonomics?

I got a 16/9 Archos 9 Win7 tablet on my desk for tests. You'll love it: 4 minutes boot, awkward 16/9 (because of the form factor but also because of the display ratio of the softs) and a so bloody sloooow Atom running Win7. Yummy, you'll love it.

iPad:very fast, great UI, light, enormous battery life.
post #51 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by ultranote View Post

So you think they made it 4/3 for no specific reasons? Like...ergonomics?

I got a 16/9 Archos 9 Win7 tablet on my desk for tests. You'll love it: 4 minutes boot, awkward 16/9 (because of the form factor but also because of the display ratio of the softs) and a so bloody sloooow Atom running Win7. Yummy, you'll love it.

iPad:very fast, great UI, light, enormous battery life.

Quite the opposite. I'll laugh because many tablets were showcased at CES with 16:9 ratio and many stated that Apple's iPad would fail because of the 4:3 ratio usage when it was clearly chosen for very practical reasons, not because it's the "in thing".

Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against 16:9. It's great for larger displays where vertical space isn't an issue, like desktop displays. For notebooks I would't want the 13" or 15" MBPs to go any wider than 16:10; I think 17" wouldn't be about the minimum for 16:9. For 12" and smaller 4:3 (or 3:2) is the way to go. In fact, I have been an advocate for that ratio since the 12" PowerBook went away and used it as a reason why a 12" MacBook would be less than ideal with a widescreen display.

PS: If you really want to see a tablet that is close in size to the iPad and is a complete failure, even worse than Archos on many levels, check out the JooJoo review on Engadget.

PPS: Welcome to the forum.
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post #52 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdistheword View Post

All 3 of those have the same dated broken OS that would be a joke in 2000. And I don't see a "phenomenon" here, it's just the Wizard of Oz (Steve) serving up the "magical" juice.

Broken because you won't plug a fibre channel PCI-E card in these? or even a scanner?
There's a deep misunderstanding between what some IT guys see as the ideal machine and what most people need.

The appeal here is to have an optimised OS built from the ground up for multitouch portable devices, instant-on, **speed**, no maintenance and an inspiring UI. So scary for IT support jobs

Not a desktop OS squeezed down (and slowed in the process), bloated by legacy features.

But then many of the same guys will support a Google tablet (maybe) running Chrome OS, "so open" with its web-only apps.
post #53 of 87
>Quite the opposite. I'll laugh because many tablets were showcased at CES with 16:9 ratio and many stated that Apple's iPad >would fail because of the 4:3 ratio usage when it was clearly chosen for very practical reasons, not because if's the "in >thing".

we agree !

>PS: If you really want to see a tablet that is close in size to the iPad and is a complete failure, even worse than Archos on >many levels, check out the JooJoo review on Engadget.

Joojoo: such a naive endeavour...
post #54 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bageljoey View Post

I love how Apple can still completely surprise the industry in this day and [information] age. I mean, even my mother knew Apple was working on a tablet but nobody knew what it was going to be or do. They still had to wait to see the iPad to know what to make to compete with it.

Here, they seem to be admitting that it will take two of the biggest companies in the industry working together (with Apple's blueprint to boot) to come up with something.

I suppose this either makes people love Apple or hate Apple...

Well, the SADDEST thing is that the iPad was announced in JANUARY... It's almost JUNE and only now these assclowns are saying, "Oh, we're working on something... yeah...watch out Apple!11!!"

Good bl**dy luck to them.
post #55 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by spiced View Post

Why not all the big smoking guns (Dell, Palm, HP, Sony, Nokia, Symbian, Nintendo and on and on!) join arms and legs to create this mutant gPoogle pDevice/Endriod OS. If they are any smarter! Sharks! How bad these guys can be when they are not even announcing a game changing iPoogle or pDevice to compete......

Bingo! They're not even bothered. Dell, Palm, HP, Acer, Asus, Sony, Nokia, Nintendo, -- all of them have not even bothered to announce even vapourware... You might think they're secretly working on *something*, but geez, it's already the middle of 2010.
post #56 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by iBill View Post

Verizon and Google have Apple envy, bigtime.

