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Acer exec says Apple's 'closed' iPad will drop to 20% market share - Page 4

post #121 of 236
8/23/10 at 1:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

Indeed.

And you have another option: you can legally jail-break your device.

This is a perfect solution that Apple has provided: if you want to be a tinkerer, then the first step you have to take is one that is clearly tinkering and unsupported by Apple. You are, in essence, declaring your intent to take control as well as responsibility for the results. If you want to play it safe, buy the product and just use it.

Why is this solution not tickling the fancy of both crowds?

Thompson

Very well said. I couldn't agree more - if you want to tinker, do so at your own risk.
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post #122 of 236
8/23/10 at 1:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

The Oracle lawsuit has merit, Fragdroid uses a rip-off of Java that violates the licensing agreement, and Fragdroid software, all of it, will be "impounded and destroyed."

And don't forget that Sergey Brin himself said that Chrome OS is the future of Google's OS development. At this year's Google I/O conference. Why would any software developer bother with Fragdroid after the 1-2 punch of the Oracle lawsuit and Google top brass saying that they're already working on a new OS? (Unless said developer is so philosophically challenged that he refuses to program for iOS...)

i really had to laugh at that one. 'fragdroid'? no, you aren't biased....
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post #123 of 236
8/23/10 at 1:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Booga View Post

Yes, because Windows and iPod were SO open compared to Linux. Why doesn't Linux run on every desktop in the world? Because consumers don't care about openness. They want value, utility, and entertainment. Android is looking like it will be a reasonable contender, but nothing is inevitable.

Excellent point. User experience counts more than anything. Ease of use, availability, and customer support are what most people are looking for. Just a thought if I have problems with my iPhone, iPod Touch, or iPad, I simply walk into the nearest Apple Store and walk out fairly quickly (unless, of course, I want to hang around) with an answer. Where do I go if I have problems with my Android phone?
There are many more cockroaches in this
world than human beings, but it doesn't
make them a higher life form.
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There are many more cockroaches in this
world than human beings, but it doesn't
make them a higher life form.
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post #124 of 236
8/23/10 at 1:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by RayCon View Post

Excellent point. User experience counts more than anything. Ease of use, availability, and customer support are what most people are looking for. Just a thought… if I have problems with my iPhone, iPod Touch, or iPad, I simply walk into the nearest Apple Store and walk out fairly quickly (unless, of course, I want to hang around) with an answer. Where do I go if I have problems with my Android phone?


ooops, i mean

"you can go to hell, i am going to go with android down to texas and be killed at the alamo" davik crokkett
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post #125 of 236
8/23/10 at 1:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe View Post

That is exactly why the iPad is going to retain 100% market share.



you should say that Apple is going to retain a billion trillion zillion percent market share.
Both statements are equally credible.
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post #126 of 236
8/23/10 at 1:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkichline View Post

...Sure, scores of manufacturers will probably jump on the Android band wagon, and together they might make a dent in the iPad business. But they each have their own agenda and there WILL be fragmentation. Many devices, many form factors, thousands of combinations of things that developers have to account for. In the long run, iPad is a consistent experience. Android tablets will not be....

In the same category (things about Android people don't realise), there are two facts that don't seem to occur to anyone.

1) Android *needs* a fragmented platform to survive at all because the manufacturers need to differentiate their hardware to compete.

2) Android is a cheaper copy of iOS, so a lot of Android sales, are "me too" sales and don't necessarily reflect the consumer choosing anything but a lower priced product.

So Android will basically *always* be a severely fragmented platform like Windows is/was, and the current boom in sales reflects more on people moving into the smartphone market in general, than it does consumers intelligently choosing Android as a superior platform.

In fact, whatever their level of technical expertise, the average user, even the average Android user, is well aware of the fact that iOS is the "leading" platform. Only a tiny portion of technical minded users on the Android platform will argue that it's technically better than iOS, the rest are using it cause it's cheap, or it's what their cell carrier told them they could get when they asked for "a smartphone."
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post #127 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ihxo View Post

If it's something Google doesn't approve it gets remotely killed by Google?
I love open.

Its open cos you can install software from anywhere. And about those apps google killed.
They did it because they were MALICIOUS not because they dont like them. You must have google confused with apple. Just because their platform is open doesnt mean they should allow malicious apps in their app store.
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post #128 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

In the same category (things about Android people don't realise), there are two facts that don't seem to occur to anyone.

