Popularity of Apple's iPad helps drive down PC RAM prices - Page 2

BS, really.

Talk about selective analysis. They are ignoring the fact that smart phone sales have increased dramatically over the last couple of years. It wasn't too long ago that smartphones were limited to primarily business types, and they didn't really browse the web or have that great a selection of apps.

Now that more and more consumers have smart phones for personal use, they can check their email, do their web browsing, and a few other basic tasks while they are away from home. So there is far less reason to fire up the home computer.

So if there is an impact on DRAM prices due to mobile devices, it's from smart phones, not the iPad, where most of the impact is coming from. But as others have already posted, most of the glut of DRAM is likely due to the typical ups and downs of that particular market. Trends that existed long before the iPad, or even the iPhone, even existed.

Yep... I subscribe to a number of podcasts some mac-centric, some pc-centric as well as a number of relatively unbiased ones... Some are shows but quite a few are 'first looks' type casts. Net-books are getting very few 'positive' reviews and most tend to point to the iPad and all it can do as a negative when reviewing the net-book given the cost.

I guess what it really comes down to is most netbooks are so lightweight in power, graphics and battery that even with a keyboard the iPad is often given the nod as the better buy.

netbook sales are declining, netbook company CEOs blame the iPad for the decline. Apple is expanding production, Asus is scaling back production. Anecdotal evidence that someone bought a netbook doesn't change industry trends.

There was an uncomfortable transition to MP3 players, and iPod led the way. Now there's an uncomfortable transition to smart phones with touch screens, and iPhone is leading the way. And there's also an uncomfortable transition to iPad-like devices, and yes, iPad is leading the way.

Apple won the MP3 player battle with iPod. And iPod touch totally dominates the mobile internet device market in general. There aren't even any competitors. (Unless you count Zune, but its sales round down to zero.) Time will tell whether iPhone and iPad dominate their markets, but so far Apple is looking good.

Oh, and there's one more thing. There will soon be an uncomfortable transition to internet-enabled TVs that run apps. Apple is just barely scratching the surface on that with the new Apple TV. But as always, they have a long-term plan that leverages their existing technologies. And it will likely involve iOS on Apple TV, iTunes App Store, and the giant North Carolina server facility Apple has nearly finished. Once again, Apple will lead the way.

I just can't get through life without a truck and Mac desktop machine. I always cringe when I see people at Home Depot trying to load lumber into a compact sedan.

Of course I also have an iPad and a compact sedan.

You can rent a truck at Home Depot for less then the cost of owning one. Although I'm not sure where the analogy is going...

Personally I can see us losing the desktop eventually. If these device can never have significant processing power, then they will just offload processing to a home server or the cloud. Mainly I see lightweight, inexpensive, energy saving devices. Some of them could return to a laptop form factor, but still work like an iPad. I could even see my big monitors replaced with a circle of a half dozen iPads. If they integrate well together, why not?

It's quite a feat of engineering that an iPad with 4-8x less RAM than a typical PC offers such a fluid and snappy end user experience. It really puts into perspective Steve's truck vs. car argument from the D conference. It's like driving your 18 wheeler down to the grocery store to buy some milk.

You're right but you can also rent a PC. I have always enjoyed owning a truck and I use it a lot, just like my Mac. I use the iPhone and the iPad much less often. It is nice to have a device/vehicle for every situation. I'm not even sure why I have a Windows PC since I use it very, very infrequently, but if I need it I have it. I have every form factor that Apple makes.

If I could afford it I would add a Prancing Horse to my stable.

Personal experience, for starters. I have a netbook that I do not like. Granted I'm a Mac user so the whole Windows thing is not appealing. I have a relative who works for a chain of stores that sell office supplies, electronic equipment, etc. They're feedback regarding netbooks has been negative. Apparently some customers are unhappy with them. Sales of netbooks have apparently slowed since the introduction of the iPad. The netbook form factor is intrinsically inferior to the touchscreen tablet for a number of functions, many of which the netbooks were purchased in the first place.

My netbook runs out of battery power in less than two hours. Not nearly enough. The iPad lasts considerably longer. The track pad is a pain to use and the keyboard not great for someone like me with larger hands. The iPad is very easy to manipulate. The netbook is painfully slow at just about everything. Not nearly enough horsepower. I haven't used the iPad but I suspect it's quicker. I certainly hope it is. Software bundled with the netbook was rather meagre though my standards are high because I've been a long-time Mac owner. Software for the iPad is easy to acquire and inexpensive.

