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"6 Months Until the Largest Tax Hikes in History"

post #1 of 683
Thread Starter 
http://www.atr.org/sixmonths.html?content=5171

Quote:
Personal income tax rates will rise. The top income tax rate will rise from 35 to 39.6 percent (this is also the rate at which two-thirds of small business profits are taxed). The lowest rate will rise from 10 to 15 percent. All the rates in between will also rise. Itemized deductions and personal exemptions will again phase out, which has the same mathematical effect as higher marginal tax rates. The full list of marginal rate hikes is below:

- The 10% bracket rises to an expanded 15%
- The 25% bracket rises to 28%
- The 28% bracket rises to 31%
- The 33% bracket rises to 36%
- The 35% bracket rises to 39.6%

Higher taxes on marriage and family. The marriage penalty (narrower tax brackets for married couples) will return from the first dollar of income. The child tax credit will be cut in half from $1000 to $500 per child. The standard deduction will no longer be doubled for married couples relative to the single level. The dependent care and adoption tax credits will be cut.

The return of the Death Tax. This year, there is no death tax. For those dying on or after January 1 2011, there is a 55 percent top death tax rate on estates over $1 million. A person leaving behind two homes and a retirement account could easily pass along a death tax bill to their loved ones.

Higher tax rates on savers and investors. The capital gains tax will rise from 15 percent this year to 20 percent in 2011. The dividends tax will rise from 15 percent this year to 39.6 percent in 2011. These rates will rise another 3.8 percent in 2013.

and

Quote:
Second Wave: Obamacare

There are over twenty new or higher taxes in Obamacare. Several will first go into effect on January 1, 2011. They include:

http://www.atr.org/userfiles/040510p...ealthtaxes.pdf

and

Quote:
Third Wave: The Alternative Minimum Tax and Employer Tax Hikes

When Americans prepare to file their tax returns in January of 2011, theyll be in for a nasty surprisethe AMT wont be held harmless, and many tax relief provisions will have expired. The major items include:

The AMT will ensnare over 28 million families, up from 4 million last year. According to the left-leaning Tax Policy Center, Congress failure to index the AMT will lead to an explosion of AMT taxpaying familiesrising from 4 million last year to 28.5 million. These families will have to calculate their tax burdens twice, and pay taxes at the higher level. The AMT was created in 1969 to ensnare a handful of taxpayers.

Small business expensing will be slashed and 50% expensing will disappear. Small businesses can normally expense (rather than slowly-deduct, or depreciate) equipment purchases up to $250,000. This will be cut all the way down to $25,000. Larger businesses can expense half of their purchases of equipment. In January of 2011, all of it will have to be depreciated.

Taxes will be raised on all types of businesses. There are literally scores of tax hikes on business that will take place. The biggest is the loss of the research and experimentation tax credit, but there are many, many others. Combining high marginal tax rates with the loss of this tax relief will cost jobs.

Tax Benefits for Education and Teaching Reduced. The deduction for tuition and fees will not be available. Tax credits for education will be limited. Teachers will no longer be able to deduct classroom expenses. Coverdell Education Savings Accounts will be cut. Employer-provided educational assistance is curtailed. The student loan interest deduction will be disallowed for hundreds of thousands of families.


Read more: http://www.atr.org/sixmonths.html?co...#ixzz0scbeRK3N


No one is talking about this issue. I can see it now: Obama will argue that since the economy is not yet recovered despite trillions in spending, we need to now deal with the deficit by letting tax cuts expire. Don't worry...it's not really a tax hike, we're just letting the tax breaks for "the rich" expire. Strike that....we're just "not renewing them."

<Obama Tough Guy Teleprompter Voice> "I...refuse...to let a bunch of...millionaires...dictate what happens with the people's money. So, we're going to...uh...ask them to pay their fair share. So long as I am President, I will work to ensure that the people's money is spent responsibly."
</OTGTV>

He'll argue this is no time for "greed." Biden will tell us it's time to "get with the program and be patriotic...be part of the deal." Pelosi will continue to tell us that unemployment benefits actually create jobs, and we need tax revenue to pay for them.

