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Apple says just 0.55% of iPhone owners have reported antenna problems - Page 2

post #41 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naboozle View Post

Ok, waiting for the meat of this.

The 0.55% call rate is silly. Most people with the problem are probably aware of the situation and have either remedied on their own, or waiting to see what Apple is going to do about it. No sense calling a help line when the whole world knows about the problem and Apple's official response is still pending. So, mention of the 0.55% call rate is silly.


Actually, your assumption is rather silly.
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post #42 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Is Steve holding this press conference "the wrong way.

Some idiot will say he is in 1, 2, 3.....
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post #43 of 108
no, it is not closed. apple should and can fix the issue, otherwise, no one else can. i hope apple can contribute to cell phone antenna design for the industry which has been in a status quo for a long time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by obs1970 View Post

This has been way overblown by the media. Both my iPhone 4 and previous 3G drop calls at the same rate and locations. The iphone 4 is amazing, that is why it has a 1.7% return rate.

Apple did the right thing today. You live in low coverage area and your hands short the antenna, there is a free bumper for you. You don't like the iPhone with the bumper or without the bumper, return it for a full refund.

Antenna Case closed!
post #44 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehrhards View Post

Perhaps it's because on iP4, there is an actual mark showing exactly where to "just touch" to get the signal to drop. That mark doesn't exist on the other phones, so maybe it's harder to locate the spot to touch for attenuation?

Dear God, don't confuse them with logic!
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post #45 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Is Steve holding this press conference "the wrong way.


That is SO funny! And original!
post #46 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Hard to argue with a 0.55% complaint rate, unless of course you assume that Apple is lying. Which, no doubt, some will.

I rang customer care about the reception issue i have and they told me they would not even register the call as all reception issues were a non event as far as Apple was concerned. So Steve's facts and figures DO NOT represent the full facts,..
post #47 of 108
I don't have an iPhone 4 yet, but I'm very interested in getting one. That's why I haven't been commenting much, but I have been trying to follow this closely.

I agree they need more time to figure some things out.....and will eventually "tweak" the design.

On the issue of dropped calls.....the videos I've seen, folks have been experiencing the problem when the phone is held in their left hand and the data (via Speedtest) stops within seconds. This type of scenario would not be considered a "dropped call" for obvious reasons. Add to that, that using the same grip, would be quite awkward to be making an actual phone call up to your ear. I'm just wondering if this is why, when measuring just dropped calls, the problem seems pretty small.

Again, I'm not talking about the gradual drop in signal that every cell phone experiences. I'm talking about the almost immediate drop in data when you touch "the" spot.
post #48 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

Yes. I am a right handed person. I noticed the problem most when I would hold the phone in my left hand in the portrait position to type an email etc. That is how I held my 3G and my BB before then. The lower left corner of the phone hits the base below my thumb. Never had this problem with any other smartphone.


Maybe you weren't listening?

"...you can go on the web and look at pictures of nokia phones that ship with stickers on the back that say dont touch here...

We just spent the last hour going through how the iPhone 4 drops only 1 more call per hundred than the 3GS. Go talk to the Times, because you guys talk to yourselves a lot, and theyre just making this stuff up ...


And Finally:

We might have set the expectation that smartphones have weak spots but the fact is, most smartphones seem to have the same characteristic as the iPhone 4. If you grip them in a certain way they lose signal strength dramatically, especially in a low signal strength area.
post #49 of 108
The photos of Apple's test equipment were impressive. Clearly they are doing things properly, and with the stats about other good phones having the same issue, I believe them that it's an industry wide problem.

The only reason it came in to prominence with the iPhone 4 I think is because they made the antenna physically visible, so people naturally tried experimenting with it. They saw the little gap in the antenna and thought it would be fun to start playing and covering it. But before the iPhone even came out, there were other phones with internal antennas and stickers saying "don't hold here."