The BEST part in this whole fiasco is that even with Google's reach, involving Verizon means.... wait or it.... you're pretty much limiting your product to the US. That means you're only getting 30% or so of potential sales if you went fully worldwide. As much as the US is the centre of the world in some ways, it sometimes just isn't.
post #57 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

So long as Verizon keeps its mouth shut and stays out of the way, this could just catch on!

</sarcasm>

True. Will have to wait and see. Haven't seen the latest phone but they say it's great and for a pad, I wouldn't laugh Google out just yet, especially since they have their pro google apps now. Just saying.
post #58 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdistheword View Post

All 3 of those have the same dated broken OS that would be a joke in 2000. And I don't see a "phenomenon" here, it's just the Wizard of Oz (Steve) serving up the "magical" juice.

Must be nice contributing absolutely ZERO to this thread little Troll. Please cancel your AI account and go back under your bridge little troll.

Mods??? You have your troll-swatter handy for this guy??
post #59 of 87
NEW iPhone 4G / iPhone HD leaked
http://www.macrumors.com/

LEAKED... Expect an article on AppleInsider very soon, I suppose.
post #60 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

It's certainly a sad state of affairs that after all this time, the rest of the industry has now delegated themselves to the bottom-of-the-barrel in terms of innovation. They have to do minimal R&D work now since they essentially wait for what Apple comes out with and then get the copy machines fired-up.

Of course, there will be those folks that will say that Apple was not the first to create a tablet. However, I think everyone can agree that Apple for the most part got it right, and on their first attempt too!


I find it interesting that all the talk of a tablet "needing a proper OS" has, largely, dissipated.

I guess "they" were wrong and Apple was right-- iPhone OS is a proper os for a tablet.

.
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post #61 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by -AG- View Post

oooo dont forget the built in USB port and SD card reader.


It is actually quite a sad day because all google is going to do now is release some iPad clone that is not quite as good in any areas, BUT is a lot cheaper.

VerGoogle* may want to do that but they may not be able to do it for a good long while.

* sounds like the German children's song: kommt ein vogel geflogen


Consider this: the iPad is supply-constrained! What does that mean? Shortage of key parts? Shortage of manufacturing lines?

AIR, the pixelQ people said a major barrier in getting their screens into production (large enough to get an affordable price) was that there were only a few multi-billion production lines in existence and these were scheduled 13 months in advance.

If Apple is savvy, they have options for "first pick" with suppliers of key parts and production lines.

That's one way Tim Cook earns his salary/options!

.
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post #62 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by g3pro View Post

That is a false dichotomy.

The iPad is missing several features, including Flash, including video conferencing, including full-featured multi-tasking, including AMOLED screen, including higher-resolution screen, including running ABC shows over 3g.

Oh... I guess Apple will reduce the iPad's price 30% and give refunds to early adopters

.
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post #63 of 87
Today, 03:31 AM\t * #59
nvidia2008
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 4,221
NEW iPhone 4G / iPhone HD leaked
http://www.macrumors.com/

LEAKED... Expect an article on AppleInsider very soon, I suppose.
*\t
-------------
saw that at
mac rumors


All FREE PRESS. MARKETING IMHO
post #64 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

We can almost guarantee the VerOogle pad will include features everyone complained were missing in the iPad, right?

Video conferencing, possibly camera.... what else?

Yea I know right, the same features that made the iPad such a flop on its release, the same iPad that every other company will try and copy down to the tee. I mean, Apple clearly has no clue on what features consumers need. /Sarcasm off.
post #65 of 87
The gPad is an interesting idea, but what OS will it run? If it runs Android - it could be a nice competitor to the iPad. If it runs ChromeOS, forget it. I like the idea of a Google - Verizon - HTC tablet, it could really be something, but somehow I feel Verizon might screw it up.

Even if this gPad become successful it will be an affirmation of the legitimacy of a brand new device category basically invented (reinvented if u will) by Apple, which will in turn make more people want to use an iPad.

