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Apple adds Motorola Droid X to iPhone 4 death grip page - Page 7

post #241 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Well, there's nothing really left to say on this non-issue other than repeat refutations of repetitious rewordings of the same discredited accusations, so, we might as well talk about why we are all here.

Here's a thought. You call me a troll, so if you believe that to be true, have the mods ban me, and if that's successful, you can rest content that you were right all along.

If they don't ban me, then it proves what I've said which is that you resort to personal attack when you often find yourself ill-equipped to rationally debate a point.

So go ahead, fill your boots*.

*(Kiwi slang for "do your worst" or "have at it" or expressions of that ilk).
post #242 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

The smartest move when a competitor gets himself in hot water is to just let them stew in their own juice. By weighing in (or piling on) you only divert attention to yourself. You then become part of the drama. Not the best thing.

That blade might have two edges.

Competitors might come out with actual info regarding how much each phone suffers from attenuation under different grip/hold conditions. From what I managed to salvage around it seems iPhone 4 is suffering more - significantly more in some cases (which could explain why Apple is using grip&bars dust in the eyes approach instead of real data) - and while some competitors are not up to media game with Apple, some other are - like Google, for example.

So this might turn both way now - another commercially great Apple marketing campaign, or anti iPhone4 spoof with "1 finger is all it takes" themed response from funky little Android.

(I can almost envision ad with little R2D2-esque droid wondering around and giving a finger to people who are ignoring it while talking on their iPhones, resulting in their calls to drop instantly. One finger is all it takes. And it even doesn't have to be the finger)
post #243 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by phalanx View Post

Please enlighten us where on any other phone you can put one finger and lose 5 bars? "Industry wide phenomena" my eye. Apple diluted this problem by talking about a "Death Grip". No one complained about a "Death Grip". They complained about the fact that if any part of their hand touched one spot on the side of the phone, it dropped calls. Grow up Apple, we are not in the 1st grade anymore, admit you screwed up and fix it, and move on. Don't point at your other classmates. MAN UP!!!! I guess the "great innovators" "missed a spot".

Well, the power to the finger is innovation, sort of... no one else has done it before

Just kiddin'
post #244 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeCourious View Post

So you say there is a problem. And over 3 and 1/2 million people say it isn't a problem. If you have any dignity, you would admit you are the one in the wrong. I'll take the millions of people who own the iphone 4 and the millions who are on the waiting list for it to your feeble attempt to make a mountain out of a molehill.

Saying that 3.5 million people don't have a problem just because they are not returning their phones is a bit of over-optimistic.

I have 3Gs, it is mediocre phone but I never considered returning it because it is good pocket computer (I would call it PDA but it is beyond way PDA, to be honest). That still doesn't mean I'm happy with 3Gs phone performance - far from it. I'm just accepting trade-in between poor signal reception and great eBook reader, among other good things with 3Gs.

I would say that much more people will experience finger-issue with iP4, but majority of them will also accept to deal with issue utilising bumper, holster or holding it differently. Still it doesn't mean they will all be ecstatically happy with that development.
post #245 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

The first article is not at all pro Apple. The second article is more neutral, short, and really just a blurb about another story elsewhere that's been all over every site. I don't see how this defeats the notion of inherent bias at all. When you label anything not anti Apple as the "fanboys", I think that says it all.

Just becuz someone uses the term fanboyz does not mean they hate Apple. Look at another article of theirs:

http://www.ankleskater.com/pagemaker...20100725224226
post #246 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Given my personal (now 2 week) experience with the iPhone 4 while vacationing in Tahoe (the spouse bought one), I'm going with 'Apple Is Lying'... or at least being highly deceptive.

