or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Verizon-Apple iPhone agreement 'may not ever get resolved'
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Verizon-Apple iPhone agreement 'may not ever get resolved' - Page 4

post #121 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

Have to agree, it is not like he started doing this day one or the day after he made his first million or billion in that case. I would say Gates is no better than Andrew Carnegie, Rockefeller, Or Hurst, All these men made their money off the backs of others then later in life they decided to give back since everyone hated them and they did not want to go down in history as the most hate men of their times. Gates is falling into that mold.

When Bill Gates made his first billion dollars, he didn't donate --- but he didn't buy himself a super yacht or a trophy wife either. Benefit of the doubt goes to Gates --- that he just spent all his time on Microsoft as the super geek. You don't ever read news about him with super expensive toys.
post #122 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

That's right, IBM's business operations were different --- that's why IBM was clear by anti-trust cops. So what happens if Apple gets nailed right now and IBM was clear 20 25 years ago? Then Apple is worse than IBM's big brother.

This is probably the most nonsensical argument presented on this list in a while.

1. Antitrust investigators investigated IBM.

2. IBM was the subject of a fictitious portrayal of them as "Big Brother" in a TV ad. a portrayal, the particulars of which, had little to do with reality.

3. Apple is being investigated by antitrust regulators.

Therefore, Apple is worse than the fictitious "Big Brother" entity supposed by everyone to be IBM.


Unfortunately, for you, besides the fallacious reasoning employed, you're mixing fantasy and reality in an attempt to make a point about the real world, which results in nothing but fantasy as a conclusion.
post #123 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

... Have to agree, it is not like he started doing this day one or the day after he made his first million or billion in that case. I would say Gates is no better than Andrew Carnegie, Rockefeller, Or Hurst, All these men made their money off the backs of others then later in life they decided to give back since everyone hated them and they did not want to go down in history as the most hate men of their times. Gates is falling into that mold.

Exactly, although, in Gates case, I think the proximal cause was the way he came out of the antitrust trial looking like a lying, dysfunctional, moron.
post #124 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

2. IBM was the subject of a fictitious portrayal of them as "Big Brother" in a TV ad. a portrayal, the particulars of which, had little to do with reality.

Therefore, Apple is worse than the fictitious "Big Brother" entity supposed by everyone to be IBM.

You live by the sword and you die by the sword. Apple made the commercial in 1984 and now 26 years later --- media is using the 1984 ad against Apple themselves.
post #125 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Exactly, although, in Gates case, I think the proximal cause was the way he came out of the antitrust trial looking like a lying, dysfunctional, moron.

EVERYBODY looks like a lying, dysfunctional moron if you gather all their emails, sms, facebook entries... Google's CEO jokingly was correct --- when kids turn 18 years old, they should be able to change their names automatically to erase all their facebook entry crap.
post #126 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

You live by the sword and you die by the sword. Apple made the commercial in 1984 and now 26 years later --- media is using the 1984 ad against Apple themselves.

The media? Really? I don't think so. Maybe some competitors, like Google, have disingenuously (or, more correctly, hypocritically) tried to tag Apple with the "Big Brother" label, but it's simply not sticking, because there's no truth to it.
post #127 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

EVERYBODY looks like a lying, dysfunctional moron if you gather all their emails, sms, facebook entries... Google's CEO jokingly was correct --- when kids turn 18 years old, they should be able to change their names automatically to erase all their facebook entry crap.

Actually, it was the deposition video that screwed him.
post #128 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Actually, it was the deposition video that screwed him.

But the deposition video is about the government lawyers questioning Bill Gates on emails and memos that Gates sent. If there were no emails in the first place, then there would be no paper trail for the government lawyers to question.
post #129 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

The media? Really? I don't think so. Maybe some competitors, like Google, have disingenuously (or, more correctly, hypocritically) tried to tag Apple with the "Big Brother" label, but it's simply not sticking, because there's no truth to it.

