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Verizon iPhone would hurt AT&T less than expected - report - Page 2

post #41 of 73

Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Here's their website http://www.abiresearch.com/home.jsp.

The first article only discussed smartphones but I think the second one has it right. Both VZW and Sprint sell a boatload of broadband cards and I would attribute that heavy data usage to those cards.

Your attribution of heavy data usage to broadband cards is also, apparently, what the research report cited in your links claims. However, ATT claims they are not seeing the same usage patterns. I suppose that could be due to radically different customer usage patterns on different networks, or maybe ATT is lying to justify poor performance. Or maybe the report got it completely wrong.

Interestingly, the synopsis of another research report from the same group claims the following:
"In 2009, AT&T's mobile network experienced a huge surge in mobile data traffic. iPhone data usage was the primary contributor to the traffic surge that year causing AT&T to carry more data traffic than any other operator."

Source: https://www.abiresearch.com/research...ic+Profiles?ll
post #42 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

No, haven't you heard? Apple is Doomed ... The phone wars are over, Apple and iOS lost, Android won. It's too little, too late. Apple missed the Verizon boat. Maybe their best hope is to ditch iOS and come out with Android phones and tablets, people are abandoning Apple and AT&T in droves.

That pretty much encapsulates most of the flaming fandroid comments here!!

FTW!!!
post #43 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Android may already be doomed. The latest "Android" phones aren't even Android phones.

They're just not Google phones.
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"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
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post #44 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

How so? This is a poll of people to whom Android is unavailable: ATT customers.

Android is available on ATT. Dur.
post #45 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

They're just not Google phones.

No, they're no longer "Android" phones. Google has definitely used up its three wishes, and it's not likely to be able to stuff the genii back into the bottle.
post #46 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysBlackmore View Post

Android is available on ATT. Dur.

Yeah, sort of. They've got the Backflip. Did they bow anything decent yet? Anything of a Droid X caliber?

I'm waiting for a great ATT Android phone. The Nexus One tempted me sorely, but I screwed up and didn't investigate eBaying my 3GS until after the prices had fallen off the cliff.

Does ATT have any hot Android phones at all? They didn't used to. Even the rumored ones, with the exception of something by Dell, weren't very exciting, IIRC.
post #47 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

No, they're no longer "Android" phones. Google has definitely used up it's three wishes, and it's not likely to be able to stuff the genii back into the bottle.

Are you referring to the Samsung Galaxy S line of phones? Then run Android with Samsung's Touch Wiz UI but Samsung eliminated all the Google services. No navigation, Bing is the default search, not even Google maps is installed. So it's technically a Android phone just without all the Google services which even VZW is starting to eliminate.
"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
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"I got the answer by talking in my brain and I agreed of the answer my brain got" a 7 yr old explaining his math HW
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post #48 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Are you referring to the Samsung Galaxy S line of phones? Then run Android with Samsung's Touch Wiz UI but Samsung eliminated all the Google services. No navigation, Bing is the default search, not even Google maps is installed. So it's technically a Android phone just without all the Google services which even VZW is starting to eliminate.

Well, no, technically, it's not an "Android" phone unless Google says it is, that's why these are not marketed as Android phones, because they aren't.

EDIT: And, technically, any report on mobile OS share that includes these phones under "Android" is incorrect. They should be included under "Linux", or "Other".
post #49 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Are you referring to the Samsung Galaxy S line of phones? Then run Android with Samsung's Touch Wiz UI but Samsung eliminated all the Google services. No navigation, Bing is the default search, not even Google maps is installed. So it's technically a Android phone just without all the Google services which even VZW is starting to eliminate.

Without Google services installed by default, and not even google searches, the Android OS itself is just a giant waste of time for Google. I suspect once this becomes prevalent, Android update will slow to a trickle, and all the carriers will start to fork their own flavor of Android, with their own app market. Android on smartphone will become a messier and uglier version of Unix on PC.
post #50 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

Do rabid fanboys add anything of value to the forums? How helpful are comments like "I've got my wallet ready!! Or "Go Apple!" or Woot!!"

I personally think this forum is very well balanced now that I am here. I bring that missing tasty ingredient to the stew of meaningful discussion.

Seriously, before I came along, this forum was made up of about a dozen fanboys who posted the obvious and were met with a chorus of "spot on" and "totally agree." And if any "outsider" tried to join the discussion by saying anything positive whey were utterly ignored. If they said anything negative, they were dismissed with a "completely wrong" or "you're a troll, go away."

This forum is much better now. You just needed some leadership.

Keep it up everyone.