Perhaps there are limited scenarios in which the netbook works better but I wouldn't put much stock in the fact that you see people using them. Once you've bought the thing, short of returning it in the first month, you're not going to take something you've paid for and cast it aside. I use my netbook all the time but that doesn't mean that I enjoy using it or would want to buy another one.

You can't expect that a product that is good for a small percentage of consumers has a future. I doubt there's much margin in netbooks and if market share drops dramatically in the next few years in favour of touchscreen devices, development of the small laptops will slow considerably. Eventually it will just stop.

None of what he is asking for in having the iPad be more independent from a computer requires different hardware. It's all software. Indeed, I fully expect over time the ability to activate, manage and sync to Mobile.Me or some other follow on service - with no dependency on a Mac OSX or Windows computer at all.

It's the next logical progression and not a big leap. For people like my father, the general purpose computer was always a non-starter. The iPad is perfect for him - and he's not alone. Don't think Apple doesn't see this as the next, great untapped market. I suspect this is what North Carolina is for - more so than for iTunes (although I wouldn't be surprised if they do that too). The truth is for 90% of people with general purpose computers at home they total overkill and more of a liability than an asset. They don't understand them and resent being at the mercy of The Geek Squad or technical friends and family. This is the sweet spot for the iPad and whatever follow-on devices Apple is planning. Devices that are computing appliances and that do a limited set of functions, and do them extremely well with little to no overhead.

It doesn't mean general purpose computers are going away, or that Apple is going to come in the middle of the night and confiscate them. It does mean that sales of them, at least to individuals instead of businesses, will probably fall dramatically. Indeed, there is evidence that is in fact happening.

I dunno, the CEO of Acer moaning about their tanking sales might have had some to do with it.

Maybe just a little...

The problem is that if you allow for the iPad to be operated independent of a full-function computer, at this time, it's inevitable that some fools will come along and whine about what a weak computer the iPad is. Not enough memory. Not enough computing power. Not enough connection options. Doesn't run OS X apps. Blah, blah, blah, on and on and on.

By making it right now a complimentary device, Apple is making it clear that the iPad, in its present form, is not intended to be a computer replacement. In time, this will probably change. Computing power will improve dramatically, memory will go up significantly, etc.

Do you, for instance, have any idea how expensive it would be to offer the amount of memory most of us would need to store what we want to store? If you're storing tons of data on a desktop computer, that frees you to offer significantly less memory on a portable companion device. Even 64GB, these days, is horribly inadequate for the average consumer. When people were storing mainly music and text files, there was no problem. But now, visual files are a very important part of the average consumer's collection. When Apple starts offering a 128GB iPad as the entry-level machine, then we can start to consider the iPad a viable desktop/laptop substitute for people who are not very demanding of their computers.

Apple does an excellent job of managing expectations. The iPad is not, as it is today, meant to be one's sole computing device. If you let that line blur, it's inviting trouble. Basically if you open the door to the iPad being a computing alternative, rather than a complimentary device, you'd better be prepared to deliver a device far more capable than today's technology allows in an affordable, hand-held, touch-screen device.

For every three or four folks with modest computing requirements you'll get one fool who wants the iPad to do it all. That fool would be rather loud and damaging. Apple is wise to not give that segment ammunition.

No. Just no. Trust me, the iPad won't replace anything. Telling you this from experience.

Why? Lemme begin... My MacBook broke then I was stuck using an iPad and iPod Touch for several months. The only way I could sync my data to it was from creating a temporary account on a laptop I was borrowing from a family member when it was no longer needed.

Not being able download/send files, view Flash (though honestly not a huge issue), and multitask got really annoying. Even more so that I was stuck getting apps only from the App Store, which goes back to my first annoyance on downloading, and the catalog was very limiting since it device is still fresh out of the oven. Even when I tried jailbreaking many of the apps were still only designed for the iPhone and iPod Touch. All while my music, movies, and tv show just sat there on the device because the rest were still on my MacBook. After a while I just said just said F* it and deleted all of it.

Didn't take until I got a new power cord for my iBook G4 with Ubuntu 10.04 LTS that I was stuck on that for month or two before I decided to sell it to get a netbook. Something I wanted to get even before Apple announced it.

