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Apple says iPhone 4 calculates bars wrong, software fix forthcoming - Page 4

post #121 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by vrkiran View Post

What is you say is fair enough. I wish that is what Apple said!

Give them a chance... they need to be careful, and we're only 8 days in.

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post #122 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

Read. the. article. before. commenting. on. the. article.

I could cut and paste it for you, but don't really feel like it. Anyway, he was able to have the phone report the strength numerically instead of with bars. He gives a great explanation.

Thanks for the reply, I made a mistake. I'am sure I read the calibration method I described. It wasn't Anand though.

J.
post #123 of 434
Can someone help me out here. Is this going to fix the fact that when I hold my iPhone, I can't download any data? I never seemed to have that problem on my iPhone 3G.

I was hopeful that a software fix would improve this problem, but I guess instead of improving the problem, they're just going to show the problem differently to us.

If I have 2-3 bars at my house right now, am I going to have NONE now? This sucks. This really, really sucks.

They should've just called this thing the new iPod touch. I have to be on wifi, if I want data to load and I need to use a different phone to make phone calls with it. Great.

This does not make me happy at all. It's still going to be the same even after the update. People are still going to realize that they're unable to use their phone where their old iPhone was used flawlessly.

It's not about showing the bars accurately, it's about touching the phone and losing all reception all together.
post #124 of 434
I think Apple knew AT&T's service was shit, so they left this flawed code for their own advantage.
post #125 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquatic View Post

Steve Jobs thinks we are all stupid idiots. What a way to thank loyal customers that do more marketing for a company than possibly any other company on earth.

I don't think so.

However, I do think that anybody that complains about something they don't have any experience with isn't very brilliant.
post #126 of 434
OK, let's review. There are 3 issues that may combine to produce call and signal issues:
  1. Attenuation caused by touching the antenna
  2. Complete data service intrruption caused by bridging the seam
  3. Misfuntioning of the proximity sensor

The promised update doesn't actually address any of these, although, it seems that it will more accurately reflect what's going on in relation to the first issue. However, I don't think this was ever really as big an issue as many thought it was.

The third issue, which is probably responsible for at least some "dropped calls", may be quietly addressed by a software update, and since it hasn't really been the focus of a lot of attention it's not too surprising that they haven't specifically mentioned it.

The second issue, which seems to be the most significant real issue, doesn't seem to be addressed at all. Since it doesn't affect all phones, I don't think it's a design issue, which leaves the possibility of some sort of manufacturing issue, which could be hardware (e.g., improper assembly) or software related (e.g., improper firmware version). It will be interesting to see if this issue goes away after the update, or remains as an actual problem. But, it doesn't seem particularly reassuring to me, and I'm sure not to iP4 owners afflicted by this issue, that it remains unaddressed through this announcement.
post #127 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

This is true of iPhone 4, iPhone 3GS, as well as many Droid, Nokia and RIM phones.

Interesting that they refer to Android-based phones as simply Droid. Perhaps it's like most of the "Get a Mac" ads not referring to Windows, just PC, until the gaff with Vista made is sour name worth stating directly.

Quote:
This is a far bigger drop than normal, and as a result some have accused the iPhone 4 of having a faulty antenna design.

Note that they aren't saying it's a faulty design, simply stating that some have made the accusation.

Quote:
We have discovered the cause of this dramatic drop in bars... Upon investigation,...

I'm amazed that some of you actually have a problem with Apple stating they had to look into the problem. I know it doesn't jibe with your conspiracy theory that Apple designed the Bumpers to deal with reception issues, but perhaps it's time you let that silly drop for once, or am I asking too much from this community?

Quote:
We will issue a free software update within a few weeks that incorporates the corrected formula. Since this mistake has been present since the original iPhone, this software update will also be available for the iPhone 3GS and iPhone 3G.

A few weeks, eh? I have assume they will issue it sooner rather than later in that time frame, but it does suggest the resolved than altering the height or bars and what Db each bar represents.


Quote:
Originally Posted by thomasfxlt View Post

"As a reminder, if you are not fully satisfied, you can return your undamaged iPhone to any Apple Retail Store or the online Apple Store within 30 days of purchase for a full refund."

