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Official Christian Thread! - Page 7

post #241 of 444
8/12/10 at 3:53pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Radical Christians used and use guns to kill innocent people, doctors at that, use bombs to blow up buildings, They bless nuclear weapons and howitzers, I think even you can see the similarities.

You have a problem with reality Wormhole; it was back in history as far as the Crusades that militant Christians made a presence; however radical Muslims as late as yesterday committed suicide attacks on innocents. Matter of fact, throughout the mideast, fanatical Muslims are now the norm - using young Islamic boys and girls as suicide weapons upon the innocent; more often than not the victims being Christians. Nontheless, we expect you to apologize for these Muslim jihadi terrorists as is your youthful norm; we hope that you begin to accept reality as the rest of us adults!
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post #242 of 444
8/12/10 at 4:00pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Abortion clinic bombers aren't Christian Terrorists? The IRA aren't Christian Terrorists? Fuck, they resumed the violence and bombings over the last week. You, sir, are the one out of touch with reality. Christians are pretty fucking brutal, too.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #243 of 444
8/12/10 at 4:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by FineTunes View Post

When I read about this, I was outraged that "Christians" could take part in something like this

http://www.examiner.com/x-44332-Colu...-the-Koran-Day

and then ask why we are hated in many parts of the world.

As a Christian, I would not participate in such activities, nor do I believe they are in harmony with the teachings of Christ:

"Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" (Matthew 5:43-44)

This only serves to foster the spirit of contention and discord, which Christ also specifically discussed:

"For verily, verily I say unto you, he that hath the spirit of contention is not of me, but is of the devil, who is the father of contention, and he stirreth up the hearts of men to contend with anger, one with another. Behold, this is not my doctrine, to stir up the hearts of men with anger, one against another; but this is my doctrine, that such things should be done away." (3 Nephi 11:29-30)

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #244 of 444
8/12/10 at 4:13pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Abortion clinic bombers aren't Christian Terrorists? The IRA aren't Christian Terrorists?

Anything this decade BR? When was the last abortion bombing and how many were killed? When was the last IRA bombing and how many were killed? Just today, a bombing in Iraq by a suicide Muslim killed 36.... just how much apologia do you plan to extend for this fanatical Islamic zealots?
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post #245 of 444
8/12/10 at 4:41pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Last IRA bombing was last week. Do you not read the news?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #246 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Vast Majority of Muslims around the World in response to 9/11 and other terrorist acts View Post

As a Muslim, I would not participate in such activities, nor do I believe they are in harmony with the teachings of Mohamed or the Q'uran.

Yet some Christians still seem to think think all Muslims are terrorists. How do you think some Muslims feel about Christians, and why?
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post #247 of 444
8/13/10 at 7:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Yet some Christians still seem to think think all Muslims are terrorists. How do you think some Muslims feel about Christians, and why?

Some Christians do. Most don't.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #248 of 444
8/13/10 at 9:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Some Christians do. Most don't.

I would agree with that statement. Until you limit the statement to the US. I honestly believe most or close to most Christians in the US think Islam is an evil religion and all Muslims are capable of terrorism.
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post #249 of 444
8/13/10 at 9:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

I would agree with that statement. Until you limit the statement to the US. I honestly believe most or close to most Christians in the US think Islam is an evil religion and all Muslims are capable of terrorism.

I disagree that most Christians think Islam is evil and all Muslims are capable of terrorism.

But then again most of the Christians I know well are Latter-day Saints and our 11th Article of Faith states:

"We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."

See this post in the Islam thread for some Latter-day Saint perspectives on Islam: http://forums.appleinsider.com/showp...79&postcount=7

I don't condemn the entire Muslim faith for the heinous acts that some have committed in their name. And I honestly do think the majority of Christians agree with me.