By making that spot more visible, is where this whole thing came from, not because the device is a lot worse than the competition.
post #50 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Hard to argue with a 0.55% complaint rate, unless of course you assume that Apple is lying. Which, no doubt, some will.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

Own one, am posting from it and love it. With a case it's great. Without it's often useless. I always have a case anyway.

You should not have to have a case on it to be able to use you phone,.. where on Apple's site does it advise potential customers that you need a case to be able to make the phone useable ,..?

I was hoping for more from Apple today, I am a sad Fanboy and really hoped that Apple could put this issue to bed but from reading the press conference I don't feel that they did, i come away kind of disappointed. I love my iPhone 4 but it definitely has issues which hand on heart i was hoping Apple had some kind of fix up there sleeves,..!

Its a long wait for iPhone 5 ,.. in some ways i wish i had not sold my 3GS as it performed better than my IP4
post #51 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naboozle View Post

No sense calling a help line when the whole world knows about the problem and Apple's official response is still pending. So, mention of the 0.55% call rate is silly.

I'm in complete agreement with your statement. For Jobs to say that this situation was "blown out of proportion" because "only 0.55% of owners contacted AppleCare" is ridiculous. I, personally, couldn't be bothered calling AppleCare because I knew that it was an issue affecting so many others. Had it just been me who was experiencing this problem, I would have called them immediately. Instead, I put a Bumper on my phone, and took a 'wait and see' attitude.

His "0.55%" statistic is far from representative of the number of iP4 owners affected by this problem. Instead, (as he has in the past) he used this number as a way of dismissing the problem. It was a stupid thing to say...
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post #52 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by aquabella View Post

Actually, you are only an idiot if you don't return the phone when you are experiencing this problem.

HAHAHAAHHA!
post #53 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Footloose301 View Post

Yes, I could manage to remove my pinky from the iPhone 4 and point it straight up like I'm drinking a cup of tea, but I won't.

HA! LOVE it... LOL
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post #54 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naboozle View Post

Ok, waiting for the meat of this.

The 0.55% call rate is silly. Most people with the problem are probably aware of the situation and have either remedied on their own, or waiting to see what Apple is going to do about it. No sense calling a help line when the whole world knows about the problem and Apple's official response is still pending. So, mention of the 0.55% call rate is silly.

Silly? What should APPLE go by? I mean, they just SAID they sold 3 Million phones. They just SAID the return rate at the stores is LOW.

WTF?

I am a shareholder. Generally lying to shareholders or the public can cost you...

Get over it.

Am a marketing exec in L.A. I am dead sure Apple used it's stats to determine the gravity of the situation, DOH!
post #55 of 108
Quote:
The song parodies the iPhone 4 antenna problems, and suggests that the media has blown the issue out of proportion.

The Media! Never! No way! You can't possibly be suggesting.

Blown out of proportion, Storm in a teacup, Something out of nothing, Mountain out of a molehill etc etc etc...

Keep it up Apple. Your obviously hurting the competition. Can't wait for my Free bumper.
A reputation is not built upon the restful domain of one's comfort zone; it is made out of stalwart exposition of your core beliefs, for all challenges to disprove them as irrelevant hubris.- Berp...
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post #56 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scafe2 View Post

You should not have to have a case on it to be able to use you phone,.. where on Apple's site does it advise potential customers that you need a case to be able to make the phone useable ,..?

I was hoping for more from Apple today, I am a sad Fanboy and really hoped that Apple could put this issue to bed but from reading the press conference I don't feel that they did, i come away kind of disappointed. I love my iPhone 4 but it definitely has issues which hand on heart i was hoping Apple had some kind of fix up there sleeves,..!