So there you go. Shut up or take it back.

Wait, what?! I and others were saying this yesterday and were told we were liars and fanboys. g3pro in particular was posting an obnoxiously large font to refer to non-defective product returns and products that weren't phones. So is this a new policy or did some people run around like Chicken Little, yet again? inquiring minds want to know.


Quote:
Originally Posted by brett_x View Post

I guess that's one way to get "More bars in more places"

Maybe this will lead to "More prototypes in more bars".


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerseymac View Post

Wow. A software fix for a situation that half the community here said didn't even exist. And I thought you guys knew everything!

Who said there was no issue? Who said that Apple and iOS 4.0 was perfect? The only thing the pragmatic posters stated was that there is no proof of the exposed antenna being a "design flaw". Big difference.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

A good company admits to its mistakes. Well done, Apple!

Classic corporate misdirect. They admitted to one thing while ignoring another. But that's not their fault, it's the silly Chicken Littles who have clouded the issue this past week. All Apple did was their hysteria to their advantage by disclosing one issue as the issue.

I think it's telling that it will takes up to a few weeks to release a fix for this. That makes me lean even further toward this being a driver issue for the UMTS chips; well, that they will try to fix with a driver issue.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

This is tantamount to confirmation from Apple that the iPhone 4 actually has a hardware/design problem.

That is an erroneous conclusion and only works if all other things are equal, which they are not.

Of course, the real test will come after the update. If you can touch the iPhone 4's "3G-Spot" and have a website stop completely and instantly, and then startup again the moment you release it then they would have successfully resolved the issue.


Quote:
Originally Posted by parksgm View Post

I find it difficult to believe that a thirty year old computer company responsible for several revolutions in personal computing capable of engineering a state-of-the art network-integrated web browsing, media playing device somehow neglected to check the accuracy of the signal strength formula.

Come on...this doesn't even make sense. This is an egregious error in the most basic functionality of a device that comes from a company so perfectionistic that people were debunking the first authentic pictures of the device because of asthetically unpleasing, millimeter-wide breaks in the side of the case.

Your argument starts off saying Apple is too big and experienced to make such a gaff (which isn't true, look at MS et al.), but then your next paragraph talks about basic functionality that they have failed at. You can't have it both ways. You either to think that all companies, run by people, can make a mistake, or that they are infallible. If they don't mistakes then I guess we should never expect point updates to SW.

Note, this is only their 4th device using cellular tech pushing the envelope of size, power and efficiency well beyond the longtime giants in this industry, and there are many who claim that Apple can't even get WiFI right even though they've had that under their belt since 1999.


Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

You can't discount the possibility that you have a lemon. There must be some problem sets out there and the assumption they all have an issue is now more than likely wrong thus meaning yours might be a bad one.

Have lemon, want working model, get new one. Have lemon, don't want new one, get money back. Have lemon, want new one, but only after SW fix proven to work, get money back.


Quote:
Originally Posted by adam937 View Post

Maybe this change simply reverses the signal strength display "improvement" they made back in OS 2.1:

http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/20...one-os-2-1.ars

I clearly remember the display began to show more bars after installing this update.

Nice find!


Quote:
Originally Posted by dm3 View Post

This is very sad. How embarrassing for those insisting that Apple would fix it.

This fixes nothing, can't folks read?
This doesn't address, not even admit the problem.
Changing the pretty picture of the number of bars has nothing to do with reception.

It doesn't take a few weeks to alter a "pretty picture".


Quote:
Originally Posted by neondiet View Post

How about we wait and see what happens until after the update has been released.

That sounds like a great idea.
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post #128 of 434
"..stunned to find.." ? It's easy enough to understand how a provider would want more bars to be showing on their phone, provided there is enough of a signal to hang on to. After all, that's one of the things we compare with our friends standing in the same spot. It may be cosmetic and a selling factor at the same time. (Think over and under contrasted TV screens in certain showrooms).

