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Apple introduces iTunes 10 with Ping social network - Page 2

post #41 of 106
I cringe increasingly with each passing Apple Media Event... Apple is fast becoming a company for chavs who think they are buying classy "cool" toys to match their NIKE raiment. It's transforming into The Pig With Lipstick of the computer industry. Who was that talentless prat attempting to play piano at the end?

A deal with FOX and ABC speaks volumes.
post #42 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodshotrollin'red View Post

Who was that talentless pratt attempting to play piano at the end?

Coldplay.
post #43 of 106
The big new functionality to me in itunes is AirPlay. This will wirelessly stream to AV gear and speakers from other manufacturers! That is insanely great.

Should be interesting if they build the receivers into car audio as well.. no more plugging in.
post #44 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by initiator View Post

What's up with the UI? They seemed to have gotten rid of all color (everything is gray).

From the screen shots only (I haven't downloaded it yet) I actually kind of like the more muted coloring. What they seem to be doing is trying to de-emphasize the "chrome" of the app in favor of the content of the app. This, I think, is a very good move.


Quote:
Originally Posted by initiator View Post

And, what's with the window buttons? They're now vertical on the left side? That just looks weird.

While definitely a departure from the standard so far to date...it actually makes more sense in terms of its analogy to a traffic signal.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #45 of 106
This must be an 'ironic' post, right? Simplicity of use not as valuable as the mess that is the MS storefront?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Ping.... Bing... Really?

It's good to see that Apple is finally adopting a few of the ZUNE Marketplace's social networking features, though admittedly, iTunes is looking in serious need of an aesthetic makeover, especially when compared to the elegance of MS' Zune Marketplace.
post #46 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

why it's still called iTunes is beyond me. it's music, movies, podcasts, tv shows, books, apps and [shudder] ringtones.

While other posters have addressed the whole brand identity/recognition issue (though I think if any company has the balls to take such bold risk as renaming something if they think they need to)...one thing that surprises me a bit is that the icon redesign didn't take into consideration the multiple facets of "iTunes" (e.g., books, videos, games, etc.)

Designing a new icon with these things factored in might have been the first baby step toward re-branding/renaming iTunes. Apple tends to do these things in very carefully planned baby steps all the while acting like "Oh we just thought about doing this."

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #47 of 106
I would like to follow App developers, Book Authors, etc, on Ping and see what Apps/Books/Music my friends are downloading too. Why only music? Are music sales down? Or will they release a social network named Pong for everything else?
post #48 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by connector View Post

Or will they release a social network named Pong for everything else?

No, that's just the decomposing smell iTunes gives off.
post #49 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

While definitely a departure from the standard so far to date...it actually makes more sense in terms of its analogy to a traffic signal.

It also decreases the amount of space taken up by the top of the application, increasing the space for displayed albums, etc, slightly.

In fact, the application name is gone.
post #50 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

why it's still called iTunes is beyond me. it's music, movies, podcasts, tv shows, books, apps and [shudder] ringtones.

iTunes is already deeply embedded in people's minds, why mess with it unnecessarily? NCR stands for National Cash Register, AT&T for American Telephone & Telegraph. In the end the words in a a brandname itself lose their meaning. It's the association people make in their minds that count.

The last company who changed an established brand name for no good business reason was Nissan when they dropped 'Datsun' in the U.S. That was a bonehead decision which took years to recover from the sales hit.
post #51 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cbswe View Post

I read that question not so long ago and saw a very good and simple answer:
It would be madness to switch to a new name from one that's so very established as a brand and so strongly recognized as one of Apples core products.

That's why the Big 10 is still the Big 10 when there's 11 and soon to be 12 schools in it
post #52 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraboy View Post

iTunes is already deeply embedded in people's minds, why mess with it unnecessarily?

I actually think this is a real dilemma for Apple and I suspect they may be trying to find some way to address it in the future. Here's my totally wild-ass prediction:

Let's zoom out and take a look at iPhoto and iTunes (particularly original music-only iTunes) side-by-side. These are basically the same app targeted at different media (pictures vs. music).

However, iTunes became the main conduit for syncing with your iDevices so they felt they had to continue bolting all sorts of non-music things onto the side of iTunes. The Rube Goldberg-ness of this is starting to show.

iPhoto content is also synced with your iDevices but through iTunes.

Apple quietly made a move a while back to completely restructure the underlying organization of the iTunes folder/file structure into the new "iTunes media format" organizing things along their types.

It's all a bit of an inelegant mess.