1) Android *needs* a fragmented platform to survive at all because the manufacturers need to differentiate their hardware to compete.

2) Android is a cheaper copy of iOS, so a lot of Android sales, are "me too" sales and don't necessarily reflect the consumer choosing anything but a lower priced product.

So Android will basically *always* be a severely fragmented platform like Windows is/was, and the current boom in sales reflects more on people moving into the smartphone market in general, than it does consumers intelligently choosing Android as a superior platform.

In fact, whatever their level of technical expertise, the average user, even the average Android user, is well aware of the fact that iOS is the "leading" platform. Only a tiny portion of technical minded users on the Android platform will argue that it's technically better than iOS, the rest are using it cause it's cheap, or it's what their cell carrier told them they could get when they asked for "a smartphone."

You do realize that the best selling android phones are the high end ones right. And that those phones cost just as much as the iphone on a monthly contract.
And as for android being a cheap copy of ios i really dont see it. I dont see any similarities between the 2 os except for the fact that they're both touch based.
Yes there are some android phones whose hardware resemble the iphone but thats limited to those models and not the android os as a whole
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post #129 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

Enterprises are able to create and distribute their apps at will on the iPhone and iPad via the Enterprise Developer program. How is that 'limiting'?

http://developer.apple.com/programs/iphone/enterprise/

It's limiting in the sense that Apple is the only single vendor... although in any good software+hardware combined enterprise rollout, hardware costs are usually not an overwhelming factor.

Still, the "single source" vendor issue is what's likely keeping companies from mass-adopting iPads in the workplace, as iPad + enterprise server = very useful customizable in-house system...

Corporations realize that other corps often act like brutal amoral pricks, so vendor lock-in can be an issue.
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post #130 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by demitri View Post

You do realize that the best selling android phones are the high end ones right. And that those phones cost just as much as the iphone on a monthly contract.
And as for android being a cheap copy of ios i really dont see it. I dont see any similarities between the 2 os except for the fact that they're both touch based.
Yes there are some android phones whose hardware resemble the iphone but thats limited to those models and not the android os as a whole

android isn't a 'cheap copy'. android 2.2 is impressive. not perfect, but not inferior to ios4. sadly, most android users aren't able to use 2.2 because of the stupidity of google and the providers and handset makers. this is where apple kicks MS and androids butt: the whole package is thought out and designed better.
i would put money down that the only reason people are specifically going with 'high end' android devices is that they don't have the option of getting an iphone.
the rest of the people really don't care if it is cornflakes or cheerios.
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post #131 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by demitri View Post

You do realize that the best selling android phones are the high end ones right. And that those phones cost just as much as the iphone on a monthly contract.

Android phones are cheaper overall though. In any case that doesn't affect my argument. Replace "cheaper" with "alternative" or "non-Apple" or any number of things and it's the same basic argument.

iOS is clearly the standard. Android is clearly a copy of that standard. In the end, that will matter the most.

A whole new mobile platform is emerging and just as when the "personal desktop computer" arrived, there's lots of action and a lot of people buying devices. If you look at the numbers however, it's crystal clear that those sales primarily reflect the growth of the entire market segment, not a movement of users to a particular product within that segment.

In platform development it's who is seen as "the standard" that is most important thing, and it's the biggest determinant of future dominance. Right now we are seeing a lot of companies doing whatever they can to get a foot in the door and to drive down the dominance of iOS by using the copycat (Android) system. That doesn't mean that it's actually a better system.

Apple has more to fear from WebOS than Android.
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post #132 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:25pm
Competition is good, well for us users anyway. Left to their own devices Apple will not pay much attention to some features that we users would benefit from the most, because it doesn't fit with their agenda. I'm thinking specifically of having a common file namespace (a.k.a a filesystem) that all apps can dump their files into and can open from. For example I want to be able to write stuff in pages and then export the files from my iPad via GoodReader to a webdav server. Every app being restricted to its own private namespace may suit Apple, but it severely restricts what I want to do. When the competition offer this functionality as standard Apple will be forced to respond. So Android tablets can't arrive fast enough for me.
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post #133 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdbryan View Post

Right, and what OS have they created? What silicon have they designed?


You may be confusing Acer with some other company. They neither write software nor do they design microchips.

Maybe its Samsung you are thinking of? I think they make chips too.
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post #134 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by minderbinder View Post

You're saying acer sells more smartphones, tablets, and mp3 players than Apple?

I'd really love to see the numbers backing that up.

