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Microsoft manager claims Kinect will "blow away" iPad sales - Page 3

post #81 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ochyming View Post

\: ?

Why excuse that stupid statement?
: Isn't stupid of Microsoft to bully the iPad?
: Envy of Apple success/uniqueness.

Because Jobs fired first when he said they sold 100 million iOS devices, outselling gaming consoles. Theoretically, iOS has a greater install base for gaming than Xbox all together.

So MS fired back saying Kinect will outsell iPad, which is somewhat misleading and irrelevant. iOS in its short life has accomplished what few have managed to do in 10+ years.
post #82 of 156
Erm, surely Microsoft should be saying that it will sell more than the PS3 Move?!? which is a competing product unlike the iPad which has nothing to do with Kinect.

Seems they are trying to build Kinect momentum by loosely linking it to the iPad.

I think Microsoft will find that the iPad is selling close to the monthly numbers of the xbox 360, Kinect is an add-on not a full system and as such its sales will spike high then decline over time as the existing user base buys it.
post #83 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by irnchriz View Post

Erm, surely Microsoft should be saying that it will sell more than the PS3 Move?!? which is a competing product unlike the iPad which has nothing to do with Kinect.

Seems they are trying to build Kinect momentum by loosely linking it to the iPad.

MS is officially out of ideas.

Oh wait, that happened 10 years ago.
post #84 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by barthrh View Post

I don't see anything wrong with the comparison. If I say the iPad is the best thing since sliced bread, it doesn't imply that I believe that it is in any way a substitute for sliced bread. Perhaps ham, maybe cheese. He's only acknowledging the strong initial sales, for Pete's sake.

You are using something called a metaphor, he wasn't.
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post #85 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

I do not see a problem with the comparison either. The guy is merely saying the initial demand is strong and sales will likely be stronger then the iPad sales we have seen to date (not necessarily for the holiday). It is merely a reference to sales volume.

So ... he could have referenced it would sell more than say ... garter belts? That is a reference to sales volumes too.

I think what all the Mac people here are saying is that MS seems to be a little bit intimidated by Apple's successes these days and they can't think past trying to beat Apple at something even if it is by referencing categories that are, shall we say Apples and Oranges.
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post #86 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

MS is officially out of ideas.

Oh wait, that happened 10 years ago.

10?!!!

LOL, try 26
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post #87 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexkhan2000 View Post

It really has become Apple against the world, hasn't it?

Us vs. them has long been a popular method to sell things. Apple used that technique from day one with their 1984 ad.

And lots of apple customers are into that sort of thing.
post #88 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by nondual View Post

So 'Sells like the iPad' has become the new 'Selling like hotcakes'?

Precisely. But that doesn't stop the fans from getting all offended. They should be flattered instead, but only if their personal identity is caught up in the products they use.
post #89 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

So, you have a specialized, limited-function, programmable webCam for $150... With, say, an initial target of 20 million (one half of install base) and, say, 1 million per month new sales (including the X-Box).

If you made a similar videoCam that emphasized remote pan/zoom/focus you would have something that you could connect to an ATV or a Mac and use for FaceTime...

Further, it could be used for security monitoring... And even games like the Kinect.

I wonder what a camera like that would cost, and what the sales targets would be.

Kinect seems like a webcam/eyetoy but it's not really. It has IR sensors for tracking depth as well as a camera for video, which allows it to work in any brightness levels. The lower resolution and functionality is to lower costs and the images need to be processed quickly for tracking (no lag). Apparently, Microsoft is selling the device for the same amount they are paying for it:

http://www.develop-online.net/news/3...g-costs-to-150

and giving away a free game. This means no profit for the time being as is common with the video game market. The software analysis of the depth data is important which is why it wouldn't be simple to replicate.

A typical new XBox game will be around $60 so Kinect is costing slightly more than 2 games and you get a game with it so it's not too badly priced but it needs titles to convince people to invest in it. So far there are 15 titles listed:

http://kotaku.com/5563326/the-15-kin...nch-titles-are

Kinect Adventures (Microsoft Game Studios)
Kinectimals (Frontier Studio/Microsoft Game Studios)
Kinect Joy Ride (Big Park/Microsoft Game Studios)
Kinect Sports (Rare/Microsoft Game Studios)
Dance Central (MTV Games)
Your Shape: Fitness Evolved (Ubisoft)
EA Sports Active 2 (EA)
Deca Sports Freedom (Hudson)
Dance Masters (Konami)
Adrenalin Misfits (Konami)
Zumba Fitness (Majesco)
Sonic Free Riders (Sega)
The Biggest Loser: Ultimate Workout (THQ)
Motion Sports (Ubisoft)
Game Party: In Motion (Warner Bros.)