But what if Apple did this:

- break apart iTunes into its component parts along media lines (e.g. iGames, iApps, iBooks, iVideos, iTunes, iPhoto)

- create a new centralized "home base" application that "contains" all of these "sub-applications" and handles the syncing centrally but allows you to click off to a sub-application to deal with the specific media/content type you need to deal with at that moment.

I actually think they may already be doing this sort of quietly, in baby steps within iTunes. The next major step is really just a UI restructure where "iTunes becomes a part of this larger umbrella application.

It's just a wild-ass guess. But I suspect they will need to address a major refactoring soon. This would also likely coincide with a store refactoring too. Once you break iTunes into its separate "apps" it becomes easier to present the different sections of the store as well (e.g., iBooks presents you the book store, iTunes presents you the music store, iApps the app store, etc.)

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post #53 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

While definitely a departure from the standard so far to date...it actually makes more sense in terms of its analogy to a traffic signal.

The Red, Amber, Green of the Apple menu beads behave nothing like traffic lights.

Apple beads:

Red = Vanish (to where?).
Amber = Vanish (to the bottom of the screen...) Then hunt for where it went.
Green = Expand or Collapse the Window (sometimes as each window behaves differently).

Traffic Lights:

Red = STOP
Amber = WAIT
Green = GO

Mac OS lost the plot a few years back and hasn't yet recovered. It's at the, er, Amber light of GUI design.
post #54 of 106
are aligned vertically. Ain't that interesting?
post #55 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodshotrollin'red View Post

The Red, Amber, Green of the Apple menu beads behave nothing like traffic lights.

I didn't say they do. \ They appear to have been an analogy (perhaps a poor or weak one) to a traffic signal. Visually speaking anyway.

Furthermore, the behavioral mapping isn't that much of a stretch. It might not be great (and that has been debated endlessly) but it also isn't entirely ridiculous.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #56 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Ping.... Bing... Really?

It's good to see that Apple is finally adopting a few of the ZUNE Marketplace's social networking features, though admittedly, iTunes is looking in serious need of an aesthetic makeover, especially when compared to the elegance of MS' Zune Marketplace.

The elegance of a ghost town.
post #57 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

I didn't say they do. \ They appear to have been an analogy (perhaps a poor or weak one) to a traffic signal. Visually speaking anyway.

Furthermore, the behavioral mapping isn't that much of a stretch. It might not be great (and that has been debated endlessly) but it also isn't entirely ridiculous.

"Appear"... What does that mean?

An analogy is an illustrative way to accurately explain a concept. The world knows what Red/Amber/Green means. Apples' analogy is nothing like the internationally recognised behaviour applicable to traffic lights. It's a tragic mess.

The behavioural mapping is not remotely a stretch from traffic light indicators, it's a bloody universe apart (the universe Steve Jobs inhabits).

iTunes has ballooned like a malignant tumour and lives apart from its host. Like Steve Jobs' liver, it needs to be transplanted.
post #58 of 106
\ Look, I'm not really looking for a UI debate. But...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodshotrollin'red View Post

"Appear"... What does that mean?

It means looks like.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodshotrollin'red View Post

An analogy is an illustrative way to accurately explain a concept. The world knows what Red/Amber/Green means. Apples' analogy is nothing like the internationally recognised behaviour applicable to traffic lights. It's a tragic mess.

The behavioural mapping is not remotely a stretch from traffic light indicators, it's a bloody universe apart (the universe Steve Jobs inhabits).

iTunes has ballooned like a malignant tumour and lives apart from its host. Like Steve Jobs' liver, it needs to be transplanted.

OK

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #59 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraboy View Post

The last company who changed an established brand name for no good business reason was Nissan when they dropped 'Datsun' in the U.S. That was a bonehead decision which took years to recover from the sales hit.

They dropped the usage world wide. And they had a good reason for the name change.
post #60 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

- create a new centralized "home base" application that "contains" all of these "sub-applications" and handles the syncing centrally but allows you to click off to a sub-application to deal with the specific media/content type you need to deal with at that moment.

They could call that syncing application something like, iSync...

Oh, wait...
post #61 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

They could call that syncing application something like, iSync...

Oh, wait...

So I suspect maybe you're trying to be a smart ass. OK. Fine.

I thought about iSync. Perhaps iSync is the technological backbone for all of this. Who knows. I don't really care. But I don't think that's what the "umbrella" app I'm suggesting/predicting would be called at all. I have no idea what it could be called. Someone earlier suggested that something along the lines of "iLife" might make sense, but won't be used for obvious reasons. Maybe iMedia? I have no idea. Either way, what I was trying to sketch out is more than simply iSync...it is perhaps a launching "shell (and centralized syncing backbone) for a set of newly decomposed "sub-applications" (e..g., iTunes, iBooks, iApps, iGames, etc.)

