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Popularity of Apple's iPad helps drive down PC RAM prices

post #1 of 67
Thread Starter 
Prices of dynamic random access memory are expected to fall due to an oversupply in the market, thanks in part to devices like the iPad which use fewer DRAM components than traditional PCs.

Samsung Electronics on Tuesday warned that weakening PC sales could drive down prices on memory chips even further, according to Reuters. The report noted that there is currently an oversupply of memory in the market as sales of traditional PCs have slowed.

It stated that the sale of devices like the iPad has had a dramatic effect on the price of RAM, as mobile tablets are less reliant on such memory than PCs.

"PC sales are also taking a hit as consumers delay purchases and opt for smaller tablet computers, which use fewer DRAM components than desktops and notebooks," the report said. "The new device is gaining popularity after Apple introduced iPad and vendors such as Samsung, Nokia, LG Electronics and Dell are rushing to get a piece of the emerging market."

As those devices come to market, experts believe that DRAM inventories could become even higher, as people move away from traditional PCs. The report noted that Samsung is considering a plan to spend 30 trillion won next year on chip investment, as a "prelude to DRAM oversupply in the quarters ahead."

In June, Apple Chief Executive Steve Jobs predicted that the iPad and devices like it are part of an "uncomfortable" transition to the post-PC era. The Apple co-founder predicted that devices like tablets will eventually replace the PC as we know it to become the most popular computing option.

Jobs compared the move to mobile devices like the iPad to the U.S. automobile industry, when most vehicles were trucks because they were driven by farmers. He noted that cars became more popular as cities rose, and features like power steering and automatic transmission were added over time.

"PCs are going to be like trucks," Jobs said. He noted that he believes traditional computers will remain, but will eventually represent a smaller number of users.
post #2 of 67
I can believe this. If iPads get most of the software features of computers, there won't be much of a point lugging or even accessing my Macbook Pro, even if it's remotely from school to home.
post #3 of 67
Seriously...the iPad (and other devices) are causing a drop in RAM prices? Seriously?

There are over 1 million computers built new EVERY DAY....and the iPad is causing RAM prices to drop....right. Computer production is at an all time high. Yes, the growth has slowed but total sales are still up.

Maybe, just maybe, it is because last year RAM prices reached a high point and multiple companies jumped on the bandwagon and built more factories to produce RAM....thus we have a higher supply. Just maybe.

Don't get me wrong...I'm loving my iPad but I wouldn't go as far as to say the price of RAM is dropping caused by people purchasing iPads instead of computers.

I have yet to meet someone who replaced their computer with an iPad.

So, sounds like it is time for me to bump my MacBook up to 8GB....
post #4 of 67
... Mac sales help drive down the price of Blu-Ray drives. There is now an oversupply of Blu-Ray drives in the market because there is increased demand for Macs which don't use these drives!

I mean, volumes of iPad are quite insignificant in comparison to the overall PC market - maybe things will change, but still long way from that.

I think a more reasonable explanation would be that people are not really migrating to Windows 7, and PC sales are not picking up as much as they would otherwise. Over 80% of the Windows installed base is on XP, which has not even been available for a year now.

I would actually think slowing PC sales are a signal of something even bigger in the marketplace... people are getting sick of Windows, with all the viruses, spyware, etc. But because of typical inertia, they are not ready to make the jump to Mac yet. Exploding Mac sales are an indication that some of these people are willing to overcome inertia. This is verified by Steve Job's statement that over 50% of new Mac buyers are switchers.

In a couple of years, this could become a flood, and we could see serious market share increases for Mac.
post #5 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by macarena View Post

... Mac sales help drive down the price of Blu-Ray drives. There is now an oversupply of Blu-Ray drives in the market because there is increased demand for Macs which don't use these drives!

That is not a correct comparison at all. Macs were never expected to have BR drives. And anyways, BR drives manufacturing chain is nothing like manufacturing of memory.

