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Netbook maker reduces shipments due to success of Apple's iPad - Page 2

post #41 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by julesburt View Post

Disclaimer - I'm an Apple fan. Mac's iPhones, iPads etc...

Surely though some of these PC Netbook are powered just fine?? I have a couple of blogger friends who use them (mainly in wifi free cafe's) to produce video blogs, video uploads / edits etc...and they also use the built in camera for creating some of these video blogs too...

I never hear them complaining that their Netbooks are underpowered etc...and they can actually import and edit video - unlike me on the iPad! Perhaps they didn't just spend $500 though??

Are all netbooks garbage really - if you don't mind the small form factor?

I think netbooks are OK for ultra portable computers. I have seen and worked with couple and they did all the usual tasks fine. Features like native DivX/XviD playback, big HDD, capability to copy photos/videos from camera etc, in my eyes, puts them in completely different category from iPad and Android tablets.

I don't even think competition from iPad is hurting them. There is natural saturation of that market segment - when you look at typical netbooks, they haven't changed much once they evolved from 7 to 10" and from Celeron to Atom... which is reducing reasons for netbook upgrade/replacement to virtually ZERO. Plus, more and more brands are coming out with their offerings - I have recently seen Viewsonic netbooks, for example.

Additionally, part of netbook market is shifting to ULV market. ULV Core 2 duo netbooks, while more expensive and bigger (11 - 13" usually) are actually the only upgrade alternative for people who need to replace their netbooks for something stronger yet still highly portable.

And finally - I think Asus is coming out with a couple of tablets for this holiday's season? Others will follow. Dell Streak is already out and, according to Anandtech.com, screen size is just about right, Android 1.6 being major if not the only let-down for this device (which Froyo update should sort out nicely).

Bottom line - really big number of reasons for netbook market to slow down, iPad maybe being one of them but hardly the one. However, this is Apple Insider - so this reasoning is sort of understandable
post #42 of 66
Over 10 million sold in 2010. I've been claiming it since the day it was released.
post #43 of 66
I just recently sold my MBP due to the fact that it had been sitting on a desk, plugged in, and unused ever since I unboxed my iPad. I take my iPad with me everywhere I go. It is practically none existent compared to the MBP. I pull it out and use it in places where a laptop would be awkward. It is a 3G version, so I always have an internet connection, unlike the MBP. In short, I use it for almost everything I used a notebook for, and more. Not once have I missed my notebook.

It is important to note that I have a 27" iMac for home use, so the iPad is not a primary computer replacement, but it makes an unbelievable secondary computer. Having the right expectations for it is the key to getting the most enjoyment out of it. What expectations should one have? Watching the keynote introducing it is a good start. The iPad mostly fails at things it was never intended to be, but succeeds fabulously at what it is.
Apple has no competition. Every commercial product which competes directly with an Apple product gives the distinct impression that, Where it is original, it is not good, and where it is good, it...
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Apple has no competition. Every commercial product which competes directly with an Apple product gives the distinct impression that, Where it is original, it is not good, and where it is good, it...
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post #44 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by julesburt View Post

Are all netbooks garbage really - if you don't mind the small form factor?

Absolutely not but the haters would have you believe so.
post #45 of 66
so Asus is just a netbook maker?

lol

ipad is competition for motherboards? must be why those sales are down for one company
Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, coming iPhone 5S, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x1, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod classic...
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post #46 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by vexorg View Post

I've always thought of netbooks as being a bad idea all around. Now, there may be good netbooks out there, but the ones I have seen are crappy. Even ones by name brand manufacturers such as Dell and HP.

I have had a number of friend who have bought these largely because they were cheap had unreal expectations and were disappointed. The manufacturers have very low margins, and to make matters worse it cannibalizes some of their more profitable notebook sales. What do they get for that trouble? A diluted brand name from the customers who typically don't think about how little they paid, but how crappy the machine is.

I'm not sure that companies like Asus are not hurting. Yes, they sell lots of computers, but their profit margin is in the 3½ % range. Not much room for error.

Have you seen people you know switch to Apple products? I have. Even long time Windows users who would not have considered it just a few years ago and buying iPhones and iPads in droves. I think that partly Apple has executed very well, making lovely products, but partly that PC makers in the race for the bottom have diluted the value of their own brandnames by putting out cheap low quality products.