This could be a totally dumb idea. I was just trying to think about how Apple could more carefully transition away from iTunes (as both an app and a brand) being the central and prominent hub of everything.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #62 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

So I suspect maybe you're trying to be a smart ass. OK. Fine.

So you suspect wrong.

I think syncing should have been seperated from iTunes a long time ago, iSync has existed for years, and would have been a good application to tie the syncing to, it would have solved the issue of having to download 100Mb just to enable a new iPod to sync.
post #63 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

So you suspect wrong.

OK. Cool. Sorry. Always hard to read "tone of voice" in text.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post

I think syncing should have been seperated from iTunes a long time ago, iSync has existed for years, and would have been a good application to tie the syncing to, it would have solved the issue of having to download 100Mb just to enable a new iPod to sync.

Agreed. And that might be the technology platform they would use. Not sure. I guess my point was that what I'm talking about is more than just breaking out the syncing.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #64 of 106
And they add yet another "feature" to iTunes, one that I probably won't every use. I hope that iTunes 10 won't be slower than 9 (which for me was pretty slow already). Don't like the "traffic lights" and in my opinion the new itunes icon is horrid. Going to stick with iTunes 9 for the time being... On another note I am still waiting for the next iteration of iLife.
post #65 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by initiator View Post

What's up with the UI? They seemed to have gotten rid of all color (everything is gray).

And, what's with the window buttons? They're now vertical on the left side? That just looks weird.

If you minimise the main window in iTunes 9, the button arrangement is the same - i.e. vertical.

But agree it's strange to see on a full sized window!
post #66 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Ping.... Bing... Really?

It's good to see that Apple is finally adopting a few of the ZUNE Marketplace's social networking features, though admittedly, iTunes is looking in serious need of an aesthetic makeover, especially when compared to the elegance of MS' Zune Marketplace.

Really dude? Zune? You're kidding right?
post #67 of 106
At least here in germany "today" or the 1st of september is over. Well I have to sleep now. Then wake up and check out iTunes 10.

Nice update for the iPods but they actually raised the price while keeping the same storage space.

Not enough reasons to through more money at apple. But as I said, updates are nice.
post #68 of 106
I find this very interesting. People with similar musical tastes tend to have other things in common; it's definitely a better measure of social compatibility than going to the same high school. If you want to find out what losers your classmates turned into, Facebook is nice. If you want to find some new people to socialize with who are on the same wavelength, then iTunes might be the new stop . . .
post #69 of 106
can we Poke someone with Ping? or Bing?
post #70 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacHead75 View Post

More people will download iTunes which will mean millions more accounts which will result in more music, movies and app downloads. Word of mouth on facebook and twitter will help Ping to grow. Marketing throuth Artist, etc. I can see it now.... "Follow me on Ping"!

Nah.

"Ping me"

"Ping us for more information"

etc.
post #71 of 106
What's the hold up? Is iTunes 10 having issues even before they release it? It's 4:40 p.m. here on the west coast and they still haven't released the software. Just once, I'd love to get that software update prompt while Steve is talking about the software. It'd make sense that we be able to actually use the stuff he's talking about rather than watching it online and wondering how it'll work.

I also know that the patented answer is, "Patience.", but there's got to come a day when things are actually available when we're told they would be. This goes back to the Magic Trackpad I wanted to buy from the Alderwood Mall Apple Store in Lynnwood, WA, on the day they were supposed to come out, only to be told, "We don't have them yet." It's not like I was there in the morning.

iTunes 10 should have been available at the end of the Keynote, at least. The fact that it isn't leads me to be suspicious of it. Like something's already wrong.
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post #72 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by desarc View Post

why it's still called iTunes is beyond me. it's music, movies, podcasts, tv shows, books, apps and [shudder] ringtones.

No kidding. iTunes needed a new name at like... version 6? It should be iMedia or just iStore or something.

I do feel like there's getting to be a little bit of feature bloat though, I'd kind of rather have an option to do device management in its own app. I didn't mind this so much until iPad - but now it seems like kind of a big deal. It feels awkward and almost inappropriate to be managing your tablet computer through a music player...

It's funny to me that Apple insists on keeping Mail, Calendar, and Address Book as separate apps, but puts every single iOS + Store function into one program. I'd argue that my music library and the documents I write on my iPad are MUCH less related than my calendar and email inbox!
post #73 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by latafairam View Post

I dont want a new social network or care aboy showing people wht i listen to. and I dont care about "following" artists. Somehow I feel as if I am kissing their a$$ by doing that.
What I want is for my itunes to sync and manage my music. AND to share my playlist through MY network to my iPhone. Is this possible yet?

