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The Eminem Show

post #1 of 80
Thread Starter 
Found the new album on teh intarweb, giving it a listen to now.

The first song is called "White America". He hasn't lost his ability to write really good satire.

I'll post more thoughts on it later for those interested.

For those not interested, feel free to gripe about Eminem.
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post #2 of 80
People that grip about Eminem just aren't giving him his due.

Been listening to Rap since the "Sucka MC" days and Eminem is the certainly the best White Rapper in the History of the genre and in the top 10 of all MC's IMO. I'll be picking up his album.
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post #3 of 80
Sorry, Eminem is only stupid white trash to me. Gimme Beastie Boys or gimme death. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
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post #4 of 80
Whether you like Eminem's content and style or not, you have to admit, he's a very good hip hop/rap artist. Lyrically, he's a genius, I think.

But then again, I still don't listen to his music much.
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post #5 of 80
Vanilla Ice 2 RULZ!
post #6 of 80
I've listened to the Eminem album and thought there was definate talent there. It's not really my thing but he knows his shit.
post #7 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by Artman @_@:
<strong>Sorry, Eminem is only stupid white trash to me. Gimme Beastie Boys or gimme death. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>


Beastie Boys are nice but when it comes to lyrics and delivery Eminem crushes every Beastie.
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post #8 of 80
Thread Starter 
Well, there really isn't much comparison, they are different styles. I'm partial to the B-Boys, a large part of that is due to the fact that I grew up with them. I don't see many similarities between Eminem and the B-Boys.

I sure as hell don't see any similarities between Vanilla Ice and Eminem (other than skin color).

I haven't ever bought an Eminem album I won't ever, but he's fascinating to me.
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post #9 of 80
Thread Starter 
I was never a big fan of gangster rap during its high point. While Tupac and Snoop Dogg, etc... were at their most popular I stuck with my Beastie Boys and that was basically it. I loved Run DMC back in the day, Eric B & Rakim, etc...

OutKast and Eminem have made me interested in listening to hip-hop again.

You don't get better than Eminem nowadays. In the hardcore rap arena he really has no peers because his style is so different. For pure hip-hop skill he is the real deal.

But if you're not into that thing or if his attitude/lyrics turn you off then I can understand.
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post #10 of 80
Call me whatever(old school maybe)but Eminem is the most annoying performer in existence. I know I'll get flamed harshly for this but Rap should only be performed by blacks...I find it embarrassing to watch white people and asians rap (and dress or speak like rappers)...even the Beastie Boys sometimes. Dunno, my opinion... <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" />
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post #11 of 80
I find rap embarrasing. Period.
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post #12 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by Shanny:
<strong>I find rap embarrasing. Period.</strong><hr></blockquote>


I'm sure Rap finds you embarrassing also Shanny



[ 05-13-2002: Message edited by: hmurchison ]</p>
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post #13 of 80
Thread Starter 
I can understand what you're saying, and I won't flame you at all for it.

Like many things, a lot of things are attributed to race that would more accurately attributed to socio-economic status. If you want to analyze it then where has the "rap culture" come from?

You say it's from blacks, well where did they get it? Did they bring it from Africa? Hip-hop was born of jazz, dance music and *gasp* rock 'n' roll.

The first rap album to sell 1 million (platinum):
"The King of Rock" - Run D.M.C. 1985



D.M.C. of Run DMC has the best quote (albeit a concise one) about this issue. When the B-Boys were first getting big the whole "white rapper" idea was new and revolted against, and when asked why they let the B-Boys play before them at their shows he said something to the effect of, "They bring people to the shows and the people like what they hear. That is what music is about. They are white boys, yeah, but as long as they sing about white boy stuff they'll be fine." Remember, this is 1985/6.



That's why they flourished, that's why they sell millions of records over a decade after their first multi-platinum album in the record industry where new acts are shuffled in and out monthly.

They made good music and told good stories. They had fun lyrics and didn't rely on one gimmick to sell records, which the vast majority of rappers (and rockers) do. And they fizzle out.

It's not arbitrary that some rappers make it and some don't. It's not just about who has got the most booty hoes in their video or who got the richest quickest. Master P was huge for a year or so but now he can't give his new album away. He's got booty ho videos with a diamond-encrusted tank and everything.

I have liked hip-hop since I can remember liking music. I broke my Teddy Ruxpin making him rock out to Bruce Springsteen and Public Enemy.