Its a long wait for iPhone 5 ,.. in some ways i wish i had not sold my 3GS as it performed better than my IP4

Well it was pretty 'slick'. Apple is great at 'slick'

Example - the 1 out of hundred more dropped calls, can someone explain a little clearer for me what that means?
When I read that, my thought was- So the 3GS may drop at a .1% per call rate and the ip4 is at 1.1% rate? or 1000% worse... just as an example. Seemed like 'slick' answer. Same with the gripping the other phones. Apple admitted bars are not a good measure of 'recepetion'(if thats the correct term), but he presented... in BARS. The real answer is does it drop the call compared to 3GS. Antedotally, users say use.

But in the end, if there is no fix other than the bumper, Apple probably did all they could do- get a bumper or return it and move along. For me(3GS), looking forward to Iphone 5. But those android boys... are catching up.
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post #57 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by mymoon View Post

Wow, I think Steve Jobs basically asked people to swamp his AppleCare folks regarding every little gripe about their products in today's press conference. I, for one and I bet I'm not alone in this, did not call AppleCare about the disappearing reception bars (continues to happen after installing 4.0.1 btw) because I knew Apple doesn't have a solution and that I'd be wasting my time on the phone to try and eke one out. I was playing the wait-and-see game.

But now Steve has sent a clear message that I should call their AppleCare line as soon as I notice any little problem no matter what.

Sigh, I'd better hold the phone 'correctly' or else my call might get dropped as I wait on hold...

YOU KNOW HOLDING IT INCORRECTLY WILL DROP CALLS, YOU'RE STILL DROPPING CALLS BECAUSE YOU INSIST ON HOLDING IT THAT WAY INSTEAD OF HOLDING IT IN WAY SO IT DOESN'T DROP YOUR CALLS, AND THEN YOU CAN GO TO DIFFERENT ONLINE FORUMS TO BITCH ABOUT IT.

You're genius and I admire you.
post #58 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by gijoeinla View Post

Silly? What should APPLE go by? I mean, they just SAID they sold 3 Million phones. They just SAID the return rate at the stores is LOW.

WTF?

I am a shareholder. Generally lying to shareholders or the public can cost you...

Get over it.

Am a marketing exec in L.A. I am dead sure Apple used it's stats to determine the gravity of the situation, DOH!

You are forgeting one thing, there are a lot of owners on the sidelines waiting to see what Apple did (or did not do). He used 'the appropriate statistics'(not lying) to tell(sell) his story. As an marketing exec, I would guess you more than most, must marvel at Steve's ability to speak(some say spin) to an audience. If you read his words, they are very good. I don't think its scripted, he's just a natural.
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post #59 of 108
I am hoping 30 sept means they are going to do some form of hardware fix to this. If they are i want to buy my iPhone4 now because i want to have one of the iphone4s that have the problem. It will be a talking point at dinner parties.

And these leads onto my other point which is that those who are saying this is a non issue are missing an important factor Since the iPod, Apple has not been a consumer electronics company, it has been a maker of cultural phenomena. If something similar to this event had happened to an Apple product 10 years ago it would have been a non issue. But today Apple's recent status as a maker of cultural phenomena means that the issue has create a media firestorm, one which will run and run. Whatever the rights and wrongs Apple will be known as the company that made the flawed iPhone4. They will still sell millions and millions of iPhone4 s, they will still make lots and lots of money: but they will be known as the company that made a phone which didn't work if you touched it in the wrong place. Google has made a ton of flawed products, but they are not known for doing so. Apple has made on e slightly problematic product but thanks to their previous success and the media they will be forever known as the company that made the flawed iPhone4. That is not a good place to be.

Right, i am off to check the o2 website to see if there are any iPhones in stock in Bristol.
post #60 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

I am happy with the phone, because I have a case. IMO a phone should not require a case to work properly.

What really bothers me is the BS Jobs is feeding people. There is no question that this problem is far more prevalent on a phone where you're in actual contact with the antenna then when it's internal. All I'd like is some honesty which would do much to restore my trust in Apple.