I think I'm going to get a few of those exemption cards.
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post #2 of 683
Thanks for this post. I was aware of the bits and pieces of tax hikes but didn't know the whole picture.

Amazing. And shocking when you consider it still won't be enough to balance the budget. In fact the deficit crisis will still be upon us.

I think it just underscores how reckless Obama and the Democrats have been in passing new entitlements in the midst of a budget crisis - criminal really.

PS Dont worry, Obama has promised to go over the budget "line by line" and to "veto all pork". LOL...seems like ancient history.
post #3 of 683
The war against the people, part 26353576.
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #4 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

The war against the people, part 26353576.

Sigh.
post #5 of 683
The most interesting thing about this will of course be how the rhetoric on it will all change. These will go from being taxes on the rich to punches in the gut for the little guy.

How else can you describe a 50% increase in taxes on the bottom 10%?

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #6 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

How else can you describe a 50% increase in taxes on the bottom 10%?

Yes, this is clearly an extreme-left policy in line with the Leftist mission to bolster the Capitalist upper-classes and keep the working class downtrodden.

This is obviously a transparent ploy by hardline communist factions and their socialist allies to oppose the Plutocratic ruling-class.

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What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
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post #7 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by segovius View Post

Yes, this is clearly an extreme-left policy in line with the Leftist mission to bolster the Capitalist upper-classes and keep the working class downtrodden.

This is obviously a transparent ploy by hardline communist factions and their socialist allies to oppose the Plutocratic ruling-class.


I think every time trumpy makes an judgement call he goes to look in a mirror so everything is backwards.
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post #8 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

The most interesting thing about this will of course be how the rhetoric on it will all change. These will go from being taxes on the rich to punches in the gut for the little guy.

How else can you describe a 50% increase in taxes on the bottom 10%?

I'll try to explain this to you as slowly as I can. You see, the 10% the tax bracket only applies to families making more than $250k per year so...ummm...ohh...wait...well, hang on a second.

No wait I've got it...this isn't really a tax increase it's simply eliminating a tax decrease to this isn't really raising taxes it's just...mmm...ohh...wait...well, hang on a second.

Yeah, sorry. I'm baffled. The "tax cuts for the 'rich'" are going to expire and, well, that will make things better. Or something.

The only thing I can come up with is that, to a Democrat, 'the rich' are anyone who makes any money.

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post #9 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I think every time trumpy makes an judgement call he goes to look in a mirror so everything is backwards.

I don't care who you are - that's funny right there.
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post #10 of 683
Here's a chart I'm sure some people wish was being reflected in a mirror.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #11 of 683
Here's a timely article :

http://blogs.reuters.com/frontrow/20...-independents/

Quote:
Poll finds Obama losing favor among independents

This article is mostly about the upcoming election. While this isn't good news for Obama it did have this to say :

Quote:
President Barack Obamas approval rating is showing the steepest decline among independents, slipping below 40 percent for the first time in a year, according to a new Gallup poll.
Thats not good news for Democrats four months before the November elections when all seats in the House of Representatives and one-third of the Senate are up for a vote.

Even though it isnt a presidential election year, the state of Obamas popularity can rub off on his party with Democrats fighting to retain control of both houses of Congress. Independents could be key in determining the outcome of close races, and certainly worthy of wooing.

And :
Quote:
Gallup says Obama has an overall 46 percent approval rating in the June 28 to July 4 week.

That rating is well within the company of former presidents Bill Clinton, Ronald Reagan, Jimmy Carter whose approval ratings were in the 40s in July of their second year and each of those presidents saw his party lose a substantial number of seats in that years midterm election, Gallup said.
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post #12 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

I'll try to explain this to you as slowly as I can. You see, the 10% the tax bracket only applies to families making more than $250k per year so...ummm...ohh...wait...well, hang on a second.

No wait I've got it...this isn't really a tax increase it's simply eliminating a tax decrease to this isn't really raising taxes it's just...mmm...ohh...wait...well, hang on a second.

