My Statement to Nations That Hate the US - Page 6

You're entirely amusing,

but probably just missed the point.

The "Ugly American" stereotype is what Europe thinks of us. Such headlines appeared in many Euro newspapers when the US Golf team beat PGA Europe in that tournament a few years back.

What, what, what?!?! Please explain this more, i think you were trying to make a point but someone kidnapped your body and pressed the Add Reply button before you typed it. or else somebody better call the US soccer team before they beat anymore European teams! This could lead to WW3!

[quote]Originally posted by Outsider:
<strong>You're entirely amusing,

but probably just missed the point.

The "Ugly American" stereotype is what Europe thinks of us. Such headlines appeared in many Euro newspapers when the US Golf team beat PGA Europe in that tournament a few years back.

What, what, what?!?! Please explain this more, i think you were trying to make a point but someone kidnapped your body and pressed the Add Reply button before you typed it. or else somebody better call the US soccer team before they beat anymore European teams! This could lead to WW3! </strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> No, it's really simple enough.

[quote]Originally posted by sjpsu:
<strong>
Get off your highly pious horse about swearing. I used it to puncuate my message, not as a substitute for the message itself. </strong><hr></blockquote>

Well then that makes it okay.

[quote]<strong>As for name calling- We've settled that issue way back in page one. It's clear that throughout SDW2001's posts, name calling is a vital part. Just think of how many times he used the word "liberal," which he clarified to mean as a "curse" word. Please, you're hypocritical to criticize me.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Nothing hypocritical about me. I don't call people names and I don't swear at them. You were complaining about people belittling each other while you were do precisely that. Who's the hypocrite?

[quote]Originally posted by spaceman_spiff:
<strong>

Nothing hypocritical about me. I don't call people names and I don't swear at them. You were complaining about people belittling each other while you were do precisely that. Who's the hypocrite?</strong><hr></blockquote>

You are a hypocrit through your inaction. You critized me alone while leaving SDW2001, a valid part of this discussion, unscathed while he spoke of "liberal" this and "liberal" that.

[quote]Originally posted by spaceman_spiff:
<strong>
Well then that makes it okay.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yes, it does. Do you not see the distinction or are you just against "swearing" generally speaking? Using colorful swear words to puncuate an argument is fine in discussion.

[quote]Originally posted by spaceman_spiff:
<strong>And BRussell's MO is to police my posts.</strong><hr></blockquote>haha

It's only because I see potential in you. Granted, as yet utterly and completely unrealized, but potential all the same.

Uh, what 's this thread about again? Something about pets maybe?

Well it looks like Spaceman-Spiff and SW ( whatever ) got someone elses ire up with their redneck attitudes. It doesn't look like this ones letting go ether. Well guys now you know not everybody thinks like you ( thank god ).

I just got tired of arguing the point. Which really didn't matter. All they wanted was to have the last word. I suppose they would have seen it as some " big " victory or something.

So spaceman are you going to start sending them private messages also. Calling them a troll for having a different opinion. Anything to win an arguement. SW editing his posts so he could backpeddal better.

Pretty bad.

But, hey, if you guys want wallow in your own opinions, by all means do so. Just don't expect the rest of the world's foreheads to slope backwards in agreement.

[ 06-12-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by jimmac:
<strong>Well it looks like Spaceman-Spiff and SW ( whatever ) got someone elses ire up with their redneck attitudes. It doesn't look like this ones letting go ether. Well guys now you know not everybody thinks like you ( thank god ).

I just got tired of arguing the point. Which really didn't matter. All they wanted was to have the last word. I suppose they would have seen it as some " big " victory or something.

So spaceman are you going to start sending them private messages also. Calling them a troll for having a different opinion. Anything to win an arguement. SW editing his posts so he could backpeddal better.

Pretty bad.</strong><hr></blockquote>

Yep.

[quote]<strong>But, hey, if you guys want wallow in your own opinions, by all means do so. Just don't expect the rest of the world's foreheads to slope backwards in agreement.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

I called you a troll because you were trolling. Which is what you are now doing again. But I suppose it comforts you to believe it was just because you have a different opinion.