End rant.

You also spent about twice the amount of money on an iPad as well, there's a point you should expect more for certain functions.

But, I think the current iPad is a very 1st gen device, and given Apple's track record with the 2g iPhone and 1st iPod Touch, their 1st gen devices age very quickly.

I have a netbook, circa 2008, and it fits the bill still, as it can run a full OS, and has more storage space than any iPad (160 GB vs up to 64 GB), and it has an SD slot/USB without requiring even more money from me. It's also not anchored to iTunes, which just kills the current iPad for me, and it just makes me think of it as a bigger version of my iPod Touch.

As I said earlier, we've already replaced one need for a computer with an iPad, not only could it replace a computer for that task, it's better suited than any laptop or netbook for that task. We will soon replace another need for a computer with one. And when they add printing in november, we have yet another place we can use one.

And part of the problem with what you said is you seem to assume that the iPad is not going to evolve. I have no doubt that in 5 years more people will use computers that are iPad like than ones that are netbook like.

The other problem with what you said is you're missing a huge part of the market. One reason for the iPad's success is that it's hands down the easiest to use computer ever made. Many people don't want all of the complexity of their work computer when they are doing leisure computing. Many more only do leisure computing.

My biggest problem with my iPad is figuring out which of my kids (ages 9-18) is using it when I need it. They all love it and all prefer it over their notebook and netbook computers. They use it to play games, watch movies, watch TV shows, read books, browse the net, etc, etc.

As much as I like the Mac I think the slow adoption of Windows 7 and slower than expected PC sales has more to do with inertia then anything else. The time between XP and Vista was the longest (5 years) between OS updates for Microsoft and even when it finally came out Vista was slow compared to XP.

It doesn't help that Microsoft's idea of XP "comparability" is to run XP on Virtual PC resulting in the totally ridiculous situation of running a Windows program that emulates PC hardware on a PC so that you can run older Windows programs.

So companies that were leery of updating their OS (and programs) back with Vista look at this and go "if still works reasonably well why upgrade?" For 90% of what people use a computer for XP works well enough.

This story is retarded.

Overall PC sales might be down, but that has nothing to do with the iPad. Are there more than 5 iPad owners out there that don't also own some other form of computer? Did anyone who bought an iPad not have a computer in the first place or cancel ever buying a computer again as a result?

At this point, the iPad is no more a PC replacement than an iPod touch is. Maybe in a few years some people will drop Notebooks and Desktops altogether in favour of the iPad, but that isn't happening now.

(Cue fanboys leaping to the defensive)

You didn't answer the question, and instead you just come off as someone who doesn't sound very intelligent at all. Acer's sales dip, and suddenly there isn't a market for netbooks?

I guess there hasn't EVER been a similar situation... Oh wait, didn't Apple's sales dip with their computers? Yeah, like a MAJOR dip. What are they doing now? Oh right, still making computers.

Netbooks aren't going away. They will simply continue to evolve.

what is the logic that says that an iPad has to be the only computer being used for it to replace the need for a computer? I've already mentioned a couple of times in this thread that our company has found places where we are using iPads instead of computers. These are places that previously we would have bought a computer for that job, but now not only is the iPad fine for the job, it actually works significantly better than using a laptop or netbook computer to do the same job.

And I use mine for meetings, both work meetings, lunch meetings, appointments. I don't even have a laptop computer at work - the iPad does everything I need when I'm not at my desk and is lighter and more convenient than any notebook/netbook computer. The built in 3G networking means I don't even need an airless router wherever I am to keep up with emails and stuff.

The iPad is quite clearly replacing the need for some computers, but not the need for all computers.

OK, so you're saying that situations like yours with the iPad have created a glut of RAM on the market, which is driving RAM prices noticably down, in agreement with the article? You think the iPad is the reason? Not global economic downturn and less people buying high-end PCs with lots of memory? That's where the bullshit lies in the article.

the companies who make the RAM and the people who make netbooks who say that's the problem, I'm simply giving some examples. Netbooks use 1 to 4 gigs of ram, the iPad has 256meg. If 5 million expected netbook purchases turn into iPad purchases, that's a lot of ram that isn't getting used that otherwise was expected to be.

My only working laptop at the time was broken.


Ever heard of a niche market?

You might want to recheck your facts - Windows 7 is the best selling verson of Windows ever, over 150 million copies. http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/new...7-licenses.ars

This is in spite of the overall growth of OSX too. There are more Macs and PCs on the market.

