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Nielsen: Android overtakes Apple's iOS in latest US smartphone sales - Page 5

post #161 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

You have no way of knowing whether it it the OS that is causing purchases or whether it is other factors that are causing purchases. For all you know, people buy a Mac despite it not having the "regular" OS they have always used in the past.

My guess is that lots of different people buy Macs for lots of different reasons.

Still works for what I was saying. Mac share is increasing even though they are more expensive... OS, style... who knows... it still shows that the Mac has an allure that is not diminished by the availability of a cheaper alternative.

My own experience shows that most people that I know that have switched actually wonder why they didn't switch sooner.

Totally unrelated but something I found interesting...

Someone I know owned BMWs for years. Last year they bought a Lexus and later cursed the day they switched. I asked why. They said that all the recalls from Toyota (2) and having to take the vehicle into the shop for said recalls was an awful experience. I then asked if they had any problems with the Lexus other than that and they said, "oh, no, it's a wonderful car to drive". Hmmmm...
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post #162 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Let's see those real results! Let's see those claims!

I think you must made that stuff up from ill-formed memories. I don't think Apple made any such claims.

Got some cites?

I mentioned the last conference call. Google it.
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post #163 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Instead, I think people buy what they like. A cellphone is not a spec-dependent beige box. There is plenty to differentiate any HTC from any Samsung, despite one of the aspects of them, the OS, being the same.

I am sure the manufacturers would argue that there's plenty to differentiate a Dell laptop from an HP laptop.

Except there isn't. Consumers understand that they are all essentially the same thing. So nowadays they look for the best deal on the spec they want. So it boils down to price. And a race to the bottom begins.

With phones it's even worse. They are all virtually identical slabs with big touchscreens. Many are sold without the consumer even seeing them running.

Yes, Android handsets makers are scrabbling to distinguish their particular flavor of Android, but that's a double-edged sword. The more they differentiate their product, the more fragmentation they risk.

Remember PC makers who strayed too far from the Microsoft path left users with all manner of incompatibilities and limited support.

Like I said earlier, this can be good news for consumers. We are already seeing devices with very high specifications and very low prices. But that trend is very bad for the manufacturers who need to narrow profit margins year on year if they want to stay in the game.

C.
post #164 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

I am sure the manufacturers would argue that there's plenty to differentiate a Dell laptop from an HP laptop.

...

With phones it's even worse. They are all virtually identical slabs with big touchscreens.

.


Somehow, I think consumers can see somewhat of a difference among Samsung and HTC Android phones:



post #165 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

Somehow, I think consumers can see somewhat of a difference among Samsung and HTC Android phones:

And I am sure that consumers can tell the difference between a Dell and a Vaio laptop.
The problem is that the differentiations are moot. Adding on a webcam here, or a fancy case design there don't add value. Consumers are not persuaded to pay a premium for the added features.

It remains to be seen whether I am right - but my prediction is that the same narrowing of margins that happened in the PC clone market will come to haunt the Android handset market.

I think HP understands this phenomenon all too well. Which is why it bought Palm.

C.
post #166 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davewrite View Post

what did your post contribute?

It pointed out that complex explanations of why obviously successful companies will fail are usually incorrect.
post #167 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniphage View Post

It remains to be seen whether I am right - but my prediction is that the same narrowing of margins that happened in the PC clone market will come to haunt the Android handset market.


C.

I think that someday, you will be right. But as of now, Android offers customization and is not homogenious. It is nothing like a beige clone sporting a white C:> prompt.

Once cellphones become a commodity, they will be a commodity. But as of now, they are bursting with indiviuality. Including Android phones.
post #168 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by appl View Post

It pointed out that complex explanations of why obviously successful companies will fail are usually incorrect.

you're still saying nothing and still not reading my posts clearly

did I EVER said that "obviously successful companies(i.e I believe you're referring to Google) will fail", did I ever in my entire thread say Google will fail? Can you copy and paste where I said that? I didn't even say Android will fail.

I only pointed out that the Droideks who gave the idea that Android is cruising trouble free and making money off EVERY droid phone is false (as droid phones are being loaded with bing, yahoo etc and the other reasons I cited) and that their belief that the Google money making method is so vastly superior to Apple is not necessarily true. That does NOT equate me thinking Google will fail. Google will survive with or without Android.. shoot even Apple devices have Google search as default.

See why I need to be lengthy? (and you criticize me for it " you give complex reasons"), I'm lengthy and give detail reasons because you are following some of the others in being so dense, misreading posts and reading stuff which isn't there. When I gave simple explanations (why Google doesn't make profit on every Android phone) people didn't get it so I had to be lenghty', now you show yourself to require the same nursemaiding.

Lastly your "complex explanations of why obviously successful companies will fail are usually incorrect." is just an supposition supported by you Solely on your personal observation of your work experience (WTF is that?) Can you quote some studies to support you hypothesis? On the other hand I've read complex explanations like 10 years or so ago that Msft an 'obviously successful company ' which was valued at 600 billion will have problems in the future (Windows saturated, oracle etc rising in enterprise etc) , Msft is now worth 211 b (which is 50b smaller than Apple). Were these complex explanations part of your "usually incorrect"? I was using PCs at that time but reading those complex explanations I dumped my mutual fund of primarily Msft and Dell stock, some time later I bought Aapl and Google. (when Palm Pre came out I advised in talkbacks like this that buying the Pre acclaimed as a big hit by the tech press was a bad idea, not because WebOS is bad but that the Pre's profit was not covering Palm's cash burn and debt financing and that Palm will go under. Sometimes complex financial explanations underlying tech companies is useful)
post #169 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davewrite View Post

I only pointed out that the Droideks who gave the idea that Android is cruising trouble free and making money off EVERY droid phone is false


Ok. I didn't get that point. Sorry.