It's probably a great move for a company to advertise they are using a more correct and informative means of displaying signal strength. But I don't get how they were stunned to find what the bars are actually showing.
post #129 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by thomasfxlt View Post

"As a reminder, if you are not fully satisfied, you can return your undamaged iPhone to any Apple Retail Store or the online Apple Store within 30 days of purchase for a full refund."


So there you go. Shut up or take it back.

Exactly..this is why the lawsuits are garbage at this point. They were filed even before the period of return expires. Any company has to be given a chance to correct a problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_cazorp View Post

I guess when my web pages stop loading and my data speeds drop into the gutter, it's just a cosmetic issue. Whew, what a relief. Can't wait for this fix.

There is no antenna issue.

Your data speeds are as good as, or better, than they ever were.

These are not the Droids (TM) you're looking for.


Do you really not understand? You're in a weak signal area, but you think you're not. You could be in a place with "3 bars," whereas you only have one. You could think you're in a place with 1 bar, and you really have none. It's not Apple's issue...it's Craptastic AT&T.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

.

Hmmm...

I wonder what effect this will have on the sue-ers [sic]?

Will they. now, need to carry elaborate radiowave measurement tools to document their claim that the iP4 is dropping signal (rather than just misreporting the siglal strength)?


...interesting!


'course, this could be the basis for a new lawsuit-- falsely over-reporting signal strength, or somesuch!


BTW, I am stopping my postal mail delivery-- I just keep getting bills!

.


They will likely lose or withdraw. Apple hasn't even had time to issue a fix yet. And to win or possibly even file the second lawsuit, you'd have to prove not only damages, but negligence. You'd have to prove that Apple knew of the calculation issue all along, and did nothing to fix it. Good luck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

So basically they are saying that they're going to update your phone to tell you that your reception is worse than it really is, bar wise. This doesn't fix anything. This isn't going to fix the people who live in lower reception areas from losing service completely or drop low enough to drop calls, where their previous iPhones or whatever they used works fine.

This is just smoke and mirrors. They also need to address the proximity sensor, although I think they are going to sneak it in. It's a real simple fix, just give it more tolerance.

Apple cannot fix where you live. That's simply an AT&T issue. AT&T sucks, by the way. As for the proximity sensor, it sounds like they need to give it less "tolerance," not more. It needs to be MORE sensitive, apparently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Pummelon View Post

So how does this explain the testers who could make calls from their desk on the 3G S with no problem, but who get dropped calls from the same place using the 4G?

Let's see those "testers" and their "reviews." The only thing I've seen is bars dropping.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

So basically, Apple is saying there is no problem with the antena, the only issue is you thought you were getting better reception thatn you were?

Yes. Are you honestly surprised? Have I mentioned what a pile AT&T is in many places?

Quote:

Even more BS that they say they've always calculated things this way. This means people should not be seeing any worse problems with the 4 than the earlier 3. Evidence does not bear this out.

"Evidence?" What "evidence" do you have?

Quote:

This makes no sense. People's calls are dropping and data speed is much slower when portions of the antenna and touched and/or bridged. Apple's solution is to show you that you have less signal all the time?

Bullshit. There are only unconfirmed and/or isolated reports of this. There are reports of signal bars dropping. Those are different.

Quote:

I know all phones lose some signal when the antenna is covered, but APPLE'S IS THE ONLY EXTERNAL ANTENNA TOTALLY EXPOSED TO SKIN ETC.

If this indeed Apple's solution, ie. screw you, then I suspect they'll get a lot of phones back. When mine comes, if I have this issue I will take the opportunity to return it and go Android (not what I want to do). Apple is still in denial there there is a problem.

Then just cancel your order now, because you're being foolish. You're pre-judging what you're going to do about a problem that 1) You don't know you'll have, 2) Might not even really exist, and 3) Before even giving Apple a chance to fix it. If your phone constantly drops calls and generally sucks over a period of say, two weeks...then return it. Then get an Android phone ON THE SAME NETWORK and use it in THE SAME PLACES, and see if it's better. I say two weeks, because network conditions vary widely. AT&T has been shitty for me for the last couple of weeks, with dropped/unavailable 3G for no reason, dropped calls, etc. It will get better as it always does. But yeah...AT&T sucks. Surprise.
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post #130 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by erybovic View Post


Well F me, AT&T signal strength is shittier than the Iphone has been displaying all along. You don't think you would have figured that out years ago? Its funny how field test mode *3001#12345#* is taken out of IOS4.

