or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPad › RIM unveils 7-inch 'PlayBook' tablet set to launch in early 2011
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

RIM unveils 7-inch 'PlayBook' tablet set to launch in early 2011 - Page 6

post #201 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

1) Yes you are missing something. The built-in display is 1024x600, but it can playback 1080p content and output 1080p content via HDMI which can be displayed on 1080p displays. They all scale to meet their needs.

2) Note that the 1080p resolution you listed is 1.78:1 aspect ratio and the PlayBook is 1.71:1 aspect ratio so the resolution you want could never happen anyway. Also, the PlayBook is 170 ppi, which is more than iPad at 132 ppi. The iPads ppi is good and the PlayBook is better.

3) The iPhone 4s HW can actually playback 1080p but this would cause some issues with battery duration and performance so Apple limited the maximum you can playback content recorded at 720p and even take video in 720p, though the display is 960x640.

Quote:
Originally Posted by emacs72 View Post

yes, the PlayBook supports output via HDMI

HDMI output is good. Will it support HDCP? Where do I get the 1080p content, though?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiro View Post

The difference is Apple, post Jobs return, always uses the device itself in the ad used to sell the concept. They use the widget to tell a 30 sec story of the things it does and how you can feel cool using it.

RIM used Minority Report graphics completely disassociated from their product. The way cool images that have absolutely no chance of meeting expectations in the reality

....Yes, it's just advertising, not a literal promise, but RIM didn't put any context in there to mentally prepare buyers for e smallish screen. iPhones have tiny screens in comparison, but Apple always used real hands in the ads, so that phone in the ad on a 52" screen didn't cause any mental conflicts when you got to the store. The hand is an invariant that grounded the screen size despite being radically enlarged in the ads.

It's little stuff like this this that is incredibly important in shaping attitudes when people finally get to see the real thing. RIM is literally overselling the device, unintentionally, and setting themselves up for blogdom panning and overall disappointment when it actually ships.

Well, I can't blame RIM, they had to make a big splash. The ad is well done for the layman to enjoy. I'm sure you're right on the compositing issues, most people will just look at the ad, and be like, cool, wonder when it will come out, I want to check it out...

I am hoping it doesn't disappoint. It's almost winter and no real iPad competitors, no iPad official launches outside the already-launched countries. I know it sounds like my mantra, but, please, somebody come out with more tablets so everyone doesn't have to just depend on Apple, they can only make so many iPads at one time.
post #202 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

Few not Every.

More iphone carriers offering the iphone for free than Blackberry carriers offering BOGO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Ahh.... Yes CNBC! The article did shed some light on why Dual Cores... My guess it's one core for each of the co-CEOs.

Good thing they aren't planning a quad-core..... Or.....

What's that all about?

.

QNX can do 16 cores.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Looks like they are going to need to work on that ecosystem. PlayBook runs QNX with webkit and BB runs ...whatever and BB browser. A completely new platform seams like it would cause problems with compatibility unless they transition their phone OS too. Wow are they screwed.

Apps for the old BB OS'es are all java apps --- that's how the Playbook can get compatibility (via java).

Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

There is a certain irony that phone makers were quick to point out Apple was entering their realm and that Apple knew nothing about phones. I am not saying RIM knows nothing about computers but then again they don't have Apple's experience and know how either. The mobile devices running iOS are far more than phones and I wonder if RIM maybe in for a rough ride taking on iOS and Android based on their success with BBs.

That's why they bought QNX --- which has been in the PC business since the early 80's. As a Canadian, I was using this in high school --- it's a 80186 CPU.

http://www.old-computers.com/MUSEUM/...asp?st=1&c=971

Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Right, you're a Qualcomm shill.

Not that either. After 10 years of bashing Qualcomm --- what have you people learned? GSM side has its own patent troll (Nokia paid InterDigital more than 250 million dollars to settle GSM patent lawsuit in 2006). Qualcomm became the largest mobile technology company in the world. ATT ended up using Qualcomm BREW. LBS became the only 3G killer app --- which Qualcomm was years ahead of the GSM world. And the GSM iphone became the most locked-up phone in the world.

No need to shill at all.
post #203 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Why didn't they actually go on stage and demo it to an assembled group from the tech press? Just curious. My guess is they are a ways off and this is a PR stunt to bolster their position for investors.

Because there is no working, demonstrable-to-public prototype yet. It's PR, Marketing and Stock Boosting 101. I really do want it to gain traction, I hope the actual product is good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

What do you mean by level?

