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Microsoft exec compares Apple's iPhone 4 to Windows Vista - Page 2

post #41 of 113
7/14/10 at 1:55pm
Vista (noun): A product that attracts a wildly disproportionate amount of negative attention and yet still sells like hot-cakes.

Yeah, it's probably an appropriate analogy.
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post #42 of 113
7/14/10 at 1:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amdahl View Post

I actually think Xbox 360 is the closer match to iPhone 4. Both hardware products.. Both having a failure that prevents them from working at their basic function. Both denied by the maker, both facing class action suits for the defect, and then eventually having to capitulate and acknowledge the gadget is just flawed by design. Xbox 360 due to compromises made due to ineptitude on thermal effects and an overly aggressive timetable, iPhone 4 due to ineptitude and a likely refusal to compromise 'the pretty design' with laws of physics.

Oh yeah, and both costing in the vicinity of $1+ billion to address. (except MIcrosoft still basically didn't fix it for existing owner, hence the '100%' failure rate.)

Except once you get a Red Ring of Death, you can't do anything...ever.....again. The iPhone 4 still works, you just have to hold it a little differently or put a bumper on it.

What a freaking nightmare though. Fix it soon please, It just needs a coating on the antenna, it can be clear, it will look fine, I promise.....
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post #43 of 113
7/14/10 at 1:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

Vista (noun): A product that attracts a wildly disproportionate amount of negative attention and yet still sells like hot-cakes.

Yeah, it's probably an appropriate analogy.

Vista never sold like hot-cakes.
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post #44 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Sorry, I have to disagree. In the court of public opinion, the iPhone 4 is already a Vista. EVERYONE "knows" the iPhone 4 is problematic, regardless of whether or not it actually is. Apple has already lost the battle for "common knowledge" on the product; it is permanently tainted in the cultural vernacular. Not everyone knows that Android phones have issues, but even technically-ignorant grandmothers have heard of the iPhone 4's problems.

I honestly don't know if a recall would help or hurt, but the only way Apple can fruly fix things is to move on and release the iPhone 5. That's what it took for Microsoft with Vista, Ford with the Edsel, Disney with EuroDisney, McDonald's with the Arch Deluxe, etc.

talk about reality distortion field.. keep dreaming in your own world. anyone who buys android phone knows its no iphone. the phone has been out less than a month and you backbenchers are calling it over? you clearly do not know apple and their customer service. Their customer service alone insures that this is a non-issue. Apple does not need to address bloggers who live in bad service areas vehemently trying to say apple screwed up the design and the phone is worthless.

well guess what I have been to the apple store and several and not seen one person trying to return their phone or even complained. In fact all i hear are people who have one ordering another for someone else.
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post #45 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Damn_Its_Hot View Post

Or maybe Microsoft's Kin?


i read that they only sold like 10k of those, canceled it and THEN i saw an ad on TV for it.

What a well run company.

in contrast, apple has sold probably close to 2 million iphone 4s. There are some issues but will likely be solved and there aren't a million people demanding their money back!
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post #46 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:06pm
Shorter Kevin Turner: HAHAHA!!! Apple sucks almost as much as we do!

"Don't be a dick!"Wil Wheaton
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"Don't be a dick!"Wil Wheaton
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post #47 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Sorry, I have to disagree. In the court of public opinion, the iPhone 4 is already a Vista. EVERYONE "knows" the iPhone 4 is problematic, regardless of whether or not it actually is. Apple has already lost the battle for "common knowledge" on the product; it is permanently tainted in the cultural vernacular. Not everyone knows that Android phones have issues, but even technically-ignorant grandmothers have heard of the iPhone 4's problems.

I honestly don't know if a recall would help or hurt, but the only way Apple can fruly fix things is to move on and release the iPhone 5. That's what it took for Microsoft with Vista, Ford with the Edsel, Disney with EuroDisney, McDonald's with the Arch Deluxe, etc.

Ok, I am not sure what alternate universe you are living in, maybe the one that the media and this douche from Microsoft have created, but the problem with the iPhone 4 has yet to be scientifically/technically diagnosed or have you not read the other article on here about Bob Egan the electrical engineer who debunked even the Consumer Reports "testing" of the antenna problem?