I can identify with a lot of it, because it's farce and all there really is to identify is with the emotion. When I was really young rap was about fun (B-Boys) or having a message (P.E.). That changed when rap started getting more complex, when rapping over guitar riffs went out I didn't like new rap anymore, because it was all black rage rap.

Tupac, Notorious B.I.G., N.W.A., Ice T, Ice Cube, etc... are about very specific situations. The message wasn't universal anymore nor was it anything you could sympathize with like Public Enemy would present. I can't get into anything Tupac says because I'm not his audience.

However, don't relegate the entire genre of hip-hop to Tupac. Oddly enough, the song I'm listening to while I type this entirely-too-long post is dealing with this very issue:

"White America" - Eminem

Look at these eyes, baby blue, baby
just like yourself
If they were brown, Shady lose
Shady sits on the shelf
But Shady's cute, Shady knew
Shady's dimples would help
...
Let's do the math, if I was black
I would have sold half
...
See the problem is
I speak to suburban kids
who otherwise wouldn't even know
these words exist
whose moms never would have never
gave two squirts of piss
till I created all this mother****in' turbulence
straight out the tube and into
your living rooms I came
And kids flippe when they knew
I was produced by Dre
That's all it took, and they were
instantly hooked right in
And they connected with me, too,
because I look like them.


------
I think I like too many different types of music, it gets tiring.
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post #14 of 80
IMO Eminem's a dick, but for a white guy he's a great rapper.
post #15 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by hmurchison:
<strong>


I'm sure Rap finds you embarrassing also Shanny



[ 05-13-2002: Message edited by: hmurchison ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

Rap and my mom get together and talk about me all the time. They started a bowling league.

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post #16 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by groverat:
<strong> I broke my Teddy Ruxpin making him rock out to Bruce Springsteen and Public Enemy.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

groveratwins the award for "most obscure reference in a post". Unfortunetly groverat is not here to except his award, he is busy trying to sell his "My Buddy" doll on eBay.
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post #17 of 80
That's funny Shanny!

Hip Hop/Rap has become soooo boring. I mean I'm Old School but I haven't seen the impact of a Hip Hop group hit as hard as Public Enemy. I mean a PE album made you think. It wasn't about Booty Shakin or Bentley's or being a Playa. I miss those days. Todays Rappers are living caricatures. Even Chris Rock laughs at the buffoons on the Source Awards...I wouldn't blame you for doing the same.

Eminem isn't afraid to to say things that inspire controversy. I laughed about his statements about Elvis Presley on his current Single.
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post #18 of 80
If a rapper could ever get famous without making a SINGLE song that called women "bitches" or made untoward remarks to any other class, I would respect him.

It's not the waythe music is done or the poor quality of the voices - it's the fact that there's nothing but anger there. Fine and good for a song or two, but jeez, don't they ever let up?
post #19 of 80
Good post/explaination groverat. I have nothing against rap or Eminem...it and he can do what it he pleases. I don't get it. I own one rap album. DJ Spooky's "Riddim Warfare". I heard it at a friends house and was amazed at all the variations going on musically. Lyrically it was fantastic. I use it as a litmus test for other rap artists. Beastie Boys? Only have In Sound From Way Out and their anthology CD.

I guess I lean more toward the Punk genre than Rap too.
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post #20 of 80
Eminem's first CD was pretty good. His second CD was not quite as good. Eminem does have some talent. However, why do people swear? It is a waste of space. Now I'm really the pot calling the kettle black , but Eminem is becoming crap. Oh, and "false and sugar-coated" too! He's becoming a hypocrite! Also, I'd be interested to know if he writes his own music, or just the words.

And, now my real beef. He dissed Moby and techno. What an ignorant guy! In the song where he disses Moby all the music is electronic except for him! Besides, why the heck does Eminem hate Moby and his music?

I like Eminem's music, but I hate Eminem. Beastie Boys are good. Bloodhound Gang, good. I even find some good things in ICP. Kotton Mouth Kings are good. But I listen to everything. Baroque, you name it. In fact, I'm going to make a bunch of Baroque techno once I figure out Digital Performer!

Eminem is just party music in the end. He doesn't explore social issues or universal questions anymore, and his musical style is getting stale.

A side-note: anyone heard that "The word fvck" skit? "From the German 'frikkin', which means, to strike." LOL! Fvck the fvcking fvckers! I don't know where that came from, but is sounds like the "Biography" guy on SNL. I don't know how, but this conversation made me think of this skit
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post #21 of 80
My English teacher did a "Moby Dis n Dat" skit for our variety show, with a the "my name is" tune about Moby Dick. That was hilarious, he should sign a contract! When he tried to do the worm, I almost fell out of my seat! He dropped his shorts at the end, the second pair of course, but that still prompted angry letters at the forum of our paper! LOL!