Though, if you get most of your information about what Christians think from mainstream news outlets instead of talking to Christians themselves, I can see why you would feel that way.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #250 of 444
8/13/10 at 9:34am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

I would agree with that statement. Until you limit the statement to the US. I honestly believe most or close to most Christians in the US think Islam is an evil religion and all Muslims are capable of terrorism.

tonton: I concur with jazzguru's earlier comment that although some Christians believe that, "Most don't" as jazzguru maintained. However, some explanation is certainly necessary here. While most Christians are aware that the fanatical elements with Islam are a minority, they are also keenly aware that the Muslims, as a whole, have yet to reject the violence as espoused via the radical enforcement of Sharia Law, which transcends the Muslim faith from religious borders to civilian borders. Moreover, when you have fanatical Imam's enforcing the most violent elements of Sharia on both the religious and civilian populace, much like a state trooper might enforce state law here in this nation, you are left with quite a different picture than the Islamic propagandists like to paint to the west.
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post #251 of 444
8/13/10 at 11:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

As a Christian, I would not participate in such activities, nor do I believe they are in harmony with the teachings of Christ:

"Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" (Matthew 5:43-44)

This only serves to foster the spirit of contention and discord, which Christ also specifically discussed:

"For verily, verily I say unto you, he that hath the spirit of contention is not of me, but is of the devil, who is the father of contention, and he stirreth up the hearts of men to contend with anger, one with another. Behold, this is not my doctrine, to stir up the hearts of men with anger, one against another; but this is my doctrine, that such things should be done away." (3 Nephi 11:29-30)

Now could you quote the verse that states that Jesus was not a homosexual, please.

Also the one that explains how to identify someone as "enemy". Thanks.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #252 of 444
8/13/10 at 11:58am
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I disagree that most Christians think Islam is evil and all Muslims are capable of terrorism.

But then again most of the Christians I know well are Latter-day Saints and our 11th Article of Faith states:

"We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."

So why do you send out missionaries door to door to bother the shit out of people and attempt to convert them? Let everyone else worship how, where, or what they may. AND STOP GOING DOOR TO DOOR TRYING TO CONVERT PEOPLE.

Fucking hypocrisy left and right within the Cult of Joseph Smith.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #253 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Now could you quote the verse that states that Jesus was not a homosexual, please.

No. Not everything that Jesus ever said or did is included in what we now know as the Bible, nor are all of his teachings and doctrine.

Here is our 8th Article of Faith:

"We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God."

We consider the Bible to be "canon", however we also believe that many doctrines and truths were removed from it or altered over time. Hence, the need for a restoration of the truth, which was carried out by the Lord through his prophet Joseph Smith.

Modern revelation through latter-day prophets has confirmed that homosexual behavior is indeed contrary to the Law of God.

Quote:
Also the one that explains how to identify someone as "enemy". Thanks.

I think if you read further in that same passage, you'll get your answer. An enemy is someone who would "curse you", "hate you", or "despitefully use you, and persecute you".

See also "adversary" or "foe".

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #254 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

So why do you send out missionaries door to door to bother the shit out of people and attempt to convert them? Let everyone else worship how, where, or what they may. AND STOP GOING DOOR TO DOOR TRYING TO CONVERT PEOPLE.

Our 50,000+ missionaries do a lot of good around the world. They do much more besides go door to door and share uplifting, spiritual messages. They give humanitarian aid, help people find information on their ancestors, and much more.

I'm sorry that you are bothered by missionaries knocking on your door. You can tell them never to come back, and they won't.

But our missionaries are warmly received by many others and welcome to share their message. My brother is currently serving a full-time Spanish language mission on Long Island. He learned Spanish just for that purpose. His weekly emails to our family are filled with accounts of how he and his fellow missionaries have been able to help people turn their lives around, end cycles of abuse and dependency on drugs, and so on.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #255 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:09pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

We consider the Bible to be "cannon",

Canon. Unless you are speaking metaphorically and that does make sense. The bible is a weapon that causes grave spiritual harm to those it is aimed and fired at.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #256 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:09pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Our 50,000+ missionaries do a lot of good around the world. They do much more besides go door to door and share uplifting, spiritual messages. They give humanitarian aid, help people find information on their ancestors, and much more.

