AppleCare memo emphasizes no free bumpers for iPhone 4 reception - Page 5

Originally Posted by bytorx1

Thank you!!! and that's why I only just registered today to comment back on some of the BS people are just screaming for the sake of it.

Seriously, it's bad? you unhappy? return it.

Originally Posted by macologist

This is getting silly...

Seemingly the same group of folks on this Forum are screaming at Apple here... The Sky Is Falling...

Others say what I've been thinking:

Shut Up and Return It? But the screamers don't seem to respond to that! So then I wonder:

what do they really want? Are they trolls, or whatever?

Then there are those who try to recreate this issue and can't! The funniest yet was the guy whose wife had this issue with 2 of their phones, but the guy/husband can't recreate this issue, and same goes for most others who have bought this product which is hardly available because of the huge demand!

Most people use iPhone with Cases! Many use it with Hands-free Ear Pieces, wired or Bluetooth, thus this issue won't come up in those cases!

Of course there are always those to whom Steve Jobs is a Devil..., and so they wish him, a cancer survivor, a speedy death, or so it seems from their venomous comments!

So... If most people are not having this issue, and Apple can't meet the demand, is it fair to be demanding free Bumpers?

Apple refuses to be dragged into this topic, as they are likely working on a fix...
Apple doesn't want to acknowledge this as a problem, cause they don't feel that it is!
Apple's Refund Policy allows for Return of their products, and I assume that includes item!

So, by dealing with this the way Apple is, Apple is calling some people's bluff -- Shut Up, or Return it for a Refund...

People are free to buy another phone, or design their own!

As I've read some antenna expert:

It's always a trade off! Apple took this antenna to the edge for better reception, because they understand that most people will use the case, and or Hands-Free!

With all the conflicting reports, plus no problem for most people, it's hard to know what the best fix would be!

I am getting suspicious of the same names here SCREAMING at Apple!
Again I say:

Apple is calling your bluff -- Shut Up, or Return it for a Refund!

Buy another phone, or design their own!

Originally Posted by souliisoul

Reason why Apple is so good because the people who are screaming, come together as a group and cause the SJ/Exec team sit up and listen to the concerns. So please do not try and stop people from screaming, since I can bet you grumbled/screamed about some product that was not to your satisfaction, we all have. Thats are RIGHT as the consumer and spending our hard earned money!

Each to their own and voice your opinions!

If you do not like the screaming and comments, then leave the discussion thread

Originally Posted by nvidia2008

Yeah!!!! Scream it up then Apple will take notice.

BTW just got my iPad wooooooooooooooooooooo

Sent from my iPad with no apparent reception issues.

Originally Posted by MacRR

I've read them, and seen a headline about it on every single major news outlet. Since the phone works better than the previous gen for me there is no waaaaaaay it's more than anything other than hysterics.

Originally Posted by souliisoul

I really dislike you iPad not in India until 2011? btw if you get caught bringing one into the country it is 36% tax charge on the original cost.

Originally Posted by st3v3

Also, using electrical tape on your phone seems a bit... ridiculous. But I assume this is acceptable since it's by Apple, not the competition.

Originally Posted by Chopper

Apropos of nothing, but...

Those rabid Apple-hating denizens at MacDailyNews have a poll on the reception issue, the results at the time of my visit following:

No issues - iP4 - 43.7%
No issues - 3Gs - 19.6%
No issues - 3G - 10.8%
Issues - iP4 - 21.2%
Issues - 3Gs - 2.9%
Issues - 3G - 1.8%

All phones running iOS 4
Total of 1746 votes

Make of that what you will but I doubt that we're looking at 1%-ish numbers. And nope, I have no idea why the poll was constructed as it was. Interesting that the 3G and 3Gs "issues" are much lower proportionally than the 3G and 3Gs "no issues" numbers. Which seems to suggest that the 3G and 3Gs are much less prone to reception problems than some believe.

In the end though, it's hardly scientific. Intriguing maybe...

Originally Posted by amazingdm

Oh for the love of god. There is nothing wrong here. People just want something to bitch about for ANY new item.

Originally Posted by 1stkorean

steve jobs is demonstrating apples newest product called: iTheft, a magical new way of gaining access to consumers' wallets.

Looks like it is time to return all of these iphones and join the Class Action Law Suit that has been filed.

here: http://www.kcrlegal.com/iPhone-reception-problems.aspx

If your Fascist-Dictator jobs told All you fanibois to eat his sh$t y'all would kneel and gobble. I think jobs second-hand liver has failed and all the toxins have gone to his brain, and this is why he has become a bigger aHole than he use to be.