Just my 2 cents. Feel free to disagree.


crappy PC's... thats so new... the fall of netbooks makes sense, most people do not work on them, and they are not good for much besides being portable. This leads to choosing Intel's Atom over AMD's athlon-neo's and V class chips, as it lower battery life, for more preformance (though they cost more)

for me the fall of netbooks is a bad thing because it means there will be few cheap newbooks that can run games that are a few years fluently (which means they can do most task quickly).

also, when Apple lowers its product margin of the Ipad to lets say 20% maybe i would buy one, i don't believe that it costs under $300 to make and ship like most people says, but after selling over 3.5 million, i would think some of the design costs (a large part of which was making an itouch larger...)_ have been covered and that its time to stop making $150 of each one.

i lol whenever some complains about profit margin's in anything involving Apple.

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

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PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

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post #47 of 66
I've had a netbook for about 2 years, and it has its advantages and drawbacks.

They're good for portability, and being able to do some e-mail, web, dump pictures when traveling light - I can do edits of RAW files in Picasa fairly well with it, and then upload them, so I can share them with family.

I could probably do some of that with an iPad, but it would be more expensive, I would have to buy a separate SD/USB adapter, I wouldn't be able to edit RAW files, next to no storage space, and it's hard to say how easy it would be able to upload a batch of photos, to either Picasa or Skydrive.

The problem with most netbooks, is that there's nothing to differentiate them, and they're getting squeezed from the low-end laptops...$350 for a bog standard netbook, with an Intel N450, 1 GB RAM, 250 GB HD, vs a dual-core Pentium or AMD, with 4 GB RAM and 250 GB HD for $400. Someone else brought up the growing line of ULV laptops, and I can see that too.
post #48 of 66
No surprise here. The writing was on the wall in January.
post #49 of 66
In a nut shell I think that is why iPad is successful and netbooks have a hardtime in the market. People expect to run a netbook like a laptop and with Windows 7 that leaves a lot to be desired.

Interestingly this is in part Apples arguement for AIR and the Mac Books. A good experience requires a certain level of performance for a given OS revision and apps.

The other thing with iPad is that it is only a rev one device. I'm actually expecting a major overhaul of the guts for next year.

Dave
post #50 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by AjitMD View Post

With multimedia, etc, these netbooks are not optimized for these functions. So it is a choice between a powerful - and heavy laptop versus a iPad. Then there is the issue of apps.

What's multimedia, precious??
post #51 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by vexorg View Post

Why? Of course there will be a new model coming out next year. There always is. It may have more features that add on to the current model. Sure. One expects that. Not a big deal. By the time the new model comes out, early adopters will have had theirs for a year.

Does the new model do something so compelling that one has to upgrade? Maybe, maybe not. One can upgrade or just stay with what you have.

The one year cycle is not a bad thing.

I feel for the guys who buy Android phones, which are topped 3 weeks later. And they have to hope that the manufacturer does not decide to blow off OS f/w updates for the phone you have because they have so many new models that they are working on that take priority over something they have already gotten their money from, and has essentially gone end of life.

I agree with you. I know there will be a refresh every year and know most of Apple's refresh schedule. However, the average person does not and many who ran out to buy an iPad I think will be a bit upset when v2 comes out with a webcam and more. They are possibly expecting Kindle type upgrades where it's nothing major. I was in Costco a few weeks ago and saw a couple looking at iPods, I told 'em to consider waiting cuz new iPods will be out in September. They had no idea that new iPods were coming out soon. The avg consumer has no idea of Apple's or any tech companies doings or roll outs.
post #52 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleADayKeepsDrAway View Post

You need a case, if you don't already have one. I find the Apple's case dramatically improve my enjoyment of holding the iPad than when it's bare.

For me too!!!!
post #53 of 66
One more thing I missed.: show me application on iPad that can play internet TV. Yes we have some grey market pages that allow watching TV even from other continents. I need to watch TV from my home country and from Europe even if I have intersting slew of sitcoms, teenager show series, comedy series here in the USA. Honestly i am too old for US coach potato offerings on TV and I need to see for example foreign news and foreign sports events (I do not like baseball and golf at all).

On netbook I install all needed plugins for some browser and I can watch streaming content. Can I do this on iPad or iPhone unless these are "Apple mandated" formats? I do not think so.