Notice, sjpsu, jimmac's colorful use of the word "redneck" and his word picture, "foreheads to slope". It's a little clunky but he's implying that somone's a neanderthal. I wonder who?

Oh well. I guess I shouldn't mind because he's just so earnest.

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> you are hilarious. both of you.

[ 06-12-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by BRussell:
<strong>haha

It's only because I see potential in you. Granted, as yet utterly and completely unrealized, but potential all the same.</strong><hr></blockquote>

I'm sure there are other, more promising acolytes who could better benefit from your attentions.

Damn good thread. Where's G4Dude? We should get Eman in here to brief him about the current state of world affairs. He'll need it for 10th grade history class... <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />

[ 06-12-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>.
For your information, I generally only edit my posts for content immediately atfter posting......anything else is pure spelling and/or grammar correction. I didn't backpedal at all.
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Unless anyone has documented posts, we'll have to take SDW's word on this.
[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>.
As far as my "redneck" attitude.....that is interesting, because I consider myself to be about as far from a redneck as one can get. The fact that I support Bush and think democracy is right doesn't make me so.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Agreed.

[quote]Originally posted by digix:
<strong>The goverment of the United States of America, like any other offical goverments in the world, are merely just puppets controlled by the same puppeter.

This puppeter, created, divided, and ended a goverment as he wish.

Puppets are played to fight against other puppets, and in the same time some puppets are played to make peace with other puppets.

People who aren't in the know, thought that the puppets are acting on their own.

Imagine a puppet beat you up regulary, at some point, you will harbor an animosity toward the puppet. But unknown to you, the puppet is merely just controlled by the puppeter. Even if you destroyed the puppet, the puppeter will just use another puppet to fool you, and even worse, you too can be played by the puppeter like a puppet.

Folks... Our true enemy is currently hiding and using puppets so that we will fight against each other.</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
This reveals a poor understanding of how our government actually works.

Spaceman and SW,

Aw, you little knucklewalkers you. I don't really believe you guys are rednecks. I just got tired of the liberal this and that and " flaming liberal " comments.

Spaceman, I suppose BRussell is a troll also for " policing your posts "?

Lets face it we aren't going to change each others minds.

By the way I thought the sloping foreheads fit in nicely and wasn't clunky at all.

I also believe in democracy that's why I don't like Bush.

Also I am basically in earnest as in the importance of being by Oscar Wilde ( another flaming liberal ).

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />

[quote]Originally posted by yogisfunhouse:
<strong>

Don't be such an idiot. How are people supposed to pay for travel, accomodation and food to and at these demonstrations? I don't know... duuuuh, with money??? <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> Or how about having excellent guest speakers to come in and lecture - that requires money you know. The rental of the space to fit hundreds of people inside kind of needs to be paid for in money.


I have given you some good examples of how IMF policies have ****ed nations up beyond repair. If you want, I can give you web address where you can read about why. Oh wait, you don't want to hear anyone else's side but your own.

Also, if you actually want to learn about what really happened in Seattle, go out and watch "This is what democracy looks like". It was shot on the streets of Seattle and it shows an unbiased account of how the police reacted to peaceful protestors.</strong><hr></blockquote>

My god are you really this immersed in this bull? An unbiased account that You recommend with your unbiased point of view? How about if i recommend one, and i am whole heartedly against you on all of this. Would you say hmm wow that was unbiased? I was wrong. Same film different edit.

For god sake open your eyes your an extremist who is feeling the full weight of non existent oppression on your neck. You make money, pay for your accomdations and speakers from your pocket. Support your belief financially, well wait that's some else responsibility, as well as Emotionally. Then gather your wits and ask yourself who is there to stop violence? Uhm police and when someone... and of course not your peaceful people, definitely someone kind of oppression conspiracy here too... starts to become violent what should they do? Well for gods sake they should have a meeting and in the meeting decide who is the active demonstrator screaming and throwing things harmlessly and who the one throwing them maliciously is. No that won't work... here's a better one let's try this for a peace keeping effort, we'll run in and knock the heads of the quiet ones sitting down with the hope that the ones running all over will get the clear message that only those peacefully demonstrating will be knocked on the head those running, fighting, throwing things, and looting we'll let go to be a warning to the... uhm well damn that didn't work. So how about if we round up those who appear to pose a threat to others and sort it out from there, reasonable peaceful demonstrators will be able to rationally understand that this is an effort to keep Peace within a situation that is no longer peaceful.