Originally Posted by Mazda 3s

Apple hiring iPhone antenna engineers for some reason



Maybe they should have done that the first time

Originally Posted by motrek

Apple, you have to pick one:

1) All cell phones have this problem, it's a fact of life, nothing can be done

OR

2) This is a problem that can be solved with a small ring of plastic

You can't have it both ways. Idiots. And if the problem is solved with a small ring of plastic, then why isn't that PART OF THE DESIGN OF THE PHONE?

Originally Posted by sheff

I can understand saying no to free bumbers, but telling people they hold their phone the wrong way is not a good thing to say to your customers. Say somethng like its true that holding iPhone a certain way is not the best practice and that they will work to help make it better, but don't tell people who paid for the phone that they are wrong. Customer is always right, even when they are wrong.

Originally Posted by m3centurion

Why is everybody making such a big deal about this, I have had absolutely no problems with my iPhne 4 and I am also left handed. I think this all sounds like sour grapes on behalf of the competition and others are just jumping on the bandwagon using poor signal as a design issue instead of just admitting that the problem is a network problem.

This is getting so ridiculous I heard someone on the radio here in the UK today complaining about the signal problem who admitted that he doesn't even have or even seen the iPhone 4.

This is a great product everything works perfectly and I have an iphone 2G, 3G, 3GS and iPad 3G and the iPhone 4 is by far more superior

Originally Posted by Rob55

As others have said, this is very un-scientific, but it certainly appears that not all phones seem to be affected.

Originally Posted by svnipp

Actually, no they don't. There are two separate problems that are actually being lumped together as one. The first problem you list the argument for is simple signal attenuation due to covering the area of the phone that houses the antenna. This is the problem that would exist with any phone to some degree. Radio signals don't travel very well through water unless at very low frequency. The human body being composed primarily of water well do a great job attenuating a cell phone signal under the right conditions.

The second issue that you sarcastically speak of is the creation of a short between the antennas. This is created by physical contact with the antennas. One big reason that some people have this problem and others don't is that the conductivity of the human body varies greatly. This is why someone posted that he has never been able to make this happen on either of his phones but his wife can make it happen on both. This is also the reason that the bumpers eliminate this particular problem but do nothing for actual signal attenuation.

Originally Posted by ski1

All iPhone 4's are affected. There is a reason you are not seeing the issue at your particular location. Here's a new, detailed scientific test/review of the iPhone 4 antenna issue -

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3794/t...one-4-review/2

Originally Posted by ski1

All iPhone 4's are affected. There is a reason you are not seeing the issue at your particular location. Here's a new, detailed scientific test/review of the iPhone 4 antenna issue -

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3794/t...one-4-review/2

Originally Posted by ski1

All iPhone 4's are affected. There is a reason you are not seeing the issue at your particular location. Here's a new, detailed scientific test/review of the iPhone 4 antenna issue -

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3794/t...one-4-review/2

Originally Posted by anonymouse

This doesn't address the seam issue at all. This just describes the manner in which iP4s are affected by the signal/antenna problems that affects all cell phones.

Originally Posted by snoop92679

Wow, I can't believe the level of denials, and the arrogant way customers are being treated by Apple. I put a case around my iPhone IV, and it helps. However, the phone still looses the signal in 2-3 minutes rather than 20-30 seconds.

I really think this is, potentially, a securities law issue because this appears to be a very material problem that Apple seems to be covering up. Also, some of the conflicting statements really concern me. By not openly and honestly addressing the signal issue, you have to really start doubting the integrity of the executive officers and board.

If the phones are all defective & need to be recalled, Apple should just do it.

If there is a software / service configuration fix, then Apple should say that.

Why can't they just tell all of us the truth about what is going on?

IMO, to blame users or deny the problem, is VERY dishonest and people should be held accountable for that conduct. While this isn't a BP level issue, it's not OK for companies to act like this.

Originally Posted by Ireland

Yeah, and the iPhone 4 you'll notice is affected by holding the phone is a regular manner way more than the 3G S. I think you'll find that makes the iPhone have worse reception when you're holing it, without a case, which is the way some people like to hold it. From where I'm standing that's a step backwards with regards to antenna design of the iPhone 4 compared to the 2G, the 3G and the 3G S.

Originally Posted by Ireland

Yeah, and the iPhone 4 you'll notice is affected by holding the phone is a regular manner way more than the 3G S. I think you'll find that makes the iPhone have worse reception when you're holing it, without a case, which is the way some people like to hold it. From where I'm standing that's a step backwards with regards to antenna design of the iPhone 4 compared to the 2G, the 3G and the 3G S.

From my day of testing, I've determined that the iPhone 4 performs much better than the 3GS in situations where signal is very low, at -113 dB (1 bar). Previously, dropping this low all but guaranteed that calls would drop, fail to be placed, and data would no longer be transacted at all. I can honestly say that I've never held onto so many calls and data simultaneously on 1 bar at -113 dB as I have with the iPhone 4, so it's readily apparent that the new baseband hardware is much more sensitive compared to what was in the 3GS. The difference is that reception is massively better on the iPhone 4 in actual use.