Count me in on iPad bandwagon as soon as Apple stops being hardheaded on flash and other media formats and encoders/decoders and allows other mobile networks. Even if HTML5 is way to go I do not see reason why I would resign from watching everything else now.
post #54 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by AjitMD View Post

With multimedia, etc, these netbooks are not optimized for these functions.


What optimization do you want for which functions?

Most of them will display widescreen movies and TV shows and output 5.1 audio. The iPad is mono with a 4x3 screen.
post #55 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

At one point I said that I couldn't see myself using an iPad. I went ahead and bought one anyway, the 16 gig 3G. I bought an Apple case, a bunch of apps, games and a month of wireless. But it turns out I was right. I really don't use it very much. I have to force myself. Oh well, it's pretty and all but not that useful. I also have an iMac which I use all the time. And an iPhone for on the go. How do other people use it?

Nothing is more better than waking up in the morning and checking out the news on my iPad while still in bed. And playing a game or some more reading before I retire.
post #56 of 66
If it weren't for Microsoft's strict OEM contract, I bet all netbooks would still have some Linux-based operating systems on them instead. I can think of that as being the only reason why they're considered "slow" and not that much different from normal laptops. Windows 7 is just not designed for those types of computers.

As for the iPad, I sold it. Waay to dependent on iTunes for my taste; after having my MacBook's keyboard just suddenly die. I'm sorry. Getting a netbook... :|

HP Omni 100-5100z, 500GB HDD, 4GB RAM; ASUS Transformer, 16GB, Android 4.0 ICS
Although I no longer own Apple products like I did before, I'll continue to post my opinions.

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HP Omni 100-5100z, 500GB HDD, 4GB RAM; ASUS Transformer, 16GB, Android 4.0 ICS
Although I no longer own Apple products like I did before, I'll continue to post my opinions.

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post #57 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by maciekskontakt View Post

One more thing I missed.: show me application on iPad that can play internet TV. Yes we have some grey market pages that allow watching TV even from other continents. I need to watch TV from my home country and from Europe even if I have intersting slew of sitcoms, teenager show series, comedy series here in the USA. Honestly i am too old for US coach potato offerings on TV and I need to see for example foreign news and foreign sports events (I do not like baseball and golf at all).

On netbook I install all needed plugins for some browser and I can watch streaming content. Can I do this on iPad or iPhone unless these are "Apple mandated" formats? I do not think so.

Count me in on iPad bandwagon as soon as Apple stops being hardheaded on flash and other media formats and encoders/decoders and allows other mobile networks. Even if HTML5 is way to go I do not see reason why I would resign from watching everything else now.

You can try CineXPlayer and OPlayerHD apps for XVID, etc. etc. including http and rtsp streaming or something like that. YMMV, but there is some progress on that front.
post #58 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zc456 View Post

If it weren't for Microsoft's strict OEM contract, I bet all netbooks would still have some Linux-based operating systems on them instead.

Nope, The reason netbooks don't still have Linux on them is because people kept returning them for refunds. People couldn't figure out what to do with the alien OS, and Linux netbooks were not compatible with anything. WXP was the only other OS that would run on those underpowered, cheep notebooks, and that is what people were comfortable with. It had nothing to do with strict OEM contracts.
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post #59 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zc456 View Post

If it weren't for Microsoft's strict OEM contract, I bet all netbooks would still have some Linux-based operating systems on them instead. I can think of that as being the only reason why they're considered "slow" and not that much different from normal laptops. Windows 7 is just not designed for those types of computers.

Actually, it was because of MS strict OEM contracts that allowed Linux to get a seemingly large foothold on netbooks in the first place. Remember that Vista was selling when these devices emerged. It was because MS opened up WinXP to be shipped on these machines that MS regained its ground.

Then there are reports of people returning the Linux-based netbooks. Ive used more than a few than theyve all sucked. These are not for the average consumer looking for a small, simple machine. Sure, Linux is more efficient so it would feel faster than Windows but were still talking about an OS and GUI that is not intuitive and still not designed for a 10 display.

I returned my iPad, too, but its a much better machine than any netbook Ive owned from the display panel type, the aspect ratio, the relative performance, the focus on core apps and the UI that is tailored for the device, not shoehorned in.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
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post #60 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

The netbook market had plateaued and even a more expensive option like the iPad appears to be eating away market share. Netbooks have always exhibited a very high rate of customer returns which shows that many people simply aren't happy with them regardless of the price.

