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Some iPhone 4 launch units lose signal when held with left hand - Page 2

post #41 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

If it is a shorting issue due to damp hands as some seem to suggest, a layer of clear plastic (clear nail varnish?) or a case would suffice one would think.

If the invisible shield can't stop it probably not damp. Clear nail varnish? Please don't tell me you're suggest we paint our phones with that crap?

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post #42 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:08am
BTW, anyone go back to watch the keynote from earlier this month? Anyone notice if SJ was holding the iPhone 4 the wrong way and that's why he was having all those WiFi issues?
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post #43 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:09am
I once had a Mac with really poor WiFi reception and I thought it was the Alu case and was cursing the design, but it turned out the antenna wasn't plugged in on the motherboard. Since not everyone is reporting this issue it may just be a manufacturing problem and not a fundamental design issue. There is other evidence that manufacturing is being rushed, namely the undried glue on the screen.

But there are so many factors in cell reception that there really needs to be some isolation testing at this point.
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post #44 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:09am
Hopefully not a major issue, but I will not be picking up my reserved iphone today as originally planned. Will wait to see how this plays out.
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post #45 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflybob View Post

So purchase a friggin' Bumper and "problem" solved!

Seriously.... how did some of you manage to get this far in life?

I for one am not really interested in having to buy an extra item in order to use the phone. As for the bumpers specifically, if Apple deems it necessary to use these to have predictable service to make calls, then they better start giving them free with every purchase.

Of course, even if they did give them for free, I am not interested in a stupid looking bumper or a case that adds thickness as a fix. That's really just a band-aid. The clear coating on the metal is interesting though. Hopefully there is just some ground wire that didn't get connected during the assembly process for some phones.

We'll see...
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post #46 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflybob View Post

So purchase a friggin' Bumper and "problem" solved!

Seriously.... how did some of you manage to get this far in life?

Problem hidden, not solved. Seriously, you're going to accept that as a solution? What will you do when you're selling the phone on eBay (if it turns out special firmware can't fix this)?

"Make sure you use it case, the phone loses calls without a case".

If you weren't being sarcastic than I have pity for you.

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post #47 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflybob View Post

So purchase a friggin' Bumper and "problem" solved!

Seriously.... how did some of you manage to get this far in life?

Some people don't want a bumper on their phone. And, more importantly, you shouldn't have to buy an accessory to mask a critical design flaw.
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post #48 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

"However, the review unit given to the tech blog before the release of the iPhone 4 did not experience any of these issues, suggesting it does not apply to all handsets."

Let's see what irrational argument you create from that comment. Next time you might want to read the entire article before posting.

I can probably assume that the reveiw handsets are hand picked and QAed before being sent to an Andy Ihnatko, Dave Pouge or Walt Mossberg or for that matter an Engadget or mac world. In mass production, 1 in 100 or 1 in 500 may be pulled for random QA checks, so it may well be a wide spread issue.
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You can't quantify how much I don't care -- Bob Kevoian of the Bob and Tom Show.
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post #49 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by justflybob View Post

So purchase a friggin' Bumper and "problem" solved!

Seriously.... how did some of you manage to get this far in life?

I don't think too many people here would label me an Apple basher, but that's really not a viable long-term solution. But, assuming this is a real issue: If this is a design issue, they have to fix it and replace all of them. If it's a manufacturing issue related to only some phones, they have to replace those. Telling people they have to use a case isn't an acceptable solution for those who have already bought the phone, and telling everyone to use cases would be a much bigger PR disaster than this has the potential to be. Again, assuming the issue is real, I think if they fix the problem, admit it and do the right thing, the PR damage will be minimal, and it could even end up being a net positive.
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post #50 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

BTW, anyone go back to watch the keynote from earlier this month? Anyone notice if SJ was holding the iPhone 4 the wrong way and that's why he was having all those WiFi issues?

I know you're being sarcastic, but I went back and saw he wasn't cradling the iPhone 4, so the issue weren't this.

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post #51 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

I didn't mean you. But there a few people here who don't want to admit to this issue. I'm not trying to start flames, that's just what seems to be happening.

Yeah, I know you didn't mean me. I was just putting that out there. If there's an issue, then there's an issue and Apple will have to deal with. Only question is whether I'll be keeping my phone when it arrives.
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post #52 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I once had a Mac with really poor WiFi reception and I thought it was the Alu case and was cursing the design, but it turned out the antenna wasn't plugged in on the motherboard. Since not everyone is reporting this issue it may just be a manufacturing problem and not a fundamental design issue. There is other evidence that manufacturing is being rushed, namely the undried glue on the screen.