Not for you though, nope your going to laydown and be as uncooperative as you can so that the bad guys can not break this up because they are just trying to oppress your freedoms and opinions.

Bahh the train left you missed it go home.

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: Ruhx ]</p>

SW, SW, SW,

" That's just plain ignorant. "

Like most of his kind I think Bush represents less freedom ( although he preaches otherwise ). I don't think he is a good choice for president. Hence my statement ( well that and to get under your skin ).

Aren't you speaking of yourself? After all I'm sure you have said worse about certain democrats. So it comes down to this after all. People who don't agree with your political choice are ignorant. There is no other way to take your statement. Lame, lame, lame.

My descriptive statements ( mostly in fun ) were aimed at your viewpoints on the world and it's problems not your political choices. So sorry, you can't try that tact.


<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>

[quote]from RHUX:
My god are you really this immersed in this bull? An unbiased account that You recommend with your unbiased point of view? How about if i recommend one, and i am whole heartedly against you on all of this. Would you say hmm wow that was unbiased? I was wrong. Same film different edit.

For god sake open your eyes your an extremist who is feeling the full weight of non existent oppression on your neck. You make money, pay for your accomdations and speakers from your pocket. Support your belief financially, well wait that's some else responsibility, as well as Emotionally. Then gather your wits and ask yourself who is there to stop violence? Uhm police and when someone... and of course not your peaceful people, definitely someone kind of oppression conspiracy here too... starts to become violent what should they do? Well for gods sake they should have a meeting and in the meeting decide who is the active demonstrator screaming and throwing things harmlessly and who the one throwing them maliciously is. No that won't work... here's a better one let's try this for a peace keeping effort, we'll run in and knock the heads of the quiet ones sitting down with the hope that the ones running all over will get the clear message that only those peacefully demonstrating will be knocked on the head those running, fighting, throwing things, and looting we'll let go to be a warning to the... uhm well damn that didn't work. So how about if we round up those who appear to pose a threat to others and sort it out from there, reasonable peaceful demonstrators will be able to rationally understand that this is an effort to keep Peace within a situation that is no longer peaceful.

Not for you though, nope your going to laydown and be as uncooperative as you can so that the bad guys can not break this up because they are just trying to oppress your freedoms and opinions.

Bahh the train left you missed it go home. <hr></blockquote>

I just had to repost this, as a nomination for the most incomprehensible post to grace the fine pixels of famed Appleoutsider . . .do I hear any ayes in favour?


.would it (or this) qualify for that rarest of catagories the coveted "trolling" post?!?!?

[quote]Originally posted by pfflam:
<strong>
.would it (or this) qualify for that rarest of catagories the coveted "trolling" post?!?!? </strong><hr></blockquote>

It just might however it's a point made with irony from the other side of the fence. I flamed you yes, but your post struck me with just the right/wrong cord.

Incomprehensible though?

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: Ruhx ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by pfflam:
<strong>

I just had to repost this, as a nomination for the most incomprehensible post to grace the fine pixels of famed Appleoutsider . . .do I hear any ayes in favour?


.would it (or this) qualify for that rarest of catagories the coveted "trolling" post?!?!? </strong><hr></blockquote>

Aye. I skimmed over the rubbish also.

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>




That's just plain ignorant. <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>

Plainly ignorant? Ignorant to what? Quite contrary to your statement, jimmac is completely aware of Bush's poor democratic record. For instance, was it not Dick Cheney who spoke out against the idea of democratic criticism of the President during the "war"? How completely undemocratic of the Bush White House. Sure, Bush sends our troops to fight for democracy, and he believes in its core concepts. Yet, when political pressure intensifies.... *poof*

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by pfflam:
<strong>SDW = your an idiot. And global warming is real, and we better think about new models of dealing with the world because what we decide is important will effect all of the world in the furure.</strong><hr></blockquote>

You know pfflam, and the other supports of his/her points of view, this is exactly why things are bad. Your need to jumpin and fix it! Yes the industrail revolution added immense polution and there is an effort needed to clean it up. However the "we need to decide" is what bothers me. We need to take our cues from our enviroment, not graft onto it.