And are you forgetting about Classic under OSX? Vista/7 takes advantage of newer HW that XP can't; we use XP Mode in Windows 7 at work, because it's too expensive for us to upgrade the SW for LC/MS instruments, but XP as a VM has a lot of benefits, such as being sandboxed, and easy to create state snapshots and backups.

Why? We have all these huge LCD TVs these days and the aTV streams video. Not too hard to stream the desktop to the TV instead of a movie and the iPad becomes the keyboard.

Heck, they do that now.

Tools will be tools


The iPad as is is perfectly powerful today for basic needs. Right now Apple has the iPad tethered to iTunes on a computer because that's the infrastructure they have today. As soon as their next step is ready (and I'm convinced this is more what the datacenter in NC is for) they will launch it.

Just like it's obvious to rational people that the SDK and app store was planned from day one, but not ready for the first iPhone. As soon as it was ready, it launched. Apple has a long history of steady releases of features as they are ready. The cynical try to ridiculously spin that as Apple "holding back" to spur upgrades.


/cough - massive datacenter in NC...


Not if you discount media files. Stream those from the iTunes cloud in the sky. For commercial products like songs and movies, one copy can serve millions. Things get more interesting for user-created content like pictures and home movies - again, there is a certain data center rumored to be under construction...


Irrelevant. Streaming is the obvious future for these kinds of devices, not huge caches of local storage. Just look at the path being laid out with the new AppleTV.

I'm not saying I'm willing to go down that path - I will always have a general purpose computer with lots of local storage for my media. But you and I are in the vast minority, and Apple knows this.

But the evidence is there that regular users are comfortable with this idea. I remember when some of the early photo sharing sites tanked post-dot com bubble and people lost their photos. That was unbelievable to me since I would never think of having my stuff in just one place - but 10's of thousands of people are already comfortable with these concepts. I find people today where the only place they have files are in google docs - simply mind boggling to me


Not really. And I think Apple has every intention of not only blurring but erasing that line.

Jobs has stated that the desktop war is over, that they want to skate where the puck will be. Mobile devices are that new frontier. Apple is just getting started, and they won't roll out features before they are ready so this may take a couple of years to fully develop - or the transformation could be well underway by this time next year Who knows. Apple is really good at keeping their plans close and poo-pooing technologies and features until they area ready to enter a space.


For you, maybe. But not for the vast majority of people. The iPad is all my dad and my best friend's mom needs. For web surfing, email, facebook, the occasional game - the current iPad is more than sufficient. Extra power and functionality would just be wasted. Remember, you, I and everyone else posting in threads like this are in the VAST minority when it comes to gauging what "average" requirements are.


Again, those fools exist today and will always exist. You can't do anything about them so it's not worth paying attention to them. And normal people like my father don't hear them today - and he's certainly not going to pay attention to them tomorrow. The internet echo chamber is big, but it's not nearly as big as we like to think it is. There are far more on the outside than there are in here commenting in places like this.

And while annoying, Apple rarely concerns themselves with addressing such fools. They don't have to. They understand the single most important thing they can do is focus on the customer, and the customer's experience with their products. Not on what people are saying about them, not about criticism about their stuff missing "must have feature X, Y and Z" - but simply producing the best product and experience they can. They know the rest will take care of itself - and it does!

Look at how even the massively overhyped "antenna gate", with all the false information, innuendo and weeping and wailing from the blogisphere end the end amounted to.... nothing!

That's not because of Apple mind control, marketing or their "hip image" (always my favorite). It's because they produce quality stuff that people can readily see. Their success and reputation is earned, and for good reason. If they pitch the iPad as good enough to be the sole computing device for people, it will be because they have delivered the rest of the required infrastructure to make good on it. And I have no doubt it's a matter of when, not if.

I guess we'll see - but I am feel pretty safe predicting that netbooks are going away. The user experience was always substandard and full of compromises. The only people enamored with them are techies who see their deficiencies as endearing.

The ONLY thing netbooks had going for them is price - give Apple a year or two and the base iPad will be in the $400 or less range - well into netbook territory.

Not that it matters. The iPad is already outpacing netbooks today, despite the price difference.

You can pretend it's a momentary dip - however, Acer's CEO wouldn't have been commenting on it if he agreed.