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Apple yanks widget apps, likely to add feature to iPhone OS 4 - Page 3

post #81 of 156
I'm a developer for Apple and it's becoming a joke.

I've got a patch for my app that I've tried to submit back in January that has yet to be approved, each reason is random

I've had to send in screen shots of their developer pages to show them that I'm using documented methods...I've learend that the reviewers don't really read your emails, but pictures work well.

The process is completely random, it's now becoming funny.

If I had it to do over again I would have invested my time learning the Android platform.

I'll post updates to existing apps that I have, but I'm not wasting any more time developing new apps for the app store.

Apple didn't learn from the past, users want freedom and choice.

It's the reason apple failed in the past (Adobe's graphical suite was the only useful program on the Mac years ago, the major reason people bought Mac's, and now Apple's bashing the one company that kept them alive...nice)

Steve will eventually piss everyone off.

Lesson learned.
post #82 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTel View Post

Ya know, I had no problem with Apple preventing apps from getting on for valid reasons but yanking them after the fact is a bit much. I'd be frustrated and discouraged if they did that to me. They are the gate keeper so they can throw apps out too but there's this fine line when innovation ceases to exist on a platform.

Spot-on, my friend.

This story is like ones we're reading almost every week now, where developers spend thousands or tens of thousands or, in the case of Adobe and other x-plat tools vendors, millions complying with Apple's rules, and then at the last minute Apple changes the rules without notice and destroys that developer's investment in their platform.

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

Developers and their VCs around the world are reconsidering the wisdom of investing in iPhone OS development. Apple is simply too fickle to be considered a reliable, trustworthy business partner.
post #83 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by TenoBell View Post

As we know this was simply a ploy to sell a phone that few people want. If you look in the fine print, Verizon says they can start charging for the hot spot feature anytime they choose.


Oh. Ok. That's different.

What I originally responded to was your statement that "No major carrier is going to allow free tethering. "

Verizon is a major carrier. Verizon allows free tethering.

But let's talk about the quality of the Pre instead. Or what Verizon may or may not do someday. Anything except the original claim that "No major carrier is going to allow free tethering."
post #84 of 156
Its amazing the develops continue to support the iPhone with this kind of stuff going on.

Imagine the work they put into it, they get approved, they start making money and Apple crashes down on their party.

Apple is only going to expidite two things, Android app development and bringing the DOJ to their front door faster.

That market cap iFan orgy everyone was so happy about, will only bring the heat faster now.

Good luck Apple. I wonder if Android will out sell the iPhone in the US in 2010, my guess is yes.
post #85 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by jouster View Post

Tried that last week. Turns out you can't see Chicago from Connecticut.

If Earth was the size of Jupiter and you had a really, really, really big pair of binoculars, you'd be able to.

But then you'd probably be crushed to a pile of goo to begin with...
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post #86 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by swinge;1644809

[B


To those who think Google doesn't also bend to business pressures I suggest you open your eyes... Thinks are getting bumped out of the Android market place as well:
http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl...0/05/28/079200 [/B]


You seem to be taking a superficial similarity, an app being discontinued, and to be using that as the basis for a claim that the Android app world and the Apple app world are therefore similar.

Not only do you miss the main point, which is NOT that apps are discontinued, but rather, WHY they are discontinued, but you also miss the basic difference between the two markets.

If Apple refuses to sell your app, you have no real access to iPhone users. If Google refuses to sell your app, there are an infinite number of other vendors available to you.

Aside from the fact that in the case you cite Google's actions were perfectly understandable, while Apple's actions are not, nobody needs Google's marketplace in order to sell apps. There is competition in the Android app marketplace. It is not a walled garden.
post #87 of 156
I feel sorry for this fellow but he is a software developer so he is not stupid. He must have wondered whether he was on thin ice by developing something so close to an OS feature. It certainly would have been in the back of my mind.
post #88 of 156
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it,"

It would do Apple's board well to do a little historical research and rediscover the price the company paid for letting job's retain fanatically tight control on their products in the 1980s. There are plus and down sides to any genius, which is why men of average ability and outlook should manage them. Otherwise you end up with "history" -- again, and again, and again...
post #89 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by testor View Post


Steve will eventually piss everyone off.

.


Is there any precedent for that?
post #90 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

I wonder if Android will out sell the iPhone in the US in 2010, my guess is yes.