1) This report does not say that prices have fallen, but rather, are expected to fall. Orders for memory are placed months and years in advance (especially with the tightening of supply in the past few years). And capacity planning is done many years in advance.

2) Not more than a few months ago, 2010/2011 were expected to become the "year of the netbook". People were extremely bullish about it. However, literally, over a few months after the release of the iPad, the market has greatly soured. The ACER president admitted as much.

3) But its not just the iPad sales that is the issue, but rather, the fact that everyone else will be coming out with their own iPad competitors, and promoting them ahead of netbooks. Netbook sales may not take a dive (I think they will) but will seriously undersell expectations from not even a year ago.
post #6 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by addicted44 View Post

That is not a correct comparison at all. Macs were never expected to have BR drives. And anyways, BR drives manufacturing chain is nothing like manufacturing of memory.

1) This report does not say that prices have fallen, but rather, are expected to fall. Orders for memory are placed months and years in advance (especially with the tightening of supply in the past few years). And capacity planning is done many years in advance.

2) Not more than a few months ago, 2010/2011 were expected to become the "year of the netbook". People were extremely bullish about it. However, literally, over a few months after the release of the iPad, the market has greatly soured. The ACER president admitted as much.

3) But its not just the iPad sales that is the issue, but rather, the fact that everyone else will be coming out with their own iPad competitors, and promoting them ahead of netbooks. Netbook sales may not take a dive (I think they will) but will seriously undersell expectations from not even a year ago.

Ah. Someone who actually read the article! How refreshing (seriously).
post #7 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by macarena View Post

I mean, volumes of iPad are quite insignificant in comparison to the overall PC market - maybe things will change, but still long way from that.


Insignificant? The iPad alone should represent about 10% of the world wide computer market in Q4 as Apple should sell about 9 million of them in Q4. I suspect even building 9 million of them, they'll have trouble keeping them in stock and wouldn't be at all surprised to learn they increased production again mid quarter.
post #8 of 67
I got an iPad and love it, only wish it had more RAM and was more PC-independent. For example, I wish it could be updated without needing iTunes and had a reliable method of importing content without needing a PC and iTunes.

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iPod nano 5th Gen 8GB Orange, iPad 3rd Gen WiFi 32GB White
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post #9 of 67
the ipad is awesome and I have one to prove it at least to myself. Does that make sense?
16 gig wifi + 3G.
post #10 of 67
Cheaper RAM for laptops and desktops!
post #11 of 67
The assumption reached in the article does seem highly unlikely. Windows PC buyers have always been more sensitive to price concerns, so one might just as easily assume that overall PC sales have been impacted due to economic uncertainty, which in turn affects DRAM demand.

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post #12 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aizmov View Post

I got an iPad and love it, only wish it had more RAM and was more PC-independent. For example, I wish it could be updated without needing iTunes and had a reliable method of importing content without needing a PC and iTunes.

It's because the iPad works in tandem with a typical computer that it can be so compact and affordable. Adding functionality is all well and good but it comes at a price. More complexity, more demands on hardware, more connectors, leads to greater weight, more power consumption, etc. all of which are undesirable in a handheld device. In time clever solutions will expand the funtionality of tablets but right now those solutions are not apparent. Keep in mind that the PC became the mess that it did when software and hardware companies tried to keep adding features consumers said they wanted.
post #13 of 67
we've been told ipad HAS NOT cannibalize apple's notebook/desktop market... now we're told ipad IS cannibalizing the pc market?!

this doesn't add up. i think ram demand has dropped and they're looking someone to blame.
post #14 of 67
So Macs suddenly don't use DDR3 RAM anymore either? The growth of smartphones is irrelevant, but the iPad is driving everything?