Can you somehow get the field test mode back if you jailbreak? Or something like it?
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post #131 of 434
This changes nothing. Again.

post #132 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glockman View Post

A software fix to only change the display behavior is a fail.

It does not fix the REAL PROBLEM of DROPPED SIGNAL!

I can reproduce the issue 100% of the time with my phone and it is truly insulting for Apple to refuse to accept this fact even after multiple independent studies.

Are you interested in getting the issue resolved or just interested in complaining?

Do you really have an iPhone 4, or do you just claim to?

The reason I ask is, you joined AI :

Join Date
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And your posts all appear to be negative:

http://forums.appleinsider.com/searc...earchid=352112

here's your first post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glockman View Post

Hats off to AppleInsider for this forum post and thread. Both reports from these independents describe my problems exactly since I unboxed my beloved iP4 1 week ago.

iJobz cannot keep insulting us with his denial and useless rhetoric forever!

Fix this freaking problem!


Kinda' came out with your guns blazing! And, you ridiculed Jobs' name and questioned his sincerity.

Why would you buy anything from someone you hold in such low regard?

Do you believe that is a reasonable approach to resolving a problem?

.
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post #133 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by noexpectations View Post

This changes nothing. Again.


Thanks for your informed, well-thought-out and excellently stated post.
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post #134 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Thanks for your informed, well-thought-out and excellently stated post.

Awe, his comment is funny. I'm all for the digs at a company, so long as they aren't hysteria driven.
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post #135 of 434
Apple/Steve Jobs: 2 + 2 = 5, 5 bars means 0 bars, 1 bar means 5 bars, antenna in grip of phone where one finger kills all reception = best antenna design ever, iPhone 4's inferior reception compared to iPhone 3gs means iPhone 4 has "best reception ever".
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post #136 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

I don't think so.

However, I do think that anybody that complains about something they don't have any experience with isn't very brilliant.

Are you suggesting that because I want to buy a working phone that comes from a company that backs it with real customer support and honesty isn't very brilliant?

Are they going to try to cover up the proximity sensor issues, too? Perhaps after you hang a call up it will display a message saying your face is too fat, and it is your fault.

Yeah I don't have an iPhone, yet. I've been saving big for this. I'm not going to spend a ton of money on a product that sucks, and even moreso on one from a company that sucks.
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post #137 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by thespaz View Post

Can someone help me out here. Is this going to fix the fact that when I hold my iPhone, I can't download any data? I never seemed to have that problem on my iPhone 3G.

...

I upgraded from a 3g as well and my issue is that when driving home, the iPhone 4 drops calls on the same hill that I never had an issue with my 3g. I am was never holding the phones, they were plugged into the car using the car's bluetooth.

However, we could be dealing with quality control issues. All iPhone 4s that my company upgraded each have their own set of issues. Yesterday we tried replacing the some of the SIMs with new ones since that may help sometimes. I don't know if there is a benefit to that yet. Some just have straight-up hardware issues, speaker doesn't work, any call made with another has severe crackling. One will randomly stop all internet connections when the phones around it are working great, etc.

We definitely feel like we got a bag of lemons! On the bright side, we determined that all the iPhones with battery issues have all had cases on them 100% of the time. All the "naked" haven't had a single dead battery.
post #138 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Who said there was no issue? Who said that Apple and iOS 4.0 was perfect? The only thing the pragmatic posters stated was that there is no proof of the exposed antenna being a "design flaw". Big difference.

WHAT??? Better re-read some of the five hundred or so posts from yesterday. Many here screamed there was no problem with their iP4 so there were no problems with anyones. A typical post for this forum I might add.