What about the iPod campaign, which Apple ran for years with images such as these:



... with the product barely even visible?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Huh? Whatever they happen to be advertising, they are both advertisements.

Dude, you're stretching here These are ads which, IIRC, ran after the iPod itself was introduced and demoed. It wasn't a product introduction.
post #204 of 392
BTW did you guys see Micro-HDMI as the output? Aww yeah, this is definitely out of Apple's playbook. Seriously though, if Apple did this they would be crucified by some on this forum.
post #205 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Conclusions:

-- they haven't defined the UI
-- there is no OS
-- there is no SDK or Simulator

Apple pulled OS X experts to work on finalizing the first iOs from a running system (demoed).
It took trained experts 3 months to finalize iOS 1.

There is no way in hell that this will be ready for release before 3Q 2011!

.

As the CNBC article stated, they are shipping it to partners in the next month for testing.

RIM just bought 200 software engineers on the QNX deal.
post #206 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

BTW did you guys see Micro-HDMI as the output? Aww yeah, this is definitely out of Apple's playbook. Seriously though, if Apple did this they would be crucified by some on this forum.

They probably would. Apple still gets vilified for using the same 30-pin connector for 8 years straight and across 3 different product categories accounting for hundreds of millions of devices sold.

Apple will have to update that connector one day to something smaller and leaner. Maybe they will wait for optical, but then you can have to the majority of PCs to have optical or include an optical to copper convertor. Neither seem ideal.

Note that micro-HDMI is part of the v1.4 spec which is a very good thing for HDMI so in this case there really is no reason for anyone to complain unless they dont include the cable.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #207 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

As the CNBC article stated, they are shipping it to partners in the next month for testing.

RIM just bought 200 software engineers on the QNX deal.

That's a bunch of crap -- if you can't see that, what's the point...

Just who and how many are these "partners"'? Where do I apply?

What are they 'shipping" -- the only tangible shown was a marketing video?

How long does it take to gather 200 software engineers (or 200 anybodys) for a meeting?

Are these 200 high-paid engineers just sitting around looking for something to to? Or, are they committed to ongoing projects with deadlines?

10 experts might be able to do the OS, frameworks, and APIs in 6 months after the hardware and UI are defined.

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #208 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

What's "fake" about the video? In fact it looks a lot like something Apple might do. A public demo also doesn't tell you much except that they've got working prototypes. I don't have any idea whether this product will be any good, or whether it will ship in three or six months, or never. But I think it's silly to criticize RIM for pre-announcing the product with a gee-wiz video, when that's exactly the kind of thing Apple does, and does so well.

It is far from exactly what Apple does:

1) Apple demoed the product, and gave hands-on access on the same day. RIM didn't even show a live movie of the thing in actual use.

2) Apple gave a price.

3) Apple gave battery life.

4) Apple specified shipping in < 3 months; RIM 3 to 8 months, and considering the absence of a demo, the longer time is more likely.

5) When Apple announced the ipad, there were no other similar tablets in the wild. RIM is announcing a me-too product.

Other than that, exactly the same.

(Apple announced the iphone 6 months before it shipped, but they had to apply for operating permits ahead of time, and that would have let the cat out, and again, it had essentially no competition when it was released, and again, a live demo, price, battery life, and shipping month were given on the day of the announcement.)
post #209 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by samwight View Post

It is far from exactly what Apple does:

1) Apple demoed the product, and gave hands-on access on the same day. RIM didn't even show a live movie of the thing in actual use.

2) Apple gave a price.

3) Apple gave battery life.

4) Apple specified shipping in < 3 months; RIM 3 to 8 months, and considering the absence of a demo, the longer time is more likely.

5) When Apple announced the ipad, there were no other similar tablets in the wild. RIM is announcing a me-too product.

Other than that, exactly the same.

(Apple announced the iphone 6 months before it shipped, but they had to apply for operating permits ahead of time, and that would have let the cat out, and again, it had essentially no competition when it was released, and again, a live demo, price, battery life, and shipping month were given on the day of the announcement.)

You don't make many posts, but if this is any indication -- we're missing a lot!

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #210 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Just who and how many are these "partners"'? Where do I apply?

you'll have to contact RIM for the details. and if you're interested in becoming a partner, this site may prove useful http://www.rim.com/company/contact/index.shtml

Quote:
What are they 'shipping" -- the only tangible shown was a marketing video?

development kits

Quote:
How long does it take to gather 200 software engineers (or 200 anybodys) for a meeting?

teleconferencing is a common means to gather people from various geographic locations into a meeting

Quote:
Are these 200 high-paid engineers just sitting around looking for something to to? Or, are they committed to ongoing projects with deadlines?