Anyhow, the more I think about it, the more angry I get. We wouldn't be talking about Eminem if he weren't white. He probably wouldn't have gotten any attention at all if he sounded exactly the same, did everything the same, except was something besides white. He wouldn't have gotten the support and direction from Dr. Dre, etc. But he is breaking new ground supposedly, even though many informed people can beg to differ. He doesn't have any real talent, actually. Well, not like that of the Notorious BIG or Bone Thugs N Harmony, or, say, Moby. We are basing everything we say on his ethnicity, I think. I have noticed how quick almost everyone is to jump on the "...But actually, Eminem does have talent, no one can argue that" bandwagon. My English teacher, people here, journalists in columns... We are working on the assumption he does have some bold and inciteful talent. Does he?

Almost immediately, an article I read that was handed out in English class last year started out along the lines of the above, saying how talented he was.

Why do people like Eminem? The easily hummable tunes and the nice catch phrases, I assume. I think his first CD had some interesting thoughts, but still, he isn't Mozart. Plus, everyone always listens to his crappy songs at my school, like that "Every day I am what you say I am" song. Or that one that has the spray cans in it. "Stan" was great. Mostly from Dido, I think, but I enjoyed how Eminem took a step back from the whole showbiz scene and looked at its effects on people. Anyway, just my thoughts.

And all music is good, IMO. I'm just pondering why Eminem is so popular.
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post #22 of 80
Thread Starter 
[quote]Oh, and "false and sugar-coated" too!<hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/surprised.gif" border="0" alt="[Surprised]" /> <img src="graemlins/surprised.gif" border="0" alt="[Surprised]" />

I don't know if you listened to the same Marshall Mathers LP that I did, but... sugar-coated? Maybe if that sugar is very very bitter and razor-sharp.

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />

Of course, I didn't like his first album much at all, I think the second one was much better.
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post #23 of 80
Hip Hop started as as storytelling and partying. Then somewhere along the line it metamorphised into some "outlet" for angry Black Males....Bullshiza! Now that's all we hear. Tell me you don't listen to old cuts like "White Lines"
and other Rap songs from the pioneer and get a positive message. Rappers used to smile and dance now it's about flippin' of the crowds and boasting about killing people. Eminem might not be everyones favorite but what's he supposed to do in a genre hellbent on genocide? You see players like Ice Cube and others have softened over the years and have all but exited the Industry for making movies(Where at least a modicum of artistic vision is permitted). I hate HATE H-A-T-E the Music Industry!
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post #24 of 80
Enimem sucks. 'nuff said
post #25 of 80
rap, hiphop... this late in the game is pretty silly. i'm not saying there isn't any room for improvement, but too much these days, like electronica, nothing's happening but repetition. happens to all 'scenes and genres' once white fratboys catch on... it's time we let it die. its just not dangerous anymore. no mainstream music is. as an artform? well, EB, rakim, t, sugar hill, run dmc, beasties, nwa, etc... they'll be remembered as being the artists of trendsetting rap/hiphop. the rest?

where are they now,

gfresh BLT-aka cuss
post #26 of 80
Hmm....believe it or not I was just about to post a topic about this. Ima hit that album up tomorrow (been too lazy to get it yet). I've heard it's hot. Diss Em all you want but he's a lyrical genius. I think his raps are just plain hilarious and njoy his sarcasm.

I've heard "Without Me". man, how can you rap over that beat, but he makes it hot.

Eminem's back. Let the controversy begin.
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post #27 of 80
As far as rap being embarassing sucking whatever, rap has been the most influential music and CULTURE. You look how wide-spread the hip hop culture is now, and how much money it has made. Not only that, but most rockers now have turntables DJs MCees up on stage with them now.
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post #28 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by TigerWoods99:
<strong>Hmm....believe it or not I was just about to post a topic about this. Ima hit that album up tomorrow (been too lazy to get it yet). I've heard it's hot. Diss Em all you want but he's a lyrical genius. I think his raps are just plain hilarious and njoy his sarcasm.

I've heard "Without Me". man, how can you rap over that beat, but he makes it hot.

Eminem's back. Let the controversy begin. </strong><hr></blockquote>

Yeah, his raps are great... insulting everyone possible is amazing <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />

[ 05-13-2002: Message edited by: EmAn ]</p>
post #29 of 80
it's funny.
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post #30 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by hmurchison:
<strong>People that grip about Eminem just aren't giving him his due.