Lots of fitness games.

It will have interesting implications for standard games though because you will be able to break free from the repetitive character movements and the on-screen character will replicate exactly how you move. If you feel like just slapping someone in a boxing game, it can let you do that. If you want to make a rude gesture in GTA to another driver, it can let you do that too. In games like Star Wars, you don't have to remember which buttons do force push/pull/choke etc, you do the pose:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilmPq98wXcw

In fitness games, it can track your body shape and posture.
post #90 of 156
I can hardly wait for the parade.
post #91 of 156
wow, off their meds again at ms... oranges will outsell canned squid, time magazine will outsell gps devices...
post #92 of 156
What a compliment to Apple that other companies are comparing their non-related products to sales of the iPad. A little confusing, but how precious of them.
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post #93 of 156
Next Wednesday, 9/22/2010, marks the first day of Autumn. With the cooler weather coming, there's got to be a way to capture all of Majorcrap's hot air to help with the heating bills. Is there an app for that?
post #94 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron;

Us vs. them has long been a popular method to sell things. Apple used that technique from day one with their 1984 ad.

And lots of apple customers are into that sort of thing.

Maybe 5 years ago. But not nowadays. A lot of people see Apple as something trendy and cool, that you have gotta get on board if you wanna be hip.

I think "us against them" is the other way around now. Those that get Zunes and Samsung tablets and Windows phones because they're "going against the crowd".
post #95 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove;

wow, off their meds again at ms... oranges will outsell canned squid, time magazine will outsell gps devices...

That about sums it up.
post #96 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

I do not see a problem with the comparison either. The guy is merely saying the initial demand is strong and sales will likely be stronger then the iPad sales we have seen to date (not necessarily for the holiday). It is merely a reference to sales volume.

It is, but with hopes of cutting into iPad sales!

Many, WAY to many folks, will read this, hear this and go out and purchase the damn thing, only to realize, it's not what they thought. Now will they return it, and get an iPad maybe. Will it cut into iPad sales with this kind of hype YES, even if only for a short time.

How about simply stating - "With pre-orders hitting the roof, (or way ahead of projections) we see the (X) being the hottest selling Holiday Gift product of it's kind this Holiday Selling Season" - something like this makes more sense to me.

Hell, get the damn thing on the Oprah Show and let those folks decide if it's worth waiting for.

The 2010 Camero this quarter, is out selling the Ford Mustang's LAST quarter sales by 40%! DO you think folks will think that the Camero is kicking Ford's Ass hell yeah.

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post #97 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

Kinect seems like a webcam/eyetoy but it's not really. It has IR sensors for tracking depth as well as a camera for video, which allows it to work in any brightness levels. The lower resolution and functionality is to lower costs and the images need to be processed quickly for tracking (no lag). Apparently, Microsoft is selling the device for the same amount they are paying for it:

http://www.develop-online.net/news/3...g-costs-to-150

and giving away a free game. This means no profit for the time being as is common with the video game market. The software analysis of the depth data is important which is why it wouldn't be simple to replicate.

A typical new XBox game will be around $60 so Kinect is costing slightly more than 2 games and you get a game with it so it's not too badly priced but it needs titles to convince people to invest in it. So far there are 15 titles listed:

http://kotaku.com/5563326/the-15-kin...nch-titles-are

Kinect Adventures (Microsoft Game Studios)
Kinectimals (Frontier Studio/Microsoft Game Studios)
Kinect Joy Ride (Big Park/Microsoft Game Studios)
Kinect Sports (Rare/Microsoft Game Studios)
Dance Central (MTV Games)
Your Shape: Fitness Evolved (Ubisoft)
EA Sports Active 2 (EA)
Deca Sports Freedom (Hudson)
Dance Masters (Konami)
Adrenalin Misfits (Konami)
Zumba Fitness (Majesco)
Sonic Free Riders (Sega)
The Biggest Loser: Ultimate Workout (THQ)
Motion Sports (Ubisoft)
Game Party: In Motion (Warner Bros.)

Lots of fitness games.