QNX Software Systems continues as a business as always. i don't see them being idle. more information about QNX is over at http://www.qnx.com/

Quote:
10 experts might be able to do the OS, frameworks, and APIs in 6 months after the hardware and UI are defined.

where did you get these figures? are you experienced in embedded OS design and development?
post #211 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by samwight View Post

It is far from exactly what Apple does: ...

i agree. and, it should be interesting to see how the PlayBook fares in the marketplace next year and beyond.
post #212 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Oh come on. Enough with the double standards. Apple does this kind of thing all the time.

Well, I'm tired and maybe my brain isn't working all that well, but I can't think of a single time in any of SJs presentations where he didn't have a working device there. It may not have been a finished product for sale but afaik he always had a device there. Perhaps you know of a specific time that I have forgotten about?
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
Reply
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
Reply
post #213 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

That's a bunch of crap -- if you can't see that, what's the point...

.

Then you have to assume that RIM is terminally stupid, and provide evidence of the fact based on their history.

They announce a product and say that they are shipping it to corporate clients in a month.

You claim 6-8 months (how you figure that is a mystery).

If they don't ship by October, early November, they will be crucified and they know that.

So you are saying that RIM is knowingly performing actions that will cause a substantial decline in their share price.
post #214 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

You don't make many posts, but if this is any indication -- we're missing a lot!

I second it.
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
Dick Applebaum on whether the iPad is a personal computer: "BTW, I am posting this from my iPad pc while sitting on the throne... personal enough for you?"
Reply
post #215 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacs72 View Post

where did you get these figures? are you experienced in embedded OS design and development?

Not an expert, but have worked on and observed enough software projects to know what's attainable.

Where am I wrong?

Is 10 people to few? To many? How about 50? 100? Or 200 as the OP implied?

What about the time period? We have 33 days until October 31 -- the last day that RIM can ship the "kits" to their "partners" and meet their (supposedly announced) deadline/

That's not a lot of time! If they are going to make it, shouldn't they at least be able to show a simulated (or even story-boarded) illustration of the UI?

At the very least they could take iOS or Android SDKs and use them as a guideline for the UI and APIs.

But, they have nothing to show today! This was their Big day!. Their big chance to make a good impression. They showed a "concept" movie-- they have nothing else!

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #216 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

Selling the sizzle instead of the steak. Apple's ads don't dwell on specifications, or even the functions of their products. If the ads work at all, it's because they make you excited about the concept they are selling. I've got nothing against it; this is just how advertising works. This is what RIM is doing with this ad. Very light on the specifics and long on eye-catching generalities. A lot like an Apple ad, is what I thought when I saw it. That BTW is not a criticism. Apple is the master of this approach.

Nice reply, too bad it had nothing to do with the post you were replying to. If you follow the "trail" you will see he wanted you to elaborate on your statement that Apple,with regards to using fake videos, "do it all the time". Better luck next time.
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
Reply
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
Reply
post #217 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

Then you have to assume that RIM is terminally stupid, and provide evidence of the fact based on their history.

They announce a product and say that they are shipping it to corporate clients in a month.

You claim 6-8 months (how you figure that is a mystery).

If they don't ship by October, early November, they will be crucified and they know that.

So you are saying that RIM is knowingly performing actions that will cause a substantial decline in their share price.

No. that'swhat you are saying.

And, you must not believe them because you are hedging their date for them-- from October to "early November".

As I said in an earlier post, RIM has provided a few hard specs, and left themselves a lot of wiggle room!

We were misquoted, taken out of context, we want to take extra time to get the UX just right... shit happens. All these are available excuses.

Likely, what RIM showed today was the best they could cobble together. The fact that they couldn't show even a powered on device... tells me they don't have one worth showing!

Is that difficult to understand?

Then you should ask the logical follow on question-- If the Bride doesn't make an appearance at her wedding, what makes you think she'll make one at the honeymoon?

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #218 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

We were misquoted, taken out of context... shit happens. All these are available excuses.

.

Excuses don't mean "shit" to use your terminology. The news is out there, and any decent company has at least a few people monitoring the news that came out.

If they were "misquoted" or "taken out of context" and really have no plans to ship for 6-8 months as you assert, there would have been (or will be be by tomorrow) a statement to that effect.