Note: Your experience may differ, but this one is mine and my family's based on the reality of actually using the handset)

I believe the statistic doesn't agree with you. It shows your experience doesn't represent the majority (and even your opinions in this board may not represent the majority either),
post #247 of 271
This seems to make many users angry

Giovanni B. Saccone
Creativity is just connecting things (Steve Jobs)
> > > My wEb SiTe < < <

Reply

Giovanni B. Saccone
Creativity is just connecting things (Steve Jobs)
> > > My wEb SiTe < < <

Reply
post #248 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by voodooru View Post

this antenna issue seems to be put to rest at this point.

now the real drama coming next is the glass.


I second that. I couldnt believe my eyes when the leaked phone (engadget) details were make public in the apple anouncement. Its the same phone!!!??? You got to be kidding. Glass going to all the way to the edge on both sides of the phone. WHAAAT!!!!???? I have always used a bumper on my 3G model and cant understand how somebody would dare to use this piece of glass without it. People are going to start crying about this soon and some class-action suit is unavoidable.

offtoppic part:

Do you want to have fun on a friends iphone ;-P ? Do this:

1. go to phone app.
2. press clear.
3. press home button.

Voila.. phone app is unusable and you have to force the app ro restart. On a 3G you cant to this nicely from menus but have to restart the app by going to shutdown screen (hold powerbutton) and pressing and holding the homebutton untill the phone app exits.
post #249 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

What's this then?

How about that, it's a Nokia user forum where someone is complaining about the bars dropping on an N97 Mini in January this year.

There's even a suggested solution which involves how to hold the phone, all before the iPhone 4 was even released (or found in a bar).

Amazing that Nokia never heard of it as the forum is hosted on their site.

You were saying?

Nokia doesn't care about the forums neither about their customers.

I had display issues with nokia it went off thrice when came into contact with moisture and nokia refused to fix it every time (had to use means) other than replacing the phone so I changed and I changed to apple.
post #250 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chopper View Post

... I was looking for public discourse with you, which is why the comment isn't a PM ...

And he chose to ignore you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chopper View Post

Here's a thought. You call me a troll, so if you believe that to be true, have the mods ban me, and if that's successful, you can rest content that you were right all along.

If they don't ban me, then it proves what I've said which is that you resort to personal attack when you often find yourself ill-equipped to rationally debate a point. ...

Ha, ha, ha. Sorry, but you are, as usual, entirely mistaken in your premises, on all counts, and your argument defies logic as well. Yet, ironically, your "argument", tone and desperate attempts to "get into it with someone" reinforce the impression that your only purpose here is trolling. Well, good luck.
post #251 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Just becuz someone uses the term fanboyz does not mean they hate Apple. ...

No, but it pretty much disqualifies them from being considered unbiased.
post #252 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

Saying that 3.5 million people don't have a problem just because they are not returning their phones is a bit of over-optimistic. ...

No, actually, it does mean exactly that. It means that this issue is so entirely overblown, and kept alive by people with vested interests and others who just don't like Apple. Your counterargument essentially states that 3.5 Million people are idiots whose phones don't work but they keep them anyway. If they aren't returning them in significant numbers, and they aren't, it means that in real world use people aren't finding this to be a significant issue at all.

It also means that most of the people complaining don't own the phone.
post #253 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikon133 View Post

That blade might have two edges.

Competitors might come out with actual info regarding how much each phone suffers from attenuation under different grip/hold conditions. From what I managed to salvage around it seems iPhone 4 is suffering more - significantly more in some cases (which could explain why Apple is using grip&bars dust in the eyes approach instead of real data) - and while some competitors are not up to media game with Apple, some other are - like Google, for example.

That still makes the other guys part of the story. "We suck too...but not as much!" isn't exactly a great selling point.

If they were smart they would have kept their mouths shut this whole time and let the press beat up on Apple. Instead they pushed apple to call them on it.
post #254 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

No, but it pretty much disqualifies them from being considered unbiased.

Nope. Not at all. But no point in arguing further because the location of the bias is obvious.
post #255 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

That still makes the other guys part of the story. "We suck too...but not as much!" isn't exactly a great selling point.
.


Yes it is. That is why Apple is saying it.