It's people like you who have blow this thing up!! You say you like it yet you don't like it. Make your damn mind up. You either love it or hate it!! I mean yea there MAY be some signal degration in a poor signal area and maybe a dropped call or so but how has this changed since the release of the iPhone 4. People have been since mobile phones first came out complaining about "dropped calls". And until some company can come along and sprinkle some fairy dust on our phones I don't see much changing as far as "never" getting dropped. And signal drop does not "always" mean you are going to get dropped. It's digital! Not analog! You either have 0's and 1's or not. Not to say signal strength will not effect data! But for me? This new iPhone is smoking on the data side. I have download and upload speeds I wish I could get at home. 3 to 4 Mb up and down!!! But back to you!! Please return your phone sir. I know many many people who would bs happy to taking it from your "death grip" hands because you know you not giving it up.
PS let's give some credit too to Apple for thinking "outside the box" they tried something different. A different design and concept. Because as far as I am concerned I am tired of the same ol copy cat cheap plastic phones out there. Though my iPhone may not be "perfect" and sprinkled on pixy dust, it is unique. And BTW way no shit, I have yet(and I am sure I will) have dropped a call on my iPhone 4. That leaves much to be said in my case. Now proximity issue? There may be something there. My wife had noticed it on her iPhone 4. However hope a software issue will fix this and it is worth mentioning that maybe just maybe the proximity issue can be a factor in some of these dropped called cases since your cheek may hit the end call button and not so much the reception!!
post #61 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by drk_one View Post

I'm in complete agreement with your statement. For Jobs to say that this situation was "blown out of proportion" because "only 0.55% of owners contacted AppleCare" is ridiculous. I, personally, couldn't be bothered calling AppleCare because I knew that it was an issue affecting so many others. Had it just been me who was experiencing this problem, I would have called them immediately. Instead, I put a Bumper on my phone, and took a 'wait and see' attitude.

His "0.55%" statistic is far from representative of the number of iP4 owners affected by this problem. Instead, (as he has in the past) he used this number as a way of dismissing the problem. It was a stupid thing to say...

I love this logic, don't base your data on the internal support group you have for customers that have issues?? What they should have read thru all the forums and made up a number from there?? Jeez your as bad as folks that complain about the government but don't vote because they feel it won't make a difference.

If you feel there is an issue, call applecare, get the issue logged so they can get the proper data, if you can't be bothered then return the phone or give it a rest already..
post #62 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by vrkiran View Post

Did not admit to the problem, but this is the most I expected!

I guess you watched a different press conference than I did. Steve Jobs provided two data point with regards to (1) complaints to Apple Care (0.55%) and (2) dropped calls are less than 1 more per 100 calls over the 3GS. Not to mention that the return rate is less than 2%. He showed that other smartphones experience the same antenna weakness. He admitted that the iPhone antenna was not perfect. Apple is giving all iP4 users a free case. Apple is offering a total refund to everyone. What more do you want? You have no reason to complain now that you can return the iP4 and get out of your ATT contract. Apple is not obligated to be perfect just because you are disappointed. There are plenty of other smartphones in the market. Get one of them and move on.
post #63 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scafe2 View Post

You should not have to have a case on it to be able to use you phone,.. where on Apple's site does it advise potential customers that you need a case to be able to make the phone useable ,..?

I was hoping for more from Apple today, I am a sad Fanboy and really hoped that Apple could put this issue to bed but from reading the press conference I don't feel that they did, i come away kind of disappointed. I love my iPhone 4 but it definitely has issues which hand on heart i was hoping Apple had some kind of fix up there sleeves,..!

Its a long wait for iPhone 5 ,.. in some ways i wish i had not sold my 3GS as it performed better than my IP4

Again as was said in the press conference all phones have their trade-offs, hell Motorola and Sony Ericsson were know for years for having crappy antennas but cool features. Thats why you have the option to return it if you don't like it.
post #64 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartBuzz View Post

I guess you watched a different press conference than I did. Steve Jobs provided two data point with regards to (1) complaints to Apple Care (0.55%) and (2) dropped calls are less than 1 more per 100 calls over the 3GS. Not to mention that the return rate is less than 2%. He showed that other smartphones experience the same antenna weakness. He admitted that the iPhone antenna was not perfect. Apple is giving all iP4 users a free case. Apple is offering a total refund to everyone. What more do you want? You have no reason to complain now that you can return the iP4 and get out of your ATT contract. Apple is not obligated to be perfect just because you are disappointed. There are plenty of other smartphones in the market. Get one of them and move on.