As an example there were a group of ecologist working to solve the ozone problem a while ago. Their solution involved adding iron to the Antarctic ocean to inspire growth of plankton, there by adding more oxygen and reducing carbon dioxide with one of the most abundant forms of plant life we have. Sounds good, but what is the other side of the coin? Would the plankton starve the fish of needed gases in the water? Would it through off the balance of oxygen we breath? I don't know and don't pretend to. I do know that a drastic change on a global scale in the short term is not good. Ala industrial revolution.


What we need are studies showing what our enviroment is doing to compensate. There is an undeniable balance to nature and it corrects itself, slowly, most often impercetibly. But with people who can percieve and prove theories about the weigh and expanse of the universe there must be some who can percieve the changes.

Enhance them and work in moderation.

[quote]Originally posted by Ruhx:
<strong>

What we need are studies showing what our enviroment is doing to compensate. There is an undeniable balance to nature and it corrects itself, slowly, most often impercetibly.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

You have an excellent point. However, I think we are talking about preventive measures such as Kyoto rather than corrective ones such as your story. That said, I think we can all agree that eliminating or greatly reducing our use of fossil fuels and other pollutants will benefit the environment.

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by sjpsu:
<strong>

Plainly ignorant? Ignorant to what? Quite contrary to your statement, jimmac is completely aware of Bush's poor democratic record. For instance, was it not Dick Cheney who spoke out against the idea of democratic criticism of the President during the "war"? How completely undemocratic of the Bush White House. Sure, Bush sends our troops to fight for democracy, and he believes in its core concepts. Yet, when political pressure intensifies.... *poof*

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

So your point here is what, it was the right time to strike with "democratic criticism"?

[quote]Originally posted by Ruhx:
<strong>

So your point here is what, it was the right time to strike with "democratic criticism"?</strong><hr></blockquote>

That's a political question you're asking me.

(By the way, "democratic criticism" is not a special kind. "democratic" is simply an adjective used to describe who the critics are: aka- criticism from democrats. I apologize if I was unclear. Retrospectively, I should have written it the latter way.)

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by sjpsu:
<strong>

That's a political question you're asking me.

(By the way, "democratic criticism" is not a special kind. "democratic" is simply an adjective used to describe who the critics are: aka- criticism from democrats)

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

I thought this was a political dicussion <img src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" /> and i used the term "democratic criticism" as i did for exactly the reason you suggest. It was the political party of democrats alligning to oppose the republican party. There by making it a special kind of democratic. The special being the differentiation of the political beliefs we all hold, a democratic society, as opposed to those you hold the for the democratic party.

<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> Please. You don't understand what you are talking about.

[quote]Originally posted by sjpsu:
<strong> <img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> Please. You don't understand what you are talking about.</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> please enlighten me then. Were you speaking of the democratic party in your post or the freedom of speech inherent in democracy being exercised by the democrats.

edit for demon content no exorcisms here

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: Ruhx ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by Ruhx:
<strong>

<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> please enlighten me then. Were you speaking of the democratic party in your post or the freedom of speech inherent in democracy being exercised by the democrats.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Both. The democratic party has a right to criticize whoever they choose. Cheney's lambasting the very idea of criticizing the president during the "war" is undemocratic.

[ 06-13-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

Looks like the scales have tipped towards the "left."

SDW2001,

Give me an extra big break. Everything you have said and your demeanor drips with close mindedness.

During republican rule the people of the United States have lost more personal freedoms than at any other time. Bush didn't need to tell me anything. Who stands up of for all these right wing agendas like taking away a woman's right to choose? The problem these days is the democrats are almost as bad. So we end up with milktoast candidates like we had last time.

Yes, from Watergate to the Contras I've seen it all. You know what? It stinks.

Listen bucko, I'd wager I've been around a lot longer ( 30 is still young to me which was almost 20 years ago, just about the average age of people on this forum ) than you so I don't need any lessons in right wing politics. I respect the opinions of people younger than myself until they try to tell me something I know is a bunch of horse sh*t.

[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by jimmac:
<strong>( 30 is still young to me )</strong><hr></blockquote>

I guess that would make me the 18 year old political maverick?