Jon Stewart was doing it well before Google did in the I/O conference.
post #130 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farjamed View Post

THis is what I have heard from a high ranking Verizon Exec. a friend of a friend. we will see. I am on Tmobile and have too great a rate to switch to verizon, but thats what i heard, and i believe this one.

Abject lies. Don't post anything like this ever again unless you're holding a hardware CDMA/LTE iPhone in your hand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

EVERYBODY looks like a lying, dysfunctional moron if you gather all their emails, sms, facebook entries... Google's CEO jokingly was correct --- when kids turn 18 years old, they should be able to change their names automatically to erase all their facebook entry crap.

Or, you know, parents should just teach kids to be intelligent. "Gathering" all of my data related in this manner would not show lying, dysfunctional moronity. Particularly since I never used social networking.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #131 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

The media? Really? I don't think so. Maybe some competitors, like Google, have disingenuously (or, more correctly, hypocritically) tried to tag Apple with the "Big Brother" label, but it's simply not sticking, because there's no truth to it.

Depends on how you view the 1984 commercial. As you know, it depicted IBM devices as the monotone system that enslaved the world, while Apple's products were "different" and unique and would set you free of all the IBM restrictions.

Fast forward to today and you can see how the roles have been switched. Apple is no longer the "small, new, hip kid on the block". It's become as massive as the IBM overlords the commercial depicted back then. And all their products look and act very similar and have all the same restrictions. And now, the "Think Different" tag can apply to any number of Apple's competitors for the very same reasons Apple used it against IBM.
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
post #132 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Abject lies. Don't post anything like this ever again unless you're holding a hardware CDMA/LTE iPhone in your hand.

Or, you know, parents should just teach kids to be intelligent. "Gathering" all of my data related in this manner would not show lying, dysfunctional moronity. Particularly since I never used social networking.

People write a lot more informally with emails (even corporate emails) --- and that gets a lot of people into trouble.

A man's got to know his limitations. If you think you are infallible with your emails and sms --- your over-confidence is going to get you someday.
post #133 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post

Depends on how you view the 1984 commercial. As you know, it depicted IBM devices as the monotone system that enslaved the world, while Apple's products were "different" and unique and would set you free of all the IBM restrictions.

Fast forward to today and you can see how the roles have been switched. Apple is no longer the "small, new, hip kid on the block". It's become as massive as the IBM overlords the commercial depicted back then. And all their products look and act very similar and have all the same restrictions. And now, the "Think Different" tag can apply to any number of Apple's competitors for the very same reasons Apple used it against IBM.

a) This doesn't seem to be an actual response to the post quoted/

b) Apple's products are still different and unique. And comments like, "And all their products look and act very similar and have all the same restrictions," indicate that you have no knowledge of the IBM of that time.

c) Think Different was a completely different ad campaign from a completely different time and had nothing to do with IBM.

d) Apple, in the media, is definitely still the, "hip kid on the block."

Sorry, but this Apple is Big Brother meme that you and others are attempting to bring to life is stillborn.
post #134 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

a) This doesn't seem to be an actual response to the post quoted/

So I can't offer a second viewpoint of this?

Quote:
b) Apple's products are still different and unique. And comments like, "And all their products look and act very similar and have all the same restrictions," indicate that you have no knowledge of the IBM of that time.

Yes, but what I meant was the interface between all their devices. Personally speaking, I'm beginning to find the interface a bit boring now. Don't get me wrong, having consistency is still good.

Quote:
c) Think Different was a completely different ad campaign from a completely different time and had nothing to do with IBM.

Apologies if my inclusion of the "Think Different" tag confused you. Even though it doesn't apply directly to the IBM commercial, if you think about it, what I said still makes sense. The original commercial was to introduce the Mac in the face of the conformity that was represented by IBM. To "Think Different" from IBM, if you will.

Quote:
d) Apple, in the media, is definitely still the, "hip kid on the block."