I don't think that Acer sells smartphones, tablets or MP3 players. I could be wrong.

I think that the only thing that competes with Apple is their computers, and Apple is no longer a computer company anyways.
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post #135 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:29pm
The folks at Acer are always good for a laugh.
http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/1713.jpg
http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/1685.jpg
http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/1704.gif
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http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/1713.jpg
http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/1685.jpg
http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyimages/1704.gif
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post #136 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:30pm
/ahem, who disabled voice guidance from Google maps on European Android phones when it was enabled prematurely by hackers?

Currently Motorola is issuing cease and desist orders over the leaked release of the Froyo update for the Droids.

Meanwhile Google gathers information about Android users and makes money selling it to advertisers.

It's time some of you Droidtards took off the rose coloured glasses and stopped drinking the Google Kool Aid.




Quote:
Originally Posted by demitri View Post

Its open cos you can install software from anywhere. And about those apps google killed.
They did it because they were MALICIOUS not because they dont like them. You must have google confused with apple. Just because their platform is open doesnt mean they should allow malicious apps in their app store.

I was playing around with a HTC Legend the other day, I opened the calculator App and when you turn the phone on it's side it changes to scientific...

...remarkable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by demitri View Post

And as for android being a cheap copy of ios i really dont see it. I dont see any similarities between the 2 os except for the fact that they're both touch based.

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #137 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post


Apple has more to fear from WebOS than Android.

I'm very interested in what HP comes up with the webOS. I've always liked Palm's stuff. HP is actually a pretty strong PC brand. I'll always choose their printer over anyone else's although I'm sure an Epson or Canon or Lexmark or whatever will do a competent job.
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post #138 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

/ahem, who disabled voice guidance from Google maps on European Android phones when it was enabled prematurely by hackers?

Currently Motorola is issuing cease and desist orders over the leaked release of the Froyo update for the Droids.

Meanwhile Google gathers information about Android users and makes money selling it to advertisers.

It's time some of you Droidtards took off the rose coloured glasses and stopped drinking the Google Kool Aid.


what the hell are you talking about???
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post #139 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post


It's time some of you Droidtards took off the rose coloured glasses and stopped drinking the Google Kool Aid.


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post #140 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkhan2000 View Post

I'm very interested in what HP comes up with the webOS. I've always liked Palm's stuff. HP is actually a pretty strong PC brand. I'll always choose their printer over anyone else's although I'm sure an Epson or Canon or Lexmark or whatever will do a competent job.


WebOS is just a cheap ripoff of Apple. And they don't have as much software either. It is always better to go with Apple.
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post #141 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkhan2000 View Post

I'm very interested in what HP comes up with the webOS. I've always liked Palm's stuff. HP is actually a pretty strong PC brand. I'll always choose their printer over anyone else's although I'm sure an Epson or Canon or Lexmark or whatever will do a competent job.

HP. the king of making millions of different designs and names (most are awful) and of adding bloatware to everything....
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post #142 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:40pm
"first to market" usually prevails, especially when surrounded with such unprecedented hype. I think he may be talking to his own shareholders. It sounds more like a 'rallying cry'. The rest of the industry has been playing a game of "catch up" and not playing it very well.
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post #143 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:41pm
The "malicious" intent behind enabling voice guidance on European Android phones before the dictators at Google allowed it.

Google tripped the kill switch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

what the hell are you talking about???

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #144 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by justbobf View Post

Well, perhaps we will relive the classic Mac vs. PC fight of 20 years ago. We all know what happened then. Will history repeat itself? Different this time?

No. Yes.
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post #145 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:44pm
[QUOTE=hill60;1700708]/ahem, who disabled voice guidance from Google maps on European Android phones when it was enabled prematurely by hackers?

Currently Motorola is issuing cease and desist orders over the leaked release of the Froyo update for the Droids.

Meanwhile Google gathers information about Android users and makes money selling it to advertisers.

It's time some of you Droidtards took off the rose coloured glasses and stopped drinking the Google Kool Aid.





uh oh. they found out i was looking into buying a new car stereo eh? those b@st@rds!
this 'droidtard' has used the built in access point on froyo to save his a$$ 3 times now...no additional fees either.
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post #146 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:46pm
Wow, I can't wait for my free and open Acer tablet when next I 'open' my box of breakfast cereal! Perhaps they could call the product 'WindowPops' and make it out of edible components!
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post #147 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe View Post

They are the second-largest computer company in the world. Their unit shipments dwarf those of Apple.

