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AT&T caps new iPhone, iPad data plans at 2GB, announces tethering - Page 6

post #201 of 360
If the original plan was up to 5gb for $30, then maybe a fair solution would be $6 a GB with a 1GB a month minimum and half GB increments. Does that not sound incredibly fair? Then you truly pay for what you use. Just my 2 cents.....
post #202 of 360
The moaning and wailing and caterwauling here is out-of-control. Pathetic, really.

Pay for what you eat!

For most of us, esp. those with family plans with widely varying usage patterns, this will be a price reduction. The only part of the pricing that I would quibble with is $15 for 200MB extra in the DataPlus Plan when they plan to (very reasonably, imho) charge $10 for an 1GB in the DataPro plan.
post #203 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

unless, you must have tethering. Then you must change plans.

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post #204 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by walshbj View Post

I hear you, but it's not that simple.

Those plans are priced based on a predicted use. If tethering was included for everyone the predicted use would be much higher and we'd all pay a lot more.

What's been happening, I suspect, is that most of us are not coming close to 2GB. Not close at all. And thus MOST of us have been paying way too much.

If we could "eat the mints we paid for any way we want" we'd probably get closer to getting what we paid for. But the predicted use would be higher and so would the plans.

Pricing for a capped max is the problem here, especially when there was only one tier. You can try to eat as much as you can out of spite, but it's not really productive. I think today's change is a step toward letting people pay for what they use, although one more tier between 200MB and 2GB might have been warranted.

Yes, that is exactly what the caps are for...to bring what you pay more in line with what you use. I think their per MB charges are pretty high, but they are what they are. I am not against them getting rid of the unlimited, though I am sure it was nice. But now that you are capped, why shouldn't you be able to use all?

As far as plans being priced based on predicted use, then that is what they ought to be based on and flogged as. Instead they are sold to you as being based on what you can use, i.e. 2GB. So, you are paying to use 2GB, but they are assuming/predicting that you won't use it. If they are expecting you not to use 2GB but only 500MB, then charge for 500MB and not 2GB.

If you use your data is such a way that you might be more likely to use the 2GB you paid for, then you have to pay a second time to actually use it up.

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...sometimes it's both
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post #205 of 360
I turned off the data plans for both of our iPhones (by switching to regular phones) because of the expense. This might bring us back into the fold. We mainly miss the ability to check Yelp listings and Google maps while on the road.
post #206 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Because people wanted an iPhone and unlimited was the only option available. While I and others and happy to be saving some money each month that doesn't mean others will be happy. It's been aptly stated by AIaddict, AppDev and others, it's designed to force the heavy users off AT&T, which is a win for AT&T and normal users.

This is my point. Why should others on this thread criticize (some even said to lose weight, go to work and get out more) when their purchase was essentially an impulse buy while others actually made use of their purchase.

The term heavy user is a relative term in this case. Our neighbors up north consider heavy usage anything over 6GB and that includes free tethering. AT&T apparently considers over 2GB and are charging for tethering without any benefits. Had AT&T stuck to their unofficial/suggested cap of 5GB I wouldn't have a problem. 2GB is really a small amount for the price especially when you consider the upcoming potential features of the 4G and any future iTunes cloud-based content.
post #207 of 360
I hope AT&T is not changing their pricing model just for iPhone. If so, I do hope what Steve Jobs said yesterday on D8 is true - That is, he hopes iPhone has multi-network future. Because, I think what AT&T just did is screwed most of their customer base. I was just looking at the Data Usage on my AT&T bill and I noticed that my average use is certainly around 300MB and not 200MB, except spikes in recent month, which I think is because my kids were watching YouTube while they were getting bored standing in the line. I am not a lite user nor I am a power user. I use my iPhone to check stocks and news and my personal e-mail while I have some down time. Other thing I use my iPhone is for my GPS, which does generate data usage.

So this whole new pricing structure will change my iPhone usage pattern and is basically losing the feature usage of this marvelous device. Since I am already in plan I hope they will have to honor my unlimited internet contract even if I upgrade my device to new iPhone 4G - If they don't, I hope I am protected with some consumer protection clause. I do hope Apple start making their device multi-network soon.
post #208 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbyrn View Post

Only the most cultish of Apple fanboy will spin this ripoff as something good. The people who just purchased the iPad 3Gs with the happy promises of unlimited data plan are now finding out that Lord Jobs & AT&T have essentially lied through their teeth. Mass returns, class action lawsuits, FTC, you name it.

No, just no. people you already have the unlimited data plan can keep it and if you just bought an Ipad today you will see it when registering.
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post #209 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by noexpectations View Post

Show me a Utility (Gas, Electric, Water) that has an unlimited plan? Would you want that? Would you want everyone to pay the same monthly costs if you use a lot less than the average user?