You do not claim to ship a product in a month to clients when there is no hope or chance that that will happen, which is essentially what you are asserting.
post #219 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

I've challenged people who say this to show me how RIM could be so stupid as to release a video a product that will either never arrive or not look at all like the promotional ad, but I notice nobody has taken me up on it.

And we challenge you to back up your claim that Apple use fake videos all the time. .... still waiting. I'll check in tomorrow and see what you come up with.
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
Reply
See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
Reply
post #220 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

Excuses don't mean "shit" to use your terminology. The news is out there, and any decent company has at least a few people monitoring the news that came out.

If they were "misquoted" or "taken out of context" and really have no plans to ship for 6-8 months as you assert, there would have been (or will be be by tomorrow) a statement to that effect.

You do not claim to ship a product in a month to clients when there is no hope or chance that that will happen, which is essentially what you are asserting.

First. I do not know that RIM claimed that they will ship a product in a month... even if they said that, what's a product. A somewhat working device? A buggy SDK and a Simulator with lots of missing documentation and APIs-- it'll be Beta, right? Who Knows?

As others have said, more eloquently, I think that RIM is trying to do whatever it takes to persuade their business customers to wait for a RIM Tablet solution.

Today, RIM placed its marker on the table -- It intends to do this as well and as soon as possible...

But what comprises "it" is not sufficiently defined as to what or when. I think that was what was intended,

Why do it now?

What else could they do?

Excuses do mean "shit" if you are telling loyal followers what they want to hear... Longhorn!

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #221 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism;1722682
My point is made better by this comparison to the Nokia N97 promo video, not unlike what we have in the PlayBook video except the N97 promo video actually focuses on the device itself, even if it all done by skilled animators. Note, the limitations of the N97 aren’t just the speed of transitions but how they are done. We’ll see when this comes out how accurate this video was to the real OS and UI on the real HW.[INDENT


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJpEuMidcSU[/INDENT]

I'd like to refer back to this. Several people are saying that it's highly unlikely or beyond the pale to think that RIM would wildly misrepresent their new OS-- that they'd have to be stupid or crazy to expose themselves to that kind of grief, and that there's no evidence that they're that stupid.

But Nokia did precisely this, and Nokia isn't generally thought of as "stupid", in that sense (they don't seem to be very good at hanging onto market share, but I never thought of them as duplicitous or erratic, particularly). But they went ahead and made that video. I can imagine the exact argument being made here being made upon viewing the N97 piece. The same admiration for the fluidity and style of the UI, the same dismissal of the idea that Nokia would be so insane as to just make shit up, the same request that someone provide evidence of Nokia's capacity for that level of folly.

I think the thread has confusingly conflated several meanings of "vaporware." I don't doubt that RIM will be shipping something, even if it's somewhat delayed. I also think it's entirely possible that that something won't actually behave much like the video, which plays more like a broad conceptual piece than a demonstration of any product. If that proves to be the case I'm sure RIM could point out that the application of screens to various real world objects made it clear that the video was just dreaming about the future, or something. But I really don't think it's out of the question that this kind of rendered publicity can get pretty far afield from actual shipping product.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
Reply
post #222 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Millmoss View Post

What's "fake" about the video? In fact it looks a lot like something Apple might do. A public demo also doesn't tell you much except that they've got working prototypes. I don't have any idea whether this product will be any good, or whether it will ship in three or six months, or never. But I think it's silly to criticize RIM for pre-announcing the product with a gee-wiz video, when that's exactly the kind of thing Apple does, and does so well.

I have used Apple products for quite sometime. I never followed their press conferences, until recently.

I have yet encountered an instance when Apple announced a product without a working prototype (see caveat below)-- not just a "mock-up" of a concept product, like many tech companies do.

Was it many many years ago when Bill Gates, with all the fanfare, even a prototype to show, announced the coming Microsoft handheld tablet computer, stylus and all? It was supposed to revolutionize mobile computing. I was so ecstatic then when I became more familiar with the ways of Gates, and Microsoft. Until now, some Apple detractors use the Bill Gates demo to suggest that MS was the first to conceive such a tablet device???

It is not exactly the same analogy, but the "boy who cried wolf, or something comes to mind" -- "It's coming! It's coming! It's coming!" -- or some related parables and stories. In this case, the "alarmist" made the proclamation so many times that later on, no one believed him, when the menace really came.