The joy of self-gratifying scoffing. SO important to any discussion - keeps that ignore list link limber...
post #51 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

In August, Shaw Wu with Kaufman Bros. said Verizon and Apple are in talks over the iPhone, but warned that a partnership could come as late as 2012.

And we all know how in the know Wu is. which is how he can state a Verizon gig as fact and even that it is about to happen now.

We have count papers saying the deal is until 2012. Yes it is possible that there's a clause allowing them to pay it off and get out of it. There were rumors that the wording would allow T-Mobile to get the 3gs phone as early as now and I suppose that is also possible.

But lets look at a major fact. Apple hasn't made CDMA for anyone else. None of the countries where the deal with ATT is moot but CDMA is living large got a phone for those carriers. So it seems very plausible that Apple isn't going to make one. For anyone or anywhere.

And lets face it, T-Mobile isn't totally suck. And folks sticking with them or going back to them still means less folks choking up ATT. Which is one of the supposed reasons for this Verizon deal in the first place
post #52 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

Yeah, sort of. They've got the Backflip. Did they bow anything decent yet? Anything of a Droid X caliber?

I'm waiting for a great ATT Android phone. The Nexus One tempted me sorely, but I screwed up and didn't investigate eBaying my 3GS until after the prices had fallen off the cliff.

Does ATT have any hot Android phones at all? They didn't used to. Even the rumored ones, with the exception of something by Dell, weren't very exciting, IIRC.

Actually they have a total of five Android phones: the latest which is the Captivate (rebranded Samsung Galaxy S), Motorola’s Backflip, of course the Nexus One has been spotted on ATT, the HTC Aria, and the Dell Aero. There's contrary discussion on the Moto Flipout Droid phone, but apparently also slated are the Moto Bravo and Flipside - both rumored to be Android-driven as well.
post #53 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysBlackmore View Post

Actually they have a total of five Android phones: the latest which is the Captivate (rebranded Samsung Galaxy S), Motorolas Backflip, of course the Nexus One has been spotted on ATT, the HTC Aria, and the Dell Aero. There's contrary discussion on the Moto Flipout Droid phone, but apparently also slated are the Moto Bravo and Flipside - both rumored to be Android-driven as well.

So, four Android phones and the Samsung Galaxy S.
post #54 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Android may already be doomed. The latest "Android" phones aren't even Android phones.

Not only that, but it appears that Android and others are not hurting Apple's bottom line one iota:

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2010/09/...strys-profits/


"We are also impressed with Apple's ability to monetize its innovative products through selling high-margin consumer products that drive strong earnings results and growth trends for Apple shareholders. A case in point is the mobile phone market, where most handset OEMs struggle to post a profit or even 10% operating margins (except RIM and recently HTC), while we estimate Apple boasts roughly 50% gross margin and 30%+ operating margin for its iPhone products.
In fact, Nokia, Samsung and LG combined sold roughly 400M mobile handsets worldwide in the first half of 2010 with a combined value share of 32% of handset industry profits, while Apple sold roughly 17M units over the same time period and captured an estimated 39% of industry profits, or greater than the top three global handset OEMs combined. Apple leads the industry in every metric except for unit share..." (bold emphasis mine)

This is an industry that Apple is leading in the only metric that counts for anything .... Bragging rights (marketshare) can easily be obtained by simply giving away your products and services. Google seems to understand this. ..... I think I'll stick with Apple on this one.
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post #55 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superbass View Post

Only 23% would switch to Verizon because they'd have to pay out the ass to get out of their 2 year contracts...

I will gladly pay the $350 to ditch AT&T. I can then sell my iPhone 4 for $350, shell out another $200 for the Verizon iPhone plus other charges; and have a phone that works everywhere I do.

I don't have internet connectivity at the local international airport, I don't have connectivity at my office, and when I do get a 3G signal - the data rate is pathetic. It's a 3G connection, but the data transfer rate is along EDGE speeds. When I was with Verizon, I never experienced a drop call with the frequency I have with AT&T. I've had more dropped calls in the past 6 months with AT&T than I've had with 14 yrs with Verizon.

So, will I drop $500 to drop AT&T? In a heartbeat.
post #56 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newtron View Post

How so? This is a poll of people to whom Android is unavailable: ATT customers.

Because part of the android is doomed when the iPhone goes multicarrier is that a huge percentage of AT&T iPhone customers will jump ship to the new carriers and buy iPhones, thereby suppressing android sales. If the mass exodus does not occur then there is less suppression of android sales
post #57 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

Really? You find NO truth in any of my words?

Individually, there's some truth in your words, but not when taken as sentences.
post #58 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

What are you, some kinda ATT fanboy?