I'm sorry that you are bothered by missionaries knocking on your door. You can tell them never to come back, and they won't.

But our missionaries are warmly received by many others and welcome to share their message. My brother is currently serving a full-time Spanish language mission on Long Island. He learned Spanish just for that purpose. His weekly emails to our family are filled with accounts of how he and his fellow missionaries have been able to help people turn their lives around, end cycles of abuse and dependency on drugs, and so on.

Why not do all the good stuff and leave the Jesus out of it? By even bringing it up they are violating the 11th principle of the doctrine of the Cult of Joseph Smith.

And replacing one terrible addiction with another doesn't really solve the problem. Just saying.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #257 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Canon. Unless you are speaking metaphorically and that does make sense. The bible is a weapon that causes grave spiritual harm to those it is aimed and fired at.

Fixed it. Simple mistake. Thanks.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #258 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Why not do all the good stuff and leave the Jesus out of it? By even bringing it up they are violating the 11th principle of the doctrine of the Cult of Joseph Smith.

Telling people about Jesus and his Doctrines is in no way hampering or infringing upon their ability or right to worship how, where, or what they may.

We share the message where and when we are welcome to do so. If they say they don't want to hear it, we move on.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #259 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:19pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
You are essentially telling them that what they are believing is wrong because your beliefs and those who you attempt to convert are overwhelmingly mutually exclusive. That isn't leaving people alone to their own devices at all.

Of course all that happy live and let live stuff goes out the window when it comes to gay marriage...at that point the Mormon message becomes "fuck you, you're doing it wrong."

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #260 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You are essentially telling them that what they are believing is wrong because your beliefs and those who you attempt to convert are overwhelmingly mutually exclusive. That isn't leaving people alone to their own devices at all.

Have you ever met with our missionaries? Like actually invited them into your home and let them present their message?

I served a mission for 2 years in Brazil, and not one time did I ever tell anyone that what they believed was wrong, or even imply such a thing.

We shared our message when invited to do so, answered whatever questions they had, and encouraged them to sincerely study and pray to God to know for themselves whether our message was true. If they wanted to know more, we'd visit them again. If they told us never to come back, we never came back. If that's not "leaving people alone to their own devices", I don't know what is.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #261 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:29pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You are essentially telling them that what they are believing is wrong because your beliefs and those who you attempt to convert are overwhelmingly mutually exclusive.

To do anything less is not aligned with the words of Christ; moreover "the telling" as you depict is essentially and roughly parallel with the actions accomplished of a green/yellow/red traffic sign in public transportation. Do you agree with road signs? If so, why would you disagree with someone speaking about religion in a free society as everyone is free to choose, much like one is free to choose to obey/disobey road and traffic signs, though there is consequences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

That isn't leaving people alone to their own devices at all.

Actually it is; you just can't accept the fact of someone speaking about religion in a free society and want to penalize it in some way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

YOf course all that happy live and let live stuff goes out the window when it comes to gay marriage...at that point the Mormon message becomes "fuck you, you're doing it wrong."

Actually the majority of the voters in the state said that about this issue. Can you accept the will of the majority or do we need special court rulings for deviancy?
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post #262 of 444
8/13/10 at 12:41pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Camp David, I never said it should be illegal to talk about religion. I said that doing so violated the 11th tenet of the Cult of Joseph Smith.

And there is a thing called tyranny of the majority that the constitution does protect us from. A majority at one point didn't want blacks or women to vote. Gay marriage is a civil rights issue. It's a bit different.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #263 of 444
8/13/10 at 1:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I said that doing so violated the 11th tenet of the Cult of Joseph Smith.

Our missionary work is not in contradiction to the 11th Article of Faith, but is in harmony with it, as I have already shown.

Letting people worship (or not worship) as they choose does not mean we cannot share what we believe with others. They still retain their ability and right to act "according to the dictates of their own conscience".