That it may be, but I believe you missed the point. Apple is no longer a small company trying to gain traction. It's now a dominate player in the field. much like the IBM their commercial went against back then.

The woman swinging the hammer could easily represent Android, webOS, WP7, MeeGo, etc in this new age and the black and white people be replaced with Apple users with Steve Jobs as the man on the screen (if you dismiss that there are a legion of Apple users that hold onto every word Steve Jobs says, you're kidding yourself). The commercial would still make sense.

Quote:
Sorry, but this Apple is Big Brother meme that you and others are attempting to bring to life is stillborn.

I'm not trying to make it any larger than what it is. I'm just saying that you can look at "Big Brother" it in the light I mentioned above and it does make sense. But clearly you have already purchased lifetime membership to one of those audience seats in the commercial.
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
post #135 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post

... The woman swinging the hammer could easily represent Android, webOS, WP7, MeeGo, etc in this new age and the black and white people be replaced with Apple users with Steve Jobs as the man on the screen (if you dismiss that there are a legion of Apple users that hold onto every word Steve Jobs says, you're kidding yourself). The commercial would still make sense. ...

Well, the rest of what you wrote is irrelevant, but let's have a look at the above...

Ignoring for the sake of argument that Apple simply doesn't fit the bill for your attempted Big Brother indictment, the woman swinging the hammer could represent...

* Android? Not a chance. Android is a carrier's dream for imprisoning customers. And, Google really is Big Brother, the one from 1984.

* webOS? Not likely now that HP owns it.

* WP7? That was joke, right? Microsoft will set us free?

* MeeGo? I think that was also a joke, although, I don't get it. Must be some sort of Finnish humor.


Then, the myth that, "there are a legion of Apple users that hold onto every word Steve Jobs says," ...

Handful would be more accurate. A legion who are interested in hearing what he says to know what Apple's next move is, perhaps, but, again, you are attempting to perpetuate a myth. I know it's a convenient argument when one doesn't have one to just say, "You think whatever Steve Jobs tells you to think," but I think Apple haters tend to be more hung up on Steve Jobs than Apple fans.


So, sorry, it doesn't make sense, not in any way. You might like it to, but you're destined for disappointment.
post #136 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

When Bill Gates made his first billion dollars, he didn't donate --- but he didn't buy himself a super yacht or a trophy wife either. Benefit of the doubt goes to Gates --- that he just spent all his time on Microsoft as the super geek. You don't ever read news about him with super expensive toys.

I guess you have not see is 22,000 SqFt house have you.
post #137 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

I guess you have not see is 22,000 SqFt house have you.

A house for his wife and kids --- it may be very expensive, but it is not a toy.
post #138 of 142
This is why I went ahead and bought an iPhone 4. There is no real guarantee a verizon iPhone will materialize.... apple might even be openly antagonistic to verizon since verizon is largely the reason Android is even a threat.

However I still think even if apple screwed up by not coming to terms with verizon early (thereby opening a hole for android), verizon is still shooting themselves in the foot to not open iPhone to their network. Unless they make less money with iPhone then they do with android phones, what do they care which phone people buy? Isn't the point to sign up as many people to your network as possible? I, and many others, probably jumped ship to AT&T primarily because verizon wouldn't offer an iPhone. Can verizon really ignore all those people?
post #139 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Well, the rest of what you wrote is irrelevant, but let's have a look at the above...

Ah, this attitude explains it all. No need to say more. You will find all kinds of new inventive ways to "refute" my posts in your eyes, so there's no real point in continuing.

But if you need further proof that Apple has grow up from the "new kid" to the "playground bully", check out this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-11404886

Yes, this is Apple submitting a 873-page briefing on why they should own the word "pod". All because they believe that a projector can be mistaken for one of their music players (note: they look nothing alike). Way to turn around and step on the start-ups (which you used to be back when), Apple.
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
post #140 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by enjourni View Post

This is why I went ahead and bought an iPhone 4. There is no real guarantee a verizon iPhone will materialize.... apple might even be openly antagonistic to verizon since verizon is largely the reason Android is even a threat.