1) Call in complaints are a bad metric. Most people wouldn't call. Especially those that would actually be looking for this problem. They would have read all the stories that we did that Apple support couldn't give any answers. Also, maybe they could have given the return rates of the 3GS in it first 3 weeks. Probably even lower than the 4. But they didn't.

2) If the 3GS had about the average number of dropped calls on the AT&T network, then 1 additional dropped call per 100 is almost 100% more dropped calls. AT&T's rate of dropped calls in Dec 2009 was between 1.05 and 1.41 per 100 calls. If the 3GS was with those bounds, then the 4 is not doing well comparatively, if it is 1 additional dropped per 100 calls.

3) return rate is even more useless. There are tonnes of reasons people won't have returned the phones yet, even if they have this problem.


Apple is doing the right this here, IMO, with the free bumpers. That doesn't mean you shouldn't actually consider what was said and what it actually shows. Which isn't much.

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...sometimes it's both
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post #65 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by mplaisance View Post

It's people like you who have blow this thing up!! You say you like it yet you don't like it. Make your damn mind up. You either love it or hate it!! I mean yea there MAY be some signal degration in a poor signal area and maybe a dropped call or so but how has this changed since the release of the iPhone 4. People have been since mobile phones first came out complaining about "dropped calls". And until some company can come along and sprinkle some fairy dust on our phones I don't see much changing as far as "never" getting dropped. And signal drop does not "always" mean you are going to get dropped. It's digital! Not analog! You either have 0's and 1's or not. Not to say signal strength will not effect data! But for me? This new iPhone is smoking on the data side. I have download and upload speeds I wish I could get at home. 3 to 4 Mb up and down!!! But back to you!! Please return your phone sir. I know many many people who would bs happy to taking it from your "death grip" hands because you know you not giving it up.
PS let's give some credit too to Apple for thinking "outside the box" they tried something different. A different design and concept. Because as far as I am concerned I am tired of the same ol copy cat cheap plastic phones out there. Though my iPhone may not be "perfect" and sprinkled on pixy dust, it is unique. And BTW way no shit, I have yet(and I am sure I will) have dropped a call on my iPhone 4. That leaves much to be said in my case. Now proximity issue? There may be something there. My wife had noticed it on her iPhone 4. However hope a software issue will fix this and it is worth mentioning that maybe just maybe the proximity issue can be a factor in some of these dropped called cases since your cheek may hit the end call button and not so much the reception!!

So in your world, people either have to totally like something or totally hate it. Got that. Most of us use a scale of things when rating products and other things in life.

I use my iphone 4 in exactly the same places I used my 3G for two years, up until July 6th. I upgraded my 3G to iOS4 the day it came out. I hold my phones the same way. With the 3G I had never had the bars drop to 0. With the IP 4 it happens every time I touch it without the case.

This is what we call empirical evidence of a problem. I enjoy my phone and am able to do so because I use a case. If there were no cases, I'd have to return it. I'm not complaining about my phone, but for Apple to claim the issue is the same for any smartphone is disingenuous and wrong. Apple's honesty, or lack thereof is troubling to me.
post #66 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartBuzz View Post

I guess you watched a different press conference than I did. Steve Jobs provided two data point with regards to (1) complaints to Apple Care (0.55%) and (2) dropped calls are less than 1 more per 100 calls over the 3GS. Not to mention that the return rate is less than 2%. He showed that other smartphones experience the same antenna weakness. He admitted that the iPhone antenna was not perfect. Apple is giving all iP4 users a free case. Apple is offering a total refund to everyone. What more do you want? You have no reason to complain now that you can return the iP4 and get out of your ATT contract. Apple is not obligated to be perfect just because you are disappointed. There are plenty of other smartphones in the market. Get one of them and move on.