Until there is an independent, scientific, properly implemented diagnosis of the iPhone 4 problem and/or Apple releases a fix the jury is still out on whether a recall is even justified.
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post #48 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:09pm
Double antenna designs are challenging but surely not as challenging as trying to decide where to put the CTRL, ALT & DEL keys on a phone?
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post #49 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone;

And the 3GS will be Apple's XP. Glad I have a nice 32 gig - works great and they still sell them BTW.

I doubt that apple will be forced to support the 3GS until 2020, when Microsoft can finally stop supporting XP.
Tofino
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Tofino
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post #50 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

[Blah, blah, blah Arch Deluxe]

Arch Deluxe! Now I'm hungry!

"Be aware of wonder." ~ Robert Fulghum

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"Be aware of wonder." ~ Robert Fulghum

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post #51 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:17pm
.

What a low blow!


Have they no shame?

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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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post #52 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremyos View Post

Double antenna designs are challenging but surely not as challenging as trying to decide where to put the CTRL, ALT & DEL keys on a phone?

ctrl, alt + del? why would I want three keys on my phone for something i need so often! win-phone7 phones should have a task-manger key on the front; that would be practical!
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post #53 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristophB View Post

When MS decides to make phone hardware, are they going to put a red ring of lights on it?



Oh man I busted something!!!
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post #54 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:21pm
Another Microsoft douche attempting to divert attention away from his own company's glaring inability to get a solid phone into the marketplace. They're all jealous 'haters'...
It's drk_one for a reason...
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It's drk_one for a reason...
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post #55 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:27pm
I want to thank Microsoft for making these stupid misinformed statements. Hopefully it will help me load up on apple stock at a cheaper price.
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post #56 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:33pm
So, Vista could have been fixed with a bumper? Man, I'll bet PC users could've used that important bit of information.

Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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Proud AAPL stock owner.

 

GOA

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post #57 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:36pm
What is far more intriguing even for Vista they failed to figure out a software fix.

We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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We mean Apple no harm.

People are lovers, basically. -- Engadget livebloggers at the iPad mini event.

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post #58 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:39pm
Not quite ms, the courrier the h slate demoed by your very own gorilla, sorry, ceo, before hp told you to piss off and went with palm, win ce, win me, the zune, so many more to mention, and oh, wait the lovely revolutionary kin withdrawn after 48 days, and 500 bozos that bought it.

Surely you don't have to go all the way back to vista to compare when you recalled a priduct you advertised the hell out of in all media, 48 days after launch. And it wasn't because of a glitch as the iPhone, it was because it was garbage, as was vista, because unlike apples occasional glitch they don't actually release garbage, you do.
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post #59 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

A Microsoft executive has said that the iPhone 4 could become Apple's version of the maligned Windows Vista operating system -- implying the product could be a misfire that will leave a bad taste in the mouth of consumers. "It looks like the iPhone 4 might be their Vista, and I'm OK with that," Turner was quoted as saying.

It's totally premature to compare the iPhone 4 to Windows Vista. We have yet to see what Apple is going to do to make this situation right. And besides, Vista was terrible from start to finish; an appropriate assessment perhaps best illustrated by the fact that Microsoft actually provided users ways to downgrade back to XP!

The iPhone 4 is the best smartphone currently available (Consumer Reports even said so), despite the overblown hype of negativity that Apple haters are stirring up. Whatever the cause of the antenna/reception problem (and there apparently IS one, though I'm not experiencing it at all; sorry others are), however widespread the impact is, however expensive (or not) correction measures will be, Apple will resolve everything soon enough. I suspect the problem(s) is less an overall design flaw and more likely a bad production batch (or two) were distributed.

"Be aware of wonder." ~ Robert Fulghum

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"Be aware of wonder." ~ Robert Fulghum

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post #60 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Sorry, I have to disagree. In the court of public opinion, the iPhone 4 is already a Vista. EVERYONE "knows" the iPhone 4 is problematic, regardless of whether or not it actually is. Apple has already lost the battle for "common knowledge" on the product; it is permanently tainted in the cultural vernacular. Not everyone knows that Android phones have issues, but even technically-ignorant grandmothers have heard of the iPhone 4's problems.

I honestly don't know if a recall would help or hurt, but the only way Apple can fruly fix things is to move on and release the iPhone 5. That's what it took for Microsoft with Vista, Ford with the Edsel, Disney with EuroDisney, McDonald's with the Arch Deluxe, etc.

Gee! I guess the "court of public opinion" failed to notify their constituents-- they are still, blindly, mass ordering iP4s that "everyone" knows are "problematic".