All phones have this problem. The fact is, it is less of a problem on the iP4.
post #256 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe View Post

Yes it is. That is why Apple is saying it.

All phones have this problem. The fact is, it is less of a problem on the iP4.

I'd like to believe that. But it is not a fact. There is no test data available to indicate this.
post #257 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Yet here with iPhone 4 we have people insisting that it is Apples fault that something bad happens when that insullator is touched. Sadly this is after people have learned that doing so causes problems in their location. Again to use motorcycles as an example it is like somebody grabbing a hot muffler and then blaming Harley or Honda for getting burned. If you know of a hot spot you should really avoid touching it.

Dave

No... I don't like your analogy.

The iPhone 4 is like this: Imagine that you hop on your brand new motorcycle and start it up. For some reason, you find that it won't go over 10 mph if you're holding onto the left handlebar, but as soon as you let go, it went as fast as you want. However, the handlebar is specifically made for holding, so it doesn't make sense to you why you should have to drive your bike differently than all other motorcycles to get the same performance as ALL other motorcycles.

That's why people are going crazy! Never before have they used a phone where if they lightly touch a specific spot on the phone, all communication stops. Otherwise, why wouldn't everyone be complaining about connection grinding to a halt when using older iPhones?

Think about it. THAT is the issue. If there was no issue, why would everyone be so vocal about it?
post #258 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

...someone purposefully gripping onto phones tight in order to show dropped bars. That's not the issue that was originally reported at all!

I think you're missing the point. Regardless of how antenna attenuation occurs, either by finger placement or by firm grip, it occurs on most every phone out there. That is the issue.

Let's take this into consideration now. A lot of folks use BT headsets right? So you leave your phone in your pocket because you don't need to hold it right? You then proceed to sit down thus causing firm pressure on the phone itself (unless you are wearing MC Hammer pants ) then your call drops. Hey crazier things have happened!
post #259 of 271
shame on Apple - but they are a Corporation so what else do you expect?
post #260 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by thespaz View Post

... That's why people are going crazy! Never before have they used a phone where if they lightly touch a specific spot on the phone, all communication stops. Otherwise, why wouldn't everyone be complaining about connection grinding to a halt when using older iPhones? ...

Everyone is not complaining about the iP4. So, your point is, well, pointless.
post #261 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by msheredy View Post

I think you're missing the point. Regardless of how antenna attenuation occurs, either by finger placement or by firm grip, it occurs on most every phone out there. That is the issue.

In a way, the placement/grip issue really why this whole "Antennagate" thing got blown up. If the iPhone 4 required the same "death grip" as Apple has done to competitor phones to cause a call/data to drop, then everyone wouldn't have cared as much.

It's the fact that holding the iPhone 4 in a "natural" grip is what's causing the phone to drop call/data that's the issue. This grip is one that pretty much everyone naturally uses to hold a phone while on a call.

The "death grips" that Apple shows in its videos (or ones that show two-handed holds) will cause bars to drop for obvious reasons. But when was the last time you saw someone using one of those "death grips" to actually hold the phone? It's both uncomfortable and really awkward to use next to the face.
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
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\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
post #262 of 271
Do you really think the people who are whining about the iPhone 4 antenna are intelligent enough really understand that statement?

The simple fact is --- Anybody who has dealt with Apple knows that they take care of the customers --- beyond the letter of the written warranty. "Fanboys' like myself did not become a fanboy by accident, and should I be dissatisfied with my Apple product ( not the case), I know the Apple store will make it right.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

With hindsight I wish Steve had just laid it on the table:

"We've re-thought the whole antenna thing, and putting it on the outside has both benefits and deficits. We believe the former outweigh the latter. Some may notice an interesting phenomenon that when you bridge the gap between the two antennas with your finder or hand that there may be a small drop in bar indication. In a normal signal strength area this should not have any detrimental effect. If you are in a low signal strength area, it might. But again, this design allows for greater signal strength in most conditions most of the time. On the plus side the outside antenna on the iPhone 4 yields a clear improvement in overall performance over its predecessor, and we believe it is the best smartphone on the market."