One more thought - Apple is the only "computer" manufacturer that is in this market. HP is trying with Palm tablet and dell with their 5 inch phone/ tablet, but none are considered front runners and don't even have a mass production going. Google-HTC are becoming the dell of computer world, with a verity of hardware with a lot of compatibility problems, and Apple remains apple with a limited offering, but a solid plug and play (now almost literally) capabilities and a great ecosystem of accessories that are guaranteed to work and of course great software that is stable and intuitive.
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post #66 of 87
It's ironic how Verizon could not work with Apple on this, but instead they'll work with Google, you know, the makers of the super smart and successful Nexus One.
post #67 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheff View Post

The gPad is an interesting idea, but what OS will it run? If it runs Android - it could be a nice competitor to the iPad. If it runs ChromeOS, forget it. I like the idea of a Google - Verizon - HTC tablet, it could really be something, but somehow I feel Verizon might screw it up.

Even if this gPad become successful it will be an affirmation of the legitimacy of a brand new device category basically invented (reinvented if u will) by Apple, which will in turn make more people want to use an iPad.

One more thought - Apple is the only "computer" manufacturer that is in this market. HP is trying with Palm tablet and dell with their 5 inch phone/ tablet, but none are considered front runners and don't even have a mass production going. Google-HTC are becoming the dell of computer world, with a verity of hardware with a lot of compatibility problems, and Apple remains apple with a limited offering, but a solid plug and play (now almost literally) capabilities and a great ecosystem of accessories that are guaranteed to work and of course great software that is stable and intuitive.

That is a very well said response, in addition the reason why other companies are failing to offer anything comparable to the iPad is because they do not have control of the software or hardware they make. The very system they're trying to assemble is made up from a slew of different companies and their road map is filled with fragmented hardware/software with no clear cut approach.

The gPad or whatever it may end up being called will have its shortcomings because it will be running either windows operating system software/ Android OS/ Chrome OS, none of which was designed for tablet computing, none of which has a rich full touch environment, and that is where they will fail against the iPad. I once watched a video of Chrome OS running a 3D game, and the developer had to fall back to a keyboard and mouse to play the game, now tell me what sense does that make?
post #68 of 87
Here is another reason why the Voogle pad will not mean anything, cause a bunch of other carriers will want one too, which means self imploding competition (too many differences in hardware, not enough support or updates, sound familiar?) meanwhile the iPad will still remain at the top of the heap...
post #69 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by cgc0202 View Post

The competition has to really work hard and be very innovative and very imaginative to come up with something that will compare with the iPad.


CGC


Not really. Take a cellphone design, use a big screen, eliminate the phone.

Android is equivalent to Iphone OS. It would not be very hard to make an Android tablet.

And because Android is customizable, it would be easy to add a layer above the standard UI to optimize it for a tablet.

I dunno. ISTM that an Androidx tablet is easy. It need not be either innovative nor imaginative. I was disappointed that the iPad was not so.
post #70 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bageljoey View Post

I suppose this either makes people love Apple or hate Apple...

I think that in truth, Apple is not even on the radar screens of the vast majority of people.
post #71 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

We can almost guarantee the VerOogle pad will include features everyone complained were missing in the iPad, right?

Video conferencing, possibly camera.... what else?

USB host.

The ability to install software sourced from your choice of vendor.

16x9 screen.

Internet video.

Playback of HD videos from internal storage.

HDMI output.

Ability to use as an external disk.

Multitasking.

What else?
post #72 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnboi1978 View Post

This reply has nothing to do with your post. Just thought you should know that the "]" after html5 in your signature link to youtube screws up the link.

Thanks...I think
post #73 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevie View Post

I think that in truth, Apple is not even on the radar screens of the vast majority of people.

Well, obviously, I ment among the people who do care...
...But I guess being dense is what you are going for in your posts today...

You said that the iPad was not inovative, but there was nothing like it in existance before, so how is it not? Sure, there is no doubt that Android tablets are on their way and some might be great. I'm sure there will be many people who prefer them to iPads. But the market will have been created by Apple.
Hindsight will make this progression seem obvious, but 6 months ago it was common knowledge that a tablet had to be full featured. If it can't run Word, PowerPoint, Flash...FAIL!
Think about how an Android tablet would have been recieved before the iPad: "What can it do that my $300 netbook can't? It is not cheaper, and it doesn't have the storage or connectivity. FAIL!"

you don't have to like the iPad or want an iPad, but it is already too late to dismiss the iPad!
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post #74 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Google/verizon will release a 'Free' (2yr contract) iPad 3g clone. It will be crap but sell millions!