Yeah, sorry. I'm baffled. The "tax cuts for the 'rich'" are going to expire and, well, that will make things better. Or something.

The only thing I can come up with is that, to a Democrat, 'the rich' are anyone who makes any money.

I am a rich Democrat and I am looking forward to paying more taxes.
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post #13 of 683
If Best Buy normally sells an ink cartridge for $9.99, and they have a week-long sale on many items including the ink cartridge which has a sale price of $8.99...... is it a "price increase" when the sale ends as announced after one week and the ink cartridge returns to its everyday low price of $9.99?
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post #14 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

I am a rich Democrat and I am looking forward to paying more taxes.

Good for you. I think then you should voluntarily pay as much in taxes as you like.

If I'm not as rich as you and wish to pay less in taxes than I do now, can I?

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post #15 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

If Best Buy normally sells an ink cartridge for $9.99, and they have a week-long sale on many items including the ink cartridge which has a sale price of $8.99...... is it a "price increase" when the sale ends as announced after one week and the ink cartridge returns to its everyday low price of $9.99?

Yes.

But to make your analogy better match the tax cut example let's modify it slightly:

If Best Buy normally sells an ink cartridge for $9.99, and they have a seven-year-long sale on many items including the ink cartridge which has a sale price of $8.99...... is it a "price increase" when the sale ends as announced after seven-years and the ink cartridge returns to its everyday low price of $9.99?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #16 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Yes.

But to make your analogy better match the tax cut example let's modify it slightly:

If Best Buy normally sells an ink cartridge for $9.99, and they have a seven-year-long sale on many items including the ink cartridge which has a sale price of $8.99...... is it a "price increase" when the sale ends as announced after seven-years and the ink cartridge returns to its everyday low price of $9.99?

You have no choice but to pay taxes. Make it your water bill and the rest works. I think everyone would agree that it is a price increase.
NoahJ
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NoahJ
"It is unwise to be too sure of one's own wisdom. It is healthy to be reminded that the strongest might weaken and the wisest might err." - Mahatma Gandhi
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post #17 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoahJ View Post

I think everyone would agree that it is a price increase.

I wish you were right. But many who don't see a problem with higher taxes always find some some form of logical or rhetorical gymnastics to avoid using the word "increase" such as "revert to previous levels" or "allowing reductions to expire." Whatever. At this point in 2011 my taxes will be going up (i.e., increasing.) \

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #18 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Good for you. I think then you should voluntarily pay as much in taxes as you like.

If I'm not as rich as you and wish to pay less in taxes than I do now, can I?

13 year olds should not post here.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #19 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

13 year olds should not post here.

I agree. Now are you going to answer my question?

As an additional question: What has prevented you from paying more taxes until now? Have you taken deductions which lower your tax bill? If so, why? Have you taken all of your income in the highest taxable form? If not why not?

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post #20 of 683
This is all the MORE reason we need to seriously look at doing something now at least two decades overdue: a MASSIVE revision of our tax code to drastically simplify it and make it encourage American citizens and businesses to keep their savings and capital investments in the USA as much as possible.

That's why I want to see our income tax reduced to what Steve Forbes proposed several years ago with a true flat tax, with a tax filing so simple it would make the current IRS 1040-EZ form look complicated in comparison. And best of all, we get rid of the payroll tax, tax on bank account interest, tax on dividend payments, alternate minimum tax and capital gains tax, essentially meaning you can save and invest completely tax-free; that could result in a GIGANTIC land rush of liquidity into the USA, which would right there provide the basis for real economic recovery.

Right now, Americans spendi over US$300 BILLION per year just to comply with income tax laws; under the Forbes' proposal, we could cut that to less than 1/3 of what we spend now, freeing up around US$200 billion per year to be used in more economically productive activities.
post #21 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Yes.

But to make your analogy better match the tax cut example let's modify it slightly:

If Best Buy normally sells an ink cartridge for $9.99, and they have a seven-year-long sale on many items including the ink cartridge which has a sale price of $8.99...... is it a "price increase" when the sale ends as announced after seven-years and the ink cartridge returns to its everyday low price of $9.99?