A little more research reveals that the "very high rate of return" meme comes from stats from just one manufacturer, MSI, because they advertised the price difference boldly but failed to explain that those machines were running an OS that was very different from Windows.

Smarter companies see a very different trend:

Quote:
Mini 9 Netbook Running Ubuntu Returned Less Than XP

According the recent sales figures by Dell, the Inspiron Mini 9 netbook running Ubuntu Linux has been remarkably successful and experienced supremely low return-rates.

Unfortunately, MSI has been returned a great deal of its netbooks by consumers. A few months ago its MSI Wind netbooks running SuSE Linux brought in return rates four times greater than those of Wind netbooks running XP.

Dells Jay Pinkert, however, is pleased with Linux sales: A third of our Mini 9 mix is Linux, which is well above the standard attach rate for other systems that offer Linux.

http://netbookboards.com/2009/02/24/...-less-than-xp/

As for the netbook market overall, it's true that the rate of growth is smaller than it was last year when growth in that segment was so often described as explosive, but note that sales are still growing year over year:

Quote:
Netbook Sales to Reach 36 Million in 2010

Last year, the netbook market practically boomed, showing an incredibly fast growth, and the segment has since continued rising as a fairly rapid pace. Still, the rate of growth appears to be slowing down, mostly because the market is starting to get saturated. Still, the amount of shipments is expected to rise for a while still, and Techaisle believes that this year, as a whole, will yield a 13% growth compared to 2009 in terms of sales.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Netbo...0-151301.shtml


Meanwhile, Microsoft is not without its netbook issues:

Why Windows 7 on Netbooks Wont Save Microsoft
http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/0...ave-microsoft/


Still, anyone enjoying a Microsoft OS on a netbook can thank Linux: before netbooks started shipping with Linux, Microsoft's OEM pricing was more than twice what is it now.

Welcome to Ghandicon 3.
post #61 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by mesomorphicman View Post

Congrats Apple. With that said, I feel for the early adopters when they release the iPad 2 with a webcam and probably more memory and possibly more hhd space will be annoyed at buying a product that will be so far behind in one year or less (iPhone > iPhone 3G), but those are pains of buying first gen I guess. Webcam, more memory and hdd space - that's what I'm waiting for.

Good for you.

I feel no pain with true 3g unlimited broadband for $30/mo.

Amen.
post #62 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by iGonz View Post

Good for you.

I feel no pain with true 3g unlimited broadband for $30/mo.

Amen.

Everyone I know that bought an iPad absolutely loves it, save for myself as I returned it due to a still present Safari bug that interferes with my usage patterns.

I think Mesomophican is one of those people that thinks if they don't have the latest product theres is obsolete. We can say the iPad 3 will be more powerful and have more features than the iPad 2. That's product evolution so I don't understand his point as their seem to be millions loving their current iPads.

Surprisingly, my mother only reads books from her iPad now. I really didn't expect her to adopt to an electronic reader after so many decades of reading bound books.
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post #63 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleSwitcher View Post

For me too!!!!

Surprised how well the apple case works with the iPad.
I also used the zipper pouch that came with my Eeepc netbook for added protection as well as the micro cloth which is perfect for cleaning the screen.
post #64 of 66
Sol, you must tell us more of this Safari bug that interferes with what usage pattern. I, for one, dumped Safari as soon as Atomic Web Browser came out. I, then, dumped that for Perfect Browser. There are many good options for iPad browsers. Do tell.
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post #65 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Everyone I know that bought an iPad absolutely loves it, save for myself as I returned it due to a still present Safari bug that interferes with my usage patterns.

I think Mesomophican is one of those people that thinks if they don't have the latest product theres is obsolete. We can say the iPad 3 will be more powerful and have more features than the iPad 2. That's product evolution so I don't understand his point as their seem to be millions loving their current iPads.

Surprisingly, my mother only reads books from her iPad now. I really didn't expect her to adopt to an electronic reader after so many decades of reading bound books.

Yes he is in that vicious cycle. I've never used the cam in the netbook and Studio XPS that I have.
Only used 7g of the 64g of memory so far and no problems at all with memory on the iPad so at first I wasn't sure what he was talking about.

I also think Mesomorphican is the one feeling the pain or else he would not have wrote that.
Hope he feels better now.

Saying that he bought a slightly used 3G iPad half price would make more sense.
post #66 of 66
I'm still not buying into the whole iPads and netbooks are equivalent, competing products meme.
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