But all we care about is Apple, so it is easy to miss what is going on in the world around us.

The question wasn't "Who is Acer on the world stage?" It was in the vein of, "Who is Acer in the tablet race?" The answer: nobody.
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post #148 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SendMe View Post

WebOS is just a cheap ripoff of Apple. And they don't have as much software either. It is always better to go with Apple.

Haven't seen the webOS and sure don't have any interest in actually buying one. I'm just interested in seeing what HP comes up with. They've got their "fans."
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post #149 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

HP. the king of making millions of different designs and names (most are awful) and of adding bloatware to everything....

I've never operated an HP PC in my life but that doesn't surprise me. HP has become the Samsung of the PC industry.
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post #150 of 236
8/23/10 at 2:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Low quality hardware? What world are you living in? The Evo, Incredible, Droid X and Droid 2 can match the iPhone and in many cases beat it hardware wise. My Evo running 2.2 is far faster then the iPhone and that can not be debated.

Your Evo running 2.2 is "far faster?" What does that mean? 2x...? 3x...? 10x...?

Which iPhone?

What does "faster" even mean? For browsing? Gaming? Snappier?

I've used a friend's Evo. I thought it was pretty cool. It didn't seem any faster or more responsive than my 3GS. There was nothing about it, save tethering, that seemed very different. Camera has more pixels than my 3GS, but the pictures didn't seem significantly better quality. It is a sharp phone, though. The Evo is the first Android phone that I thought was decent.

But your claims sound like Fandroid talk.
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post #151 of 236
8/23/10 at 3:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by roontoon View Post

Just walk int ANY apple store and you will notice that it is FULL of people. That is what they want PERIOD.

I think the free wi-fi, and free internet access has more to do with the number of people in the stores. Go look at the Apple section of a reseller, they are empty the majority of the time.
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post #152 of 236
8/23/10 at 3:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkhan2000 View Post

I'm very interested in what HP comes up with the webOS. I've always liked Palm's stuff. HP is actually a pretty strong PC brand. I'll always choose their printer over anyone else's although I'm sure an Epson or Canon or Lexmark or whatever will do a competent job.

but it takes a lot more than a printer to offer consumers an "ecosystem." if HP is serious, they will have a lot of work to do. an HP on-line media store (they can buy ... somone), HP "cloud" services (they can buy Yahoo), other integrated Web OS hardware (they can buy Vudu), and retail stores for customer service (they can buy ... Blockbuster?). and then they can make it all "just work" together.

even with all their money, it is not as easy at it sounds.
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post #153 of 236
8/23/10 at 3:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

I think the free wi-fi, and free internet access has more to do with the number of people in the stores. Go look at the Apple section of a reseller, they are empty the majority of the time.

I guess there is really a reason that Microsoft is copying the business model. You of course are welcome to your delusion. Pitiful reasoning considering the profits Apple is making. Pure delusion.

d
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post #154 of 236
8/23/10 at 3:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

In the same category (things about Android people don't realise), there are two facts that don't seem to occur to anyone.

1) Android *needs* a fragmented platform to survive at all because the manufacturers need to differentiate their hardware to compete. "

This is Apple vs PC all over again. A Dell will soon emerge, and the only thing the Android manufacturers will be able to compete on is price.

Quote:
2) Android is a cheaper copy of iOS, so a lot of Android sales, are "me too" sales and don't necessarily reflect the consumer choosing anything but a lower priced product.

If anyone needs the history lesson, the combo that won the desktop was 1 ) cheap commodity hardware, 2) Windows 3.1, and 3) DOOM.
Dishonorable mention goes to Windows 95 and IE...

As others have pointed out, many Android sales have been on the high-end. But it's going to be interesting when "cheap and good enough" devices start filling the shelves in Best Buy and Wal-Mart.
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post #155 of 236
8/23/10 at 3:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Low quality hardware? What world are you living in? The Evo, Incredible, Droid X and Droid 2 can match the iPhone and in many cases beat it hardware wise. My Evo running 2.2 is far faster then the iPhone and that can not be debated.

First. According to reviews droid 2 is not on the same league as evo, droid x or incredible.

Second. Your evo is subsidized and in reality costs around $700. So a tablet at $250 would be cheap and endup as low quality.