Touching it with one finger in the right spot drops calls. The issue will be known by Apple by now.

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post #53 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

I know you're being sarcastic, but I went back and saw he wasn't cradling the iPhone 4, so the issue weren't this.

Just trying to inject a little humor.
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post #54 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

I for one am not really interested in having to buy an extra item in order to use the phone. As for the bumpers specifically, if Apple deems it necessary to use these to have predictable service to make calls, then they better start giving them free with every purchase.

Of course, even if they did give them for free, I am not interested in a stupid looking bumper or a case that adds thickness as a fix. That's really just a band-aid. The clear coating on the metal is interesting though. Hopefully there is just some ground wire that didn't get connected during the assembly process for some phones.

We'll see...

I hope you're right about the "ground wire". Interesting hypothesis.

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post #55 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

Perhaps they'll start clear-coating the metal bands. Either way, it'll be interesting to see how this develops.

I received my iPhone yesterday from AT&T and quickly discovered the problem with dropped signals due to interference from touching the bezel antenna. The only fix seems to be either not holding the phone by the edges when you talk, or insulating the bezel. I wrapped mine with electrical tape and that helped so I stopped by the Apple Store this morning to pickup a bumper. That seems to have helped a lot. Without the bumper, my phone us unusable. There are a lot of postings about this problem on various forums.

I showed the Apple Genius how I could get 4 bars when the phone laid on the table and then degraded to "no service" when I held it. I reproduced it a couple of times for him when he admitted he had been seeing it all morning. He said there has not been an announcement from Apple yet.

Meanwhile, there were a few hundred unsuspecting people in line waiting to pick up their probably defective iPhones.

Not getting your iPhone today may be a blessing.
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post #56 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:20am
I think this may be in the OS - I upgraded my 3Gs to iOS4, and now it shows fewer bars (sometimes only 1) in several rooms of my house and at the office, but can still receive/send calls. The bars also randomly decrease and increase without moving locations (or switching hands - ha ha). Anyone else with 3Gs seeing this?
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post #57 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:20am
I just returned from the AT&T store and both demo units lost their signal when I connected the antannea with just my thumb on the left side of each.

I am currently waiting for a call from AT&T to pick up my pre-ordered iPhone 4... This is all very concerning.
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post #58 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:25am
Tried to reproduce this on my wifes new iPhone. Haven't seen any degradation in signal quality or download speed no matter how I hold it. Even tried moistening my hand and repeating. Maybe it is a very weak effect and you need to be on the verge of losing connection anyway for it to be noticable.
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post #59 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cubert View Post

Ummmm....I'm right handed so I hold the phone in my right hand as most right handed people do. It's the unfortunate 11% of us who are left handed who are going to have issues.

I disagree. I expect more people right-handers hold a phone with their left hand so as to keep the right hand free for dialing, writing, etc. I know I do.
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post #60 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by a_greer View Post

I can probably assume that the reveiw handsets are hand picked and QAed before being sent to an Andy Ihnatko, Dave Pouge or Walt Mossberg or for that matter an Engadget or mac world. In mass production, 1 in 100 or 1 in 500 may be pulled for random QA checks, so it may well be a wide spread issue.

That's a potent point.

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post #61 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

I don't think too many people here would label me an Apple basher, but that's really not a viable long-term solution. But, assuming this is a real issue: If this is a design issue, they have to fix it and replace all of them. If it's a manufacturing issue related to only some phones, they have to replace those. Telling people they have to use a case isn't an acceptable solution for those who have already bought the phone, and telling everyone to use cases would be a much bigger PR disaster than this has the potential to be. Again, assuming the issue is real, I think if they fix the problem, admit it and do the right thing, the PR damage will be minimal, and it could even end up being a net positive.

Totally plausible.

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post #62 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:28am
If the phone doesn't perform per the user agreement, I think that is theft. Apple is stealing from these people! Thieves!

Maybe someone should ask for a parlay; per the "guidelines." Arrr..
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post #63 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by StLBluesFan View Post

I disagree. I expect more people right-handers hold a phone with their left hand so as to keep the right hand free for dialing, writing, etc. I know I do.

I am ambidextrous, so I guess I will only be screwed 50% of the time?
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post #64 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

Yeah, I know you didn't mean me. I was just putting that out there. If there's an issue, then there's an issue and Apple will have to deal with. Only question is whether I'll be keeping my phone when it arrives.