Better still, what happens when they do return the price $9.99 and so you decide to purchase at Office Depot?

Show me where I'm allowed to shop around my federal tax rate and decide to pay a higher or lower price somewhere else.

Talk about a flawed analogy....

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #22 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by SactoMan01 View Post

This is all the MORE reason we need to seriously look at doing something now at least two decades overdue: a MASSIVE revision of our tax code to drastically simplify it and make it encourage American citizens and businesses to keep their savings and capital investments in the USA as much as possible.

That's why I want to see our income tax reduced to what Steve Forbes proposed several years ago with a true flat tax, with a tax filing so simple it would make the current IRS 1040-EZ form look complicated in comparison. And best of all, we get rid of the payroll tax, tax on bank account interest, tax on dividend payments, alternate minimum tax and capital gains tax, essentially meaning you can save and invest completely tax-free; that could result in a GIGANTIC land rush of liquidity into the USA, which would right there provide the basis for real economic recovery.

Right now, Americans spendi over US$300 BILLION per year just to comply with income tax laws; under the Forbes' proposal, we could cut that to less than 1/3 of what we spend now, freeing up around US$200 billion per year to be used in more economically productive activities.

Well You saw what it took for Healthcare Reform ( what a circus ). Can you imagine how cooperative the two parties would be over this?

Much as I agree it's needed.
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post #23 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well You saw what it took for Healthcare Reform ( what a circus ). Can you imagine how cooperative the two parties would be over this?

I'm sure if the reform was done in the same manner, you can expect the same result. 2000+ page documents that no one has read and that we have to pass to see what is in them and how they work isn't any sort of model to hold up or be proud about. Likewise muck like those reform efforts, if the the rhetoric claims a "reform" but instead doubles the requirements and costs, then expect opposition.

The health care "reform" has been shown to be a total scam already. It excluded the Medicare cost fix as an example and those high risk pools are already going bankrupt almost before they've started as it is already clear that "savings" won't be achieved in any form or fashion with the high cost patients via best practices, electronic records or anything short of outright rationing.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #24 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

I'm sure if the reform was done in the same manner, you can expect the same result. 2000+ page documents that no one has read and that we have to pass to see what is in them and how they work isn't any sort of model to hold up or be proud about. Likewise muck like those reform efforts, if the the rhetoric claims a "reform" but instead doubles the requirements and costs, then expect opposition.

The health care "reform" has been shown to be a total scam already. It excluded the Medicare cost fix as an example and those high risk pools are already going bankrupt almost before they've started as it is already clear that "savings" won't be achieved in any form or fashion with the high cost patients via best practices, electronic records or anything short of outright rationing.

I'm sure this ( tax reform because that's what we're talking about except for the example of cooperation between parties ) would go really smooth if there was just one party running the show ( like the Republicans ). Uh huh.
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post #25 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I'm sure this would go really smooth if there was just one party running the show ( like the Republicans ). Uh huh.

For so-called healthcare "reform" there was "just one party running the show"...the Democrats. What happened?

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post #26 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

For so-called healthcare "reform" there was "just one party running the show"...the Democrats. What happened?

That isn't what I saw. But if the matter of " Tax Reform " came up can you imagine the show being any different no matter who's in charge?

The thing is the two parties aren't exactly getting along right now and it's not just the Democrats.
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post #27 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

That isn't what I saw.

Seriously? What sort of Reality Distortion Field have you been subject to? Do you deny that the Democrats have the presidency as well as had filibuster-proof majorities in the House and Senate throughout the whole healthcare "reform" debacle?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

But if the matter of " Tax Reform " came up can you imagine the show being any different no matter who's in charge?

Just like there has been no healthcare (or health insurance) reform in this country, nor will there ever be any tax reform in this country outside of a revolution.

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post #28 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Seriously? What sort of Reality Distortion Field have you been subject to? Do you deny that the Democrats have the presidency as well as had filibuster-proof majorities in the House and Senate throughout the whole healthcare "reform" debacle?