Good guess - it happened before the middle of the year:
http://www.google.com/search?q=android+outsells+iphone
post #91 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I feel sorry for this fellow but he is a software developer so he is not stupid. He must have wondered whether he was on thin ice by developing something so close to an OS feature. It certainly would have been in the back of my mind.

The key to appreciating the horror of this latest anti-developer move by Apple is in this part of the story:

Quote:
Jobs reportedly replied, "We are not allowing apps that create their own desktops. Sorry." Ivanovic's app adds a layer of information over user's own photos, similar to Microsoft's Vista Gadgets or Mac OS X's Dashboard, although the app is not integrated into the iPad desktop, and is launched like any other app.

It's just an app, more like a screen saver than any "OS feature". Apple had published no guidelines suggesting it would not be acceptable, and indeed had approved the app for sale in their store - three times.

Stories like this are cropping up with a regularity that is quite dismaying to the developer world and, like the posters above, moving a great many of them to Android.
post #92 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

It doesn't? So I guess I'm imagining iTunes continuing to play while I checked my email. And I guess that I didn't really see Pandora continuing to play in the background in the iPhone OS 4.0 demo.

I really wish you lame trolls would stop with the outright lies.

Next time try reading past the second sentence before calling someone a troll. I'm not sure if native apps that have always multitasked follow the same rules, but the method of multitasking I described is accurate for App Store apps in OS 4.0. Pandora continues to stream music because Apple provided an API for performing that task, not because the app itself is still running, but that isn't a bad thing. It's efficient and looks no different to the end user.

Edit: 1000 troll posts? Give me a break. Only tekstud did that.
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post #93 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

It's just an app, more like a screen saver than any "OS feature".

A screen saver is an OS feature. I can't remember buying a separate screensaver app since After Dark in the early 90s.
post #94 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

Good guess - it happened before the middle of the year:
http://www.google.com/search?q=android+outsells+iphone

New Android phones just introduced outsold a year old iPhone? Wow... The question was will they outsell the iPhone in 2010? As in the whole year, which includes the 4th gen iPhone launch. We all saw the sales numbers from the minimally upgraded 3GS, a significantly upgraded 4th gen model will destroy those. It's likely that Android phones will outsell the iPhone on a continuous basis, but I don't think 2010 will be that year. Try to be a little more rational and a little less troll.
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post #95 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

A screen saver is an OS feature.

How do you define "OS feature"?

Quote:
I can remember buying a separate screensaver app since After Dark in the early 90s.

Precisely. Why would anyone anticipate that something commonly available from third parties since the dawn of GUI computing would suddenly become verboten on iPhone OS?
post #96 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

New Android phones just introduced outsold a year old iPhone? Wow... The question was will they outsell the iPhone in 2010? As in the whole year, which includes the 4th gen iPhone launch.

We'll see. But even if Apple pulls ahead again, analysts like Gartner believe it will be short-lived:

Android to grab No. 2 spot by 2012, says Gartner
http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...2_says_Gartner

Note the date of that article: October 6, 2009. That's noteworthy because Gartner's prediction came out long before Apple's SDK 4.0 fiasco and the steady stream of stories about other ways they've screwed developers and VCs, events which have initiated a migration of developers away from Apple to the Android platform.
post #97 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

How do you define "OS feature"?

Things that are commonly included with or built-in to an OS.

Quote:
Precisely. Why would anyone anticipate that something commonly available from third parties since the dawn of GUI computing would suddenly become verboten on iPhone OS?

I meant to write "can't." There are lots of programs that used to be separate apps but have become part of the OS over the years. What OS these days doesn't come with a browser?

You are making out like Apple is coming "out of the blue" with this ban but it is only out of the blue if you can not see the pattern with desktop OS and predict that the same would happen with mobile OS. Sorry, but a widget framework is an obvious one, since a major job of an OS is to provide application frameworks, and a widget is a class of lightweight application.

Any software developer, or person in the industry, should have noticed that Vista and OS X Tiger both already have such a framework, and therefore conclude that writing such a thing for OS X mobile (which is what iPhone OS is) might not be such a long term proposition. But I don't want to harp on this topic any more, since anyone who expends some effort is a good person in my book.
post #98 of 156
I like it! Apple should systematically take all the best kinds of apps, make those things OS features, and then tell the developers to piss off. All Apple has to do is look at what apps are downloaded the most and they can work their way through them. GENIUS!
post #99 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

A screen saver is an OS feature. I can't remember buying a separate screensaver app since After Dark in the early 90s.