I just about have with whiners!! Move on if you don't like it!! There is android and others. Hell Droid X was just released. Please go get one and let us that truely enjoy our iP4 lay in bliss!!
post #67 of 108
how are they collecting the user complaints? if it is only users who have scheduled a genuis bar appointment specifically over "antenna" or "reception" problem - then I suspect the true number may be 10 times higher than what Apple is reporting.

i would like to see the dropped cal stats for iPhone 2G.

if a case solves the problem that is not too bad - since I wsa looking in to something like this:

http://www.ivyskin.com/iphone-4-case...tion-case.html

which isloates the conductivity while not hiding the phone in an ugly or ill fitting case
post #68 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

So in your world, people either have to totally like something or totally hate it. Got that. Most of us use a scale of things when rating products and other things in life.

I use my iphone 4 in exactly the same places I used my 3G for two years, up until July 6th. I upgraded my 3G to iOS4 the day it came out. I hold my phones the same way. With the 3G I had never had the bars drop to 0. With the IP 4 it happens every time I touch it without the case.

This is what we call empirical evidence of a problem. I enjoy my phone and am able to do so because I use a case. If there were no cases, I'd have to return it. I'm not complaining about my phone, but for Apple to claim the issue is the same for any smartphone is disingenuous and wrong. Apple's honesty, or lack thereof is troubling to me.

No you right it's not a love or hate? Sorry for my misrepresentation. But I guess now you calling apple as lying! They gave you the stats, the facts, the numbers, and based off that these are small number of composite thus far! You sir are obviously in the minority camp. Sorry! Maybe you really do need to exchange your phone (maybe it's faulty). But hats off to apple for addressing their customers. I don't think in my recent memory have I seen another company so concerned about customer approval even though in there honest opinion they feel it's the best phone they released "yet"!! Sure there is always room for improvement. And hopefully Apple will address those in coming versions. Look in just 3 years how phones have evolved! Partionally that's to the iPhone. And to your case: you noticed a signal drop correct? But can you please tell me honestly if you have been dropped and how often are you dropped. Forget signal. Your dropped calls? I was honest thus far I have yet to get dropped and I talk and move around a lot. Again I am sure I will get dropped eventually and I wonder when I do if it would be on my end or the person I am talking to end!
post #69 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

1) Call in complaints are a bad metric. Most people wouldn't call. Especially those that would actually be looking for this problem. They would have read all the stories that we did that Apple support couldn't give any answers.

2) If the 3GS had about the average number of dropped calls on the AT&T network, then 1 additional dropped call per 100 is almost 100% more dropped calls. AT&T's rate of dropped calls in Dec 2009 was between 1.05 and 1.41 per 100 calls. If the 3GS was with those bounds, then the 4 is not doing well comparatively, if it is 1 additional dropped per 100 calls.

3) return rate is even more useless. There are tonnes of reasons people won't have returned the phones yet, even if they have this problem.


Apple is doing the right this here , IMO with the free bumpers. That doesn't mean you shouldn't actually consider what was said and what it actually shows. Which isn't much.

Your logic just doesn't make sense to me. IMO customer complaints work. iPhone sales have not been affected. But if you feel you are right, then just return your phone and move on. If Apple has screwed up, they will pay for it in the market place. BTW, 100% of a small number is still small. It's all relative. ATT is not known for their reception excellence...at least not with the iPhone. Yet the iPhone users haven't abandoned ATT. Let's see if there's still an iPhone flap in two months.
post #70 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCMacUser View Post

If you feel there is an issue, call applecare, get the issue logged so they can get the proper data, if you can't be bothered then return the phone or give it a rest already..