It does not make sense.....and it doesn't make sense in wireless networking either. I do not want to pay for anyone else's service.

You dont get it. The towers, internet lines, the routers, the spectrum licenses all have to be paid for REGARDLESS if you use 1k or 5 gigs. the cost must be spread out. The cost of sending the actuality bits to your computer is almost nothing (unlike, water, gas, electric) its the infrastructure to get it to you that costs the most money.
post #210 of 360
Now the Wired app will cost people an extra $45, should they decide to download it while tethered to their iPhone.

Caps on internet access is absurd. They should be going away, not coming back.
post #211 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteo View Post

You don get it. The towers, internet lines, the routers, the spectrum licenses all have to be paid for REGARDLESS is you use 1k or 5 gigs. the cost must be spread out. The cost of sending the actuality bits to your computer is almost nothing (unlike, water, gas, electric) its the infrastructure to get it to you that costs the most money.

True and not true. If they constantly have to upgrade the hardware to meet increasing demand it gets costly fast. Not to mention a few people with unlimited data plan can bring down the service for everyone. At some point you will cook standing there just like if you were in a microwave.

A pipe is a pipe, its has limits.
post #212 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

But now that you are capped, why shouldn't you be able to use all?

imho - because the prices, fair or not, would be higher if everyone used something close to their cap. AT&T beancounters probably revel in how many of us have been paying for 5GB and using < 20% of it. In return, the plans are hopefully priced a little lower than they would be if we all got near the cap.

The prices are what they are based on predicted use. And that price is lower than if tethering were allowed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

As far as plans being priced based on predicted use, then that is what they ought to be based on and flogged as. Instead they are sold to you as being based on what you can use, i.e. 2GB. So, you are paying to use 2GB, but they are assuming/predicting that you won't use it. If they are expecting you not to use 2GB but only 500MB, then charge for 500MB and not 2GB.

Yeah - I think the new plan is closer to achieving that for many of us, but like I said, it needs at least another tier. To me, it was ridiculous that they could be allowed to call something unlimited when it was in fact capped.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

If you use your data is such a way that you might be more likely to use the 2GB you paid for, then you have to pay a second time to actually use it up.

I see your point there, I really do.

Maybe this helps: Lots of us will never need to tether, and when I look at the price of my tier I can easily see it costing $20 more per month than it does now if tethering was included. Based on predicted use and how AT&T would have to set prices.

For some of us our usage might vary quite a bit, and maybe that's a reason to have fewer tiers. That could be another reason some of us will be further below our cap in a given month.

I agree, in a perfect world it would be nice to pay for exactly what you're going to use. But that's an unknown every month. You have to ask yourself if you'd prefer paying by the bit. Would you enjoy Pandora as much if each song cost a little more?
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post #213 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by str1f3 View Post

This is my point. Why should others on this thread criticize (some even said to lose weight, go to work and get out more) when their purchase was essentially an impulse buy while others actually made use of their purchase.

I have no concern for people who make impulse buys and then complain about it. If you signed up for an unlimited plan you still get to maintain your unlimited plan. AT&T is not tearing up those contracts, even though they legally can, with the caveat that you would no longer be responsible for at ETF fee.

There are aspects of this new plan l that I certainly don't care for, but it's their choice to do business as they see fit. Unless you can find some illegal about the practice, not undesirable, then all you're king is bellyaching. Comparing to another country's cellular infrastructure makes no sense.
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post #214 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

It's not silly at all for iPad WiFi+3G owners. It's very easy to exceed 2GB on an iPad (over 3G).

i got one of those. i load all my big content on it at home, by sync or by wifi. where do i want to stream via Netflix or TV websites for hours outside of a hotel or airport? and i just use SlingPlayer briefly to catch news and sports around town, probably a wifi cafe hot spot anyway. so when traveling i can bump up to the big plan that month, and the rest of the year i stay on the small plan. if you're a frequent flyer/road warrior, either you got bucks or some company is paying your travel costs (and very possibly your AT&T service costs too) anyway. so what is the actual problem scenario?
post #215 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

I have no concern for people who make impulse buys and then complain about it. If you signed up for an unlimited plan you still get to maintain your unlimited plan. AT&T is not tearing up those contracts, even though they legally can, with the caveat that you would no longer be responsible for at ETF fee.

Like I said before, what happens when your contract is up like mine is in July? Surely AT&T is not going to continue offering an unlimited plan to these users.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

There are aspects of this new plan l that I certainly don't care for, but it's their choice to do business as they see fit. Unless you can find some illegal about the practice, not undesirable, then all you're king is bellyaching. Comparing to another country's cellular infrastructure makes no sense.