These headlines are ridiculous.
post #15 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by bonklers View Post

we've been told ipad HAS NOT cannibalize apple's notebook/desktop market... now we're told ipad IS cannibalizing the pc market?!

this doesn't add up. i think ram demand has dropped and they're looking someone to blame.

it's cannibalizing the netbook market.
post #16 of 67
[QUOTE=OskiO;1709459]Seriously...the iPad (and other devices) are causing a drop in RAM prices? Seriously?


"I have yet to meet someone who replaced their computer with an iPad"

Well I would say that if I'm going out to spend $500+ on an iPad yes you are correct. I'm not going to replace my iMac, iPad acts as a compliment. But I may delay buying a replacement iMac or laptop for a couple of years. So over time yes it will affect the desktop market and probably the laptop more than the desktop? Really what do I use my desktop for? Only because it has a bigger screen , perhaps word processing and editing photos but I imagine as I use the iPad more and as iPad gets more features the desktop will become less and less needed to the point at which can I REALLY justify its cost?.

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Originally by Rickers - 2014 : Cook & will bury Apple.  They can only ride Steve's ghost so long.



 Originally Posted by  thataveragejoe :  Next week  Korea Times, "I'm gay too"-Samsung



 



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post #17 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by alandail View Post

it's cannibalizing the netbook market.

More like it's killing the netbook market. Within the next few years netbooks will go the way of CRTs, 8-tracks, and VCRs as other manufacturers put out their tablets using the iPad as a template.
post #18 of 67
Has anyone checked to see if the iPad has had an impact on keyboard prices?
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Do you realize that fluoridation is the most monstrously conceived and dangerous Communist plot we have ever had to face? - Jack D. Ripper
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post #19 of 67
i remember DRAM price fluctuations going back to the 1990's. they happen every few years. except now it's the iPad that caused it
post #20 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by alandail View Post

it's cannibalizing the netbook market.

the netbook was a fad anyway. it got left behind by iphone and android phones
post #21 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by OskiO View Post

Seriously...the iPad (and other devices) are causing a drop in RAM prices? Seriously?

The logic that they are using is that the the high sales of the ipad have led to a drop in netbook and lower level notebook sales. Basically the folks getting a portable to take on the road for email, watching tv/movies got an ipad instead. Which might be true, or it might be more that folks that have a computer at home and never thought about having a 'road' machine were woo'd by the aura of the ipad and changed their minds. Then there's the schools giving students ipads, the etextbooks etc. Again, creating a pro ipad aura perhaps even for kids that figure they would be fine with just using the computer lab on campus

Regardless, the ipad only uses something like a quarter of a gig of ram and not even the faster out there. It's like 2 steps below what is going in notebooks (including Apple's). But the suppliers thought they would get huge sales for all types of notebooks and such. So now there's this huge supply of RAM (so this odd logic goes) that is filling up warehouses. And, says the logic, the suppliers will want to fire sale this RAM, particularly any lower speeds to clear things out.

Which I think they might but not to the degree that is suggested. It all depends on speeds and likelihood that it can be used in future orders. Including even future ipad models.

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(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

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post #22 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by al_bundy View Post

the netbook was a fad anyway. it got left behind by iphone and android phones

Truth is, lots of people on a tight budget bought netbooks hoping they would meet all their computing needs. Most found that to not be the case. By virtue of being a shrunken variant of a laptop, netbooks promise something they can't deliver.

Now laptops have dropped so far in price that it hardly makes sense to spend $300 on a netbook when a full-functioning laptop is only about $100 more.

What has happened is that those who thought a netbook could replace a proper laptop now know better, so that segment of previous netbook customers is looking to cheap laptops whereas people just looking for a convenient, compact device for portable use are looking to the better options than netbooks like the iPad, the iPhone, the Touch, Android phones, etc.

Hence the netbook is going to be rendered utterly pointless within about a year.
post #23 of 67
few months ago i bought a $299 toshiba laptop with a 15" screen as a gift for someone. i was shocked that the build quality was very good and no crap ware. even the best buy software installer doesn't make any trouble.
post #24 of 67
I have a netbook. I bought it to tinker with and for the most part it's fun enough. As far as usability goes the iPad is vastly superior. The cramped keyboard coupled with the teeny touchpad makes inputting data, as well as manipulating what's already there, a chore.