A lot (deliberately vague) of people want Verizon to get the iPhone. It's not about ATT vs Verizon and "who's number one", it's about everyone getting the iPhone and increasing the value of Apple's stock. And that will happen when the iPhone is opened up to multiple carriers in the USA. Not because ATT is "better" but because no carrier is everywhere.

So put down the pom poms, okay?

AT&T fanboy? No not really. The reason why I said that was because people were saying that once AT&T loses it's exclusivity of the iPhone, AT&T is finished, it's over for them blah blah. But according to this report, it's unlikely that will happen. But thanks for your opinion though.
post #59 of 73
As a New Yorker, I think the Verizon iPhone adoption would be quite high here, much higher than 23%. I know so many people here that will never re-up with AT&T because of the continuing poor call reliability, even though it is a bit better now than at its worst.
post #60 of 73
I still have a hunch that there will be a Verizon-capable 3G iPad announcement in January. Here's some evidence and rumors to support my gut feeling:

1. Verizon's CEO will be delivering a keynote at CES in January
2. Apple is rumored to have bought a bunch of CDMA chipsets
3. January is when the first iPad was announced
4. January is a terribly awkward time to announce any new iPhone

On the other hand, we all know there will be an upgraded 2011 model iPad next year. And that's too important a product announcement for anyone but top Apple brass (Steve) to deliver. So my thinking is that the Verizon iPad will be a variant of the current 2010 model.

Verizon would essentially get a 2010 iPad with CDMA. AT&T would get the new 2011 iPad, of course, and also continue to sell the 2010 iPad. And why would Apple want to keep the old one around? To fend off low-priced competitors. I think Apple will drop the price of the old iPad by $100, whether or not Verizon gets it. Instant Galaxy Tab killer: cheaper with a bigger screen and it works with the massive Apple ecosystem. With no extra engineering effort.

And why would Apple want to do an iPad deal with Verizon before an iPhone deal? Because it's simpler. Especially if Verizon does a no-contract deal like AT&T's. Verizon is the "King of Lock-In" among US carriers, and we've seen what they did to Android. They replaced the Marketplace weedpatch with their own walled garden V CAST store, replaced Google search with Bing, and removed all mention of Android. So Apple may be testing the waters and seeing if Verizon will play nicely before doing an iPhone deal with them.

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post #61 of 73
Question: Do you plan to switch to Verizon should the iPhone become available?

Answer: 23% Absolutely, I want to switch to Verizon.

Question: Did you know you may have to pay an early termination fee as high as $325?

Answer: 12% Yeah, I know. I still want to switch to Verizon.

Question: Did you know you will need to buy a new iPhone that works on Verizon's network for $199-299?

Answer: 6% Uh Yeah, I knew that. I still want to switch to Verizon.

Question: Did you know your new iPhone V comes preloaded with the vApp Store, vTunes and vNavigator software?

Answer: 3% Oh Really? I still want to switch to Verizon.

Question: Did you know your new iPhone V comes preconfigured to use Microsoft's "Bing for Everything" service?

Answer: 2% Your messing with me right? I can change that right?

Question: Did you know you can't?

Answer: 1% I had a feeling you were going to say that.
post #62 of 73
at Johnny Mozzarella’s post. He may have found a new way to do surveys.
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post #63 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Mozzarella View Post

Question: Do you plan to switch to Verizon should the iPhone become available?

Question: Did you know you can't?

Answer: 1% I had a feeling you were going to say that.

post #64 of 73
Despite Verizon's tyrannical practices, AT&T is making it easier for them.

A Map Of Wireless Dead Zones In San Francisco: Every Single One Is AT&T
post #65 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Most people have better things to do with their lives then troll an Apple forum. While I agree there are some negative views on this forum most of us own Apple products in some cases like myself many Apple products and a ton of Apple stock.

So just because everyone doesn't always agree or may say something negative about a product doesn't make them a troll or hater.

I know I am wasting my time even bringing this up.

Yeah, you probably are.

You don't really have much credibility claiming to own, "a ton of Apple stock," since pretty much all you do here is talk about how much Apple and Apple products suck, and how much better competing products (Windows, Android, ...) are. I suppose it's possible that you do, and you are just a self destructive or totally irrational person, but, it seems unlikely you are that irrational.

As far as owning Apple products, your claims are equally mystifying: why would someone as relentlessly negative as you own all these Apple products? Sure, some professional trolls/astroturfers will have this stuff, so they can seem to know what they are talking about, but it doesn't make any sense that someone totally negative on Apple would spend his own money on Apple products. Yeah, I know, supposedly, they gave you an iPad at work, but, did they give you "many" Apple products? I seriously doubt it. So, why exactly are you spending all this money with a company you think sucks on products you think suck?