Microsoft and Bill Gates, touted so many "concept" products before, sometimes even with actual "prototypes", only to be proved illusory as actual consumer products. Was in only this year when they shelved the latest iteration of the "clam shell" tablet, after the iPad was announced, and even before it was known to be a success?

What was more in character, was that when Microsoft actually comes out with a consumer product, that was sure to resonate with consumers, the latter seemed to look somewhere else? Zune, and yeah, their iPhone killers (that I cannot even recall now, that had to be abandoned, only after? They still have faith on the Zune though, and the incoming "Windows 7 Phone?" or whatever it may be called in the future.

Announcemens, like this by RIM thought is not just limited to computer/software ccompanies. Remember all those mock up products of mass media companies that were supposed to exploit the potential of the innovative promises of the iPad, or similar table devices? Until now, they remain "video demos". I have yet to see a working magazine App that truly exploits the capabilities of the tablet.

In fact, as many people in the know, even so-called journalists and analysts, may even already subconsciously imbibed:

"There are announcements. And, there are Apple product announcements." The Pew research just confirmed this.

If I have to hazard, even Apple haters, accept this. Otherwise, I feel at a lost to understand why some people spends so much time in forums, like this, to share they thoughts about products they profess to be subpar to, and extolling those from other companies, or those "concept products yet to come. "They're coming! They're coming!" (many times, they do not come at all)

What makes Apple different? Until Apple has a working prototype, in their quarterly press conferences for their financial report, Apple reps never confirm nor deny, about a purported (every analyst is so sure) prduct will be manufactured by Apple. As it turned out, many of those rumors, were untrue.

Even if it were true, Apple would not confirm or deny its existence, until they are ready to announce, that indeed a product is coming. Is it any wonder why "many" get so "excited" to a frenzy sometimes, even Apple and Steve Jobs detractors, schedule an "Announcement"?

By the time, they announce a "working prototype", they already have a good idea what the price would be -- because they already are at manufacturing stage to be able to estimate the cost to manufacture (e.g., the iPad, iPods), and/or have already negotiated with any company that will subsidize the product, AT&T, and respective telcos in other countries with the iPhone), and sorts of costs associated with the sale of a new product.

The "grand announcement" of Apple of a "new product therefore gets much attention, because it allows pundits to claim they made a correct prognostication. Apart from being truly innovative or one that may resonate with the average consumer, everyone knows that the product will indeed come.

Can you say that of Microsoft announcements, or all those demos that come out every year at the CES? Or, those "grand announcements" by many companies?

If there is one caveat to what I stated above, one that I could think of would be the "white iPhone 4". I am not privy to any insider of Apple, including how things are manufactured. However, if I give Apple the benefit of the doubt, and be more "generous", I would surmise that it is just Steve Jobs being picky about the most minute details, like the color of the "white iPhone". After all, except for the manufacture of the outer casing, the black iPhone was not only a working prototype, but was actually a "consumer product" -- much desired, in spite of all the "Antennagate" that seem to just have disappeared in the media.

I wonder sometimes why everyone in the massmedia, and Consumer Report, seem to have had amnesia, considering how they portrayed the problem.

Is it any wonder why Apple gets so much press coverage? Is it any wonder why many people love Apple so much, a devotion they do not seem to bestow to any tech company? Is it any wonder why many people hate Apple and Steve Jobs?

Just curious where you will categorize yourself?

Personally, I would like for other companies to come up with viable competition to any Apple product. However I feel about Android phones, for example, or whatever motivated Google to do so, I am glad that they are making Apple rethink their strategies. More power to companies that can truly comoete with any Apple products. It prods Apple to innovate even further.

I feel disgusted sometimes with the tendency of both parties to attempt to justify the choices of Apple, as if they as if those specifications are sacrosant -- "Apple can do no mistake", and for the adversary to nit pick or overblow, any "missing" specification, and then extoll products of the competition, even before it was even in their hands.

Where is the spirit to help each other find the best, for us consumers?

When I first came here, or for that matter, related forums, I thought it would be a good way to learn from the expertise and/or experience of others. And, I did post a few inquiries, in the past.

No one ever responded, "Google" to my requests, but to those who respond with "Google it!", or something similar to some posts here: "What were you trying to say?" Do you honestly believe that someone who found a site, like "AppleInsider", never heard of "Google"? Geez, "AppleInsider" must be inherently known to everyone.

Is it really just plain laziness on the part of the poster? Or, they were seeking more elaborations, from people they think may have more technical experties than themselves?