I don't agree with that idea either.
post #170 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davewrite View Post


...GOOGLE MAKES LESS OR NOTHING".

...Google gets zilch from search.

...Google gets zilch.

...google loses revenue

...a larger change that could undermine Android itself,

...GAIN for Google ZERO.


Sorry I misunderstood. I got the impression that you were saying that Google will have difficulty profiting from its involvement in Android.
post #171 of 176
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post #172 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by extremeskater View Post

The siutation with Android and 2.2 is the same situation with the iPhone and v4 of its software. You need the hardware that can support and handle the software. The latest handsets have either been updated to 2.2 or are soon to be updated to 2.2 because they have the power to run it.

So you're actually confirming my post... To recap, you said:

"Let see so we have iPad and iOS record sales and we have Android record sales which promotes Flash as a benefit over iOS. So it appears to me that Apple has done nothing to slow down Flash or help move to HTML5 or any other alternative."

To which, I say again,

You claim "Android has record sales and promotes Flash as a benefit over iOS". But you mention you need hardware than can support and handle the software, and the latest handsets "are soon to be updated to 2.2". Thus here we have the problem that Flash is supposed to be a benefit of Android but clearly it is not as widespread as it should be, and, even some of the latest handsets don't have it and may or may not be updated within a shorter or longer timeframe.

So, Flash as a benefit on Android appears to be more hype than reality at this stage.

Secondly, you mention "Apple has done nothing to slow down Flash or help move to HTML 5". Again, if Android actually was shipping with Flash-capable phones right from the start, and if Android was only used on hardware that was "capable to run Flash", then Flash should be no issue for any Android smartphone.

However, smartphone manufacturers know that Apple iOS devices can do, and more importantly to them, sell well without Flash. Smartphone manufacturers also ship a significant percentage of phones which they know currently don't or will never run Flash.

So, Apple and even other smartphone manufacturers have done at least something in encouraging many sites to move to HTML5 video, to drop Flash-only websites, and to consider non-Flash versions of their websites.
post #173 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidia2008 View Post

So you're actually confirming my post... To recap, you said:

"Let see so we have iPad and iOS record sales and we have Android record sales which promotes Flash as a benefit over iOS. So it appears to me that Apple has done nothing to slow down Flash or help move to HTML5 or any other alternative."

To which, I say again,

You claim "Android has record sales and promotes Flash as a benefit over iOS". But you mention you need hardware than can support and handle the software, and the latest handsets "are soon to be updated to 2.2". Thus here we have the problem that Flash is supposed to be a benefit of Android but clearly it is not as widespread as it should be, and, even some of the latest handsets don't have it and may or may not be updated within a shorter or longer timeframe.

So, Flash as a benefit on Android appears to be more hype than reality at this stage.

Secondly, you mention "Apple has done nothing to slow down Flash or help move to HTML 5". Again, if Android actually was shipping with Flash-capable phones right from the start, and if Android was only used on hardware that was "capable to run Flash", then Flash should be no issue for any Android smartphone.

However, smartphone manufacturers know that Apple iOS devices can do, and more importantly to them, sell well without Flash. Smartphone manufacturers also ship a significant percentage of phones which they know currently don't or will never run Flash.

So, Apple and even other smartphone manufacturers have done at least something in encouraging many sites to move to HTML5 video, to drop Flash-only websites, and to consider non-Flash versions of their websites.

I think it's a bit more than hype now, as more phones are updated, it was just a couple months ago, when no android phones had flash at all. Smartphone upgrades happen at a pretty rapid pace, so it'll be on quite a few phones as nokia,win7,rim adopts it, and users begin upgrading their smartphones. I knew it was only a matter of time. This will move quicker than anyone thinks. I recall someone saying it would barely hit 1% in a year from 10.1's release. I have to have a wee chuckle about this...
What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
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What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
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post #174 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Groovetube View Post

I think it's a bit more than hype now, as more phones are updated, it was just a couple months ago, when no android phones had flash at all. Smartphone upgrades happen at a pretty rapid pace, so it'll be on quite a few phones as nokia,win7,rim adopts it, and users begin upgrading their smartphones. I knew it was only a matter of time. This will move quicker than anyone thinks. I recall someone saying it would barely hit 1% in a year from 10.1's release. I have to have a wee chuckle about this...

The only thing that matters to consumers is video playback - if flash is replaced by HTML5 nobody is going to sleep to unsoundly with regards to ads not displaying.
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post #175 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdasd View Post

The only thing that matters to consumers is video playback - if flash is replaced by HTML5 nobody is going to sleep to unsoundly with regards to ads not displaying.

agreed, though there's far more to flash than video playback, or ads. html5 video, can't kill flash. Something else will.
What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
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What I got... 15" i7 w/8 gigs ram,iPad2 64gig wifi, 2.0 mac mini, 2.0 17" imac, appleTv, Still running my old G4 466 upgraded to 1.2GHz maxed ram as a pro tools machine, and 2 iphones.
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post #176 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Yup, adding more carriers when you already can't make enough phones to keep up with demand is an absolutely brilliant strategy.

And left behind at what? Owning the 2 for one special? The high volume no-profit marketshare? I think Apple has a pretty clear history of being perfectly happy not being all things to all people, and since high volume no-profit strategies are about, well, volume I don't understand why anyone gets worked up about market share numbers. At all.

Google can ship all the Android phones they want, but like Windows Mobile of old, if hardly any of them are used to do anything beyond basic phone calls and light email does it really matter that the phone came with Android? Does google really gain any revenue from the fact that it was simply loaded on a device that was shoveled out the door to someone that is not using it nearly as much as the average iOS user?

As they say, the proof is in the earnings reports...

I love this post!
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