But I digress. I don't have an iP4 so I'm not supposed to comment. Just forget what I said.
post #139 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostface147 View Post

So basically they are saying that they're going to update your phone to tell you that your reception is worse than it really is, bar wise. This doesn't fix anything. This isn't going to fix the people who live in lower reception areas from losing service completely or drop low enough to drop calls, where their previous iPhones or whatever they used works fine.

This is just smoke and mirrors. They also need to address the proximity sensor, although I think they are going to sneak it in. It's a real simple fix, just give it more tolerance.

I think testing has shown that the phone does better than the previous models.
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post #140 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquatic View Post

Are you suggesting that because I want to buy a working phone that comes from a company that backs it with real customer support and honesty isn't very brilliant?

Are they going to try to cover up the proximity sensor issues, too? Perhaps after you hang a call up it will display a message saying your face is too fat, and it is your fault.

Yeah I don't have an iPhone, yet. I've been saving big for this. I'm not going to spend a ton of money on a product that sucks, and even moreso on one from a company that sucks.

Then don't. Just don't, please.
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post #141 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquatic View Post

Can you somehow get the field test mode back if you jailbreak? Or something like it?

I think we've covered this. You can pretty much do anything with a jailbroken phone and you can get, at least the carrier DBs in the Menu Bar with a clever hack without jailbreaking.
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post #142 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glockman View Post

A software fix to only change the display behavior is a fail.

It does not fix the REAL PROBLEM of DROPPED SIGNAL!

I can reproduce the issue 100% of the time with my phone and it is truly insulting for Apple to refuse to accept this fact even after multiple independent studies.

From the article:

As a reminder, if you are not fully satisfied, you can return your undamaged iPhone to any Apple Retail Store or the online Apple Store within 30 days of purchase for a full refund.

.
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post #143 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

OK, let's review. There are 3 issues that may combine to produce call and signal issues:
  1. Attenuation caused by touching the antenna
  2. Complete data service intrruption caused by bridging the seam
  3. Misfuntioning of the proximity sensor

The promised update doesn't actually address any of these, although, it seems that it will more accurately reflect what's going on in relation to the first issue. However, I don't think this was ever really as big an issue as many thought it was.

The third issue, which is probably responsible for at least some "dropped calls", may be quietly addressed by a software update, and since it hasn't really been the focus of a lot of attention it's not too surprising that they haven't specifically mentioned it.

The second issue, which seems to be the most significant real issue, doesn't seem to be addressed at all. Since it doesn't affect all phones, I don't think it's a design issue, which leaves the possibility of some sort of manufacturing issue, which could be hardware (e.g., improper assembly) or software related (e.g., improper firmware version). It will be interesting to see if this issue goes away after the update, or remains as an actual problem. But, it doesn't seem particularly reassuring to me, and I'm sure not to iP4 owners afflicted by this issue, that it remains unaddressed through this announcement.

Just to re-write your list based on the technical explanations I've read:

1. Signal attenuation caused by something (your hand) blocking the signal.
2. Antenna de-tuning caused by direct physical contact with the antenna and/or bridging the gap between the two antennas.

3. The proximity sensor issue.

#3 I think is irrelevant to this discussion. My understand is that is simply a display issue with the the sensor not properly lighting/dimming the display when the phone is held close to your face.

#1 is the issue Apple says common to all cell phones. They are right about that. All cell phones, all radios, will suffer in performance when something blocks (attenuates) the signal from getting to the antenna. You don't need direct contact for signal attenuation. Just something between the receiver and the transmitter.

#2 is the issue Apple is completely ignoring/denying. Their design exposes the antenna to direct contact, which affects antenna performance. Anyone who has ever used rabbit ears on a TV knows this. Standing near the TV can have a mild effect on the reception. Actually touching the rabbit ears has a huge effect on the reception.
post #144 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerseymac View Post

WHAT??? Better re-read some of the five hundred or so posts from yesterday. Many here screamed there was no problem with their iP4 so there were no problems with anyones. A typical post for this forum I might add.

But I digress. I don't have an iP4 so I'm not supposed to comment. Just forget what I said.