I think for the crowd that netbooks are aimed for, the iPad is a much better solution (my opinion). This is particularly true if you buy the keyboard accessory for easier input of large quantities of text.
Do you realize that fluoridation is the most monstrously conceived and dangerous Communist plot we have ever had to face? - Jack D. Ripper
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Do you realize that fluoridation is the most monstrously conceived and dangerous Communist plot we have ever had to face? - Jack D. Ripper
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post #25 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

It's because the iPad works in tandem with a typical computer that it can be so compact and affordable. Adding functionality is all well and good but it comes at a price. More complexity, more demands on hardware, more connectors, leads to greater weight, more power consumption, etc. all of which are undesirable in a handheld device. In time clever solutions will expand the funtionality of tablets but right now those solutions are not apparent. Keep in mind that the PC became the mess that it did when software and hardware companies tried to keep adding features consumers said they wanted.

Exactly. It's like a Shuttle is to the Enterprise

Although in the future I expect the iPad will have descendants that become totally independent - all done wirelessly.
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From Apple ][ - to new Mac Pro I've used them all.
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post #26 of 67
I should have known this was going to happen. I just picked up 8GB of DDR3 for $130. Any time I decide to finally buy a computer component, it drops sharply in price right after I buy it. I should try to make a career out of this. Anyone want to pay me $5 and I'll tell you what I'm planning to buy next so you'll know to wait until right after I buy mine?
post #27 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

He's not talking guesses about "someday". He's talking facts about now.

he said they won't be signficant any time soon. The iPad is at about 6-7% of worldwide market share this month and will be at about 10% next month. About the timeframe the article is referring to.

The iPad uses about 512 meg of dynamic ram (or is it 256 meg) - a netbook uses about 4 gigs. Replacing 10% of shipping computers with new computers that use a fraction of the ram could have a significant impact on ram supplies as the article states.
post #28 of 67
I would like to think the recent collusion awards against the major manufacturers of RAM have made a difference, making them less likely to continue such price-fixing activities, and driving down prices, but I believe that may be naive of me to ever think that, and that they will just be a little more discrete about their collusive agreements.

Movie Trivia: Where's good ole Zorin Enterprises when you need them to corner the market on chips and get those prices back up?
post #29 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by OskiO View Post

I have yet to meet someone who replaced their computer with an iPad.

We already use one iPad for a job that previously would have required a computer and we are about to do it for a second one. These aren't technically replacing a computer since we didn't have one for these jobs yet. But they did replace buying a new computer.
post #30 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

More like it's killing the netbook market. Within the next few years netbooks will go the way of CRTs, 8-tracks, and VCRs as other manufacturers put out their tablets using the iPad as a template.

doer the first time ever i dis agree w/ you

net books are here to stay
net books serve valid functions
as with dvd players
companies like coby and acer with little by little improve their products
the net book market will kill off msft low end biz
that all
i can now buy a 25 dollar dvd player that plays real nice
whats in a name ? 
beatles
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whats in a name ? 
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post #31 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

As if.

Somehow, I don't think that HDMI outputs and BD drives and 1080p screens make Dell notebooks "a mess".

I'm thinking in terms of what happened to Windows until Microsoft finally took a step in the right direction with Windows 7 and with the inclusion of so much junk just to satisfy the needs of a small minority.

Basically when someone came up with a feature they wanted, Microsoft put it in. They kept doing that with little regard for design elegance. Likewise, when the question of offering people a good portable solution came along, other computer manufacturers kept the laptop form factor pretty much intact just shrinking it. Apple, instead, has given us the iPad. It's a deceptively simple device that meets the needs of most. Right now it compliments a typical full-function computer which means it doesn't do it all. But not doing it all also means that what it does do, it does quite well.