Hey there's nothing wrong with being young ( after all I was there once ) but, When I hear crap like what I hear coming from some of these guys it's like deja vous.

By the way I think it's great that there are young people like yourself who can still question. It gives me hope. But, as for the rest hasn't the human race learned anything from the past?

It's really quite disheartening to hear the same closeminded garbage that I heard when I was a boy. I mean one would hope for some progress instead of going backwards. But I guess these bad apples are always around.

But, here's to you, your kind, and the future.



[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>
Oh give me a BREAK. Poor democratic record? I'd LOVE to hear about that. That is just a stupid statement.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

You wouldn't consider Cheney's comments the epitome of democracy now would you? As far as my statement being labled "stupid-" No, sir, you honestly do not intend to offend my intelligence now do you?

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>
And I'm sorry, just because we have the RIGHT to criticize the President and the war doesn't mean we HAVE too.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Well... yes, I agree that having the right does not mean that one may freely exercise it anyway one chooses (Akin to the situation of "buying a high-priced sporting event ticket and freely yelling injurious epithets at players).

Yet, that is irrelavent to my point. Cheney criticized that very right to criticize the President during a time of "war."

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>
And, I am convinced most of the criticism was for political gain.....not due to true beliefs.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" /> Democrats could enjoy politcal gain regardless of motive. To say that politics is not a part of true beliefs to polititians reflects a poor understanding of the political process.

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>
AND....your last comment about Bush giving up democracy .....I have one thing to say: WHAT THE F.UCK? What are you talking about?
</strong><hr></blockquote>

I should have clarified my statement to convey that when political pressure intensifies, Bush is willing to sacrifice some long and dearly held democratic principles. Like what? Dick Cheney's criticism of the First Amendment (which, ironically, is protected by the first amendment itself) Jeopardizing separation of Church and State- aka some "Faith Based Initiatives."

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>
I truly and honestly believe your statement IS ignorant, not to mention totally unsupportable.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

Earnest adverbs like "truly" and "honestly" should not replace actual support of an argument. Do you honestly (no pun or mocking intended) want us to take your word???

[quote]Originally posted by SDW2001:
<strong>
Bush does not represent less freedom. Who the hell told you that?</strong><hr></blockquote>

AG John Ashcroft.

[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by jimmac:
<strong>
But, here's to you, your kind, and the future.



[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

Thanks for your praise. Don't laud it on too much though- I want to become an attorney.

I work at a liberal arts College. Helping Young people step into adulthood is what we do. Even attorneys. The future needs people like you. Good luck!

[quote]Originally posted by jimmac:
<strong>I work at a liberal arts College. Helping Young people step into adulthood is what we do. Even attorneys. The future needs people like you. Good luck! </strong><hr></blockquote>

Thanks.

Cool. what college do you work at? I am attending King's College in northeastern pennsylvania this fall as a freshman English major.

Ah... Facilities Support Specialist from Salem, Oregon.

[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</p>

Willamette University. I work in the events dept. Which means I run the sound, do setups, supply equipment, and provide whatever the situation needs. Lectures, concerts, workshops ( even silly stuff ) etc. I'm very glad to be a part of it. My position means I get to sit in on some very interesting things.

[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: jimmac ]</p>

[quote]Originally posted by sjpsu:
<strong>

Well... yes, I agree that having the right does not mean that one may freely exercise it anyway one chooses (Akin to the situation of "buying a high-priced sporting event ticket and freely yelling injurious epithets at players).

Yet, that is irrelavent to my point. Cheney criticized that very right to criticize the President during a time of "war."

[ 06-14-2002: Message edited by: sjpsu ]</strong><hr></blockquote>

I have to say i love this, "anyway one chooses" i believe that the point was the Time not the Way that they did it. You can take it out of context all you want but it was a defense against unethical political grand standing.

He was speaking against the criticism because it had already happened. He took an Ethical stand against it. I completely agree with it, they should not have tried to sway votes when standing by the current leader was more important. Ethics.

Last please stop speaking of open mindedness as if you have some handle on it. The fact that you discount things like ethics, and politicians using trying times to get elected shows you to be more closeminded in this.