Why is it that the "outrageous" posts, from our perspective, elicit the most response? Do we really think our chosen adversary will change their mind?

What are our priorities here? Just curious: What did we think we really achieved after posting hundreds, sometimes thousands of posts, in this forum?


CGC

N.B.

The emphasis (bold) in the quote above was mine. Not that I considered the quoted post the most bizzare, but something else resonated.
post #223 of 392
.

Cisco announced their 7" tablet on June 29.

In many ways, it is similar to the PlayBook.

Except, it has an available and proven OS (Android) and a proven CPU (Atom).

Their original video showed the device, but it was not turned on or demoed.

Their latest video is a mock up of what it will look like when running -- a better, more targeted presentation than the PlayBook video.

It was announced almost 3 months before the PlayBook.

I cannot find any reliable price and availability information.

Of the PlayBook and Cius, which do you think will ship first?

Have a look:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/06/29/c...-capabilities/

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #224 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmf2 View Post

The iPhone 4 has 512 MB, it's quite possible that the iPad 2 will have a gig as well and launch in a similar timeframe.

The iPhone 4 has 16Gb or 32Gb of RAM NOT 512MB.

The PlayBook only has 1GB or on board storage.
post #225 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I'd like to refer back to this. Several people are saying that it's highly unlikely or beyond the pale to think that RIM would wildly misrepresent their new OS-- that they'd have to be stupid or crazy to expose themselves to that kind of grief, and that there's no evidence that they're that stupid.

The issue is not that RIM "misrepresented" their OS. there are people like Dick Applebaum who are claiming that RIM flat out lied - not misrepresented, but lied about the OS and their tablet, supposedly to hold their customer base.

This is from Dick
Begin Quote
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum
Conclusions:

-- they haven't defined the UI
-- there is no OS
-- there is no SDK or Simulator

Apple pulled OS X experts to work on finalizing the first iOs from a running system (demoed).
It took trained experts 3 months to finalize iOS 1.

There is no way in hell that this will be ready for release before 3Q 2011!
End of Quote

So it is not that there is a misrepresentation as you suggest. Dick Applebaum is claiming that RIM got up in front of the press and in effect said:

"we have this OS from QNX that is going to run our tablet that we will ship in a few months at the beginning of 2011",

However, according to Dick, in reality, there is no OS at all, and the tablet will not ship for another year.

That is what people are saying is implausible, because RIM would have to be truly stupid to do something like that.
post #226 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wonder View Post

The iPhone 4 has 16Gb or 32Gb of RAM NOT 512MB.

The PlayBook only has 1GB or on board storage.

No, the 1 GB is not storage but system memory, and yes, the iPad only has 512 MB. RIM never mentioned how much storage would be on the devices, but most reports presume 16 and 32 GB.
post #227 of 392
In US businesses it is very common to use "sports" metaphors or analogies. It's common to say something will be a "home run" or "touchdown". And also that everyone on the "team" is using the same "playbook".
post #228 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

No, the 1 GB is not storage but system memory, and yes, the iPad only has 512 MB. RIM never mentioned how much storage would be on the devices, but most reports presume 16 and 32 GB.

The iPad has less 256Mb. It's the iPhone 4 which has 512Mb.
post #229 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Like I said in my other post the only OS that can compete with Appe right now is Android. So combine hardware from HTC and Android 3.0 and maybe you have something that can compete with the iPad.

What exactly will Android 3.0 bring to the table that makes it better suited for tablets than 2.x?
post #230 of 392
.

... Mysteries solved...

I wondered about the Dual Core 1 GHz ARM CPU, the 1 GB RAM -- they seemed like odd (expensive) overkill for the small screen PlayBook.

... then rthere was the undefined battery life spec.

Well, these mysteries seem to be solved:

Quote:
Built with the security, efficiency and seamless connectivity from the ground up youd expect from RIM

There are currently two application development approaches for the BlackBerry Tablet OS:
  • Web Applications with HTML5 Developers will be able to create compelling applications using HTML5, CSS and JavaScript®, which leverage the WebKit rendering engine.
  • Web Applications with Flash Leveraging Adobes tools, developers will be able to create visually rich applications using Flash 10.1.
Application distribution through the BlackBerry App World storefront makes it easy for end-users to discover, download and use your application.

http://na.blackberry.com/eng/developers/tablet.jsp

http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/f...ackberrytabos/

This means that developers will write apps that are interpreted/executed at runtime rather than executed as native machine language. This requires additional CPU cycles, RAM and battery -- which are some of the reasons Apple will not allow Flash on iOS.