Hold there feet to the fire, that's the only way Apple will address it head-on.

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post #65 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:29am
they never realized this bc they had huge cases to make it look like it was a 3gs
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post #66 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosh01 View Post

I showed the Apple Genius how I could get 4 bars when the phone laid on the table and then degraded to "no service" when I held it. I reproduced it a couple of times for him when he admitted he had been seeing it all morning. He said there has not been an announcement from Apple yet.

Meanwhile, there were a few hundred unsuspecting people in line waiting to pick up their probably defective iPhones.

Not getting your iPhone today may be a blessing.

Finally, someone with an actual iPhone 4 talking major sense.

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post #67 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markb View Post

Tried to reproduce this on my wifes new iPhone. Haven't seen any degradation in signal quality or download speed no matter how I hold it. Even tried moistening my hand and repeating. Maybe it is a very weak effect and you need to be on the verge of losing connection anyway for it to be noticable.

It might be because this issue only affects one of the two bands AT&T uses (800 & 1900). The band you are using at your location might not be affected.
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post #68 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:32am
Quote:
Originally Posted by dksmidtx View Post

I think this may be in the OS - I upgraded my 3Gs to iOS4, and now it shows fewer bars (sometimes only 1) in several rooms of my house and at the office, but can still receive/send calls. The bars also randomly decrease and increase without moving locations (or switching hands - ha ha). Anyone else with 3Gs seeing this?

Yeah, that's the iOS4 issue - a cosmetic one - but the iPhone 4 has a separate "real hardware flaw". When both antennas are connected.

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post #69 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boogerman2000 View Post

I just returned from the AT&T store and both demo units lost their signal when I connected the antannea with just my thumb on the left side of each.

I am currently waiting for a call from AT&T to pick up my pre-ordered iPhone 4... This is all very concerning.

Indeed.

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post #70 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by StLBluesFan View Post

I disagree. I expect more people right-handers hold a phone with their left hand so as to keep the right hand free for dialing, writing, etc. I know I do.

I do to.

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post #71 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Hold there feet to the fire, that's the only way Apple will address it head-on.

That's not the only way. I think Apple has a pretty good record of making things right when they screw up, especially compared to other companies. Sometimes they are slow to respond, and sometimes fast, but they do make it right in most cases. I don't blame them for taking more time to diagnose and make an official statement about some of the more complex issues. Figuring out the cause isn't always easy.

In any case, I believe that it isn't a fundamental design flaw as not all phones are affected. The poll over at engadget shows some people with the issue, and some without. Was about 50/50 last I checked. And this is only people who took the poll. Plenty of people out there are happy and using their phones with no issue and have no interest in taking a poll when things are working right.

So, Apple will figure it out and do what's necessary. Stay positive people.
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post #72 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:36am
no point

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post #73 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

That's not the only way. I think Apple has a pretty good record of making things right when they screw up, especially compared to other companies.

Mostly so, yeah.

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post #74 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Thank you for repoting this. Won't be forgotten.

Let's see what "solipsism" says now.


I can palm a basketball with ease and have spent the last 30 minutes holding my phone in every position imaginable and haven't seen the bars drop once.

Just my experience.

 

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post #75 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Touching it with one finger in the right spot drops calls. The issue will be known by Apple by now.

Yep. Hopefully they will be able to get hold of a faulty one and open it up and have a look inside.
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post #76 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

I can palm a basketball with ease and have spent the last 30 minutes holding my phone in every position imaginable and haven't seen the bars drop once.

Just my experience.

I respect your opinion so I'll believe you on that one.

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post #77 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:40am
they field tested it with a case around it to look like a 3gs... so they never experieced the interference issue
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post #78 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:40am
Jobs shows how to hold it right

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post #79 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:41am
This is just logic without any electrical knowledge, so it may be BS, but if the antenna is properly connected to the motherboard, wouldn't you have to cover the whole thing to block the signal?

But if it is somehow disconnected then the little hole between the two metal bars (they are no longer antennas) might be the only place reception can get in, so covering it with a finger would cause hang up.
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post #80 of 446
6/24/10 at 9:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerARSgm View Post

Is this not a problem when iPhone 4 is held in the right hand?

It seems to be a smaller problem (fewer bars lost) when held in the right hand. It's pretty amazing to see 5 bars disappear altogether in the left hand and then reappear when released. (This is from personal experience.)
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