You can call it bellyaching, whining, crying and whatever other sort of insult but people have a right to be upset over this. I don't get where you think I said AT&T is doing something illegal.

Comparing one company's data plan to another in a bordering country makes no sense to you? If you don't like that comparison go check out data plans for Verizon, T-Mobile & Sprint for a comparison that is more suitable for you.
post #216 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by str1f3 View Post

This is my point. Why should others on this thread criticize (some even said to lose weight, go to work and get out more) when their purchase was essentially an impulse buy while others actually made use of their purchase.

The term heavy user is a relative term in this case. Our neighbors up north consider heavy usage anything over 6GB and that includes free tethering. AT&T apparently considers over 2GB and are charging for tethering without any benefits. Had AT&T stuck to their unofficial/suggested cap of 5GB I wouldn't have a problem. 2GB is really a small amount for the price especially when you consider the upcoming potential features of the 4G and any future iTunes cloud-based content.

I should have clarified. The 6 GB in Canada was a limited time offer. Typical plans offer only 500 MB, but tethering is still free.
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post #217 of 360
For those of us that don't want a data plan at all with our phones, this isn't a bad option. At school I have wifi EVERYWHERE, there's no need for me to have a data plan. I'd be more interested in paying an extra $15 a month to have an iPhone/Android Phone than $30 a month. But the $25 a month for 2GB is a ripoff, imo.
post #218 of 360
AT&T provides an app that clearly shows your usage.

This is no different that monitoring your minutes or texts. We are supposed to be responsible grown ups.

Quote:
Originally Posted by peteo View Post

are you kidding me. The first time a person gets and overage bill for $100 since they didn't realize how much data they used to watch a base ball game on the MLB app, there are going to flip!!!!!!!
post #219 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteo View Post

You dont get it. The towers, internet lines, the routers, the spectrum licenses all have to be paid for REGARDLESS if you use 1k or 5 gigs. the cost must be spread out. The cost of sending the actuality bits to your computer is almost nothing (unlike, water, gas, electric) its the infrastructure to get it to you that costs the most money.

Your post makes little economic sense. On any number of fronts. But here's a catchall, put simply: creating capacity costs money; extra capacity costs more money (whether it's bandwidth, water pipes or generation/T&D assets for electric power).
post #220 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteo View Post

Umm your math is wrong your "Saving" $5 not $15.

Also I LOVE how every one is excited to pay a little less, to get ALLOT Less.
if AT&T really wanted to do users good, they would have added a $15 for 2 gig plan
But no they want to screw you and take as much money as they can.

you're looking at this wrong. we're paying a little less and STILL getting a LOT MORE than we will use.
anyone going over 2GB/Month needs to learn what WiFi is.
post #221 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteo View Post

You dont get it. The towers, internet lines, the routers, the spectrum licenses all have to be paid for REGARDLESS if you use 1k or 5 gigs. the cost must be spread out. The cost of sending the actuality bits to your computer is almost nothing (unlike, water, gas, electric) its the infrastructure to get it to you that costs the most money.

But infrastructure has to be paid for and replaced after some time. Divide the cost of the infrastructure by its lifetime and the amount of data it can throughput and you get a cost per MB.

What you argue is that the marginal costs of one MB are essentially zero (probably a small additional electricity consumption in the towers). But while a company can offer a product at marginal cost while it has idle capacity, it cannot do so forever.
post #222 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by peteo View Post

You dont get it. The towers, internet lines, the routers, the spectrum licenses all have to be paid for REGARDLESS if you use 1k or 5 gigs. the cost must be spread out. The cost of sending the actuality bits to your computer is almost nothing (unlike, water, gas, electric) its the infrastructure to get it to you that costs the most money.


You don't get it. I'm a network engineer....been one for almost 20 years now. Networks cost money.....an awful lot of money. The more bandwidth that you use, the more routers you need as well as higher speed links, backhaul circuits, cell phone towers, etc.

You think just like the FCC.....that all of this should be free.
post #223 of 360
I went into an AT&T store today to confirm the news. Their suggestion?

Hold onto your unlimited plan for as long as you can.
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post #224 of 360
I've got no problem with the cap - if its really true that it only affects 2% of users, it's a great trade off for the other 98% of us. I'm a heavy user - I have an exchange account + gmail, I use logmein to support computers from my phone, and download podcasts daily (over wifi or 3G whatever is convenient). I stream pandora at times. I've used 5 GB of data in the 4 months between Feb 1 and June 1. If all my use averages only 1.25 GB, then I find lowering the price to $25 for most users and allowing heavy users to pay for the strain they put on the network is a perfect trade.
post #225 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

I should have clarified. The 6 GB in Canada was a limited time offer. Typical plans offer only 500 MB, but tethering is still free.