MS claimed the browser was a part of the OS. No modern consumer OS would ship with a mail client or media player.

Any functionality that becomes commonplace is a candidate for being defined as a possible OS feature. The difference between now and in the past, is that even if the OS implemented a function that was available separately the original app might still be available or the OS vendor could buy them out (Sherlock/Watson as an example). It sucked for the devs of original apps as they would die off eventually, because as you mention, why buy it when it is free in the OS, but they were left with a chance.

Today, if you develop an app that includes useful functionality you risk simply being kicked out, precisely because it was so useful Apple decides to implement it themselves. As a developer, you are encouraged to create and sell apps that apps that add to the experience, especially if it adds functionality not otherwise available. But, you serve at their pleasure and when they decide you don't fit, you don't fit.

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post #100 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

Things that are commonly included with or built-in to an OS.



I meant to write "can't." There are lots of programs that used to be separate apps but have become part of the OS over the years. What OS these days doesn't come with a browser?

You are making out like Apple is coming "out of the blue" with this ban but it is only out of the blue if you can not see the pattern with desktop OS and predict that the same would happen with mobile OS. Sorry, but a widget framework is an obvious one, since a major job of an OS is to provide application frameworks, and a widget is a class of lightweight application.

Any software developer, or person in the industry, should have noticed that Vista and OS X Tiger both already have such a framework, and therefore conclude that writing such a thing for OS X mobile (which is what iPhone OS is) might not be such a long term proposition. But I don't want to harp on this topic any more, since anyone who expends some effort is a good person in my book.

But with that logic, any developer that creates useful apps should expect that they will be removed simply because they are useful.

You are completely correct that as functionality becomes common, it often becomes part of the OS. But that doesn't mean devs should expect to go out of business if they develop a good and useful app.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

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post #101 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

Quote:
How do you define "OS feature"?

Things that are commonly included with or built-in to an OS.

Do you mean to suggest that any category for which the OS vendor supplies an app should be explicitly forbidden to developers?

That would prohibit Firefox, Thunderbird, Premier, Dreamweaver, RapidWeaver, Cakewalk, Office, and thousands of other apps.

Is that really the sort of OS experience you're looking for?

Quote:
You are making out like Apple is coming "out of the blue" with this ban but it is only out of the blue if you can not see the pattern with desktop OS and predict that the same would happen with mobile OS.

Would you kindly point us to the URL where Apple had previously forbidden apps like MyFrame?

Please note that in contrast to your characterization, Apple had explicitly approved the app - three times.

Quote:
Sorry, but a widget framework is an obvious one, since a major job of an OS is to provide application frameworks, and a widget is a class of lightweight application.

Any software developer, or person in the industry, should have noticed that Vista and OS X Tiger both already have such a framework, and therefore conclude that writing such a thing for OS X mobile (which is what iPhone OS is) might not be such a long term proposition. But I don't want to harp on this topic any more, since anyone who expends some effort is a good person in my book.

That an OS vendor has the right to *compete* with their developers in any category they choose is not disputed.

What's new in Apple's recent pattern of aggression against developers is that they don't merely compete, but *forbid*.

Very, very different things.
post #102 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

Not even vaguely the same way. Those iPhone apps will never be usable on a device that isn't manufactured by Apple. So if you don't like the features on the iPhone, you're out of luck. That WOULD BE lock-in.

With Android, if you bought an HTC device and decided a Motorola device was better for you, you could switch without losing all your apps.

And Lo! There it is. The traditional phone companies sell handsets, and stick on whatever OS is been pimped best from the software guys. Apple sell the platform. Why would I want iPhone OS on other hardware? What will it give me?
post #103 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

Do you mean to suggest that any category for which the OS vendor supplies an app should be explicitly forbidden to developers?

No but I think a computer system has software levels. There are certain functions that belong logically at certain levels, and app management is an OS level function, and widgets are a class of app.

One clue that you might be stepping on the OSes toes with your app is if you start duplicating a lot of OS-like stuff, such as writing schedulers or sandboxing or such.

The other types of app that can be included with an OS are email programs and web browsers, since they are so necessary and ubiquitous and there is no real paid market for them any more.

Quote:
Would you kindly point us to the URL where Apple had previously forbidden apps like MyFrame?