Just like there has been no healthcare (or health insurance) reform in this country, nor will there ever be any tax reform in this country outside of a revolution.

I can understand coming from a parallel universe and all. If the shoe was on the other foot it would have made no difference. Surely an independent like yourself would agree? However you are right about the last statement. Too many ( powerful ) would have too much to loose.
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post #29 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

If the shoe was on the other foot it would have made no difference. Surely an independent like yourself would agree?

If by "shoe on the other foot" you mean the Republicans having the presidency and filibuster-proof majorities in the House and Senate, yes, I do agree.

The best I can hope for is strongly divided government. This is what happened during the Clinton years. This is not ideal since many bone-headed things can still get done, but I think it's the best we can hope for.

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post #30 of 683
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerLurker View Post

If Best Buy normally sells an ink cartridge for $9.99, and they have a week-long sale on many items including the ink cartridge which has a sale price of $8.99...... is it a "price increase" when the sale ends as announced after one week and the ink cartridge returns to its everyday low price of $9.99?

You're asking the wrong question. You can call it whatever you want. If Best Buy's sales of said cartridge are flagging, would they raise the price back to $9.99?
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #31 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I'm sure this ( tax reform because that's what we're talking about except for the example of cooperation between parties ) would go really smooth if there was just one party running the show ( like the Republicans ). Uh huh.

Interesting reply. It is interesting because you declare so many to be partisan and even pull out your PPD nonsense all the time yet there wasn't a single mention of party in what you replied to there. If anything there was only pure criteria for determining a judgment that could easily be applied to any party in power.

How strange it is that the partisan one does all the accusations of being partisan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

You're asking the wrong question. You can call it whatever you want. If Best Buy's sales of said cartridge are flagging, would they raise the price back to $9.99?

Obviously you're asking the wrong question. The real question is why didn't all notice that the person unwilling to pay $9.99 is an asinine, greedy, racist, ignorant, liar in the first place and thus should not be entitled to the printer cart and should have the $9.99 taken from him so as to help all the tolerant and well intentioned people in the world.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #32 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

Interesting reply. It is interesting because you declare so many to be partisan and even pull out your PPD nonsense all the time yet there wasn't a single mention of party in what you replied to there. If anything there was only pure criteria for determining a judgment that could easily be applied to any party in power.

How strange it is that the partisan one does all the accusations of being partisan.



Obviously you're asking the wrong question. The real question is why didn't all notice that the person unwilling to pay $9.99 is an asinine, greedy, racist, ignorant, liar in the first place and thus should not be entitled to the printer cart and should have the $9.99 taken from him so as to help all the tolerant and well intentioned people in the world.

It's just that your position was so transparent. And for the record I've listed both parties in this discussion so that hardly makes me polarized anything.
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post #33 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

If by "shoe on the other foot" you mean the Republicans having the presidency and filibuster-proof majorities in the House and Senate, yes, I do agree.

The best I can hope for is strongly divided government. This is what happened during the Clinton years. This is not ideal since many bone-headed things can still get done, but I think it's the best we can hope for.

We might be in agreement here. Both sides working together ( even if they're fighting all the way ) is what they're supposed to do.
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post #34 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

We might be in agreement here. Both sides working together ( even if they're fighting all the way ) is what they're supposed to do.

Let me ask you this:

If the Republicans had the presidency and filibuster-proof majorities in the House and Senate would you support the Democrats in doing anything legally possible to stop the Republicans from ramming through whatever legislation they wanted? Would you consider the Democrats to be standing on principle in doing this?

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post #35 of 683
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Let me ask you this:

If the Republicans had the presidency and filibuster-proof majorities in the House and Senate would you support the Democrats in doing anything legally possible to stop the Republicans from ramming through whatever legislation they wanted? Would you consider the Democrats to be standing on principle in doing this?

Doesn't it depend on the legislation?
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post #36 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

It's just that your position was so transparent. And for the record I've listed both parties in this discussion so that hardly makes me polarized anything.