Well, it was a limited time promo but they have run it with both of the Canadian iPhone launches, opened it to other devices and it ran for months both times (IIRC). At this point, if you need it, it will come back.

Also, with Fido they recently added a couple new retentions plans to counter Wind defections. You can get a pretty good voice plan for $50 if you threaten to leave (pretty much unlimited except for long distance) and for $30 more you can add the 6GB of data on top.

Also, tethering is included on all plans except the 500MB (unless you have a grandfather plan, which did include tethering at 500MB). But any plans over 1GB have it included.

Basically, Rogers/Fido's attitude to this point is "you are paying for a specific amount of data, so why should we care how you use that data? If you go over your allotment, whether you tether or not, we charge more for overages, so great. If you don't go over, whether you tether or not, we were paid for data you didn't use, so great"

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"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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post #226 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by O-Mac View Post

what do you need tethering for if you have a smartphone?
and do you really need to be online so much?

people, get your heads out of your laptops and enjoy the outdoors a little. talk to someone face to face. lose some weight!!

Yeah that's it, how about when I am stuck in an airport for 4 hours and need to get some work done? Or stuck in a crappy hotel with crappy wifi and need to get some work done? Ill get my head out of my laptop if you get your out of your A$$.
post #227 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by walshbj View Post

I don't buy that tethering argument. You paid for what the phone could consume. Not your computer's consumption appetite.

Free mints in a restaurant: you put a couple in your pocket. You don't bring in a wheelbarrow and demand all the mints in the storeroom.

What? Free mints. If they restaurant gives me two mints why should I pay the restaurant to let my kids eat my two mints? 2GB is 2GB no matter how I consume it, if I consume more then I pay. Your analogy is way off.
post #228 of 360
double posted - see below
post #229 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Not really. All it takes is one carrier to stay with unlimited and the others will soon have to go back. Back when cell phones first came out I paid $50 a month for 30 mins. As carriers increased data and eventually offered unlimited, all the rest had to follow suit. AT$T only gets away with this because they are the only ones carrying the iPhone, we have no other options if we want an iPhone. As soon as another carrier gets the iPhone they will want to draw customers, how will they do it, offer unlimited data and AT&T customers will flock. This is why AT$t raised the ETF and is trying hard to lock people into new two year contracts. They know customers do not have a choice but once they do they have allot to account for.

Let's adjust those expectations just a titch: "All it takes is one MAJOR carrier..." the locals can squirm all they want but it only impacts a limited user group. It has to be between the big players - primarily Sprint/Nextel, ATT and Verizon. And while they like jacking each other, they only have so much room to play with, so they aren't going to do much beyond what the cable and DSL and satellite companies do to each other, offer limited time discounts that existing customers can't use, in order to pull some vagabond users from other carriers. And with all the other complaints cited here, not to mention the reluctant Verizon customers who just had to have an iPhone, it will take more than just some temporary price reduction to pull them back to ATT if the iPhone goes to Verizon. Plus we have NO definitive indication that the Verizon network will be able to handle the data use any better than the ATT system has. The best you have is maybe fewer dropped calls. Maybe.

There will some migration back to Verizon, some vagabonds who want to try out Verizon after being on ATT, and Verizon may well offer some attractive terms to try and recover some of the customers lost to ATT, but once things regularize the data plans will not come down in price, they will increase and they will continue to play with your affections until you are a bitter and disillusioned customer or numb or uncaring. Youneed to look carefully at how the industry has operated over the last couple of decades and see the trends for what they are.

post #230 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by scotty321 View Post

The name of this article should really be changed to:

AT&T nearly doubles the cost of 5 GB of data for users, from $30 per month to $55 per month

OR

AT&T finally announces tethering... (not that you can use it!)
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post #231 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katonah View Post

So... with this new plan I can pay $25 (instead of the current $30), and add $20 for tethering, and use the tethering to get 3G service on my iPad, thus allowing me to avoid paying $30 per month for the iPad 3G service? Or am I missing something?

Can you tether an iPad to an iPhone?
post #232 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by noexpectations View Post

It's a lot more than you think. I was away on vacation for a week.....I surfed/emailed extensively! My data usage for that month?....202MB.

I do not want to pay for someone else's data hogging.

You can quite easily go through 1GB/week on an iPad. Remember, it's not just web surfing and email, it's also network access by apps, any transaction with the App Store (or iTunes, generally), including app updates.