This kind of unambiguous statement would have done much to "attenuate" criticism. Buyers would know up front what the characteristics of this model are, and could judge for themselves whether their real world experience is better or worse than before. I can understand why he didn't make this statement at the time the phone was released. Probably assumed people would figure this out for themselves. Also, it just goes against all normal business practice to point out any potentially negative characteristic of a newly released product. But again, in hindsight, it would have been better. Some people would have still not been pleased, but I think much of the reaction was fueled by the belief that Apple was trying to slip something past buyers.

For the record, I can make the one or two bars drop by bridging the gap, but it doesn't seem to cause me any actual performance problems that I am aware of. Took my case off to experiment.
post #263 of 271
"That's why people are going crazy! "

The iP4 has only been out for a month. How much time and effort did each "crazy" person lose upgrading to IP4? Using your analogy of a motorcycle, I own a BMW. The turn signals work totally differently from other makes. Do I like it? No. Do i spend hours going crazy about it? No. Do I love my BMW? Heck....YESSSS !!!!

If holding the phone is so unacceptable, just return it and get something else. This is America.


Quote:
Originally Posted by thespaz View Post

No... I don't like your analogy.

The iPhone 4 is like this: Imagine that you hop on your brand new motorcycle and start it up. For some reason, you find that it won't go over 10 mph if you're holding onto the left handlebar, but as soon as you let go, it went as fast as you want. However, the handlebar is specifically made for holding, so it doesn't make sense to you why you should have to drive your bike differently than all other motorcycles to get the same performance as ALL other motorcycles.

That's why people are going crazy! Never before have they used a phone where if they lightly touch a specific spot on the phone, all communication stops. Otherwise, why wouldn't everyone be complaining about connection grinding to a halt when using older iPhones?

Think about it. THAT is the issue. If there was no issue, why would everyone be so vocal about it?
post #264 of 271
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_659272.html

I love it!
Stick it to the apple-ho's
post #265 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

And he chose to ignore you.
Ha, ha, ha. Sorry, but you are, as usual, entirely mistaken in your premises, on all counts, and your argument defies logic as well. Yet, ironically, your "argument", tone and desperate attempts to "get into it with someone" reinforce the impression that your only purpose here is trolling. Well, good luck.

You didn't ignore it though, yet it was directed specifically at solipsism, so on the contrary, it appears you were desperate to "get into it with someone", me. Interesting that you seem to feel that solipsism needs you to debate on his behalf though...

You'll forgive me I'm sure for rejecting your baseless assertion that I'm "entirely mistaken" in my premises, when you're consistently incapable of demonstrating it and you again resort to accusations of trolling. You're simply proving my point, and surprise, surprise, I'm still here.

If your debating prowess is accurately reflected by your performance so far, I'm certainly not going to need any luck.
post #266 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Your the one that's confused.

The issue isn't the "finger of death." The issue is blocking the signal by means of the users hand, and related to that, the dropping of calls.

Apple's antenna is on the outside, therefore it's more sensitive to the issue. No one at Apple has ever denied that, they have even touted the extra sensitivity as a good thing. All phones have the issue, most of the time they don't drop calls however.

If you hold the iPhone in a natural way, it won't suffer from this and won't drop calls. If you insist on holding your finger over the antenna, it will drop bars, but for the most part still won't drop the call. If you are in a marginal signal area while participating in such hijinks, you might drop the call.

I hold my iPhone in my left hand exclusively while making a call but I never get my fingers near that spot unless I contort myself on purpose. It's a non-issue because it's almost impossible to reproduce for the vast majority of users.

I feel sorry for you if you hold your phone that way and also live in a low signal area, but that doesn't make it an issue for the rest of us. Try holding the phone with your fingers like most folks do instead of slapping it to the side of your head with your entire hand cupped around it (the only way you'd see any problem at all).