Nice rationalization for your very bad behavior.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #37 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

http://www.atr.org/sixmonths.html?content=5171



and



and




No one is talking about this issue. I can see it now: Obama will argue that since the economy is not yet recovered despite trillions in spending, we need to now deal with the deficit by letting tax cuts expire. Don't worry...it's not really a tax hike, we're just letting the tax breaks for "the rich" expire. Strike that....we're just "not renewing them."

<Obama Tough Guy Teleprompter Voice> "I...refuse...to let a bunch of...millionaires...dictate what happens with the people's money. So, we're going to...uh...ask them to pay their fair share. So long as I am President, I will work to ensure that the people's money is spent responsibly."
</OTGTV>

He'll argue this is no time for "greed." Biden will tell us it's time to "get with the program and be patriotic...be part of the deal." Pelosi will continue to tell us that unemployment benefits actually create jobs, and we need tax revenue to pay for them.

I think I'm going to get a few of those exemption cards.

6 months until some really nice tax cuts for most people- http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxto...igh-income.cfm
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #38 of 683
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

It's just that your position was so transparent. And for the record I've listed both parties in this discussion so that hardly makes me polarized anything.

Trump posted this:

Quote:
I'm sure if the reform was done in the same manner, you can expect the same result. 2000+ page documents that no one has read and that we have to pass to see what is in them and how they work isn't any sort of model to hold up or be proud about. Likewise muck like those reform efforts, if the the rhetoric claims a "reform" but instead doubles the requirements and costs, then expect opposition.

The health care "reform" has been shown to be a total scam already. It excluded the Medicare cost fix as an example and those high risk pools are already going bankrupt almost before they've started as it is already clear that "savings" won't be achieved in any form or fashion with the high cost patients via best practices, electronic records or anything short of outright rationing.

To which you replied:

Quote:
'm sure this ( tax reform because that's what we're talking about except for the example of cooperation between parties ) would go really smooth if there was just one party running the show ( like the Republicans ). Uh huh.

He said nothing about Republicans. You sarcastically speculated and framed the issue in a hyper-partisan way. He was merely criticizing the current "reforms." Are those criticisms not valid in your view?

Concerning your speculation though, it's clear that Republicans would be doing much better. We know this because for all their faults when they had the Presidency and both houses, they didn't pass bills like are being passed now. They didn't take over large swaths of the economy. They didn't run 1.6 Trillion dollar deficits. They didn't raise taxes every chance they got.

What's happening now is unprecedented. There is essentially no conceivable way it could be worse.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #39 of 683
Arguments about Rep v. Dem are pointless.

The government (no matter who has been in "control") has been on a spending binge for decades... and it gets worse with every year.
The ONLY way to pay for it is to increase taxes AND decrease spending (an actual decrease, not just a reduction in the rate of increase... something politicians advertise as a decrease.)

I would have no problem with very high tax rates (for a limited time) if i believed the federal government at large would actually use it to pay off our debt and not just spread it around as pork. But because I don't feel "they" spend the tax money wisely, I don't see any point in giving them MORE.

Everyone has an opinion, and with matters like this, you've got a VOTE to make that opinion heard where it might matter.
From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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post #40 of 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by KingOfSomewhereHot View Post

The ONLY way to pay for it is to increase taxes AND decrease spending (an actual decrease, not just a reduction in the rate of increase... something politicians advertise as a decrease.)

I value your opinion here but as a U.S. citizen who had no part in the Government's fiscal incompetence causing this deficit I respectfully disagree with any tax increase that will force me to pay twice for the government's foolishness (once in high taxes and once again in deficit repayment). You are right as rain that we need to decrease spending but increasing taxes simply forces citizens to issue dual payments on the government's problem. Have them cut federal spending to pay for all; no way citizens should be forced to solve a problem the government itself originated. Our state is one in which fiscal soundness and balanced budgets are required; I demand no less from the federal apparatus. Taxing the citizenry is no way to repair federal mismanagement. btw... Want a fiscal pattern to follow here? See New Jersey Governor Chris Christie...
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