It's been turned off specifically for you because you are a troll.

I've been able to do it fine for... well for years now.
post #74 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

I actually think this is a real dilemma for Apple and I suspect they may be trying to find some way to address it in the future. Here's my totally wild-ass prediction:

Let's zoom out and take a look at iPhoto and iTunes (particularly original music-only iTunes) side-by-side. These are basically the same app targeted at different media (pictures vs. music).

However, iTunes became the main conduit for syncing with your iDevices so they felt they had to continue bolting all sorts of non-music things onto the side of iTunes. The Rube Goldberg-ness of this is starting to show.

iPhoto content is also synced with your iDevices but through iTunes.

Apple quietly made a move a while back to completely restructure the underlying organization of the iTunes folder/file structure into the new "iTunes media format" organizing things along their types.

It's all a bit of an inelegant mess.

But what if Apple did this:

- break apart iTunes into its component parts along media lines (e.g. iGames, iApps, iBooks, iVideos, iTunes, iPhoto)

- create a new centralized "home base" application that "contains" all of these "sub-applications" and handles the syncing centrally but allows you to click off to a sub-application to deal with the specific media/content type you need to deal with at that moment.

I actually think they may already be doing this sort of quietly, in baby steps within iTunes. The next major step is really just a UI restructure where "iTunes becomes a part of this larger umbrella application.

It's just a wild-ass guess. But I suspect they will need to address a major refactoring soon. This would also likely coincide with a store refactoring too. Once you break iTunes into its separate "apps" it becomes easier to present the different sections of the store as well (e.g., iBooks presents you the book store, iTunes presents you the music store, iApps the app store, etc.)

Great idea!
post #75 of 106
What's weird is that there's a link to download iTunes 10 from the Apple site, which then offers iTunes 9 and says that iTunes 10 is "available soon".

What I'm wondering is whether this is still Carbon app or if it's now a Cocoa app.
post #76 of 106
I've thought for quite a while it should be called iMedia, with all of the media it deals with. I'm sure that's too obvious, though. It isn't as elegant and creative as say... I dunno... "Ping"? >sarcastic<

Now people will get confused with that good ol' networking tool "ping".


Quote:
Originally Posted by burlesona View Post

No kidding. iTunes needed a new name at like... version 6? It should be iMedia or just iStore or something.

I do feel like there's getting to be a little bit of feature bloat though, I'd kind of rather have an option to do device management in its own app. I didn't mind this so much until iPad - but now it seems like kind of a big deal. It feels awkward and almost inappropriate to be managing your tablet computer through a music player...

It's funny to me that Apple insists on keeping Mail, Calendar, and Address Book as separate apps, but puts every single iOS + Store function into one program. I'd argue that my music library and the documents I write on my iPad are MUCH less related than my calendar and email inbox!
post #77 of 106
But what if Apple did this:

- break apart iTunes into its component parts along media lines (e.g. iGames, iApps, iBooks, iVideos, iTunes, iPhoto)

- create a new centralized "home base" application that "contains" all of these "sub-applications" and handles the syncing centrally but allows you to click off to a sub-application to deal with the specific media/content type you need to deal with at that moment.

I actually think they may already be doing this sort of quietly, in baby steps within iTunes. The next major step is really just a UI restructure where "iTunes becomes a part of this larger umbrella application.

It's just a wild-ass guess. But I suspect they will need to address a major refactoring soon. This would also likely coincide with a store refactoring too. Once you break iTunes into its separate "apps" it becomes easier to present the different sections of the store as well (e.g., iBooks presents you the book store, iTunes presents you the music store, iApps the app store, etc.)[/QUOTE]

I see one problem with this: it would severely complicate things for windows users. True, Macs could use iSync (as someone already mentioned) to sync content, but Windows doesn't have that option. Syncing would need to be built into the apps. Thus, a one program strategy is really the only option that makes sense. Apple needs to be able to maintain the software on windows and mac as easily as possible
Summer '09 Macbook 6 GB RAM, SSD; iPhone 3GS, aTV v.2

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Jesus told her, I am the resurrection and the life. Anyone who believes in me will live, even after dying. Anyone who lives in me and [trusts]...
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post #78 of 106
Does anyone know of a notification service that will let us know when iTunes 10 is finally ready for download?
post #79 of 106
never mind! i am downloading right now!
post #80 of 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by mercivic View Post

never mind! i am downloading right now!

I just checked and it said 10 was available for download. I clicked download and it was downloading 9. Then I reloaded the download page and it went to saying 10 was coming soon. Reloaded a minute later and now I'm downloading 10!
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