Either they don't "know", or they don't think it is "problematic".

Which is it?


The next time you speak to the "court" why don't you ask them to post their findings for all to see, instead of just being privy to your eyes... Oh, yeah-- tell 'em "Hi" from me!

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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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post #61 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:51pm
lol OK, so I'm in no way trying to say the antenna thing isnt bad for apple.. but is esentially saying "their bad product is starting to look like our terrible product", somehow good for Microsoft??

And why exactly was he bragging about a call pointing out how their advertising tools showed incorrect information??
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post #62 of 113
7/14/10 at 2:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Sorry, I have to disagree. In the court of public opinion, the iPhone 4 is already a Vista. EVERYONE "knows" the iPhone 4 is problematic, regardless of whether or not it actually is. Apple has already lost the battle for "common knowledge" on the product; it is permanently tainted in the cultural vernacular. Not everyone knows that Android phones have issues, but even technically-ignorant grandmothers have heard of the iPhone 4's problems.

I honestly don't know if a recall would help or hurt, but the only way Apple can fruly fix things is to move on and release the iPhone 5. That's what it took for Microsoft with Vista, Ford with the Edsel, Disney with EuroDisney, McDonald's with the Arch Deluxe, etc.

Every products has problems at some point. The problem with Vista is they never went away. iPhone has an unwanted hardware defect that they will eventually fix.

Microsoft built Vista to perform in a way that consumers didn't want their OS to perform. In other words they thought they had good ideas and they turned out to suck.
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post #63 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

I honestly don't know if a recall would help or hurt, but the only way Apple can fruly fix things is to move on and release the iPhone 5.

It's the iPhone 5 the one that's going to be released in January for Verizon?
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post #64 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:09pm
Simply amazing! Someone's managed to get Vista running on their iPhone 3G- http://tv.gawker.com/5587280/how-doe...rst-commercial

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #65 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

It's the iPhone 5 the one that's going to be released in January for Verizon?

There may or may not be validity to that rumor, but my contract comes up in Feb, and I'm not upgrading early until I find out definitely one way or another. I want an iPhone, and I want to stay on Verizon. I'm going to hold my breath until it happens... lol
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post #66 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:15pm
.

I just downloaded the new iPhone 4.1 SDK, and am installing as we speak!

I checked the API differences and there appears to be a solution:


There is a new API:

UIDontSufferFools

... it refuses to unlock the phone unless certain conditions are met.


Unfortunately, this will do nothing to reduce the anti-iPhone 4 hype....

... most of that appears to come from people who have never touched an iPhone 4.

/sarcasm


My apologies to those who have experienced real iPhone 4 problems and have posted here in a reasoned manner-- this sarcasm was not directed at you!

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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
post #67 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:28pm
I think the iPhone 4 thing is a bit overblown, but iOS 4 has left a bad taste in my mouth. It turned my iPhone 3G in to a slow, slow thing.
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post #68 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:37pm
This is merely wishful thinking from MS. From what I can find out iPhone 4 sales are still booming. And I haven't seen any reports of people returning them for a refund. Of course it has only been 3 weeks.
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post #69 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:40pm
I am totally cool with my iPhone4. If Apple recalled it, I wouldn't send it in because it works great the way it is> with the bumper.
I'm also a windows user, I'm still using the XP64 from... I think six years ago, because that was the last good OS they put out. If I could do my window apps on macOS I would dump all my windows machines out the window.
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post #70 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by roehlstation View Post

Vista never sold like hot-cakes.

180 million licenses sold up to July 2008, with enough profit generated to prop up all of Microsoft's other failures at the time. That's not bad for the apparently the worst OS ever written.
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post #71 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:48pm
4.1 doesn't fix iDeathGrip- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F6Qz...layer_embedded

But it does if you're not a troll!

"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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"If your enemies cannot find a flaw in your reasoning, they will find it in your reputation".

~ William Hazlitt

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post #72 of 113
7/14/10 at 3:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Simply amazing! Someone's managed to get Vista running on their iPhone 3G- http://tv.gawker.com/5587280/how-doe...rst-commercial

Cute!


I almost wish I were Steve Jobs with a fix, in hand, for the iPhone 4 antenna issue.....


Here's what I'd [love to] do:

1) Announce that they are still working on the "bars" problem and expect a solution in 2-3 weeks.

2) Announce that Apple and AT&T are extending the 30-day return period to 60 days to accommodate those waiting for the solution.