Originally Posted by Ireland

Exactly why I have been branded a troll round here. People are in denial and calling me "negative". Apple crossed the line here. I'll be highly recommending against the iPhone 4 on principle alone. This just showed Apple at their worst.

Originally Posted by Pooch

uhm, no ...?

don't masturbate next to the wall, you'll injure your wrist?

Originally Posted by Hands Sandon

When I pick up my iPhone and put it in my left hand the left corner of the iPhone naturally fits snuggly in my palm, as I hold it to the side of my face to make a call it stays in exactly the same position and quickly leads to a failed call.

Originally Posted by Rob55

Actually, the article went on to state that at the -113dB level, the iPhone 4 outperformed the 3GS. So yes, placing the antenna on the outside where it can be subjected to significant attenuation, it does (at least according to the article) appear to perform better under those low signal strength conditions. I've only had my phone a day, but I haven't dropped any calls yet. One thing I do notice is that the iPhone 4 is reporting less "signal strength" than my wife's 3G when both are placed side by side.

Originally Posted by stevesong

Apple's policy of "not appeasing" iPhone 4 customers unhappy with the reception problems of their newly purchased phones surely reflects incredibly poor business judgment. Especially when the fix is as simple as supplying customers with bumpers rather than charging them another $30.00 to make their phones fully functional. It appears that fantastic success has bred a culture of amazing dumbness and arrogance at Apple. This is the kind of "small" issue that can cut a company's share price in half over a year or so. It's happened again and again in the history of American business and people do not seem to learn. What a shame!

Originally Posted by anonymouse

This [Anand's article] doesn't address the seam issue at all. This just describes the manner in which iP4s are affected by the signal/antenna problems that affects all cell phones.

Originally Posted by jragosta

Apple has stated that there will be a software fix.

Originally Posted by Mazda 3s

Apple hiring iPhone antenna engineers for some reason



Maybe they should have done that the first time

Originally Posted by Hands Sandon

Apple won't just not give me a new bumper they won't give me a replacement phone either. I was told that clearly by a level 2 technician today having been told last Friday, by the exact same technician that they would replace the phone if they couldn't fix it. The technician said there was no point giving me a new phone because it would do the same thing and there was no point putting it in for repair because they would find nothing wrong with it so I would just be wasting my time, but he did say I could do that if I wanted to.

I will probably keep the phone though because other than that and a few minor software bugs, I'm amazed at how good it is. Unless a SW fix comes I don't see being able to get a properly functioning phone until at the very minimum a years time if Apple redesigns the antenna, and that's too long for me to want to go without an iPhone. It sucks, but the alternatives suck even more.

Originally Posted by lamewing

When will people learn not to buy 1st iteration hardware from Apple (and others too)? Invariably Apple's 1st gen hardware comes with warts and the iPhone 4 wars are pretty spectacular. Apple really should have done a better job with testing, or if they did, it just goes to show they have contempt for their customers, of which I am one (Mac Mini, Macbook Pro 13", iPhone 3GS, iPod 5.5). Ha, provide a phone with a problem and then refuse to provide a free bumper. Instead charge $29 for a $2 piece of rubber.

After this fiasco, I most likely will drop my iPhone for an android or just go back to a dumb phone. Unlike what Apple says, I can hold my 3GS in any manner and my reception is not affected...not that it is great anyway. I have had much more trouble with the iPhone/AT&T than I ever did with Sprint.

Next summer we will see if this mess has worked itself out....

[What scares me is that people are more concerned about their iPhones than the oil spill in the GOM. If folks were to check out what many engineers are saying regarding fixing this torrent of oil - if it can be fixed - they would stop bitching about their phones as a whole]

Originally Posted by jragosta

Actually, it does. They address the effects of holding the phone in various ways - including 'cupping it in the hand' which is one way to get the seam issues.

Originally Posted by Trajectory

Apple has stated no such thing {that there would be a software fix}.

Originally Posted by anonymouse

Not necessarily. "Cupping it in the hand," is too vague to say with certainty that it actually bridges the seam consistently. For that, there's a very specific test that's been demonstrated that is unambiguous as to what exactly is happening.

It does not seem as though normal holding really represents a problem. But bridging the seam, which could happen, but doesn't necessarily happen, when "cupping it in the hand" does seem to be a real problem, on some, but not all, phones.

Originally Posted by jragosta

Actually, they did. Read Mossberg's review.



The point is that holding it cupped in your hand while holding it to your face is extremely awkward and not something that most people are likely to do. The way most people are going to old it will not have the bottom of the phone covered with your palm.