Given that $30/month for unlimited data was advertised by AT&T as an inducement to buy a device that connects to their network, changing it to 2GB/month, 1 month after that device became available, and customers purchased it with the expectation of data at a specified cost, is classic bait and switch. Remember, if you don't currently have an active data plan with AT&T you aren't an existing customer, and you were supposed to be able to signup for and discontinue these plans at will.
post #233 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Only the true data hogs will be paying more. On another web site some poster was lamenting that he used something like 60GB/mo all the time. That's the type that needs to pay a lot more. That's a real data hog.

I agree. While this won't affect me because I am grandfathered in and only use a GB or so per month, the price was $30 for a soft 5 GB limit (even if ATT did not enforce the limit which is their own fault) for a cost of $6 per GB. Now it is $25.00 for 2 GB for a cost of $12.50 GB. While I am all for someone using 60 GB a month paying more (I would prefer something in the middle like a flat $ 8 per GB and it is fair to all users depending on their use) using 5 GB is not in the same league as someone using 60 GB and ATT should have put in a plan to curb that sort of abuse, not go after those in the currently acceptable 5GB usage range.
post #234 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by old-wiz View Post

Now that AT&T has all those customers and all the demand from iPhones and iPads, they have a captive market and can charge whatever they d*** well please, although existing customers can keep their unlimited plans

and your point is?
Current customers can continue to pay what they are currently paying or not. How is that bad?
post #235 of 360
On Monday Steve will announce the iVOIP.

3G, GPS, OS4, no voice plan needed, no-contract iPad style data plan.

16GB WiFi: $299
32GB WiFi: $399

16GB 3G: $399
32GB 3G: $499.

Take that, AT&T!
post #236 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhyde View Post

Can you tether an iPad to an iPhone?

Steve said earlier that the WIFI iPad wouldn't support tethering and if you wanted 3G get the 3G version.... Something like that... I guess Apples feeling was, if everyone thought the iPad could 'soon' get 3G off an iPhone then not as many 3G iPads would sell.
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post #237 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

What? Free mints. If they restaurant gives me two mints why should I pay the restaurant to let my kids eat my two mints? 2GB is 2GB no matter how I consume it, if I consume more then I pay. Your analogy is way off.

I admit it's not a perfect analogy. The point is the pricing is based on the tool you have to consume the data: an iPhone. A different tool you could consume data with is a computer. It consumes more. They know you're NOT using a computer so the pricing is lower for the plan based on that fact.

The mints are provided because you'll be carrying them in your pocket - not a wheelbarrow. Some people will take two, some will take three, nobody will take 5000.

The problem is that people are trying to make a tiered system have perfectly matched usage. That doesn't work. Some people fall under the tier limit, others exceed it. many of those complaining are seeking a charge by the bit plan.

Like I said, do you really want to pay by the bit?

Before you shoot this idea down try thinking it through and realizing that you're not paying by the bit so you won't match the allowance.
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post #238 of 360
To everyone bitching about this: PLEASE do all of us that have some sense a favor and switch to Verizon/Sprint/Tmobile/<insert favorite carrier>. Do you honestly think that Verizon, etc isn't going to follow suit? How long did it take for AT&T to match Verizon's unlimited pricing when they announced it a few months ago? Not even 24 hours if I recall...

By the way - tethering your phone to a laptop is not the same as using the Internet on the phone. Nor is it the same as washing the dishes with your 5000 gal allotment of water for your house. It's more like owning two houses side by side with water service only at one of the houses and then running a hose over the fence to supply the other house.

Oh, and one more thing - if you're using more than 2GB of Data on your phone inside of 30 days, you might consider walking out of your mom's basement, getting a job, and making some friends.
post #239 of 360
Here's all I'd like to know.
How do I shut down ALL data on my iPhone to ensure that I'm not accidentally connecting when I'm away from wifi?
I can turn off 3G, but that leaves Edge running.
I can go into Airplane mode, then turn wifi back on, but then my phone is off.

2 gripes I have about my iPhone are:
1) Lack of certainty that I'm not actually using wireless (so that I can better control it), and
2) Lack of 'one-click' tools to turn specific features on or off. I shouldn't have to drill down to do simple things like turn bluetooth or wireless on/off.
post #240 of 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

The moaning and wailing and caterwauling here is out-of-control. Pathetic, really.

Pay for what you eat!

Totally agree. But that's not what AT&T is offering.
They're saying 'pay 1/2 of what you pay now to get 1/5 of the service.'

If they simply implemented a rate per 1/2 gig, that would be totally fair.
That's not what they're doing.
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