One need not own an iP4 to comment, just be rational in your comments. Now, could you quote us a few of the posts where people were screaming that there were no problems at all with any phones?
post #145 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerseymac View Post

WHAT??? Better re-read some of the five hundred or so posts from yesterday. Many here screamed there was no problem with their iP4 so there were no problems with anyones. A typical post for this forum I might add.

But I digress. I don't have an iP4 so I'm not supposed to comment. Just forget what I said.

I can't see anyone being so daft as to think or say that not a signal iPhone could be possibly be faulty simply because theirs works. Then again, I can't imagine anyone being so daft as to go into hysterics because their iPhone doesn't work.

Please, find me some of these 500 hundred posts stating that it's impossible for there to be faulty units.
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post #146 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

From the article:

As a reminder, if you are not fully satisfied, you can return your undamaged iPhone to any Apple Retail Store or the online Apple Store within 30 days of purchase for a full refund.

Surely that can't be true.
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post #147 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by erybovic View Post

Well F me, AT&T signal strength is shittier than the Iphone has been displaying all along. You don't think you would have figured that out years ago? Its funny how field test mode *3001#12345#* is taken out of IOS4.

A wonderfully sensible statement!

I wish other people could think beyond the "oh, Apple is so great" and look at each product objectively and say "oh, iPhone 2G is so great", "oh, iPhone 3G is so great", "oh, iPhone 3GS is so great" and "BTW, something is amiss with iPhone 4". Just because the last few products were good, how can people simply ignore the complaints of thousands of other users who have genuine problems?
post #148 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnjnjn View Post

Nop, the measurement was calibrated with the bars shown on the iPhone4. The problem is that according to Apple (and I'am sure they are sure) the bars shown where wrong. And there goes your calibration.
Maybe someone should sue Anand for such 'ignorant' measurements and presenting results that are wrong.
J.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jnjnjn View Post

How did they do that without an iPhone4 showing db's in service mode?


Nice one. Fabricating "facts", using them to attack a reputable site whose article you have not read and then exposing both the lie and the fact that you have not read the article.
post #149 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

And that is exactly what Apple is fixing here; the actual reporting of signal strength. But, in your analogy, if it was not uncommon for some drivers to reproduce a problem where when they pressed the gas not only did the fuel gage show a sudden drop, but the gas tank actually emptied itself. In that case, the fuel gage might be faulty, but there is still no gas in the tank. The iOS might be misreporting the signal strength, but the iPhone 4 design still seems to lead to greater actual signal loss than designs with an internal antenna.

Admitting to the accuracy problem is good. Failing to address or acknowledge the actual physical problems caused by the physical design is not.


Even if this is true, it doesn't seem to be true for a vast number of people. There have been over 2 million phones sold (if you ask me to prove that I will ignore that request for a couple of reasons). Where are the numbers? How many people actually wind up in a situation where the signal degradation is "worse than other phones"? Then, when you factor in the issue of holding different phones in different places along their edges, how does the iPhone 4 stack up then?

My point is, there may be an issue, affecting a tiny percentage of people more because of where they use it than the actual device (as compared to other iP4 devices) they are using. However, the amount of ink spilled over this is completely and totally out of sync with the actual magnitude of the problem.

Also, do you know anything about how field tests are done and certification with carriers is performed? Serious question.
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post #150 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iphtashu Fitz View Post

Yeah, a full refund IF you bought your phone from Apple. Buy it from an AT&T store, Best Buy, Radio Shack, etc. and you're stuck with restocking fees. And unless you return it in 3 days you also get stuck with ETF's from AT&T unless you get a different phone for the 2 year contract you signed with them.

There was a post on another thread where a user returned his phone to AT&T and they refunded all charges/fees, etc. AIR, there was no restocking charge and AT&T even refunded his purchase of an AppleCare extended Warranty.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showt...59#post1666659

http://forums.appleinsider.com/showt...88#post1666688

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post #151 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

Yes, you are correct. Anand did confirm what Apple has released. That the antenna is far superior to previous models and that the bars algorithm was flawed. But he also confirm that the industrial design, of exposing the antennas, resulted in greater actual loss of signal when touched. That is the issue that Apple has not addressed.