They haven't previously forbidden that kind of app, but they have previously added it to an OS of theirs. When OS X 10.4 came out they introduced Dashboard which all but killed the incredibly popular Konfabulator app at the time. That should have raised a red flag with this dev, since iPhone OS is 85% the same code as Mac OS X, it might logically have the same next steps.

Quote:
That an OS vendor has the right to *compete* with their developers in any category they choose is not disputed.

What's new in Apple's recent pattern of aggression against developers is that they don't merely compete, but *forbid*.

Very, very different things.

I agree they should be very careful about banning. But as I said, due to the logical layers of the OS I think it was the right choice *in this case.*
post #104 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

But with that logic, any developer that creates useful apps should expect that they will be removed simply because they are useful.

I think that is an overly cynical view. Try to look at it from Apple's perspective. They have the bird's eye view, they have to look out for the system *as a whole.*

When developers start duplicating parts of the OS at the app level (widget managers) or start building entire other frameworks at that level (Flash), they have to say "Woah!" No one else has that perspective, and no one else can do that job.

At the very least it will be an interesting experiment. Computers have been troublesome and buggy for a long time, and a lot of the reason for that is app developers breaking the boundaries of what logically should be an app, and as a result adversely effecting the system as a whole, making the computer unstable. Will a platform that finally clamps down on that ultimately be better for everyone, or will it fail (as some here seem to think). Let's wait and see.
post #105 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

We'll see. But even if Apple pulls ahead again, analysts like Gartner believe it will be short-lived:

Android to grab No. 2 spot by 2012, says Gartner
http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...2_says_Gartner

Note the date of that article: October 6, 2009. That's noteworthy because Gartner's prediction came out long before Apple's SDK 4.0 fiasco and the steady stream of stories about other ways they've screwed developers and VCs, events which have initiated a migration of developers away from Apple to the Android platform.

It's not an if, the 4th gen iPhone will exceed the sales of all android devices in the quarter of its launch. Why did you switch from phone sales to developers? Like any good troll you change topics when you're uncomfortable with where the discussion is headed. 2012 isn't 2010, and the iPhone hasn't had a massive drop in developers that would affect sales due to apps not being available.

Like I said, Android devices will likely outsell iPhones at some point, but it's unlikely that 2010 will be that year, and your presented no evidence otherwise (except that they could if Apple didn't release a new iPhone). Honestly, out selling a single device with a slew of devices isn't that great of an accomplishment anyway. I have nothing against Android, and 2.2 has some features I'd love to have on my iPhone. I just don't like Android trolls in an iPhone thread.
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post #106 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Widgets? Does anybody use widgets on the Mac? I can't remember last time I did. I can't remember ever seeing anybody use them. Maybe they'll be more useful on a phone or pad...

It's just you.

I use widgets on my Mac. And so does every Mac owner I know.
post #107 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I think that is an overly cynical view. Try to look at it from Apple's perspective. They have the bird's eye view, they have to look out for the system *as a whole.*

When developers start duplicating parts of the OS at the app level (widget managers) or start building entire other frameworks at that level (Flash), they have to say "Woah!" No one else has that perspective, and no one else can do that job.

It is obvious that there was not a problem, hence it's approval. It wasn't removed because it started duplicating anything. It might have been removed because Apple will now duplicate the functionality that it provided, but not the reverse.

I am sure Apple does have a very high level picture of the whole. It would be nice to let devs know some of it or even use the info they have to prevent devs from wasting time and effort (i.e. their livelihood) developing apps that don't fit the big picture.

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post #108 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

I know you're just a troll, but for those that might actually *believe* this crap I have to mention that in fact the implementation of multi-tasking on iPhone OS 4 is almost identical to the multi-tasking on Android. The two systems work essentially the exact same way.

I am curious to know why you think Android and iPhone OS 4 and Android are similar on multi-tasking? I am interested in a detailed comparison if anybody can provide one.
post #109 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

I am curious to know why you think Android and iPhone OS 4 and Android are similar on multi-tasking? I am interested in a detailed comparison if anybody can provide one.

I've heard that many times from android users, but they were saying it in a negative way. "Ha you think Apples implementation of multitasking is a new idea? That's how Android has always done it". Now they seem to be on the "the iPhone doesn't offer real multitasking but Android does" train. I don't know how multitasking on Android works, I wish I did so I could separate fact from fiction.
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post #110 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

I am curious to know why you think Android and iPhone OS 4 and Android are similar on multi-tasking? I am interested in a detailed comparison if anybody can provide one.