'Give the razor/camera away and sell the sh*t out of razor blades/film."

Only thing is it isn't working out as far as I can tell. We read somewhere on AI last week that Android smart phones were outselling iPhone but the web usage stats still put iPhone 1000% higher than Android. So you can give it away but if it is so user unfriendly that no one sees your ads, giving it away BOGO becomes counterproductive.

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post #75 of 87
Does anyone really and honestly think/believe that Verizon will not force it's crappy software in some way on any of these tablet devices? Well, i'll tell ya, since i worked for Verizon....the answer is NOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Verizon has a similiar model, much like Apple's. Customer controll. Apple supplys its customers via Itunes with media in various forms. Verizon does the same. What i get from reading this article is that there are NO verizon Iphones coming, nor Ipads..less the customer uses vzw's wifi. That verizon knows that it missed the ball with the Iphone, now the Ipad and finally gets that its been left behind. It's now up to Verizon to find a company thats competitive with Apple, and develop out some new products, much like AT&T has done. Only problem is now they are YEARS behind, and i see them loosing overall....could be wrong, but really doubt it....
post #76 of 87
I doubt that an Android tablet would be as successful as the Android phone is. The thing about phones is that everybody "needs" one, so some of these people in the market for new phones purchased an Android phone not because of the OS, the promise of Flash, or developer freedom, but because it was a phone that fit their price range, perhaps through BOGO deals, and was decent. I'd even wager that many of the people who have Android phones don't even know they're Android phones. It's just a phone to them. The same can't be said about the iPhone.

A pad/tablet/slate isn't as necessary. I don't ever see a gPad having the same allure as an iPad. The people who buy a gPad will be people who want an iPad-like device but won't buy one either because they hate AT&T, because they want something that caters more to the tech crowd, or because it's cheaper. There is also the "I hate Apple for irrational reasons" crowd, but that's such an insignificant minority.

I don't understand the appeal of the 16x9 screen. Sure, it's perfect if all you do is watch movies on it, but it's awkward otherwise. I thought my MacBook was wide, but then I saw my friend's wide-screen notebook; even she thinks it's weird.
post #77 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

If someone would come up with a tablet that can do half as much as a netbook you might be right.

There's no netbook that can do half as efficienly what the iPad can do.

Let me elaborate. There's no netbook that doesn't "feel" slow. The iPad does NOT feel slow. It is not slowed down by a full OS powered by a ultramobile processor.
post #78 of 87
The iPad sold over 1 million units in little over a month, lets see the Android based tablets do that, then I'll give them respect.
post #79 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevie View Post

I think that in truth, Apple is not even on the radar screens of the vast majority of people.

Then how do you explain that Apple is the #3 brand in the country? I would say that they're on quite a few radar screens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevie View Post

USB host.

The ability to install software sourced from your choice of vendor.

16x9 screen.

Internet video.

Playback of HD videos from internal storage.

HDMI output.

Ability to use as an external disk.

Multitasking.

What else?

You left out:
SD card slot
CF card slot
MM card slot
A few more card slots for good meausre
ExpressCard slot
At least 5 USB ports
Two analog audio ports
Optical audio port
Parallel port
Serial port
Floppy disk drive
Blu-Ray disk drive
eSATA

I wonder why it is that no one seems to understand that when you have a great product, you don't automatically make it better by adding a bunch of other features. That can actually take away from its value.

Look at Microsoft Office. At one time, that was a very usable suite. Easy to use and very productive for most people. Now that they've added everything but the kitchen sink (most items added 4 or 5 times), it's a sloppy mess and extremely hard to use. The average user is probably far LESS productive than they were a decade ago. All these attempts to start with an iPad and add lots more features will have the same result.
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post #80 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by zindako View Post

The iPad sold over 1 million units in little over a month, lets see the Android based tablets do that, then I'll give them respect.

I'm sure they will, but it will take time to rewrite Android to be an effective tablet OS. There are just too many opportunities for that free OS to be pushed to cheap ARM-based tablets. I don't foresee any one vendor having a product that outsells the iPad or makes more money, but in several times things could looks differently. Hopefully HP bought Palm/WebOS specifically for that reason.
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