While the HTML5/CSS/JavaScript approach has these same issues, they are open standards that can be addressed with iOS implementation.

Presumably, at some later time PlayBook will allow Java apps -- These. too, require runtime interpretation, but at a much lower (more-efficient) level.


Also, it appears that the reason, that RIM will be able to get up and running, quickly, is that they do not need to provide an SDK -- Adobe provides the Flash SDK, and Open Standards provide the HTML5/CSS/JavaScript SDK (likely, using an Adobe tool).

RIM/QNX has to provide the base device OS and expose low-level capabilities to the higher-level tools.

I expect that most system-wide services will be supplied by the QNX OS.


In effect, I think this means the PlayBook (at least, initially) will have sort of a hybrid QNX/Flash OS and SDK.

It sounds a little scary... but we'll have to see how that works out.


So, it appears as if the competing OSes for the Tablet market are:

-- Apple iOS
-- Google Android OS
-- HP WebOS
-- Microsoft Windows Mobile 7
-- RIM QNX/Flash OS
-- Nokia whatever

... Interesting

,
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #231 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by samab View Post

Not that either. ... Qualcomm ... Qualcomm ... Qualcomm ... Qualcomm ...

No need to shill at all.

Uh, yeah, right
post #232 of 392
Ok, so Apple will introduce the second generation of iPad soon.

- Thinner
- Lighter
- With camera(s)
- Video Conferencing - will be a BIG Deal
- Faster
- Better Battery life
- Available in colors
- For LESS- and oh yeah, one more thing, now available in 3 sizes!

- Big one, is lighter the ANY other tablet on the market - so is bigger better?
- The mid size, is for all of you who want a mid-size tablet
- and the smallest one, is for those who want a small one

Then where will the competition be?
post #233 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by grking View Post

There is no way in hell that this will be ready for release before 3Q 2011!
End of Quote

So it is not that there is a misrepresentation as you suggest. Dick Applebaum is claiming that RIM got up in front of the press and in effect said:

"we have this OS from QNX that is going to run our tablet that we will ship in a few months at the beginning of 2011",

However, according to Dick, in reality, there is no OS at all, and the tablet will not ship for another year.

That is what people are saying is implausible, because RIM would have to be truly stupid to do something like that.

Companies do this shit all the time. The RIM tablet at this point exists only on paper. They have an OS that runs on the processor they are planning to use, they will copy UI from the iPad (like Samsung), webOS, etc., the SDK is Web+Flash, so they don't have anything to produce for developers (the choice of dev tools is another indication that this is a hacked together rush job, btw), and the hardware design will be a mashup of the Torch and iPad. They will try to cobble this together as quickly as possible, and early 2011 by their reasoning lasts until the end of Q2, so they have about 9 months to ship product to make their date.

But, the purpose of this is to delay customers from buying competing products. By saying early 2011, people (including some in this thread) are thinking, Jan-Mar, but that's totally implausible, other than some prototype units. If they can't make June, they'll simply announce that it's slightly delayed and will be here real soon now.
post #234 of 392
is RIM a company known to announce vapourware? What's their track record like?
What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
Reply
What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
Reply
post #235 of 392
That's kind of what I was thinking here. I think the reason why everyone on this forum is sort of excited about this product, is because RIM is a company with a really good track record for successful products. I don't know any other smartphone a I've overheard people saying they'd rather have over the iPhone. Plus they pretty much own the business-end of smartphones, however the iPhone and Android phones are quickly taking over that slot. So given that, it's pretty simple to understand why people are being drawn to the Playbook, not to mention that other forums on AI i've seen an overwhelming interest in a 7" iPad. So given a strong competitor, a solid looking device and a company with a good track record...this will probably be the business tablet to have for most managers.
post #236 of 392
it seems to me a few people making some wild assumptions, based on nothing.

I don't have a crystal ball that tells me the success of this, but I'm amazed at how quickly people are shouting vapourware. It's RIM, not microsoft we're talking about
What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
Reply
What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
Reply
post #237 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wonder View Post

The iPhone 4 has 16Gb or 32Gb of RAM NOT 512MB.

The PlayBook only has 1GB or on board storage.

I am not a techie, but do you understand the difference between (disk) storage space and RAM?
much

Quote:
Originally Posted by ncee View Post

Ok, so Apple will introduce the second generation of iPad soon.