It will have interesting implications for standard games though because you will be able to break free from the repetitive character movements and the on-screen character will replicate exactly how you move. If you feel like just slapping someone in a boxing game, it can let you do that. If you want to make a rude gesture in GTA to another driver, it can let you do that too. In games like Star Wars, you don't have to remember which buttons do force push/pull/choke etc, you do the pose:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilmPq98wXcw

In fitness games, it can track your body shape and posture.

Thanks for the good info and links.

So this is a loss leader for MS.

If they make 50% on each game, then they would need to recover $175 just to break even (direct marketing, packaging, shipping, selling, costs, aside).

As I understand, they don't make much on the X-Box, so they must be planning to make money in games.

.
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post #98 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

MS is officially out of ideas.

Oh wait, that happened 10 years ago.

More like 25.
post #99 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

Precisely. But that doesn't stop the fans from getting all offended. They should be flattered instead, but only if their personal identity is caught up in the products they use.

You do realize that your ripostes are as predictable and trite as the behavior you have appointed yourself to mock, don't you?
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post #100 of 156
According to some of our resident trolls, the iPad IS an exercise game by virtue of it's excessive weight. Put an iPad in both hands and work--pumping aluminum!
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post #101 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

According to some of our resident trolls, the iPad IS an exercise game by virtue of it's excessive weight. Put an iPad in both hands and work--pumping aluminum!

They've gone onto my ignore list. I'm done with the nonsense.
post #102 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

MS is officially out of ideas.

Oh wait, that happened 10 years ago.

MS is out of ways to capitalize on other peoples ideas.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Huber View Post

According to some of our resident trolls, the iPad IS an exercise game by virtue of it's excessive weight. Put an iPad in both hands and work--pumping aluminum!

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post #103 of 156
no, that's not the point! It just makes more sense to compare similar item to similar item. I am sure they are going to sell a ton of those KINECTS- there are a lot of xboxes out there! The real comparison is how many of their ipad type product will they sell in comparison to the ipads sales. Apples to Apples!
post #104 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by nondual View Post

And bananas will outsell mosquito repellent.

How are Kinect and iPad even remotely similar? Okay, they're both electronic. Is MS THAT desperate to say it outsold Apple? Didn't they 'win' the desktop OS wars?

I am confuse.

It's more about "mindshare" and perception than marketshare. And it is nothing new from Microsoft: remember their commercials featuring a John Hodgman lookalike? For Microsoft to react to anything Apple does was rather funny, since their desktop OS marketshare was never in danger, but I think they didn't like the fact that Apple got disproportionately good and flowing press coverage despite their relatively small market share.

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post #105 of 156
This is dumb on so many levels.

First off, entirely different products. Entirely different markets. Entirely different price points. One is an accessory for an already successful product, and the other is a competitor to successful devices (well, netbooks were successful volume-wise if not revenue-wise)

Aside from ALL of that. The iPad sells more per month than 360s.

The iPad has over 20,000 apps designed specifically for the device.

There are maybe 10 games for kinect, and none of them allow the character to move without being on rails. As of right now, no one in the gaming community sounds all that excited about kinect. The previews were huge 18 months ago, but lately everything has said that the PS move shows far more immediate promise. Kinect is considered a long-term pipe dream until a developer can make a AAA titlebthat doesn't involve me having an avatar dance on screen.

So, it's comparing two entirely different devices AND pretending people ate excited about a product they are not.

Just more claim chowder for Gruber.
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post #106 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Kinect will have high expectations to live up to

Why?
And it "will" have high expectations? Those expectations are not yet there?
Quote:
Apple sold over 1 million iPads in 28 days, and over 3 million in its first quarter. Earlier this month, analyst Katy Huberty with Morgan Stanley believes iPad production has reached 2 million per month. Apple reportedly hopes to reach production of 3 million a month by the end of the year.

What does this have to do with an X-Box accessory?

And with the name Kinect, isn't MS cannibalizing names from the dead?
What's the point of this article (as written)?
post #107 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by nondual View Post

And bananas will outsell mosquito repellent.

You bananafanboys are impossible : )
post #108 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlandd View Post

You bananafanboys are impossible : )

That may have made my weekend.
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post #109 of 156
Microsoft manager claims Kinect will "blow away"

.... well, this part of his quote may well be prophetic.....
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post #110 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlandd View Post

You bananafanboys are impossible : )

Made my day too. LOL!
post #111 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by SHOBIZ View Post

If it's not Apple then it's garbage - Big surprise on the comments.

No, if it's not Scottish, it's crap! (delivered with proper brogue).