I don't know where there's a comparison, but this video from the 11:10 mark will tell you about the iPhone multitasking capabilities to be introduced with OS 4. From 16min on it gets quite technical.

http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/specialevent0410/
post #111 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

We'll see. But even if Apple pulls ahead again, analysts like Gartner believe it will be short-lived:

Android to grab No. 2 spot by 2012, says Gartner
http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...2_says_Gartner

Note the date of that article: October 6, 2009. That's noteworthy because Gartner's prediction came out long before Apple's SDK 4.0 fiasco and the steady stream of stories about other ways they've screwed developers and VCs, events which have initiated a migration of developers away from Apple to the Android platform.

There's no mass migration from Apple to Android yet. Doesn't mean it won't happen....Jobs could keep this up and piss off dvelopers enough to precipitate such an event sooner. Just not yet.

As for pulling ahead, who know. It'll happen simply because Android has way more vendors. But it's debatable whether Android will beat the iPhone OS in 2010. I would add that you also have to look beyond just the phones. In the end what matters (particularly for developers) is the installed base for the OS. That should include the iTouch, iPad and iPhone. Android's still got a ways to go to catch up.
post #112 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

I've heard that many times from android users, but they were saying it in a negative way. "Ha you think Apples implementation of multitasking is a new idea? That's how Android has always done it". Now they seem to be on the "the iPhone doesn't offer real multitasking but Android does" train. I don't know how multitasking on Android works, I wish I did so I could separate fact from fiction.

From what I've seen on my Nexus One and the OS 4.0 keynote the major difference seems to be the suspended state. I am curious to know what the practical difference is. For example, on my Nexus One, I routinely stream music (Slacker, RadioTime or SiriusXM) and play a game (say Air Control) at the same time. Would iPhone OS 4 allow this?
post #113 of 156
"It's also impossibly unlikely that Apple would want to cede that feature to a third party app."

Doesn't that mean it is possibly likely that Apple would want to cede that feature to a third party app?
post #114 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by swinge View Post

Right...and how well would that work if you purchased a Blackberry or a Windows based HTC phone?? Apple is no less "closed" in that sense...

And if you buy a Black & Decker blender, iPhone apps won't work on that either. If you're going to be ridiculous, please go all out.

Quote:
Apps are OS specific....

Well, hello, yes! All computer systems are closed to some extent. Are you going to sit there and tell me Apple's iPhone isn't a heck of a lot more closed than Android?

Quote:
Trolls, at least come up with valid points...

Ah, the old "anyone who even vaguely speaks ill of Apple must be a troll" argument. Classic.
post #115 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

From what I've seen on my Nexus One and the OS 4.0 keynote the major difference seems to be the suspended state. I am curious to know what the practical difference is. For example, on my Nexus One, I routinely stream music (Slacker, RadioTime or SiriusXM) and play a game (say Air Control) at the same time. Would iPhone OS 4 allow this?

As explicitly stated in the Apple keynote, and in some of the previous posts in this thread, yes.
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post #116 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetz View Post

From what I've seen on my Nexus One and the OS 4.0 keynote the major difference seems to be the suspended state. I am curious to know what the practical difference is. For example, on my Nexus One, I routinely stream music (Slacker, RadioTime or SiriusXM) and play a game (say Air Control) at the same time. Would iPhone OS 4 allow this?

You didn't watch the keynote very closely. They specifically had the guy from Pandora on, saying how OS 4 lets you play radio in the background of other apps.
post #117 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

It's not an if, the 4th gen iPhone will exceed the sales of all android devices in the quarter of its launch.

As with the rollout of any new product, in such an abitrarily narrow window as a single quarter I would agree.


Quote:
Why did you switch from phone sales to developers? Like any good troll you change topics when you're uncomfortable with where the discussion is headed.

I think you have that exactly backwards.

Look up.

Yes, near the top of this page.

See the title of this discussion topic?

It's about a developer who had his app removed from the App Store.

That's what this thread is about: Apple's relationship with developers.

The specific post you're replying to was a response to another poster who suggested Android sales would exceed Apple sales in 2010, in which my comment about developers was an attempt to bring this thread back on topic.

But as long as you're intent on hijacking this thread, let's take a moment to address that:

Quote:
2012 isn't 2010

Astute observation.