Poor analogy, and clearly you completely missed the point. Jobs used this "0.55%" statistic as a means of defending his "no big deal" theory.

Everyone calling to report a power outtage after a tornado rips through their neighborhood isn't going to get the power turned on any sooner. In this instance, fewer 'official' complaints doesn't mean that there isn't a problem.

Not "wanting to be bothered" placing a call to AppleCare and returning my phone are 2 separate things. I happen to love my phone.

Perhaps it's you who should give it a rest...
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post #71 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by BartBuzz View Post

Your logic just doesn't make sense to me. IMO customer complaints work. iPhone sales have not been affected. But if you feel you are right, then just return your phone and move on. If Apple has screwed up, they will pay for it in the market place. BTW, 100% of a small number is still small. It's all relative. ATT is not known for their reception excellence...at least not with the iPhone. Yet the iPhone users haven't abandoned ATT. Let's see if there's still an iPhone flap in two months.

If you were one that could see the problem on your phone, would you have called? I wouldn't have, given what I have read before hand. That is just one reason someone might not have called. So what does the number of calls tell us? Not much. I _might_ have brought it in for a replacement. Would that replacement have counted as a return?

I am not saying they 'screwed up'. I am saying the number were present very selectively and selected for a reason. Other important number were omitted.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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post #72 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

So far, the tone of the conference is that there is no problem and we're all idiots if we think there are. This will not do Apple's PR any good.

Yes, if you cup and death squeeze a phone you'll get signal drop. On the iPhone 4 all you need to do is rest your finger on the spot, no grip, no cupping nothing.

So just dont touch it there. Tough huh?
post #73 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

Own one, am posting from it and love it. With a case it's great. Without it's often useless. I always have a case anyway.

"Without it it's useless" People lose all credibility when making such asinine comments. SO if your iP4 has no case the phone is rendered totally useless?

Troll comment.
post #74 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by mplaisance View Post

No you right it's not a love or hate? Sorry for my misrepresentation. But I guess now you calling apple as lying! They gave you the stats, the facts, the numbers, and based off that these are small number of composite thus far! You sir are obviously in the minority camp. Sorry! Maybe you really do need to exchange your phone (maybe it's faulty). But hats off to apple for addressing their customers. I don't think in my recent memory have I seen another company so concerned about customer approval even though in there honest opinion they feel it's the best phone they released "yet"!! Sure there is always room for improvement. And hopefully Apple will address those in coming versions. Look in just 3 years how phones have evolved! Partionally that's to the iPhone. And to your case: you noticed a signal drop correct? But can you please tell me honestly if you have been dropped and how often are you dropped. Forget signal. Your dropped calls? I was honest thus far I have yet to get dropped and I talk and move around a lot. Again I am sure I will get dropped eventually and I wonder when I do if it would be on my end or the person I am talking to end!

Tell me honestly that you think there would be no difference in attenuation in antennas that actually touch your hand and those that are covered and do not.

Apple's giving away of free cases is tantamount to an admission that this is correct. They should have just said so.

In my case, I noticed a complete loss of signal. I was not calling, but using the internet. The signal dropped to zero and the connection was lost. This was in multiple places and times. I do not think my phone is faulty, I just think that it's a natural result of bridging two antennas.
post #75 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsm View Post

"Without it it's useless" People lose all credibility when making such asinine comments. SO if your iP4 has no case the phone is rendered totally useless?

Troll comment.

As a connective device, yes. Unless I hold it like a wine glass at a cocktail party, I bridge the gap. It's how I've always held my phone.

Of course it's still great for games, pictures, and other apps.
post #76 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

Tell me honestly that you think there would be no difference in attenuation in antennas that actually touch your hand and those that are covered and do not.

Apple's giving away of free cases is tantamount to an admission that this is correct. They should have just said so.