The part you keep leaving out is that EVEN WITH THE SIGNAL ATTENUATION, the iPHone 4 gets better reception than other phones. So why fix something that's already better than the alternatives?

If you want to improve it so it's 50% better than the alternatives instead of just 20% better, go ahead and get a case. But that doesn't change the fact that even without the case, it's better than the options.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomasj106 View Post

Fixing the display so that bars indicate a false signal strength does not fix the dropped calls nor the poor call quality.

The problem with that is that you're assuming something that's not in evidence. The dropping bars problem has been widely reported. There's no evidence (other than a few anecdotal reports like yours) that indicate that the iPhone 4 drops calls any more than any other phone. In fact, Anand and Apple's testing indicates that EVEN WITH THE 'PROBLEM', the iPhone gets BETTER reception.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquatic View Post

Crucified. Nice wordage. Oh yeah, they'll be drawn and quartered. I also am re-considering buying an iPhone 4. I thought they would FIX it! Not cover it up!

Time to short AAPL.

Steve Jobs thinks we are all stupid idiots. What a way to thank loyal customers that do more marketing for a company than possibly any other company on earth.

As you said we would have all moved on if they gave out free bumpers that cost a few cents to make. Greed.

As for PR people another poster here RBR made a good point...this probably goes directly to the top to Steve Jobs. He in fact absolutely started this whole thing with his condescending personal email to a user. He will have only himself to blame.

So your point is that you're so full of irrational hatred that you expect Apple to become as irrational as you?

Apple chose a technical, rational solution to the problem. They collected data and tested it and reached a conclusion - same conclusion that Anand reached. If you have evidence that the iPHone 4 drops calls any more frequently than other phones, feel free to provide it. Until then, you're just ranting mindlessly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by noexpectations View Post

This changes nothing. Again.

Because there was nothing of consequence to change. There is no evidence that the iPhone 4 has a reception problem. Feel free to present a scientifically valid study that compares the number of dropped calls to any other phone under the same conditions. If you can find that kind of evidence, then complaining about the 'problem' might be valid. Until then, it's only making you look foolish.
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post #152 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

So I can't help but wonder what the calibration for the 3GS was? Did they change the formula for the iPhone 4? If so, why? But if they were using the same calibration, then this software "fix" seems more of a coverup.

I'm in a wait-and-see mode before making any decision. Apple is correctly explaining the effect of attenuation when something (ie, your hand) blocks part of the signal. But that is a different effect than coming in direct contact with the antenna itself. Apple's explanations have so far completely ignored that issue.

We'll see...I'm in no hurry to run out and make a purchase. I'll let the rest of you be guinea pigs.

Happy to be one and happy to report that I am more productive and have had more fun on this phone than any other I've owned.
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post #153 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartBuzz View Post

I hate to be drawn in on this. But let's assume for a moment that Apple is telling the truth. If the iPhone's calibration/calculation of signal strength gives a false reading, then what the user "sees" as a strong signal is a false reading. That would explain why signal bars drop when the antenna is physically blocked from what little signal it "sees." If the iPhone has a strong signal, the user will not experience the bar drop anomaly. Now, let's assume Apple is lying. Do you really think they want to open up that can of worms for the lawyers? Poor reception causes dropped calls...not a false calibration. There is a silver lining. Because of all the attention given to this perceived issue, Apple discovered a formula error in how signal strength has been calculated for all iPhone models. Of course I could be wrong and Apple is deliberately covering up a design flaw. But that's only wishful thinking for all the Apple haters.

It's not about the truth or lying. Apple is fixing something that may need fixing, but it has nothing to do with the antenna problem is the iPhone 4.
post #154 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Posting in this forum has been a complete joke. So many members just want to make out that people with problems are mad (hysterical) or unnaturally forcing their phones to get reception issues, it's pathetic. Truly the posters here who are spouting that crap have really brought this forum down and are a disgrace. I don't care if you own an iPhone 4 and haven't had problems either, your crap still stinks.