However I still think even if apple screwed up by not coming to terms with verizon early (thereby opening a hole for android), verizon is still shooting themselves in the foot to not open iPhone to their network. Unless they make less money with iPhone then they do with android phones, what do they care which phone people buy? Isn't the point to sign up as many people to your network as possible? I, and many others, probably jumped ship to AT&T primarily because verizon wouldn't offer an iPhone. Can verizon really ignore all those people?

In time, the iPhone will come to Verizon. As you said, Verizon stands to steal a huge number of customers from AT&T when they get the iPhone.

Interests on both side have to be accounted for, since neither company can be considered "small beans". It's only fair that Verizon be able to get some of their requests agreed to, as opposed to rolling over and playing dead for Apple. Verizon is doing very well with it current lineup and has the option of waiting until the time is right.
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
\Apple has always had competition. It's just been in its blind spot.
Reply
post #141 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsianBob View Post

Ah, this attitude explains it all. No need to say more. You will find all kinds of new inventive ways to "refute" my posts in your eyes, so there's no real point in continuing.

But if you need further proof that Apple has grow up from the "new kid" to the "playground bully", check out this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-11404886

Yes, this is Apple submitting a 873-page briefing on why they should own the word "pod". All because they believe that a projector can be mistaken for one of their music players (note: they look nothing alike). Way to turn around and step on the start-ups (which you used to be back when), Apple.

That's really a stretch, even for you, unless, of course, you are entirely ignorant of the practical realities of trademark law.
post #142 of 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Struggles between Verizon and Apple are a sign that a deal to bring the iPhone to Verizon's network may never happen, even once the carrier's high-speed 4G network is established, one Wall Street analyst has said.

Mike Abramsky with RBC Capital Markets said in a note to investors Friday that he believes Apple is likely to turn to T-Mobile and possibly Sprint in the U.S. to counter the expansion of phones running the Google Android operating system. But comments made by Verizon's chief executive this week could be a sign that the nation's largest wireless carrier still cannot reach a deal with Apple.

"Verizon may not accept Apple's contract terms that risk its Android franchise, which could face significant cannibalization from pent up iPhone demand on its network," Abramsky wrote. "And Apple may not want iPhone to be second banana to Android at Verizon, and may be unwilling to accept less than prime marketing, subsidy support for a Verizon iPhone."

He continued: "This may or not ever get resolved even under LTE; the longer this takes, the more entrenched Android becomes at Verizon so the more difficult to strike a deal."

Last October, Google and Verizon announced a partnership in which they would help to create, market and distribute products running the Android mobile operating system. Verizon's push has helped Android grow exponentially in the U.S. smartphone market.

Abramsky said he believes that recent reports of a CDMA iPhone set for manufacturing in December could be destined for other carriers around the world, including KDDI in Japan, China Telecom, and Mexico's Telefonica. Verizon also runs a CDMA network, but it's possible the carrier cannot reach a deal with Apple.

The analyst said the impact of a delayed Verizon iPhone, or no iPhone on its network at all, would be minimal to Apple's stock. Abramsky had previously predicted that Apple would sell between 6 million and 8 million iPhones on Verizon's network in 2011, though the addition of T-Mobile and Sprint could add between 4 million and 5 million sales.

He also said he's heard that the iPad could possibly come to Verizon in the first half of 2011, but cautioned that he has not "confirmed" the rumor. RBC Capital Markets has currently forecast sales of 24 million iPads next year.

In recent months, numerous rumors have claimed that Apple will release a CDMA iPhone, compatible with the Verizon network, in January of 2011. A CDMA variant of the iPhone has reportedly been in testing, and in August was said to be just two steps away from production.

sad news indeed

apple should become a gate keeper



9
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
whats in a name ? 
beatles
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPhone
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPhone › Verizon-Apple iPhone agreement 'may not ever get resolved'