It's not healthy to have the antenna touching your face anyway. A more normal grip would eliminate your problem with the signal as well as make it less likely you will get jaw cancer or something.

If you have a large hand like some of us it is very difficult not to hold the phone so that your fingers are crossing that line.

However, since Apple is giving away a free bumper to resolve the issue, I personally don't think it's worth being angry about. If the worst case scenario is I have to re-learn how to grip my phone, oh well. If you don't cause the attenuation the iPhone by far has the best reception of any smart phone.

Though I think they are being a big pompous about I say kudos to them for making an example of other manufacturers. These other companies are trying to make it sound like Apple suffers the issue alone, even going so far as to outright lie about their own phones having the issue. So I say rake em all over the coals and may the best phone win.
post #267 of 271
I finally got an iPhone 4 today. Wow, talk about an overblown "problem". I can't get the deathgrip to work. My two impartial friends couldn't get it to happen. My Apple-hating Droid-loving friend couldn't get it to happen. I've been an Apple user for over 10 years. I knew people hated Apple, but I had no idea it spread to the tech bloggers who drummed up this whole farce.
post #268 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by fonts View Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_659272.html

I love it!
Stick it to the apple-ho's

Okay, people will go on jailbreaking and Apple will go on not prosecuting them. That sounds...well...just about exactly the way things are now. But thanks for the totally unrelated post.
post #269 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by hezetation View Post

If you have a large hand like some of us it is very difficult not to hold the phone so that your fingers are crossing that line.

I think I have fairly large hands and I have no issues holding a regular-sized (read: 3.5"/3.7" screen) phone around the edges without having my hand swallow the entire phone. But that's just me...

Quote:
Though I think they are being a big pompous about I say kudos to them for making an example of other manufacturers. These other companies are trying to make it sound like Apple suffers the issue alone, even going so far as to outright lie about their own phones having the issue. So I say rake em all over the coals and may the best phone win.

In a way, Apple is alone in this issue. They would be making an example of the other manufacturers if only their videos showed a signal drop while holding the phone in the "natural" grip. If you hold any other phone in the "natural" grip, you won't find the same signal drop as the iPhone. Instead, they have to wrap their model's hand in what would be an uncomfortable and excessive grip for most users.

As many have said, the actual measurement of signal strength in dBm is what needs to be shown here and is the great equalizer in this debate. Android phones have it readily available in the settings, while Apple hides that information from the user. In all the videos I've seen, even though the competitor's phones bars might have gone down to zero, the "call ended" of "call dropped" screen is never shown. Even when the phone is held in the "death grip" Apple uses.
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
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\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
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post #270 of 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malligator View Post

I finally got an iPhone 4 today. Wow, talk about an overblown "problem". I can't get the deathgrip to work. My two impartial friends couldn't get it to happen. My Apple-hating Droid-loving friend couldn't get it to happen. I've been an Apple user for over 10 years. I knew people hated Apple, but I had no idea it spread to the tech bloggers who drummed up this whole farce.

My wife and I were holding out on the iPhone until we could understand the extent of the "problem." Now a number of my friends have their ip4s, and none have problems with their phones. On the contrary, they love them. We will be ordering our new iPhones this week.

The extent of this problem has been exaggerated by people with an agenda. In this thread alone, so much of the dramatic noise about signal issues come from people who do not/will not own an ip4. Personally, I'd like to know how these folks have so much time on their hands that they can go to various sites, register, and conduct their private propaganda campaigns.

At the end of the day, it's "The iPhone Antenna Song" that has it right...

If you don't want an iPhone 4
Don't buy it.
If you bought one and you don't like it
bring it back.

...but, you know you wont.

BTW, I thought it was hilarious that Apple started off the Press Conference with this jingle.
post #271 of 271
Whatever your purposes in putting and playing Movie/Music on Motorola Droid X , you can get the method here, so just know how to do it.

http://www.aunsoft.com/put_and_play_...id_x/#motorola
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