If you read my posts you'd note that year-to-date for 2010 Android is already outselling iPhone, and aside from the one-quarter bump you imagine when Apple finally gets around to upgrading the only model of phone they offer, Gartner believes this trend favoring Android sales will continue, eventually eclipsing iPhone completely in 2012.


Quote:
…and the iPhone hasn't had a massive drop in developers that would affect sales due to apps not being available.

"Massive" is relative. It's only a matter of time before one of us is proven correct.

In the meantime, consider the many apps Apple already forbids on iPhone/iPad:

Teachers can't use Squeak, researchers and engineers can't use MatLab, analysts (and most of the statistics world, including sociologists, research psychologists, engineers, biologists, etc.) can't use R, nor can anyone use any other tool that relies on interpreted languages.

Then add to that the many entire categories of apps that Apple is progessively shutting down from their new OS, such as the one which is the topic of this thread.

Then consider the many vertical-market apps that rely on cross-platform frameworks to be cost-effective, specialized tools for a million business, medical, and other niches that will never be allowed on iPhone OS until Apple backpeddles on Section 3.3.1.

Add all those together and that's several tens of millions of people; doctors, business owners, scientists, engineeers, professionals of all sorts who won't be able to do their work on iPhone OS - all choosing Android because Steve forced them to.

You can dismiss these audiences if you like. Enjoy your movies.


Quote:
Like I said, Android devices will likely outsell iPhones at some point, but it's unlikely that 2010 will be that year, and your presented no evidence otherwise (except that they could if Apple didn't release a new iPhone). Honestly, out selling a single device with a slew of devices isn't that great of an accomplishment anyway.

Agreed: Apple's closed nature will squander its momentary lead with iPhone OS to eventually maringalize it as it's done with 24 years of Mac OS earning a mere 5.4% market share.

Quote:
I just don't like Android trolls in an iPhone thread.

I'm a developer in a developer thread.

So which one of us is in the wrong thread?
post #118 of 156
Specifically I was talking about offering free tethering for all Android phones simply because tethering is built into the Android OS. No major carrier is going to offer free tethering on all of their Android phones. You are the one who brought up the Pre.

The situation with the Pre is something entirely different from what I was talking about. Verizon is offering the hot spot feature for free to sell an over stocked and unpopular phone. They reserve the option to charge for this feature at any time. I would not exactly consider that free tethering either.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevie View Post

Oh. Ok. That's different.

What I originally responded to was your statement that "No major carrier is going to allow free tethering. "

Verizon is a major carrier. Verizon allows free tethering.

But let's talk about the quality of the Pre instead. Or what Verizon may or may not do someday. Anything except the original claim that "No major carrier is going to allow free tethering."
post #119 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

Spot-on, my friend.
This story is like ones we're reading almost every week now, where developers spend thousands or tens of thousands or, in the case of Adobe and other x-plat tools vendors, millions complying with Apple's rules, and then at the last minute Apple changes the rules without notice and destroys that developer's investment in their platform.

Jobs just said yesterday that when apps are pulled from the store their is always more to the story than the developer is telling. Developers sometimes even lie. He said Apple does not feel the need to constantly defend these choices.

Quote:
Developers and their VCs around the world are reconsidering the wisdom of investing in iPhone OS development. Apple is simply too fickle to be considered a reliable, trustworthy business partner.

There have been an extremely small number of developers who choose to not develop for the iPhone because of Apple policies. But where do you see this as any wide movement? App store submissions are growing exponentially.
post #120 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by RationalTroll View Post

I'm a developer in a developer thread.

So which one of us is in the wrong thread?

Regardless of the thread title, you were talking about sales. It's also funny how you looking at one quarter with some major Android launches is fine, but me looking at a quarter with an iPhone launch that will blow those launches out of the water is incredibly narrow. Is the Droid still the best Android launch? That launch matched, in fact slightly bettered the original iPhones launch? The original iPhone took 60 days (or was it 90) to hit a million devices. The 3GS took three days. They are orders of magnitude different. I guess that doesn't matter because the EVO is apparently going to change the world (4 hours at a time).

Quote:
Agreed: Apple's closed nature will squander its momentary lead with iPhone OS to eventually maringalize it as it's done with 24 years of Mac OS earning a mere 5.4% market share.

Pretty good for one hardware vendor. If Apple was going for market share, they would license their OS, and make less money as a result.

You can have your thread back, I'm done being trolled. If you want to be on topic, talk about widgets.
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