3) Sit back and watch the feeding frenzy

... If you think the last 20 days (since the iPhone 4 became available) were over-hyped-- just imagine how the anti-Apple crowd would react to the above.

4) Then,just as the sharks begin devouring each other, release the fix that resolves the known issues...

5) I bet it'd take a week before the sharks realized that they'd been had!


It would never happen, but it would be fun to see the sharks destroy themselves!

And, the discussions on AI would return to sanity-- for a while!

Sigh!

.
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
post #73 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I think the iPhone 4 thing is a bit overblown, but iOS 4 has left a bad taste in my mouth. It turned my iPhone 3G in to a slow, slow thing.

I had the same problem with a 3G and rebooting fixed the problem. Others have posted that they needed to do a full restore.

If neither of those are successful, there is a way you can return to iOS 3.1.3-- by restoring from a prior to iOS4 backup.

.
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
post #74 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I think the iPhone 4 thing is a bit overblown, but iOS 4 has left a bad taste in my mouth. It turned my iPhone 3G in to a slow, slow thing.

I hear you there. I wish there was an easy, bullet proof way of going back to iOS 3.

At least in that regard iOS4 is like Vista - it does not run well on older equipment.
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post #75 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

I had the same problem with a 3G and rebooting fixed the problem. Others have posted that they needed to do a full restore.

If neither of those are successful, there is a way you can return to iOS 3.1.3-- by restoring from a prior to iOS4 backup.

.

Unfortunately, rebooting did not help me, neither did a full restore. I am a bit gun shy of the method outlined at MacWorld because they said it does not always work.
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post #76 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:10pm
<Microsoft Says 12th Alleged Russian Spy Was Employee in Redmond >

and this isn't idle chatter. just check bloomberg news or google.

now we know the reason some people should just shut up.
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post #77 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonard View Post

I'd hardly say that the iPhone 4 antenae problem is on the same level as the Vista problem. As one person said, it can be fixed with a simple non-conductive coating or adding the "bumper".

All Apple should do is give out free "bumpers" to existing owners who have a problem, if that fixes it. Apple can then fix future iPhone 4's by adding the non-conductive coating.

Apple, however is going to become the butt of all jokes.

Actually, the fix is even simpler. I've been using it ever since the problem came to light: holding the phone very slightly differently. I'm left handed, and I'm supposed to be the demographic that's particularly slighted. But it's so easy to hold the phone so as to leave that one trouble spot alone. Haven't dropped a call yet.

Which is not to say they won't make that non-conductive coating trick.

As far as the jokes, yeah, it'll happen. It'll be like hearing comedians with that joke about "why can't they make the whole plan out of black-box material?" or like the old jokes about Newton's handwriting. Those went on long after they were no longer true. I had a Newton 2000 (or was it 2100? It's been so long) and the thing did astonishingly well at reading mixed cursive and printing. But people are stupid and prefer to remember the old joke than find out how things really are.
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post #78 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:18pm
The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is probably the day they start making vacuum cleaners
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post #79 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

4.1 doesn't fix iDeathGrip- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F6Qz...layer_embedded

But it does if you're not a troll!

Err...

iOS 4.1 is a developer release of the next version of iOS 4. It is not available to the general public.

I wouldn't expect 4.1 to address this issue at this time-- it wouldn't be available to those with the problem.

Usually Apple (and most software companies) fix high-profile issues in an x.y.z numbered release, where:

x.y is the current release level as in 4.0

z is the current update level as in 4.0.0


The "bars" fix is targeted at the current release and will, likely, be released as 4.0.1.


At the same time they are addressing issues with the current release, 4.0, a different team is adding new features to the next release, 4.1 (called a point release).

The last thing that is done before a new point release (4.1) is made available to the general public, is to to incorporate any fixes from the prior point release (4.0,z1, z2, z3...).

Otherwise everybody would be running around, getting in each other's way, changing what others have fixed... creating general chaos (kinda' like a thread on AI).

So the "bars" fix will. likely, be available to the general public, before the next point release (4.1).

.
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
post #80 of 113
7/14/10 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"We're back in the game," Turner reportedly said. "And this game is not over."

At which point, Turner activated the Genesis Device countdown and quoted Melville before dying.

"Can't innovate anymore my ass!" -- Phil Schiller

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"Can't innovate anymore my ass!" -- Phil Schiller

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