Moreover, in doing missionary work, we are heeding the admonition and teachings of the Savior in ancient and modern times. Here are a few passages:

"How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of him that bringeth good tidings, that publisheth peace; that bringeth good tidings of good, that publisheth salvation; that saith unto Zion, Thy God reigneth!" (Isaiah 2:7)

"And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature." (Mark 16:15)

"And ye shall go forth in the power of my Spirit, preaching my gospel, two by two, in my name, lifting up your voices as with the sound of a trump, declaring my word like unto angels of God." (Doctrine and Covenants 42:6)

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #264 of 444
8/13/10 at 2:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Camp David, I never said it should be illegal to talk about religion. I said that doing so violated the 11th tenet of the Cult of Joseph Smith.

A pejorative in your reference to Joseph Smith? Do you include like pejorative in your reference to Mohammed?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

And there is a thing called tyranny of the majority that the constitution does protect us from. A majority at one point didn't want blacks or women to vote. Gay marriage is a civil rights issue. It's a bit different.

Tyranny of the majority? WHich clause or amendment are you referencing?
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post #265 of 444
8/13/10 at 3:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

No. Not everything that Jesus ever said or did is included in what we now know as the Bible, nor are all of his teachings and doctrine.

Here is our 8th Article of Faith:

"We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God."

We consider the Bible to be "canon", however we also believe that many doctrines and truths were removed from it or altered over time. Hence, the need for a restoration of the truth, which was carried out by the Lord through his prophet Joseph Smith.

Modern revelation through latter-day prophets has confirmed that homosexual behavior is indeed contrary to the Law of God.



I think if you read further in that same passage, you'll get your answer. An enemy is someone who would "curse you", "hate you", or "despitefully use you, and persecute you".

See also "adversary" or "foe".

First: The way to the universe is only through me - Wormhole

This is the most idiotic crap I have read in a long time.
Wife beater and murderous fuck freak Joseph Smith a prophet? Wow.
Are you completely of your rocker????
The bible is very clear: Let the thieves go, kill the prophets otherwise they are not prophets.

If I hate you, you must love me. You are lucky I don't hate you.
Hook line sinker.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #266 of 444
8/13/10 at 3:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Some Christians do. Most don't.

Nor one single atheist does.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #267 of 444
8/13/10 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

Nor one single atheist does.

I don't think you can say that with absolute certainty.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #268 of 444
8/13/10 at 5:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

First: The way to the universe is only through me - Wormhole

This is the most idiotic crap I have read in a long time.
Wife beater and murderous freak Joseph Smith a prophet? Wow.
Are you completely of your rocker????
The bible is very clear: Let the thieves go, kill the prophets otherwise they are not prophets.

If I hate you, you must love me. You are lucky I don't hate you.
Hook line sinker.

Opinion noted. I'm not sure what the point of that post was except to rant and try to provoke me into some kind of retaliatory response.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #269 of 444
8/13/10 at 5:35pm
I have a friend who was born Mormon. He studied Cantonese and came to Hong Kong to teach. He met a girl here, converted her to Mormonism, brought her back to Utah, married her, had a kid, left the Church, divorced his wife and left her in Utah, came back to Hong Kong and became an actor, and has had a string of nubile young girlfriends ever since. So Mormon missionaries do serve a purpose, it seems. I once told him I respected him greatly for the decision he made to leave the Church, as it must have been very difficult.
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post #270 of 444
8/14/10 at 8:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Opinion noted. I'm not sure what the point of that post was except to rant and try to provoke me into some kind of retaliatory response.

You agree. At least a small glimmer of hope.
No, I took into calculation what I have stated in a previous post: the stupidity of the religious is reliable and can be used by evil people like myself for any purpose.

I know your books and what you believe. This makes you my toy. It also makes all believers toys of politicians and the power hungry all over the world.
yes I want oil genocide.
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yes I want oil genocide.
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post #271 of 444
8/14/10 at 9:11am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

I disagree that most Christians think Islam is evil and all Muslims are capable of terrorism.