If you have functions you want to perform that the iPad isn't designed for, the solution is simple. Use something else. I have a car and I know what it can do, hence I plan accordingly. If I have to transport an item that will not fit, I make other plans. But on a day-to-day basis, I appreciate the better gas mileage that I get because my car is not a truck. The gain in economy is worth the occasional inconvenience of not being able to transport certain larger items. If, on the other hand, I needed to transport such large items often, I wouldn't have purchased the car that I did.

This idea that a device has to be capable of doing absolutely everything that anyone could possibly imagine is not what Apple does. It's not as if Apple has to build products that make every imaginable consumer happy. But for those who get what they want out of Apple's products, no other electronics company, right now, is doing it any better. The iPad is great at doing what it does, it's clear what that is gong in, and consumers are giving a big thumbs up to the device.

More connection options, more this, more that. You have to know that the iPad would turn into a cumbersome mess if Apple tried to shoehorn it all in. The device isn't perfect and tweaking will go on for the forseeable future. But for the most part, the iPad works as intended and that's plenty for millions of satisfied consumers.
post #32 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by alandail View Post

- a netbook uses about 4 gigs.



As if.

Somehow, I get the feeling that facts are totally unimportant in some circles, except to the extent that they get in the way of a good theory. Then they are Bad.

Kind of like the reason Stephen Colbert dislikes books...
post #33 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I'm thinking in terms of what happened to Windows until Microsoft finally took a step in the right direction with Windows 7 and with the inclusion of so much junk just to satisfy the needs of a small minority.

Basically when someone came up with a feature they wanted, Microsoft put it in. They kept doing that with little regard for design elegance. Likewise, when the question of offering people a good portable solution came along, other computer manufacturers kept the laptop form factor pretty much intact just shrinking it. Apple, instead, has given us the iPad. It's a deceptively simple device that meets the needs of most. Right now it compliments a typical full-function computer which means it doesn't do it all. But not doing it all also means that what it does do, it does quite well.

If you have functions you want to perform that the iPad isn't designed for, the solution is simple. Use something else. I have a car and I know what it can do, hence I plan accordingly. If I have to transport an item that will not fit, I make other plans. But on a day-to-day basis, I appreciate the better gas mileage that I get because my car is not a truck. The gain in economy is worth the occasional inconvenience of not being able to transport certain larger items. If, on the other hand, I needed to transport such large items often, I wouldn't have purchased the car that I did.

This idea that a device has to be capable of doing absolutely everything that anyone could possibly imagine is not what Apple does. It's not as if Apple has to build products that make every imaginable consumer happy. But for those who get what they want out of Apple's products, no other electronics company, right now, is doing it any better. The iPad is great at doing what it does, it's clear what that is gong in, and consumers are giving a big thumbs up to the device.

More connection options, more this, more that. You have to know that the iPad would turn into a cumbersome mess if Apple tried to shoehorn it all in. The device isn't perfect and tweaking will go on for the forseeable future. But for the most part, the iPad works as intended and that's plenty for millions of satisfied consumers.

Excellent, well thought out analysis. Apple should use this verbatim to ward off critics who are always asking why iPads don't do such-and-such. Along these lines, did you catch the Bizarro cartoon this weekend, on the new features of the iPhone 5?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Wqo9IVCWV5...E+09-05-10.jpg
post #34 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

I'm thinking in terms of what happened to Windows until Microsoft finally took a step in the right direction with Windows 7 and with the inclusion of so much junk just to satisfy the needs of a small minority.

Basically when someone came up with a feature they wanted, Microsoft put it in.


How does Windows 7 differ? They have a huge ad campaign which claims they did exactly that with Windows 7.