Been listening to Rap since the "Sucka MC" days and Eminem is the certainly the best White Rapper in the History of the genre and in the top 10 of all MC's IMO. I'll be picking up his album.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I can name 3 white rappers that are better
1) MC Paul barman
2) A.D.M( adeem)
3) MC Idea(eyedea)

eminem is definatly the most talented mainstream white rapper though, I won't contest that...but I've never heard any of his lines compare to paul barman or A.D.M

[ 05-13-2002: Message edited by: Wrong Robot ]

[ 05-13-2002: Message edited by: Wrong Robot ]</p>
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post #31 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by EmAn:
<strong>IMO Eminem's a dick, but for a white guy he's a great rapper.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I've heard this a bazillion times....and its practically exactly what MTV feeds the world "yea eminem is an asshole, you hate eminem...but you have to admire his talent, yea...he's super talented"
and he is talented...but its just funny how much I hear this, and how its exactly the image that eminem is going for
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post #32 of 80
by the time any sort of music is embraced by 90% of 14 year olds of the world... it's over.

don't embarrass yerself tiga... you like teenybopper music and that's fine with us but don't try and tell us it's influential in any real sense over and above a marketing one. sure but that's not art, it's moosic fer the mass of tasteless cows. rap was influential, past tense, nowadays.... it's just sad. take the whitey crap that currently clogs our airwaves. 20 years ago, when it was called 'grunge' or post punk or whatever the crits labelled it.. it was pretty groundbreaking stuff. now ya got creed. it's the same, sonically, but tired, trite... unoriginal.

feh, try harder fer yer music... don't take what's handed to you. it's yer life... make the best soundtrack ya can.

cuss
post #33 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by Wrong Robot:
<strong>

I can name 3 white rappers that are better
1) MC Paul barman
2) A.D.M
3) MC Idea

</strong><hr></blockquote>

I've never heard of any of those guys.
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post #34 of 80
What's teeny bopper about KRS One, Grand Master Flash, Run DMC, Rakim, Eric B, 2pac, etc....???

Rap in its purest artform is poetry.
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post #35 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by Shanny:
<strong>

I've never heard of any of those guys.</strong><hr></blockquote>

yea....As I mentioned...eminem is the most talented mainstream white rapper...but there are many other white rappers equally or more talented than mr slim shady.
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post #36 of 80
Thread Starter 
I'd like to hear those three.

My favorite white rapper is definitely <a href="http://www.mcfrontalot.com" target="_blank">MC Front</a>

As far as what MTV says... the only MTV I've watched in the last 5 years has been The Osbournes. I know very little about what MTV is saying at any one time about any particular artist.
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post #37 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by TigerWoods99:
<strong>it's funny.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Hillarious.
post #38 of 80
groverat- Have you heard Stillmatic? That is a good album

Forgot to mention Talib Kweli & Hi Tek

I like all kinds of music.
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post #39 of 80
oh i'm sure there's some white boys that pose like gangstas better than others... but uh, yeah. same is same. as for rap being poetry?

heheee, well, it rhymes... i'll give it that much.

it never was poetry tiga... it was original at one point but not now.

love,

cuss
post #40 of 80
[quote]Originally posted by little cuss:
<strong>oh i'm sure there's some white boys that pose like gangstas better than others... but uh, yeah. same is same. as for rap being poetry?

it never was poetry tiga... it was original at one point but not now.

love,

cuss</strong><hr></blockquote>

its fools like you that give rap a bad name, you don't know shit what your talking about, modern day hip-hop thats a trend...is just that, its a trend, real hip-hop, real rap, isn't just a bunch of punks trying to be gangsters or whatever, ****, even gangster rap was just a trend....today's media and culture takes whatever it can get its hands on thats fresh, chews it up spits it out to fools like you, who swallow(like little bitches) and all of a sudden understand what they are talking about.
real hip-hop is about doing just that, keeping it real, never selling out, never bling blinging, just keeping the rhymes flowing, and the minds working.
all the crap MTV sells you is not hip-hop, its not rap, its just pop-shit that they KNOW young kids will buy, and when they do a bunch of guys up top(be they rappers straight outta compton, or lawyers straight out of beverly hills) get mad cash, and thats what motivates them, that is not real, that is phony....before you go talking down on something, shouldn't you at least learn something about it first? it will save you the trouble of having to think up your counter to this post.
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