But then again most of the Christians I know well are Latter-day Saints and our 11th Article of Faith states:

Tell me, then. Does the CJCLDS support, oppose, or take a neutral stance toward the Ground Zero Islamic Cultural Center?
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post #272 of 444
8/14/10 at 10:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormhole View Post

... It also makes all believers toys of politicians and the power hungry all over the world.

The reason that "religion" was invented in the first place.
From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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From out there on the moon, international politics look so petty. You want to grab a politician by the scruff of the neck and drag him a quarter of a million miles out and say, "Look at that!" -...
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post #273 of 444
8/14/10 at 10:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Tell me, then. Does the CJCLDS support, oppose, or take a neutral stance toward the Ground Zero Islamic Cultural Center?

Our stance on this particular matter is neutral. To my knowledge, no formal statements from the General Authorities have been issued regarding this.

However, our position on religious freedom has been made quite clear:

Religious Freedom

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #274 of 444
8/14/10 at 10:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Our stance on this particular matter is neutral. To my knowledge, no formal statements from the General Authorities have been issued regarding this.

However, our position on religious freedom has been made quite clear:

Religious Freedom

Thanks for the response. One could assume, then, that there shouldn't be any objection.
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post #275 of 444
8/14/10 at 10:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonton View Post

Thanks for the response. One could assume, then, that there shouldn't be any objection.

No, there shouldn't be. We know what it's like to be on the receiving end of religious persecution, and we realize that if the government can infringe upon the constitutional rights of one religious group and get away with it, it can infringe upon the rights of all.

Let them build the Cultural Center. They have a constitutional right to do so.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #276 of 444
8/14/10 at 12:08pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Our stance on this particular matter is neutral. To my knowledge, no formal statements from the General Authorities have been issued regarding this.

However, our position on religious freedom has been made quite clear:

Religious Freedom

Enjoy religious freedom unless you want to gay marry. Then you'll fight tooth and nail against it.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #277 of 444
8/14/10 at 4:40pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Enjoy religious freedom unless you want to gay marry. Then you'll fight tooth and nail against it.

What is "gay mnarry" and what does it have to do with this thread?
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post #278 of 444
8/14/10 at 9:37pm
  • BR
  • Justified Arrogance
There are religions out there that accept gay marriage. You want to deny those religions their free exercise by prohibiting it. You want your religious freedoms, but you don't want others to exercise theirs.

Mormons want polygamy. You don't want their religion to have the freedom to practice that. You just want your own freedoms.

What it comes down to again and again and again with these awful christian conservatives is this:

You want the freedom to decide things for other people and not the other way around.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #279 of 444
8/15/10 at 9:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

As a Christian, I would not participate in such activities, nor do I believe they are in harmony with the teachings of Christ

See my response in the Official Islam Thread! - AI
無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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無心 The idea of wilderness needs no defense, it only needs defenders., Wilderness is not a luxury but a necessity of the human spirit__Edward Abbey
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post #280 of 444
8/16/10 at 2:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

There are religions out there that accept gay marriage. You want to deny those religions their free exercise by prohibiting it. You want your religious freedoms, but you don't want others to exercise theirs.

Why want 'marriage' at all though BR? It is a purely religious concept and a dubious one imo.

Why not just live with someone? I know there is a Rights issue but this can be tied up legally without 'marriage'.

I never understood this actually - unless the gay couple are religious - why not lobby for a secular Mass and Communion too?

Quote:
Mormons want polygamy. You don't want their religion to have the freedom to practice that. You just want your own freedoms.

Haven't Mormons abandoned this for quite some time?

Quote:
What it comes down to again and again and again with these awful christian conservatives is this:

You want the freedom to decide things for other people and not the other way around.

Most people who are power-driven want this regardless of label or position.
What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
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What is Faith? When your good deed pleases you and your evil deed grieves you, you are a believer. What is Sin? When a thing disturbs the peace of your heart, give it up - Prophet Muhammad
Reply
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