Apparently, assuming they aren't paid by someone, there apparently are some number of people who don't have better things to do with their lives.

No, just because everyone doesn't always agree or may say something negative about a product doesn't make them a troll or hater. But, when that's all they do, when they have nothing but negativity, when they behave like Newtron or Blackintosh, they aren't hanging out on an Apple focused site for any purpose besides trolling and expressing hate.
post #66 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

Do rabid fanboys add anything of value to the forums? How helpful are comments like "I've got my wallet ready!! Or "Go Apple!" or Woot!!"

I personally think this forum is very well balanced now that I am here. I bring that missing tasty ingredient to the stew of meaningful discussion.

Seriously, before I came along, this forum was made up of about a dozen fanboys who posted the obvious and were met with a chorus of "spot on" and "totally agree." And if any "outsider" tried to join the discussion by saying anything positive whey were utterly ignored. If they said anything negative, they were dismissed with a "completely wrong" or "you're a troll, go away."

This forum is much better now. You just needed some leadership.

Keep it up everyone.

Actually its not true that this place is just Fanboyism. Every product announcement brings out the naysayers. That said, I think people like you, if you keep it civil ( which you do) are useful.

Boring if we all agreed.
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post #67 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

Actually its not true that this place is just Fanboyism. Every product announcement brings out the naysayers. That said, I think people like you, if you keep it civil ( which you do) are useful.

Boring if we all agreed.

Actually, no, I don't think he's useful at all. If we didn't have these trolls around, we could actually have meaningful discussions on these topics, instead of people just wasting time countering bullshit from trolls.

We would never all agree, but, if the trolls weren't here, the disagreements could be explored in a meaningful way.
post #68 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Actually, no, I don't think he's useful at all. If we didn't have these trolls around, we could actually have meaningful discussions on these topics, instead of people just wasting time countering bullshit from trolls.

We would never all agree, but, if the trolls weren't here, the disagreements could be explored in a meaningful way.

I can take 'em. PM me when there is trouble.
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post #69 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltraSPARC View Post

I've heard bad areas in NYC, but the DC area is just horrible. When you have service it's great! But what you may have one minute is gone the next. This is especially true when crossing any of the bridges or riding along the GW parkway. It's almost as if the Cell towers get confused on where I'm going. I'll have full bars, then none, then full bars again. This is the case with every single iPhone I've owned (3G on up to the 4). I purposely bought my iPhone 4 without renewing (paid full price - but I'll sell it when I switch) so that I could switch over to VZ as soon as possible when they get the iPhone. It's sad when my GF is talking on her 4 year old feature phone on VZ and doesn't have a single problem in the car, and I had 3 dropped calls during the same exact time.

I don't drive the GW parkway but other than one oddball building in Arlington my iPhone 4 has been pretty solid in the DC metro area. VZW has a huge dead spot right around where I work and rumor has it that they'll be adding a tower nearby someday. I can't get a decent signal on my HTC Incredible to save my life.

YMMV but AT&T in the northern DC metro area has been great (Rockville, Bethesda, etc).
post #70 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackintosh View Post

From what I hear, ATT may be a different animal now than they were three years ago. Three years ago they were the same animal they were a decade ago. I guess Apple has been pressuring them into doing better as implied at the D 8 conference. Either that or they realize that this is a massive market to be in and they need to be a competitive part of that. Glad they finally smelled the coffee.


I agree.
post #71 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by plovell View Post

Prophecy is false. Steve B can't possibly last until 2015.

Sure he can. He will just continue to suck the life out of Microsoft and therefore live forever as their Idiot in Chief.
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post #72 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by LewysBlackmore;

That pretty much encapsulates most of the flaming fandroid comments here!!

FTW!!!

Why, thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism;

His post was sarcastic.

PS: The Temherte slaqî really needs to get used more. How we can have internet forums without a sarcmark is beyond me. This type of mark will be common punctuation one day. Its easy to use on on a Mac: Option+1 = ¡.

It truly is strange that we have arrived at the stage of human evolution whereby sarcasm needs to be indicated as such. Ah, sarcasm, how short-lived thou were.
post #73 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Superbass View Post

Only 23% would switch to Verizon because they'd have to pay out the ass to get out of their 2 year contracts...

That and there's no guarantee that the package that Verizon will offer will be as good as the unlimited one that AT&T continues to have (grandfathered in) or that Verizon wil have the bandwidth to handle all the extra traffic from new subscribers.

Of course it would be novel to be able to use it as a phone without standing on my roof wearing a tinfoil hat..
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