In my case, I noticed a complete loss of signal. I was not calling, but using the internet. The signal dropped to zero and the connection was lost. This was in multiple places and times. I do not think my phone is faulty, I just think that it's a natural result of bridging two antennas.

I can't for obvious reasons because I am by no means a radio engineer. Granted I can type away all the hog wash I read on the Internet about the whole "bridge" or "shorting" of the antennas. BTW I do work on electric communications circuits and yes I do understand shorts, grounds, hign resistance opens and all but I take no credit in understanding the issues of a radio antenna and it's technologht. That's a whole different beast. And you seem like an intelligent person and I am sure you think you have it figured out but unless I missed you did not claim to be a radio engineer. Remember don't believe everything you read! I sure as hell don't. Was this something that Apple knew about? I doubt. Why? Because if Apple thought for one second that this "outside" antenna would have a "true" negative effect, I really doubt Apple would have praised it at the keynote as a great new feature. Instead they would have just not mentioned anything about the antenna. But by doing so they drew attention to it. So came out the critics. Look you like your iPhone right? It's beautiful, it's thin, it's crisp, it's a phone , email client , web browser, picture and hi def video(BTW I don't use my Kodak video anymore) etc (you get the point) in one small device that fits in your pocket and you complain about one little spot that may or may not depending on who you ask may drop your signal to a point that makes the phone unuseful. With all that I say just don't touch that. But let me say, I touch the "sweet spot" all the time waiting for my dropped call. None to date.
post #77 of 108
Given the media hoopla I bet it would've been more than that.
The hard data Jobs mentioned probably could've been obtained by journalists, had they the skill. Yet media types any more are all about regurgitating the garbage.
http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/quotes.asp

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Never quote idiots, they just clog up...
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http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/quotes.asp

Never argue with idiots, they'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. - a bumper sticker

Never quote idiots, they just clog up...
Reply
post #78 of 108
As a long Apple fan, Apple has seen darker days. This is small. I see this as Apple's growing pains. Yes Apple is big, Apple is cool again now, Apple is all over the news. So it's no suprise that "everything" Apple goes under the microscope. And Apple being the company it is, it is no surprise. Not saying Apple always invents, but they surely do reinvent and remarket a great idea. But as Apple is great at reinventing they are also great inventors as well and sometimes go against the grain! Apple is a true "form and function" company. Not many companies can claim that. And I am sure sometimes form and function do not meet in the middle. Yet we as consumers do love the look of everything we own (come on you know you do!) and tend in many ways favor the look of the things we own. Apple has always IMO challenged the two to play together and while mostly the two can play in harmony they do at times sometimes clash. IMO I too believe that this is overhyped by the media. Please you can't tell me that there are many who would love to see the iPhone fail!! That is a fact!! But as a long Apple user, we will come through. Apple has always and even today value there customers and maybe are one of the few companies who do because I don't think Apple has forgotten that it was the loyal customers who brought them though the dark days. So I end this in that it is an insult to me, long Mac user, to see or hear people on here talk such negativity like Apple did this willingly! I imagine many on here may think that Apple is a new company of some sort. Apple has been around for over 30 years even before Microsoft and it has been a fun ride. Live long Apple! Some of us do understand the Company!!
post #79 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

If you were one that could see the problem on your phone, would you have called? I wouldn't have, given what I have read before hand. That is just one reason someone might not have called. So what does the number of calls tell us? Not much. I _might_ have brought it in for a replacement. Would that replacement have counted as a return?

I am not saying they 'screwed up'. I am saying the number were present very selectively and selected for a reason. Other important number were omitted.

Well, I'm a simple consumer. If the product doesn't work as promised, I won't buy that brand again. So if my iPhone worked as you describe and I can get a refund, back it goes. And I'll try another brand. I've owned a lot of things that didn't work as promised. But only one of them.
post #80 of 108
Quote:
Originally Posted by obs1970 View Post

Dell customer support=Free 80 min trip round the world [call centers that is!]

Just like Apple... What is your point?
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