What features are missing from Windows 7?
post #35 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by brucep View Post

doer the first time ever i dis agree w/ you

net books are here to stay
net books serve valid functions
as with dvd players
companies like coby and acer with little by little improve their products
the net book market will kill off msft low end biz
that all
i can now buy a 25 dollar dvd player that plays real nice

The difference is that a lot of people have yet to transition to Blu-Ray. They're still buying DVD discs and will continue to for a few years yet. It took years for VCRs to be phased out and the transition from VCRs to DVD was rapid, compared to the move over to Blu-Ray.

Netbooks will not instantly cease to exist but their market share will dwindle to the point where manufacturers will lose interest in developing them. They're not exactly a distinct product so much as really small, cheap laptops. Keep in mind that while pricing, initially, for tablets will be higher than netbooks, in time it will drop to where netbooks currently are positioned. Tablet functionality will improve, not to mention performance, as pricing drops.

While Apple has opened the door, within a year we'll be flooded with tablets covering a wide range of pricing and functionality. Many of the tablets will fail to sell well but a few manufacturers will carve out a portion of this fledgling market, and each portion is another piece of the netbook segment pried away.

It's not just about how good a product the iPad is. It's also about how poor a product the netbook is proving to be and I suspect there's not likely to be a lot of repeat business.
post #36 of 67
I think it's a red herring to think the iPad is in any way to blame here. Relatively bog standard laptops have been shipping with 2-4Gb for some time now. It's not like it was back in the 90's when a PC shipping one year would have 64Mb, then the next year the "same" PC would ship with 128Mb.

However, whilst the standard amount of included RAM hasn't changed much over the past few years device manufacturers have been through geometary shrinks as they always do, so whilst there have not been a whole lot of new DRAM fabs thrown up (quite the opposite, there have been closures and consolidation), the fabs that are there are able to make more devices for the same production cost.

As a result of that, we're seeing one of the typical cyclical DRAM gluts start to appear. Happens every 2-3 years. The iPad wasn't to blame for the last one (or the one before that, or the one before that), so it's not to blame for this one either.
post #37 of 67
The headline is such a reach.

Samsung and other ram makers are looking for an excuse to slow down production to keep prices high.

they weren't too happy when ddr2 prices dropped so low you could have gotten 4gigs for 15 to 20 bucks after rebate from reputable brands.

they don't want to see prices that low and will do whatever they can to keep the prices high.

I loaded up on ddr2 the last time.

if DDR3 drops that low. I'm loading up again. 24gigs here I come.
post #38 of 67
I heard that because of the ipad, computers some day will take up entire rooms and cost A MILLION DOLLARS!

Seriously, is this even remotely considered journalism? What does journalistic integrity have anything to do with the articles around here?

IPAD IS SO GOOD RAM IS CHEEP NOW!
rooooooooooooofl
post #39 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by ufwa View Post

The headline is such a reach.

Samsung and other ram makers are looking for an excuse to slow down production to keep prices high.

they weren't too happy when ddr2 prices dropped so low you could have gotten 4gigs for 15 to 20 bucks after rebate from reputable brands.

they don't want to see prices that low and will do whatever they can to keep the prices high.

I loaded up on ddr2 the last time.

if DDR3 drops that low. I'm loading up again. 24gigs here I come.

"24 gigs here I come"

Are you saying you're running this now with ddr2? Good God LOL. That's awesome.
post #40 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carmissimo View Post

It's not just about how good a product the iPad is. It's also about how poor a product the netbook is proving to be and I suspect there's not likely to be a lot of repeat business.

The entire network team here at work each got a netbook. On Saturday, the guy who inspected a house I'm trying to buy wrote his report on a netbook and printed it out on a small portable printer for me. On my last work trip out to Iowa, my boss chose to bring his netbook with him instead of the laptop given to him by work, and he and a woman in Iowa got into a big chat about how awesome their netbooks were (she was using one at the meeting as well.)

It seems as though I see netbooks more and more these days. They obviously serve some basic functionality for many people.

How did you land on your conclusion about them going away?
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