I don't think any comment even mentioned quality or lack thereof. The issue was how bizarre it was to make the comparison. At first glance it may seem weird since there has been a lot of bravado about how much better the competing tablet products will be and this claim seems to be a tactical retreat. But there really is a tradition of identifying which product is the most sought after with little hope of buying as a Christmas present. They even made a bad movie about it starring Arnold.

So years after Nintendo takes a huge risk with a gaming innovation Microsoft finally responds and they seem to suspect that they will be unable to meet the demand they now anticipate. There are so many XBoxes out there which means the market is huge. On the other hand it looks like Apple has marshaled resources in advance to handle the expected spike in demand for Christmas sales. They even have expanded distribution so it will be easier to find a store where the iPad can be purchased.

My guess is that the Microsoft spokesman might be right. The Kinect product might leave shoppers frustrated because of how hard it is to find while the iPad will just sell in huge numbers worldwide but without the drama. They are both in the Christmas gift category so let the games begin.
post #112 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

I think the Camera interface will be the next big thing after the touch interface, and Apple missed an opportunity to put a user-facing camera on the new Apple TV.

Or maybe Apple are in fact on top of this, and the "big thing" in Mac OS X 10.7 will be to use the iMac's camera to support Minority Report style gestures?

Edit: how cool would Coverflow be if you could just sit back on the couch and flick through the albums with a flick of your hand?

I wouldnt like that at all. Think about that you moving your hands and your film exits and goes to another channel when someone sneezes. I Would have liked to have a WII-like controller for appleTV!!!!!
THAT would have kicked ass. Nintendo is probably not going to license this technology to apple because they are afraid it will compete with the nintendo WII.... But it would be awesome!!!!
post #113 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goocher View Post

... but MS just keeps on a'jumpin.

Now that's some funny stuff.
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post #114 of 156
I thought the comparison was very bizarre as well, given that the products are so different. If they were trying to make a statement about competing for Xmas gift dollars, that would have been fine. However, they were specifically predicting launch sales figures. iPad did not launch during any holiday season, never mind this one.
post #115 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by habi View Post

. I Would have liked to have a WII-like controller for appleTV!!!!!
THAT would have kicked ass.

Great idea! Once the Apple TV is hacked, it might actually be possible by adding a USB Bluetooth adapter.
post #116 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dlux View Post

Just curious what the average purchase price for a Kinect will be compared to that of the iPad. If they aren't even in the same ballpark then the tenuous connection between the two is even shakier than I thought.

Are we talking Toyotas to BMWs here?


Edit: Joshong snuck in during composition.

You also have the hype differences. iPad hype was poor after it's announcement because a lot o people built it up to be more than it was, hype for Kinect is very excited. After release it may get some bad reviews that hurt sales, iPa got good reviews & it cause people to take a second look. Pre-orders only judge whether companies have recognized a marketable niche, not whether they will succeed in filling it. I like the Kinect concept, still waiting to see how it develops before I buy one.
post #117 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by hezekiahb View Post

You also have the hype differences. iPad hype was poor after it's announcement because a lot o people built it up to be more than it was

Yeah right ... Not! ... Apparently the consumers .. (the people who actually buy stuff rather than sitting around just thinking about stuff) .. don't agree with you. The hype was so poor it went on to set sales records that other companies can only dream of.
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post #118 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Thanks for the good info and links.

So this is a loss leader for MS.

If they make 50% on each game, then they would need to recover $175 just to break even (direct marketing, packaging, shipping, selling, costs, aside).

As I understand, they don't make much on the X-Box, so they must be planning to make money in games.

.

Actually, this is potentially the first step - like MS fans in the 90's, people here tend to dismiss MS out of hand, as evidenced by many posts on this thread. If you read up on Kinect, this is just the beginning for kinect uses. The vision, and who knows if it pans out, is a whole new computer interface - think the movie Minority Report.
post #119 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

Actually, this is potentially the first step - like MS fans in the 90's, people here tend to dismiss MS out of hand, as evidenced by many posts on this thread. If you read up on Kinect, this is just the beginning for kinect uses. The vision, and who knows if it pans out, is a whole new computer interface - think the movie Minority Report.

Except that waving your hands around in the air is far more fatiguing than resting your hands on a surface. It makes a modicum of sense for certain video games, where the wired controlled is likely to be handheld in the first place.

But it makes no sense at all for general computing.
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post #120 of 156
Judging by the name, it will sell as twice as the kin
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