What's your experience been like with your iPhone?
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post #155 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

As you originally reported,You also have said,So it appears that you are showing 3G service where there is none. Or you are close enough for the iPhone 4 to pick it up. Unfortunately, the service is either not strong enough, the iPhone 4 is not powerful enough, or both, to maintain the connection.

It may also be an internal hardware switching problem going from 3G to Edge. I live near a hilly area that the 3G service drops precipitously. When passing through there, I switch 3G off via the General Settings and haven't had a dropped call since.

I would suggest that until Vodafone upgrades to 3G, you will have issues. Check Vodafone's 3G coverage map. You may be in or in close proximity of a fringe area or as any radio wave, it maybe bouncing around and being influenced by geographical, atmospheric or man-made structural factors.

Good luck.

Thankyou.

The Vodafone store was in a 3G area on my Vodafone phone, the o2 store was about 30 miles away from there in a town were my Vodafone phone showed no 3G service at all.


Usually I'm in Edinburgh and as it took about 5 hours for my ip4 to activate was home (20 miles away and out of 3G coverage) when it activated. The Vodafone store was on the outskirts of Edinburgh and worked great before I pick it up on 3G. I suspect, but don't know yet, that the same thing will happen in central Edinburgh, I'll know for sure before that long when I go there.

The streaming radio has been a huge improvement on Vodafone, and I obviously can't tell how much of that has to do with the ip4 because I'm on new network. When I'm not holding the phone everything seems to be working perfectly but I'll try your suggestion, if I need to, because I've noticed the same sometimes in the past too.
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post #156 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Homie View Post

Lighten up Francis.

It is ok to love a phone and still be dissatisfied with a portion of it's performance. It is fair to complain.

I'm fine with the signal my self but I wish the notifications were more like on my Pre. There. I am keeping the phone and love it, but I found something to complain about.

Not all of us worship at the alter.

But over the past few days, way too many have been groveling at the sacrificial alter.
The immaturity demonstrated by a big faction of the community here has been really pathetic.
post #157 of 434
more kool aid to feed the fanbois.


still will not explain or help actual contact with the antennas. in other words - DESIGN FAIL.

so the software will hide the flaw and ATT can continue to be the bad guy. touché!




post #158 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJinTX View Post

Even though this isn't the answer that some were hoping for, it is a good first step, and here's why:

After Apple issues this software fix to make the phone accurately report bars or whatever, then either one of two things will happen...

1. This solves all current reception related issues and everyone is happy except trolls and haters.

or

2. It only fixes the cosmetic reporting of signal strength, which makes it more accurate, but does not resolve the actual dropped call issues.

If #2 above is the outcome, then at that point if dropped calls and other actual reception issues are still happening, then they won't be able to blame anything on the software incorrectly reporting the signal strength. They will then have to address it from the point of view of dropped calls and go from there. I know this isn't anyone's first choice, and it's not a speedy solution, but if there is more going on here, then it will force the issue.

Well said!

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post #159 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

It's good to have confirmation from Apple, but it isn't like this isn't exactly what Anand reported. The algorithm for the bars display is weighed to show a better signal than actually existed. The first problem of holding it resulting in the dropping of the number of bars being displayed is mainly a visualization problem..while there is a signal drop, it is not as pronounced as the display indicates.

But as Anand also stated, it doesn't change the fact that the actual amount of signal loss is still a problem.:
"The drop in signal from holding the phone with your left hand arguably remains a problem. Changing the bars visualization may indeed help mask it, and to be fair the phone works fine all the way down to -113 dBm, but it will persist - software updates can change physics as much as they can change hardware design. At the end of the day, Apple should add an insulative coating to the stainless steel band, or subsidize bumper cases. It's that simple."

And you explain the fact that most users (myself included) are experiencing far better reception in weak areas... how?
post #160 of 434
Quote:
Originally Posted by patroll View Post

Nice one. Fabricating "facts", using them to attack a reputable site whose article you have not read and then exposing both the lie and the fact that you have not read the article.

Yep, I take the blame. It wasn't my intention to frame facts though.
Just an honest mistake. But I should have verified my thought.

Never made a mistake yourself?
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