- Thinner
- Lighter
- With camera(s)
- Video Conferencing - will be a BIG Deal
- Faster
- Better Battery life
- Available in colors
- For LESS- and oh yeah, one more thing, now available in 3 sizes!

- Big one, is lighter the ANY other tablet on the market - so is bigger better?
- The mid size, is for all of you who want a mid-size tablet
- and the smallest one, is for those who want a small one

Then where will the competition be?



The iPodTouch is just an iPhone "without the phone", which has been worked around too, based on the Chinese creation.

Before it got into the hands of consumers, many all self-professed "tech analysts", like that guy from Newsweek who masqueraded as the Fake Steve Jobs, believed that the iPad, is just nothing but a larger iPod Touch. Perhaps, much like the US Sixth Fleet Flagship is nothing but a larger gunboat?

A few months after April, one could claim that iPod Touch and the iPhone, were actually the smaller iPad -- if Steve revelation would be accepted. One could say the smaller iPad has already been in place, for more than three years, going on four. The iPod Touch, never really gettting a truly competitive rival.

I would understand a 5-7-inch iPad or would welcome even an iPad in steroids ("OSX-featured" iOS, and even larger screen???). but do you really think Apple under Steve Jobs will fragment the iPad model, and in different colors so soon?

The rainbow colors of the iPod, has its origins from the original iMac, but even the iMac, has veered away from that rainbow color. Also, it was much later before the smaller iPods have been introduced, and now provided some more specific niche, because the iPods had matured.

If anything, the iPod Touch is being differentiated from the style of the iPods, and more akin to the iPhone. It may also mimic the few colors of the iPhone models (to date two -- black and white).

I am not sure that with these more complex and more delicate mobile computing models would be offered in rainbow colors so soon, if ever. Do not forget the issues with the white iPhone because of the unique casing of the iPhone 4.

Apple, because of its exclusive rights, for electronic products, may be experimenting right now or might be a direction Apple would take in the future. While at first glance, it may be costly, the features of the alloy material allows more easy and mass molding, like glass and plastics, thereby reducing manufacturing cost, significantly. Not only is it scratch-proof, its tensile strength, allows thinner walls for the casing thickness, thereby using less material and would likely be lighter than existing iPhones or iPod Touch.

If Apple is ever going to use this LiquidMetal, as casing material, rather than used for special parts, it is likely that Jon Ivy, would hide the novelty of such a material with a coat of color.

A "Dick Tracy-like" gadget may come from a future evolution of the iPod Nano. [Gadgets for kids, and young teenagers, under the blanket? No need for penlights or flashlights to enjoy those "simple pleasures", so dear and novel to younger kids] The changes in the iPod Nano, points to that direction, even if the video capabilities, were excluded in the latest version.


CGC
post #238 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

Companies do this shit all the time. The RIM tablet at this point exists only on paper. They have an OS that runs on the processor they are planning to use, they will copy UI from the iPad (like Samsung), webOS, etc., the SDK is Web+Flash, so they don't have anything to produce for developers (the choice of dev tools is another indication that this is a hacked together rush job, btw), and the hardware design will be a mashup of the Torch and iPad. They will try to cobble this together as quickly as possible, and early 2011 by their reasoning lasts until the end of Q2, so they have about 9 months to ship product to make their date.

But, the purpose of this is to delay customers from buying competing products. By saying early 2011, people (including some in this thread) are thinking, Jan-Mar, but that's totally implausible, other than some prototype units. If they can't make June, they'll simply announce that it's slightly delayed and will be here real soon now.

Wish I could have said that as well and in as few words.

.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #239 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

Most other companies aren't paranoid like Apple when it comes to releasing specs. Not saying that is good or bad just that Steve Jobs tends to be the only one that worries about stuff like that.

Just to add to your comment, questioning Apple's "paranoia" or "secrecy" (one of the keys to their success) at this point is like someone saying to Michael Phelps: "I know you keep winning gold medals, but I don't like it when you move your arms like that."
post #240 of 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Just to add to your comment, questioning Apple's "paranoia" or "secrecy" (one of the keys to their success) at this point is like someone saying to Michael Phelps: "I know you keep winning gold medals, but I don't like it when you move your arms like that."

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPad
  • RIM unveils 7-inch 'PlayBook' tablet set to launch in early 2011
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPad › RIM unveils 7-inch 'PlayBook' tablet set to launch in early 2011