Finally. The iPad owns 100% of the market share so apple fanboys can brag all they want. Anyone who disagrees has to wait till an android or win7 competitor hits the market before putting their 2 cents.
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post #156 of 236
8/23/10 at 3:47pm
  1. I'd love to have a Linux based tablet computer for the same reasons that I have both Msc and Linix machines at home. That would be to leverage the strengths of each platform.
  2. Android is NOT an open system from the user standpoint. Never has been and never will be.
    It
  3. There is nothing to indicate that Android is a viable tablet OS. Proof is in the pudding and frankly Android will have significant competition. To truely be competitive against Apple one needs to have infrastructure and vision. There is potential for a big plauer to find the right leader to realize a competitive environment but right now there isn't a serious player.
  4. As far as a serious play goes, right now I think WebOS has more potential. Not because of technical superiorty but do to and organization with a vision.
  5. All these guys claiming that they will beat up on iPad need to realize that Apple will have rev two out before they even debut. In otherwords they have no idea what they will be competeing with.
  6. Speaking of competeing I have this feeling that no one in the industry understands the importance of FaceTime. This in and of itself will sell lots of iOS devices. Which highlights another important consideration, it isn't simply a matter of having software but having the right software. Apple balances that really well offering key pieces of supported functionality. This is extremely important for many consummers.
  7. Even now you can't look at iPad as a single device. That will be even less of a case if a 5-7 inch device arrives.
  8. On top of the 5-7 inch device Apple could be playing with other devices in the market. The rumored iOS based iTV for one. But i could also see a iTV tablet, that is a tablet optimized for HDTV woth an over the air reciever. In otherwirds Apples first TV might be a very portable device instead of a wall hanging panel. Wall hanging panels are a possibility too, just that entry into the small screen areba would be a snap for Apple.
  9. Some have also indicated that Apple could deliver a gaming platform. It is possible but i think they would simply tweak the smaller machines to better support gaming.

Those are a bunch of points but I think the important thing here is that it really isn't the hardware they have to compete with. The most obvious thing being that the current hardware won't be around when the are actually in the market. Even at that Apple is offering up much more than hardware.



Dave
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post #157 of 236
8/23/10 at 4:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdbryan View Post

Enterprises who want to develop apps for their own use are supported by Apple:

http://developer.apple.com/programs/iphone/enterprise/

Did you even bother googling before making your pronouncement?

Clearly, they don't work in the Enterprise landscape. Practically all development is closed source and proprietary for IP leverage.

It doesn't matter if they leverage Java, C/C++/ObjC/ObjC++/C#/Python/Ruby/PHP, etc. Their money is in developing in-house only call-center suites, test harnesses, massively redundant database deployments, etc.

They love the $250 Enterprise iPhone development license for in-house only apps that they can leverage for their personnel.
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post #158 of 236
8/23/10 at 4:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Who cares. For all that volume, they make, sadly, an annual profit of of ~US$350 million across the whole company.

I'll venture a guess that the iPad alone makes a much larger profit than that (If we assume, say, 5 million iPads will be sold this year, at an average price of $600, with a profit margin of 20% - Apple's average - that's $600 million in net income).

The SendMe answered the original poster's question of "who is Acer", succinctly, and to the point. Did he include all possible relevant information about Acer? No, but why change the topic of the answer.
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post #159 of 236
8/23/10 at 4:09pm
Why all the fuss? Have you ever heard Apple wishing about being number one in market share?
They talk about love, humanity and ofcourse money sitting in banks. Android win is inevitable but that is not because it's better. It's in philosophy.

There's this comprehensive article on this matter here
Same Apple. Same Mac. Different Take. Different Place. http://Applemacness.com
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Same Apple. Same Mac. Different Take. Different Place. http://Applemacness.com
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post #160 of 236
8/23/10 at 4:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

but it takes a lot more than a printer to offer consumers an "ecosystem." if HP is serious, they will have a lot of work to do. an HP on-line media store (they can buy ... somone), HP "cloud" services (they can buy Yahoo), other integrated Web OS hardware (they can buy Vudu), and retail stores for customer service (they can buy ... Blockbuster?). and then they can make it all "just work" together.

even with all their money, it is not as easy at it sounds.

I totally understand that. I have no intention of buying an HP webOS-based phone or tablet. I'm just interested in what HP can come up with and how they plan to fight the iOS/Android onslaught. It doesn't seem they're interested in the Android at all at this point in time. They're betting on the webOS and Windows Phone 7 and I find that strategy interesting from a business standpoint.
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